SUPER SAIYAN 3 IS DUMB?! | A Dragonball Discussion

Goku and his Super Saiyan 3 is powerful, but is it a useless technique? I go into the details of this transformation to see if it's been any use in Dragonball Super, Dragonball Z...or ever!
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[@Marshiemewo]

Technically, SSJ3 could've been meant to end fights quickly with the ridiculous boost.

[@thefuture269]

GoldenFredboy Goku turning SSJ3 in Budokai 3: "Let's finish it!" Still one of my favorite lines from Goku/Sean

[@itasukekuromon518]

I really like vegetas line "Saiyans are a true warrior race! Don´t underestimate us!"

[@PokemonTrainerRed01]

That's funny because the only time he ever does that is against recoome and never again. He'd drag a fight out against a butterfly if he could.

[@alexfraser8352]

yet it never, ever did.

[@Etheoma]

@DavidProducts Isn't SSJ Blue kaioken x 10 the same deal though... obviously yes SSJ Blue Kaioken x10 is far stronger than SSJ3, but I mean you can't hold the form for long and it's only meant as a quick burst to defeat enemies you couldn't otherwise. Which is why I don't think Goku has a new form because we have seen him use SSJ Blue with Kaioken x10 against Jiren in the OP, he wouldn't use it if there was a new form unless it's even more stupidly power hungry, which I don't think you can get much more power hungry without killing yourself in the process.

[@BC21beats]

in goku's defense he was dead when he learned it so maybe he couldn't judge the power waste

[@superkamizack2]

I would agree with you, but he even states that it consumed too much of his power, which is why his "1 day free pass" was cut short, and he knew it would be. He also stated he wasn't sure how his living body would handle it once he was brought back to life.

[@BC21beats]

Zack McTigue right so he knew it would drain energy but he didn't know to what extent

[@superkamizack2]

Ah, I misunderstood. Fair enough

[@ammash3000]

Also in his defense he was not preparing for some big battle like he was when mastering ssj1, he was just trying to find out what the absolute limit was to where he could take his power... making the most of his eternity in the afterlife and all. That is why ssj3 was the most powerful form he had at his disposal when the time came to fight buu rather then a completely mastered ssj2 form.

[@Gotz_the_iron_hand]

Well 3 is useful in the afterlife because the power drain basically isn't a thing. Hence Goku trying to master it. He could handily use it in tournaments or battles there. On Earth however, the only two possible uses it might have is if you need to beat someone who is two or less times more powerful than you in ssj22 and you couldn't for whatever reason master ssj god or blue as you could stomp them quickly being at least twice as powerful as them so your form wouldn't run out. The other being if you would get instantly killed in ssj2 and need to run out the clock till someone more powerful shows up or make a quick getaway and didn't have instant transmission. Basically, it's better to think of 3 as an ultimate last-ditch desperation attack rather than an ssj transformation. For that matter ultimate ssj has a few uses I can think of as well though limited ones. Say you have an enemy basically immobilized and can't actually harm them with ssj because they have some kind of defense that renders them too tough to damage only they are rooted to the spot in using it or they are slightly tougher than ssj to the point your attacks are like mosquito bites but are really slow. That or Gero or somebody built a super saiyan resistant fortress you need to break into and you can't go ssj2 or above, or maybe Chi-Chi really needs you to open the world's most powerful jar of pickles. Nothing is totally useless even if it is really, really, really impractical most of the time.

[@DrPhil-rg2pe]

Vegeta cant go super saiyan 3 because he keeps his pride in his eyebrows.

[@thatvolvoguy6565]

Dr. Phil 💀

[@darkhero352]

These are facts.

[@electroosis]

Thats steve harvey in your profile pic not dr.phil

[@nomemesforu1328]

Magic_Burger *whoosh*

[@kazyvad3962]

Lol love the steve harvey pic with the name dr phil

[@01pigoso]

The My Bulma form is the strongest

[@RahulKumar-ey9xl]

Pigoso Pig Well its the strongest in terms of catching people off guard!

[@01pigoso]

yeah

[@gingeetheginge6071]

Pigoso Pig NO. Farmer with shotgun form is the best!

[@MoostachedSaiyanPrince]

Pigoso Pig Yeah, but if anyone other than Vegeta uses it, things get really awkward.

[@TylerCharlesFisher]

That form is even more difficult to master; you have to actually like Bulma.

[@SWad250]

I always felt that the biggest factor that hurt SSJ3 was that the people using it never actually USED it well, baring the DragonBall content after the Buu Saga. Goku claims he could have solved the entire Buu problem when he was Fat and Kid, but didn't because he didn't want to be the hero anymore (despite ending up that way more or less in the end). Then we have Gotenks, who was just so damn cocky that he just blew what little time he had just to display his strength. If either of these guys actually cut to the chase and just killed Buu, then everything would be great. But they didn't, and that just cemented the form as cool but ultimately pointless.

[@TheGeoXWar]

Swedish X SSJ3 couldn't beat Kid Buu because it drained him and kid Buu and fuckton of stamina. Gotenks just got distracted and absorbed before he could finish him off

[@seandobbins2231]

+TheGeoXWar Goku said he could have defeated kid Buu at full power, but let the fight drag on to allow Vegeta a chance to fight.

[@seandobbins2231]

***** what I'm saying is what Goku actually said to Vegeta, it wasn't Vegeta's guess.

[@jaycorp.7222]

I agree

[@Malthizar]

To be fair, SS3 is the only transformation to never defeat an opponent. Even SS4 was able to defeat Baby

[@PlagueOfGripes]

If your potential ki is a bunch of wood you can't find, and turning SSJ is setting fire to the wood, SSJ2 would be having 100% of it all neatly piled and finally in order, all burning at once. SSJ3 would be throwing gas on the wood, and maybe some TNT. Does it burn way brighter and more intensely? Well, sure. For a few seconds, as embers and bits of corpses rain down on you. Grade 2 and 3 is sort of like picking up some of your wood, lighting it on fire and throwing it into the dark in the hopes it'll land on more wood. You'll get more fire, but you lost a lot of wood. They're all basically the same exact form, just using fuel in different ways.

[@dsg2v]

.......get back to drawing butts plague. Who told you to stop drawing?

[@SWad250]

I enjoy when you make metaphors, Plague. Usually.

[@diegomedina9637]

And there's Plague with the wood knolege.

[@Rahhelthethird]

What's Imoya's powerlevel and is she stronger than Broly?

[@WyrdDarcnyzz]

Where does Saiyan God form fit into that analogy?

[@xred_spider_9157]

Super Saiyan 3 is meant for quick to the point battles. Basically, meant to deal the final blow!

[@Deverosfear]

It's the super Saiyan equivalent to KioKen?

[@magentapurpleyap5566]

So basically its like the juicero of super saiyan

[@SuisLBC]

I get it but it’s still not really worth it just master 2 and you’re good

[@erinblue4043]

Maybe Goku never fully mastered this form that's why he was unable to control his stamina.

[@randalljolla]

It's dragon ball, the old transformation always gets thrown out the window when the new one comes. SSJ 3 probably can be mastered but when the god forms came around made it useless. When Beerus one shotted Goku that's when SSj 3 became useless

[@randalljolla]

Plus power levels don't make sense at all

[@daca4571]

+Randall Jolla a full powered ssj3 would be powerful as fuck though .trunks with full powered ssj2 was at least keeping up with everyone

[@randalljolla]

Young V.L. It's Future Trunks, he can do anything

[@ZigTheHunter]

It never really accomplished anything in the Buu saga either, so it was never really useful.

[@daca4571]

+ZigTheHunter I wouldn't say that unless it was a dub mistake goku said he could have killed fat buu and gotenks vs super buu remember that classic throw down

[@DominatorLegend]

SSJ2 is and will always be the best of the "normal" super saiyan forms. It's basically an enhanced version of SSJ form without serious drawbacks.

[@shamimaaktar2449]

Here is the thing trunks never went ssj2 only ultra saiyan that's why I think trunks hidden power was ssj2 like teen gohan. But with a hint of god ki that's why his hair is yellow not blue. His form has a tiny hint of god ki. But its actually ssj2 like teen gohan.

[@PANICBLADE]

No Shamima, he did go ssj2. It was spoken in dialogue. Nobody is assuming.

[@CaseJurassic]

No MSSJ is the best super Saiyan form

[@scottbaker4505]

toriyama said ssj2 and ssj3 had draw backs in a interview for BOG. each saiyan transformation past ssj increases ones saiyan instanct .the cockyness the saiyan attitude. its why ssj was uses for ssjblue because it keeps there mind and personality pure. ssj2 and ssj3 dont.

[@xSilentZeroXx]

Which is a hell of a thing to say since SS1 did the exact same thing. But through mastering the form, Goku and Gohan were able to suppress those effects. Logically speaking, there should be nothing stopping that from happening with SS2 and SS3. Of course, in the case of the latter there's still the power drain issue, but the former? Its only "drawback" is that it sort of makes you angrier, and it's shown that you can sort of "train" out of that (which Trunks seems to have, since he can keep his cool as a Super Saiyan 2).

[@R3dbul7]

I think you're over exaggerating how much energy Super Saiyan 3 exerts. While it does exert a lot more energy than Super Saiyan 1 and 2, the power increase from Super Saiyan 3 is well worth it. Yeah, right now, Super Saiyan Blue is overall better, but in the Buu saga, Super Saiyan 3 was needed to keep up. It also lasted a decent amount of time too, the only reason it seemed like it was exerting a lot is because Buu was practically invincible. Super Saiyan 3, with it's power output, aims to get the job done quick, but Buu being able to regenerate was not a good matchup. Against other opponents, Super Saiyan 3 would be awesome. Also, Masakox says Kaioken is his favorite technique/transformation because of it's drawbacks and feeling of suspense it adds. Isn't Super Saiyan 3 like that?

[@Brandonhung95]

I agree, and remember when Goku went Kaioken in his Super Saiyan Blue form, when he was fighting in the Universe martial arts tournament? That took a huge amount of energy, just like SSJ3.

[@Random1567]

JaRedBull kaioken can be added on top of SSB and base, so it's worth it since new forms from now on won't make it irrelevant now that Goku has God Ki. SSJ3 is made worthless by having SSB, but since kaioken can be added on top of god ki forms then it will never be made pointless. It's basically SSJ3 done right.

[@gingeetheginge6071]

JaRedBull I guess if you're a Saiyan completionest you could master SSJ3.

[@liyifenn]

You can't really die from SSJ3, you'll just get tapped out of power.

[@veggy4216]

Well Kaioken destroys your body and 3 just drains energy. Just cause it has drawbacks doesn't mean it has the same effects

[@simipour5577]

These "work arounds" like SSJB were not available in 1994.

[@placeholdernameless8569]

But still, To use the same kind of thing like how he Pointed Out with Super Saiyan 2nd & 3rd Grade, And Blue Which also takes a Lot Out, They should have kept Super Saiyan 2.

[@saramarie9091]

SSJ3 is best as like a last effort move.

[@GizzakOlden]

Was*

[@insidetrip101]

Until we get Super-Saiyan-Blue-Perfect-Golden-form-3-Kaioken-x20. Just wait, it'll happen.

[@Gokussjdensetsuno45]

Super-Hyper-Ultra-Mega-Omni-Saiyan-rainbow-red-blue-golden-4342121-Kaioken-over-9000

[@insidetrip101]

Nameless Avenger Win

[@NocturnalNugget2]

at the time for a last ditch move you might not have enough energy to activate it not to mention sustain it

[@Jesterclown17]

One thing's for sure... The Bruce Faulconer score for the transformation was awesome.

[@nintendogeek24005]

yeah,from what I heard the number of song Falconer himself did can apparently be counted on one hand

[@HyperShadic600]

It was the only good thing from the over ridiculous scene.

[@isaacfgarzav]

just imagine Ultra Super Saiyan 3 Kaioken x20... Like, if the form existed, would it even possible to achieve for Goku? not maintain it, achieve it, maybe yes but would die immediately

[@Lin15900]

I thought ssj3 is only 4x stronger than ssj2

[@slejszer6640]

it is

[@pinkfrosteddonut1915]

It is but he said 800 times base

[@Geekdom101]

our dear friend needs a haircut!

[@MasakoX]

+Geekdom101 I'll go get the super scissors!

[@otherfligg3503]

I like the figmes in the background

[@otherfligg3503]

+MasakoX Also you make a Fantastic point

[@bman2cool4u68]

malachi malone probably less hair in base.

[@theriverswarning]

@@MasakoX Goku: *goes ssj3* don't even think of touching my hair, or popochi will get you! AH POPOCHIS BEHIND ME! HE SHE TOOK MY MUFFIN BUTTON! AAAAAAAAAAA-*wakes up next to Chichi, but as she rolls over she has Mr popos face* Goku: AAAAAAAAAAA-*wakes up being punched in the butt by Broly* Broly: I TOLD YOU YOU WOULD BE PULLING BROLYS FIST OUT OF YOUR BUTT!

[@eivarden]

(1) While it drains Goku's stamina, he mentioned he needed more time with it, and I feel it can be better with enough time. (2) The logic of "It drains stamina, so the increase isnt worth is" is wrong, as the ability is situational. (Examples being Kiao-ken, and normal SSJ as it also drains more stamina to maintain for long periods of time) Think of trunks vs freiza. since SSJ takes up more stamina, it wasnt worth 1 shotting freiza in SSJ? (3) Goku mentioned that with training, you can get used to the requirement, and keep it up full time with normal SSJ, so it's not far fetched to assume similar means to increase duration of other SSJ forms is possible. (4) With SSJ Blue, NOW its pointless to have SSJ3, but prior, it wasnt.

[@YoungSkullKid1990]

To add to this...the reason Goku didn't suggest 2nd and 3rd grade Super Saiyans is because of the speed deficiency. Not necessarily the Stamina drain.

[@majorearl12]

Yes and no, any form can be in this same boat "with enough training then it could be good", it was pointless before as Vegeta never bothered with it, much like how he didnt bother using Ultra SS (Super Trunks form). The thing is, SS3 while as strong as it is, tears your body up with how much energy and stamina it drains. Not to mention it seems to be that alot of energy is wasted through the power up seeing as it was literally out of control whenever Goku transformed, but when Gotenks used it, seeing as he was in the Hypersonic Lion Tamer, it didnt show any major out of control nature. Trunks although been training ever since he went back to his time, never achieved the SS3 form, mostly because he wasnt in Otherworld and didnt know of it like Goku figure out, but also when he almost matches SS3 Goku in just SS2, which is a much more stable form, there is no point, same with Vegeta, he could match Goku in just SS2, the form itself requires blood to be shed for you to even train with it, signing your life away to achieve that immense power, ONLY IN OTHERWORLD IS THAT POSSIBLE. The SS3 form has always been a neat form, personally i love the SS4 form as it is the perfect fusion of the Saiyan powers together in one package that is more stable than Full Power SS. SSB at this point in Super doesnt even look like a decent form and just has become a throw away form for Goku and Vegeta.

[@akritos546]

Before the whole super saiyan blue thing ssj3 would essentially be the "I've got no other options" form. When shit gets real ya gotta put all your cards on the table.

[@henrywalsh]

My personal thoughts on it are as follows. There is call to use it. If you can't turn Super Saiyan Blue, and if your Super Saiyan 2 isn't cutting it, then Super Saiyan 3 is worth the risk if you already happen to know how to do it. If there was no Super Saiyan Blue, and since Super Saiyan 4 isn't canon, then becoming 4 times more powerful can win you a fight if you have no other option. There are better options, but I wouldn't call it dumb. Calling it dumb just because there is a Super Saiyan Blue now is kind of like saying that a person in 1952 was dumb for driving a roadster because we have modern Corvettes now. Sure, we do, but they didn't at the time. Also, it should be noted, we don't canonically know what Super Saiyan 3 looks like mastered. Goku was very clear on the fact that he had learned it while he was dead and hadn't really gotten used to it. We have no indication that he ever did get used to it let alone mastered it. Its probably less intelligent to use it now, of course, since Goku has Super Saiyan Blue, but before he had that... It was the best he had so... Using it? Not dumb as long as the stakes are high enough.

[@darkhero352]

MrGladBEAST Well why would he use any super saiyan transformation if he has blue. It's just different tools in his arsenal.

[@matthewhouston9584]

I think what he means is at a time when SSGSS didn’t exist yet, if you didn’t have Potential Unleashed, SSJ3 was your best bet if a fully mastered SSJ2 wasn’t enough

[@JohnNy13375]

Henry Walsh Toryama said ssj4 is possible

[@BreitheNua]

@@JohnNy13375 Yes, but Goku no longer had his tail and with GT not being canon, he's unlikely to ever grow it back, thus making SSJ4 inaccessible to him. Sure, maybe Bulma could whip something up to make his tail grow back, but they first have to even think to do that. What could happen to him to even have him consider trying to get his tail back?

[@RM-bg5cd]

Henry Walsh does the analogy holds up in terms of the DBZ story though? Because that person would be driving a Corvette in 1954 following the timeline lol. SSJ3 feels unfinished actually, I hope it somehow comes back. Also, just realized this was a 3 years comment I replied to, smh.

[@shirobrief3538]

I say it for years, I get shit from angry fanboys... Goku says it himself, everyone agrees... It is clear i´m not Goku, but fuck fanboy denial. Also the long hair and namekian eyebrows, just no. It is the kind of thing that when people like it, i lose faith in humanity. :P

[@MasakoX]

Everyone's got a little Goku inside of them. When you're hungry, think of him.

[@IceBreaker165]

i just like the look and serious vibe goku gives off, i think SSJ3 goku really is awsome

[@shirobrief3538]

That was so corny... And don't say "mmm, corn"!!! I wonder if you not fully loving this transformation will play a factor whenever you get to that point if you do, with the abridged series.

[@shirobrief3538]

I lost a bit of faith... just right now... Lol i´m kidding. From my end looks cumbersom and deformed... I have the same issue with SS4, is not so much the design, which is cool too, that the fact that i hardly recognize the caracters anymore. Those desings im my opinion would have served a bit better for new characters, more than changing so drastically such iconic designs as Goku's.

[@nzekwefiction]

Shiro Brief thank you for finally putting into words, what I've been trying to explain for years.

[@Rahhelthethird]

What's up with MasakoX's math? SSJ is 50 times stronger and SSJ2 is a 100 times stronger and SSJ 3 is 400 times stronger than a base Sayajin, yet he keeps saying SSJ3 is 8 times stronger than SSJ2.

[@MasakoX]

Yeah I got it mixed up there! Ooops!

[@ppnono17]

Atomic Munchies nope.

[@ppnono17]

www.kanzenshuu.com/battle-power/databook/

[@1doomphd]

no, ssj is actually 24x 2 is 2x greater and 3 is 4x greater than that. .

[@mr_dino4222]

.......where are you getting the 24 from? akira himself stated that ssj is 50 times stronger than base form when it was first introduced. 3,000,000 times 24 is NOT 150,000,000.(before going super saiyan, goku's official power level when he fought freeza was 3,000,000. and after going super saiyan, it jumped to 150,000,000. a 50 times increase)

[@illogical1421]

Super Saiyan 3 is what means going further beyond limits, what too much raw power can do, that's the whole reason to it I believe, well back then at least since it was supposed to be the pick of the Saiyan transformations that's why it was so meant to be so hard to control, now Goku can control it easily lol

[@noahtackett6264]

I don't know about easily but he has better control of the form. I wonder what would happen if he did super kaioken in ssj3

[@QuakeGamerROTMG]

To be fair it is a pretty massive amount of power. When Goku came back to Earth he didn't know how draining it would be, sure I bet it still drained him a lot in otherworld but he made it pretty clear that he didn't expect it to wear him out as much as it did. That is why he was shocked in the final battle against Buu when he wasn't able to get his power back from resting while in super saiyan 3. And if Goku hadn't fought using super saiyan 3 he would have been so much behind Buu that it wouldn't be funny. Evidence: Goku and Vegeta were still quite comparable in strength, no massive difference. When Goku fought kid Buu using super saiyan 3 he was not only on par with Buu but according to him he was stronger than Buu (hence why he took a rest to get his strength back). Vegeta on the other hand could not touch kid Buu using super saiyan 2. There is clearly a huge difference between the two forms and was basically the only hope of Goku, bringing him at least to the same level as kid Buu. So to put it simply it was a crutch, his last ditch effort pushing himself past his limits. Unlike the form Future Trunks or Vegeta took however super saiyan 3 is just plain more powerful as long as you can hold it so it was worth trying to hold the form for the added power, again this is against Buu where if you aren't stronger than he is you would never bust out the power to completely destroy him. Now with Dragon Ball Super it has become irreverent as super saiyan blue gives more power with zero strain on the body until we almost inevitably get a super saiyan blue 2 or something.

[@noahtackett6264]

Well... The Royal Blue form is like a ssjb grade 2 I think

[@RaphielShiraha64]

@@noahtackett6264 the official name is super saiyan blue evolution

[@noahtackett6264]

@@RaphielShiraha64 well given the official name sounds stupid, I've elected to ignore it lol Royal Blue is way cooler than "ssjb evolution"

[@PainCausingSamurai]

I'm pretty sure SSJ3, and the Buu Saga as a whole, was just Toriyama making fun of his own series.

[@YounesLayachi]

lol ^^

[@BigGeekEmpire]

It was. Toriyama is a troll and know for constantly parodying himself and other animes or things. That's why it's my favorite arc because it's Toriyama being Toriyama at his most.

[@CidGuerreiro1234]

"Toriyama being Toriyama at his most" would be the original Dragon Ball and Dr. Slump.

[@adrianpaul1985]

Because it was insanely long, had an infantile villain, "bigger hair means more power",comedic and just...weird.

[@kingpeso4240]

PainCausingSamurai Ssj3 was just to buy time for Goku

[@jackjacques7495]

Well its definetly the least efficient of the basic 3 forms, but calling it useless its going too far. Since its 4 times stronger than SSJ2, then it still has its uses. I mean, if you're fighting as a SSJ2 and your opponent is a bit stronger than you (or even twice as strong), wouldn't you rather have it to end things quickly? It would save your life. The problem is the battle where it was used to its fullest (Kid Buu) was against an opponent who not only was really close to it in power, but also had super regeneration and apparently unlimited stamina. I mean, are you kidding me? The one time we get to see this strong but draining form in action for real (no holding back) and its against a dude with unlimited stamina that can regenerate from almost anything. I know its defects but c'mon. It was the worst possible match-up as well. So if your opponent was as strong as Kid Buu, but with no broken/unfair/hax regeneration, then it wouldn't be dumb, in fact it'd probably be enough to win before it runs out. While if you were stuck in SSJ2, then that'd just be the end for you.

[@wyvern0m3g42]

I'd also like to add that part of the problem involved in that fight was Goku holding back just enough so that Vegeta would have a turn against Buu. If I recall, I think Vegeta asked Goku why SSJ3 wasn't enough to kill Buu, and Goku admitted he held off on finishing the job so that Vegeta would get his chance. Knowing Goku's track record of doing things like this (such as letting Frieza reach 100% of his strength,) I wouldn't be too surprised if this is partly to blame for SSJ3 looking somewhat useless as a result.

[@DanielMWJ]

Super Saiyan 2 Kaiouken x8, basically. Except you can't blink hack it. And it doesn't actually injure you.

[@RazgrizXMG0079]

MasakoX seems like he would be a total joy to hang out with.

[@kbennett365]

I love SSJ3. its my favorite transformation. he can't keep the form because he never tried to fully master it. that's why he can only stay as it for so long. I feel if he took the time and spent lots more time in that form and trained more in it he could fully master it and could control it more and stay in it way longer.

[@cupgg21]

Agreed i absolutely love it too and its sad he never bothered with it.

[@SUPERVEGITO554]

SSJ3 might have its problems, but it still had a better transformation than SSJB. SSJ3 was a big plot point in the Buu saga, and when Goku and Vegeta went SSJB, the transformation was practically skipped over, like "Yeah, we can do this now. Deal with it".

[@alexmansfield3268]

SUPERVEGITO554 because super sayian 3 was only useful when goku was dead. His body can't handle it alive. Plus the only way vegeta could get it if he died and went to hell where the laws of time and space are irrelevant. Then remember when super sayian 2 was also a game changer. People barely remember it besides gohan

[@Whynaughteh]

SSJB is basically going Super Saiyan whilst in God form... I mean the original name... SSJSS kinda explains that....

[@Mohrrix]

Didn't Goku in the Buu saga just go Ssj3 and basically said "Yeah, I can do this now. Deal with it", same can be said to Gotenks

[@Whynaughteh]

Marko Radetić Goku did against Fat Buu because Goku could have actually beaten Fat Buu He did it against Super Buu because he wanted to use that power to keep Super Buu at bay to fuse with Gohan as fast as possible.. and using it against Kid Buu was a mistake....

[@Mohrrix]

JR Texx That's cool and all, but if you look at Ssj3's winning record... Oh wait... It doesn't have one, does it?

[@razmere924]

Also I read somewhere that SSJ3 only exists because the writer FORGOT that SSJ2 was already a thing. "Check it out! Goku has a new power up and hair style! I call it Super Saiyan 2!" "Sir, you already made a Super Saiyan 2." "I did? When? Who did that?" "Vegeta and Gohan in the Android Cell saga." "Oh, right! Well let's just call this Super Saiyan 3 then."

[@originlollol7]

Raz Mere That sounds exactly like something Toriyama would do.

[@YeYe-rc9pw]

He is rather forgetful.

[@stunned_iroiki]

that makes no sense cause he showed off ssj2 right before he turned into ssj3. plus goku fought majin vegeta while in ssj2, sooooo? .-.

[@kirbystarwarior]

Nitpick but Vegeta didn't go SS2 in the Cell saga. He was an Ascended Super Saiyan.

[@gladehartdreamer5620]

that is because before toriama actually released the frigin manga he had the editors or whatever read it, then they had him correct the script and goku ended up saying what he did.

[@DeepRuffian]

the reason why vegeta laugh at ssj3 was because he knew he couldn't do it

[@tmjm-qp7jo]

Pewpewboomshot I think ur dumb

[@bman2cool4u68]

Random Video Channel no, its because he knew that the amount of energy used up for the form was a joke. Why use a form that used so much energy? when you can master the 1st and 2nd levels to use even less energy and train your base form to get an extra boost in power instead. Look at SSBEvolution as an example, it's super sayian grade 2 mastered with God ki, Goku isn't able to do it because he works towards new forms for greater multipliers instead of focusing on previous forms.

[@herculesburgess6773]

​@@bman2cool4u68Thank you

[@TheMisterbobman]

I always assumed that ssj3 could be refined just like 1 and 2 was eventually after getting the form. I mean even in the show it's kinda been hinted at that goku has at least gotten a better at using the form since he can go directly into it and doesn't do the whole 2 episode power up like the first time he showed buu

[@AsgUnlimited]

I also kind of have to Disagree, SSJ3 when used properly is really good.. For example when he used it against Trunks, he fought as a SSJ2 and then he instantly switched into a SSJ3 hit him real quick and changed back, ending the fight quickly. The problem isn't SSJ3, the problem is Saiyans like to drag out fights while using the form for some reason XD

[@GAPMan88]

Agreed.

[@tonyhakston536]

Maybe the increase in hair makes one think like a Raditz?

[@jtyler8865]

in the Manga goku fought trunks as a ssj3 and then turned ssjb to knock him out because ssj2 Trunks was as strong as SSJ3 goku. which is what this guy is saying. it's too strenuous to use.

[@AsgUnlimited]

Jerome Serrano The manga is none canon, you might as well say "In Dragon Ball Xenoverse SSJ3 doesn't last very long"

[@moonum4567]

Umm manga is canon.

[@davidattenborough1631]

yes but it gives you a form of sheer, raw, unadulterated power. you don't need to worry about falling out of it because while IN it everything is your bitch. vegeta is your bitch, buu is your bitch, the laws of physics are your bitch. and yes I did watch the whole video. besides, your trying to aply real life logic to dragonball. your only evidence against it is stuff that only applies by real life logic. all other concerns have already been explained away in the show. my only problem with it is that it looks dumb

[@davidattenborough1631]

great video though

[@BlazerFury01]

who did he beat with it?

[@ryuchael]

James Harris One movie villain and the first form of another so.... yeah. Even Ultimate Gohan and Vegeta were stronger in battle of the gods.

[@RetryThisPro]

Beerus aint yo bitch tho. Kid buu aint your bitch. Shitt. Super Saiyan 2 Trunks is just barely his bitch

[@AdnamaBriefs]

I agree... Logic to anime doesn't really take you too far xD Just think... So ss3 Goku = ss2 FTrunks... What if FTrunks went ss3? That's x8 power serge! You have to multiply to the original amount so ss3 would just explode depending on who used it. Although, it is not touched by Vegeta because why go ss3 when you can have ss4/blue?

[@zacktheking3218]

SSJ3 could kill you guys so I would not say it's weak

[@MrDrProfessor4]

It also doesn't have a good track record...

[@KaizerFaith]

You're wrong and completely misguided.

[@MasakoX]

I get it! ;)

[@DudeHunder]

i did not

[@KaizerFaith]

MasakoX Trying not to read this in Goku's voice... I failed ಥ_ಥ

[@jeremiahgiles3593]

SSJ3 - looks the coolest - most powerful normal transformation - has its own epic theme song - saved the earth

[@cinnamonbun2251]

-wears the user out very fast

[@galaxyrunaway]

Jeremiah Giles RIP Eyebrows

[@jeremiahgiles3593]

Cinnamon Bun -retains it's badassery

[@cinnamonbun2251]

Jeremiah Giles I know it's badass, it's just so inefficient to use.

[@jeremiahgiles3593]

jaime ruiz eyebrows would make it look funny

[@kissland29]

when masako said it looked like two sausages stapled on his forehead, i cant unsee it

[@L0AInk]

"Oh dear it's another person going Super Saiyan 3 damn aliens" And my one "veCHEATER"

[@PrimeroJinJusuke]

Actually, it's 4x stronger than SSJ2, but 8x stronger than SSJ1. Look at it. Yx50x2x4=Yx400.

[@lamalien2276]

No, it's double super saiyan 2. According to Toei animation notes.

[@lamalien2276]

So its 4x super saiyan, and 2x SSJ2, and power level 780 million sccording to Japanese DBZ cards. So double Goku's SSJ2 power level.

[@PrimeroJinJusuke]

LAM Alien No, it's 4x Super Saiyajin 2.

[@brandongreen6491]

good vid but ssj3 will always be my favorite form

[@pigbacon_]

Ssj2 is my favorite

[@randypence6289]

True Pride SSJ3 is more of a transformation technique similar to Kioken. Since he says he was taught the technique in the otherworld. And that's why Gotenks could use it. Trunks and Goten learned it when they asked Goku to demonstrate it.

[@lostsoul7345]

same here

[@ssj1k650]

Brandon Green same

[@rampantsarcasm2220]

Well, one thing I'd posit forward, you remember how during the Cell Saga Goku and Gohan train super hard so that they can maintain SS1 without any effort or energy drain? What if you managed to do the same thing with SS3? Would it be worth it then?

[@BreitheNua]

Really late reply but, would it even really be possible with a form that energy consuming? Don't get me wrong, I think it could be mastered to a point where the stamina consumption could be significantly minimized and the transformation held for much longer, but I don't think it could reasonably be mastered to the point of zero stamina consumption.

[@opinionatedright7068]

No, ssj2 trunks was not as strong as ssj3 goku because goku was holding back in that fight and he couldve easily took out trunks at anytime this is what we call suppressed.

[@jaquan541]

Opinionated Right no dumbass Goku was getting pushed

[@pengudiegu]

jaquan541 that’s why he turned god

[@azarathomen6864]

One punch from ssj3 Goku knocked ssj2 trunks

[@drejefferson1247]

But his mastered SS2 form is still much better as in terms of usability in battle

[@azarathomen6864]

Ssj 2 is illogical now because if you can match in ssj 2 then ssj 3 that is 8 times stronger will one shot that opponent.

[@xelic1996]

Five mins is a LONG time in dbz fights though.

[@xelic1996]

Plus I think SSJ3 only had the time limit when it was new.

[@xelic1996]

Plus saying it is irrelevant now that there is blue is a no shit thing. That's how dbz works.

[@Vulgun]

Doesn't five minutes translate to about two hours?

[@xelic1996]

Vulgun Exactly. Because they are moving extremely fast. This is shown by Hit in super. The fights are not shown in real time obviously.

[@LoverBoi32697]

Wanna know something funny. Goku fought Frieza for 19 episodes. halfway through Frieza decided to blast the planet. Frieza says in 5 minutes the planet will blow. We got roughly 7 more episodes out of that if not than more. Dragon Ball GT comes around and Super Saiyan 4 Goku and Vegeta fuse. Gogeta has 15minutes of screentime. Then they say what would have been 30 minutes only lasted 10 minutes because of too mich power....wut xD

[@markgeary53]

I always thought SSj3 was more of an attempt to force more power out of the SSj transformation, much like the USSj forms, this new transformation Trunks has seems to be the next actual natural form. As you said the SSj transformation is a rage based transformation.

[@AdvyDeven]

I think this too, and I think its right. SSJ comes from rage. SSJ enhancements (USSJ, SSJ"3", SSB) come from training.

[@MamaLukuBuku]

Trunks' transformation is a false SSB transformation, I would think it is very similar to the false SSJ transformation Goku went through when fighting Slug.

[@greedow]

I think trunks transformation is the middle stage between being a ssb and not being a ssb if he pushes a little more, he will turn ssb at least that's what I think

[@boanbalax8792]

False SSJ has diffrent thing with what happens to FT. But, if It's the case, I think they animated it in wrong way.

[@charliewalker6519]

if it's a false super saiyan blue how is it more powerful than SSB

[@TheDragonaf1]

Anyone know where that wallpaper on his computer came from?

[@T7Productions]

Your discussion videos seriously tickle my funny bone. Truthfully they are very in depth and intellectual. Thank you for making it

[@Arausito]

I remember in GT when Goku fought Baby in SSJ3 he got his ass handed to him cuz his body was so underdeveloped

[@MasakoX]

That and he could only hold SSJ3 for 2 minutes.

[@dbzfanzone4725]

MasakoX i thought it was 30seconds?

[@chanceofbliss8175]

By that logic kaioken is just as stupid

[@DarkSpyro707]

.......for saiyans it is. and before they knew ssj existed thats all they had, and you clearly see they dont use it anymore unless its in a ssj form and used as a last resort to the final stretch of the fight, ala goku vs hit.

[@chanceofbliss8175]

DarkSpyro707 yh but just because there are better forms doesn't mean the old one is dumb

[@DarkSpyro707]

Roronoa Zoro Like I said, its dumb for saiyans to use when there are simply better forms to take, but for something like humans, thats pretty much their only choice.

[@nyankers]

kaioken is brilliant for saiyans to use you get a chance of winning the fight, and you get a power boost by nearly killing yourself in the process! now imagine using it as a human, where you just kind of... ow...

[@storm0fnova]

Kaioken was just an asspull to make Goku relevant and competitive against stronger opponents. I'm surprised none of the z fighters learned it and Goku didn't push it past x20 (even though theoretically i see the possibility of "INFINITE KAIOKEN" granting him unlimited power if we talking about asspulls)

[@Arsio12]

I love how Xenoverse 2 handled Super Saiyan 3. Massive power boost and defence boost, but your ki barely regenerates, it feels like it hardly ever does, leaving you wide open if you try to recharge your ki. The entire form feels inefficient, but the massive power boost makes Super Saiyan 3 effective in the same way as Kaioken (quick power burst).

[@alexfenk710]

what would happen to Raditz('s?) hair if he went ssj3 would he be able to use his hair as an attack because it's so long?

[@touchingladybug9590]

Wait, trunks' ss2 is strong as goku's ss3? Wow..ss3 is pointless.

[@sarcasmos3684]

Well to be fair half breeds have more potential than regular Saiyan's, and he also trained with Kaioshin.

[@greedow]

not the same power, but close enough for it to not be usefull

[@Whynaughteh]

Not really pointless to say Goku stopped Trunks' sword.. Goku basically wanted to show Trunks' his strength

[@shamimaaktar2449]

Here is the thing trunks never went ssj2 we only assume that. He only went ultra saiyan that's why I think trunks hidden power was ssj2 like teen gohan. But with a hint of god ki that's why his hair is yellow not blue. His form has a tiny hint of god ki. But its actually ssj2 like teen gohan.

[@Whynaughteh]

***** Trunks went SSJ2 against Goku in Super... Goku literally says "SSJ2 right from the bat huh?"

[@arabhero10]

To be fair, he did manage to get SS3 while living during the fight with Buu and later with Beerus. Sure, it happened in Other World, but he's basically got it down.

[@enkiimuto1041]

And he wasn't used to it, when fighting Beerus (well, he lost but that was because well, Beerus) he got it in a second, getting used with it is like ssj or ssj2, takes a while but you get there.

[@TJM470]

Remember when Goku fought Beerus in SS 3 He had master SS 3 and had no limits

[@BeardedDragonite]

I love how northern you randomly sound at times, only just started watching your videos

[@bananatree2527]

I'm a firm believer of the "constant unchanging multipliers for Super Saiyan forms are bullshit" theory, but apart from that I think you're right. But I'm not sure what you mean by Gohan's Ultimate Form getting stronger by the second. I still don't understand that form

[@jaketheberge1970]

bananatree25 Well its ment to unlock his full potential, and to me that could mean ssj level power without having to transform to achieve it. Gohan doesn't need to burn energy transforming into another form, he's just their all the time. Its more efficient, at least that's my theory on it.

[@YusoYagari]

You take a person whos real tough. So then you multiply his power with a transformation. Then you get a stronger guy and you multiply his power with the same transformation. This guy is stronger than the first guy I don't see how thats hard to believe.

[@Goken234]

I have no idea why. The multipliers are canon.

[@Snotnarok]

With none of that power level nonsense 3 was entirely useful considering SSJ2 vegeta couldn't keep up with Kid Buu at all and was being mercilessly pummeled. Vegeta never learned it because ..from what I could tell Goku learned it (not mastered it ) because he was dead and able to do things you couldn't/wouldn't do when you were alive. Super's power scaling is so terrible it not only forgets this but has a SSJ2 Trunks helping SSJB Goku and Vegeta against Gods...SOMEHOW. Things he shouldn't be able to sense without some kinda training nevermind the power difference since SSJ2, SSJ3, SSG, SSB. How was he able to keep up at all? Or go further back ,SSJ2 Gohan wipes the floor with Cell, SSJGoku kinda keeps up. But Trunks at SSJ2 is helping something 2 forms ahead? He should be KO'd and not even know what hit him. Super can't be used for scaling because it's AWFUL at it.

[@TuberTugger]

Future trunks defeated buu in his time line by himself. So his power level at ssj2 should rival or surpass goku's ssj3. Its also notable that half blood sayians are much stronger than full bloods. I believe the assumption in super is zenkai boosts. Either way though, I makes fine sense that trunks can keep up. They never fully explained the process vegeta used to achieve ssjBlue. So its possible that its forged through zenkai boosts and just being around the ki energy.

[@Snotnarok]

***** Trunks never beat Buu, he beat Dabura and Babide before Buu could be let out. Dabura being about as strong as perfect Cell. So, mastering SSJ2 to beat him fine makes sense. But getting stronger than SSJ3 Goku? No. Smarter than Goku? Yes since Goku, Vegeta and Gohan had 10 different chances to stop Buu from being reborn or killing people. He had to be DEAD to learn SSJ3, after that he fought a powered up Majin SSJ2 Vegeta, fought fat Buu then fused to stand a chance against Gohan, Goten, Trunks, Piccolo fused Majinbuu and had to be battle hardened from all that to keep up with Kid Buu and still required the Genki Dama. Trunks could spend the next week in the room of time and space and he'd still be catching up with the battle loving Goku & Vegeta. The better explanation is, Toriyama wanted to include Trunks and went with the theme of bad power scaling and ran with it.

[@1Adamrpg]

It makes sense to me, half-saiyans are special. I read the manga, Vegeta stating SSJ2 Trunks is about SSJ3 Goku's power was surprising to me as well. I figure the year fighting Black led to a lot of zenkai boosts, haha. Either way I'll take the manga as true

[@Snotnarok]

As far as I gathered, Buu never got out because Trunks isn't an idiot and he didn't mess around, unlike his father who just haaaad to fight Goku. Not learning his lesson from Cell when he let him get perfect. Either way, if I'm right and Buu never got out, he only had to deal with Dabura and Babadi. Dabura being less strong than Cell apparently.

[@Snotnarok]

That I have trouble believing. It seemed more like the plot needed Trunks to be strong or rather that Goku+Vegeta were WAY too strong to involve anyone else. Think about it, Goku had to be dead to be able to get to SSJ3. Meaning the training was too taxing on a living person, I can't see just because Trunks was part human he made it to be that strong where he not only surpassed SSJ3 but also God and got to SSJB level. That's just goofy. Wild idea! If they let Goten actually age up they could have had him and some of the lesser used characters in Super go challenge Black for a fight that didn't require such power skewing. Let's face it, the whole end battle was goofy, drawn out and should have had a better conclusion. Down to shoddly retconning Vegito. Was not into what they did.

[@Deverosfear]

Would this mean brolly would have a less difficult time with learning it as he has overflowing energy?

[@noonnoon658]

ssj3 is like any transformation if it is not masterd you will have Problems with it ,not like what all peaple are saying that the from it self has Problem it self best examble of that is golden friza he didnt master his form so he has Problem with it beside vegeta and goku no has ultra instent and ultra ego so ssj3 is clearly is no Problem for them goku just didnt master it yet agenst buu thats all and he clearly said so ,i dont know whare peaple get the othor stuff from

[@Lost_idiot223]

2:13 If all that happen just to grow his hair out, what would happen if he was constipated?

[@KokoroNoSama]

As a man with long hair. I support the mastery of SsJ3 blue Kaioken x 20.

[@streetguru9350]

It may be pointless overall, but it still has probably the best intro out of all the forms

[@MasakoX]

Absolutely! One of my favourite scenes is when Goku goes SSJ3 in Fusion Reborn! :)

[@maestrulgamer9695]

3:27 SSj3 Goku:Stops SSj2 Trunks's attack with only his fingers. MasakoX:They are equal in power.

[@kuronyra1709]

2:16 That scene, just that scene.

[@remryukcreepy]

I think we should have more faith in Goku here, Masako As you said it, he noticed the flaws of USSJ from the get go, the reason he didn't know for sure that SSJ3 had such drawbacks was because he had never used it outside of being dead until the fight with Kid Buu, he was even surprised that he was being completely unable to gather enough energy. Yet he didn't drop the form, he spent even more time mastering it in the four years between Buu and BoG and it did him good. Heck, he was able to transform into it instantly and while he was heavily outclassed by Beerus, he didn't have much trouble maintaining the form. The reason why Vegeta didn't try SSJ3 was indeed because it would be a waste of time to him, he'd need more time than what Goku spent dead just to hold it for a few minutes. I think Goku skipped mastering SSJ2 indeed but it's because he probably KNOWS SSJ3's drawbacks can be negated, he's still figuring out how, though. Heck, in GT he apparently did master SSJ3, but then his small body couldn't hold it regardless. I don't think SSJ3 should be aspired by other people rather than Goku (at least not now that there's canonically stronger and more efficient forms), but I feel that Goku is probably the only one who can possibly master this form

[@TeddeyZzzz]

I thought I was the only one.. Phew Super Saiyan 3 is DUMB!!

[@AdamRee-lx8uh]

I have no problem with it. Anyway, he is a saiyan, not a human being. SSJ 3 made him look scary and angry like how a saiyan would look like. His face is also kind of similar to a great ape. Even Piccolo does not have eyebrows and he is also an alien. SSJ 3 is still my favorite form.

[@mahamednour8991]

I disagree with the part where you say he draws out the same limations by using ssj3 instead off ascended super saiyan especially in terms of speed. It was said in dbz that the ascended form would be far greater in strength but as a drawback would cut back about 50% in speed however ssj3 has even greater strength and doesn't cut back in speed. But I do agree that they both have stamina limations. If the ascended form can match up to only semi imperfect cell then surely ssj3 has already proven itself far more useful in the dragon Ball franchise since ssj2 was enough to takedown cell and obviously ssj3 is stronger then ssj2. But I'm not saying it's more efficient Furthermore ssj3 took on the likes of buu and some irrelevant characters here and there. That's just what I think.

[@crimsonchin991]

My favorite form is SSJ3 😢

[@jaseanims2534]

Mine too bro!

[@drejefferson1247]

Then you're equally dumb

[@TheCompleteMental]

Eyebrows man... I guess vegetas form would be one big hair spike, still though, favorite is ss2, maybe god or blue evolution

[@thisisnoplaceforahorse872]

People complain about the eyebrows but have you seen an anime before? Wacky transformations in shonen anime/manga is kinda the cool thing about it!

[@cosmicstar7473]

Mine is Ssj Blue not because of its strength because of its look

[@Whynaughteh]

SSJ3 is ok... if you want to get a fight done quick. The transformation and holding the form is tiring.. I mean if we do got back to the Buu Saga, transforming, having a fight with Buu... resting then transforming again to show Goten and Trunks tired him out

[@MasakoX]

Yeah, if you can get the win fast then it's good!

[@East_Coast_Toasty_Boy]

it was new to him then

[@Whynaughteh]

UNSC Marine Corps Spartan II: Connor-177 that doesn't change what I said...

[@East_Coast_Toasty_Boy]

JR Texx not at first no, but eventually it will be like ssj1 in the cell saga, with sustained exposure you can master it like a base form like Goku and Gohan did ss1. But it will take way longer and way harder because of the extremely high power output.

[@Whynaughteh]

UNSC Marine Corps Spartan II: Connor-177 lol what? no. Goku was training for about 7 years and only got that far, and he was training all day every day... lol.. it doesn't really matter how long he trains for it, it's not time productive for a form that may or may not be any use ...

[@Zelia_Wolf]

Now, what f you learned how to mastered SSJ3. So like Super Saiyan transformation ,and as SSJ3, and then you could stay in the form with no energy drain.

[@tonyhakston536]

I doubt anyone could survive the effort.

[@Zelia_Wolf]

Never underestimate a saiyans training

[@dgskilla6285]

@Dor-Al Kryton: Question... why would you even bother 2 try mastering SSJ3? Goku tried for 7 YEARS in the other world and failed. It's completely pointless now especially when SSJ2 Vegeta was temporarily stronger against Beerus. You might as well stick 2 that like Goku once did (in Super) against base form Black and his 1st meeting with Zamasu.

[@Shin_FTW]

Actually Goku succeeded. But the problem was that he had trained in Otherworld and was used to it in Otherworld, where it's not as taxing. It's like being used to Earth's gravity and then jumping into 100x Earth's gravity. Had Goku trained it on Earth, he'd be used to it.

[@tonyhakston536]

Shinku no Yami "Mastering" a Super Saiyan form refers to learning to hold the form without using any energy, in this context. So no, Goku did NOT succeed in mastering it.

[@Attilathepun]

How big would Raditz's hair be at Super Saiyan 3?

[@Alex-vy2zc]

Stop saying ssj3 is 8x stronger than ssj2, it is not, it is 4x stronger SSJ1= X50 SSJ2= X100 SSJ3= X400

[@zeromuramada]

he put up an annotation that said x4

[@Alex-vy2zc]

Supreme Kai Rutaba I watched it on my smart tv so I couldn't see

[@Diamonddeath]

To be fair, the Ultra Super Saiyan form and Super Saiyan 3 form differ in that Super Saiyan 3 has speed. Even if the other faults exist, it serves as a huge power boost to finish off an opponent. Goku actually was able to beat Majin Buu if he wanted to (something that was later confirmed) and later held his own against Kid Buu in the state pretty well.

[@GoldStorm07]

Wasn't that the point Toriyama was trying to make with Super Saiyan 3 in the first place? In the two previous overarching sagas (Saiyan + Namek arc, Android + Cell arc), the final battle was won through the awakening of a new Super Saiyan form that made a joke of the big bad boss. Super Saiyan 3 subverts that by bringing it in before the midpoint of the saga and displaying severe drawbacks. It also exists as a subversion of the shounen trend of serially escalating powerups that just get better, stronger and more efficient...a subversion that was lost with GT and Super, but I digress. From my viewpoint, Toriyama brought in Super Saiyan 3 as a plot device to prove that you won't necessarily get stronger by employing increasingly ridiculous super modes.

[@s.nifrum4580]

I have a question that I'd like to see answered in a video How the hell strong would super saiyan 3 be of goku ever mastered it (with great difficulty but when has great difficulty ever stopped Goku?)

[@patlefofort]

You forgot the biggest problem: The hairs. How do you fight with long hairs always getting in the way and being pull-able by the enemy?

[@Joren129]

I wouldn't say completely useless. By achieving it, it has probably helped Goku with form mastery. Kinda like how he pulled Kaioken x10 while SSJB. Actually come to think of it... maybe thats how Goku was able to get SSJ3 by having learned the Kaioken since that form is meant for just huge bursts of energy.

[@TheGeoXWar]

Joren Helixux Even Toriyama said it was useless

[@Joren129]

I think you're missing the point I just made... I'm saying it DID have it's use...I'm not saying it still does.

[@MrGMoney1944]

Joren Helixux Honestly he could do what Trunks did stay in SS2 and then right before he punch's switch to SS3 for a volley of strikes before reverting back to SS2 to conserve power though the artists would likely murder anyone who tried to implement this as it would be so much work.

[@LetsMakeItALifetime]

Is this guy the voice of goku in DBZ - abridged ?!

[@Howiebrosome]

I love your videos. Literally all of them. The only thing that I find slightly slightly annoying thing is the fact that your intros are in different keys or rather sometimes, they sound a half step up or a half step down. I don’t know if anyone else can hear it lmao.

[@michaeldenham9552]

But it looks cool!

[@thesugarfatman]

Please use the Yorkshire accent for SSJ3 Goku in DBZA. Pretty Pweese! P.S. I think you've made one tiny error. SSJ3 is 4x stonger than SSJ2, not 8x. SSJ = 50x Base SSJ2 = 2x SSJ (100x Base) SSJ3 = 4x SSJ2 (400x Base) Source: = www.kanzenshuu.com/battle-power/list/

[@MasakoX]

Yeah I got my math wrong!

[@thesugarfatman]

+MasakoX it happens to the best of us mate. Cheers! And keep the awesome content coming.

[@CodesTheOtaku]

Hey. SSJ3 is better than Super Saiyan Kaioken- I mean, er, Super Saiyan God. OOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHH~!

[@burntcheeseproductions6573]

can you make a graph or scale showing all ssj forms and ultra instinct and gohans potential unleashed and lgendary super saiyen and futere super saiyen its hard to know which are stronget than others

[@finalredemption4088]

Can you make a video about what is the exact multiplier for Super Saiyan 2

[@BNHardwarereviews]

did you watch Dragonball Super? Goku can use it easy there. no problems.

[@ggimweird5218]

But ssj3 is now pretty much irrelevant in super

[@Ashmedai]

@Gg I'm weird So is SSJ and SSJ2. This video might as well be about how all previous SSJ forms are now pointless and "dumb".

[@tonyhakston536]

He used it one time (Unless we count the BoG saga) for a few seconds and Bulma had to erect a barrier around him to prevent environmental damage.

[@Tharja-iBW]

only SSJ2 and SSJ3 are pointless. In order to acheive SSB Goku needs his SSJ form. Because SSB is basically his Super Saiyan form beefed up with God KI and proper control. While SSG is Base form Goku with a huge God KI power boost that is under controlled. It was even more shown that SSJ3 is pointless considering Goku was having trouble with Trunks in SSJ2 in the manga and then turned into his God form proving it is pointless at this point, there is no one weak enough that can fight Goku's SSJ3 form (apart from most of the U6 members) The only downside to SSB is that it drains more stamina than his regular forms however considering even at its weakest its about as powerful as SSG which took on Beerus it shouldn't be much of a downside.

[@tonyhakston536]

Tharja Is Best Waifu "Under controlled" is a confusing term. Does that mean "under control" or "uncontrolled?"

[@Malidictus]

SSJ3 is a "weird" form. The "normal" Super Saiyan forms have always looked and felt like something natural and discreet. Yes, they burn with power and rage, but they feel like a natural extension of Saiyans who use them, rather than full transformations like what Freeza would do. Super Saiyan 3, on the other hand, doesn't look or feel like a Saiyan form at all. It's a full transformation, it's unstable, it's hard to sustain and it ultimately feels like a dead end. To my eyes, SSJ3 is Goku's failed experiment similar to Trunks' heavy muscles form. It's unnatural to his body, which limits what can be done with it. SSJB, on the other hand, is represented as more of a "technique" than a transformation. As such, it feels like the logical continuation of the Super Saiyan forms. Hell, I'm not even convinced that SSJ2 itself should count as a separate form. The visual difference is minor and the power-up seems more gradual. SSJ2 scales with the Saiyan's own power level. SSJ3 doesn't appear to. Vegeta passed it without going SSJ3 and Trunks in SSJ2 seems about on par with Goku's SSJ3.

[@storm0fnova]

SSB is just Super Saiyan 1 with God Ki mastered. I'm thinking they'll add Super Saiyan 2 with God ki making it Super Saiyan (insert new colour name)

[@xxzenn01xx9]

thats what some people are guessing super saiyan rose is but. but i think rose is just a twisted god ki form since black's ki is off color in the first place. its just his OWN version of blue.

[@stable610]

The most creative intro. ‘’Super saiyan 3 is dumb’’

[@SatinderShergill]

If raditz went super saiyan would he just get repunzel hair ?

[@MainGuyHere]

You're wrong! You're completely misguided!

[@MasakoX]

I see what you did there!

[@MarginalSC]

What about Super Saiyan Blue 3 with Kaioken x10?!?

[@Lukmendes]

Instant death, for Goku that is lol.

[@MarginalSC]

***** What if he keeps a senzu bean in his cheek?

[@HORRIOR1]

Death in... well depends how many beans. 10 beans he will live 10 minutes.

[@MarginalSC]

***** He gets stronger every time he almost dies though, so it'd eventually be ok.

[@Lukmendes]

***** He wouldn't last that long, in Super's anime he says that trying to combine SSJ with Kaioken would instantly kill him because of the emotional distress, he wouldn't be able to control Kaioken, even without this information, it's already obvious from Boo saga that trying to combine SSJ3, the energy waster transformation, with Kaioken, another energy waster transformation, would royaly fuck him up, even with Senzu beans he wouldn't survive.

[@svddsosa7396]

LMFAO MASAKO WHY YOU DO MY BOY GOKU LIKE THAT IN THE THUMBNAIL 😂

[@stammesbruder]

the part about the transformation: the more grip you have over the transformation, the easier it becomes to do it- i recall the first super saiyan transformation of goku causing a storm, the first visible transformation of vegeta caused a crater, gohans ssj2 transformation caused an areal earthquake. ssj3 is described as drawing out a saiyans potential- elder kai had to dance for 25 hours- now imagine how much energy there is involved in drawing out your strength in about 3 minutes! kinda like kaioken- if you can't control your ki, it's going to put a lot of strain on your body, and the excess ki is put outwards.

[@jimbob1862]

The thing with Super Sayajin 3 is that it's essentially SSJ2 on steroids in every single regard. It gives a 4x power boost to SSJ2, but the extra drain and drawbacks that SSJ2 had were so exemplified in SSJ3 that it was essentially another Kaioken. Cool as fuck, but in pragmatic terms it's almost useless because it's not useful for more than a few minutes or so. Kaioken had the extra bonus of a potentially unlimited multiplier however, so that worked in its favour. Also, SSJ Blue is not more power efficient than SSJ3. The manga states that after a minute or two that Vegeta was at less than 10% of his full power in Blue. That's arguably even worse for power drain than SSJ3, it's just that the incredible power boost of Blue is worth the trade off. Toriyama said it himself after Battle of Gods, SSJ2 and SSJ3 were forced transformations off of regular SSJ which is why they both have noticeable drawbacks and he said SSJ1 is overall the best of those forms. Trunks is a special case because he's the only one who seemingly has actually mastered SSJ2 unlike the others who just kept jumping to the next transformation. Trunks is probably the most well rounded fighter transformation wise now.

[@Cool-Spot]

Which is why I think if it was possible to use SSG without a time limit it would be the best form since I don't think it had any power drain since he 100% god ki, unless I'm mistaken.

[@jimbob1862]

gdog662 There's absolutely no need to use the God form though. Goku has already absorbed the God ki so just transforming into i is a waste of energy. Unless we're talking about the manga where using his God ki automatically puts him back into God form.

[@1BuFo]

You are wrong. SSB does not have a power drain. They said in the manga its not a suitable transformation to keep going in and out off. Meaning going from base > SSB> back to base and then SSB again will fuck up the SSB power output. Maintaining the form itself does not drain almost any ki or stamina.

[@jimbob1862]

1BuFo In Chapter 12 when Gku talks to hit they say this. Hit: I encourage you to transform. Goku: The thing is, that burns a serious amount of stamina so I'm saving it for later. Whis then states in chapter 13 "The amount of stamina it consumes makes it a detriment in that regard". You are correct that transforming in and out of Blue worsened the burden on Vegeta, however it's because of the massive power drain it has that constantly going in and out of the form is so exhausting. Remember, each transformation takes energy to transform (barring SSJ1 since it's mastered) so to then add that on top of how much power it burns through naturally worsens the burden. It would be like Goku fighting Buu in SSJ2, but then constantly jumping up to 3 in between the fight and then back down to 2, the immense energy wasted not just from the drain but by constantly jumping up and down between forms would amplify the effect. Vegeta would have stood a better chance had he stayed in Blue sure, but the result would be the same because that massive drain is still there.

[@1BuFo]

jamal munir I dont understand where you are getting that SSB even has a drain? Let alone a big one? Its not the same as previous SS forms. To further add to that, Goku states to achieve the Kaioken feat he needed Blue because it is a tranformation that requiers perfect ki control. The way they are presenting Blue to us is as if its a supperior form especially about the drain thing, this is the reason Vegeta didnt bother going to SS3 at all. Because Blue drains nothing / way less than SS3> making the form obsolete. And to be honest I dont like the way they took it in the manga stating Vegeta was weak because of that > it goes against everything they previously established about the form. So I prefer to stick to the anime on this one. Where that thing about Vegeta was never mentioned. Kinda seems like Toyotaro fucked up. Also what you are saying doesnt make sense to me because Vegeta hardly spent any time in SSB at this tournament. A few seconds with Cabba and like a minute befaure Hit mauled his ass. If what you were saying was the case he wouldnt have been drained that much in those 1.5 min he was in SSB.

[@BlueAcid9]

+MasakoX SS2 Future Trunks is not stronger than SS3 Goku. Goku's base is higher...

[@spikegilfer1997]

In the manga he's equal. Goku snaps into basic SSG to beat Future Trunks *And does it in one move*

[@BlueAcid9]

spikegilfer1997 There's no way that Trunk's base has caught up with Goku's. It makes no sense! Goku trained for 7 years in Other World. Then he fought Majin Buu... Then he trained even more with Beerus and Whis... How the hell could Trunks have gone from being an USS in a world with no strong opponents? He only reached SS2 because of Babidi's arrival. Unless he's been training in that gravity chamber at 1000x every day since he killed Cell and the Androids... Even then I doubt it equals Goku's training and fighting.

[@spikegilfer1997]

BlueAcid9 Apparently the highly consistent Toriyama doesn't agree. Swinging around the Z-sword for years and years is apparently enough to catch up with people who got a god Ki infusion.

[@spikegilfer1997]

BlueAcid9 *His* series

[@BlueAcid9]

spikegilfer1997 Don't care. He's a senile old man. Nothing he says matters.

[@supervegito2277]

1:40 didnt goku SPECIFICALLY say Sorry bout the wait, but i HAVENT HAD MUCH TIME TO PRACTICE THIS ONE??

[@SylentEcho]

It was a good idea because it had a weakness. Better stories with twists and turns can be written around forms that have weaknesses as opposed to those that don't.

[@calebolds9609]

Didn't goku himself say the form was a waste of time because it was too strenuous on your body

[@richardflores7731]

I have a soft spot for SS3 but I admit it is pretty pointless especially now because how SSG and SSB are much better.

[@killeveryvenue]

Though goku has shown fighting against beerus and trunks that he can transform into 3 instantly. So what if he could bounce in and out of ssjb and ssj3, the way he bounces back and forth from red to blue in the tournament of power? Or back and forth from red to ssjb 3 to save everygy but get the strength of three for the attack to hit

[@42ndblaze43]

This is out of context with the video but I just can’t seem to find that really meme worthy DB dub where the line “WHAT YOU EAT MY MILK” came from