Taking a $2 Million Stock Portfolio Line of Credit - Our “Buy, Borrow, Die Strategy” to Avoid Taxes

[@OurRichJourney]

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[@impala6464]

As a millionaire, I took a loan out against my TSP retirement account to make a down payment on my rental house next door. I paid back the loan within 5 years while maintaining my same Biweekly contributions to keep me investing in my TSP. The property value has increased over 155% in 11 years. I've only had 2 sets of tenants with no missed payments. One of my best decisions and yes I was afraid to take the risk!

[@roshunepp]

How did you pay back the loan? With regular earned income? What happens if you stop working and just want to live off assets?

[@JD0226-t3e]

Example: Navy Federal credit union best share loan rate at 2.25% borrow of your own money. Say u loan yourself $50000 at 5yrs finance charge will be $2900 for all 5 years. Average it out will be $48 of interest charge per month for 5 yrs. I have done this to payoff student loans, bought a few cars this way, and used the borrowed money to invest. Do the math with simple interest calculator with amortization.

[@OurRichJourney]

📈Looking to learn how to invest? Enroll in our Stock Market Investing Course: www.ourrichjourney.com/investingforfire 🔥Learn more about financial independence and retiring early: Enroll in our F.I.R.E. Master Class: www.ourrichjourney.com/firemasterclass

[@palawenia2]

which is better to enroll Investing for Fire or Master class?

[@martinguldnerAutisticSwanGuru]

It depends on your tax bracket. I am in the 12% US federal tax bracket so my long term capital gains in a taxable brokerage account is taxed a 0% for federal taxes; state of Georgia taxed as ordinary income current flat rate is 5.39%.

[@RetirementbyDesign26]

Happy Mother’s Day Christina!! This was a highly informative video. Thank you!

[@OurRichJourney]

Aww, thank you so much!!!!❤️

[@dotunfamakinwa]

Very informative as I’ve been wondering about this for some time now. Much thanks

[@Dividendflywheel]

Credit Union’s do something similar- using a CD as collateral for a loan (usually at a more favorable interest rate)

[@christinabaek4624]

Amon, thank you SO much for this video. I have never truly understood how securities backed line of credit works and FINALLY I understand it. I have read about it before, but had not grasped the pros and cons of this strategy. My husband and I learn so much from you guys. Appreciate you both very much!

[@aceflamez00]

I think borrowing is the best thing you could do to get ahead, it makes no sense for me to sell stock to buy a house. I rather borrow anytime and arbitrage the interest rate of the borrow with the property appreciation and if it's a rental that would contribute to it also. Saves money/time and me from earning and paying taxes twice lol. I always weight my port with enough dividend stocks to cover the interest or I borrow in proportion to the amount of divs my portfolio yields. Interactive brokers IKBR is usually the best for this type of stuff at 6.8% rates. But yeah I think 6.8% can be arb'ed rather than the 12% at the big firms.

[@Nix4me]

Interactive Brokers has the lowest SBLOC margin interest rates. Much lower than Fidelity.

[@OurRichJourney]

That's great to know! Thanks for sharing!

[@rochester3]

yep i pay 6.3% on my Canadian margin funds

[@gregoryfaulcon550]

@@OurRichJourney Fidelity just started a new program with Leader Bank and US Bank with the rate at 8.5% against your assets. Leader Bank does a soft credit pull using Equifax and US Bank does a hard credit pull using Equifax. This rate now competes with Interactive broker.

[@mjs28s]

Lowest marketed rates. A simple phone call can get your broker to match a competitor. I went to move my account to IB from schwab and they called me in a panic. when they asked me why I told them that IB has margin rates significantly lower than Schwab. Schwab immediately matched IB rate, this was in 2014, and ever since then I have paid well under schwab's marketed rates. I never had to bug Schwab about it again either. they just automatically renew my rate, even though I haven't been on margin since rates started to run up. I wager that Fidelity, or others, will probably do the same as they are competing with each other. Also, IB does not have SBLOC. They are margin only, thus none of the downsides of SBLOCs. Other brokerages have both. Schwab has margin as well as their version of SBLOC called PAL (pledged asset line).

[@don_kandon6006]

IBKR and i believe m2 offers the lowest. In addition, if you have portfolio in swiss bank, you can borrow at 1.75-2.5%. Check interactive brokers page where all major currencies listed. japanease yen and swiss franc has lowest, due to their fed always keeping low rates. What was missed in video, you never borrow more than 30% of your portfolio, because if crap hits a fan, markets drop, you can get margin called if you borrowed 40, 50% or more.

[@davidfsanabria]

Used to watch y'all way back in 2020, forgot to subscribe and lost y'all. The algorithm brought me back! Y'all are great!

[@METVWETV]

You works and it's better too!

[@washingtonavenue5016]

Also, get access to funds like a sbloc when you DON'T need it. Sit on it, there are no fees, and leverage it when the opportunity is right.

[@actionvj]

📈 I took your Stock Market Investing Course. It was very easy to understand. Loved the video tutorials. Definitely recommend! 👍🏾

[@OurRichJourney]

So sweet of you to say! Thank you so much! We’re so happy you enjoyed the course!!!❤️

[@Angel-zn1xh]

Wow... such great information, and I love the read out note that we must do our research, put in some time to investigate for ourselves & ask questions for our financial health... take action 🎬

[@OurRichJourney]

Thank you Angel! You pointed out two things that we live the most: 1) people doing their own research so that they know the investments and strategies that work best for them; and 2) taking action!!!!

[@edithdonaldson9483]

Thank you for sharing this strategy of maintaining wealth 🦋.

[@MelissaHobbs-qm8wi]

Investment banking can be quite lucrative if you know what you're doing, but it also comes with its fair share of risks.

[@darylmiller8911]

Never knew about this. This is a huge benefit.

[@QPSbatch92]

which one is better using margin vs barrow SBLOC?Please let me know.. Thank you so much

[@OurRichJourney]

It’s a bit like comparing apples to oranges. A margin is used to buy other equities (which can be very risky). With an SBLOC, you actually can’t borrow to invest in equities.

[@thegzak]

So then what kind of loan did you get with better rates, what did you put up as collateral?

[@Angel-zn1xh]

Happy Mother's day Christina! 💐🌹🌻

[@OurRichJourney]

Thank you so much Angel!!!❤️❤️❤️

[@Laura-kh9rt]

Great that you posted new content. More new topics please ❤

[@BrunissimoArt]

Yes! You made the video on the topic! Thank you!

[@saplouie]

Thanks for covering the pros and cons. That was really useful.

[@KEEFERMALLORY]

That is super brilliant. I have to, have to, have to employ the stock line of Credit strategy. Thank you for sharing!

[@Dr.Ganhym]

Thank you for constantly sharing insightful videos like this one. Like you said "We'll probably need this information at some point in our investment journey." I appreciate you for sharing this knowledge with us.

[@westcoastmediasolutions]

Why not just borrow against it on margin? With M1 for instance you can borrow against your brokerage account instantly without having to do a separate application or anything. And you still keep control of your portfolio.

[@artbw3413]

Almost all brokerage accounts allow margin borrowing. On the flipside, the brokerage can sell the securities anytime, sometimes without notice to cover the margin.

[@audreyl704]

@@artbw3413 yeah

[@albertograu3318]

thanks for the clear explenation

[@Shirley-n-Maryland]

WOW, that FIRST con is a deal breaker!!..THEY get control of your WHOLE😮😮 account, even if you DONT use the Line!!? NO WAY!!!!!!

[@OurRichJourney]

Right?! In reading the 66 page contract (!!!!), we decided against it!!!

[@rodneyrchicago]

It is pledged, yes. But let's say it earns dividends, you can take those out. You can even sell your pledged assets if needed. Pay off the loan and close the line if that is your concern. Many use their dividends gained to pay off the monthly interest payment. Even better, invest the loan into an asset that generates rental income and use that to pay the interest. OPM if you're disciplined. Good luck.

[@Shinque92]

​@@rodneyrchicago now that is a good strategy thanks brother

[@myfindependencejourney]

If there is a bear market and the value of your portfolio / brokerage account goes down, does this impact the limit of the line of credit? I mean if the lender automatically adjusts the limit down in such an instance or no?

[@artbw3413]

They will call on the SBLOC loan and if you don't pay by the time frame they will sell the securities to cover the loan.

[@AndEyeOop]

This was a wonderful explanation. Thank you.

[@OurRichJourney]

Glad it was helpful! Thank you so much!!!

[@FrLo616]

How do you manage your US banking and investment accounts from abroad.

[@danielmaldonado6388]

Idk if you are aware but sime sbloc do have anual fees specially if you are approved whit a 50k portfolio ,but not in the 100k+ portfolio.

[@TheRFreyre]

So wait, you still have to pay it back plus interest. I take you can deduct the interest in your income tax and keep your original asset intact but, there needs to be a loan repayment strategy. If the loan is used to buy something that gives you a cash flow to pay the loan then that is a strategy. But what else works here?

[@a.blakelee8807]

could you guys do a video on whole life insurance? Building the policy up, cost, age, pros, cons, borrowing against it, annual growth, safety of its use, etc.

[@moniryousefian8782]

Huge fan of you and Christina ❤ Could you please share which stock is your first favorite, vti, spy or qqq and which platform is your most favorite? Greatly appreciated 🙏 happy mother's day to Christina !!!

[@abogler]

Don’t you trigger capital gains when you replay the loan with your portfolio ? I imagine approximately 3-4 years of paying interest would negate any capital gains savings.

[@Rshen11]

But your making more

[@zhaojudien7858]

Is the interest tax deductible?

[@mashanti_worldwide]

Very thoughtful and informative

[@sidandsof12]

Happy Mother's Day Christina!!!

[@OurRichJourney]

Thank you so much!!!!❤️

[@davidleonard4925]

Very good video. The step in basis is a great example of why we have huge deficits every year and massive national debt.

[@johnp7739]

No, that's reckless gov't spending. Stop being programmed.

[@michaeldavis8599]

Thanks for this informative post. ☺

[@trichelleconner2612]

I'm curious why haven't you explored 'be your own bank option?

[@99SSC]

This scenario is great if you die because someone else will need to deal with the debt accrued. When it passes to your beneficiaries they will have to liquidate assets at the step up basis to cover the debt. The die part is essential to not creating a disaster from your borrowing.

[@celestesiempre3757]

Good information thank you❤ Happy Mother’s Day to your wife Christina.

[@OurRichJourney]

Thanks so much❤️❤️❤️

[@ilovecoors4286]

I took out $26k in margin and invested it. I used Robinhood gold. My total cost is $2140. My portfolio brings in $1000 a year. I plan on paying down the margin $237 a month. I’ve picked up some side hustles. I might get a second job. While doing this I’m going to be buying $25 a week of either Ibotta or VXUS. Maybe even both if I’m being indecisive.

[@audreyl704]

yeah i would do this also

[@Thebrokeragemoneymachine]

46k single and Married 92k capital gains are 0% federal every year. Another nice option. That could be a sale of 150-180k in sale of stocks/efts

[@AccuseSelf1st]

Great info 👌🏾! Question: How can I apply this technique to my crypto portfolio?

[@KevinDhaliwal]

great video!

[@GG-eu1nu]

Could that be an interesting “bridge to Medicare”? Borrow against your portfolio to live until 65 and get the ACA subsidies by showing minimal income?

[@02nupe]

This was very insightful and educational. Thank you

[@dionneking8]

Thank u so much for this channel happy mother's day christina ❤❤

[@autumngreen2877]

Great video team! If not a rental property. Would there be another situation where you might consider an SBLOC?

[@FamilyMatters-oy5kt]

Do you offer any consultations for families interested in moving to Portugal from the US? Specifically info on education and supportive services for autistic kids?

[@tthul141]

Great video. When you redo the video, let me know. Might make it in parts:1,2,3…. Went from a simple Apple share example and after 5 minutes of going different directions, lost me. Seriously, I love the topic and appreciate your knowledge. Make it work for my monkey brain.

[@fudogwhisperer3590]

If the stock falls in value, will there be a lump sum cash payment due to keep from liquidating?

[@washingtonavenue5016]

Most sblocs will let you borrow ~70% ltv (vs. 50% for margin). They will prioritize the ltv by asset, e.g. BRK would be 70%, TSLA @ 30%, money market at 90%. So yes, if your avg withdrawal is more than 70% on avg, and it drops by that much, there will be a capital call for the lump sum. Use it wisely and strategically.

[@Dividendflywheel]

Yes. Very prudent question. I looked into it and my loan to collateral ratio had to be 50%. Translation I needed $2 in equity (stocks mutual funds) for every dollar. The ratio’s are more fav😢for a broad market index ETF, than a collection of small cap stocks

[@angjachem1093]

Great information thank you

[@OurRichJourney]

Thank you!!!

[@nayoungsukhdeo6668]

What a wonderful and important piece of information!!! I just happen to have similar experience with Fidelity recently. Fortunately, our money was all in retirement types of accounts so that we were not qualified for it and now I feel even better that we didn’t qualify for it. I also have to agree with you about how their “meeting” is so beneficial for their benefit! It was definitely eye opening moment for me. The lesson I got it from the meeting was this “let me just study even harder to manage our own finance”. We are so thankful all the time with your KZbin!

[@OurRichJourney]

The “meeting” is just too much, right?! 😂😂😂

[@nayoungsukhdeo6668]

@@OurRichJourney indeed!!!😜

[@AngelPerez-nw5cd]

Did you talk about margin calls?

[@CristianHeredia0]

So what happens to the debt when you die? Do they collect from the collateral asset?

[@austinsharpe8157]

The account will become frozen, but interest will continue to be charged. All debt goes to your estate when you die and thus goes to whoever's in the will.

[@1970SS]

Is there a way to do this with vanguard?

[@Dividendflywheel]

I’d contact them

[@TimelessWealthMentor]

Fantastic video and topic! Happy Mother's Day Christina!

[@lataraashley9143]

Excellent explanation as always. I've heard about these but didn't know how they worked.

[@aracelireyes999]

These guys have a knack for explaining/simplifying things that could be complicated. Love these guys.

[@GregMOlympian]

Excellent, excellent information as always 😮

[@dr.lefort1596]

M1 Finance’s SBLOC is way easier to use and currently only 7.25% (as of 05/17/24).

[@PhilLeinberger]

You mention that you only have to pay back the interest. My understanding is that you don’t have to pay back the interest either. Have you heard this?

[@zacchaeusdennis4768]

Have you considered doing a 1031 exchange?

[@fractalclues]

Thanks for sharing

[@99999me1]

Could you create a separate trading account and move just some of the assets or are they are asking for access to all trading accounts? It's still a nice option to have. It's cheaper than margin account.

[@washingtonavenue5016]

Yes, you can have as many accounts as you'd like and only pledge the one that you need.

[@raviy5396]

What option you took to buy now avoiding SBLOC?

[@lionheart93]

what is your rates of return on stock portfolio for the past 5 years? have u beat the s and p500?

[@OurRichJourney]

Because we have individual stocks and technology ETFs, our average has been higher than the S&P 500.

[@ricograham6358]

This is similar to cash value life insurance but the loan interest rates are much lower.

[@macleandanso4890]

I smell infinite banking here

[@PaulProsperInvestments]

Great video and information. Buy, borrow, die is great. However, many states and the federal government require estate taxes when the estate its passed on after one dies.

[@eugeneeugene3093]

Well if you are dead…why would that matter?

[@thecashflowsoldier]

8% is kinda crazy but depending on the situation it could be beneficial 🙌🏼

[@SpyTrader1988]

Robinhood margin rates are 5.7 to 6.75 depending on loan size. Much better than Fidelity

[@noellemubaira4328]

Great content! Yes you can borrow against a 401k at least in my case

[@lslurpeek]

Cant you just do this then open up a new brokerage at a different company and buy securities there?

[@Jepi369]

So if you have cash value of $2 million in the policy , which by the will take 40,50 years to accumulate that much money and you borrow 100,000 every year to live off you pay 5.5% to the insurance every year and your money is gonna run out in 20 months

[@OurRichJourney]

It can be tricky though because you have to maintain a certain balance with your account in order to maintain the collateral that you pledge.

[@ilyaw.3081]

You guys doing a video on tax harvesting?

[@EugenioJ.Ballenger]

I had initially planned to retire at 62, work part-time, and save money, but the impact of high prices on various goods and services has significantly disrupted my retirement plan. I'm worried about whether those who experienced the 2008 financial crisis had it easier than I currently am. The volatility of the stock market is a concern as my income has decreased, and I fear that I won't be able to contribute as much as before, potentially jeopardizing my retirement savings.

[@cocolavon]

It took us 8 years to recover from the 2008 crash. We were finally able to move abroad. It was a beautiful, peaceful, adventurous refuge!!! We left California and moved to a very affordable country where we were able to save and invest well over half of our income. Had we stayed in America, we would have struggled. The hit was hard. Thank God for our rich journey. I knew a lot of the strategies they were talking about and once I became fully tuned in and implemented their recommendations, investing became less stressful. I found confidence in Etfs and index fund investing and reduced my portfolio from being 100% weighted in stocks to a more balanced percentage. I got rid of my rental properties because I didn't really enjoy owning them even with property management. Life is healthier, simpler, lighter and more abundant now. Stick to your plan. Work will always be there but life may not🙏🏾

[@808pera6]

I did this for our house in the Philippines.

[@MyWillbot]

Just started to look into this and interesting way to leverage. Wish I would have done this with my last home purchase

[@OurRichJourney]

Yes! We find it interesting, too! Now that you know about it, you can analyse whether it could work for your next investment!!!😀

[@crizdancemedia]

Is margin loan the same as line of credit?

[@rodneyrchicago]

No tax loss harvesting opportunities to defray your taxes?

[@bangalorebobbel]

Great video, thanks! Just to mention it: Buy borrow die works best if your heirs don't have to pay inheritance tax, or if so, have to pay only a small fraction of the real value. That's another benefit of countries like e.g. ... Portugal.

[@BoxMountainLLC]

Is it possible to borrow against a 529 college plan?

[@washingtonavenue5016]

No. Only taxable accounts.

[@willmallory9085]

Excellent video Brother

[@danelledautrievesanford]

Hi There. Happy Mother's Day.

[@OurRichJourney]

Thanks so much Danelle!!!❤️

[@JJ-jn7ei]

Wow! Thanks for sharing!

[@artbw3413]

Did Elon Musk use SBLOC against his Tesla shares to buy Twitter?

[@artbw3413]

Sophisticated millionaire investors don't care about interest on the SBLOC loans because they deduct the interest payments through their business and also use the tax credit i.e solar roof, high efficiency home HVAC systems, business assets purchase using amortization and depreciation etc.

[@MR.B1004.]

You don't think you have to pay back that loan with interest.I whether pay the taxes for taking out my cash! Interest rates are in the double digits.

[@MGMG-es9ry]

Can I borrow from IRA account?

[@MGMG-es9ry]

Should have listened the entire content. No retirement account

[@margottomasik2108]

Great info - you never know when you need to access your investments

[@philb6079]

Great information but now I feel even more confused. The more you know the more you know you don't know.

[@collegedegree8506]

I don’t get how this works. You have $2m in assets and can get a 50% SBLOC. You now have a debit card attached to this $1m bank account that has an 8% interest rate. The goal is to not sell, but if you’re living off of your investments and you’re solely invested in the stock market… your cash comes from selling. Since you only have to pay the interest, I guess you can sell less and just continue to rack up debt over time… but how does this actually stop you from having to sell your investments to avoid taxes in the long run? You’re going to have to continually take out debt raising your payment YoY as you live off of the SBLOC. Eventually you’ll hit the credit limit and will need to pay on the principal. Now you’re forced to pay taxes to sell more than usual to get access to your SBLOC principal while also paying your living expenses while also paying the interest. It’s short term gain for potentially long term problems if the market is in a down turn when you hit the limit.

[@washingtonavenue5016]

Not at all. Make sure your taxable portfolio has dividend paying assets - even Money Market funds (SWVXX = 5.2%) and use that income to pay the monthly interest and to generate the income you need to live.

[@dariogreggio7981]

the interest is rax deductible right?

[@StevenTRivera]

I was the 1000th like :)

[@sirrebral]

I *cringed* both times borrowing money for vacations was mentioned. Not only is that a financially irresponsible move, it's unnecessary as long as one is willing to challenge their pre-conceived notions about how much travel costs; there are multiple ways to see world without having to spend much.

[@greekbarrios]

My advice to new investors: Buy good companies stocks and hold them as long as they are good companies. Just do this and ignore the forecasts and market views which are at best entertaining but completely useless. By doing this, I have managed to grow my portfolio to $500k.

[@StefanM.-]

How can you guys still have a 401k when living in Europa? Dont you have to pay taxes here?