11 MISTAKES with MULCH and PLASTIC MULCH in the Permaculture Orchard

11 MISTAKES I've made with MULCH and PLASTIC MULCH (Part 4 of 4 of my MISTAKES Series).
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[@vonries]

It's like I always tell my kids, "You have to learn from other people mistakes, because you don't have enough time in life to make them all yourself."

[@Skashoon]

Tips like these are why I’m trying to watch all of your videos before buying and planting my fruit tree guilds. Merçi mon ami!

[@Hatarue]

I think I've heard #8, like 5 times now. I will remember that one forever.

[@cafarmgirl3279]

Here in San Diego CA we have free mulch and wood chips at the green recycling center. I’m taking the truck to get a load after hearing your video. Have 12 fruit trees less then 3yrs old... their small, now I know why!

[@MsVernonSullivan]

I sharpened my shovel today before watching that video. I have 50 trees to plant, I said to myself it was better doing it now than next year when most of my trees would be planted... It was worth it, it digs better than ever ! I love how you talk a lot about your mistakes in your videos and help us not doing them, that's very helpful, thanks for sharing your experience !

[@StefanSobkowiak]

It’s like the old saw ‘always take time to sharpen the saw’. I use it as ‘always take time to sharpen the shovel’. Way to go.

[@metalarbort1054]

Get to know your local tree care companies. Many are actively looking to unload chips and you can get 10 or 12 yards for free

[@eldonelder7254]

One of my supervisors at my last job had a little plaque on his desk that said, "IF YOU AREN'T GOING TO DO IT RIGHT THE FIRST TIME WHEN ARE YOU GOING TO DO IT RIGHT?"

[@chriswalford4161]

That implies you never learn from experience. Never be afraid to make a mistake - observe and correct.

[@chriswalford4161]

G K Chesterton wrote “If a job’s worth doing, it’s worth doing badly.”

[@eldonelder7254]

@@chriswalford4161 .... No, it implies some people don't give a shit in the first place. It's about caring enough to make the effort required the first time so as to save unnecessary effort later. Being lazy and sloppy is an intentional choice, not a mistake.

[@georgcorfu]

Eldon Elder Silly perfectionists, unhappy people. So what if you make a mistake!

[@eldonelder7254]

@@georgcorfu .... Making an honest mistake because of inexperience or ignorance is one thing but doing a sloppy job because you don't care is another.

[@dianakingsley4540]

You can use landscape staples instead of the rocks for your plastic.

[@TheStax5150]

Building soil is a beautiful thing.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I agree and there are many paths that lead to the result.

[@beckyjohnson3153]

I am so grateful for your videos. We are finally getting ready to put in a beyond organic, permaculture orchard, and your videos are invaluable!

[@RamHomier]

Unfortunately here in Ontario in the Belleville area wood chip is no where to be found other than the commercial expensive 45$ per cubic yard. Hay and straw just the same. I just had to use my grass clippings and maybe will use my fallen tree leaves.

[@tanarehbein7768]

It all works!

[@jonathanvanallen1662]

Talk to the arborists and the city/hydro crews that clear up trees along the roads, power lines, etc. Last summer a crew was taking down a massive old maple and I let them know that they could empty their truck in my driveway. It saved the crew about an hour of driving so the crew was happy to drop it off for me. I’m just the other side of Kingston. There should be something available; you may just have to search for a bit

[@mtorrisi42]

This is such a good video on a topic I have really been thinking hard about. Thank you so much Stefan!

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Glad it was helpful!

[@chriserickson2677]

Thank you for sharing. Your advice is invaluable to us!

[@judahjackson9506]

Always a blessing to watch you videos 😁 Thank you for sharing your wisdom❤️

[@zazugee]

non-UV treated plastic is a huge mistake, i got lot of plastic debris in my garden and they are pain to clean

[@bossdog1480]

I used to use 'weed mat' and bricks to hold it down. That works well on a small scale but may be impractical for a bigger setup. I stopped using it after I pulled some up and checked the soil. It looked completely dead and lifeless. It took some TLC before it came good again.

[@georgcorfu]

18.49 Do you ever look at the moon before you plant? My dad and uncle always said, "Never plant beans when the moon is waxing"" .

[@ghanemghanem7520]

May God Protect You

[@chrisg7349]

Excellent, thank you so much !!!! :)

[@janemonroe921]

I love your videos! ♥️

[@zazugee]

i tolerate weeds, as long as its not those that spread their rhizomes around i let any wild plants grow to keep the grass from growing, bc they are easier to remove then they are mature and they are good for compost pile, like redroot amaranthus, it he;ps to cover the ground before the veggies sprout then as soon as veggies are established, they are easy to remove, and their leaves can be eaten too

[@organicgardeningtogetherca971]

Great great video!

[@euphoniahale5181]

I can get free chips from our city garage. It just sits there in a big pile. I’m turning my front yard into a chipped permaculture. Amazing how much I am squeezing into this fairly small space.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Wonderful. Go for it it’s the best for most trees.

[@kathmandu1575]

Excellent video - thanks!

[@frauerdling2558]

great content

[@georgcorfu]

I love your garden.

[@redlily8101]

My suggestion would be to find hay farmers who bail in round bails. A lot of them get damaged and cannot be fed to livestock. I was given several and unrolled them with my tractor, in my case restoring some ground that had been stripped of the topsoil. Easy peasy. No reason why they couldn't be used as mulch under trees. I use wood chips under my Galas that get scab real bed, very little scab since.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Good point. We use them in the newest orchard block, see seeded orchard playlist.

[@pjnelson414]

Thank you

[@SnakeAndTurtleQigong]

Sending gratitude from a Daoist monastery near Seattle! 💙☯️

[@Mrbfgray]

I'm fortunate to live in small city that loves our 'urban forest' plus have endless nut tree orchards all around so I can usually get the truck loads of chips fairly easily. (I tip the landscapers who dump it in my front yard tho some won't except it, I know it's often the closest place for them to dump anyway but it's a little extra trouble for them to figure out a new place, dead end road they have to turn around on and so on, $20 tip is fair for a good load) I don't know the decay rate but after a yr or so most of it is still there. I swear by it, saves me a lot of water, weeding, mowing too.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Wow $20 that’s a cheap load. Get all you can before more people learn the value of it. After a large ice storm in ‘98 many people got loads due to huge supplies, now most loads go for $50-100.

[@Mrbfgray]

@@StefanSobkowiak Indeed. Actually it's generally free I just like to tip the guys.

[@theressomelovelyfilthdownh4329]

I used wood chip in the paths of my old allotment plot in 2020 & 2021. We get similar rainfall here in the north-west of Ireland as the east of Canada. They break down very fast if you have contact with half decent soil, and a fair bit of rain. Plus, they add a lot to the quality of the soil as they break down. Some people will dig out their old broken down wood chip paths every few years. Then they run it through a screen. You will get some excellent, dark, rich compost doing that. And anything that's still too big and woody, you just throw on your composters. The amount of fungi which shots up all over the place in the Autumn is pretty crazy. They are in there right away doing their job of breaking down the wood fibres. It's worth using wood chips around a fruit tree or shrub just to see how fast it breaks down, and the mushrooms show up. The one exception is the wood chip path in my poly tunnel. That's been down for almost a year now, and they are very much still hard bits of chopped up tree. So the amount of rain you get would be a key factor in how long your wood chips will last. If you can get lots of wood chips cheap, I'd use them. If you have to pay more for them, but only have a few trees, I'd use them. At least for one year to get better soil, a long term feed, and to get the fungi thriving. I would avoid using wood chips from other fruit trees. Unless chipped them yourself, or helped somebody else do it. I'd just be a little paranoid about setting a dinner plate for anything that could attack your trees. So if you see people working the town/city trees in your area. Just ask them if you can have some, and get a card with their number or something. You could be lucky, and your driveway is easier than carting a trailer load the X miles back to where they are based. Worse case, you now have their number, and can see what they charge for your needs.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Yes wood chips are marvellous. That's why we can't get it here for free anymore. It's usually $50-100 a load from pruning crews. People here value it.

[@brendalynblanco]

We use woodhicps but I understand there are places where it is much harder to get....so here are a few thoughts I have on that. What about a living green mulch? Like a low-growing, shallow root crop, for example, in some areas, we have a living mulch of All-Heal (Prunella vulgaris) herb. It can handle walking on and even driving my tractor on, it stays green all through winter here for us, as the old leaves die off they drop to the soil and break down while new leaves regenerate, it's useable for many things apart from just a living gree mulch, etc. so maybe find a crop that does well in your area that is similar in concept? Another idea is organic burlap topped with a light layer of straw or hay. And how about stretching the woodchips out by layering? Layer cardboard, then 4" of chips, then aged horse stable bedding, then some chop and drop, then more woodchips, etc. That way you are using less woodchips so when you do get a load you can stretch it out. Just a thought. Of course in a large space, like over 3 to 5 acres, it would be a constant project to get it all down, but it is an option outside of plastic. These are just some thoughts that came to mind.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

All great ideas. The only thing green over winter here is evergreen trees otherwise snow for 4-5 months. Yes scale makes it different. The quantity of mulch needed is about 3 tractor trailer loads per acre per year, even if we stretch it.

[@misterfixie6003]

Going to plant 600 trees in early 2021. I'd love to know a US source of high quality, UV protected plastic. Didn't see any sources in the comments. I am still leaning toward wood chip mulch and ramial mulch and a sore back. :)

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Look up or suppliers of plastic mulch for vegetable growers or for farm silage use. Otherwise my usual supplier in Canada ships a lot to the US. duboisag.com

[@WWPermaculture]

Can you please explain how you dig holes and plant trees into existing plastic. I suppose being careful not to damage drip tape under the mulch.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Make a slit not a hole in the plastic and use the smallest tree size you can get.

[@patblack2291]

White Dutch Clover and Sheep Fescue for a living mulch may be better than putting plastic into your orchard. Adds nitrogen and pollinator forage.

[@Burbun]

Mulch supplies nutrients and habitat for beneficial insects, as well as holding moisture, I can't see plastic serving that purpose... Maybe it'll hold some moisture. Wood lice and springtails eat fungus and rotting material, very few types bother living material, and keeping mold down keeps plants healthier, and they'll process those nutrients into something plants use as well

[@jessicawagner1381]

The fruit trees in my yard all have round metal edging to make it easier to keep weeds out. I have pine bark mulch in the rings under the trees. I am in the middle of adding native flowers (Florida zone 8b) and nitrogen fixing ground cover in the rings. My family has gifted 6 acres of land to me that I am wanting to turn into a permaculture orchard with the intent of selling the fruit at the farmer's market. Can I mulch and add wildflowers with nitrogen fixing ground cover between the rows of trees to reduce mowing? If I apply a thick layer of mulch and the wildflowers and mulch will weeds be such an issue that it affects the tree growth?

[@frodehau]

Hi Stefan, was the C/N ratio of the wood chip mulch you added low? Lots of green leaf, green bark, and little heart wood? I'm asking, because 6 inches in one winter is a lot. I see that if I use chips form thin birch branches, and a much slower rate with chips from coarser stuff. I try to separate what some call ramial chipped wood from the thicker stuff when I chip, by turning the output of the chipper between two piles. One for fine branches (less than 5cm), and one for the rest. I use the older stuff to suppress grass, and the finer for soil amendment.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Probably an optimal c:n ratio for wood chips since it was late fall and leaves were off. Yes the higher N ratio will speed up decomposition and higher C (or thicker branches) will slow decomp. I had never seen such rapid decomposition and had used it on many projects.

[@isabellebaron5031]

Hi Stefan! Thank you so much for all the teaching! I wonder if you can name the company who can install the plastic mulch and the dripping for acres in one day? I’m in the same area than you, we follow your KZbin channel, we saw the movie and I’m really curious about that!

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Dubois Agrinnovation in St-Remi.

[@isabellebaron5031]

Stefan! Merciiiii! 😁❤️

[@xdahnx]

Look at what Pete Kanaris (in FL) is doing with growing grass in between all the rows as mulch-in-place - a great idea for large scale while still skipping the plastic! Just need a scythe!

[@xdahnx]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/mma0p3SLYpilnM0

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Hahaha. I’ve used a scythe in the past and am fairly skilled with it. It would take me one hour for a 300-480’ row. We had 72 rows. Do the math. I have more to do than mow alley ways. I like the method used by Grant Schultz with wider rows and hay making equipment. Yes using grass on orchard scale mulching is possible but must be planned for in the design phase. I did not.

[@WWPermaculture]

I tried for days to get a "plow" rigged up on my 23HP kubota and it wasn't enough power and the trench not deep enough. I was thinking of putting a trenching bucket on my small backhoe next time. But this mulch layer machine sounds better after struggling with the plastic for so long. Can you please tell me the name of the implement and the size of tractor needed to run it? Many thanks for each of your videos that provide so much clarity.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I've seen such machines for fairly large tractors (duboisag.com/ca_en/equipment/machinery-equipment/plastic-mulch-layers.html). But have also seen them for installation pulled by 2 people (kzbin.info/www/bejne/h5urq4qDrKepm7M) however it needs tilled ground.

[@WWPermaculture]

@@StefanSobkowiak Very cool. Thank you. I don't have cultivated soil. More like weak pasture plants including tough rooted weeks and grass clumps. The hand unit doesn't look tight enough. I was able to get my plastic very tight as I sweat over it as you have shown in another video. Still much better than stunting trees and endless weeding, not to mention the understory crop viability. You have produced an excellent design, thank you for all of your efforts over the years to share it with us!

[@StefanSobkowiak]

We used a small garden tractor fitted with a small plow and only went 3 inches deep (7cm). If laying by hand mulch doesn’t need to be buried deep.

[@EdenGreenFarmandAdventures]

Stefan, how do you keep the soil fertile (for vegetables) year after year?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

We will be moving the garden over by one bed every 3-4 years based on how the crops do. The regular grass clippings in mow and blow give a nice boost about every two weeks during the season.

[@jacobe1942]

I have a bunch of extra flagstone flats would that be a good way to cover the root zone of trees? I am ultra small homestead.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Yes

[@dmaifred]

Re Plastic film. Will it kill the earthworms in hot climate raised beds? I have - lots- of good health raised bed here in hot Perth. I often use newspaper then the drip lines then straw based mulch to keep in the moisture and TRY and prevent the weeds. I use the brown neta micro dripline.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Put paper mulch over the drip lines if you want them to last longer. Otherwise I’m not sure how plastic mulch behaves or affects In hot climes.

[@ragingfool1113]

Great video! Would have been great tips before I planted my last orchard for sure. What would you do to kill off grass before wood chipping? I have a great source for wood chips and leaves but have grass between several of the trees. Have been moving to a permaculture orchard over the last few years and the biggest problem is keeping the grass that was allowed to establish in between the trees. I don’t want to disturb the root systems by digging it and the organic weed and grass killers that I make don’t seem to permanently kill grass. Any thoughts would be appreciated thanks!!

[@StefanSobkowiak]

A couple of layers of cardboard under 12 ´´ of wood chips can do the job first thing in the spring or now before winter. Keep the chips away from the tree trunk.

[@ragingfool1113]

@@StefanSobkowiak sounds like a plan. Thank you!!

[@tammybuckley2563]

At minute 11, there was a type of sunflower in the background that I have in my yard, but do not know the name of it. Does anyone know what that is? Thanks in advance!

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Cup plant. Silphium perfoliatum.

[@kevincoffman7240]

Would it work better in an established orchard to make a cut horizontally half way in at each tree, to lay the plastic down?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

You can it depends on the width of the plastic. Just remember the bigger the opening in plastic the more maintenance you will have.

[@mattcantrell5640]

I read through most all the other comments, mostly in regards to using the plastic. I definitely agree with your choice based on the situation, scale, and amount of labor involved. Do you feel like there are detriments to using the plastic in your setting? I live in a much warmer climate (US zone 6b, I believe), and I would be concerned about summer sun cooking things under the plastic. I guess an mow and blow of the grass in the lanes onto the plastic would help to some degree...or even a "mulch" of sorts on top of the plastic just for sun barrier. Any thoughts?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Just mowing the grass onto plastic can completely cover it. Warmer zones make sure to add enough perennials (1/ft2) to completely shade the plastic and mow onto it will keep it cool. Thoughts: definitely saves huge amounts of maintenance.

[@JB-yg3ew]

Do you have any resources on using animals in an Orchard? What about using them in the laneways?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

A couple of chicken videos.

[@dianampowell1]

Hi Stefan, Where do you source the plastic you use? I'm in the UK and considering using silage tarps as they are made of a fully recyclable plastic and nice and strong. I can get 4m x 50m lengths so thinking I'll cut them into 2m wide strips which once buried each side and overlapped in the middle will give me about a 2.8m wide covered row. It would be easier if I could source a roll of the correct width though. What plastic do you buy for your tree rows and what is it's intended purpose?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Sounds like you have the right plastic even if it just needs a cut down the middle (fold in half and cut with a utility knife).

[@DavidfromMichigan]

19:08 says the confident man. 😆

[@didgeridooblue]

Will mulch from Eastern Red Cedar trees be okay to use for mulching peach trees and grapes?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Ok will last a long time but not breakdown much or add to nutrition, but better than plastic that’s for sure.

[@geomundi8333]

wood chips last like3 years or so max. I shipped in tons and tons; but it just disappears. Also critters burrow in them. I don't like plastic mulch at all either; for me in central IL I don't think its necessary, I don't irrigate either.

[@chriswalford4161]

Getting too many ads here!

[@pjnelson414]

My wood chips are 1 to 3 inches big. Will they work for mulching or do I need smaller chips. Please

[@willieclark2256]

Those are fine

[@Mrbfgray]

Don't be picky about that I get even 6" chunks, sticks and such sometimes and even bury limbs from pruning under it all on occasion. It's all good. I use cleaner more attractive chips in front yard and messier looking stuff outback.

[@christopheambroise9220]

j'ai paillé mes mirabelliers avec du carton et de la tonte , et c'est pas trop mal .Sinon on apprends beaucoup de erreurs des autres .Merci

[@mathieuhelie]

Any thoughts on syntropic agroforestry? As in, growing trees closely between your fruit trees for the sole purpose of chopping them to source wood chips?

[@mikevanhoutum2844]

This is what i am planning to do in southern Spain. Using moringa trees, 1 mulch tree per fruit tree. Bought a conventional mango farm there.

[@meh4164]

@@mikevanhoutum2844 Great. Do you have a blog or make videos. Would like to see your work. I live in dry tropical region and plan on starting a Permaculture Mango farm.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I love what they are doing and am very interested in seeing how it works in a temperate light limited environment. I’m letting one small area go at the farm to test the idea. Spain and southern France has received visits from Ernst and some are applying his techniques. Following with interest.

[@srantoniomatos]

@@StefanSobkowiak he as been active educating in sintropic agriculture here in Portugal too. There is no woodships avaiable here. And hay is expensive too. Im trying a bit of it in my orchard...lets see...

[@mikevanhoutum2844]

@@meh4164 Hi meh, you can follow us at instagram.com/wijvertrekkennaarspanje/?hl=nl

[@ewilen]

Hi, you mention that more than 200 trees require plastic instead of wood chips be cause it's too much work. On a similar subject, what would you consider to be the maximum number of trees a single person can manage by himself in a permaculture orchard ?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I can manage maintenance for 6 acres replanted and producing on 5. The bottleneck can be harvest. Now installation takes much more work than maintaining.

[@ewilen]

@@StefanSobkowiak Wow that's impressive, I thought you had a team helping you, that's also very encouraging as to my project. Thank you for taking the time to answer :)

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Team focus on new projects and learning maintenance tasks but when I calculated the maintenance time it turns out to be one person full time for 6 months.

[@MistressOP]

six inches isn't enough. cardboard every 3 years. then you can grow mushrooms under them just spread some spawn

[@krystalpayne878]

How do you fertilize plants and trees with the plastic mulch??????

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I don’t

[@c.s.frederickson1152]

I have access to Juniper tree decayed needles (years old). Is this good for mulching? Thank you.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Years old should be fine. Any mulch is better than none.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

No don’t mix with compost. Place compost on soil surface and then cover with the decayed needles. It will protect the compost from UV rays

[@bonnieoppelt2734]

Have you ever tried stone mulching? Im thinking to do stone mulching by creating a layer of pea gravel with volcanic rock under. Then planting a cover plant in the pea gravel. This would be around the trees only. Do you think this would work or have tried something similar?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I have not but Elliot Coleman did in his mountain school orchard in the 70s. If you have them use them. Bigger rocks last longer in effect.

[@bonnieoppelt2734]

@@StefanSobkowiak thank you. Ill see what I can find on it. Just a little direction is all we need sometimes.

[@tanyawales5445]

I did that in Meridian, ID which is USDA Zone 6 high desert. The air is very dry year round. We had plenty of irrigation water thank the Lord! I went to a nearby Bureau of Land management site and would gather a half cubic yard of volcanic rocks each time which I used to edge and mulch my garden. I had a 0.25 acre corner lot and used 10 cubic yards of this dark brown and red rock. These were 6" rocks and I used 1/3 cubic yard for 11 ft. of edging. Under the rocks the roots of my plants were nice and cool and it significantly slowed down evaporation.

[@blablabla1000able]

Any thoughts on UV resistant geotextile fabric? Lets in water and oxygen.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

See previous comments in the thread.

[@hahaahahaa]

Bonjour Stefan, est-ce que du géotextile utilisé pour les pépinière pourrait faire le même genre de job? L'avez-vous déjà utilisé au lieu du plastique ? Des pour et contre de son utilisation? Merci.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Jamais utilisé sur la ferme mais vu sur des projets. Geotextile est mieux sur le court terme comme Pepiniere, je ne l’utiliserais pas pour long terme car les racines poussent au travers avec le temps et devient impossible à enlever.

[@hahaahahaa]

@@StefanSobkowiak Merci pour la réponse!

[@ube4856]

My pear tree is at least 5 years old and established. I never mulched it, which may be why it only fruited heavily last year (before it fruited small amount that all the animals got). My question is, should I mulch it now? Will it be healthier for the tree if I mulch it?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Yes mulch and keep it mulched, just not against the trunk.

[@ube4856]

@@StefanSobkowiak Thank you! Will do!

[@lordyellowman]

Stefan how do you do mulch like that on highly irregular terrain, like a mountainside?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I would mulch on contour, preferably if your rows are also on contour.

[@lordyellowman]

Thnx

[@coltonborn4835]

I herd from a different online source when you first start using wood chips they will get used much faster than after years of use

[@StefanSobkowiak]

That’s interesting.

[@daigledj]

My experience has been the opposite. 1st year they decomposed fast. Second year was similar. Third year before I finished spreading woodchips weeds were breaking through the original area. I have not done everything properly for weed suppression so withing a week worms are working through the chips and shortly after weeds (and volunteer plants) start showing up. Luckily they are very easy to pull in woodchip mulch but pulling them just brings more soil to the top speeding up decomposition.

[@robertbrawley5048]

Sound effects will produce a LOL like your boink boink sound on the little animated you" advertisement to suscribe

[@Lily-vi5cy]

👍

[@muzealle]

any substitutes for plastic?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Wood chips, straw, old hay, shredded leaves

[@trig33kgirl]

Doesn't plastic keep water and air from getting to the roots? I always thought it was a bad mulch.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

It depends. We use a lot of holes for perennials and our soil is sandy, so air moves easily. We irritate under the plastic.

[@cookybanana]

Yeh. I am confused. I thought plastic was the furthest from permaculture. Can anyone explain? I really don't understand this. I don't see time/cost effectiveness as a reason to poison the earth. It also just seems like a huge hassle.

[@cookybanana]

Not even just poison... just interference for the rest of life... Worms, other plants, insects, etc.

[@vexator19]

What's your take on cedar mulch? There's still some controversy around it. Thanks.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

The goal for organic mulch is for it to breakdown and feed the soil. Cedar has compounds that slow down that breakdown, which makes it last longer but also reduces the contribution to the soil.

[@vexator19]

@@StefanSobkowiak Thank your for your answer. I love your videos!

[@willieclark2256]

I don't know about the controversy, but it killed 5+ mulberrys (and a bunch else) down hill from where I used it as mulch

[@vexator19]

@@willieclark2256 I personally use cedar mulch and I've never had any ill effects so far. Maybe your soil drainage is not optimal and the mulch is not the culprit? Mulberry trees seem to like well drained soils.

[@willieclark2256]

@@vexator19 they were wild and doing fine before I used mulch. Not everything was susceptible but it killed the mulberries to the root.

[@MsCaterific]

🖤

[@Polkadotpup]

Do wood chips attract termites?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I don’t know we are not in termite country.

[@venticore]

Well what I should do with an Orchard with over 8000 mango trees to control the weed

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Look into roller crimping or mow the weeds and grass and put them under the trees as much. Yes it will attract snakes but they are part of the ecosystem.

[@vvdv3444]

What did you do? Maybe a sheep?

[@MsCaterific]

Question: How can you grow organically with plastic mulch? Isn't plastic bad?

[@srantoniomatos]

Nothing is bad or good on it self. Nothing exist by it self. Everything exists in relation and contex. Reality is complex. So...depends! Most of organic agriculture directly depends on plastic. For mulch, green house, water pipes , etc. And nowadays plastic can be made of bio fuel ( like corn) and be biodegradable... Well used for mulch can help better the soil just by covering it and better retain moist.

[@WWPermaculture]

This food grade plastic will last for the life of the orchard then can be recycled. Plastic isn't perfect. On this scale I don't see an alternative.Its a great solution.

[@MsCaterific]

@@WWPermaculture So then no plastic residue leaches into the soil?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

You would have to look at the organic certification standards in your area, they are not universal.They should be pretty clear. You can find the standards by looking up the certifying agencies operating in your part of the world (ie. ecocert, OCIA,...).

[@davidg813]

Why would you use black plastic on peas peas like cold weather and black plastic heats up fast in the Sun

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Yes they do but we can start them earlier since the ground thaws faster under the black plastic. We are in a cold climate.

[@dustyflats3832]

I am not a fan if plastic at all. The former owner of our property did this and it was a horrible mess. Weeds grew on top and through it and it needed to be removed. It was hard to pull up with rooted plants. It doesn't let moisture pass through and it breaks down.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Agreed if the plastic used is too thin you will end up with a mess. That's why we use silage grade plastic to last the life of the orchard without tearing.

[@dustyflats3832]

@@StefanSobkowiak I just moved an overgrown shrub that was placed too close to house by former owner. I couldn't wash out the soil because the poor roots were all entwined in the very tough plastic. I'm just not a fan of any plastic. I've picked up enough of it. If it isn't biodegradable I don't use it.

[@d.w.stratton4078]

Man, we've got to get away from plastic. I get that it's cheap and easy, but it all washes out to the ocean eventually. Got to be some way to cover crop and use green mulch.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Figure it out for our soil type and I’m all ears. Everything is possible but will it double triple or ten times my work. Choices.

[@francostacy7675]

Not all plastic washes out to the ocean. Come on, be realistic

[@yatesrats]

Hello sir , Can you make this available for Indian currency also. Can I get your advise on how to grow an orchard in 8500ft in Himalayas. Let me know sir. I'm a learner will be thankful to get your guidance. I have a plot to start. I want to buy your courses but can't because of currency issue.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I don't know what your exchange is for Indian currency to US$ but it should convert. At the altitude for your plot it sounds like you are almost in a temperate climate zone. Grow what grows well is a good start. Ask around your area what grows well. Don't try to reinvent the wheel with species choice.

[@josephtpg2205]

OK this might be the lazy way of doing things. Here is what I do to plant a garden. First get bags of Mulch. Lay bag on ground where you want to plant plants. Cut top side if bag down the middle, lay plastic flaps on ground. Spread Mulch over ground. With shovel poke hole(s) through Mulch and plastic into native soil. Plant your plants.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Sounds great.

[@northrockboy]

How about a couple layers of cardboard then some wood chips ?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Absolutely, see my wood chip video from this fall.

[@Starfucker50]

I am baffled now. Should I put plastic right on na old, half-rotten hay and THEN plant trees and shrubs, that I already have for 1 row? I put cardboard on grass before hay and will cut old silage tarps to cover rows. Rows will be 35m long. Well I think I will cover he 1st row with plastic AFTER planting and in the spring the next ones (of 5) before.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Or try to do both. Plastic first helps save the steps of closing the plastic and adding weight to hold the seam closed.

[@Starfucker50]

@@StefanSobkowiak Time is what I have in abundance beeing jobless (mostly because of covid19. An I have started planting TODAY. A yellow and red fruiting Eleagnus umbellata, 3 honey locust trees and 3 vapious aronias. Applee and plum trees will come next week. Only scab and mildew resistant old varieties.(like COX, Antonovka, Grey reinette, James Grieve etc.) Thanks Stefan -that is my plan to do both, but I wanted to start so much. And Saturday is best to start. At least so they do say in Poland (must be some superstition...)

[@ghanemghanem7520]

Stay To Me

[@ankebrodauf8011]

Don't you worry about microplastics/plasticizer?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

No because it’s not a degradable plastic.

[@peachesandsugar1]

Does it matter which type of wood chips you use? Hay/straw can contain toxic chemicals put on the fields by farmers to kill weeds.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I matters mostly between conifers and deciduous trees. I try to keep the percentage of conifers below 50%

[@peachesandsugar1]

@@StefanSobkowiak Would cedar chips be a good one to use around veggies?

[@Bernie5172]

Hay Mulch made the bush fire burn harder and it killed all my trees. I wont be doing that again.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Ouch! Chalk it up to a learning experience.

[@Bernie5172]

@@StefanSobkowiak Yep. planted 50 new ones since then .they are growing great

[@DavidfromMichigan]

6:00 lol. Don't do that.

[@dgfhujdgfhujgjbch7980]

STAY TO ME

[@StefanSobkowiak]

What does it mean when you write 'STAY TO ME'. I'm not familiar with the expression, can you explain please.

[@RUIGARAGE]

🙄

[@svalrobin]

im kinda disapointed, plastic lover granpa

[@ravenwolf7128]

lol--"only bending down 20,000 times to plant perennials but not 25 anymore". even 25 year old might find that a lot.

[@ravenwolf7128]

love your videos--I'm trying to homestead on my small bit of land following "uncle Bills" suggestions--sometimes I still do stupid things (I'm stubborn and often learn the hard way.) thanks for your help--subscribed!

[@arthurdewith7608]

No orchardist uses plastic

[@Burbun]

No true scottsman... Lots of people use plastic, I think it's worse long term, but it is lower maintenance

[@stephaniebalducci6248]

Plastic....oh hell no! Bad bad bad

[@nonyadamnbusiness9887]

Hard to believe I spent five minutes watching this guy talk about plastic mulch.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Now you know.

[@tanarehbein7768]

Okay, I could be over simplifying, but it seems if you would have skipped the plastic you would only have one regret on this video--having to haul woodchips every 3-5 years (or enough for a small section of the orchard each year on a rotating basis). All the other problems had to do with plastic...

[@Starfucker50]

From my eperience even 20 inches of woodchips is not enough to stop bindweed, thistle and wild brambles. I have a pile of woodchips and after 1 season it is all coverred with these weeds.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

I would love to have used wood chips but the application would be more like every year or two if I put 12”. Do you realize how much I would need for 6 acres.

[@tanarehbein7768]

So, just thinking out loud, as someone with only half an acre in a pretty dry zone 4b: after I applied woodchips 2x in 5 years, yes it breaks down but it's still mulch, I only occasionally weed (usually just rake the top layer a bit or add a wheelbarrow load to a weedy spot). Could you get the same effect with a rake attachment set shallow pulled behind a tractor? Seems like you could get within one or two feet of the base of the trees. Just to turn the germinated weeds under the mulch.

[@tanarehbein7768]

@@Starfucker50 well some weeds are worth pulling out on morning walkabout. After the initial year of dealing with the seed that wants to germinate the trend is fewer weeds and grass from then on.

[@Starfucker50]

Sure Yes @@tanarehbein7768 and this is what I do weekly to the patches between my vegetable beds. This summer I developed another way for 1 patch between a little raised beds. I put some 5 inches of straw and 3 inches of woodchips on top. 3 months and no weeds by now -NONE (well some do try on the sides). And the patch got levelled with beds eventually. Might be good for orchard rows though. Must try this way on a small scale. :)

[@johnskillen6208]

wood chips .... snowblower . your welcome .

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Yes it works when they are shredded small enough, also works with shredded leaves.

[@katipohl2431]

Here in Germany ecologists warn about woodchips because they create a hostile environment and microclimate for many organisms such as bees which are nesting in the soil. Peat moss will be forbidden here in 2021. Thank you for the highly informative video.

[@Stezosledec559]

I agree, herbicide is much healthier for bees.

[@katipohl2431]

@@Stezosledec559 as a biologist I understand your sarcasm but there is many different types of solitary bees here nesting only and obligatory in holes in the earth. Microarthropods and other organisms are affected negativly as well.

[@Stezosledec559]

Kati Pohl . Yes I was sarcastic. Please do research and compare conventional and mulched (only under trees) orchard. If you have in mind hectars of mulch, then I agree with you.

[@WWPermaculture]

@@katipohl2431 There are also a lot of benefits so applying wood chips. In Australia eco fascism, as Bill Mollison called, it warned about planting non native trees. The right non native trees to Australia hold a lot of water and can replace oil rich eucalyptus trees to stop the bush fire problem that is both environmentally destructive and deadly. So no intervention is perfect from a purist perspective so the net benefit or the comparison to the alternative must be evaluated. The cutting edge soil science is very pro wood chips from all of my research. In the immediate area there may be a temporary micro arthropod negative influence that I am not aware of but long term soil building and Fungal establishment is key for these systems.Look at the system as a whole over time.

[@StefanSobkowiak]

Interesting! Not all wood chips are equal in their benefit as mulch. When I refer to wood chips it is defined as Ramegial Branch Fragments made from tree branches of 5cm and smaller. No tree trunks or large branches. The ratio of inner wood to bark is very important.

[@jerkball07]

Hay there Stefan. I am glad I found you year's ago. I am west of you one province and almost exclusively follow folks on my parolle (even spell check cant find correct word, lol) or further north. Your content is solid and apricated. 6:29 what is that structure over your shoulder in the distance?

[@StefanSobkowiak]

One of our two Biotopes. Structures exclusively for wildlife to use as shelter. Birds, bees and mammals.