Stay warm when CAMPING - sleeping pads MATTER

[@NoviceWildCamper]

Hi Paul. Is the UL80 properly rated? I know Trekology say it's R value but no mention of ASTM number for regulation rating? I see loads of Chinese made mats with R ratings that aren't done the correct way which is why they set the ASTM system up. Atb Michael 👍

[@PaulMessner]

This is a very important point my friend. Some of the cheaper manufacturers will claim an R Value although is doesn’t have the certification. This is where’s buying reputable brands is a much more reliable option. You do pay the premium price though.

[@NoviceWildCamper]

@@PaulMessner I have literally just taken delivery of a mat that was reviewed by Lonewolf 902 from Canada. He knows his cold stuff for sure. He was well impressed with it and although only an R rating of 2 it is ASTM tested with the serial number as well and it only cost me £37 including delivery so I'm excited to try it out. I went through last winter with my decathlon zero R rating pad and a foil/foam windscreen type mat underneath and was comfy at minus 4 which was the lowest I got to and I'm like Jo, I feel the cold. Looking forward to trying this one and getting a review out so others might find a budget version that might see them through colder climes in combination with a £2 foil mat from good old Ali Express 🤣👍

[@Amigafan-od2vn]

The Ul80 (I have one, but it has failed unfortunately) and it is no where near a 2 r value. It's effectively as near as 1 as makes no difference, summer use only. I now have an exped synmat ul 7 and it's infinitely warmer. It's r value is 3.1.

[@AndyWardle]

@@Amigafan-od2vn you need to be careful with the synmats me and my mate have had 4 between us and the chambers failed on all 4. Nightmare

[@Fun_Dealer]

I had this matt and it’s started deflating after about 3 uses. I’ve managed to get another on the warranty but I don’t have much hope. Trekology values aren’t that good in my experience. Hopefully I’ve just got duds!

[@mervhoward5821]

Hi. I’ve just completed a whole coast bike ride around the UK, over a period of three and a half months (3700 miles). I slept on the Trekology mat nearly every night for the whole of that time. I got around the lack of protection from the cold by taking one of those silver foil backed windscreen covers and laying it on the ground under the mat. Not only did this reflect the cold, but it also stopped the thorns from puncturing it. It cost £1 from the Pound Shop, (obviously!). Beats the arse out of spending the extra and it is very light.

[@dubcatalyst]

isnt the foil designed to reflect heat back up at you? rather than the cold back down? maybe in wrong4but planet earth vs a foil windscreen protector seems a tough fight

[@TYapril]

This is very useful info, thanks!. The 3 months seems warmest month of the year in the uk though.

[@mervhoward5821]

@@TYapril Believe me, the start of the trip had major frost and poured down for 700 miles. I think my system was properly tested😎

[@gallente4TW]

Wow, fair play to ya'. That really IS a trek and people often mistake it as easy. It ain't. Respect, mate. 👊

[@lucastefanvasileberde6656]

Hi Merv! I'm prepping for a JOGLE starting late May/Early June, taking a month for the whole thing. Just got the treckology matt, not knowing about the R rating thing. Would you reckon your sunshield system would work for potential temperatures down to 4-5-ish celcius? Really not wanting to spend another hundred pounds for a sleeping mat.

[@bonariablackie4047]

I have a suggestion. Buy a small roll of reflective insulation - the kind that is put in walls and sheds to keep the heat in. Cut a piece that is long enough for your sleeping pad. It is light, foldable, and not very expensive. Put the insulation underneath your sleeping pad. This will be very effective at bouncing all heat that goes through the pad back up through the pad, keeping you far, far warmer, and saving you £160 on a sea to summit sleeping pad. It's worked for me.

[@MarkSweeting_]

Have you actually done this and it works? Tks

[@thewhiskybowman]

From an insulation perspective wouldn't it make more sense to put the closed cell foam mat on top of the air pad, rather than under it, so you aren't expending as much body heat warming the air inside the pad?

[@neilhughes3529]

Spot on. If you follow a guy called Erik Normark on KZbin - he camps year round in northern Sweden and puts his closed cell foam mat on top of his air pad. I have tried a thin 3mm sheet of closed cell foam (called plastazote on eBay - it only weighs 100g) both below and on top of my R2 air pad - it’s definitely much warmer on top.

[@thewhiskybowman]

@@neilhughes3529 Good to know. Logically it seemed likely to be the case but as I've never tested it myself I wasn't absolutely sure.

[@andrewnorris5415]

Not as comfy though.

[@thewhiskybowman]

@@andrewnorris5415 Possibly not, but are you going to get a better sleep if in a slightly less comfortable position or if you are freezing all night?

[@neilhughes3529]

@@andrewnorris5415 I found that the 3mm foam mat is thin enough not to affect the comfort of the pad, but does make a difference to warmth

[@Hmmmppffff]

Put the close-cellfoam-Mat on top of the Airmatress and Not below. The Surrounding cold Air has to much surface-contact to the Airmatress will still chill It down dramatically. Best to have the reflecetive layer of the close-cellfoam-Mat DirectX beneath you

[@markatchison9974]

I use a thick (10mm) yoga mat under my cheaper sleeping pad + a fleece blanket on the top. Sorted :)

[@gallente4TW]

Hey Paul, I just wanted to wish you all the very best with going full-time as a new career in camping. You've already got the main skill, which is being natural in front of the camera. I thoroughly enjoy your videos and content and have learned a lot from you. Good luck..!

[@northumberlandmountainhopper]

Nice advice for people who don’t know I use an exped synmat 7 and I just love it Well worth the cost

[@susanharvey4235]

My husband has UL80 and loves it where I rough it with a cheap memory foam trail mat that cost me £15 and its fine 😂

[@MrTimtim65]

I've got into layering - silk liner, decent bag plus bivvy, which helps retain the heat and also protects the (down) sleeping bag from getting wet. I use a Thermarest mat which has been fantastic.

[@SeanHendy]

Served 11 years in the Army and am an expedition leader. Many will shake their heads in disbelief at the price tag of some of the sleeping mats that are on the market and will spend some time wondering what the right choice is, so here's a different perspective. It's safe to say I've spent a fair few nights out in the open, in all weathers and times of the year, well into sub zero and snow and ice, with not a tent to be seen. The British Army doesn't do tents. So how am I still alive? A poncho (tarp) for overhead cover from any rain, a decent down issue sleeping bag (circa 1990's not the current sleeping system), a goretex bivvi bag and a closed cell foam roll mat. Army surplus of all of these items is easy to find, (used and new) and I've little doubt you'd be able to get the poncho, sleeping bag, bivvi bag and roll mat for less than the cost of the sea to summit sleeping mat featured in this video. For example the current issue roll mat from Multimat is about £32, The goretex bivvi bag I've seen on ebay for about £40 and so on. You really don't need to spend a fortune to be well equipped and be able to enjoy the outdoors and be comfortable, and the final obvious point is this. If it is colder, wear more clothes to bed. If it is warmer, then wear fewer clothes. As you spend more time camping etc if you find you enjoy it, then over time you might want to invest in upgrading your kit, but what with clothing, wet weather gear, boots, cookware, rucksack etc, there are many more items you're going to need also, so my advice is don't go blowing your budget on a gucci sleeping pad when a foam roll mat will do the job perfectly well, and it is virtually indestructible and impossible to get a puncture.

[@robpinter5431]

Sean, been there done that in my younger years....now I am older and a side sleeper I need my comfort...Exped 9 cm down mat...rated down to -38c...R value of 8...so comfortable.

[@ChristoferB]

Hi Sean, What I love about camping is that there are so many ways of going about it. I really like your approach and I also us a lot of ex army gear. When it comes to mats however, like many people, my hips and shoulders hurt. So there might not be a one fits all solution to this. Chris

[@keaponlaffin6737]

was pretty much agreeing with you there until you called these sleeping pads "gucci" pads. these pads have got some serious hardcore physics going on, and they're not only for comfort, but also for keeping you healthy. cold crawling into your body is no joke, especially on the long run when you get older. if you can afford good quality gear to protect yourself from the elements one should do it. be sensible with your expenses sure, but be respectful of the work and effort people put into developing these things. this is not "gucci", you pay for real actual developement.

[@JamesFleming888]

Nice one, I've went and bought the UL80 with pillow and pump sack - next is a foil liner or closed cell matt. Thanks for the advice!

[@MarcMallary]

The foam pad should have the silver side facing up, to reflect your bodies heat. You can't reflect cold.

[@seedmole]

I picked up the rectangular version of that StS pad and it's more comfortable than my bed. Packs up quite large, with all its insulation and its rectangular format, but my god is it soft and warm and roomy. Seems absolutely worth the size to me, especially since you can get by with a quilt or blanket with how warm it is, rather than a full bag.

[@SimonOutdoors]

Thanks Paul, nice one. Glad you didn't end up cutting one open! The seatosummit pad looks awesome. Si

[@secondintime1118]

Have used the ul80 with wind screen frost reflector under it down to -4 and was plenty warm enough. Have had 2 fail on me now though. Get what you pay for. Now used Klymit static V insulated. Great mat.

[@YoureNowOnTV]

My favourite camping KZbinr by far! Thanks for another Stella video. 😀👍 (My Ether light XT Insulated arrived today - I didn't go for the Extreme as it's not necessary for my current purposes and I'd rather have a smaller pack size and weight)

[@Seamus3051]

Have found that laying a reflective ( space blanket ) or reflectics under any sleeping pad will increase the warmth ( R rating ) and comfort factor of the sleeping pad by a perceptible degree.. Cheers.

[@MikeTheBike2010]

Came here to visit the comments and ask if this tip - given to me by a v helpful chap in Blacks - worked, and you have not disappointed me! As space blankets are often available from the pound shop (in packs of 2!) and weigh essentially nothing they seem like a good idea. I presume you put them under the tent not inside?

[@Matt7R]

Thanks Paul, just bought the Ether Light XT Extreme to replace my uncomfortable NeoAir Xlite. Sick of waking up with a stiff back! Really hoping the Ether Light solves that problem!

[@kke]

I also have the sea to summit ether light xt extreme, it's pretty nice. No complaints. A bit bulky to pack maybe, sucking all the air out with the flextailgear pump helps a bit.

[@andym2869]

I picked up a Sea To Summit Comfort Light Insulated Mat for £56 including delivery from Millets when on sale not too long back,it's very comfortable although can sound a bit like a rustling crisp packet if moving around on it,the pad has a R-Value of 3.7 so is great for 3 season use & with a closed cell mat & a Carinthia Defence 4 bag I'm sure it will be good for most camps/regions of the UK throughout the winter months too 🏕️

[@DJVOutdoors]

Yeah got the UL80 definitely don’t use it in winter! Great pad but the winter pad Paul shows is a must for winter.

[@martinostberg196]

I much prefer to use a heavier pad with better R-value, even during summertime. My favourite is the Vaude Winter Performance pad. In size L it weighs 680 grams and has a R-value of 4,1.

[@hubby-tubadventures01]

I have the UL80 which is used with a foil blanket that has a wool type material attached to it. I lay this on the mat and I used it from February this year. In the snow, in my back garden along with a 1 season cheapo sleeping bag from Tesco and a Zafabak 400 Quilt. I was fine 60 kg and no fat on me. My wife had the same mat and pad but she had merino base layer and socks. thick thermal pyjamas, 3 season large down sleeping bag AND a hot water bottle. She has a bit more fat on her than me but she was very cold. I have used the same mat and pad/blanket on all our trips this year and the sleeping bag has become redundant. I find the quilt is great to keep me warm BUT I intend to use it on our permission in the coming winter. I'll do a vid at some point.

[@iwasapirateonce1639]

Insul-Bright? I have some of it an it is indeed good stuff. Not as weight efficient as a reflective foam mat but much easier to pack down.

[@mountainidiot]

Thanks for another great video paul! Exped synmat 7 is in my opinion one of the best to fill the gap between these two in terms of performance and price , R rating of 4, picked it up for £70 and it kept me really warm this week - my thermometer showed around 3 degrees up on kinder, I used a decathlon trek 700 before with the Same bag in warmer temps, and was always cold

[@mojaslovenija9903]

Very true. A quality sleeping mat at least equals a quality sleeping bag when building a sleeping camping system. I have a four-season sleeping mat with the R = 4.65 and I was comfortable with -8C° (tested two weeks ago at an altitude of 2200 m in the Alps) even the sleeping bag was with 0° comfort ( -6°C limit). But new standard ASTM F3340-18 from few month ago "degraded" the R-value from R= 4.65 to R= 2.8 . Ether Light XT is with R= 6.2, but what standard? However, the personal experience counts... and it seems that ASTM F3340-1 R=2.8 is fine for 4-seasons: I had some degrees minus in bonus with the comfort temperature zone (sleeping in a T-shirt and light sweat pants).

[@Jaysonbc1234]

I use a foil lined sleeping mat on the ground along with a self inflatable mat from Mountain Warehouse... Nothing too expensive.

[@TruckerMatty93]

And it keeps you warm yeah?

[@LOFIGSD]

Watching this video Stealth camping in a Hammock tonight, will drop to about 6C, no Gucci gear, a Jungle blanket XL as an under blanket attached with some bungy cord and a Snugpack Sleeper Extreme bag, and all my gear in a Dutch Army Rucksack, I have the UL80, really comfortable, if I was going somewhere really cold I would buy that expensive one, makes a big difference, but unless you are, its overkill. Great video Paul.

[@darrenleigh201]

Always appreciate your honesty and sharing your knowledge with us. Thanks again!

[@tilla77]

Just a tiny tip Paul. Even though it doesn't make a massive amount of difference I would always have any reflective ground mat facing shiny side up (towards the source of heat). There have been tests to show this effectively is the best orientation. Its not a large amount of difference because of the distortion and absorption of the foam when pressed upon negates a lot of the reflective efficiency.

[@AndyWardle]

Double sided silver mat is the answer. EBay £8-£11

[@tilla77]

@@AndyWardle That'll do it. What makes the insulated mats more effective is that they have a space of air above the insulated material in the mat which is kept flat and away from the body. I do feel these mats are overpriced for what they are though as the 'technology' isn't anything special. You do likely get tougher materials and you'd hope better warranty.

[@AndyWardle]

@@tilla77 I’m going to do a video showing my winter sleep system. I’ll get criticism for how much it cost but after 10 years of cold to warm camps I’ve finally upgraded to what I consider utter cold weather luxury. Those foil mats are brilliant though. 👍

[@tilla77]

@@AndyWardle Will look forward to that and subscribed!

[@AndyWardle]

@@tilla77 nice one. Cheers. I’ll be doing it midweek next week 👍

[@DannyMacDJ]

Just remember the higher the r rating of your sleeping pad and the warmer your sleeping bag is you've still got to get out of it eventually at some point! 😱 😂

[@arthurdanielles4784]

Another great vid Paul. I made the mistake (only once) of buying a cheap sleeping bag and the weather whilst camping turned cold.😶End of summer and late autumn.. luckily I had a thick coat that I put over the sleeping bag BUT it was still a not so good night. I don't doubt that many would be newbies do not give thought to the thermal efficiency of essential items for keeping you warm!

[@DW-dd4iw]

I use a thin roll of aluminium/foil floor insulation (excess membrane from laying a wooden laminated floor) and put my Alpkit inflatable sleeping mat on top of it. Very cheap, very light and it works extremely well. I've slept on frozen ground with this combination and I was fine.

[@danieldancey3162]

I usually have a lightweight shiny foil blanket in my first aid kit, and I tend to place it under my sleeping mat shiny side up to try to reflect some of the heat back up. I'm not sure how effective it is, but I tend to be comfortable enough with it even on a really cheap and basic air mat.

[@davidcann6021]

Just got a cheap Naturehike sleeping pad but the real game changer is buying a foil picnic rug, bit bulky and could cut it down but instead it fills the whole floor of a 2 man tent, the floor instantly feels warm from all the heat reflected.

[@Thebluedocful]

Nice one Paul. Seen more and more people say that the Thermarest Neoair Xlite is just not comfy. I’m still with the Exped synmat 9 LW for winter. Have the Trekology UL 80 for warmer nights. All moot. Simply can’t sleep when camping. Worth it though 👍

[@MrOlivetribe]

Refreshing. Excellent information. Thanks

[@soggz4246]

Hi Paul. A roll of silver garage door insulation works for me. Lightweight and foldable/rolls up. Dead cheap too. Regards.

[@antoniol1776]

There's a solution to the problem. Similar to the Reflective Material put in Windshields on a Hot Summer day. They make a Survival Blankets that are Reflective and are Waterproof. They also make very lightweight, cut them to size sheets of Reflective Material. Lay that on the bottom of the tent, you're sleeping pad on top of that and you're sleeping bag. Also it can be use for throwing on the wet ground when you're cooking or if it's really Rocky and Stick Sticking Up. You can put it under the Tent as a Foot.

[@uzoge]

sorry,what?

[@ChristoferB]

He means an emergency blanket/foil. They do help a bit, but they work less well when touching the ground since then they conduct the heat (like any other metal).

[@dpax100]

This time 2 tears ago I was on the WHW and camping at Bridge of Orchy it dropped to 3'c. I thought my mat had punctured. So I was freezing and my mat was flat. The next day I pumped it up nd the was no hole. So I bought a roll mat which really helped at Glen Nevis where I woke to a frosted tent. Have since got the UL80 which is great with a roll mat underneath. Super comfy, the roll weights nothing but is bulky as you say but is a good backup should the inflatable mat gets a hole. Cheers Paul

[@BorderRambler]

The one thing for a warm nights sleep not to skimp on , I have had many a cold night not using the right mat . Now use the thermarest thermal mat for warm kip. atb Dave

[@uknighthuntingvision93]

I use the exped dura 8r sleeping pad LW and it is rated for the coldest expedition conditions on earth. R Value: 7.8 Much tougher and durable than other well known brands. It has weight, but I'm old school been doing this on and off since early seventies. Not a weight conscious jockey, take what I feel is right and carry the weight multi day camping.

[@WindinyourSails]

Thanks for the video Paul. There seems to be varying opinions about pairing your pad with an extra foam/reflective mat. I have no doubt using a reflective mat with your pad will potentially dramatically improve the R value of the overall system and I'm sure evryone will agree with that. The question is do you put the mat under the pad or on top to get the best result. I'm in the on top of the pad camp as it just seems to make more sense. Whats the science anyone?

[@Reachermordacai]

I purchased the trekology pad and after 3 hours of trying to sleep, I had to go indoors ( we tested kit in the back garden) The temp was 4 degrees that night. Also, my sleeping bag was not good for 4 degrees comfort level. It was at the limit.

[@praktika1082]

I think separating sleeping pads into seasonal categories is a mistake. I'd happily sleep on a pad with high R value rating during the summer. It's not going to make me hot. It will provide insulation from the ground. Sleeping pads are separated into price categories, with expensive/insulated pads usable all year round and cheaper/less insulated pad unusable/inappropriate for colder temperatures.

[@CordCrenshaw]

I feel the same way. The other thing to consider is the weight. The higher R value pads are just heavier. I bought a Nemo pad with a 3.5 R value and supplement it with a closed cell foam pad when needed. The pad I bought still weighs around 2lbs however.

[@ChristoferB]

Me too. I have a Thermarest with over R6 and I comfortably use it all year round. Paul is bang on when he says that investing in a good pad is the most important investment you can make. Open your wallet a bit and don't look back.

[@praktika1082]

@@ChristoferB yeah all these videos on KZbin supposedly advising beginner hikers and campers on sleep mats should be saying just one thing: buy a proper insulated mat, because that'd be the only one you need, and don't bother with anything with an R value of less than 4, because you might as well sleep on bare ground.

[@ChristoferB]

I agree with you Praktika. In fact I wonder why I even watched the clip to the end, since it's a problem I no longer have... :-)

[@apollo12329]

Nice and simple, easy to understand Paul, many thanks for sharing 👍

[@ipaales7552]

The seatosummit is probably the best on the market for comfort and heat loss, however slip a foil sheet/mat under the UL 80 and will certainly take the R rating up , as always fantastic information paul cheers all the best stay safe marra 🏕 👍......have look again at pillows paul I've tried a million of them 🤣and still searching mate 👍

[@BamBam-gs7eb]

Great point, we tried a cheapo foil mat from Amazon worked a treat with seatosummit looking forward to trying combo in colder weather, makes a world of a diff

[@jonnytentpeg]

Hiya pal try the trekology aluft 2.0 pillow with the elasticated strap it stays wrapped around your pad at head height and doesn't move absolute game changer mate no more foraging for your pillow when it pings off to the bottom of your tent in the middle of the night atb pal😀👍

[@ipaales7552]

@@jonnytentpeg appreciate your info mate certainly have a look at that and the strap around the pillow is a brilliant idea thankyou 👌

[@jonnytentpeg]

@@ipaales7552 no worries buddy not that expensive they compact to nothing and weigh nowt hope that helps pal👍😀

[@antduke2361]

@@jonnytentpeg I'll second that pillow for the price it's brilliant

[@lastchippindale8697]

Another great video. Which mats in the 3 season bracket would be on your shortlist in the £60-70 bracket?

[@kevinklein4748]

I use the regular version of the StoS Etherlight, it is an absolute beast!! I'd really recommend the StoS pillows with the lock system as well. I'll definitely look into the Xtreme version for winter camping.

[@izac6988]

I have a lowland outdoors mat which comes in at 4.4. Been really happy with it up to now and it's very cost effective at a similar price to the trekology

[@theduke998]

UL80 pad thrown in a foil survival bivvi. Never had a cold night and super comfy. Simples..... 😎👍

[@barryconway]

Thanks for the reviews - good to see comparisons. Weren't you rocking a Klymit pad recently, or wss that some other bloke in a tent on KZbin? If so, my apologies. Watching this, I was wondering if the old foil material mats or bubble/foam mats can be used in conjunction with, but you got that covered. Well done.

[@BrokenBackMountains]

Exped downmat 5m for me. Down to - 12 which does me these days. I always use a pump as don't want my breathe spoiling that down. I ruined a vaude norrsken insulated pad by blowing up by mouth. The insulation got mildewed. Anyway the long tubes of the exped means it sórt of cradles you. Combine that with my Vango Vulcan sleeping bag and I'm warm as toast... Until I have to get up.

[@ToiletDuckify]

Also check out the Klymit Static V insulated. R value 4.4, available less than £90, it's a pretty good pad, very comfortable. Also note sleeping bags are most thermally efficient when you tuck in as much of it as possible under your body. Removing that air space makes it quicker to warm you up.

[@EricBanner571]

I use the UL80 and the insulation is quite poor. I found however that a $10.00 front window car sun shade which foil lined on both sides and fold-able works a treat even down to 0 degrees C.

[@craoutdoors6827]

Didnt realise there was so.much difference in R rates in mats too. Best think on for my first winter wild camp

[@corporaterobotslave400]

I once had to sleep under a bus stop shack on a bench in the freezing rain outside the Heineken Hotel in Amsterdam after catching the last train to port... found my boots had frozen to side of the bus shack in the early morning. Travel adventures. Coulda used an inflatable mat then.

[@nigelp6640]

One year ago you reviewed the ul80 ,sounded impressed so I bought one ! Garbage money wasted cold night and more money spent!

[@oling2812]

Would highly recommend the regular S2S Ether Light XT Insulated as a more general 3 season pad. Only slightly heavier and slightly less warm than a Neo Air X Lite but a tonne more comfortable. Personally, the Extreme version of the pad is a little heavy and bulky for me.

[@marko9912]

I own the UL 80 and wouldn't use it for any camps outside of summer. Warmer if I put my Thermarest roll mat on top of it rather than underneath, but I think I'll be opting for the Thermarest Xtherm this winter, max wide version 64cm width, regular is 51cm.

[@SteveeCee]

I've used the UL80 this year from spring in the Lakes to summer in Devon. Comfiest thing in ten fleets!! However agreed that for those Autumn to spring months it's woefully inadequate.... so I just bought the Thermarest xTherm Max - same weight but R6.9!!! pricey, but you get what you pay for.

[@korean_foot_traveler8655]

Both of the sleeping pads look so comfy and reliable.😀👍👍

[@tartytube]

Thanks, I needed that.

[@ryanhuntermedia]

Great video Paul. I have the UL80 and it is extremely comfy, especially as a side sleeper. But it’s no use nor ornament in the cold 😂. Good tip combining it with the sleep pad, I’ll have to get myself one! Cheers

[@Kampkolik]

Very nice thanks 👏🖐️👍

[@blagsreport4763]

For all the tall wide fellas like myself, I'd advise the AMOK pads from AMOK Hammocks. They do both a 3 season and 4 season pad that works for us big'uns.

[@MontyOutdoors]

As someone with sleeping issues, in general and a dodgy back, the Trekology mat is a life saver when camping. I can't help but think if your tent is drafty - I've been there, - that wrapping a liner around the sleeping mat will prevent heat loss via convection. What do you think?

[@fredwestbuilding2155]

Space blanket

[@nbartlett6538]

Convection is not the problem. Or rather, it's not the problem that a mat solves, that's what the sleeping bag is for. A mat solves the problem of *conduction* of body heat into the cold ground. Adding a liner around the mat might improve this slightly, but honestly I doubt it would do much. The problem is that insulation gets crushed between your body and the ground, so it loses almost all its effectiveness. A good mat with a high R value will have insulation built into the internal spaces of the mat, so it can't be crushed.

[@MontyOutdoors]

@@nbartlett6538 I'm talking about cold wind/drafts hitting the sleeping mat. That's not conduction. I think it'll help a little, but it's all additive.

[@mphigham1963]

Good informative video, cheers Paul.😁

[@arranbailey4818]

Excellent info, thanks Paul.

[@ninjesus4079]

might be a stupid question but what about adding a survival blanket under the sleeping pad? would that help?

[@paultrussy]

That's exactly what I intend to do with my UL80 (hopefully will not be camping on frozen ground so no point in me spending the earth on a premium mat) ...I'm taking my SOL foil bivvy bag and I'll put that underneath if necessary (also adhere's to my try to have two uses for as much kit as possible rule)

[@CryptoRoast_0]

All completely true but my dirt cheap OEX traverse pad kept me alive in the arctic circle so I'm not going to remortgage for an expensive one 😁 I used a foil emergency blanket under the pad and it worked well together.

[@jimcy1318]

In the 80s I used to sleep on a piece of ipk plastic sheet layed over ferns in an army sleeping bag which only had half the feathers it should, slept like a baby.😂

[@paulp4452]

@@jimcy1318 plastic sheet? Luxury! When I was a lad I used to sleep naked on dry ice. And work 18 hours down t'pit.

[@mattedwards582]

@@paulp4452 you had dry ice!? Lucky b*stard, I had to go to bed ten minutes before I woke up and we had to share one chunk of wet ice between three of us AND we weren’t allowed skin

[@hubby-tubadventures01]

@@mattedwards582 You folk, you make I laugh.

[@leonperry123]

Same here. I like the videos. But the camping gear he has is way to expensive for me. My mat is a £12 from amazon

[@rossymcoutdoors]

Really informative Paul! If you had to pick 1 sleeping pad for all year use irrespective of price, what would you pick?!

[@grizzlydoutdoors5115]

You must have been reading my mind as I've been meaning to post on your Facebook group all week about this very topic. I've always bought cheap but now I have £100 in my pocket wanting to invest in a new pad. Great video mate 👍🏻 ATB Grizz 🤘🏻

[@grizzlydoutdoors5115]

@@thomasjeffersonlane9902 haha, yeah I know. Been looking at some of the sea2summit stuff. Seems to be the more you spend on that range the better the R value is. I could probably push a bit more, but can't justify the £170 price tag 🤣🤣

[@hosoutdoorpursuits3019]

Thanks for the video. I'm trying to decide between the Ether Light XT and the Ether Lite XT Extreme. I was afraid the Extreme would be too warm for autumn/spring temperatures. What are your thoughts? Thanks! -Mike

[@SteveeCee]

Mike, get the Thermarest xtherm, R is 6.9

[@hosoutdoorpursuits3019]

@@SteveeCee Thanks for the suggestion!

[@PoloABD]

Conscious of being a contrarian here, but it seems unlikely that there is really such a difference in insulation between these two. Surely the main reason they insulate you from the ground is the amount of air inside the pad? I’m sure the sea to summit model has more heat reflecting qualities, but still I would have thought both would in reality yield similar warmth. Personally, I’d rather use the UL80 and pack more in the way of sleeping bags and clothing.

[@PoloABD]

@@Cuntymccuntface123 possibly pack a thin foil mat and put that underneath. Some backup if you find yourself in a survival situation with a popped mat.

[@ChristoferB]

Hi Peter. You are right tol be sceptical but it actually makes a world of difference. I'm off on a bike trip from Cambridge to the Isle of Skye and if I brought my UL80 instead of my xtherm, they would have to send me back in a coffin from Birmingham. :-)

[@PoloABD]

@@ChristoferB I see, right you are. Thanks for the clarification!

[@RollrightKnights]

I find the UL80 very cold, even in Summer. That's it's biggest downfall for me

[@biggaspirit1]

Well explained. Thank you.

[@andrewgreen7996]

Remember Paul not everybody as that kind of cash to splash out on a sleeping system iv used a roll mate and a cheap eurohike mat for years no problem you can still enjoy camping in winter or summer with out all the expensive gear it's about using your initiative and some experience. And yousing what you have available!!

[@keaponlaffin6737]

yousing lol!

[@benjaminzac_Man_Wi_A_Tan]

Excellent explanation of a complex subject. Which one stops you slipping off if your pitched on a slope?

[@iknowyoureright8564]

I have the UL140….not sure if the difference in it from the ul80….thicker perhaps, only used it in summer/spring so far, but yeah it is VERY comfortable, packs smallish, built in pump and not too heavy. But yeah I think I’ll have to look into the sea to summit for the colder months coming in. Or at least pair the trekology with a foam mat below. ✌️

[@billyandrew]

You might want to contact the suppliers of the Wild Country Zephros, as their site won't allow you access, unless you accept _all_ their cookies and refuses, contrary to law, to allow you choices as to which ones are placed on your phone. Thanks for uploading another great vid!

[@OfWodensFolk]

I did have the Trekology UL140 which was perfect for a side sleeper but didn't find the built in pillow comfortable and also, it was too wide for my OEX Bobcat 1!!! (Didn't bother measuring before buying the mat)

[@lloydantonio4799]

Great video @paulmessner! Do you have any idea where to find a Big Agnes Rapide SL wide (25”)? I have been on a few wild camps and the only thing ruining it for me is that I struggle to sleep. I have the 20” version and it’s just too narrow!

[@madebyPure]

Very informative, thanks Paul!

[@laurac976]

I’ll be investing in a Sea to Summit pad for my Kilimanjaro trek in 2024 :) I’m a cold sleeper 🥶 I have a basic exped sleeping pad just for normal camping and I use a Grand Canyon insulating foil topped layer under that to increase the r value.

[@bluezorro999]

I’m also a cold sleeper and I have the Exped Downmat UL Winter. Cheaper, lighter and a much higher R value than the Sea to Summit 👍🏻 Def worth a look!

[@laurac976]

@@bluezorro999 I’ll take a look! I definitely need it to be lighter for the kili trek :) thanks!

[@chapman9230]

Could you do a film on water options for hiking,i.e. carrying or filter options . Thanks

[@stephenmankin]

THE TREKOLOGY SLEEPING PAD IS FINE IN WINTER CONDITIONS IF YOU DO THE FOLLOWING. PUT THE TREKOLOGY MAT ON A GERMAN FOLDING MAT OR SIMILAR THEN ON THE TOP OF THE TREKOLOGY MAT PUT A LIGHTWEIGHT ROLL OF FOAM WHICH COST ABOUT £10. THE GERMAN FOLDING MAT WILL HELP PREVENT PUNCTURES AND WILL STOP THE COLD COMING UP FROM THE GROUND. THE ROLL MAT ON THE TOP WILL STOP COLD AIR WITHIN THE TREKOLOGY MAT ALSO COMING UP THROUGH THE COMPRESSED INSULATION OF YOUR SLEEPING BAG. THERE IS NO NEED TO BUY EXPENSIVE INFLATABLE SLEEPING PADS. I KNOW THIS IS WHAT I DO WITH TEMPERATURES DOWN TO MINUS 10 C.

[@guidok3762]

Subscribed, greetings from the Netherlands

[@peterp5254]

Great explanation

[@phdman2014]

Hi Paul, Outstanding comparison of the r-ratings and two pads. Could you recommend a more three season pad in the mid r-rating? The Etherlight Extreme will be perfect for my wife, but I tend to sleep hot, which is miserable. I'm a tad girthy and would love the 10 cm, but I would sacrifice comfort for coolness. Thank you!

[@louishansen2370]

Just my 2 cents worth - it's not what's under that matters if you sleep hot, it's what you're in / what's on top. Your mattress on your bed at home would (if rated) have an R value exceeding any sleeping pad you can buy - by a long shot. And you sleep indoors in the summer, in an insulated house, without changing the mattress you sleep on. I'm no physicist but from my understanding the base layer (mattress, sleeping pad, etc.) aids in thermoregulation, while blankets, quilts, and sleeping bags provide insulation from the cold. Therefore the highest rated pad you can buy should be your go-to year round (with weight in mind, of course), but you should have varying grades of sleeping bags / quilts for differing seasons

[@neilmetcalfe5261]

Hi Paul. Just used the UL80 for a week in the Lakes and have to say it's incredibly comfortable. I used a foil mat underneath for a bit of extra insulation and was never cold. As a mainly fairweather camper (May to September), if you have a half decent sleeping bag, the UL80 is as good as most people will need, and very good value (£40). Another great review, many thanks.

[@craynak]

I’m seeking a side sleeping, sleeping pad that goes down to minus -5/-8 that’s under a £100, what would you recommend?

[@Leanmaniac]

Just went to look at the sea to summit and it’s now up to £230. How long ago did you purchase your sleeping pad Paul

[@PaulMessner]

Had it about 4 months. I’ve just seen it here for 150 www.snowleader.co.uk/en/matelas-ether-light-xt-extreme-w-SEAT00407.html

[@peterford6520]

Hi Paul, found it really interesting - have you ever done anything similar with sleeping bags? Would like to know what your experience is regards weight/R value/cost ratio’s

[@thomaspedersen1024]

Hi Paul Is it possible that you are going to make a review of the Sea to Summit Ether light xt Exstreme, where you compare it to some of the other winterpads, like Therm-a-rest NeoAir Xtherm, Nemo Tensor Alpine, Exped Downmat 9 and so on...?

[@paulduckworth1121]

Good, informative video as always Paul 👍 I know you like quilts rather than sleeping bags, but what are your thoughts on liners, such as the Sea-to-Summit reactor thermolite liner?

[@soggz4246]

Would it be better with some sort of space blanket on top of the mat/in a Bivvy bag?

[@daz1639]

Hi Paul I have the treko pad, and combined with foil mat , that squashes down to nothing is probably better than the £170 Pad? I think if you compare you would find its warmer than the STS pad. Maybe a test with a thermometer and compare both scientifically instead of ooooo STS must be great. Plus for the newbie it's a great way of staying warm for a Hell of a lot less cheer Paul.

[@daz.j]

foil blanket on the ground first, then sleeping pad and another foil blanket over the pad

[@turboduckhead6179]

Is it a bad idea to use a winter pad in the middle of summer?