Synchronicity On the Spectrum of Mind and Matter

[@unnunn12]

Take this observation with a grain of salt depending on your opinion on psychedelics but at around 38:30, the fella speaking reminded me of one of my first LSD epiphanies. For those of you who have taken it, you understand that it is completely impossible to try to remember or comprehend the realisations that you make while under the influence, but I do remember the sentence "everything is everything it is not" making complete sense and it has stuck with me, and everytime I've tried to comprehend it myself or explain the concept to someone else they look at me like I'm a loony. After listening to this man, the knot in my brain containing the memory of that thought slowly began to unravel and develop, and it feels like I've just found a new stretch that cracks my lower back like nothing else and hot damn I am feeling good. This talk is like fucking post-acid mental chiropractics

[@tracik1277]

Makes perfect sense to me, love it!

[@kellyryanobrien1]

You definitely feel alchemy like same way I do. This description alone is an activation 🎉

[@kingcountyband]

No new age fluff conspiracy here just an educated/knowledgeable discussion based on history, theory, science and genuine interest. That's one bright group of people!

[@catherinehammond973]

Sorry that you feel that way about "New Age" teachings. They became the touch stone of my life, leading to great healing and freedom for me. when I was young. Many ways to the center, my friend...

[@reessworld]

Based

[@johnny7629]

A solid example of synchronicity is when you are typing a text to a friend while listening to a documentary and just as you type out ~ al ~(“al” for ‘almost’) someone in the documentary says, ”almost” in a sentence. That’s just one of many synchronicities that I have l been happening to me in in recent years

[@kirstinstrand6292]

That's causal. Meaningless! Only Subjective synchronicity is worthy of contemplation.

[@jimnutter6901]

Synchronicity is a glimpse of the glue that binds it all together.🌹j.

[@OttoFazzl]

This is an absolutely great discussion. Syncronicity was boggling me for quite a long time, and there are these awesome people talking about it. Thank you for sharing with us!

[@drivethrupoet]

One of my coworkers used the word Boggle today as a text response and I've thought about it a few times cause it was odd. Have only ever used the word as - mind boggling.

[@natashapope3785]

Tom Campbell quantum physiscist and researcher of consciousness , Timothy Desmond, Bernado Kastrup , Rupert Sheldrake, Donald Hoffman, so many others would be fab at this discussion. So heartening to know there are soooooo many now......

[@shwethabanavekal7487]

The answer to synchronicity was in one of the responses. From my understanding it could be an equation of time but applied in two different worlds. The shortest*fastest time taken for something to take place. It has both psychological and physical elements to it. In the example of catching a friend in a corner. Calculating the difference of time between the thought occurring in a friends mind and the friend appearing in in front of him having taken into account all the elements that influenced the thought to occur and the friend to appear is synchronicity. The reason why synchronicity is not a regular phenomenon is simply due to the number of variables involved to make that happen. However, what we need to be able to do is apply the equation of time not only to the first layer of ‘sense’ but at the least be able to expand it to the second layer of ‘thought’ While physics is able to measure the ‘sense’ and neuroscience’ is to some extent able to measure the ‘thought’ we still do not have a sophisticated measure that can put sense and thought within the same universe of measurements! So long as we do not find a common denominator for sense and thought synchronicity atleast as we experience will remain as a fantasy If we are able to measure mind, where definition of time is yet to be determined we could get one step closer to understanding synchronicity

[@markv2087]

Harald Atmanspacher is brilliant, so happy to have just discovered his work. Explaining Pauli's Quantum Holism (1:10:50): "To put it really radically ... Quantum systems do not present themselves as collections of parts, they present themselves as wholes to begin with, and parts have to be created by interaction with the system, for instance, by measurement for instance, something like that." We are also a quantum system. Which suggests that this is directly perceptible and that, if you don't see this dynamic (wholeness becoming parts) right now, then perhaps you don't yet understand him. And then he goes further: "What happens is, when you sort of destroy the wholeness, by making an interaction with the system, you generate the parts but not only (do) you generate the parts but also generate correlations between the parts ... and these are the remnants of the lost wholeness, so to speak." Wow. The correlations are generated by breaking the symmetry of the wholeness. That is totally profound, at least to this mind. They're like a poor man's version of wholeness. Amazing. And then he spoke about the relational nature of meaning, which I will have to find the time to happily study.

[@swissrootful]

as a Swiss, living in the USA for now 37 years, I too have noticed the obvious neglect of Jung int the Swiss academic society; I even had a friend who had graduated from the Jung Institute but what she is doing in terms of therapy, has nothing to do with C.G. Jung at all any longer.

[@jamesbolger413]

Surely the whole thing can be summed up simply; we are at the frontiers of physics and meta-physics and science will continue to expand

[@WhiteWolfBlackStar]

+James Bolger I'm pretty sure they were telling themselves the same thing during the spiritual revival of the Victorian and Edwardian times - remember the seances?

[@Hugatree1]

Wow what a lineup. Amazing presentation.

[@vanlookenroel7211]

Our perception of reality is created by others Those who rules the world(autors). Once you are awakened, connected with your higher self , you realize you are playing a role in a big movie. They use fear and anger to stay in that role and makes us believe this is reality. We are scared for the unkown. If you disconnect yourself from this (fake)reality created by others and starts to create your own reality by toughts and believe, your reality really changes and everything looks like one big coincidence (synchronicity). You are one with yourself (in a flow) and follow your own path without fear or anger. Just open your 3th eye!. Those people don't even have any idea what synchronicity feels like. Its a mindset!

[@kirstinstrand6292]

Francisco🙉🙊 Gil-White 😨

[@seamus9305]

I bought a truck with a square holed trailer hitch. I bought a bike rack that fit it. Went biking in a remote place and thought someone can unscrew the bike rack so I took off the bolt and locked it in the back of my truck. I began to ride and wondered if there was such a thing as a quick release hitch pin. I thought I'll google "quick release hitch pin" when I get home. I rode my bike about a thousand feet on a trail and came to a remote road. I was crossing and noticed an object in the road and thought that can't be what I think. I turned around and picked up a quick release hitch pin.

[@sixsigma2649]

Great information

[@kellyryanobrien1]

Bolt has such a meaning for me this aligns

[@kellyryanobrien1]

I just got back here but the hitch was my sync 😂

[@fredchevry5786]

A storm of words in a desert of ideas.

[@Philibuster92]

Fred Chevry exactly! All that talk didn’t produce anything new.

[@ginkanges4438]

22:02 mark Love the coffee stain on shirt of guy in background with the to-go cup of coffee.

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

Amazon workers can Prime Deliver that to you.

[@ZiplineShazam]

Your Powers of Observation are strong indeed !

[@BrianJuntunen]

How about the woman who lost her hair brush.

[@hackandslash873]

Better to use a flask bottle, make his own, cut down on trash and save money.

[@tracik1277]

You lot noticed all that but missed the woman in purple crossing her legs and flashing her drawers at 39:25.

[@rhondacase7194]

Brilliant & fascinating. Stellar panel. Love the conversational dynamic and appreciate the excellent audio & video quality too. Watching for a second time. Thank you! 🙏🏻

[@xeraph02]

Kinda hate synchronicity because everytime I get cool vision or idea and start developing it after a week or so someone else develops and publishes that idea faster than me!

[@tigers14]

lol! that is why dont focus about that idea that much unless you start doing it.

[@Gottfried1983]

That is because it's not your main path as an individual. The universe (yourself) made it happen for your own enjoyment without any kind of effort!!!

[@Diegodescortes]

There are no new things in the world, said Salomon. Anyway you can develop that project and present us your own idea and point of view :)

[@vicklarsen1092]

Is it possible,that synchronicity,like repeating number sequences are natural phenomenom,we see the same number sequences on our digital clocks repeatedly every moment of our day,day in and day out. we see those same sequences on license plates,grocery items,etc. this is what we program into our subconsious minds,it’s like programing yourself into a believe system.

[@Sicandar12]

I did from Santo Domingo Madrid couple of time, for me its a beautiful plane but now I understand why it is less common. It always felt heavy

[@watersignwater]

wow, great video! it seems to put all of my paranormal experiences in a good perspective

[@raphaelschmid2686]

Since more then ten years I literally see the number 137 at least once a day. Very often on the car license plate of cars passing by. The amount of times CANNOT be explained by any 'meaning seeking' or selective perception... It's just happening too often and since it's a three digit number, the probability of just seeing it so often 'out of the blue' is too small. I would have to scan thousands of number plates, that is not the case.. This is number is really just popping up, since more then years now, it's totally crazy!! If anybody can do anything with what I just wrote PLEASE contact me! It's important! Thank you!

[@mortalclown3812]

I wish I knew what to say to this other than finding it damned fascinating - and busting open every set of odds in existence. (I see 11 and 111 a lot, but this can't compare.)

[@baezagreg1]

Do you ever notice when you don't see that number combination? You see what you focus on. Sometimes people filter out number sequences that are insignificant. Therefore, it seems like you're ALWAYS seeing 137

[@kellyryanobrien1]

This has a stong geometry tied to it! It’s great!

[@GreenLion419]

It is indeed very important and a sign of the times... people are waking up everywhere and beginning to learn the language of signs, symbols, and numbers. Call it whatever you want but I personally call it the universal language of God. Be assured my friend that there are many, many of us who are experiencing exactly what you describe here. Including myself, on a daily basis for many years. If you do a little research you will find alot of information and testimonies of other people experiencing this synchronicity phenomenon. I pray you are surrounded by peace, and blessing, and understanding of what is happening to you and around you. I pray you come to a knowledge of the ONE and the Unity that is Spirit that provides life to all things.

[@ms.q7445]

You ARE scanning millions of numbers a day unconsciously. The reticulator activator looks for that number and alerts you to it. It’s like buying a white car and seeing white cars everywhere.

[@92359hg]

“If you think along the lines of Nature then you think properly." from the video "Carl Jung speaks about death” Bed Bugs are Sacred - Until We Meet Again - From One Mother to Another ... Rest In Peace Sweet Sweet Rachel ...

[@drivethrupoet]

What say you about this flavor: I was debating whether or not to reach out to someone I had gotten in a horrible argument with. I asked the universe to show me an Octopus if I should indeed reach out. I live nowhere near the coast. I put it out of my conscious thought, and about 2 hours later I was playing Pokemon go (yeah, laugh at me) and I caught one that evolves into an octopus-like Pokemon. So that's not mind blowing alone, but then later in the day I mentioned what happened to a friend who was 1,000 miles away. She said - a woman YELLED Octopus at me today. She used it to spell her name, O as in, Octopus. AND THEN that evening, she sent me a picture, and in the picture unnoticed by her, was the guy's name I was thinking of calling. More similar things have happened. No dreams involved. Try to deny that was a magical, divine intervention.

[@svenland6892]

Deja vu sort of coincidence? Or since these thoughts were on/in your mind, you noticed them? Like buying a new car. you drive out of the lot and all you notice are the cars just like your "new" car? Or was it Devine interaction? In this world we live in now, there are so many distractions that lead us away from our true nature. Clutter, or as I call it, something/somebody is always in the way. Somebody is always taking up my time. But down at the quantum level, we are all the same anyhow, so maybe, I am distracting myself?

[@arunimachakraborty6423]

I really enjoyed reading your comment and I was wondering if you did reach out to the person eventually and if everything turned out favourably with him? Did those synchronicities confirm themselves as divine intervention after all?

[@drivethrupoet]

@@arunimachakraborty6423 I don't recall if I did or he did before I made up my mind, lol. But almost a year later is when we totally stopped speaking. It's complicated but I know we'll meet again because of all that. There is more to the story. But now I wouldn't call those experiences 'intervention' in the typical sense of the word - it's more like guidance where we still have some free will. Or tuning into another dimension. I do still believe it comes from outside my own consciousness. But I've purposefully shut it out because it was getting scary. I still experience syncs but I don't look deeply into their patterns. Plus we all sorta lost our way in 2020, I'm still not interacting with people like I did before.

[@roopahkaur4656]

Amazing as I was listening I was thinking of yellow colour and bang on the word yellow appears

[@JadenJahci]

1:58:18 to 1:58:22 correction,...one does not "consciously" make a Synchronicity happen (when speaking of the magical magnitude of Synchronicity that is being discussed here) Just as one does not consciously breathe in breathe out. Kind Regards, Flat Line

[@kcs4652]

Maybe they meant unconsciously lol

[@natashapope3785]

Tom Campbell who wrote " My Big Toe", Tom's Park" would be fab on this panel. Timothy Desmond and Bernado Kastrup too, (so many others)

[@Philibuster92]

They mainly just talked about what we’ve already known. They don’t actually have any new insights into synchronicity.

[@josephnakagawa8247]

It’s a statistical certainty that someone would have farted in that room during the discussion.

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

ESAS Methane bomb is a statistical certainty that civilization will soon be wiped out

[@mortalclown3812]

My low regard for scatological humor from anyone past the age of four isn't about prissiness: It's about it not ever being funny.

[@trombone7]

In a room of 30 people there is an 85% chance that someone will fart every 8 minutes. That person is always me.

[@501promo]

Lactose intolerance is most likely present on an epidemic level and, it is fairly safe to assume that, in a group of this size, at least 1 person has IBS. Depending on the dimensions of the room, methane levels could arguable have reached, at least until processed through breathing, as much as 12-22%. Not quite enough to ignite but, certainly enough to be detectable from just outside the room entrance should a synchronistic chain release occur. I would also suggest that there are enough people present, that there is a 11% chance someone left with a fart-lump that required immediate retrieval...

[@501promo]

@@mortalclown3812 Prissy!

[@superpatch12]

participation mystique. observing ones own dreams objectively helps.

[@mattspin5285]

I am in the midst of a weird set of synchronicities around the surname Paul(i)!

[@redjackal5871]

It is true, that when synchronicity happens, people have mostly a sense or feeling of something good or wonderful about to happen or that might take place or mean something special in the very nearby future.... It's more a good feeling rather than a bad one..... why?

[@i_accept_all_cookies]

Because we all love confirmation bias

[@kingearth3672]

@@i_accept_all_cookies well, does the good actually happen

[@i_accept_all_cookies]

@@kingearth3672 It's happening in that moment, as if the universe is reflecting back to you, the joyful observation that you're making. It certainly seems to be a confirmation of something important happening.

[@i_accept_all_cookies]

@@kingearth3672 but I want to add... the path to "something important happening"... and the ultimate joy... it's not always smooth or pleasant. It's the destination that matters, not the turbulence of getting there.

[@GreenLion419]

​@@i_accept_all_cookiesit's always wonderful when whatever your looking at looks back at you and acknowledges you back. It makes the moment more personal and meaningful.

[@natashapope3785]

But also other conscious influences from the field entangled.

[@drivethrupoet]

There are way too many different definitions or context of the word. And I write this as it comes up in the discussion. I'm done.

[@svenland6892]

The simultaneous occurrence of events which appear significantly related but have no discernible causal connection.

[@tlgkh]

This was way too relatable ; made my night hahaha

[@tonystephen6312]

I dont personally believe synchronicities always have deep meaning - i think the connections can be quite simple often banal.

[@CariMachet]

Belief is bullshit and Nietzsche proved that in the 1800’s

[@tonystephen6312]

@@CariMachet Of course.

[@Debunker246]

Thanks for this..

[@natashapope3785]

Individuated units of consciousness entangled.

[@islandbuoy4]

correct Pauli seeked Jung's help because he felt physics had hit the theoretical wall ... Pauli was also fascinated by the FSC/alpha the Fine Structure Constant *1/137* and when in 1958 he was admitted into a Red Cross Hospital in Zürich, Switzerland and placed into *rm 137* he knew the end was near ... *AND IT IS A MOST MEANINGFUL COINCIDENCE or SYCHRONICITY that today the hologram of a photon entangled with the concept of 1/137 resembles a RED CROSS!!!*

[@Babyhz]

where the jesters at??

[@freemind2025]

you were meant to watch this... continue searching

[@oryan2235]

I'm just here for the information, I'll throw away and take what you choose

[@lauralivingstone4052]

What if its ony a phantasy nothing more? What is it if Jung had wrong theory? If sinchronisity exist but what is it? Aim of all things are find own secure attitude and reduce anxiety.

[@helensmith7596]

Telepathy. Group survival trait

[@AConcernedCitizen420]

You must be if the old understanding. Some of my ancestors are from Ireland. How are you?

[@GreenLion419]

Interesting take. I can see merit for such a thing.

[@joannatuczynska3508]

Very interesting...

[@M.Shepardbee]

Honestly the end result of this audio is that you need an attached mic.

[@kirstinstrand6292]

Folks are lost...always searching for meaning in their lives since they cannot create meaning in their lives that carry through, day after day. I was once there myself. I remember the suffering. If you want to understand synchronicity read Jung until you truly understand when to pay attention to the "message" and when to realize it's nothing other than happenstance, only a useless coincidence. Or, only listen to podcasts by practicing Jungian therapists. (I'm not a Jungian, yet he has influenced my life, allowing Individuation. Updated Freudian Psychoanalysis transformed my life.)

[@islandbuoy4]

*Jung would simply define sychronicity as 'meaningful coincidences'* ... which suggests a coincidence without meaning might exist, but in the end it is all design emerging out of the collective unconscious ... *Einstein would chirp in with "the coincidence is god's way of remaining anonymous"*

[@Gullsz]

Fake Einstein quote

[@joshvanschaick4896]

Great talk!

[@natashapope3785]

Co creative consciousness , primary.

[@therealtruth9823]

You all are talking about The Law of Attraction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! It is a Feedback Mechanism or loop. What you are leaving out is We are Soul, Mind and Body!!!!!! The Soul is the Cause!!!!!!! If you do not include the Soul you will not understand!!!! There is no Sub Conscious, that is your soul, "your higher self" we tend to call it.... No its the real you, You are a Soul Connected via a cord a conduit to the spirit body via a cord to the physical body. The Mind, the Body are just apparatuses of the Soul, the real you, that you are using to Observe the Real Experience, You the EMOTIONAL Being!!!! Hence outter body experiences, the mind resides in the spirit body, Aura's, this is the Spirit Body. The Law of Attraction is what is creating synchronistic events that are matching your true soul condition to expose it to you.... It is the messenger of truth to you, a FEEDBACK mechinism. Your Welcome.

[@mortalclown3812]

Just getting aaaall excited. Mercy. All right.

[@CariMachet]

It’s all the “real” you

[@Gullsz]

If you say so

[@GreenLion419]

Everything and everyone is a mirror

[@rasko]

It was lame how the woman at the end who had come to the conclusion that none of these speakers had direct personal experience of meaningful synchronicity. She clearly asked them to say why they were there and whether they had actually experienced it. They just blanked her completely and went on to the next. The was concise and direct and they blanked her, yet others who droned on with laboriously dull questions all dressed up in babble had their questions 'answered' in some way. Usually no very well. The tennis analogy was ridiculous.

[@thomasdunham5427]

scientist don,t want too call it holy spirit,easterns call it mysterious integrity....

[@jacoblove3005]

cheers

[@pambennett8967]

Notice the quick dismissal of the women

[@christheother9088]

um, no. not at all.

[@BrandonMather8]

Youll notice what youve trained yourself or have been trained to observe.

[@pettydaniel]

Transference because the therapist had her periods synchronize with her patient? Don't pheromones play a large part in that? How can that be a therapeutic reaction?

[@RobertJohnson-lc5bj]

Marlene Petty I heard somewhere that always happens

[@barbarakiley1276]

Marlene Petty Do we assume the patient is ISOLATED from other women age 12-55? Are women other than her therapist near LESS than 1 hour a week, allowing the therapist's cycle to dominate? If time spent is EQUAL, is probability equal? If women in menses are near MORE than 1 hour a week, are they more likely to entrain her cycle? While your logic sounds good, its "off." The point in the video stands.

[@ruburtoe1]

Or synchronicity produces transference? Which is cause, which is effect; or are they a cause-effect quasi-influence(d) of potential? Are neurons fired and diffuse neurotransmitters to reset electrical potentiation, or do neurotransmitters cause neurons to fire?

[@kalsangdrolkar]

Actually -- i finally figured that one out -- there's really nothing mystical or pheromonal about it - as most women's cycles are around 28 days -- it's only natural that the timing of one's period changes throughout the course of a number of months -- so if you start the year with your period showing up on January 1st -- 28 days will bring your next cycle to the end of the same month -- then your cycle will gradually go backwards through all of the weeks of the month -- showing up again in February in the last week of the month - then in March coming sometime in the third week, etc, until you reach September when it will finally return to showing up in the first days of the month. So it's only natural that eventually women working together will reach a point where they are all having their periods at the same time! And when that happens - that IS noticed -- and when it happens everyone is all -- "Oh wow! I can't believe we're all having it at the same time now!" -- but what no-one seems to notice is that as magically as we all finally synchronize - we also naturally separate again - and then suddenly we're not all having our periods at the same time!! I finally saw this -- because as a teacher I would regularly work in the same classroom with a female assistant teacher -- usually a new one each year -- and -- like clockwork - at some point in the year we would be having our periods at the same time. But then what I also finally noticed was that - that synchronization didn't remain - and eventually we weren't having out periods at the same time anymore. Once I'd become aware of that - and observed it over a number of years -- I finally got over the woo-woo aspect of our "synchronization" and I realized it was just math!!

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

It's controlled by the pineal gland - not pheromones - ONLY the female human primates have their estrus synchronized precisely with the lunar cycle (when living as a group in Nature).

[@hasauka]

1:02:00

[@jamesbolger413]

One of Jung's underlying motives for advocating archetypes and the concept of synchronicity was to preserve the notion of God or spirituality in an age of increasing 'rational' scientific thought, yet here are all these Jungian analysts begging acceptance from the physics guy. You might as well have some agony aunts for broken-hearts on there and sexperts to see whether the scientific community will adopt a suitable scale of measurement to see whether love is real or not, or a scale to measure just how broken a heart is. Also, don't the members of the audience understand what is meant by keeping the question short. These guys have far too much time on their hands.

[@oryan2235]

James Bolger lol

[@voidisyinyangvoidisyinyang885]

Pauli BEGGED for help from Jung.

[@mbellizia75]

39:23

[@CariMachet]

Everything has meaning

[@jessicamore4371]

Any INTP’s here?

[@abdallajbara6242]

39,990 views as i watch this

[@sysomphonemanuthong3953]

I think mine reading is for boreing people that needs more to know about things and can't stop wondering y? 😂 Lol

[@jamesbolger413]

God must be pissing himself watching this!

[@Gullsz]

She/her actually

[@tracik1277]

@@Gullsz They. Elohim is a plural.

[@LibraTheAwakenedPoet]

If there Is no cause then what are you all sitting around in a round setting for? A bunch of intellectuals and scientists to disregard divinity from nature. If it's not magical or divinity then what is the scientific reasoning behind your round table...? Maybe the round table is your scientific cause to be an expectation of a synchronicity in the future as a result or some conclusive understanding to be a thought process no more than mere spirit transmuted into matter collectively. To be your prayers answered or just simply how nature and the divine operate by faith and the conscience to be ONE. Everyone is born with faith and an inheritance thereof to be enlightened by the will of "a synchronicity" I'll call it with the cause thereof to either be the universal lifeforce referred to as God by reason of some who understand faith and science both or causeless via Jungian theory. To separate faith from the conscience is what maintains ignorance. Paul referred to this as a SHIPWRECK biblically in the New Testament. How are you transcending physics without some form of faith, divinity, or spirit to be what is becoming the matter or synchronicity. Its like saying communication or word or vibrations are not matter or atom. Faith is a spectrum of the conscience. Science is a spectrum of Divinity. The cosmos are a spectrum of the earth. Good and evil are seemingly causeless spectrum if you remove faith and clearly a creative part of matter. For the wise and understanding to contemplate and perceive synchronicity without faith is foolishness and will only be understood in the facets of the faith together One with the conscious mind/ conscience. Such a futile gathering of minds collectively is only a karmic hamster wheel based on the denial of the divine as you are only solidifying your own regression and maintaining the minds asleep. As you aim to appease science by suppressing the faith you are only starving your own appetites to indulge such fruit in which is the source of the seed thereof to be your own fall of ignorance deriving of academia and that only leads to more ignorance.

[@Atropin1111]

these ppl dont know anything...probably havent had any exp either..

[@mortalclown3812]

Good grief. Your comments are absurd in their broadness and so inanely expressed, that I'd wager you didn't view the video at all. Or you go to one of those new schools where vaguely held opinions don't require support. Btw, I definitely take issue with some of their suppositions and found a few of them high on the unctuous scale, but it wasn't like the announcement portion in the beginning didn't give us all a heads up.

[@GreenLion419]

Well said

[@buddyschreizerden3611]

What a banal and totally useless conversation. To manage to discuss such a contentious concept with a complete lack of substance and nuance is amazing.

[@mcgibboneyshawn]

Turtles all the way down...