STOP Nagging!

[@miss_whipps]

It's one thing to be a talented rider, but to be a gifted TEACHER as well is truly impressive. You are an excellent instructor; thank you for helping us!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Thank you!!

[@tonyalbertson9983]

Thank you for this video. I’ve been a horse trainer for 40 years and I preach this all the time

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Yes!!

[@patriciasweet9928]

The end of this video made me teary. You share so much of yourself, and you are teaching me to dream bigger, to be better, to recognize the beauty in the little things. I appreciate every single lesson you teach.

[@lindawalker3373]

OMG, this lesson was soooo helpful! Made my riding effort so much easier, made my horse much happier so it just rode more forward on it's own accord!! Also then helped me focus on other things like being consistent on the reins, and set me up for doing a little jumping again! Thank you so much and keep the information coming :)

[@laurahapp9840]

I have watched this video about nagging before and I remember being slightly nervous when your horse reacted to your leg at canter, as if I was the one on the horse! I noticed how the position of your upper body never changed no matter how forward he went! Then you continued the ride as if nothing had happened. This is something I have to work towards. When scared I tend to stop riding and even lean forward when what I really need to do is sit back and ride more confidently. I guess I am not sure what is on the other side of her canter! I am helped by your videos especially seeing a horse get corrected and maybe act out a bit (although with you is this is barely noticeable because you feel it and correct it before it happens.) Seeing you handle things when a horse is not so perfect is a great help to me. Thank you for sharing your professionalism with us!

[@lindav3747]

Especially love the musical ride at the end. !!!!!!!!! Beautiful in every way ! And the topic of nagging and how to instill and install cruise control is going to help me !

[@pariahmouse7794]

Wow, I guess this was timely for everyone, this is literally what we talked about last lesson, and today is lesson day, so we'll see how it goes! Making them go faster for slowing down seems like something Manni will really listen to, I am going to try today! Thanks so much as always!

[@MrsC48]

I remember being in a lesson and one of my trainer's students was riding in the arena at the same time. She said 'excuse me' to me and then yelled at her student to stop clucking so much, "you sound like a chicken!" LOL The student was constantly clucking at/nagging her horse. It's so easy to fall into the nagging habit. I think the horse actually enjoys the responsibility and having a job to keep going until told to do otherwise. Good advice!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Haha!! That’s funny!!

[@sheritaylor3903]

Thank you for this. Especially when you were verbalizing "I will not support you", "I'm not supporting him". When I see your feet moving in videos I'm wondering (it's my own ignorance) if you are giving an aid at that moment or if it's just the rhythm of the horse you're going with. Your verbalizing everything while seeing it made it crystal clear to me. All your videos are excellent...I've created a riding bookmark on my computer with your videos!

[@nabilbugaighis9246]

Always wondered that too while watching these videos. It looks like she is constantly using her legs to drive the horse. It might be she is giving different aids, or like you said, its just the natural rhythm of riding.

[@alisonholtom160]

Brilliant video Amelia. Guilty as charged! Thank you so much 🙏

[@vickiehunt2676]

Just what I've been working on! My horse shut down from my nagging and I've had to start over with him just going forward from a light leg. I've had to take off the spurs and use the whip minimally. He would simply stop, balk at going forward and kick out at the whip. We had to start with a simple halt-walk transition and make it absolutely consistent and clear to him. It's painstakingly difficult to go from showing second level to basic fundamentals. I know that we will hit a wall going into third level if he doesn't go forward from a light leg. This restart takes time and practice. It's been more difficult for me to keep my legs quiet and not get focused on what I know he can do rather than what he's actually doing. Its so easy to fall back into bad habits. Having a ground person has helped keep me from nagging and manage my frustrations with the process. Thank you for this very valuable lesson.

[@helenscanlon8698]

Boy, I went through this exact thing, we must be doppelgangers!!

[@annerlandsson8984]

My horse also acts like this, he stops and kicks at my aids. He also bends his body to avoid going forward. I will certainly try this way.

[@carolinlarson4089]

Very timely for my horse and me! JoElyn watched my lesson with German today and recommended I look up this video and watch it. As you know, I expend a HUGE amount of energy “telling” my horse to either go forward or stop bulging sideways. In fact, it begins with a sluggish start right off the mounting block. As you say, it gets to where I work far harder than my horse. Today, we focused on going forward, not accepting the slowing down and immediately correcting when my aids were being ignored. We accomplish so much when I can get my horse forward and listening to the aids! Who knew!?

[@ChrisBurkart]

I know I get tired during my lesson and I don’t know if she perceives this when it happens but my trainer always asks if that was my choice and now I know why that is important! Thank you

[@leanngarofalo2355]

Just finished a lesson of leg, leg ,leg!!! WOW will definitely stop nagging and give this a try. Thank you!!

[@hal448]

Thank youuuu!!!!!! My horse and I have been working on this but you’re video made it click. Cant wait to get back to the barn and work on it more!

[@sylviawong2292]

Gosh thankyou for this. My horse would be less resentful and I would be able to progress if I was aware and fix this habit. 🤦🏻‍♀️

[@skywild4023]

Super helpful lesson! Amelia is an exceptional instructor!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Thank you :)

[@Irishope]

Really coherent with horsemanship groundwork. You add pressure once and the horse needs to answer so you leave him with more comfort instead of constantly pressuring with legs/hands/etc. Very instructive :)

[@amandadonaghey7540]

Super helpful and timely. Thanks 👍☺️

[@motled]

7:39 omg. is that a gallop? scared me a little. 😨☺ I keep replaying that bit to learn your calm and control. Love it so much. You are an amazing teacher. My kids and I learn SO much from you! Thank you 💗

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

just a little bit of an increased tempo, not quiet a gallop :)

[@motled]

Thanks for the friendly response. I’m internalizing the poem you shared in another video: “A Promise to My Horse”. Love your content. I’m impressed there is so much amazing relevant content here that goes back years and answers questions I have and even questions I didn’t know I have.

[@somethingaboutdragon]

Guilty as charged. That's why I searched for this exact thing. Thanks for the tips!

[@Genxtravels1979]

This came very timely for me as well. Thank you for posting. I nag and need to stop.

[@teresarottle1493]

Thank you Amelia! For explaining why ! It's not ok to nag, your horse. ❤

[@lauramonahan9343]

Love your videos and quiet training style. Thank you for these.

[@mary-brookedenbigh8004]

Thank you! This is so helpful!! My horse definitely likes to slow down and/or stop sometimes when he feels like it, rather than when I want him to. Can’t wait to work on this!

[@kellyerobinson7813]

WOW this is exactly what I was working on yesterday. Are you sure you weren’t hiding behind the tree watching? Reinforcing this message is awesome. I saved the video and will watch it again seconds before mounting. Thank you 😊

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Yay!! Glad it was helpful!!

[@SandraChaisson]

Great video very helpful and I LOVE that horse what a nice boy.

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Me too!! He’s the best!

[@ebonynewell639]

Fantastic video! You are such a lovely rider and great teacher, can’t wait to practice this in my ride today

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Thanks so much!

[@shirleybroady1844]

A great reminder. Be careful you don’t cheat in a lesson. That is, don’t nag to avoid slowing down for the sake of keeping the lesson uninterrupted or to avoid being embarrassed. This is like cutting off your nose to spite your face. Your trainer can’t always tell that you’re doing this and you throw away the opportunity to learn to save face. Huge thank you Amelia.

[@johnbeasley4211]

Great video and locked right in with what I'm learning to be aware of at the moment. It was waiting for me in my in-box this morning, so the first thing I got to do today was think about my riding in prep for the lesson.

[@tanyaenglish2631]

That's a great tip - a kick is from the hip down!

[@falizianme5846]

Guilty! But been working on this especially in the canter work! Thanks for the awesome tips!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

You are welcome!!

[@suebenbow6860]

Fantastic lesson. Thku

[@abbybasner3162]

Thank you for this video! It was a great reminder. I worked on this the next time I rode and the improvement in my horses contact was better too! I love your videos!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Yay!! That’s great!!

[@karencook1758]

Excellent demo and explanation. Thank you!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@cnkequestrian5789]

Amazing advice! My mare is very lazy and behind the leg in the warm-up. I'm gonna try this tonight when I ride! 😊

[@debigoehring7308]

I love watching and listening to you! Thank you! I love how honest you are too!!! Encourages me so much!

[@maggiepie8810]

I've been struggling a lot with nagging with my seat. I was taught to ride with my seat as if I'm sitting on a rocking horse. 🙈🙈🙈 This is what I've been doing with too-hot horses (they have to go slower or even halt or rein back) but I've never thought of reversing it. This is so clever, thank you.

[@hopescott9740]

Amelia, this was excellent! thank you!

[@mousegray4239]

This is so helpful thank you, as we often half-bate a horse, they can learn to be lazy and are nagged. thank you most useful

[@sueschmitz2170]

So guilty!! Trying to be more mindful. Thank you!!

[@diannlandau7578]

Guilty as charged! Working on it constantly- not nagging

[@realisticequestrian8229]

I had this light bulb moment in my last lesson. I was frustrated that my lower leg moves so much and my coach just said "he's not in front of your leg - it's not really your position. He needs more impulsion. " Then we both realised that I was LITERALLY bumping him on every stride to keep him going! 🤦‍♀️ So we used this method of taking the leg off and making the mistake of walking, then a BIG correction to make him shoot forwards. Seeing you explain it just reaffirms that it does indeed work and I just need to work on that for a while!

[@bogdancostea294]

excellent indeed! really hard to do, but if managed, this little lesson is priceless. while every horse is 'different', the principle here has to do with the rider and that is really valuable.

[@barbstrona1]

Makes lots of sense. I hope i have the energy to do this! Isn’t that Natasha’s free style?

[@StubbornRider]

Very helpful video! Thank you for this!

[@worththewait8349]

LOVE this video Amelia. Thank you

[@equestrianlife_2069]

Thank you so much for making this video! First of all, I never realized that it was a bad habit. When I first started riding (about a year ago) I didn’t use a whip or spurs and barely voice control. Then a few months later, I got spurs and a whip and I relied on them a TON and I feel like my leg got weaker and my horse wouldn’t move as well when I didn’t have them. This video helped me so much! I’ve been trying to not use my whip or spurs and he’s been getting better about it! Thank you!!!

[@danamoore3025]

I love this. I think I will watch it every time I ride. This helps so much. also very cool horse!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Awesome! Thank you!

[@engstromlena2690]

Very well explained! Thankyou

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Glad it was helpful!

[@patriciasaul9544]

THANKS!!!

[@ellienikolova9072]

I have been taught that I should ALWAYS have the lower leg on lightly, and for example when doing circles that my inner lower leg should press every stride to keep the horse going. So I feel like this is exhausting to begin with, but also makes the horse numb to my driving aids and then I need to kick even harder to get him more forward. It's so frustrating! I don't have my own horse, so even if I make him a bit more responsive with transitions, next time I go we're back to where we were because he's ridden with nagging all the time.

[@raversmead]

Brilliant video. I am working on this with one of my horses at the moment, and I feel this has really reinforced what I'm doing with him. So thank you 🥰 Just gotta stick at it now, it does feel like a constant battle some days 🥺

[@angelynroca6810]

Super helpful, thank you!

[@marylyncahn102]

Great video!! Thank you!! Very helpful!!

[@barbaramartin8861]

JUST LOVE THESE VIDEOS! Thank you so much...I am working on exactly this with my GRP mare, who is a nice feisty 14.3 - just the right size for me...and she DOES exactly this! PS: LOVELY RIDE...LOVELY TAIL !

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Yay!! Thank you!!

[@shirleybroady]

I remember when I heard this advice for the first time and had the revelation that nagging was not only counter productive, it was also exhausting. I found that I was working harder than the horse, not just some of the time, but all of the time. It was the opposite of the objective of horse training. It was easier to break the habit when I saw it as a reward, not only for the horse, but for myself. The observation that the horse was training me was enlightening, embarrassing and proof of how much smarter he was than me. I also became aware that I was so mindlessly busy that my horse couldn’t sort out the nagging from the intended aid. For example, the aid for a flying change couldn’t be felt because there were no quiet intervals. Still, I am burdened by the need for good timing to prepare for the change, executing it and recovery . The change or the transition or whatever, is only as good as the communication that is made possible by the quality of the gait which depends on the connection,balance, throughness, straightness, etc, etc. Add to that a super sensitive and talented horse that expects accuracy and you realize the constant battle between ignorance and knowledge that is dramatized in our sport/art.

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

[@bonniejordan8192]

Great video…thanks!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

You're most welcome!! I'm glad you liked it!

[@erinnb8063]

Would you be willing to talk about nagging with half halts? I feel I am constantly nagging my horse to slow and rebalance which at times leads to her running through the bit on the long side or diagonal, but supplies nicely in circles. This may also be a symptom of her being a show hitch horse 50% as well. Maybe you have insite and watchouts on dressage work with harness horses.

[@MP-bx3uj]

I have this exact issue with my horse as well. I would love a video to help with this.

[@paddyfromculmore8597]

super interesting video. I am also guilty. but never has anyone explained it so clearly. Thank you very much

[@eileenludlow5919]

Thanks once again for a great video! I’ve been told not to nag and I understand that part of it but still struggle with keeping independent aids. Just the thought of putting leg on or kicking more makes my upper body tense and my hands pull.

[@michelekanefsky7511]

So very helpful! Thank you thank you thank you!

[@cdom17]

Very interesting as usual, many thanks!

[@emk7132]

Your videos are so valuable!!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Glad you like them!

[@paddyfromculmore8597]

started working today. last time I made progress with the correct timing for the canter jump. Unfortunately, I had a relapse. Cause I'm falling forward and not enough for my driving leg. So I got started with this video today. And I was successful. And forward and the canter jump was good too.

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Yay!! Super!!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

I hope you enjoy this one!! If you haven't yet, be sure to sign up for my FREE webinar on Dressage Rider Position. www.ameliasdressageacademy.com/riderpositionwebinar/

[@amanda7263]

I’m a beginner just learning western at this point. This is super helpful though. Also, I don’t care what anybody says, but I think dressage looks like teaching your horse to dance, which is kind of amazing! 🎉 I’m not sure it’s what I may learn one day, but you look really beautiful on your horse. It’s very together. 🥰

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Thank you, and yes I agree, dressage looks like dancing!

[@zeiders.equestrian]

I have a lazy horse that goes really fast, does that make sense? My horse is stubborn but our trot and canter are too fast! So when I try to slow down the canter I am pulling and kicking and at the walk too, I find that I kick every stride and she is lazy now.

[@betsysmall3576]

Super helpful!!

[@laurenparisien5066]

This was very helpful! However, if my horse breaks into a canter, and I did not ask for that, my instructor does not want him to go, even just a few strides.

[@spiridoulaathanasopoulou9244]

yes, I do.

[@phyllismathews594]

Thank you for this video. I feel like I am not getting any reaction when my mare slows down. I will make sure I am not nagging. Do you have a session discussing the proper use of a dressage whip? I don't feel my legs are consistent or ready for a spurs. Or do you prefer spur before dressage whip? I am gaining so many learning nugget from all your teachings.

[@yvgfjayne]

What about the horse that wants to get super speedy, especially the longer we work (the TB in him)

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

I have a video on hot horses. Google it!

[@glennvannijevelt1133]

@@AmeliaNewcombDressage Ha. Yes. That’s the problem with my horse too!

[@danielepayen-jaekel8104]

Yes, it's a challenge to learn the right amount of legs and right amount of off!

[@helenscanlon8698]

My nagging is with collected canter. My girl is not naturally active and I've been successful getting nice activity in walk and trot and working canter, but collecting is hard!!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Yes!! It’s hard in the collected work not to nag but very important!

[@lizsmith1393]

So helpful

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Glad it was helpful!

[@rachelnarofsky1044]

What would you recommend for a horse that is inconsistently responsive to the leg, but then runs at the trot/canter because he’s not balanced? I feel I am asking him to go forward but then having to pull back to slow down his front end.

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Hi Rachel! He sounds needs to go back to the basics and find a balanced rhythm. Try some groundwork with him to vary his routine and make him aware of his body and find some self carriage from the ground. Here's a video of groundwork basics that will help! kzbin.info/www/bejne/fIGUgKxmesSYpNU Also, I'm giving a free webinar on the Dressage Training Scale, you will find it really helpful with your journey! You can sign up at the link below! I would love to see you there! But if you can't make it, sign up anyway as we can send you the recording! www.ameliasdressageacademy.com/trainingscalewebinar

[@suetye9850]

Always kicking try to allow the self carriage but forget

[@pninnabokov3734]

Thank you, Amelia, for these great videos! Do you have a video like this one, but what to do when the horse speeds up when you don't want him to do so? The same principle as this one, but rather than slowing down or stopping the horse starts to speed up and when I try to slow her down, she will just stop. Many thanks!

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

This video might help: kzbin.info/www/bejne/q3m8f3aPpN2hhbc

[@pninnabokov3734]

@@AmeliaNewcombDressage Many thanks, Amelia!

[@alisha_k]

This is a great video! I think my horse tends to quit in the canter when I get a bit tired and don't hold my independent seat and body position properly ... is it a fair ask to expect her to keep going even if I tend to get a little floppy in the saddle at points?

[@michawika8991]

Hi Amelia, thank you for this lesson. Anyway, I have a question in trhis topic. Especially, when I am riding quite young and still unexperienced horse (6yo), which is a bit lazy one (maybe even not only a bit), I have some doubts regarding 'the border' between when I am still reminding him to keep up with the right tempo, and when I am already nagging. I am not nagging him as uncontrolled habit, but sometimes I've got the feeling I need too often use my leg aids to bring him to and to keep the requested tempo. Since he is lazy, sometimes it takes even 30-40 min to get him in front of my leg. Then of course he is different and I stop nagging him, but I am not quite sure about the time before I get him in front of my leg. My question is what is your recommendation how to keep balance between the right level of leg aids and not getting to the nagging habit vs. teaching a lazy horse to keep a right tempo in a 'cruise control' mode?

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Great question! I have just the video for you to watch: kzbin.info/www/bejne/h3PYlHWjfpaFd5o

[@amandafrench8047]

but what do ye do when you are re-learning trot canter transitions , the canter in and of itself then canter trot transitions. What go ye suggest fir me..if ye have the time. Ta.

[@joannesimpson1490]

This is very helpful thank you! I find my horse suddenly stops if I stop riding, or even if I praise him. I don’t know if he was taught a pat meant he was done in his previous home? I find the gait I have to nag him the most in though is the walk. He will immediately slow down the second I stop nudging him and if I give him a couple of kicks in quick succession, he will speed up, sometimes going into trot, but immediately go back to slowing down in the walk the second I take my leg off. He even comes to an abrupt halt if I stop riding him forwards altogether with my seat. So I definitely find the walk the most frustrating gait to keep him in front of the leg! Do you have a video on improving the quality of the walk?

[@cdesserich7509]

What exactly do you do with your body/leg to correct him when he slows down?

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

add the aid and then release it!

[@sammaggiesam]

My horse has become dull & dead to leg. He wasnt always like this. Only in the past 18 months, as he lost an eye, and we've worked hard with a lot of ground work restoring his confidence. He is great to take out....now. I feel his confidence is still an issue as Ive lost the forward. I know Im the cause of this. He is 15 now, lost his eye at 13. I dont want to push him or upset him due to his injury. I'm making excuses....poor boy he lost an eye, he cant see like he used to etc & creating the problem as I find I back off🤷‍♀️😌

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Your horse will look to you for guidance even more know. If you treat him as you did before the injury, he will act as he did before the injury. If you ask for less, he will give less.

[@joannareid3289]

I’m riding a ‘plodder’, a school plodder. I only get to ride once a week and can’t wait to see if I can get her to listen to me eithout nagging

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

I just did a webinar on rider Position. Check it out: www.amelianewcombdressage.com/free-rider-position-webinar

[@ksanguinet1]

Wonder how u correct the horse speeding up instead of slowing down

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Check out this video for help! amelianewcombdressage.com/dressage-training/how-to-relax-your-hot-and-tense-horse/

[@lindog51]

What aids are you using as a consequence? I found it hard to see in the video. You mention a kick, but I could not see it. Thanks as always Amelia for your helpful videos.

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Yes!! I did kick him. It was just really fast and he reacted quite well to a small kick!

[@suzannahkolbeck6973]

Challenge: lesson horses that do not respond to light aids, and so I get on a horse that's light, and apply aids, and they take off, and I freak out and grab at their mouth to slow down, and then I am the problem. :( I really need help developing a more confident, independent seat, but only taking two lessons a week it is hard.

[@katearcher8881]

What helped me is to use neck rope (not instead of bridle, but with it). I’d ask for canter and when the horse took off, I’d pull on the neck rope instead of the reins. You could also try grabbing some mane, but I tend to lean forward when I’m doing this. Another solution is to ask your trainer to have a lesson with your horse on the lunge line and you without reins.

[@Let-it-rainn]

Two lessons a week? I take 1 lesson a week.

[@Life.on.the.wrong.leg2020]

I understad what you are trying to say, but you're riding a forward/not lazy horse how do you get this done for a lazy horse? and what if you don't get the response you want on you whip or spurrs, not forward but buck?

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Same strategy for a lazy horse!

[@CDN_Bookmouse]

When people aren't used to riding this way, it can sound sort of cruel when you try to come in and change it like no, that's big kick time, be firm. But imagine every time you went out with someone they were just constantly poking you in the ribs? It would drive you insane. Horses are so smart, they figure out really quickly that it's a lot more peaceful to just trundle along as they're set than to have someone constantly prodding them. From what I've seen, they greatly prefer this kind of riding to the kick kick kick kick approach. But boy is it a hard habit to break for everyone haha

[@cxs-yp6oc]

Very Good advice, being in the dawn of my riding, I have yet to really "nag" I think, except maybe with one of the horses who will do anything to not work and I think I am a little over accommodating catering to him and I don't want to "nag" with. But like I said, I will be sure not to do that and be watchful not to nag. Really enjoying your videos and your advice. Thank you

[@shelbsue1]

Would it be the same process at the walk?

[@miakay958]

I just started riding again after a long break. I ride a beginner horse who’s super lazy. Ny trainer keeps telling me to constantly apply pressure with my calves when we walk in order to make him extend his front legs. He tells me to constantly use my legs to make the horse move and not slow down. The whole class I have to use my legs to make the horse move. Otherwise it just slows down a lot. From your video I see that this is wrong but what am I to do? The trainer keeps telling me to keep doing it and this horse is known as super lazy. It doesn’t move otherwise. Help 😅

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

Yes!

[@betsysheridan4971]

u r awesome!

[@roseshak8440]

I am also not that neat and detail oriented either, lol

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

😂😂😂 I was debating if I should edit that Out!! It drives my Husband crazy!!

[@pariahmouse7794]

I am the SAME, and my old instructor, who just retired, was as well- things like running the billet straps under the straps on the saddle pad is something I almost never do, for example, (also, what are the straps on the front of the saddle pad even FOR, haha? I have never once used them!) my old instructor didn't care, she cared about the important stuff, haha. It really stinks that she retired, I am horrible with change, I am trying hard to give the new instructor a fair chance, she is the polar opposite of the old one, but if I can put my ego aside and not be so hyper- sensitive she might really be good! She IS painfully detail oriented, though, we'll see how we get along! Did I mention I'm sensitive, haha? 🙄

[@emk7132]

Do you always have a special treat like that at the end and I never noticed before?😃

[@AmeliaNewcombDressage]

hehe it's not always caught on camera

Exactly what my new teacher is telling me to do 🙃

[@victoriahongisto2903]

But what if you can’t be quiet in the seet🙈😭

[@amandafrench8047]

this is an EVEN BIGGER FAULT on my part than the contact concept. Definatley this one tomorrow 5/28. One thing at a time fir me STOP NAGGING yer lesson Horse (MANDY)