Why Death Magic is Evil

NordVPN ➤ nordvpn.com/tal...
Get TWO YEARS of protection and freedom with Nord VPN and get a whole extra 4 months for free, as well as a huge discount!
-
If you could cheat death... wouldn't you? If there were some magic to keep the reaper away, steal back your loved ones from the underworld, you'd almost certainly use it...
But why, then, does it always turn out to be such a bad idea in fiction?
▬▬▬▬ Tale Foundry Community▬▬▬▬
Support us on Patreon! / talefoundry
Come join our community! thetalefoundry....
▬▬▬▬ Tale Foundry Team ▬▬▬▬
• Talebot - The Talent
• The Taleoids - The Talent's Helpers
• Benjamin Cook - Writer, Director, & Voice Actor
• Abbie Norton - Art Director & Asset Artist (abbienortonart...)
• Alexander Cuenin - Animator & Editor (www.alextheanim...)
• Bazz Bartlett - Audio Engineer (www.bartlettau...)
• Austin Elizabeth Gaines - Researcher & Writer
• Rachel Doud - Packaging & Asset Artist ( / jae.sketch )
Additional Music by Epidemic Sound: epidemicsound.com

[@TheTaleFoundry]

NordVPN ➤ nordvpn.com/talefoundry Get TWO YEARS of protection and freedom with Nord VPN and get a whole extra 4 months for free, as well as a huge discount!

[@pyeitme508]

Wow 😳

[@TylerLarson]

Being a professional Security Engineer, and knowing *precisely* what browser VPNs can and can't actually do, the ad at the end felt ... icky.

[@boopleshnoot8313]

Possibly the best ad for Nord I've seen in a while

[@zoenixon5187]

Make a plushie of you lil robot character is so cute and yout voice too 😍

[@pilarrosanas5085]

Depend in what fantasy world..the Euthanatos from Mage the Ascension needn't to be evil..or in the guild of druid-necromancers of Ravnica from Magic the Gathering/D&D..

[@carolynwilliams5918]

I made a lich for a D&D campaign, who willingly underwent the rite to lichdom to avoid dying from a chronic illness brought on by an overuse of magic. She was using her powers to help build up, improve and protect her home city and effectively burned herself out. Really, she wanted to ensure she could make sure she could continue her work and stay with her partner. The DM has her pegged as 'not nearly as evil as she could be'.

[@sagggoo123]

It’s tricky in the context of games like this as well, considering most fantasy games require sacrifice or prices that go too far for a good person to do. For D&D, this is described in the monster manual and elsewhere, which can make for some really fun corruption arcs and roads to hell with good intentions.

[@bbittercoffee]

I mean, you know the dude that made the demon core even more famous? Imagine if he was still around, not caring for messing up because HE would never die for messing up, it wasn't just him who died in that room because of his hubris, I think the room would become world sized quite quickly. A Lich scientist could definitely be terrifyingly evil. But if you're undying and do good, what's the difference between you and a god?

[@ronnibech3376]

@@bbittercoffee other then worship and belief ? a lich do not grow in power if people believe in and worship them , it is all their own magic doing and their own will power on how much they are willing to do for it. on Gods and Goddess... Depending on the setting the same could be said of gods as in forgotten realms before the time of trouble was omnipotent and most gods care shit for their worshippers and used the for pawns or sport. AO saw this and disliked how they behaved and cause the fall of the gods and the rules there after stated that no god would be able to grow without the worships of mortals.

[@karno6679]

I have a wight in my dnd campaign. His city was cast down from the sky by the gods but he managed realise an illness that turned the entire city into undead. He now works tirelessly to create two illnesses- a version of a zombie illness that could restore sentience to his people and one to kill the gods themselves. The gods have little favour in my world due to having basically abandoned it. My players met him yesterday, and he did not fight them, even though he was technically the boss of the campaign. Why? Because the players found a sentient zombie. Even though we had a cleric with the standard “All undead are evil”, even he didn’t start a fight. He’s working for a good goal, and the players get that. The wight was shown it wasn’t false hope and he instead helped the players due to it- I’ve always seen bad things come from necromancy and I wanted to give him a happy ending since well, his city wasn’t meant to fall, and only did due to the gods pride. He was never meant to feel that loss.

[@bbittercoffee]

@@ronnibech3376 they don't grow in power when people believe in them but they also don't get weaker when people stop believing, there are other ways to amass power too. Plus, if you do good, you will get people worshipping you, whether you like it or not, it's just a thing people do. Also, can't you actually become a god if enough people believe you are or something?

[@Silverflame-1]

I've also, always loved stories where death is revealed to be something gentle, where a personification of Death/a reaper is there to help the dying come to terms as their life is left behind. There's the Twilight Zone episode, Nothing In The Dark, where an old woman is so afraid of dying that she hides in a boarded up safehouse, terrified that "Mr. Death" will break in and kill her. She allows a young man to shelter in the house with her, and gets to know him as a kind person... only to learn HE was Death, all along. And then he speaks to her, and it's one of the most poignant, heartfelt things ever created, easing and comforting her through her fear. "You see? No shock. No engulfment. No tearing asunder. What you feared would come like an explosion, is like a whisper. What you thought was the end, the beginning."

[@LonesomeKrow]

This is fucking beautiful and I must see this episode. Death isn’t a cruel end, it is the unseen epilogue of many lives and journeys. The circumstances that pertain to death can be subject to cynicism and the like. Such as murder, suicide and illnesses/disease. But knowing that death is a cold but soft embrace is an apt description.

[@Dachusblot]

Played by young Robert Redford!

[@godleveleldritchblast5257]

Sounds about right. Deaths aren't actually evil people, they just want to do their job. It's the reason why they can be a bit blunt sometimes.

[@sova1235]

That's why my version of death is not bad, just misunderstood, every being equal to death just doesn't understand "him" My death is very gentle and friendly looking, so when a being dies, it won't feel scared when it sees a fluffy looking being that helps them get to the afterlife

[@godleveleldritchblast5257]

@@sova1235 you aren't wrong there. Misunderstood, yes. But also deals with a lot of people who don't want to die, definitely.

[@Animefan1803]

Death Magic is truly misunderstood. The issue is: Most think only evil people would want to extend their existence for some nefarious ways. Reality is, in a world where Death is an actual physical deity instead of a concept, it be the first creature we´d actually pick a fight with. We as a species command death on a daily basis. In a world where that kind of tampering is possible, we as a species would be the first to use it.

[@SergioLeonardoCornejo]

TBH I think it is entirely wrong to allow life to end if one can stop that.

[@emberandfriendsanimations2454]

@@SergioLeonardoCornejo the only problem is that the number of humans would reach and possibly exceed the planet’s capacity at least much sooner than it would otherwise if we stoped death, since I doubt people would stop making babies just because people no longer die

[@SergioLeonardoCornejo]

@@emberandfriendsanimations2454 not everyone will want to live forever.

[@StarlasAiko]

@@SergioLeonardoCornejo The only reason life is valuable is because it is finite. Mortality gives meaning to our lives.

[@Ivan8]

@@StarlasAiko Meanings are meaningless. You can create your own meanings, your own values. The only thing death does is stops you from pursuing them.

[@Panda_Roll]

In 2019 I got sick and suddenly I found myself fighting an invisible enemy for every breath. At first I was scared out of my mind and after going through all the stages I found comfort in the oddest place. Terry Pratchett's Discworld! The place were Death, was just Death. Not this looming thing that signaled the end but just your average working joe. To this day I honestly believe that's what got me through. It's always why I think fiction is so important, stories affect and shape us more than we could ever realize.

[@tisme2888]

I'm glad you are OK. Best wishes for the future 🙂

[@tektrixter]

You may want to read On a Pale Horse, it has a similarly relatable Death.

[@MySerpentine]

The Sandman is also good for that.

[@briishcabbage568]

Well, he was looming. Just also chill

[@leyrua]

@@tektrixter You have good taste. That is one of my favorite novels.

[@noahjohnson935]

one of my favorite games, Pirate101, actually has a kind of interesting take on Necromancy and raising the dead. In most situations where a person is raised from the dead it takes a lot of will to not have their mind decay. Old Scratch, a character who is undead and is extremely skilled as a witch doctor, can't remember most of his past life (even how he died or his name). One town you encounter is cursed and almost all the spirits and undead creatures are delusional from not being able to properly "die" (to the point of them attacking you)

[@moistteeth7179]

been a long while since i heard someone talk about pirate101 ngl, that game slapped

[@kaimagnus5760]

Still waiting for that game to get a new update. Lol

[@viridiannucleon]

tem!!!!!

[@kat9866]

i miss playing the 101 games as a child, even in all their paywall glory

[@Merilirem]

@@AmsdunIsDoingThings Those games still hold up shockingly well. The concept itself was just co much fun.

[@wahwahluigi3991]

I really love that you included Pet Sematary, it was my favorite book as a child (School library was full of surprises). Something I recall is that it was very important that the body was as fresh as possible in order for it to return as a more passive creature. The neighbor of the Creed family actually buried his dog there shortly after it died, so it returned like a calm dog, if anything with a persistent scent of soil that would never go away. I think the key of the grieving in certain stories is that the characters will never bring someone back to life the way they remember it, because grief makes us remember them differently- the good seems better, and the bad (if it was someone we cared deeply about) seems barely important. To see this being bought back being different than our memories for one or other reason, it feels wrong, and the wound of grief becomes greater. That's why Death magic is often seen as evil. The characters never get what they thought they lost and that itself is a punishment.

[@VeritabIlIti]

You managed to read Pet Sematary as a child?! The only book King wrote that actually scared him? You must be made of some tough stuff.

[@wahwahluigi3991]

@@VeritabIlIti to be fair it was probably a watered down version (I read it later as an adult and noticed they erased some of the mature scenes) But if you ask me it's not that scary...? it's mostly sad due to the grieving and a bit gross for the description of guts, tho I do believe King made a lot of research so he got extra scared of the story he created. I don't think myself as tough, as a kid I felt a lot about losing pets, and didn't really understood the heaviness of losing a child, sometimes not fully understanding a concept helps you get less scared.

[@SolidLink64]

@@VeritabIlIti TBH. pet sematarty has a specal horror that gets to parents

[@marumae]

My favorite book as a child as well! Really helped me deal with a lot of grief I suffered with several deaths in my family.

[@SotiCoto]

With stories like that, it always feels like the authors are clinging to an idea that logically shouldn't apply in a fantasy setting. I mean if you're at the point where magical spirits can puppet corpses about, why is it that someone can't just.... y'know... resurrect. Like they do in D&D, for that matter. Why go so far to prove that death is final and that clinging to the dead is bad, yet supply the means of doing so in the first place? I think my favourite OPPOSITE take on this was Gantz. Not magic, of course. But sufficiently advanced technology. People CAN be brought back from the dead perfectly in Gantz... or rather new copies of them can just be printed out like it was nothing. The two noteworthy examples were that girl early on who gets "brought back", except the guiding force behind the story hadn't actually checked that she'd really died (she was assumed dead), and she goes home to find the original version of herself at home, and realises she has nowhere to go....... and then the later example of the creepy stalker girl who "resurrects" a second copy of the protagonist because she wanted one of him for herself.... and the system is just "lol okay sure". Just the way it casually inverts the usual "boo hoo life is sacred and death is inviolable" trope to such disturbing effect is so utterly unique.

[@mrmeglomania]

I have always liked Magic: The Gathering's take on death magic: any color can interact with bringing things back from dead, based on the color's philosophy. Since no color is "evil", it's just about what is bringing the creature back or why. Like, Black mana tends to get the label, but it's just focused on it's self first, so it's reanimate spells are about bringing you a minion back from the dead to serve you. Meanwhile, Green might bring a creature back from the graveyard, but that's because death is a part of the circle of life; White might do it, but flavor it as like that character received an Angels blessing or something. I also like Sabriel's take on it... Although I haven't read it in years.

[@Reddotzebra]

Black mana also has spells focused on granting yourself (metaphorically speaking) the powers of undeath, or at least your champions. Which is why it has both the minion flavored cards and powerful and intelligent vampires, liches and the like. I've always loved the black, blue and green colors of mana myself. And it's interesting that even though blue is so much about cheating and bending the rules, it's a color that generally needs help when it comes to bringing back creatures from the dead. Even though it has other tricks that does similar things.

[@lv100Alice]

ok i don't know magic lore but the black cards i have seen .... yea they seem more evil than the others

[@ninjadrew1033]

Well maybe not lore wise But Blue is pure evil Just let me play my green and red lads in peace!!!

[@Sorain1]

@@Reddotzebra That's because the Future is part of Blue's domain (while Red has the present.) while the Past? That's Black's playground. (or, graveyard?) White can only bring back lives by itself because it's grandfathered in due to how MtG began. Green can make new life, but not restore what was. (Reincarnation being the common cheat there.) Red doesn't tend to think about it, but could theoretically keep you in the moment for a little while. Blue must rely on artifice or tap Black to bring someone back (now, making someone immortal or time travel are more in it's wheelhouse.) from death. When colors mix is where things get interesting. Blue taps it's buddy Black on the shoulder and now you have upgraded 'Frankenstein's monster' style zombies running around. White legislates that you WILL serve your entire prison sentence, or contract, and Black comes in to make it happen. Green needs what was and is willing to make a trade, so Black is happy to facilitate. Red wants some deliciously ironic revenge and Black is all to happy to let Red worry about the consequences. (or not, it's Red.)

[@nemonomen3340]

This is why I love playing a necromancer in rpgs. The philosophical dichotomy between fighting your fate and learning to accept it is a quandary I’ve long been fascinated with.

[@Merilirem]

Its not so much a fight as it is a game of tag. One of you wins and the other loses but that just means the game can start again.

[@WaterFlame3030]

@@Merilirem that's an interesting way of looking at things

[@absolstoryoffiction6615]

Not really... I just like the gameplay of necromancers. But as a philosophical question... I would go with Necromancy. My expertise is in the extra / hyper dimensions. Where the Gate of Omnipotence resides... Well... If I do decide to return, that is.

[@fist-of-doom487]

Their was a short lived series years back where a Necromancer used his abilities to actually exorcise spirits and they even made an animatic music video to the tune of Magic by Mystery Skulls. The Necromancer loves music and as he travels through a massive graveyard around an abandoned mansion he raises the ghosts of the graves to play music, the music wakes up the angry spirit and he lures the spirit deeper into the mansion using his magic to weaken and slow it down. Until he enters the family room and raises too more ghosts, he then uses his original ghosts to contain and restrain the spirit before bringing the two newly raised ghosts to meet it. Turns out the angry spirit was a little girl and he helped reunite them and they all peacefully pass on together.

[@caro3460]

So I don't have my own opinions on magic raising the dead. I just really want to say that I hope this channel stays forever. I feel so inspired and creative when watching these videos. I cannot support this channel more than I already do but please know that we will always love your content.

[@thedreaded]

yes

[@Ratat0skr0]

I wonder if death is seen as necessary only because we have no choice but to see it that way? Will it be seen as barbaric to lose that person’s viewpoint if we find a way to cure it?

[@theexchipmunk]

Hm, i belive you are wrong and right at the same time. Involuntary death would likely be seen as a vile thing. But at the same time it also would be seen as a step that will be opend at at some point be taken by most, probably all people at some point. Because while people might wish for ethernal life, it will at some point turn into a curse. When you have seen and experienced everything you ever would want, lived for so long that even the most exiting event has happened dozens of time for you, life would turn into bitter dust in your mouth. Thats why i find even the thought of the afterlives that many religions depict repulsive. Be it the twisted "euphoric ethernal existance in heaven" or the "ethernal, senseless treadmill of reincarnation". I am as an atheist not scared of the non existance that awaits me in death. Why would I? I know how it is, after all, there was nothing before I became concious for the first time. I came from non existance and will go back to it, the energy and matter making me up just taking a break from their normal existance to experience reality as a counciousness for a short while. And while I am definitely scared of dying, as all life is in some capacy, there is no way to escape it. Even if we managed to beat death, make ourselfs imortal and invoiable to all in our existance, it would not last, because even existance itself will at some point unravel and go back into that very same nonexitance.

[@Broomer52]

I’ve been struggling with a concept for a while just because I’m unsure how to structure it but the idea spawned from Dark Souls 3 specifically that they mention an entire country ruled by Hollows, the undead. Also the joke that “Necromancers are just healers that didn’t give up” It made me realize we don’t give enough respect to the living dead in fantasy and usually use them as faceless monsters to kill or they’re vampires. I wanted to make a story about a thriving civilization in a fantasy world forced to flee from a terrifying invasion of Orks led by a Dragon. The flew to the frozen North where Orks don’t easily reach since when they die they taint the land and any man who falls into the black swampy depths of the tainted water rises an Ork with all the knowledge of the original person but none of the memories. They would struggle to stay alive in the unforgiving tundra while at the same time and army of monsters actively hunt them. By the end they grasp how the necromantic properties of the water works and rather than turning into Orks they use it to make themselves unkillable. Binding their souls to their bones rather than flesh. Those who live do so in bodies that are cold and dead and those not yet turned into Orks rise to life and take back their land. That which was pure death to them is now a greater source of life. The live in a rotted husk of a kingdom now most nothing but skeletons that still walk, feared by the world for what they are but nonetheless willing to defend it from death all the same. It’s the outline I got an idea of but getting the story written down has been hard.

[@whoareyoutoaccuseme6588]

@@theexchipmunk Interesting perspective. But I'm still stubborn with clinging to the idea of an afterlife, because I loathe the idea of not existing. If there is ever a way to make me feel, see, and think forever, I would gladly take it with open arms, no matter the cost. Even if it violates my own faith and the very morals instilled upon me since childhood, I would still entertain the idea of extending my own existence at the cost of others.

[@Merilirem]

@@whoareyoutoaccuseme6588 The thing about not existing is that you don't notice it. If it is at all possible to be "revived" from nonexistence it is all but a certainty. All of reality would have to end forever to stop such a return because as long as there is a chance it is bound to happen given enough time. You won't ever know how long it took though. You will simply close your eyes and open them again.

[@godleveleldritchblast5257]

Death is necessary from the point of view of how the universe works rather then how humans think it work. It is not a sickness or a disease. It is a key part of the balance.

[@darthchalupa2485]

Ran a TTRPG where one of the players was a Necromancer. She was part of a long line of necromancers. At one point in the story she gets captured by the villains and instead of waiting to get rescued she throws her soul into the after life. That's when she discovers her ancestors, all her ancestors used their collective necromancy to carve out their own personal fiefdom on the banks of the river Styx so they can all live comfortable afterlives regardless of what they did in their first life. It was a very cool side quest watching her learn how to resurrect herself from the afterlife.

[@Kattlarv]

I did play a lawful good necromancer in D&D once, that instead of focusing on undeath. Focused on helping others with the whole "unfinished business". Loved one died suddenly without saying goodbye? Bring them back for 10 minutes. They used necromancy for closure. And used the dead to save the living. Like: Some miners died from poison fumes in a mine? Raise the corpses, have them go in and rescue the ones trapped. As they cannot die from poison, already being dead. Holding the survivors above the fumes. Honestly one of my favorite characters.

[@brentparagas4549]

Was it good necromancer but still scary and not evil😂😅

[@Kattlarv]

@@brentparagas4549 I think "creepy" would fit best. He was VERY charismatic and kind. Basically Constantine from DC, except not a donkey. He'd still curse and yell insults when ripping the life out a Minotaur skeleton xP ... then rip out his OWN life force and hurl it at allies to heal them. Was really funny to have like, 4 hp. Use life trasference, take 27 damage, heal 54 damage, proc death ward, re-apply death ward and next turn: Channel divinity, vampiric touch and heal like, 50 hp. Good times~

[@brentparagas4549]

@@Kattlarv was it in game

[@Kattlarv]

@@brentparagas4549 You mean mechanic wise or? If so: Yes. And also roleplayed the character like that. I even studied cockney for 2 weeks to do the accent xD

[@brentparagas4549]

I have a question is necromancer and demon are same 😂 who is strong

[@racciastitan5534]

6:52 The fact that I can hear Ed screaming out for Al... Just, wrenches at my heart! My heart strings have been pulled! God, this scene was emotional! It's a pivotal moment... But, a negative one...

[@winterwolf1250]

I though this video was going to go over necromancy, and it.. kinda did in some ways. The trouble is with these stories, there is always a cost when it comes to 'Death Magic', conversely if you look at something like 'Light Magic' 'Life Magic' 'Healing Magic' whatever you want to call it, there rarely ever seems to be a cost to it. A priest, or druid can mend wounds with very little effort but not equivalent exchange, yet death magic tends to be an exception to this because it is somehow more perverse and profane by its nature. What is more profane and perverse, having to commit a sacrifice of sorts to return something lost, or to simply mend and fix something with nothing, with no cost, no equivalent exchange? I have always been an advocate of Necromancy being a neutral magic or a tool, rather than purely evil in fantasy. Diablo's priests of Rathma are a perfect example of this neutrality as the Necromancers in there seek to preserve the balance of life and death, and they use the bodies of the deceased to do so, to maintain the balance, the cycle. Yet in most genres necromancy is stereotypically just an evil form of magic. Most of that comes from people believing in the sanctity of a body, the remains of an individual that with time will rot away to nothingness anyway. That is the crux of the moral dilemma when it comes to Necromancy's alignment. If you value the spirit over the body, Necromancy is a tool. If you value the body as much as the spirit, it is evil. To put this in mechanical terms. Think of an Ai inhabiting a mechanical body, and then one day that Ai transferred out of said body, leaving it behind and moving on to a computer system. Would it be profane or unethical to repurpose that Ai's mechanical body? To install a new Ai onto said body or use it otherwise, despite the original no longer being present in any capacity other then a sort of visual/physical representation of what it was? I do like the discussions of morality and death, particularly when it comes to fantasy and things like necromancy and death magic. Comparing it to other sources of magic or technology can be even more interesting when you realize many of the 'good' forms of magic or tech, are actually aberrations to the very natures they claim to extol. Sorry for the rant!

[@jacobfreeman5444]

There is always a price to every action. The difference is death magic delves into the realm of the unseen pretty hard. There will be much you simply can't account for. Most other magics have a firm grounding in the mundane, making them easier to anticipate. Death magics involves trafficking with spirits of various sorts, meddling with things you cannot directly interact with, assuming a level of command that may make people uncomfortable if it is true

[@firebladeentertainment5739]

you stated "If you value the spirit over the body, Necromancy is a tool. If you value the body as much as the spirit, it is evil." this resonates me on a deep level and I think i know why i never understood why necromancy was seen as pure evil through that difference in philosophy. For someone who identifies himself as a transhumanist (a sane one, not like those wanna be cyborgs or those self castraters), my body is just a frame for my being, waiting to be enhanced with machinery when the time and technology is right. Necromancy and cybernetics mess with the body in ways the body itself cant and as many see their body and being as inseperable, so therefore they see messing with the body as messing with the being, the soul, when for people like me those are separate and one just inhabits the other. also its really fun to amass an army of the undead in games, cause there are usually no consequences for when you loose them, you can just bring back whatever remains.

[@livedandletdie]

@@jacobfreeman5444 You're deluded, and there exist no such thing as death magic, or life magic, all magic is the same, it's all transmutations, all these so called elemental classifications are moot, and while it is easier to think of water magic as separate from fire magic, it's all the same, you just change the aspect of the magic. There's no difference between the Holy Spell, Resurrect, and the Unholy Spell, Raise Dead. They're the exact same spell, to assume that Resurrect which traps a soul in a body and then regenerates the tissue of the body, is any different from Raise Dead that traps a soul in a body and animates the body in whichever state of disrepair it is in. Raise Dead doesn't heal the body, it just merely stops the body from decaying further and uses the latent magic in the environment to sustain the body and repair it over time, and in an environment where there's a lot of magic, Raise Dead is the strongest healing spell ever, it converts the magic in the air directly to new tissue, repairing all injuries, no matter how big or small. The only difference between an evil person raising the dead or a good person raising the dead, is solely dependent on one thing, do they use command magic, on them or not, while a lot of people think soultrap is an evil spell by itself it's the main component in many resurrection type spells, there's a lot of horrible spells out there, raise angelic army for instance, which turns corpses into angel soldiers. For those of you who don't understand what angels are in the first place, this might sound lovely, but it's horrible. Angelization is normally a natural metamorphosis that humans can undergo when their magic capacity is large enough, but if it's forced onto a weak body, of let's say a recently deceased person, growing twice their size, having their muscles ripped apart, their bone structure altered, the pain is often so great that the person turns braindead afterwards, and as it's an army spell their bodies while taking in enormous amounts of mana grows protrusions that turn into weapons and armor, and not only that whether the person goes braindead or not, army spells are all higher level command spells, meaning they are not the controller of their own bodies. And what is the classification of Raise Angelic Army? It's a high level Holy spell. It has several basic spell components that are interwoven carefully, and despite it using relatively small amounts of magic, on the user, it drains the magic of the environment to the extreme, it's one of the worst spells out there, because you lot don't understand the nature of magic, where there is no magic, it will drain the magic from everywhere else, that includes from the trees, the soil, the grass, everything around a magic withered area will decay into void, not empty space, but void, there's no time, there's no space, just absolute void. And while everything used to be void in the origin, magic and vis formed from the void, and from vis became time and space, laws that governed the universe, etc, things that you lot are way more familiar with on Earth. Your universe is devoid of magic, but not vis. Vis slowly decays into void over time, but as it decays it generates time and time slows things down, and when void and time interacts space is formed. Void itself is not the lack of energy, it is an all encompassing substance with infinite potential energy, and as time interacts with void more magic and vis are created, and magic and vis repel each other, but magic is formless itself and can take on myriad forms, and in regions with lots of magic, magical entities form. Humans on earth belong to a group of entities that are known as the Visbound, and while there are entities which are able to walk the world of vis and magic because even if they repel each other, they can still be melded together to form a material known as manon or as some people would like to call it, mana, it is the elemental particle which allows the particles of physics the Fermions and Bosons to interact with magic. This has led to individuals who can store magic inside their bodies, what we call mages, and they can via transmutation of magic enact their wills onto reality. The primordial world itself is composed nearly entirely out of mana, and from the rivers of time, that all lead to the sea of stillness, a place that lacks vitality, and is literally made of abyss fluid, a very voidlike liquid, that absorbs time and space, and only some of the hardiest beings live in that sea. But that's enough discussing this topic, I've already talked way too much about things humans shouldn't know about.

[@johnmcconnell7052]

​@@livedandletdieI think speaking of the void is a very very bad idea. To speak about something that observes our universe from the outside is like an ant talking about the magnifying glass before it gets sunlight.

[@theenderdestruction2362]

Death magic and necromancy atleast in any game I dm for always makes the body a unwilling thing so yes it's a evil magic cause of that, life magic is the body accepting it at worst fails and doesn't cause the entire area to suddenly have a plague of the undead trying their best to kill everyone and everything

[@KarachoBolzen]

In the little fantasy world I'm building, death is often likened to a gardener. Yes, he takes you when you are ready, even if you might disagree, but you overlook that he was the one who let you grow in the first place. All the food you ever ate was dead or soon to be, and all of it grew on the dead just the same. The dead nourish the plants, the plants nourish the living, and the living become the dead, and our world is built on the dead. So death is a gardener. He provides what you need to grow, he lets you experience life for a while, and when you're ripe, he takes you. And then you are obliterated completely. He's gentle about it, but he cannot negotiate on this. You'll recognize him as an old friend, one who's been at your side all along, he'll offer to talk about it. You can wander his garden if you want, talk to the others there, you can make yourself useful and become a spirit for the world, you can take as long as you need. Some take a few days, some take aeons no living person could comprehend, but at some point, every one of them accepts their end, and every one of them walks into the emptiness of their own accord. Knowing they will be unmade. And death can wait, death has patience. He is gentle if you let him, but he will not relent in the end. Not evil, but unrelenting nonetheless.

[@godleveleldritchblast5257]

You are not wrong but two things are slightly off. Death is like a gardener and he does assign you your life but there is no nothingness after you die and you arent allowed to wander for eons, it's all down to the plan.

[@pokemonfanmario7694]

@@godleveleldritchblast5257 good argument, one small problem, that aint your setting to develop or say what is canon.

[@godleveleldritchblast5257]

@@pokemonfanmario7694 maybe it is, maybe it isn't. Death isn't really someone many people know a lot about.

[@pokemonfanmario7694]

@@godleveleldritchblast5257 WTF you on about mate this is someone elses fiction, dont go saying things like its some historical document.

[@pokemonfanmario7694]

@@vyor8837 Enough time with nothing to do can easily change their mind.

[@stardust-reverie]

“grief is necessary. pain is necessary. death, may not be.” absolutely stealing this for my necromancer factions

[@UXMetalVTuber]

Personally, I have always considered that no magical alignment is "good or evil". The morality is merely based on the user and the purpose they intend to use it for

[@ForeverUnmotivated]

Classic mortal cope

[@UXMetalVTuber]

@@ForeverUnmotivated I do think that it is merely a tool, a means to an end. It is how you use it that matters. You could have the most purest "light powers" or whatever in a fantasy scenario, but you could still use them to just cause harm and kill people. And on the contrary, you could have complete control over death, and decide to use it to...say, create a free business where you temporarily revive people's loved ones so that they can have a final conversation with them and say their proper goodbyes

[@cherrybramble]

My brother in magick, the end result matters as well

[@Thumbdumpandthebumpchump]

@@UXMetalVTuber The issue is seeing magic as an extension of science, rather than a force with its own morality, with truths boiled into it.

[@thejester7729]

Much like in the mmo World of warcraft the light has been wielded to do terrible things. Just as the power of the void and even demonic powers are used to defeat vile foes.

[@GrayVBoat]

It makes me wonder how Orpheus would fit into this interpretation. He was given express permission to return his love from the underworld (though admittedly his music made him a special case), with only a single, simple mistake ruining his journey. I suppose one way to look at it is that if a way to "cure" death is found, extreme care should be taken to ensure the instructions are followed closely and carefully? Still, that feels like an imperfect reading; I guess that particular tale may not fit with the themes of this video. Anyway, great stuff as always!

[@danatrick4868]

"Grief is necessary, pain is necessary. These things will happen. Better to embrace them than fold in on yourself." Good words to live by.

[@imperialhistorian4201]

Memento mori

[@LemonsRage]

Yes but that should still not stop us from trying to cure the causes. If we said grief and pain are necessary then we wouldn't cure any dieseses nor would murder be a bad thing. By that logic would any chance to cause grief and pain be a good thing.

[@WouldUKindly47]

Not embrace but rather accept. It’s better to accept that pain exists. That’s how you overcome it.

[@zenebean]

The term "Destined Death" in Elden Ring makes me think that what many fear is a meaningless death. Those deaths that just crash into to lives when they are too young or have so many things that will crumble without them. The idea of locking away death only to deal it out by someone's judgement is a pretty cool concept to explore, though it is mostly in the background or vaguely hinted at. Like the undead who "live in death" or the wretches shambling about, withered but unable to really die.

[@parceustheawesome1298]

I never realized the Tyrannical Dragon was about death. That really changes how I felt about the story.

[@snaketooth0943]

I just thought the dragon was a meatphor for corruption.

[@parceustheawesome1298]

@@snaketooth0943 Same.

[@nitsanraviddaos4797]

Wha really

[@Daehpo]

More so "Death of Old Age". There will always be death, but thru advancements in science, technology, & policy we may further push back the boundaries of death's domain. EDIT: At least the "Old Age" thing seems to be CGP Grey's interpretation.

[@taramaforhaikido7272]

The story loses something. Because it's yet more dragon slaying. I remember playing Neverwinter Nights 1. The dragon that is faced is cruel. Cold. Ruthless. Yet can be reasoned with. It's about the honesty of it all. Don't compromise on your ideals. Stick to the facts.

[@annasutton4029]

I always liked Supernatural’s version of Death: “You have an inflated sense of your importance. To a thing like me, a thing like you, well... Think how you'd feel if a bacteria sat at your table and started to get snarky. This is one little planet in one tiny solar system in a galaxy that's barely out of its diapers. I'm old, Dean. Very old. So, I invite you to contemplate how insignificant I find you.”

[@crimsonitacilunarnebula]

Death welcoming super man home in death there is life in life there is death Death is the home of all of life There is no need to fear of death since your just going home after a long trip of work just like waking up from a deap sleep of a good nights dream

[@spiceyicey]

in contrast ever since it was released i've always liked castleania's version of death: T: "Oi. Death. I want a word with you." D:"You know me?" T: "I'm Trevor Belmont of House Belmont. Of course I know you. Finding things and recognizing things is what we do. And you are absolutely a thing." D: "I was put here at the dawn of life on Earth to feed on the last breath of every one of you f*ckers. I'm a little more than a thing." T: "No. You're only a thing. You're only an old killer. You don't make anything. You don't live. You just eat and hide." D: "Is there a point to this? Are you dictating your f*cking obituary to me, Belmont?" T: "It's time to give this place back to people who know how to build things. You and me, we're just killers out of history. It's time for us to go." D: "And who's going to make me go? You, with your bit of string in your hand?" T: "Probably not. But let's just give this one last go. Shall we?"

[@alejotassile6441]

death swearing like a sailor is my personal headcannon at this point haha

[@malykoth]

Great segment, as always. Though, I do kind of wish you had mentioned Death, the cosmic personification in "The Sandman" universe. She's kind and friendly, and refers to what she does as a 'gift'.

[@calladricosplays]

There is a record of an ancient Greek witch who brought someone back to life. In doing so, they say she "robbed him of death's greatest gift, the mercy of only having to die once."

[@mattb.7079]

@@calladricosplays What witch is that?

[@calladricosplays]

@@mattb.7079 Erichtho

[@mattb.7079]

@@calladricosplays thx

[@Reddotzebra]

When Dream and her speak for the first time after he's freed they even remark on how funny it is that mortals fear her more than anything, yet they enter his kingdom every night of their lives. And he is far more terrible than her.

[@a.morphous66]

In my D&D world, necromancy is actually one of the most emblematic magical expressions of the Lawful alignments. Entropy is Chaotic, with death being an expression of said entropy. Necromancy is the reversal of death, thus the reversal of entropy, thus the reversal of chaos. It is enforcing a new order onto the dead, arranging the scattered bones into a useful new shape and reverting the uncontrollable influence of mortality that killed the creature. It is not innately good or evil, but so is all the arcane. In fact, the most powerful faction of the undead are an entirely good group, one created by accident with their souls trapped in their decaying bodies by circumstance. They are endlessly bitter at the kings of the living for taking life for granted, and they often take in lost souls who have perished in the cursed land where they reside.

[@timberwolfbrother]

I actually like in Dominic Deegan, Oracle for Hire, Death itself actually explains that Death Magic is no more evil than any other magic. There's so many different applications, so many different ways to use it, and so many intentions behind its use, that it's no more evil than Death itself. I like it best when death magics and their practitioners aren't treated as inherently evil, even if you've still got evil people using it. Liliana from Magic: The Gathering is a necromancer who spends a good time after her introduction seemingly evil and working for one of the big bads, but by the end of that story his hold over her is broken and she uses her necromancy to help stop him, and even joins the Watch that she had previously fought against. There's also the necromancers in Diablo 2 and 3, who use their death magics to curse their enemies, use bones as weapons, and reanimate the dead to fight for them against the evil of DIABLO. Yet at the same time the necromancers are fully aware that death is just a part of the natural cycle, and while they might have some mastery over it, in the end they will die too, and they not only accept that inevitability but embrace it, making them fearless heroes.

[@thebigboss1824]

I did not expect Dominic Deegan to be mentioned wow!

[@Mthwe8]

As soon as I realized CGP Grey’s video was about death I also realized that he was right. The death of others close to me has never phased me much. I’ve always had the mindset of, can’t change it now. But seeing that video made me question that and my own fear of death. And I will not let myself die without at least furthering the research to prevent it.

[@absolstoryoffiction6615]

My mortality wouldn't alter my plans... But I usually do things after everything comes to an end...

[@hypermaeonyx4969]

To be honest, I'd probably become a lich and try to take over the world with armies of undead

[@Marinanor]

I for one, support our donut loving overlords.

[@hypermaeonyx4969]

@@Marinanor Donuts for everyone!

[@Elmithian]

@@hypermaeonyx4969 Bu-but if you are a lich you can never again enjoy the taste of donuts!

[@hypermaeonyx4969]

@@Elmithian A sad price to pay to ensure global Donut distribution

[@malykoth]

Ugh...sounds like WAY too much work. If I was a lich, I'd probably just play video games and watch movies.

[@matteste]

Honestly, you really should have checked the 2003 version of Full Metal Alchemist as it really dove into this topic and its consequences. Also, the visual novel Dies Irae has its own version where some characters have basically made a deal with the devil to bring back a loved one, with one of those getting it slammed in the face that she only wanted them back for selfish reasons rather than wanting their happiness like she says.

[@Necrikus]

I love that you brought up the Tale of the Dragon. One of my favorite videos I've ever seen. I've argued with DMs long enough to have my own rationale for it. People are just conditioned to reject the concept of undoing death. So much about our beliefs surrounding death that we created just serve to help us cope with it and most people would prefer the paradigm of death being final, than ever trying to fight against that finality since it would mean rejecting so much of however they coped with death and any ideas adjacent to them.

[@ronaldcounterman5812]

Thank you for including Fullmetal Alchemist in your discussion. It's one of the most heart-rending, visceral and horrifying instances of death and grief in fiction, for me. Shiver...

[@aylin6766]

In one of my favorite games Divinity 2: Ego Draconis the first necromancer you meet is actually a really nice guy that describes his work as victory of life over death.

[@StarlightNkyra]

I love the sponsor tale foundry, It was definitely one of the most creative and fun transitions I've seen. I wish more creators did things like that to make sponsorships a lot more bareable.

[@plutothechinchilla4496]

I feel like that was the most cleverly implemented ad ever - by making it apart of the story and characterization. That's absolutely buckwild brilliance right there.

[@aeaeeaoiauea]

disagree, ive seen it a lot and it really only works if you manage to make it so smooth that they only notice it when it's too late

[@plutothechinchilla4496]

@@aeaeeaoiauea k

[@spazzmaticus9086]

A cool example of non evil death magic users is in elden ring.

[@arthurdossantos6826]

Do you mean The Ones Who Live in Death? Idk if they're good or bad, bringing death is generally a good thing in Elden Ring, while trying to keep one alive indefinitely is the source of all problems in the story

[@spazzmaticus9086]

@@arthurdossantos6826 I mean like Fia and Rogier.

[@arthurdossantos6826]

@@spazzmaticus9086 oh, they are chill indeed.

[@peenyyt4921]

​@@spazzmaticus9086I mean they're pretty neutral

[@taramaforhaikido7272]

@@spazzmaticus9086 Rogier, yes. Fia? She's got a darker side. It's why she's more honest as well. She has nightmares she's still overcoming. The player helps her out with that.

[@C.D.G.1]

I have been thinking of making a story about an necromancy kingdom. This helps a lot.

[@sophiaisabelle027]

We appreciate your analysis on certain topics. Keep up the good work.

[@Siderite]

You made me want to read a story where forbidden necromancy would be the choice and solution of the hero. Consequences, yes, but also a tenuous victory against death. Keeping things on the edge would delicious.

[@lsmmoore1]

I'm pretty sure the Disney version of Hercules does something like that. It's definitely not true to the myth, it's kind of its own thing, but it works for what it is.

[@Sorain1]

I've been putting one together where a magitech society (magical analogue of a near future) when faced with a classical 'invading horde of extradimensional monsters that also poisons the land' scenario, turns to digging up what they can on the lost/forbidden old art of Necromancy to solve the one part of making de-facto human level AI robots they can't solve: Volition. The big twist to their effort is they discover a disquieting fact: (that also puts their cloning efforts on hold.) any vessel that can hold a soul but never held one before, will be filled with one naturally. They went to make undead legions and made magical AI instead. So naturally a lot of additional drama is going to ensue. Death magic, put to kinder ends, brings up the uncomfortable legacy of knowledge destruction because of 'potential harm' in a way removed from real world examples enough to chew on.

[@timeenoughatlast3368]

This was weirdly good therapy. I've lost so much recently. Just about everything. Not to death but things just generally falling out of my life. I've never related harder to a statement than when you said "you must accept that loss or stand to lose so much more."

[@jonathanphillips9637]

I love seeing how far this channel has come. I remember finding your videos when I really wanted to take my world building and writing more seriously, and I have been with you ever since...maybe not always engaging, but definitely watching from the shadows 😅. Another great video. Death Magic is probably one of my favorite forms of magics to read and write about because I think it offers a great way to explore moral ambiguity.

[@gabrielbruce1977]

One story involving death magic that somehow turns out bittersweet for the protagonist is that of the Necromancer, in Diablo 3. This is someone who's spent their entire life around death and grief and pain, taught that it's necessary, that while you can resurrect the body the soul is gone forever. This is someone who went through this obsessive stage of bargaining and came out the other side wiser for it. They tried, they failed, they were taught better. Even upon being given the same powers as Death himself, they bring no one back. Not even their own order, slaughtered en masse. They know better. That step beyond you talked about, written as a character!

[@mattsipe8963]

If we ever find a way to "kill the dragon" we'll only hold that fact above the dragons head, and bargain with it so that it only eats the poor

[@Merilirem]

Only in the short term. Long term humanity will figure itself out and there won't be any "poor" to begin with. The one thing you can always count on is that a big enough prize will dethrone any king. Immortality being kept from the populace wouldn't last long before some power hungry groups used it as a reason to rebel.

[@MrNote-lz7lh]

@@Merilirem Nah. There will always be the poor class. It's just the definition of poor will change so the poorest person of the future will have more luxuries and fulfillment than the richest person of today could ever even dream of.

[@Sorain1]

@@MrNote-lz7lh That would be in line with historical examples, so I can buy into that.

[@beastanimator7312]

Tale foundry : uploads a video Me: Guess i wont be sleeping tonight

[@YazzyFairy]

I love this topic since I'm writing a fantasy YA novel related to past lives, souls, and death - not really death as something dark or painful, but as a never-ending cycle, something we all go through more than once. I also mean to show that the things people would do to prevent it can be far scarier than death itself. I see the concept of past lives and death as a way to perhaps meet again with the people that really mattered if it is meant to be of course :)

[@calladricosplays]

I love this take! I'm also writing a story that a genderbent Odyssey filled with survivors guilt and explorations of natural forms of immortality. After all, the continuation of life is not such a foreign concept

[@jimmysohet2219]

Magic based on live and death can be really twisted like every other Magic based on elements,like water. For example you can manipulate water in every form possible, even in a human body, which turn into blood bending, like in avatar. which is extremely disturbing, you should make a video about this

[@zackarieneifert7014]

As someone with a character who can bring back people from death in a system where lore-wise, its barely know that that's possible, and having to had learn blood magic for the express purpose of doing it, I very much enjoy the dichotomy of tapping into very dark magic for a noble purpose.

[@galaxydacreature]

Omfg that ad transition was so good???? I didn't realize what was happening until about half way through, very impressive! It seemlessly fit in with the video topic and the lore dropped(Im a new watcher idk if you've mentioned any of this before) was really interesting!!! Just- just wow, super impressive. Also very interesting video to 10/10

[@lostmarble540]

-I think the dragon metaphor really fits with a more modern, late-stage capitalism approach to death. Like we may not have the technology to outright destroy the dragon but we have tools to slow it down, and yet we don't fully use those tools; so many people still die of preventable diseases or lack of resources. More frustrating still, it feels like we're not even having a debate of whether to fight the dragon or not, we're having a debate on how much money it would cost to fight the dragon. I'm going to go watch cat videos now to counteract how depressing this comment is.

[@MrNote-lz7lh]

I don't see anything wrong with that. Nobody owes you anything.

[@pmuniversee]

@@MrNote-lz7lh you say that now, until you're on your death bed, rotting away from some forsaken disease without the means to help yourself. Tell me, when the world can't decide who must pay for the Dragon to die, and you have to stare it in its eyes and beg for mercy, would the cost really of mattered?

[@azuroslazuli6948]

And if you cannot pay it, who will? You’re asking for literally anyone else to bear the cost for you. Seems rather selfish, if you ask me. What if everyone had to give up a hand to feed the dragon, or a finger? Is that still fair at that point? God forbid they have to do it more than once. It’s not as black and white as you seem to believe.

[@MrNote-lz7lh]

@@pmuniversee No. I'd even say that on my death bed. Nobody ever handed me shit for free in life and nobody ever will. I'd have to work for what I want like just about every single other person in the history of humanity. Until automation advances to the point nobody would have to bare the burden of caring for other people lives.

[@taffingspy]

One of my fave MMOs announced a necromancy skill recently so the timing on this was impeccable given the amount of discussion I've seen around necromancy ethics. Love the care and thoughtfulness towards both emotional sides of death, whether it's defying it or accepting it

[@StoryTeller796]

Most death avoiding stories: Have Death Magic as something to represent someone running away from their problems and from the truth of reality just to twist and prolong the inevitable. Me: Makes Death Magic essentially a magical ticket that grants access to different worlds with an absurdly high and priviliged cost of essentially needing to be carefully managed and doled out by both Death themselves and those who pursue that type of magic.

[@Snowy_Satura_Valentina_Rose]

I know TF won't see this, but when my grandfather died a year ago, I felt exactly this kind of grief but couldn't process it as my ex girlfriend had left me only days after. The person I poured all my trust into just... vanished, when I needed them the most. This video is helping me unearth that trauma right before I go to a psychologist, and I only found it by pure chance because I loosely follow this channel... I think I'm gonna keep a closer eye on these masterful videos.

[@old_timey_prospector]

It goes without saying that I love these videos and the content of this channel. However, I have to take a moment to say that the sponsorship towards the end was so well written and well done and well-integrated that I didn't realize what was happening until about halfway through.

[@wynnefox]

I remember Altered Carbon handling a simi-immortality through the neck disks. It really made some interesting thought experiments over life and death. Really stood out is the one woman who would bring her grandmother back every year for Day of the Dead and while Grandma had a great time, at the end of it Grandma was like, "It's time to let me go. I think I'm done."

[@Late0NightPC]

I've always really liked how this idea was done in the "story" of Aviator's song Neon Sonata. In it, a woman in the far future loses her lover, and using a combination of sci-fi tech and dark magic she attempts to bring him back. Of course he comes back as something less than what he used to be, and it's tragic and all, but what really made it special is the way the woman was portrayed. She somehow knew fairly early on that whatever "this" was could never be him, that she couldn't ever bring him back in the way she wanted, but she was so absolutely overwhelmed by her emotions that she couldn't stop. She loved him so dearly that she was desperate for any tiny little sliver of him again, to the point that this thing is worth creating just because it once was him, regardless of if it isn't any longer. I really loved that it chose to make the focus of it on how all-consuming the emotions were. It was one of the few instances where I felt that I could absolutely and truly understand the incomprehensible depth of her love and desire for her lover, and why even though she knew this thing wasn't, and couldn't, ever really be him, that desperation to feel even an echo was too overpowering.

[@FaIconLegend]

I always listen to your videos as I write and everything just makes me feel the motivation, the taste of creativity, and the flame of imagination in my eyes. The intriguing style of your videos, your calm narrating like voice. But most importantly, the topic you always go on. Even the simple wording you do gives me more ideas. Even the title! You are a godsend for people like me that can use the simplest things and turn into ideas, or just needs a voice to not feel alone as they write. Basically; Thanks TaleFoundry.

[@Jack_Stalker]

The one thing all beings that dabble in undeath, resurrection, and immortality have in common. They are all Terrible at saying "Goodbye."

[@dudeboydudeboy-zj8kd]

here's some ideas for another video : the villain protaganist and what makes a story of the bad guy as the main character interesting. and the protagonist journey to villain, what circumstances leads a good person into becoming the villain of the story. and finally the tragic hero.

[@pmuniversee]

I've always wanted to see a story involving Death magic explore the consequences of actually bringing the person back. Briefly, imagine a story in which a character commits suicide to escape the painful reality that greets them every morning. Unbeknownst to them, an acquaintance, close friend, lover, or grief-filled family member enacted a ritual to bring them back, and it completely worked. No strings attached. The story then explores the clash of someone who only wanted to enjoy the peace that comes with eternal rest verses someone who's selfish grief brought them back. The basis of the story already implies that Death can be viewed as both a blessing and a curse, and it largely depends on the perspective.

[@jacobbordeaux7842]

I love how alive you make your scenes look even when theres not much but maybe one or two thingd but because of the old timy filter background pluss the gears it all gives the illusion that even dtuff not moving is

[@kaptainmanslaughta7887]

When it got to the bargaining with the dead section, One thought crossed my mind, The deal Maurice offers death to bring his friend back, One Life For One Life. Now for characters that show the truely dark motives of using methods for trying to break the balance of life and death, that I recommend looking into are Herbert west ( Reanimator book series) and Nagash (Warhammer fantasy). One a scientist who seeks to see how far they can take science to defy the rules that govern all those who live and will allow no laws to stop his research. And the other, A Firstborn son of a king assigned the duty of high priest and given the role of managing the sanctified burial of those who depart, Turning against his peoples beliefs, gods and even the nature that they follow to see himself turned into and eternal being who rules an immortal unkillable army as God above all.

[@darksnakenerdmaster]

Man buries someone named church, Church comes back a lot worse than before. That certainly sounds familiar, altough with less tanks involved

[@SuperSylar]

A tool is a tool, it bears no intent or morals. A wrench in the hands of a mechanic can build and fix lots of machines people everyday need, but in the hands of a killer becomes a weapon. The desire to rebel what we don't like is as old as humanity itself. The concept many stories deem death magic as evil are the implications of what might happen is by chance someone succeed in beating Death: someone with clear ill intents would never fear death and commit as many atrocities they want; is it becomes easy to bring someone back, people could be brought back for the sake of being tortured again and again; people would become unable to cope with loss and move forward with their lives, resulting in getting frustrated when something impossible to get back appears, which would lead to a destructive nature that doesn't care for their surroundings/family&friends/city/world. I feel like a clear temporary one-time-only comeback would make much harm, just to help those that remain actually have a moment to say goodbye, for the dead give some last words or instructions. I think that's what most become lament when someone passes, the lack of a proper closure, specially if the person died due an accident. I think that's by no means evil.

[@Enigma457]

I'm so happy you talked abut CGP Grey's Dragon Tyrant video! I love that video.

[@itsPandorasJar]

This brings to mind a quote by Glennon Doyle I have internalized: "I have learned that I cannot be free from pain, but I can be free from the fear of pain, and that is enough."

[@cheese3996]

Is nobody going to talk about that smooth transition into the sponsor? LIKE DAMN, THAT IS HOW YOU DO A SPONSOR

[@skurvay3429]

Throughout the Astro Boy franchise Astro's origin has mainly been the same, Dr. Tenma loses his son Tobio in one way or another, so he builds an Android that looks like Tobio & has his memories, but Tenma soon realizes that the android can't truly fill the void of Tobio in his heart & becomes resentful towards it, eventually the android finds a new purpose as a superhero named Astro, but the fact remains the same that even if you build a robotic replica of your loved ones, it still won't be the same as the real ones & not change the fact that they are dead.

[@stanimirgeorgiev.87]

I have been watching your channel for some time now and I think your channel has interesting content especially because of the fact that your channel is dedicated to fiction authors combined with your comments containing real life facts. But since you mentioned that you are a fan of fictions and your mind is always in fictions, that is why I decided to mention my fiction developments that I am doing at the moment. You can see them in my basket on this profile. Because my head is always in the clouds and in fictions. Once again,great content. I love your Lovecraftian Yellow King videos.

[@amanzeihedioha]

I want to share a great quote from one such lich - "I ripped off my own living flesh so that I wouldn't have to admit weakness." Wanna guess where it's from~

[@variableaxis9652]

My first thought was the adeptus Mechanicus from warhammer 40k

[@amanzeihedioha]

@@variableaxis9652 Naaaah, want a guess?

[@nopes225]

Order of the stick -great webcomic, by the way!

[@weeb_dweeb]

Adventure time?

[@ApotheosisJuice]

Xykon bragging to Redcloak

[@pixelperfect9111]

Could bring closure to heart broken parents, a few extra moments with ones family or the ability to push yourself to your end goal. Like all things it has its purposes and can be abused.

[@Sucellusification]

Death magic and life magic are always intertwined, even if it doesn't seems so. In many fantasy contexts, undeath is a mirror to life.

[@meatfrog]

Gosh this is my new favorite channel. I have gone down a rabbit hole and i love it! I feel so creatively charged when i watch these videos and I also love the calming voice of the narrator :)

[@Jasonwolf1495]

I've been working a story that has long centered around Death, and by extension his magic. It started when I was about 13, when I was in a particularly bad mindset(you can infer the rest), but I've held onto the project for 15 years always tweaking it and trying to make it a bit better every time. The protagonist is a demigod, a child of Death, who after the passing of his mother, gets into an arguement with Death over his unbiased methods. That perhaps death should try being a little more human. Death doesn't take kindly to this, and decides his son should try being a little more god. He writes his son out of his archives, marking him to live. Knowing he'll suffer a cursed immortality, outliving all other things, Jericho's goals become undoing the curse and proving his father wrong. But that's just the set up, you've also now got the former leader of Death's Psychopomps wandering the world, which is where we get the real duality of Death magic. For many there is abject fear of death magic. They assume it dangerous and horrific, spawning ghouls and monsters, when really for the most part undead are pathetic. They are not inherently monsterous, they're just there. It's probably best summed up when Jericho (and his ward Aliosha) stumble into a zombie out on the frozen planes. While Aliosha responds in fright, Jericho quells her worries literally placing his hand in its mouth. The zombie cannot even remember how to bite much less muster the strength. The only dangerous undead are "abominations" stitched together monsters steadily build to be monsters. undeath isn't the deciding factor, its the cruelty and design that creates monsters. But we're not here about regular zombies, we're here about people trying to really bring someone back. Such things are forbidden, souls must be kept to Death's records, for altering them challenges Death's own authority, and he certainly doesn't intend to double his paperwork(I kid, but he does find such efforts tedious). In fact this has been such a conflict between Life and Death that Death has decided to act on a loophole. As neither can interfere in each other's domain, Death must recruit the living to deal with the undead. His psychopomps are the ones who hunt down those who meddle with death and assure they do not interfere with the order. But what would actually happen if someone managed to get a soul back? To really restore someone? They'd find only a recording. We do not grow in death. We do not change in death. We simply are in death. If you were to pluck a soul back, you may find them talkative, emotive, oh so close to alive, but they can never be something more than they were. They have already come to an end, their story is written. This is a failure that Jericho himself falls back on, with his Birthrite (inherent magical ability as a demigod) he can call forth souls from Death's records, but they are not the full person. Honestly the scariest part of death magic is its ability to decay, and this again is a power given to the protagonist. While other protagonists get bright golden lasers of hope, Jericho is trying to do good when his inherent magical ability is to cause harm. He's clever with it, knowing it works on much more than just people, rusting metal, rotting wood, cracking stone, etc etc. But it's a power that only harms. As to the nature of Death, I do stand firmly in the camp of its requirement. There is no greater equalizer, no stronger catalyst for change and progress. If death is conquered, it will not be to save a starving child, an ill mother, an injured friend. It'll be to preserve political heads, conserve CEOs, and keep power locked in its systems. You can't tell me that you see the world as it is, and not know that a monster like Putin would be the first on the operating table for a boon like that. Don't get me wrong, I wish mercy and long well lived lives on all, but we all need and deserve an end.

[@n3lli3mari3]

This. Is. Awesome.

[@ellamayo9045]

The idea of being able to bring back the dead but them never being able to grow or change since their story has already ended is a really interesting idea to me! It would also make a lot of sense from a story telling point of view to have death maintaining its weight and significance by having it still mark the end of that person’s journey, even if they can be contacted afterwards. I think it’s a really thoughtful and unique angle, and would be really interested to see it played out within the story. Good luck on its completion, I’d definitely buy it if I got the chance!

[@LonesomeKrow]

This is a fantastic take on death magic and stuff. Were you writing a book or something? Seems like a neat idea

[@Jasonwolf1495]

@@LonesomeKrow yeah its a novel in progress at this point. You'd think with 15 years work itd be done by now, but it also turns out that you gotta refine a lot of stuff when your basis was a 13 year olds writing

[@LoboGuara5bruxaria]

This is alos what can be said to be the most saddest and yet most possibly important rebuttal for The Dragon Tyrant Fable: No one wants to die, but if someone where to get rid of death, one of the worse consequences of it is that stupid, irresponsible people at power would never go away, and if that were to happen, everyone would wish for death to come back and get rid of these lunatics.

[@CelticVampireQueen]

The most relatable "being reborn" story I've heard is Flowey's. I woke up in my body after 2 days of being dead. But I didn't have empathy or remorse. I felt like a different person from then on. It wasn't a coma, I knew I was dead. I was only seven when that happened and still haven't moved on from it.

[@Antasma1]

Raising the dead could always be seen as a hyperbole. To not be content with what you have (or had) and asserting your ambition for the sake of greed can lead to dark places. This is exactly what Anakin Skywalker went through under the promise to keep his wife alive

[@ravin6771]

Love how smoothly integrated the sponsor was, another amazing TF video.

[@marcellosouzabeltrao9257]

whenever i think of necromancy i remember the story of arthas how melancholy and sad is his journey

[@jamesbland5207]

I know I would never want to bring someone back, nor would I want to be brought back myself. The loss of a loved one is hard enough, I'd hate to do it again.

[@noxthedremoralord2683]

I’d become a Lich just so I could take care of a crypt Maybe make myself a golden lute and play a melancholy tune throughout all the crypt, keep the dead at rest as opposed to raising them Oh, and terrify anybody who tries to come in

[@surilius0467]

I'm just imagining an adventuring party going into the crypt, interrupting your song, and then having to fight their way out of the crypt that just woke up.

[@robertbemis9800]

I view necromancer coming in two flavors Reanimators - the zombie master mad boys Ghost whisper - help ghost move on and undead slayer For some reason Frank mayor's get all the press, as there are more ghost wispers working as undertakes and grave diggers Most people only know about the other type

[@crimsonitacilunarnebula]

I'd be a lich just to retain memory nd records as it's a hassle to try to remember

[@noxthedremoralord2683]

Fair enough

[@slipspacesurvivalist9416]

That was the smoothest, most in-character segue into a sponsor I've ever seen. lol

[@shanemcguire7333]

I'm reminded of that dnd story where the DM wanted to punish his players for being murder-hobos so he created a world where a lich rules a kingdom and his necromancer minions and undead hordes do his bidding. Of course the murder-hobos kill them all without question but it's later revealed that the kingdom had been ravaged by plague that killed a big chunk of the population. Even after it passed more people died because they didn't have enough workers or farmers to make enough food. So the soon to be lich had an idea, become a lich and teach the people how to raise the dead so they could have all the workers they could ever need and save the ones left alive. Of course the murder-hobos didn't find this out until the end because they never bothered asking anything but initiative. Hell the first undead they killed was a little zombie girl who was not only the Lich's granddaughter, but also the one who sacrificed herself so he could become a lich and save people. It's to bad that the players never knew until the end, but by that time the undead were smited, the necromancers destroyed and the lich let himself be killed and the kingdom died all because the murder-hobos only saw the necromancers as one dimensional and good only for killing and looting.

[@kenichigoXtomoshimo]

This video was amazing, beautiful, therapeutic, and has the best mention of sponsor I've ever seen. Masterpiece.

[@seppukuart9213]

As the old legend goes, “Shortly after immortality was obtained, they longed for death.”

[@Lovehandels]

Oh baby what a treat listening to you talk (melts into a puddle)

[@thetux459]

And then there's Mwindo. Born-walking-and-talking-and-not-respecting-death

[@nobody4248]

"And the man beheld Mung making the sign of Mung before his eyes, which beheld things no more." Gods of Pegana

[@hobosorcerer]

I was thinking just about the story of the black dragon before you brought it up, and it does give me hope for the idea that we can overcome death through understanding of the natural world & ourselves.

[@showdownonshowdown]

Death is necessary. Think about it. You can live forever but the universe won’t. Eventually the sun will go out and everything will be swallowed by a black hole but you will continue to exist in a space where you can’t even breathe and continuously physically die but can’t actually die. In avoiding a hell, you sometimes end up creating another worse hell.

[@kaylaa2204]

As a DM this video gives me so many ideas for some D&D scenarios, from the point you said how all of these stories are compelling and why they are. Just introducing any character into a magic setting trying to use the tools at their disposal to fight mortality is a moral problem of the sort that’s always very interesting to see players interacting with. It’s hard to call it wholly right or wrong and such things leave players asking themselves tough questions through the lens of their character

[@andreil-g4t]

Someone explain to me why this is actually making me cry

[@marlutteyestrelt3441]

A way I have been embracing and accepting death in life was something I figured out since I was a young teenager, and it was around the same time I began writing fantasy therapeutically and still explore to this day. As simply as to expand upon Death as not an end but a transition. Never fully satisfied with reincarnation, spiritual theories like those explored in Lovecraft's Dreamquest about Dreams being alternate realities, applied to death in our lifetime being but a step in a seemingly endless migration to other lives to embody, in different forms. And in my current fiction, Death is not something to fear entirely, but Pain. As I have explored with my characters.Even something as natural as decay can be interpreted as an extension of life through a corpse. As terrifying as it sounds at first, it makes me feel comfortable that even corpses can nurture life.

[@furnaceheadgames9001]

0:58 did you mean medical school

[@geicolizard8147]

I think another good example for the way death and an attempt to escape, is in cyberpunk 2077. What is after death is never explained. But the possibility of becoming an engram is an option. A way to live on as a program. Except it isn’t you. Only a copy of you, it kills your souls. The ending include different options to either accept this false escape, or acccept reality. That there is no escape from death. The only option you have when it comes to death is how you want to go out.

[@BiniPulsar]

Love these videos! I'm writing a story and have been struggling to figure out how I can make necromancy work in a way that doesn't negate the death of characters. What I came up with was that the necromancer has to sacrifice a chunk of their life when they bring someone back, but that's just for the act of revival, to actually keep someone alive they have to link the soul to theirs because that soul no longer has it's own life force, it has to feed off the necromancer's, which will then continue to drain their life even more, and if the necromancer dies the revived person dies as well. Even though in the story necromancy is an almost entirely forgotten magic, and while it would be morally wrong for someone to force a necromancer to revive a person who died, the fact that is exists at all I feel like would remove allot of the effect of character deaths. Does anyone have any ideas how I can tweak this or is it fine as it is?

[@bigdiddyzp1762]

I don't see anything wrong with this system at all! I suppose the caveats to make necromancy a real trade-off would be figuring out exactly what happens to a person when their soul is being actively siphoned. Does it shorten their lifespan, pushing them to achieve immortality? Does it eat away at their conscience, making them increasingly morally-bankrupt as time goes on? It depends on what you have decided what a "soul" consists of in your world. Hope this helps!

[@BiniPulsar]

@@bigdiddyzp1762 That's a really great idea, thank you that helps allot!

[@Sorain1]

@@bigdiddyzp1762 I think the most effectively frightning answer for that is "Memories." As in what's being slowly eaten away is the Necromancer's memories, starting at the beginning. It's a hell of a cost for such power, to not remember your oldest birthday. Making it akin to Alzheimer's would be another example of sheer horror which would make any practitioner extremely sparing with their use. It could also play into the themes of legacy by being a compelling reason for a Necromancer to keep trappings important to them around at all times to limit the damage, and extensively journal their lives, trying to keep the knowledge even in some imperfect form. (Plus it opens up a background idea of someone who went into Necromancy specifically TO forget their terrible early life memories, and the dilemma that happens when they start running out of that 'supply')

[@mrrodgers0]

God fucking damnit. It took me a whole minute from the start of the ad read to realize that I had been listening to a NordVPN sponsorship. That's some excellent acting and world building. I subbed, liked, AND rang the bell.

[@Endymion766]

I keep being told that I don't really want immortality, that I couldn't handle it. I say, try me. Humor me. I may not want to live 10 million years but a thousand years I certainly would want to live. I would like to master several musical instruments, become fluent in a dozen languages, master sketching and make my own graphic novel, or maybe just lay around and play video games for centuries. Life is too short to not want to make it longer. I accept death but don't like it.

[@vali_bg5234]

I'd just like to keep coming back.

[@Endymion766]

@@vali_bg5234 what like reincarnating only keeping your memories? that sounds annoying i dont want to be a baby and really old over and over.

[@joshuab4799]

@@Endymion766 so you wish to live forever eh, well welcome to the end of the universe where you float in the middle of nothing, nothing to do, nothing to see, nothing to hear, nothing to smell, nothing to taste, all you see is the void of a dead universe as you suffocate and starve but are unable to die.

[@Endymion766]

@@joshuab4799 you didnt read my comment fully

[@chongwillson972]

@@joshuab4799 and then the universe resets.

[@OhCrapI_He]

That transition to the sponsored segment was probably the best transition I've ever heard.

[@sanguiniusonvacation1803]

Magic is nether good or evil. My favorite dnd character was a neutral necromancer who's goal it was to establish reformed necromantic magic in the wider world. Her homeland had to use necromancy in order to feed their small baren island nation. It was seen as a gift to the living from the departed to have ones bones farm the sea floor. She hunted lichs, used the bones of farm animals or the willing and never tried to hide what she was.

[@retrosquadchannel2.050]

I found once an interesting concept. There is no need to fear the death. You grieve for your lost beloved once, but you also know, that they live through you - they see through your eyes, they speak through your words and actions. They give you strength, when you are to fall. They are always with you, wherever you go. And when you die, you meet them once again. So, why should you fear, this mindkiller, small death, when there is no need for it?

[@retrosquadchannel2.050]

@@MouldMadeMind fear is irrational thing.

[@ludwigsmedicalclinic1867]

“Don’t fear the Reaper” -BOC

[@matussalaj735]

I have to say that Nord VP Segway was so good you earned my like just because of that lmao, keep up the good work!

[@matthewrosebrock7329]

Another example of this is Amelia from Owen Dennis's Infinity Train. Someone wracked with grief over the loss of her husband Ulrich. To her Ulrich was the foundation keeping her life together. Yes she was a headstrong and independent women, but one that could not be accepted for who she was due to where and when she lived. One example being a female engineering prodigy likely from a period of England where that career path was frowned upon for a women to take up. With Ulrich dead she lost a major source of moral support and the means to live the life she wants. So when she attempts to end it all, and instead ends up on the Infinity Train, where she later discovers it could theoretically create anything as said from the naivety of its conductor. She decides to take matters into her own hands, takes control of the train and tries futilely to repurpose its technology to recreate her old life and Ulrich. But every time the train does not cooperate. Instead it creates exaggerated or over the top train cars filled with reminders of Ulrich such as fountains or roads covered in Ulrich's favorite flavor of jam, or constantly making turtles due to him possessing a turtle patterned handkerchief. The train's purpose is to help people learn from what has happened to them and to then move forward with life, and so it sees her attempt at bringing Ulrich back as working against that. So no matter how much she tried she was never going to be able to succeed and likely die trying if someone hadn't forced her to face reality.