Succession - Roman and Kendall first and last scene - They're bullshit

[@michaelcowan2853]

The difference is that in the first episode he was pretending to believe it was bullshit in order to protect his pride. By the last episode, he really believed it was all bullshit because he had no pride left.

[@lyddig]

Jeremy looked so young in s1 it's crazy

[@2011hwalker]

The pilot was filmed in late 2016 so its been a while....

[@DavidRamos-sr8cx]

They all did. Marsha does look younger.

[@Jows65]

Yep, was just about to say the same thing!

[@FM0621]

Frank looks so young too! Feels like the first and last season were shot 10yrs apart, not 6

[@00st307-m]

@@2011hwalker Oh wow I didn’t realize that! Just assumed the Covid years hit everyone super hard

[@terrycullen3302]

The fact that Kendall says they're not bullshit is wild, when less than a minute before he was on the floor fighting Roman in view of a major board vote.

[@DrHeyder]

I think brothers fight everytime, just like that

[@billyobfas6962]

You’d probably do the same if your brother insults you and your kids in front of everybody

[@leonwilliams9589]

@@billyobfas6962 well technically, they’re not his kids to insult…

[@kathrynorozco5416]

They love each other but Roman was out of line for what he said about Kendall’s children. Roman and Greg are the only family members that he’s going to have contact with which honestly is for the best because the rest of them are really really toxic for him to be around especially Shiv

[@hippocratesm.d.1543]

@billy If he does, i will go full Cain on his ass!

[@AA-qb7ni]

That first scene feels like a lifetime ago. Everything really did change.

[@alonsoboulevard]

and yet, nothing ever changes...

[@randylahey8174]

I think the point is that nothing really changed. The attitudes expressed in the first few episodes stayed the same until the very end. The show takes an anti-hero approach to character development, making the point that people can change, but they never really change at their core. Particularly for these toxic, silver spoon fed characters.

[@AmourEtRespect]

Fun fact : Roman's nickname is Romulus, which was the mythical founder of Rome, but more importantly the name of the very last emperor of the Western Roman Empire, Romulus Augustus, who after a short and insignificant reign was forced to finally abdicate to barbarian invaders. He was one of the very few emperors who got to retire without being killed

[@nightwishisthegreatestband6355]

Roman is the nickname

[@sophieamandaleitontoomey9343]

The fact that Roman is the most immature and yet most mature because he realized and accepted what their Dad had been trying to say this whole time.

[@cancerino666]

Logan was also bullshit though.

[@maaz322]

I don't think the bottom line is that their father was a wise man who knew why they could never succeed. It was the opposite, he was very dysfunctional and is the reason they are immature and unserious. Coupled with the fact there are three products of Logan all trying to destroy the other or gain the upper hand.

[@moneykenny119]

People point to Ken freaking out on his sibs at the end as to why he shouldn't be CEO and that he's not serious, but what about Logan? Is he serious? He's gone on more tantrums than anyone, including boar on the floor, regular shouting matches with his children, and chasing after Nan Pierce's car while screaming at her. They are all just as flawed, but maybe even less so, than Logan is. Ken wouldn't have been an incredible CEO, but he would have been fine enough imo. Tom is also highly flawed, such as acting like an imbecile in front of the entirety of the US senate and his regular hissy fights with Greg

[@demon238]

@@moneykenny119 Tom wouldn’t be running the company. It’d be Mattson, a person that can actually run a company, Tom is just a replaceable figurehead for optics/fall guy

[@wayothefro3249]

@@moneykenny119 For one, Boar on the Floor was an older more deranged Logan as several times the characters have pointed out that the Logan we see in the series isn't the same as the Logan who built Waystar Royco. On top of that, it is the manner in which Logan freaked out that differed from Kendall. When Logan freaked out, he still commanded the room and everyone in it with the only exception being when he chased after Nan Pierce. Whereas when Ken freaked out in the finale he reverted to a petulant child when he said "I'm the eldest boy!!!", losing the respect of Shiv and even Roman (not to mention his various other meltdowns throughout the series). Kendall saying that as his last line of defense for why he should takeover the company demonstrated that he was not a serious person like his dad or Tom as he was just a man-child going after what his daddy promised him when he was 7. Kendall would've have been a disaster as a CEO. Just like his siblings, he had a few moments of greatness but his failures far outweigh his successes whereas someone like Tom has had far more successes than failures, with his only notable failure being the Congress hearing.

[@elenikarayeva]

Wow...did not remember that first scene! That really does bring everything full circle.

[@cainandabel7059]

Roman started out knowing he is bullshit but at the end he realized Ken is bullshit too.

[@DYoutubeUser]

Nah, he thought he was one of those people that "if he wanted & apply himself he could get straight A's" turns out he wasn't. He really tried and he still failed.

[@Toxodos]

@@DKZbinUser that's a revealingly specific way to look at it lol

[@DYoutubeUser]

@@Toxodos That's his character. They all where narcissists not just Logan & Kendall. He has this "i'm too good for this rat race bs" throught the seasons until he realizes he's bullshit too. In that sense he's the most self aware character by the end of the show. The point of the show is that none of them get a happy ending cause people with their personalities & flaws are not happy.

[@lshow9]

Everyone but themselves knows three of them are all bullshit, throughout whole series.

[@threenumbnuts]

@@Toxodosnah, the “I could get straight As” delusion is super common.

[@samlasley798]

As soon as Logan died, so did the need for Roman to play the game. He couldn’t get his father's love during the time he was alive and knew it was futile to keep going on with the facade

[@FNT86]

Those two okays at the end are a masterpiece. So much acceptance and even bravery to admit it finally.

[@euclidesoliveira3034]

"smart people know who they are" - Logan to Roman back in ep 402... Roman is smart.. They are bullshit

[@nicholassmieleski9710]

It’s funny because it’s not a particularly clever line, but when Roman refers to himself first with Mattson as “I’m dumb, but I’m smart” he’s spot on. He has good instincts, he’s the only sibling that seems somewhat self aware, and he could recognize that wasn’t cut out for this.

[@illijah]

@@nicholassmieleski9710 roman actually has the common touch, he understands people….hence socials.

[@manantial773]

He is not.

[@themripley]

This show is based on King Lear and, traditionally in Shakespeare plays, the Fools and the Jesters were in fact the tellers of truth.

[@JohnDoe-bi5cc]

You win.

[@jrkastl]

So... Greg and Tom?

[@JohnDoe-bi5cc]

@@jrkastl roman saying "we're bullshit" and "look at this bullshit"

[@Andytizer]

Only time Roman sits normally in the show

[@nicholassmieleski9710]

Homeboy is sitting on a table

[@KingPWNinater]

​@@nicholassmieleski9710lmaoooooooooo

[@Roman888]

Jeremy's "background acting" from 0:47 onward is just devastating. I stand by the take that Kendall was the hardest character on this show to play, and Strong nailed it.

[@Drroccy97]

Lol you can literally see Kendall dying on the inside real time. What a great actor

[@wrestlinginfodude2644]

Kendall roy is one of the greatest television characters of all time with Jeremy giving one of the greatest television performance of all time

[@Theprophet524]

This show is a masterpiece.

[@ellethegenie]

Looks like Roman genuinely caught Kendall off guard with that kiss. I wonder if it was improvised

[@MichelleseaChelle]

😂 maybe it was

[@goldbigeagle6772]

Check out some script to actual shots comparisons, a decent amount of it is improvised.

[@allovertheshopmum]

@@goldbigeagle6772 oh this would be interesting -- where can i see these?

[@actualnotanewbie]

Two things about this: 1. Roman saying that they are the BS when he mocked the system as being BS in the first episode shows how assimilated they became into their dad's game over the course of the series 2. It's interesting that when Roman calls the game "a cage to me", Frank looks at him with resentment, as if he's taking his privilege for granted. I wonder if Frank now understands how right Roman was, that the whole game is a cage for the children.

[@CompleatedMagic]

Apparently Roman liked being in the cage though, when they were kids.

[@spacecadet2172]

It’s not a game. It’s actually a serious job and real work. “Serious people” like Frank, Gerri and Karl know that and have spent their entire careers doing real work. The fact that all 3 of them (Frank most of all) had to take time away from actual real work to babysit these 3 petulant, idiotic adult babies is why he is so resentful. At one point Logan even unceremoniously fired Frank just so Roman could “play house” at this job. It’s a game to these 3, but not in real life.

[@actualnotanewbie]

@@spacecadet2172 That's what I had thought at first, and that was probably a big part of it. But "the game" (running in circles to compete for their father's approval in order to get the CEO) is all he knows, so he associates that with the system his dad has placed him in. Him not treating the "game" like the serious work it is goes hand in hand with him feeling privileged to participate.

[@pietzsche]

@@actualnotanewbie The thing is it's a bullshit game, but it has serious consequences. The thing is only the kids weren't aware of the consequences part.

[@user-pr5ip2qy4j]

This show was so good, I cannot find anything even close to the brilliance of Succession.

[@Blue-ub8ld]

Mad men I would say it’s better than succession although succession is there at the top

[@SamSullyV]

They are all bullshit. Roman gets it. I feel bad for Kendall not because he didnt win but because I'm not sure he can ever realize that.

[@slayerduval1]

Well done. Roman always knew it was a game. His only "defect" was he was too sensitive. Such a brilliant show.

[@jackashmore]

People say Rome didn’t get a happy ending but I think through it all he will have the chance to be happy. Sure he’s screwed in the head but who doesn’t have struggles? He accepted who he is at least and has a chance to change. Ken will Kurt cobain it and shiv will hate her life like her mom. Con, well con was interested in politics at a young age.

[@Emy-fv5ny]

Yes, I think he is the only one who is free and relief. Accepting they are bs it's the most close to an epiphany he has.

[@fluffywolfo3663]

Con will be fine.

[@pintolerance785]

​@@fluffywolfo3663 he's a plant that grows on rocks.

[@FM0621]

Con will always find ways to stick to Willa who will forever be trying to run away from him, but not his wealth.

[@Onechance_ngl]

He was my favorite character. He definitely had the best ending and journey. He wasn’t as attached to the company as the other two. He just wanted to be close to his family and loved in my opinion. Ken and Shiv actually wanted to be bosses with power and are worse as people. Roman isn’t a good person necessarily, but lashed out because of his pain and suffering. In the end he looked like the weight of the world had been lifted and his siblings were still broken. Not saying roman isn’t broken but his reaction versus theirs let’s me know his heart may have been in the right place all along.

[@natemccollum3731]

Rewatching and realizing how much “serious people” was said in season 1.

[@manmo0808]

That’s the key theme of the entire show. Logan’s Kids were never serious people. None of them deserved to run the company.

[@sonchik6324]

God, they both look so young and fresh in the first scene

[@c70734]

This was one of the best scenes of the entire show. Acknowledging that their company, fortune, legacy is built on bullshit and lies and he was ready to get out of it all and pass it to the next guy to keep the bullshit train rolling. Like so many corporations in the world today, great scene.

[@ciscoramon3673]

The bullshit line has more to do with them the siblings than the company itself but ok

[@divingstation95]

@@ciscoramon3673 It's the company too, though. "bullshit news"

[@c70734]

@@ciscoramon3673 ok expert lol

[@dominicjamescunneen1740]

when the failson finally accepts reality

[@0SecondsAgo]

Omg Frank looks so young in s1 it's crazy!

[@connorm1817]

Roman knew this was a cage and he stepped into that cage/ Co-CEO role just to play out his own little power drama and it was a game to him. He didn't actually care about the company like Logan (or the guy who bought ATN) do. THAT is why he is not a serious person.

[@tabaxi]

kind of, but sort of the opposite. logan was the one who constantly referred to ATN as a game, because he knew what the world really is. why they're not serious people comes down to what marcia said - "he built you a playground and you think it's the whole world." they all thought it was a game, cause that's how logan presented it, but because they had no frame of reference for anything else or what the real world actually was they also had no ability to do anything except treat the world like one big game. take everything too seriously but also never serious enough. that's why they weren't serious people.

[@connorm1817]

@@tabaxi So you're saying that they grew up thinking that everything was a game because they didn't have the context of anything other than this big game their dad brought them into at a young age (9, like Kendall said)?

[@tabaxi]

@@connorm1817 yeah exactly. that's why they treated the people around them and the world like nothing mattered, if everything is a game then nothing has consequences. they weren't built to do anything else and couldn't form meaningful relationships - but it's on logan for framing it like a game first and not giving them context for anything else while also expecting them to have it

[@connorm1817]

@@tabaxi that makes sense. It's also logans fault he didnt have a proper successor then, because he wasn't smart enough to put them in that position. Its probably also impossible to do that because of the fame and money and power. It's a tale as old as time

[@aguy3203]

Kinda funny also that Mattson killed Logan but the kids couldn't

[@joncumber2020]

Good catch. I knew he had said it before but couldn’t recall when.

[@SNIPERVIPER141]

Frank in the first scene, oh man. He knew just how rough the world actually was because he was so seasoned. He cared about Ken the whole time and you could hear that he was kind of sorry when telling Ken he lost the vote because he knew how crushing it was to that kid.

[@kabirgupta3706]

Ugh the contrast... He's just so so broken in the end. It hurts.

[@13strong]

I love how this show portrays the different effects of emotional abuse and neglect. Kendall desperately wants to be his father, so emulates him (neglecting his kids and the women in his life; being big and loud as a stand-in for knowledge and ability); Shiv defines herself in opposition to Logan, but ultimately still wants his approval and love; and Roman has absorbed the abuse and believes he's worthless, leaving him essentially nihilistic and without any self-respect.

[@Emy-fv5ny]

Wow, Roman saying bs as a joke to fianlly accepted it's not a joke, they actually are bs. At least he realized and accepted that fact.

[@anabolicchicken4115]

Funny enough. I dont mind spoilers at all. Now that I am reaching the end of the show its quite clear the only person with some semblance of self awareness is fucking Roman lmao

[@freecaseyanthony312]

Jesse Armstrong is a genius are you kidding me!

[@johnpulawski35]

kendall looks older man

[@2011hwalker]

This pilot was shot almost 7 years ago

[@johnpulawski35]

@@2011hwalker gah damn son

[@parsoumash]

He's been through a lot. His aging makes sense even within the show narrative.

[@CompleatedMagic]

This show is 7 years old??? WTF

[@rdablock]

@CompleatedMagic damn... 2018 was 7 years ago 😞

[@johnmichael_]

Love the character arc 👏

[@alexanderchance1049]

What character arc

[@sarahbgln]

Bookends. Roman Roy style

[@askalides]

This scene made me feel the same way when in season 1 of Westworld Dolores finally becomes conscious and is able to see the world. These three Roy kids have been so encapsulated in their world that have been incapable to see that there is no real conflict in their struggles, when they "lose" they get paid BILLIONS of dollars. Roman finally being able to see that, and realizing that this whole 4-season period has been entirely meaningless (in terms of real world) is one of the biggest revelations for a Succession character.

[@moonlightfitz]

yes they are

[@jupinski]

In a way, the "We are bullshit" sort of represents the limitations of the show itself. The revealed approach preferences you can't escape in a television production. It is a show, and it thinks it needs to keep your attention by always deviating from what it could make it standing out from the rest. Succession isn't about the regulation of a company, the inner office spaces or the technicality required to manage huge media and "information" industries. It does create a lot of fuss, just like everyone else, in the same way of everyone else. There is no deviating pattern. Every episode, the more you go deeper into every season, is asking you to feel the tension in the childish-adult intricacies of the family and whatever and whoever gravitates around it. Nobody else matters, just like Roman's worldview. You can mock everyone else, but you cry if you get mocked. You always need the catchphrases, you can't silently sit in your room for 5 minutes. You need the mockery, the "say everything but add a fucking", the simplifications and the extremes, in order to keep your attention to life. Succession repeates itself in every season. There is no unpredictability in how the directing method wants to make you feel as unpredictable and in the treatment of "key moments". I just feel like it could have been such a better, much more original work than this witty, attractive yet very torbid show. Succession makes you feel the savagery of royal families. And you want to be one of them. You think you could be one of them because of how it simplifies the transactions between parts. Kendall bets on everything. He uses his numbers as if they were candies. You are never shown all the boring paperwork or a deeper, complex solution to a problem. You are not shown the maybe existent, maybe not, technicalities of the characters. They seem like they have read something out of reddit and got inside of the building. All you are shown is their witty speeches and confrontations. They seem like you. And you keep wanting to be one of them. Why? Because for once, you want to bet on the game of life-industry without having to worry about the quality of your next dinner. You are so protected in your insurance and endless resources that you just can't but bet it all on something, in order to not feel just like a bored heir. Much ado about anything.

[@jaketaz2848]

Roman underwent Jokerfication

[@atlntcostv7293]

Meticulous writing 🤝

[@TheSalamlimlom]

Full circle

[@briangingull9641]

Frank looks older in season 1.

[@thecharlemagnekid9997]

I think you could make an argument that Rome is the only Roy with a character arc. In season 1 he didnt have the nerve to support his brother for CEO but in the end he stands by Ken and its Shiv who fucks him over.

[@AmourEtRespect]

You missed the part where Roman hesitated during the vote and decided to side with Shiv the moment she left the room

[@justacommenter]

Ken's arc is losing his moral high ground and becoming his father. Shiv's is a pretty similar arc but with the challenges of being a woman grounding her in how shitty it all is, and she ends up in her mother's position, but also within her relationship she sees the dynamic flipped. Roman plays the game for the love of his father before coming back to what he knew before, that it is all bullshit.

[@jcnom6606]

Nothing happened

[@imocarneiro7537]

Foda pra caralho

[@Trazynn]

Zero character development. Because he never needed any.

[@rpfcreates4476]

Idk they wrote this ending to be “tragic” and when you know you want something to be so specific in tone, you can force it. It’s Armstrong’s story so it’s his right but this was over the top and a dumb ending to me. Shiv wouldn’t relegate herself to second fiddle to Tom. She would rather die: no way would she get over mattson screwing her over either. Shiv would more likely bleed Kendall for a high ranking role to begin plotting against him immediately lol. Roman would be Roman. Kendall would be a great ceo sometimes and an irrational one too often. But I get it, they had to tie a neat tragedy now on the “cycle of abuse” and sibling rivalry at all costs including logic.

[@justacommenter]

Nah Kendall crumbles and loses the run of himself as soon as things go poorly or becomes his asshole father when things go well, and Shiv saw that. None of them are the same people they were in season one. Ken's morality is beyond compromised, it's corrupted. She could see that he would say anything to get power and go back on it just as easily, so how could she trust him? Also, doesn't it make sense that they would get sick of all of it? Ken wouldn't because he's been raised with nothing else to live for in mind, but the other two would want to end the suffering now that their father wasn't in the picture. And as for Shiv playing second fiddle to Tom, that's par for the course. She played second fiddle to her dad, and then to her brothers, and compromised her morals repeatedly over the course of the show. She can't really feel too betrayed by Tom considering the circumstances meant she wasn't getting the position anyway, and the fact that she always treated him awfully when she had the upper hand in the relationship.

[@Didymus1984]

Serious people get over their daddy issues. End of.

[@chapman2001]

It’s a shame the show tanked in season 4

[@jrkastl]

You're the type of person who puts mayo on a hot dog. Just to be a "unique" contrarian.

[@nickzee1637]

Hopefully with Succession done we can see a lot less swearing on our screens

[@jariushoffman2884]

fuck that

[@JBJblaze]

Being someone who prefers less swearing and to swear less himself... do yourself a favour and just not watch HBO or other premium station for that matter. Swearing on your screen is not their problem nor is it the least of your worries.

[@pintolerance785]

BAD LANGUAGE! THATS NOT CHRISTIAN!

[@annkey4091]

With all that goes on in some of our "Christian" pass-the-plate churches, the use of profanity is the least of things why people have taken a powder from church.@@pintolerance785

[@roccoclaps3098]

Now I have to see it again. THANK YOU!