Why Kid's Stories should be Darker

[@TheTaleFoundry]

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[@Wren_BurnsHam]

Hi Tale foundry, your videos inspire me to make small short books for my family! Your channel has taught me so much, so thank you.

[@hi-kv8ey]

Fnaf is a an

[@WoziduranJahemter]

Do you know the Legend of Ouch?

[@thecateatingasian]

absolute best thumbnail

[@blitzyt1779]

Im a kid and I've seen heeps of horror movie clips like Friday the 13th predator and ghost face and horror game like fnaf

[@kelpiekit4002]

As a preschool teacher I'd say kids need stories with strong emotions. They don't experience quaintly. They're not angry. They're betrayed or furious. They're not sad. They're in despair and alone. They're not scared of their imagination. They're terrified of things that might be real. And, with them still learning their way out of ego-centrism, they are the only person who has ever felt like that. Stories give them a chance to experience a character fully feeling an overwhelming emotion and finding a way through it. They learn empathy, resilience, and emotional processing through seeing and hearing experiences like theirs and their experiences are darkly exaggerated, not lesser.

[@Whiskerbin]

In the preschool I was in, all the books were silly and to do with poo or a fish with fingers. No characters to relate to really. Im glad I'm not the only one noticing the lack of adventure and feelings in kids book, it's all so dumbed down

[@Whiskerbin]

@@mil4023 whats that?

[@karanaher5030]

@@Whiskerbin Teletubbies

[@santajackfan101]

@@Whiskerbin with all do respect there's nothing wrong with being toned down.

[@andresltaifmuller1779]

My favorite book as a child was Struwwelpeter, so I would like more strong emotions and consequences in stories for children.

[@mollywantshugs5944]

I think the Bambi example is actually a really good test of how to approach dark subject matter in children’s media: don’t show it, but by all means imply its presence. Let the story have the shadow of violence or horror, just not those things directly

[@marocat4749]

Yepm honetly a lot of adult jokes in family is by that kid cant know the contet, and why family media can be the most mature out there (it alo help you cant be just edgy a replacement for thoughtful dealing with it. And i think the implying is the mot impactful, not only for kids but even adults. Also kid will be confronte with like death or , it nessesary to have a coated in metaphor but a preperation of that things that will happen or do exist. . Its just a doiferent medium to explore that, and more thoughtful, and dives more in the horrors of imagination. That is the best horror. And the world is very scary, horror is a good way to deal with that by giving it room, especially for children and teenager.

[@aureliodeprimus8018]

That is what i liked about Tales from the Crypt (the cartoon version). It sticked close to the original and also had some very original fates for the evil doers. For example a narcissict had escaped the vampire, but was bitten in the process and couldn`t look in the mirror anymore. Meanwhile the brother he left behind could defeat the vampire and save the princess.

[@saragreenfire4515]

There is a reason that was one of the movies I rewatched the most as a kid.

[@totallynormal5690]

yes!

[@julietfischer5056]

These stories are safe ways for children to encounter tough subjects. The problem is that adults don't want to talk about these things with each other, let alone their children.

[@Aaron-from-BroTrio]

There is a quote from Don Bluth discussing this topic. "If you don’t show the darkness, you don’t appreciate the light. If it weren’t for December no one would appreciate May. It’s just important that you see both sides of that." You can really see that attitude in a lot of his films.

[@BLET_55artem55]

You still need to be careful or it's gonna be nothing more than a childhood trauma. And it can really come from anywhere (1984 Spiderman is one of 3 reasons I don't like superheroes)

[@aaronmyers6686]

This is something that's been itching me since I was the target demographic. Kids are a lot more emotionally complex than adults may realize. Yes, maybe they're not *as* emotionally complex as adults, but kids can understand concepts beyond good buys vs. bad guys, objective undeniable good vs objective undeniable evil. Hell, I'd wager to say that kids *need* more emotionally complex media to help with emotional and social development.

[@aradraugfea6755]

For the VERY young, there is definitely developmental stuff to consider. But that process goes all the way up to 25 years old, and the only life experience we protect late teens and early 20s from is car renting. Kids have the same emotional range as adults, and ultimately are little people. The, as this video says, just lack the context and the vocabulary. Temper Tantrums are only partly because a child has not developed self control. A bigger, larger aspect, and educators and developmental psychologists will back me on this, is that children have wants and desires they literally do not know how to communicate. An adult can manage their feelings from decades of practice. Can forge those feelings and emotions into words, communicate them to each other, and thus, hopefully, resolve the upset. A toddler, who has not yet been exposed to many words longer than their own curiously grasping fingers, don't have that vocabulary. The toolkit isn't there. Which is another thing in this video that I think really nails it. Caring for a child isn't about protecting them from all challenge and harm, but being there to provide them the toolkit and experience they lack when necessary.

[@mr_indie_fan]

I was very smart for my age (keep in mind i was 7) and these things taught me the complex gray areas of the world around me: max payne 3, call of duty black ops 2, borderlands 1 2 and the pre sequel, call of duty modern warfare 2, and several of the assassins creed games. Don't worry i didn't turn out a psychopath or anything, but i did learn to fight back against bullies which got me kicked out of a ton of schools as a kid.

[@TheAsylumCat]

The challenge is trying to understand at what stages is the child is or is not ready for more complex themes. Kids develop at different rates so going by age is inaccurate and knowing another person is difficult, especially when that person is this weird protohuman bobble head creature.

[@iesika7387]

Oh I think it's extremely important to limit things the other way around - REDUCE the kids' exposure to pure good versus pure evil stories. If that's what they see in their fiction, it's what they'll expect in their life as they grow up - they will always be the good guy, and anyone they don't like doesn't just disagree - they are the bad guys, and inherently evil. The number of times I've heard a young person refer to real-life human people as "the bad guys" (in reference to everything from wars to sports events) hurts me at my core. There are no good guys or bad guys - there's doing good things or doing bad things, and everyone, absolutely everyone, is capable of doing both.

[@tbnrrenagade9507]

@@mr_indie_fan psychopathy is an innate personality trait that's there no matter your upbringing or experiences. If you were a psychopath, it wouldn't be to do with anything you listed.

[@RocknRoll301199]

No joke, the sheer ammount of sterilized content is one of the reasons I think there are so many edgelords. When I was a kid (and even as a pre-teen) I was very edgy, along with many of my friends and I think one of the reasons was the fact that we were from a full-time school. We would attend to classes in the morning and spend the entire afternoon under the school councelors watch. And the sheer ammount of sanitization of EVERYTHING was immense, specially considering almost all of the facility was composed of evangelical christians. One time a teacher even changed the symbol of our cultural fest for a symbol of another country because she said that the mask reminded her of the devil. This sterilization makes so that even children can't relate to really anything and they end up going for the extreme opposite of it as a sort of escapism from the flowery cotton candy world they are spoon fed since birth.

[@ajimtiredplsletmesleep2521]

This is why I hated being sheltered growing up. Once I realized how cruel and heartless the world can be, it crushed me. I learned about politics 2020 by having half the people praising trump and hating Biden, and the other half praising Biden and hating trump. Growing up in a religious household and community, they taught about instead of “me” it’s we. And I really followed that, i followed that until I was a doormat for anybody, I learned to be submissive. And repress emotions that others didn’t like, anger, sadness, and more. I’ve recently been rewatching a lot of kid movies and shows, certain movies just hit me differently, like Toy story 3, the letting go, abandonment, and sadness are a big part of that. I hated that movie as a child, because I was never taught that letting go was ok

[@andrewkelley9405]

Traditional evangelical Christianity is a blight on children because of things like this.

[@lost_l0ser154]

@@ajimtiredplsletmesleep2521 kinda the same, but my dad is ex-Mormon. He jokes about God existing and stuff, but this is kinda my life.

[@lost_l0ser154]

omg yeah-

[@lost_l0ser154]

wait how did this type that cuz I didn’t- HUH

[@SamuelSamuelSamuel1]

That’s why spirited away and coralline are the best kids movie’s. It teaches kids to be brave and to hold their trust with themselves, and to not trust the judgment of someone just because they’re older. Like seriously that’s the best way to raise strong kids. And when I have kids one day I will make sure to limit the black and white world shows.

[@pn2294]

I find it funny since shows that criticize black and white morality are more likely to have it.

[@BLET_55artem55]

​@@pn2294looks even more ironic with some recent events (BLM riots)

[@BLET_55artem55]

Spirited away is kind of a mess with too much metaphoric and symbolic stuff for kids' to comprehend

[@pn2294]

@@BLET_55artem55 some part of that is just culture clash

[@BLET_55artem55]

@@pn2294 still not a good choice for a 6y old

[@samwill7259]

A warning that every parent should take heed. If you are not there to educate your child on the hard things in life, they WILL find out without you, and you will not be in control when that happens, and the consequences will be far more dire. Your choice, help them step into the shallows. or wait for them to jump into the deep.

[@aceundead4750]

Do be careful not to go too far the other way though, otherwise they risk becoming antisocial or uninterested in exploring life.

[@maggiesheartlove2734]

Its why I am so, so, soooooooo grateful to my mother who not only payed attention to what I was exposed to, but was always there to educate me on what i watched. It not only helped me distinguish fiction from reality, but it encouraged me to talk to my mom more and engage in more complex conversations when I got older. So, thank you Mom for being a parent. Other parents, TAKE NOTES!!!!!!!

[@chickadeestevenson5440]

I am grateful I navigated the depths on my own, because my mother's fears made the shallows themselves seem deep. I was raised in a world of binary.

[@Simerali]

the fact that parents just let their kids go on the internet and not supervise them yet lose their minds at anything darker in kids media will never fail to boggle my mind like? There's faaaar worse on the internet they're bound to stumble across than they'll ever see on a show or whatever (speaking from experience here lmao)

[@americanstudent9062]

As someone who fits in as a teen, and knowing that I lived a sheltered life not knowing what some phrases my peers used until I myself experienced or researched, so technically going off the deep end... And now me and my father seem to be in constant arguments and the feeling of constant, smothering security of some company grade internet protection is part of my life now. So I can agree with that warning

[@hyperfocus1963]

"Children aren't stupid, they just lack context." This video is healing, thank you!

[@historiansayori2089]

This helps vocalize the objection I’ve had to those who assume children are unable to process heavy material at all or who dismiss children as unable to discuss such topics. Hopefully this idea makes the rounds more thoroughly

[@hyperfocus1963]

@@historiansayori2089 To continue the conversation, I would say that children don't yet have the tools to process everything, like he said in the video, but for sure talking down to children in a way that makes them out to be less than human is not the solution. Like "I'll tell you when you're older" is such a shut-down, brick-wall-in-the-face sort of thing to say.

[@StoryTeller796]

=)

[@MuffinEnjoyer]

Nah kids are stupid

[@mr_indie_fan]

I was a fast learner and at the ages of 6-8 I didn't lack context, i was playing max payne, borderlands and gta. Max payne 3 and borderlands 2 are still some of my favorite games till this day actually!

[@kitsux4280]

I remember my five-year-old cousin asking “why are the leaves Orange?” So I told him “they crumble up and die and then New ones grow in Spring” my grandma did not like that she said “he doesn’t need to comprehend death” which I completely agree with but still it’s a thing that happens in nature and I’m pretty sure he’s not gonna be sad over Leaf Edit : By “comprehend” I meant realization that him and everyone he knows is going to die One day. Thanks for all the likes and comments :)

[@tiamystic]

Lol my mom would’ve told me at that age “Because god wanted them that way.”

[@Star-pl1xs]

@@tiamystic ugh

[@theshellderinslowbrostail5422]

@@tiamystic my mom told me this excuse as well, but also explained why this happens, how it went in nature and what purpose it held. Its kind of nice to know my mom was 100% honest with me

[@aveganeverywhere]

Completely disagree you're never too young to know what death is. It's a part of life that should not be hidden.

[@EpicGabby24]

@@theshellderinslowbrostail5422 my parents did that too. Saying God made it, but they made a great emphasis that science and God go hand in hand. He made the cycle of the leaf needing to fall to create another when the seasons change. And if there was a question they didnt know, they admitted it. Instead of making things up. My parents believed in full honesty in kids cuz it develops them better. They didnt even want me believing in Santa cuz they hated the capitalistic twist on a holiday that was thriving on deception of kids. I know they're reaching. But I never cared about it anyways. Still got gifts and I appreciate them as parents/people.

[@wahwahluigi3991]

I remember when I was little I was given a random book to read from the school's library. It was about a little girl that was given a pet worm by her crush. Something like a caterpillar. It seemed normal, until she discovered the worm would eat anything she disliked- from normal things, like a random rock she hit her foot with, to more abstract things like the dimples the popular girl in school had (nothing gory, mind you. They just stopped appearing). And with each meal, the worm would get bigger. Spoilers ahead - It's fun to think about it now because it was almost like off-brand cosmic horror. In order for the worm to eat something she needed to hate it first. And she started to hate one thing after another, each time bigger, it ate people, whole buildings, all trains and boats and airplanes. Until it eventually ate the sun, the starts and everything else. until only she was left. And sure enough, she hated what she caused, which made her the last meal of her pet. But! She didn't die. nothing the worm ate really did. Everything was like at the beginning, but she had to live knowing they were all living inside a massive, giant caterpillar monster. I remember being so confused when I finished reading. The ending wasn't completely sad, but certainly wasn't happy. Children deserve stories that can haunt them in the most unexpected of ways. ***Edit: Hello! Sorry for the late answer, I was looking if the book had an English version (couldn't find any) but you can find it as "Lucas afuera, Lucas adentro" (Lucas in, Lucas out). Amazon offers the soft cover, a kindle version, and if you live in Mexico you are likely to find it in almost any public library. Someone mentioned the name was The Word Eater by Mary Amato and tbh I am not sure if it might be a similar theme, but I will try to fetch it to take a look at it! Happy reading!

[@topiaz]

i gtta go read that, that sounds amazing

[@Zalkin4213]

You gotta give us the name if you remember it please

[@cendre4605]

Omg you just triggered something... I think I've read this book too ? I'm not sure... All I know is when I was a kid, I had this weird game where I pretended to be eaten by a giant worm and I had to explore it, and I'm almost sure that it was because of a book with a similar story, now that I've seen your comment it feels like a confused memory- I'd really like to know the title if you remember it.

[@alyssabullock6421]

Wow , that sounds weirdly engaging -

[@johnstevenson5084]

That's a really cool story

[@davidci]

I think it's a good step that kids stories and movies are moving towards being more nuanced and serious. Granted, movies should never be an alternative to parenting nor should kids movies never be about happy stories anymore. But movies have a big impact on people, especially young audiences, and they can learn life lessons through them too. They should learn that life is much more serious than just constant dance numbers.

[@thepinkestpigglet7529]

Moving towards more serious? Yeah cause this is a new concept...

[@justradiclesandco]

@@thepinkestpigglet7529 I think what OP meant is that kids media isn’t always serious and nuanced and more creators are starting to do so now. There’s always been serious and/or nuanced kids content before, but maybe more people are starting to understand and maybe make kids content that gets kids thinking about more than just the easy positive lessons.

[@ghostwriter991]

I feel like the reason fairytales are the way they are is because child abuse is real so like red riding hood they teach kids to be assertive and defend themselves.

[@rami_ungar_writer]

Agree completely

[@Bear3737]

I felt so much emotion reading that, but then I looked at your pfp

[@smay9100]

"The world isn't to be hidden from, it is to be found" 12:37 This quote gave me chills

[@michaelriverside1139]

I would place Infinity Train and Over the Garden Wall right next to Coraline in Children's Horror, a real shame the first was cancelled on behalf of "being too dark and complex for children"... Which is ridiculous, the whole point of the show is for Children and Teenagers to find a creative solution to their predicaments, while still growing into the best version of themselves by getting a better understanding of the world around them, a true shame.

[@Master-Works]

The Ending of season 3 was kind of uncomfortable, though. You know what I mean. I mean, yikes.

[@michaelriverside1139]

@@Master-Works Oh, definitely! Simon was an absolute monster by that point, but could've been placed under some kind of task to lower his insane number like Amelia, perhaps...? I don't even know, though.

[@Master-Works]

@@michaelriverside1139 Yeah, if it shocks even adults and makes them uncomfortable, then you know it is a bit too much. I mean, who actually wants to see that? Maybe some kind of deranged person? I don’t know. By the way, Simon had become worse than a monster at that point.

[@rosykindbunny1313]

@@michaelriverside1139 I highly doubt he could've been redeemed at that point

[@rosykindbunny1313]

Yes yes yes! Love those shows!

[@gabrielbruce1977]

This is also a reason to take issue with "it doesn't have to be good, it's for kids", I think. Because yes, it IS for kids. And kids are still people, they're not a monolith of fabricated innocence and bliss you have to maintain by only feeding them sweet sugary garbage. Kids WILL get bored of bad media, especially if you expose them to good media early on, and good media includes those darker and heavier elements without flinching at them.

[@marocat4749]

If anything it neds to be better because uit should be mature, and talk about stuff while not being explicit and metaphorical. Like family series are anmong the best to go maningful dark, and yes, children are the best and worst critics. They need good media, that is mature and deals at least implied with the darker sadd things in life.

[@Master-Works]

Hey! Just becouse something is sweet and sugery doesn’t mean it is garbage! Something can be sweet and sugery and be nice media too! They can have both! They can have The Dark Crystal and Candy Land!

[@gabrielbruce1977]

@@Master-Works You're right! I guess I should have elaborated a bit. It's not that kids can't HAVE Candyland, it's just that when everything is Candyland, it's easy to say everything sucks.

[@1234321ah]

Who cares all they know is eat sleep work repeat

[@1234321ah]

@Will N I’m not talking about kid shows I’m talking about kids I still think a lot of them are dumb punks

[@chowrites6179]

As a child I longed for this sort of content, not because "scary stuff is for adults/big kids" but because the dark and emotional was such a foreign concept in my media that I wanted to experience more of that. Gargoyles, BTAS, ATLA, and later Dark Souls were important in helping me heal and grow as a child as I experienced my heroes go through hard times and in a way it was both encouraging and comforting

[@jillianefaithcobre8637]

If without dark elements, it would be boring.

[@GreenGearStudio]

When I was 16 I did some charity work at a daycare. It mostly came down to playing the Pokémon TCG with the more shy kids. Sometimes, by a school's need of constant testing, I had to study. What was fascinating, however, was that always those same kids came over and begged me to explain what I was studying. And they asked questions. Questions that were always relevant to the subject and that went quite deep. Kids are so much more curious than we often think. I'm afraid that the constant need of studios to sterilize their media is hampering that curiosity while we should be rewarding it

[@marocat4749]

Yep, there is even the book of askamortitian, that has questions , by kids and pretty good ones at that. Yeah if anything of that unafraidness to ask questions should be learned (and just teach them whn and when not)

[@smiweftrat2939]

@@bobbobby475 you battle with the cards

[@InsertMyChineseUsername]

It's a trading card game and there's actually an official game

[@MelonHere20]

This! It's very important to feed child curiosity

[@Wren_BurnsHam]

My mum NEVER let me read Coraline. I never knew why, but when I read it at my friends house I realised it was horrifying, still I loved it.

[@lilymorgo3412]

I actually remember watching the movie adapation a few times throughout my life and I'm fine with it

[@musicplaylists6718]

Love the Cattails pfp!!!

[@Leopard_211]

@@lilymorgo3412 the book is totally different

[@MagusMarquillin]

@@Leopard_211 The book is totally different because it's a book and not a movie, but as adaptations go it mostly follows the book - both are quite cool and creepy in their own style.

[@Leopard_211]

@@MagusMarquillin I never really read the book, but people say it's much creepier, but one thing I know for sure is that the movie adaptation is different in many aspects

[@chimericalbeast]

Did anyone actually have a “happy” childhood? I had a pretty privileged upbringing, but I remember the chronic bullying, realizing that my parents marriage was not that great, the death of my grandfather, gratuitous amounts of homework, learning about violent crimes that were just going to be a part of my world, being told that these were the best years of my life and really not feeling it... A manifestation of anxiety disorders can be repeated/compulsive exposure to things that are upsetting, and in that case, the child should have someone there to help them regulate that impulse. But as this video says, most children will put down something that genuinely upsets them. And sometimes they might make it through something upsetting and just have questions. I work in a library, and I frequently have parents ask if something is appropriate for their child. And, I mean, I wouldn’t hand a five-year-old a copy of Tokyo Ghoul just because it’s a comic, and I once had to explain that Princess Mononoke wasn’t a children’s movie. But when a precocious nine-year-old wants to read a young adult book, I don’t always know what to say even if I have read that particular book. I suggested that the parent just be available for conversation, because the kid might have questions. I think the parent ultimately passed on the book because they took that as a, no, this is not appropriate, but my point stands. As said, “children aren’t stupid: they lack context”

[@Sayyar615]

Yeah it just that people think that kids can not be sad at all

[@taramaforhaikido7272]

@@Sayyar615 Which is delusion and denial. No one is meant to be happy all the time. Desperation for fun and happiness is why people suffer without knowing why and kill themselves. In the hundreds of millions. Other emotions and even the lack of them happen for a reason. Turning a blind eye to it is a mistake.

[@audiobooksforfree7857]

The top part is what I'm feeling as a teen.

[@chimericalbeast]

@@audiobooksforfree7857 It gets better. Life isn’t exactly a cakewalk, but I’m way happier and healthier at 30 than I ever was as a teen.

[@wakkaseta8351]

If your criteria for "happy childhood" is "never faced any form of hardship", then no, I guess no one has ever had a "happy childhood".

[@cramerfloro5936]

When I was a child I was terrified of a lot of "scary" movies, tv shows or even concepts. I was even scared of vampires and werewolves, something that with a lot of modern media in mind, is almost completely unbelievable to me. But I would also read a lot of things that many would consider too much for children. I loved greek mythology and adored Grimm’s fairy tales, and reading them actually made me willing to watch more upsetting adaptations of them.

[@dantedharma6252]

I remember that my little sister was actually scared of being scared and that was horrifiying , she haves a great imagination and that means great nigthmares so she was always looking to avoid anithing that could cause them and even had one period were you couldn´t say anithing funny if it was late. But now she is way more capable of handeling it so I´m curious if she will enter soon this zone or if she is already on it

[@sacrilegioussasquatch]

That was me, I had the books but jurassic park was the most horrifying movie i ever saw and that was purely because of the dinosaurs. I loved learning about them and seeing them in pictures, but seeing them move on screen was terrifying

[@sacrilegioussasquatch]

@Will N I think it was the early jurassic park movies. I've seen dinosaur teeth and dino hunting in photos. It was on of the old jurassic park movies and my first "monster movie"

[@tsm688]

it's something I wonder about. Has anyone in this century actually been scared by a skeleton? Even last century they seemed played out. Monsters aren't scary. Humans are scary. Except xenomorphs. Those are still scary.

[@mushroomhehe370]

honestly, every kid should read coraline by neil gaiman. it's from the perspective of a kid dealing with adversary all on her own yet it doesn't feel like a parody of childhood. it feels genuine.

[@Kingsterofalldemonz]

My friend has seen the movie, and said it was creepy and cool. But despite her being 8-9 yrs old (She can’t remember) she absolutely loved it yet was terrified at the same time.

[@xxysdragon]

@@Kingsterofalldemonz same here i have watched it 3-5 times

[@Omelander]

I somehow was terrified of the coralline movie when I was a kid but I could watch 9 (the movie) when I was little so easily and not be scared

[@johntumahab323]

From what I've experienced, the kids in my life who watched that movie were fine with it. It's the ADULTS who said it was horrific, traumatic, the scariest thing they ever saw, and then banned it in the house.

[@xxysdragon]

@@johntumahab323 damn

[@TylerLarson]

I was friends with Don Bluth a few years back. Not super close; just the same community, same neighborhood, etc. So I had a childhood friend with me at a Christmas party and I introduced them: "This is Don. You remember those movies like An American Tail and The Secret of NIMH, and all those? Don's the one who wrote and directed them and did the art and stuff." And my friend says, "You wrote The Secret of NIMH? That movie scared the sh*t out of me when I was 6." And do you know what he said? You know what Don Bluth actually said? "Well, it was supposed to!" Yep. Children's stories were a bit different back then.

[@heartlessmushroom]

As a kid, Majora's Mask introduced me to a concept that scared and got me thinking for a long time: The idea of the End of the World. And not in the usual "fight the bad guy save the world" kind of way, but in a way that felt uncomfortably real. People seeing the train rushing at them but being unable to do much about it. Very heavy stuff for a kid to handle. Ever since I was always scared of cosmic things ending the world such as the moon falling, the sun expanding and engulfing us or more realistically, a meteor wiping us all out. It scared me, yes, but also made look up things about it, inform myself and dispell fears that might not seem as immediate as I once thought them to be. I've since made peace with all the things out there that could destroy our world with very little effort, for I know that they are distant, infrequent and ultimately not fuled by any malice. Our insignificance and vulnerability in the universe made me realize how pointless being cruel is and how much more valuable being kind is.

[@soup_lover39]

I remember watching my dad play Zelda games when I was younger, one of them being Majora’s Mask. The fact that you alone have to save the world, you alone have to take on the burden of being the hero at the ripe age of 9 was terrifying, and the reason why I avoided that game altogether. Now, that I’m older, I enjoy the concept and influence the game had, and while it’s still stressful as frick to me, I can understand it’s beauty to its full potential. Still… I’ll stick with the other games.

[@xle6114]

The ending part about how valuable being kind is, is kinda ironically funny with their channel name being heartlessmushroom

[@xerveeon]

This is pretty much my exact experience, especially the cosmic dread. Life is already hell enough, don't make it worse for people.

[@shortstackofpancakes13]

When I was younger I actually remember always liking the dark scary stories, even if they frightened me, they were interesting unlike lots of other media that I was introduced to back than

[@thorndoll_52]

In fourth grade, I wrote a horror story where the main character ended up dying. They were tied up and burned by dolls >:D I loved horror

[@ziswrld]

@@thorndoll_52 pfft lmfao let me read it >:D

[@Mi_vida_es_aburrida]

Same,i watched +18 movies and then i was like....Okay?Strange-... And thats just everything

[@Mi_vida_es_aburrida]

@@thorndoll_52 can i read It?

[@kaneninkupas4243]

@@thorndoll_52 Tails Doll story huh?

[@santaisreal]

My 4th grade teacher was my favorite teacher ever because everyday she would read a few chapters of a book, but she actually read books made for adults for us instead of those super censored "kids" books, and all of us loved it.

[@Velociiraptor]

In grade 2 I asked the teacher to read us black beauty, she read like two chapters too us than said it was too sad and didn’t let us finish it :/

[@dragonlord1935]

@@Velociiraptor bruh, seriously? my third grade teacher called me aside after the last day in class and gifted me a copy of Black Beauty in private because I was the only one who had gotten consistent straight A's throughout the year and she wanted to reward me. (In hindsight it was kind of an ironic move from her, "here, you did a good job studying for school this year, so have this massive feckin novel as a gift for the holidays because extracurricular reading is definitely what you need right now lol). But I appreciated it nonetheless since it was the first and only time a teacher has done that for me. I thought the story was slow but I loved it anyway and thought it was very thought provoking and a good example of why you should treat animals kindly. Heck, I still read it sometimes even to this day, more than a decade later. I don't know why anyone (much less a teacher) would call it "too sad", It's a classic highlight of literature.

[@ElmKyh]

@@dragonlord1935 reminded me of when my preschool principal gifted and signed me a book for being the first one in my class to learn to read.

[@ElmKyh]

@@freddysolar that book isn't even scary bruh

[@IHaveACoolSuit]

How do you guys even remember elementary school anymore, I can barely recall middle school 😂

[@wren_bean]

I always loved giving the kids i babysat media that challenged them-- anything to get them to ask me questions. Iron Giant was a favorite, and i often brought things like Kiki's Delivery Service and occasionally something more like Box Trolls. I always tried to respect the kids' reactions and if they said they were scared I'd reassure them and tell them I'd turn it off if it was too scary. Some parents didn't like my choices (which is their prerogative) but seldom understood that the kids wanted to be challenged, and that the littles always had me to give them honest answers to the questions they had about my movies and the concepts those movies presented. And that's before you consider how many kids LOVE scary stories. Kids have an intrinsic understanding that the sanitized media they get doesn't tell them much that's "real" about the world around them. The world is scary and sad, but they don't learn how to handle it until they've been given ways to process those feelings in safer environments. As always, well done-- i love your channel!

[@mr_indie_fan]

Iron giant and boxtrolls, very good choices in dark childrens movies! Personally some of my favorite movies!

[@jemd5766]

@The Stonefish It's not for everyone though, keep in mind.

[@blindedjourneyman]

Aye, and shows like are you afraid of the dark, and courage the cowardly dog. My sibs love their scary fiction, more than I ever did much to my ammusement.

[@TwentySeventhLetter]

Yeah y'know a TON of Ghibli media felt like that, just on the edge of creepy and dark but still very much palatable for unexperienced minds. Enough darkness to really demonstrate the value of the lighthearted happy times through contrast.

[@pokaay3163]

@The Stonefish my parents watched the sanctum movie* in the living room once when I was little. All I remember from that were the most graphic scenes- and the beginning when they first jumped into the huge cave-hole. They watched a lot of adult rated content without really hiding it from us, except for explicit sexual stuff. But we still saw movies like the fifth element, the matrix, armageddon, and this one movie about like.. an egyptian villain who could dissolve people with black insects? etc, without any problem. I even enjoy re-watching them for the nostalgia. I can say none of it had a negative impact on me. Sure I was scared of the horror movies, but I also LOVE horror currently. I wasnt as afraid to talk about “adult” topics and media with my elementary and middle school friends. And when teachers exercised caution about exposure to a dark subject we were interested, not confused or unaware. Kids love dark stuff (mostly). The FNAF craze was just as big in adult circles as it was for schoolchildren when the first couple games came out. I remember asking for the game in elementary and reassuring my parents that it wasnt that scary or bloody, instead of the opposite.

[@GrouchyGander]

Swedish actually has a word for remembering what it was like to be a child and retaining that childlike wonder about the world: "Barnasinne" (roughly translates to Child's Mind). Something that I'm trying my best to keep, even *if* the adult life is very stressful and seemingly speaking against all forms of childishness. It's tough, but it makes the adult world a lot easier to cope with.

[@dissonanceparadiddle]

I think too many of us cast off our childhood selves believing you have to give it up to move on and grow but people aren't like that really. I feel more like a Russian nesting doll. Each younger layer of myself wrapped around the other hidden but still there. Each year a new ring around the tree that is me.

[@michaelriverside1139]

That word essentially encapsulates Luke Pearson's Hilda, it's set in a fantastic world where trolls are treated like Bears or Crocodiles, but dissapointment and unfulfilled lives are very real issues for her and those around...

[@justradiclesandco]

That’s valid. There’s a lot of expectations to being an adult, but it’s good that you’re still able to find Barnasinne. Sometimes it’s nice to just explore things you liked as a kid or just have a day to be wild and relax

[@catbatrat1760]

@@dissonanceparadiddle This reminds me of a quote I've read. I forgot what it was word for word, but it was something like "Being an adult is about throwing away childish things, like the fear of being seen as a child". In other words, people being so desperate to not be seen as "childish" that they become outright snobby is ironically much more childish than simply enjoying what they enjoy.

[@dissonanceparadiddle]

@@catbatrat1760 i feel like i can almost remember that quote is a good one

[@sn0wsparks]

this is why I loved Animorphs as a kid. Animorphs was basically "baby's first war story", "baby's first tragedy" and "baby's first body horror" all wrapped up in one. It approached war in a complex and nuanced way. At the beginning, you think it's going to be another "good guys fighting bad guys" story, but it expands the further along you go. The "good guys" commit horrible atrocities. The "bad guys" are a complex society with a resistance up against their current dictatorship. It plays with their villains concept, an alien slug that takes over your mind, in a genuinely chilling way. The kids never know who could be one of them, and they even discover early on that one of the main characters' brother is one. The true horror of it is that the books are very clear that the host is aware in there, unable to do anything as their slavemaster uses their body to do the same thing to their friends, family and community. And every time the good guys fight them, they have to hurt the innocent hosts as collateral damage. Oh and by the way the morphing is straight up body horror. The descriptions as they turn into different animals are nauseating. Plus, because they could morph away damage, the books do all kinds of gorey things with the kids. Like the one time one of them got squashed as a fly and nearly died, in graphic detail. And the time another kid beat up the aliens with her own severed arm. And after all that, the story ends in tragedy. They win the war, sure, but the ending isn't happy. There's no big Star Wars style celebration. Rachel is dead, Jake is depressed and lost after the war, Marco is trying to ignore his sorrow via fame and recklessness, Tobias cut contact with everyone after losing the girl he loved. Cassie is the only one to make it out remotely okay. And the series ends on a cliffhanger, with Jake, Marco and Tobias getting together to fight another battle, because there's always another war. Animorphs was fucked up and it was the type of story that people would say is "not for kids". It believed in that kids weren't stupid and that we were capable of confronting realities about war and the type of world we live in. Because, at the end of the day, despite it being about aliens and animal morphing powers, Animorphs was also a cautionary tale about what happens to people when they go to war. How it warps them into an unrecognizable shell of themselves even after the fighting is over, how sometimes good people die. Many who've read it as children say that Animorphs played a big part in their current anti-war sentiments, and I'm honestly right there with them. In a world where adults were always trying to shield us from the darkness of the world, Animorphs was there to help us understand it. It was one of my favourite series as a kid and probably the childhood story that has stuck with me the most.

[@anifan98]

I completely agree, I got the entire 62 book series (plus the two choose-your-own-adventure style stories Alternamorphs) and loved every single one of them. It was my first introduction to children's books that didn't need pictures (besides the front covers), and dealt with complex issues. I also managed to get the other books by K. A. Applegate, Everworld and Remnants, which were for older teen audiences.

[@thewolfpoet]

"Ram the Blade Ship."

[@BLET_55artem55]

I think the author of this series had some mental issues, probably because he was around "fresh" war veterans as a child or was in the war zone himself

[@alinerdelav]

Never heard of animorphs will look into it. Wow..

[@loganreads90]

Rachel dies?! Spoilers!

[@charcoalangel7536]

Reccently I wrote a short one page paper on the web series Don't Hug Me I'm Scared for my scriptwriting class. This video kind of reminded me of that series. How kids watched it despite or maybe even because of it's horrifying elements. Ultimately the message of Don't Hug Me I'm scared is something that both kids and adults need: don't believe everything your told even by authority figures.

[@hbeachley]

I love this show! And my kids introduced me to it!

[@emocrybaby]

I love it I found about it since I was about 5 or 6 It scared me alot but I still loved it And still do

[@annaireton8816]

I hate don't hug me I'm scared but I loved Olive fingers

[@CultoftheSpiral]

@@annaireton8816 olive fingers..? you mean salad fingers?

[@vallum12100]

Especially authority figures that lead by force and "because they say so" Even if you feel its annoying, always explain yourself if asked. People ask for a reason.

[@finlockhart4572]

I loved Coraline as a kid because I was actually experiencing things that tend to be classified as "inappropriate for children's media," and the only way I knew how to cope was by seeking out media that mirrored my feelings (most of which was for adults, and in retrospect it feels like that media was telling me "you're not a real child, because this content/your life isn't for children.") Coraline was different, though - it was exactly as horrifying as my real life, but it was clearly made with me in mind, by someone who understood that a child who could relate to such intense horror was still innocent, and still not an adult. That's why it's still my favorite horror book years later.

[@ameliaiwan5713]

As a kid who was raised on a wide variety of books which weren't neccessarily for children and Ghibli films, who were technically for children, but also talked about war, death, trauma and other fun topics, I can only be thankful to my parents for it. Seriously, children are perfectly capable of understanding those topics on some level - from when I was two years old (according to my parents) my favourite film was "Nausicaa of the valley of the wind", and by the time I was five, i watched it with full understanding that Yes, There Was A War And People Burnt The Forest So The Big Bugs From The Forest Got Mad And Killed Even More People, and I was always captivated by the beautiful plants from the mysterious forest and scared by the killer robots and cried when Nausicaa's dad was murdered, but I always loved watching it because it was good to cry a little sometimes and I aspired to be as good and smart and kind as the umtimate pacifist that was Nausicaa (the word 'pacifist' literally became my fav word for a few months and I used it way too much in contexts in which it did not belong). Although, it was a bit alienating, I'll admit. As You can imagine, all the other kids who watched only kid friendly stuff often didn't understand what I was talking about. I freaked out my preschool teachers multiple times when i wasn't yet aware of just how weird it was for me to explain to the other kids what happened to their favourite goldenfish if it 'just went to sleep for three days and disappeared' or to dislike the boys' playing pretend that they're military officials bc "generals send their people to fight, but some of them die, and that's bad, and Rickie wants to play as a general so he's also bad".

[@BLET_55artem55]

That last part is... Ehh... Wrong in many, MANY ways. Yes, you may've been an aware child, but you weren't aware about all the variables and reasons and had one strong idea of "generals send ppl to death 4 no reason so they're bad and my bud was pretending to be a general so he's bad" which is what an unaware childish person would do (I'm trying to say that your opinion isn't exactly 100% true and valid)

[@alinerdelav]

Love this. I wasn't aware of mononoke until I showed her at 4yo..she wanted to see it many many times and I wasn't aware why. I. Wonder if she is going to tell as you later that. Among the parents I was the worst for showing that movie at so young age, but I didn't want her to watch toned out princesses movies...

[@sanewitch8036]

Unfortunately, my childhood was so much worse than the content of most children books so I turned to the original violent fairy tales because despite all the horrors they gave me strange feeling of comfort.

[@vallum12100]

Being seen in media is a cathartic experience, and the dismissal of those who had to suffer through their earlier years is a great disservice. I think it's why it's important to teach analysis of media when we can, so we can show through sensoring life lessons that are difficult but needed to be understood.

[@HEMPHILL23]

@@vallum12100 I think Saladfingers does the same for me...

[@KorporalNoobs]

It is probably for once, that it is easier to relate, but also because you can value the insights of the story or respect the character more.

[@nyarparablepsis872]

Same here

[@dr.badguyreviews6785]

Another fine example of Children's Horror I've found is Courage the Cowardly Dog. Of course, a cartoon, but it's one of the rare cartoons to actively terrify its children watchers, through clever subversion, tone building and animation techniques. You'll get people now saying it traumatized them as a child, but if you watch it now, it's barely anything. You'll also notice how the series tends to tackle things that you wouldn't expect of a child's show, like Abuse, Strangers, Negative emotions, and Failure. One gag that is that whenever Courage doesn't know what to do in a scary situation, he goes to the computer and asks it what to do. Makes me laugh, because that's really what most of any of use would do now.

[@theonewhocaredandasked9126]

happy tree friends

[@ShadowMonarch6000]

"Observe adults. Know that each and every one of them faking it. At no point was any adult actually given an instruction manual on how to do adulthood. Inside each of them is someone exactly like you." - Neil Gaiman ☺💖

[@calladricosplays]

Avatar is often praised for trusting that a younger audience will understand very real issues in the world. It does seem like some animators are getting it while whoever is in charge of remakes does not. Very concerning what happened with WB

[@Master-Works]

When I was younger I thaught Avatar was boring. It was the pacing.

[@berdwatcher5125]

@@Master-Works me to, I honestly hated how slow paced and boring avatar is.

[@LunaticTrumpet]

Avatar is one of those shows that I loved as a kid and I still love it as an adult.

[@writingwofl5836]

you are one of the only youtubers that actually gives good writing advice and makes videos that are better researched and informative.

[@tomkerruish2982]

May I suggest Terrible Writing Advice? It even covers subjects such as agents, marketing, and handling criticism.

[@writingwofl5836]

@@tomkerruish2982 Yeah it is a good channel for beginners but for as far as I remember it only covers the basics of writing and doesn't go into depth like Tale Foundry mostly does. I think most writing advice channels on this platform are so basic because the founders don't have enough reading experience to give actually valuable writing advice. Tale Foundry is great because he covers alot more ground because he talks about less popular but great literature (like Ghormenghast) and has alot of examples to back up his statements and ideas. While I don't particulary like all of Tale Foundry's videos, I still think he is one of the best on the platform.

[@tomkerruish2982]

@@writingwofl5836 Since I'm not even a beginner, I couldn't tell.

[@maidenofmisfortune]

I recommend looking into the channel, "Diane Callahan - Quotidian Writer" in regards to informative and well-versed writing advice.

[@terrortalks3037]

11:54 it should be kept in mind that younger children have some trouble distinguishing fiction from reality, so age should be taken into account, however, fiction should have some sort of mirror to reality. What's more, fiction can open the door to crucial discussions of difficult topics with trusted adults who help them feel safe, and give them knowledge and assurance. Parents will have to be ready to go there though, to have those conversations on death, grief, fear, etc.

[@Lo_.]

“Children aren’t stupid” That’s true. Children are definitely not stupid, especially the “special” children. Like my uncle - he learned to read at 3 and started reading philosophical and “adult” books before he even went to school. One thing is to think a child is stupid, but another is to think that a smart child is stupid. Treating a “smarter for their age” child exactly how you would treat a “normal” child can be very destructive and infuriating for that child. To them it seems like you’re treating a teen as you would a toddler - kind of. And some of them will fricking remember everything what you did to them as a kid.

[@Machiroable]

And they will proceed to do that same thing towards the next generation, because in the end they are either dumb kids or dumb teens.

[@LunacticInferno]

Savantism is crippling when you are forced into a family which treats you as actually mentally inept child when you are the entire opposite - it's them being incapable of mentally processing things themselves so they take it out on others. Abusive. Narcissistic. Sometimes crippling into PTSD, leading to heartbreak and cynicism of yourself. All because those around you WANT you to be sterile. The kid ends up smothered by lack of growth to their curiosity, intelligence and personality. At no point where others supportive even in my life. They actually attempted to write me off as "retarded", forcing me to go to a psychologist to get evaluated. They just want to solve everything with pills, discipline and harming someone to pass the blame. Yeah, needless to say it wasn't me that was the issue. On that note, I got to do some great accredited psyche tests for personalities, mapping my brain, and snuck titles of books from the psyche. My local librarian enjoyed my requests though. I wanted to figure out what the heck was wrong with those around me to act, and abuse others, the way they do. Unfortunately, I was never allowed to be a child at any point. I learned very quickly that this civilization has nothing in it for me. The world isn't the issue.... It's the people. The system refuses to acknowledge people like myself exist. There is no place for us and our talents just don't work to be monetized or pushed out into a gray corporate environment. I wish I could have been left to my art, music and story writing. However, humanity refuses to acknowledge that there is a whole different existence out there which doesn't revolve around grinding your life away to be a tortured slave. Knowing this is very destructive...... Exhausting, and no good will come of it all because others WANT to limit growth to all but their own voracious selfishness.

[@zackbuildit88]

This, please, I'm so tired of being treated like a kid

[@maokreatywne4059]

What? A child is more intelligent than others does not mean they can be treated like teenagers or adults. You don't even know if they're smarter or if you made it up to be prouder of your "special" child. Sure, you can teach them more, but it doesn't mean they don't want to experience childhood. DO NOT TREAT "SMART CHILDREN" LIKE ADULTS. YOU'RE ROBBING THEM OF THEIR CHILDHOODS. You're essentially taking their childhood if you treat them better, and no, they do not feel worse for being treated according to their age. A gifted kid should not watch horrors and know about messed up shit, it will give them trauma. And all of them will remember how you expected much more of them than they could give. Respectfully, never have children if you're going to think like this. Your statement is so fucking stupid that I almost died from cringe.

[@theonewhocaredandasked9126]

nah if a child is smarter than their age then they are instantly a teenager, expectations rise so high that the universe says slow down, a single B on a report card and your gonna be going down faster than gravty could ever do, you suddenly work at NASA, if your below average in anything they start pulling out torture devices

[@awesomemantroll1088]

Kids can TOTALLY self-select when things get too scary. I LOVED Five Nights at Freddy's, but Little Nightmares was where I drew the line. I also think back to how children don't know how to recognize and fight a predator. My little brothers liked talking about their "no-no square," even though they have no idea why an adult cannot touch them there.

[@Dark_Peace]

WTF I'm 20 and I love Little Nightmares but FNAF is just too much for me, haha.

[@Meloer]

In nature learning what is dangerous in infant stages it's imperative. I understood perversion,crime, murder, and concept of death all by the age of 10 and I found an intrest in the psychology of people, their self destructive nature and self destructive selfishness. I started to watch people like animals. Many predictable after seeing their normal behaviors. Guessing their reaction by adding the situations up like an equation. One thing I never liked as a kid, was consciousness. I hated knowing that I was part of a race with so much potential and yet consciously throwing it away. We draw and colorize our situation and act like it's not what's going on. To me adults were just children with more experience of existing. No better than anyone else, why? Because their environment wouldn't help them stand out for any talents they had. Suicide was a constant thought for me but I never went to deep as I knew it may be the very end of me If I did. Sometimes I wonder if there will be someone to bring down our self destructive nature or will evolution fix that before we have the chance to eradicate the last of Homosapiens, the last Human Beings.

[@Dark_Peace]

@@Meloer wo ok dude, are you Izaya Orihara ?

[@lazar2949]

@@Meloer Self destructive nature is what push us into the progress. You need it once you don't have a natural enemy and have too much comfort. We are not throwing anything away, we are actually progressing way faster than our bodies can evolve. Stop glorifying those pretentious beliefs.

[@redpanda6497]

@@Dark_Peace Are you talking about the Squimpus Mcgrimpus tapes or the games themselves?

[@nightlight-nuisance2971]

As a kid I LOVED dark stories, gore, horror, posession, and murder. Loved these as a kid and it's only as I've gotten older that I understand how deep these things actually are.

[@BLET_55artem55]

And how probably fked up your childhood actually was

[@Think_mate_lol]

Wait, have you ever watched amputation videos, or happy tree friends, or that one halloween animation with the ghost/corpse girl ?!?!??!?! I am EXCITED

[@Think_mate_lol]

Bam got a new sub ur amazing !

[@IzzyakaSpookyGurlQueenal-lh3dh]

I watched the macabre rotting girl music video and it was awesome😊! I watched one episode of Happy Tree Friends😊

[@victornoel36]

I watched Prince of Egypt when I was a kid. Even though I didn't understood some parts, I loved this movie. Sure, the dream scene where Moses sees the babies being thrown into the river was disturbing, but this gave Moses some questions about the morality of his father. So even though this scene disturbed me, I think it's one of the most important.

[@deedgemaster]

Coraline was just... one of those movies that ends up sticking with you. I don’t exactly know how to explain it the best in text, but the whole movie is just a very creative and... interesting take on a kids movie, and I feel like it really works well for that reason. If you haven’t seen it, you should, it’s a creative ride with beautiful visuals.

[@deedgemaster]

To clear up, I’m talking about the movie

[@d4s0n282]

@@deedgemaster does does it compare to the book? I always thought coraline was always unfullilled, I always felt that it ended too early imo for some reason

[@RoseDragoness]

@@d4s0n282 the book is more detailed and those who read carefully may pick up some nuanced things... tho pretty pictures are pretty.

[@aiiiia9971]

I had the privilege of watching it _as_ a child. It scared the heebie jeebies out of me. But I did enjoy it too in my way

[@huntforbigfloptober1333]

Mr. Rogers understood this so well. I remember in one interview he said something to the effect that “We (adults) forget what it’s like to be a child.” He’s right. Sometimes I find even remembering what being a teenager is like. It bothers me how few children’s stories have divorced parents considering how prevalent it is. As a kid, I remember feeling like I was the only one whose parents ever got in a nasty divorce and all I saw was happy parents on tv. If a parent was missing they were dead. Because yknow, what kid DOESNT have a dead parent? (And weirdly rarely has to deal with that loss?)

[@kannraorhara]

Yeah, I remember feeling something like this. My mom and dad had never gotten married, so they broke up and I'd just go visit dad, but lived with mom. I'd see happy parents on TV all the time (when parents were there at all, since shows like Teen Titans didn't touch on those often/at all for most of the cast) and wondering where all the single parent stories were.

[@devofficialchannel]

I kinda like Mrs. Doubtfire for how it deals with divorce and is also a family movie.

[@ludicrouS_406]

I fully agree! I remember watching kids shows on tv at my grandparent's and I remember thinking to myself: "don't those characters ever go thru conflict? like, how is this family always happy without failure and mine isn't?". I believe that potrayal of conflict or darker themes that aren't superficial bs in children's media would really benefit the child itself.

[@pinkanime_cat1460]

Malcom and the middle was one of those realistic shows that showed what a family in America was like. It's honestly and awesome show and the theme song is a banger.

[@theonewhocaredandasked9126]

bros gonna go to school and wonder why an intruder alert is going on

[@samanthafortier1763]

This makes me appreciate my parents so much. They trusted me to select books on my own and what was good for me and I never felt restricted when it came to my choices. I remember loving the Goosebumps books even though they were somewhat scary.

[@ognicho2333]

Same, I can't remember a time when my parents didn't allow me to read a book. When it was a book for adults they just said that I can try to read it but It probably won't intrest me and I might be confused. I tried reading it but like they said it didn't interest me so I didn't even finish the first chapter. I can't remember which book it was.

[@samanthafortier1763]

@@ognicho2333 when I was in middle school I tried that with a tale of two cities 😆 though my uncle did give me the mists of Avalon when I was in middle school which did have a sex scene in it. I don't know if he realizes it or not. He just loved that I enjoyed reading

[@philovidya8567]

My dad introduced me to a lot of books between the ages of 9-12 that were probably too much for me to handle at that age but I still remember them fondly. Some of those books include grapes of wrath, timeline, flowers for algernon, IT, and the diary of Anne Frank.

[@samanthafortier1763]

@@philovidya8567 the only one I haven't heard of is Timeline. That one sounds interesting. The positives though is that he at least was there for you as he introduced them! My parents weren't big readers it was my grandma who introduced me to great books as a kid for the most part.

[@virginiaellis6299]

I'm a child I agree

[@wscamel226]

The thing that annoys me the most is that in a kid's show someone can litteraly die sometime but there is no way there will be shown a tiniest amount of blood.

[@BLET_55artem55]

Death isn't always being ripped apart with your insides being blown all around

[@slimmanne]

This makes me remember a scene from the gumball episode "halloween" where the main characters drink a "ghost potion". You either know or can probably figure out what happened.

[@santiagoindisguise7289]

​@@BLET_55artem55 what about being crushed to death by a huge Boulder?

[@chromosoze]

@@slimmanne wasn't that to attend like a ghost party? cus one of the characters in the show is a ghost?

[@slimmanne]

@@chromosoze still temprarily ded

[@KezanzatheGreat]

If five-year-olds can be horrified at the implications of stories like Der Struwwelpeter (anyone curious can probably find an English version through the Gutenberg Project or KZbin), they are certainly able to understand the implications of other forms and pieces of media. And that's not a bad thing. If anything, it needs to be encouraged ... just not overdone lol. Also, fairy tales were never only meant for kids. They were meant as stories for kids and adults alike - warnings as well as entertainment. Did you know that Princess and the Pea was actually satire? That aspect is often glossed over or forgotten in modern adaptations of fairy tales. I might also add, on a slightly different topic, that kids actually love being spun around and thrown onto the bed by their parents from time to time (gently, of course, so no one gets hurt). And it's actually good for them in a number of ways. Is there some danger involved? Yes. Can it still be done safely? Absolutely! The same is true of children's media. It's about balance, not purity. I agree that kids don't often end up with the stories they want. But even so, I've been lucky enough to find some that stuck out to me. And I still have them, and even still read them from time to time. "A children's story that can only be enjoyed by children is not a good children's story in the slightest." - C. S. Lewis

[@dantedharma6252]

I´m just delligted with the response and even if not necesary I want to pay respect to it for its dedication and good use language.

[@Hanmacx]

Hello fellow Struwwelpeter reader

[@Rex10111]

I'm reminded of that one bit from Hogfather, something along the lines of: "Children know very well that there are monsters out in the world, what they need is not stories that tell them there aren't monsters. But instead that those monsters can be fought, and BEATEN."

[@Hanmacx]

"Hello Inner Child, I'm your inner babysitter" xD

[@matthewstarkie4254]

@@Hanmacx The poker only kills monsters.

[@lukethekuya]

Yes.

[@harrissyed1603]

it was shows like amphibia and owl house are such a breath of life they arent as scared of going hard and making its younger viewers feel bad

[@monicadelgado5296]

Don’t forget Puss in Boots The Last Wish.

[@austinreed7343]

And some people act like it has the "wrong kind of adult content"

[@pantherace1000]

I remember bits and pieces of a quote by a director with a sentiment of "you can show children the holocaust and they can take it, as long as it has a happy ending", and I think this sentiment is correct. We treat children like they are made of glass, which is a disservice to children. If they don't know that the world is full of evil then they can't appreciate the good. Children are smarter and tougher than we give them credit for.

[@austinreed7343]

The reason why stories like Megaman X4 fail is because they don’t quite show a happy ending.

[@josephivenegas]

...why does this quote immediately bring to mind CHicken Run?! 🐔 🐔 🐔

[@WhoAmIHmmm]

Wait, the goddamn holocaust? Jeez I think that's too far

[@laurinha2892]

@@WhoAmIHmmm I think it depends on how it's presented to a child. I mean, it's not like children don't know about things like 9/11 and Hitler, there's too many memes for them to never have heard of those

[@WhoAmIHmmm]

@@laurinha2892 even if it is presented in a childish way I still believe that is not a good idea to show them stuff related to those events

[@lollibyte5727]

Yup, this is the tightrope I've been walking as a parent of now 3 kids. For my two oldest, now 12 and 13, I have tried to figure out what is appropriate and at what time. 12 is very empathetic and sensitive to other people's suffering and avoids everything dark most of the time, and they have the worst anxiety of things. 13 is more curious, and I have been kinda impressed to see them tackling some old RPG games with pretty hard themes and well... It was kinda beautiful to see them cry and smile while playing Final Fantasy 7 Remake, after playing the original (they prefer the original) just saying: "the deaths hurt so much more." They have grown to be more balanced and weirdly, sometimes even more empathetic than 12 in some things, because they are less scared of the dark things though they cry and bawl their eyes out when they happen. My third is a lot tinier, and I do think I need to think about what is appropriate and when again, so they are equipped for the challenges of life when they grow. I remember that stories I was engrossed in when I was between the age of 12 and 13 were a lot darker, better or worse, and... it's a balancing act. A friend once said we don't grow children, we grow future adults. And part of that is teaching them about challenges.

[@biblemansings]

Your kids sounds amazing! Keep working to be the best parent. I wish you and your family the best. I was too drawn to darkness as a child and scarred by my discoveries on the internet. I definitely think kids need some darkness, but I hope parents try to help the kid when they are fascinated and addicted to darkness. I still really struggle with some of the things I’ve seen, though I’m only 20. Edit: my parents censored everything not even magic was allowed in the house. I think that heavily contributed to my fascination and love for the dark.

[@legacy7249]

Me and my brother are 12 and 13!

[@ISIMPFORCOOKIES_]

get them wings of fire its great! bad thing goodthings just do great!

[@DanDraws.]

My mom has this similar mentality. She would speak to me as if I were one of her peers and when I asked what certain words meant, she would take the time to explain them to me. I was able to grow up on books like Coraline, The Graveyard Book, The Magic Treehouse, etc. All stories that challenged my innocent world view in an simple enough way that taught me how to overcome challenges in life now, as an adult.

[@SpaceLobster21]

One of my favorite movies when I was younger was "Astro Boy". The plot of the movie is basically that the main character dies, and his dad tries to rebuild him as a robot. However, the dad can't stand living with the robot because it's a reminder that his son is dead. The dad casts out the robot, who then has to live in a garbage dump with orphans. The man in charge of the orphans takes advantage of the robot and uses him in a robot fighting competition. The story progresses some more, then the robot has to return home to defend the city from a giant evil robot by sacrificing himself to destroy it's energy core. It's really interesting, because some of the main topics of the movie are grief, abandonment, and sympathy for the villain. Several times throughout the movie, the robot boy ends up protecting the villains, at one point even stopping one of his friends from killing the man who took advantage of him for robot fighting. Some of these villains are grateful to the boy for saving them. The portrayal of grief and abandonment ties in to the idea of kids simply not having context for certain parts of the adult world. The boy doesn't understand why his dad is suddenly so cold towards him, and, not being used to the real world, was easy to take advantage of. This movie does a pretty good job of showing the importance of darker kids media while also being a darker kids movie. Unfortunately the movie was a total flop for some reason and didn't sell very well, but I loved it and I think it helped shape a lot of who I am today.

[@kitty-lue]

I just saw your comment and got excited haha I don't know if you're already aware, but in case you're not, that movie's actually based off a manga/anime series, actually it got 3 separate anime series, not including spinoffs, and each one has some variation on how it retells the story, so I thought you may be interested in checking that out. And with series having a longer time to explore all the concepts it's going into than movies do, that's another bonus. I think the manga ran from the late 50's to the 80's, the first anime series was made in the 60's (and fun fact: was the first anime imported?/exported? to the US), second series was made in the 80's, and the third one ran in 2003. I haven't compared sub/dub on the earlier series, but if you're interested in the '03 series, I'd definitely recommend picking sub over dub, as this was one of those series that unfortunately had a lot of unnecessary edits made to the English "localization," going as far as removing an entire episode and changing aspects of the main character's personality, so. given what you've mentioned you liked about the '09 movie, you'll get more of that from the original '03 version than the English dubbed '03 version :') Also! If I haven't misunderstood, the manga is old enough that you can legally read it on the internet archive by now? the story arcs seem to be all over the place and don't actually follow one set of canon, I should mention, but a really interesting portion of the manga that hasn't had any adaptations is the "Once Upon a Time" arc, again, lots of dark themes in that, which I'm a sucker for lol And regarding spinoffs and such, there's a more recent prequel series called "Atom: The Beginning," which follows Dr. Tenma and Ochanomizu (the original name for Elefun) in college making robots, and A106, one of their prototypes. There was 1 season of an anime for it in 2017 and the manga is ongoing, last I checked, so there's that as well. ...I just felt the need to dump this on any person who seems like they might want to look at any of it lol

[@SpaceLobster21]

I recently re-watched the movie, and found out about the anime when I looked it up afterwards. Was surprising to see that the movie didn't sell well at all and didn't get any good reviews. Dunno, I might check out the anime at some point. I'm still yet to actually try watching anime, but it seems like the kind of thing I'd be into so it'll probably happen at some point lol. Thanks for the suggestion!

[@kitty-lue]

@@SpaceLobster21 no problem! Feel free to reach out if you need any help tracking down a means of watching any of these, since that can sometimes be an issue with watching somewhat older series. But yeah, the '03 Astro Boy series was actually the first anime I watched since my sister found it at some point after we'd seen the '09 movie. Definitely worth a watch. :) (side note: not to bombard you with more stuff, but I remembered another spinoff manga: "Pluto," by Naoki Urasawa, is a seinen thriller sort of retelling of "The Greatest Robot on Earth" arc. I'll leave it at that so as not to write another novel of a comment, but I wanted to add that to the list of content haha)

[@daniellagold2739]

I also just recently watched Astro Boy for the first time. As a kid I remember wanting to see it so bad, but we didn’t have the money to. I loved it for all the reasons you mentioned, and much like everyone else in this thread was floored to find out about it flopping. I also think it had other topics such as classism and war mongering, that are depicted in ways that are age appropriate, but also so that kids can be exposed to these concepts in a safe environment.

[@joelle4226]

I remember watching Astro boy when I was young and thinking "wow this is messed up" the whole movie

[@codelyoko363]

I think this perfectly explains why creepypasta's are so popular among kids as well. When I was younger, I was obsessed with looking into creepypasta's and even though a lot of them kept me up at night, I still kept reading them. They scared me, but they also sparked my curiosity.

[@anrandomthing7110]

As a kid who loves analog horror and staring right into organs from google search on my computer, i strongly agree that i like creepypastas. Mostly that have something unique about them and is not just some: "Funni killer is going to kill you at night, scawy." Like take example creepypasta: "Lost Silver".

[@TeamGalactic-Cyrus]

@@anrandomthing7110 I LOVE LOST SILVER

[@anrandomthing7110]

@@TeamGalactic-Cyrus YO !!! Yk FNF Hypno’s Lullaby, right?

[@TeamGalactic-Cyrus]

@@anrandomthing7110 The FNF mod? I've sure heard of it, and it's cool, but I prefer the original, because that's what I remember. I also don't like the FNF mod because so many people think the creepypastas came from there. But here's a test: Is it Blake or Ethan?

[@jexxisahuman9073]

Yes (im a kid/teen) i really love dark and horror genre not just creepy pasta like other horror game or movie i saw them really interesting and intriguing

[@SiiriCressey]

I remember part of the creator's commentary for Finding Nemo. They spoke of a test screening wherein the possibility of removing the anglerfish scene came up. One audience member passionately fought to keep it. They said that taking it out would delete the realness of nature. This person was a child.

[@BLET_55artem55]

Is this the "Submarine Sharks" scene, the one that comes right after ("The depth") or the one where they get caught in fishing nets?

[@SiiriCressey]

@@BLET_55artem55 Neither. The "Good feeling's gone" scene.

[@loganreads90]

Hmm…

[@physics_hacker]

i always liked to read way, way above what my age "should" be reading. My mom has even talked to me about how when she would read fairy tales to me, with some of the stories she would realize that wow, this is actually really messed up. I assume she was probably reading some of the early almost-not-sterilized versions? or something? or maybe just different stories that didn't get as strong a treatment or something, idk. But yeah, that stuff always went over my head anyway and I just wanted to know how it would go. I also ended up reading YA fiction when I was like 13, and a bit younger than that I was already looking through college level astronomy textbooks since i was that obsessed with outer space (still am!). I've always attributed this to my mom teaching me to read really early on, with this video I've realized it was probably also that I was ALLOWED to read so high above what my age "should" be reading. The brain can adapt in insane ways when you're that young so I guess in my case I was basically climbing as fast as my brain would allow, since no one was telling me I couldn't. No lasting damage that I can tell from any of it, if anything I just ended up way way ahead because why the hell not lol. Like finding my 3 favorite YA book series when i was like 13-14 lol

[@dreamsalongthepath7377]

My old elementary school taught the non-sterilized fairy tales, and yeah they’re messed up, but not only do they desensitize children to real world concepts and lessons, but they also swing the doors wide open for books that children are allowed to read. And like you said, when you aren’t being stopped from reading more adult pieces, you really can develop faster. Exact same thing happened to me.

[@halley8105]

Same

[@marocat4749]

Honestly that how maturish family media works best. You have the stuff that i adult and dark metaphorical coded, that kids wont get, but adults, And making it imaginative does give a way to deal with that existing hile not knowing the messed up details. Throgh kid are great at adapting, they can deal with that if you talk wih them about it, and should.

[@pg13snipez]

i just happen to be like 3 levels above my grade, but happen to not get into harder classes because i dont do much homework sometimes

[@vi0let831]

Sameeee

[@jamesmachuta2010]

The ending portion of your essay reminds me of the song by Voltaire that he wrote for his for his children the song is called "Good Night Demon Slayer" and it ends with the line, "take what you can from the beasts you defeat, you'll need it for some of the people you'll meet"

[@tsm688]

my god, that's the illest line ever

[@kitkatmuffin]

One of my favorite underrated children’s horror series is Wayside School It may not seem like a horror based on the name, cover, and even beginning chapters, but once you keep reading things get darker and more eerie In the second book, a girl suddenly ceases to exist, and finds herself a ghost walking among her friends. The only people who can see her are people who also don’t exist In the third book, a substitute teacher steals the voices of the students and uses their voices to tell their parents that they don’t love them. This causes the children to cry mute tears because they do love their parents but they can’t do anything about it It’s not Coraline levels of horror, but it was definitely a fun read for me as a kid and I loved how dark it was. It gave me a sense of thrill that made me feel more mature than my peers because I knew dark stories and they only knew fairytales

[@austinreed7343]

And the TV show watered it all down.

[@rachaelknudsen8801]

I never realized they were horror. That said, I knew they were gripping, absurd, and grotesque. And that I loved them.

[@nopizzawithoutpineapple]

"In the process of making these stories palatable for children - by which I mean their parents" is so fucking funny and absolutely spot on.

[@Wapako]

When I was little, I was traumatized for a few weeks when I watched the movie "Coraline". I rewatched it a month ago and the movie is really great.

[@marsmia4869]

Same dude! Now i have the songs on my Spotify playlist

[@yasmineguerin2852]

Scary but good

[@josephjoestar953]

I was suicidal in the 6th grade and the thing that helped me push past it and continue my life to where it is today was mostly talking with another suicidal person, but another major part was learning about dark things which are two forms of the same thing, it made me feel less alone and capable of moving forward. I'm in the 9th grade now and the worst thing going through my head at the moment is the fact that I have a cold, learning about the bad early is important since otherwise a kid could end up in a similar and very well worse spot than I was because they don't even know what they're feeling.

[@BLET_55artem55]

What kind of Tough life do you need to live to be suicidal in 6th grade!? (I suppose it's by European measures, but if it's by US ones...)

[@thedragonthatlovesskittles7132]

As a barely child that very recently became a teenager, I 100% agree with this, kids need more context of the world around them rather then mind numbing content that is highly cliché and non interesting.

[@kakolimallik6237]

Huh, what a coincidence.

[@virginiaellis6299]

I'm a child I agree

[@Dracovenatrix]

I agree

[@sonetagu1337]

Yomulesa, me too

[@joelle4226]

It's safer on the internet to not talk about how old you are as a minor.

[@RavenStarMedia]

As someone who grew up loving the Goosebumps series as a kid, as well as Coraline, I absolutely agree with this. Children can handle darker themes, and sometimes they even might inspire them. Heck a lot of my personal works have elements of The Hunchback of Notre Dame, which was always one of my favorite films even as a little kid because it was so dark.

[@cottonsheep2367]

as a kid I skipped goosebumps and went straight to fear street, the other series by r.l.stine targeted to slightly older audiences and boy, sometimes I was shaking while turning the page. I was maybe 10 or 11 when I started reading those and I believe the confrontation with fear in the context of imagined danger helped me grow up to be a person secure in their standing in the world, in a sense. children's horror like goosebumps and the like would never have been so popular if children weren't interested in more sinister stories.

[@pianoplayingfishkeeper2094]

SAME! I read Coraline when I was around 8 1/2 and watched the movie at 7. Now I'm reading Stephen King and Peter Straub and I'm in my early teens hahaha. Goosebumps was amazing. My aunt also read me some stories from the Grimm's Complete Fairy Tales when I was younger.

[@lynxgamerlife]

I personally didn’t like any real horror as a 4-10 year old but now that I’m a teenager I find it more tolerable to watch or read. Stuff like the brothers Grimm was awesome when I was younger though. I don’t like boldly horror though, it just haunts me. It just feels wrong to my core.

[@Aimee651]

I have to agree with this. When I was little I was sheltered from shows and experiences that were determined to “ scary” to say the least. I, now older ( even though only a teen) feel and have to hide things I know from my parents. As I don’t want them to know the things I know and fear they will get mad.

[@himate7572]

I don't really like writing stories for children, but watching this got me excited about it. It sounds challenging to blend in complicated stuff into children's stories, but also fun.

[@olympiadeverre]

The touch of Cinderella being boiled down so much that it turns into the live action slipper is such a good one!

[@flibbernodgets7018]

Terry Pratchett's "The Amazing Maurice and His Educated Rodents" is another really good example of a dark, well-loved children's book. It won a Carnegie medal, and I think lead to him getting knighted. There was a note on the dust jacket of the copy I read, something to the effect of "He writes books about important subjects and also occasionally books for grown-ups", which is fitting because I think he really understood children and childhood and represented them well.

[@loganreads90]

Neat.

[@MySqueezingArm]

I like how the original Grimm's fairy tales still had enough edge to drive morals home. Also as a Goosebumps kid, I cannot stress how helpful it was for me to grow up in a healthy way. It's much better than simply waiting for a child to experience a terrible hardship that they aren't prepared for.

[@eliben4066]

As a child, my favorite stories were all gruesome, they fascinated me. I always wondered if I was weird. Max und Moritz, a German story about a two KZbin pranksters, literally chocking chickens and blowing up teachers, learn their lesson by being ground up into little pieces and fed to ducks. Another story was about a snow princess who didn’t respect the curfew and melted into a lake as the sun came out. And even the sugar coated version that is Disney was most fascinating when it was traumatizing. The monster forest in Snow White, Sid’s toys, Dr. Facilier being dragged into his grave, those terrified me, but I always came back for those scenes

[@s.c.p.foundation901]

Max und Moritz, my favorite story from childhood

[@nesiachan4534]

Poor chickens

[@austinreed7343]

What was the story about the girl who melted into a lake?

[@eliben4066]

@@austinreed7343 the funny thing is, I was never able to find the source for that story. It was a picture book my first grade teacher read to us in English class, and if I remember correctly, it was a just-so story for how a real life lake was formed. I remember it vividly tho

[@anonymousleapyear5616]

I think this concept is one of the reasons I love "The prince warrior series" by Priscila Sheerer so much. when I was a kid, I remember hating when people would underestimate me and write me off as simple minded just because I was a kid. I've always loved reading (even before I could read it intrigued me immensely) and would often spend afternoons reading "the magic treehouse" or whatever other books I could find lying around the house, eventually in my search for something new to read I was looking at my big brother's bookshelf and he let me pick out one of his books to borrow. I chose the first book in the prince warrior series; it was my first chapter book without any pictures or anything and I was excited to dive in. as soon as I started reading, I couldn't put it down; I was so captivated by the characters, the epic new world and the story they were unfolding. in the story the main characters are a group of kids who find out about the magical otherworld Ahoratos, the kids learn a lot of valuable lessons such as: believing in yourself, trusting others and knowing who's a real friend and who's not. in their adventures the kids get cool sets of armor and swords and fight off bad guys from the evil part of the magical world, but in the story the kids also face a lot of really difficult situations and emotions that can be very real, such as: mis-trusting their own decisions, getting angry at other people for things that weren't even their faults, and multiple of the characters we grow fond of dying. the stories felt captivating not only because of the beautiful and unique worldbuilding, but because of how real the characters feel. it's incredibly easy to dive into the character's heads and view the world from their perspectives and I highly recommend it. I think in the end what makes the kids feel so real is how they aren't just kids who go out and become heroes and win the day, they're real kids who struggle in their journey and face consequences for their actions. as a kid I could really relate to the thought processes of some of the characters and it made the world feel so real. sorry for this crazy long comment, but if you read this whole thing, I highly recommend you go check this series out.

[@SpectreBagels]

You know this actually puts into better words than I could explain back then what I felt as a kid. I remember once that I was on youtube(yes, when I was still too young to have an account) and was looking at other people talk about a show/movie that frustrated me with how poor the story was and bad the characters were(I can't remember what it was but I remember describing the issues in pretty simple terms but there were a lot of issues that made what it was bad), and then in the comment section someone described exactly the issues I didn't know how to articulate and even some I hadn't noticed, and I thought awesome they get it. But then someone replied with the usual dismissive argument of "It's for children stop complaining, that's how it's supposed to be". And it frustrated me because, no, it was just bad. And from then on I have had a sort of pet peeve about easily dismissing issues in media simply because of the audience, and the implication that, frankly, children were stupid and unintelligent enough to consume anything else and only want jangling keys to keep their attention. The next day from that incident, I wanted to make sure I wasn't being weird or dumb and asked my classmates and they agreed with me that it wasn't good but it was fun to just watch and they also disagreed with the "it's for kids excuse". I've actually always loved more nuanced stories as a child BECAUSE it challenged my thinking and perspective on people and things around me. I can enjoy mindless or black and white media sure, but the media I actively craved was the more nuanced takes, not completely mature and adult like but at least treated with the same care for storytelling and character building. And from what I've experienced back then and in some cases recently, it seems other kids feel the same way. The way they had spoken and do talk about shows or scenes and characters with nuance and what it all means and how they think about it is with an amount of enthusiasm for thinking for themselves that a lot of the sanitized stuff doesn't allow for

[@nmi682]

I remember being around 8 and playing a little game called "Drawn to Life 2". The ending was the most left field thing for me and anyone who has played the game knows why. It was dark and it was one of the first games to make me cry, not just cuz of scary imagery but I, to an extent, understood what happened. Apparently, this ending was heavily censored and sterilized in future releases of the game, which completely ruins the impact. I feel really lucky to have been able to experience that ending as a kid, its stuck with me ever since

[@feralchangeling97]

They made a sequel on the Switch that uses the uncensored ending and builds on that for the story.

[@FandomLurker]

Oh god, I repressed the hell out of that apparently. I was like "wait... wasn't that with the cat people, and a Brother and Sister, and a white warlock cat?" Then it clicked. The memory punched me and now I feel so.. so empty. Fun game though.

[@dutyfree5192]

Wait, I played both the Drawn to Life games for the DS so letme add: In the first game, a very important character to the story (The mayor) gets stabbed by the villain IN SCREEN. It never traumatized me, but I was shocked when I first saw it.

[@ts25679]

I agree, by denying so much of reality to push happiness, joy and excitement feels very much like the "self-esteem generation". You can't protect them forever, and if you deny them the opportunity to confront and accept the negative aspects of life they won't have the tools or mentality to shape the inevitable upsets into something positive. Children's programming also seems to aggressively push the notion that you should feel happy and excited all the time, more than a few people of the last generations have internalised and twisted that into the questions: Why aren't I happy all the time? Why am I always so tired? What is wrong with me? As you stated, it is a lack of context, therefore we need to provide them with examples. I should think that all parents experience their child's curiosity as they explore the world and their experience of it and until the advent of internet search engines, I doubt we feel we've been able to adequately explain even a fraction of what they ask. You're never really ready for kids and there is so much information out there on all topics, including how to raise them, but I do think there are specific experiences that we could all use a little guidance on like teaching them how to get along with others. I've not read more than a handful of children's books, but I think learning how to get along with others, without sugar coating how cruel, mean and abrasive people can be, let alone unsocialised children, could really help a lot of kids embarking on their first forays into society.

[@zakosist]

I think you can't really be truly happy without the contrast of experiencing some negative emotions sometimes, the same applies to children and the same applies to entertainment. If it tries to be happy all the time, it wont feel happy, it will feel unnatural and unrelatable. Its already natural for kids to feel both the bad and good emotions on a daily basis. And its absolutely inevitable (unless they are emotionally stunted, like a psychopath) that at some point in their life they will discover something that deeply disturbs them. I got really deeply disturbed when I first started learning of how horrible the real world was, and some of it still makes impression on me now as an adult. But its even worse to have zero preparement from childhood and never learned how to cope to some extent. And some things could even be MORE disturbing as an adult when you understand things better and on a deeper level

[@tsm688]

did the "self esteem generation" ever buy into that shit? Mostly don't think they did. It was their parents that hawked it. Kind of like how nobody wanted participation trophies except parents.

[@iesika7387]

"children already know that there are monsters, he said, and fairy stories teach them that monsters can be killed. We now know that the monsters may not simply have scales and sleep under a mountain. They may be in our own heads.” - Terry Pratchett

[@CanonicalKaoru]

That's a beautiful way of phrasing it

[@hmart6881]

Some Stories enable kids to celebrate life and have fun with it - while other stories help them deal with the darker side and live through it, not being alone with it. If stories miss the chance to show that actions have consequences - may they be easy or heavy -, then they are maybe not worth being told.

[@technotoister]

tbh i think "children's media" is getting better with the things u mentioned and i honestly absolutely agree with ya i mean kids shows like steven universe, the owl house and so on are loved because of the stories and the challenges! also i love how u said "Children aren't stupid, they just lack context." because it's absolutely true

[@TheLazyFusspot_3428]

There is Britt and David's Thomas and Friends as well. Not only did it perfectly balance its tones, it kept its world and its morals grounded and realistic. That infamous scene with Henry and the tunnel tought us not to be so stuck up about ourselves, and as a result started a character journey in Henry we can all resonate with after he was let out and given a second chance. Meanwhile, Smudger got turned into a generator and was left that way for how stuck up he really was...

[@starrlesscreative]

My mother would only allow us to watch Disney, only the things deemed save and good. No violent video games, so squirt guns allowed, nothing that was deemed unsafe... But I was an avid reader and by 6 or 7 I was reading far above what was recommended for me. I read "Winter of the red snow" a historic fiction book about the revolutionary war, and a passage from that book completely shifted my understanding and till impacts me. It described a scene where a solider needed to have a frost bitten leg amputated, he was given a bullet to bite down on to keep from screaming. The line 'before the surgeon's blade had cut thru to the man's femur, he was already dead having chocked on the bullet set between his teeth' HAUNTED me for years after. It's hard to explain just how it changed my day to day, but i was more keen on wearing my gloves during the winter and faced my fear of needles for procedures of my own. I was seven when I read that book and I'm 32 now... I can still give a fairly accurate book report on it because of how it impacted me for better or for worse.

[@solalabell9674]

Personally I absolutely love both the dark crystal and coraline both hit a spot in childhoods that resonates for a really long time and are a great way to introduce me to the darker side of art

[@astraeaflorence]

this is an excellent video! when i was a child, i was traumatized by my life experiences, but scary fiction didn't trouble me - being patronized did. i felt trapped, not being able to communicate with adults about my actual life experiences because they treated childhood as a perfectly innocent, pure world. i craved dark stories, and wrote my own. and now that i work with kids, i see the same desire in the next generation. while we don't want kids to be exposed to too much, letting them work through troubling concepts in fiction and conversation is a lot kinder to them than letting them find out on their own in the real world.

[@laurenloertscher1319]

Dark story elements were the ones that appealed to me the most as a kid. They still do. Not because I enjoy the morbid, but because of the greater context it gives the good and the beautiful. How can you appreciate the light if you've never been in darkness?

[@Shiresgammai]

Our indigenous folklore is very dark, full of disturbing stuff. We're not on a German level, but still: it looks like my ancestors tried to convey warnings and life lessons through their fairy tales.

[@Notfallkaramell]

Our folklore isn't that intense. The Slavic stuff is on another level, though.

[@Shiresgammai]

@@Notfallkaramell Yeah, the Germanic and Slavic folklores are very dark, but then again, they often tell important things to children. Stuff like "be careful in the forest" and "don't trust everyone".

[@Quilly-Sammy]

God, now you're reminding me of an American Girl book series based on one of the girls, Samantha. Her stories were introduced to me and my class when we were just little kids playing around before coming to circle time on the carpet. Her stories were much more realistic and slightly grim with their topics that were from long ago, but they were stories that resonated with me and my classmates because of how the protagonist can triumph through her obstacles and solve mysteries with her curious mind. And while it was incredibly dangerous with its terrifying scenes, it made me think about how I can go through my own giant waves on a sailboat or how I can talk to my very own "grandmother" (grand-mary? . . . . . I don't know). But at the time just like her, it made me way too curious and wanted to know more, and so I did. All of the American Girl stories, the B.F.G., Harry Potter, Ink Heart, Elske, the greek gods, and everything in between. Although most stories that I did read were happy and soft, it was the dark moments where the main characters would feel trapped and then triumph that inspired me as a person with my own stories. Heck, I was even exposed to how dark Sailor Moon and Madoka Magica got, and that gave me a chance to explore even more. To say that I'm glad would be an understatement because in general, I'd be happy to give these stories to my own daughter in the future if I ever have one.

[@Quilly-Sammy]

Almost forgot to mention A Long Walk To Water, Charlotte's Web, and Liddie. Seriously, those can TEACH!!!

[@mascotwithadinosaur9353]

I was depressed even when I was little. The sterilization actually hurt me, because I felt lonelier where depression and "chronic suicidality" already make you feel very lonely. It helped me tremendously when I watched Digimon Tamers, which is notoriously dark.

[@buzzfiend]

When I was a child, horror actually was most of the inspiration for any of my first choices of research. My nightmares of my father turning into Medusa when I was 2 led to a crippling fear of him in my childhood, but also guided me to look into the origins of Greek mythology and the natural distrust of cold scaled snakes in dreams. Sure, I still don't believe in any of the religious aspects, but mythology and history are still two of my favorite subjects to this day. I get the same ping of horror and science intrigue that a forensic scientist gets at hearing a new gruesome crime scene described.

[@orrorsaness5942]

Nice! I am making a horror comic right now! It’s called The Pensuke Files.

[@olakpasa6486]

You nailed the forensic part, I want to dedicate to that in a near future and I must say I often find myself thinking about "how did this body died" or "what damages could X do to a human" when seeing the news, a movie or reading a book

[@whofarted.45]

#socialstudiessweep

[@Caroteen666]

I feel that there should be a series that represents this, like in one book it’s about the death of a loved one, and there’s an entire story about it, or about a friend having allergies or asthma, presenting to children that even if they don’t have these things, they are still dangerous and should be taken seriously (I say this because I have allergies, and once, a child my age asked me to demonstrate how my epi-pen works by using it on myself.)

[@PureEggworth]

8:44 this thought was had by the late and great stan lee and i feel it’s a relevant story to share. At the time of the amazing spider man’s early issues, each comic was published under something known as the comics code. basically the comics code was a thing you submitted a comic into and if it was approved you got the stamp. basically it meant your comic was safe and sanitized for children. This was until 1971 with the amazing spider-man issue #96, which was published without the comics code’s approval. This comic featured Harry Osborne’s struggle with drug addiction amidst his fathers’s amnesia. This one comic single handled led to the revision of the comics codes authority and is why we got darker comic stories in the first place. Stan believed that entertainment and lessons can be mixed together and no kid should have to be lectured on these lessons, rather be taught through entertainment. rest in peace stan lee.

[@tsm688]

the amazing thing is that this code was voluntary. Well, fear-based. Not laws enforcing it, but maybe an old-boys club willing to make trouble if you didn't. By the 70's they were all dead or no longer cared. Publishers slowly realized they didn't have to bother doing that any more.

[@writingwofl5836]

Alice in Wonderland is also a great example of good child literature that challenges and confronts the mind.

[@Master-Works]

I prefer the book over the movie. But back then the Kids didn’t like to read much.

[@darklyberry]

I remember I was OBSESSED with the Disney animated movie when I was around 3 years old. I asked my mom to play the VHS tape we had over and over again, and I also learnt some dialogues

[@scrathed]

This is a way I haven't actively thought about childen's fiction, but I guess I've always kinda felt that way. The Dark Crystal and The Labyrinth (both by Jim Henson), although having seen them decades after they were made, were some of my favourite movies as a kid. Together with the Spiderwicks, and also movies like "9", THOSE were the stories that intrigued me... And I think I now see this tendency in my little brother, who is 12 years younger, too. Last year, during covid lockdown, when I couldn't travel to see my family, I wrote a little ttrpg for my brother, to play with him via videochat. I knew that I wanted to write a "child friendly" story, to provide an approach for him to TTRPG, which he always knew I was big into, but never had the opportunity to participate. And yet, I usually write horror stories and weird, dark fantasy stuff, so that wasn't easily wiped away to write something for a kid. We ended up with a story about a cursed forest, around which the farmers fields rot and in which the trees mold, and animals are corrupted... Because the land is drenched with an ancient wizards magic. For decades, he had healed and fertilized the land with his powers, but he had become sorrowful, one could say, depressed, even. And with him and his mind, the forest and the land he once healed and saved, grew dark and hostile too... My brother's job was to find out what was going on, and finding a solution for this strange curse. Of course, for the most part of the game, he was expecting to fight the wizard, or imprison him. When in the end he found out that he had to help him, and fell a decision with the wizard, I think he was surprised and touched. And that felt successful. It was a dark story, but he found a way to produce a happy ending, and I really liked the experience. And now, having watched this video, I feel like child's stories should be darker indeed. More like the sad wizard in his corrupted forest, who just has to let go something he tried to keep close to him - for the world, and himself, to flourish again :3

[@phootaphan9166]

I remember watching an old Peter Rabbit cartoon when I was a kid. It was a musical, but it was done in a way that I remember there being a very real feeling of tension and danger throughout and a feeling of relief when he finally escaped the garden. I haven't actually seen the movie itself, but I saw a trailer for the newer Peter Rabbit movie that came out recently, and it looked like just another safe, generic, jokey kids' movie. The tone I remembered just wasn't there, it didn't have anywhere near the emotional impact that the original did.

[@Venus-ur7dy]

This video just made me remember one of my favorite books as a kid. "Scary poems for rotten kids." I can't find it right now, but I definitely remember being terrified of the boneless monster that would creep under your door frame to steal yours. Edit. I found it! The poem was called "The body." The others also freaked me out but that one stood out for sure. Mostly because of the illustration to be honest.

[@PercydeRoloFangirl]

I think I read that lol.

[@SamiDC]

Don Bluth's films are a really good example of how to make the darkness and complexities of life digestible for kids. I can't tell you how many times I watched and rewatched The Land Before Time when I was little. Now in my 30s, I appreciate it even more. Also the Secret of Nimh gave me a shock when I first heard one of the characters exclaim 'Damn!' in a "cartoon."

[@webbycroissant5692]

I remember that when I was a kid, I started discovering horror medias at the age of 6. My parents then started doing everything to stop me from exploring it further, even though I was never really scared. Now I'm 16 and a big fan of everything related to horror.

[@orrorsaness5942]

Noice! Then you will really like The Pensuke Files!

[@webbycroissant5692]

@@orrorsaness5942 What's that?

[@orrorsaness5942]

@@webbycroissant5692 A comic in my KZbin channel

[@orrorsaness5942]

@@webbycroissant5692 If you see where it is, and if you watched it, is it good 😊?

[@sanitytheorist8221]

Courage the Cowardly Dog is the epitome of how to make horror for kids that becomes re-contextualizes with age, for me at least. I especially love how it keeps the lines between Courage's true awareness of the situation vs. what's in his head vague, especially. Excellent video as always, love the message behind this one!

[@tejas4567]

So true

[@bryanrussell4613]

That show also teaches kids that courage is NOT being unafraid but DOING things you are afraid to do. As Courage said, "the things I do for love."

[@BLET_55artem55]

This show, for me, was nothing more than a nightmare/trauma fuel. You need to be careful with what you give to your kids and remember that everyone is unique (I went through a few gore-filled documentaries about serial killers, I practically grew up watching brutal "police series'" but got a trauma from 1984 Spiderman

[@cronchyskull]

I remember when I was in year 1 (British school system) the one book we always wanted to have read to us over and over again was all about a suburban mum turning into a monster throughout the course of a day because her children are misbehaving. It was the right level of building tension and was genuinely scary whilst in a familiar setting and scenario, and we LOVED it. It was the right level of scary and dark and the fact it was the one we loved the most was telling.

[@jackukridge5381]

I recommend Geoffrey Trease, a criminally underrated children's author. His books are meticulously researched and he should be remembered as one of the first authors who set out to appeal to both boys and girls by writing both as strong protagonists.

[@antonakesson]

Hansel and Gretel feels like one of the few dark fairytales that almost every adaptiation still involves implied cannibalism and burning someone alive.

[@Gusenichka925]

Cannibalism and burning someonealive is in that fairy tale????

[@antonakesson]

@@Gusenichka925 The witch is fattening Hans up to later be cooked but they got wise about it and shoved the witch in the oven to be burned alive.

[@belynda1224]

@@Gusenichka925 yeah. the witch tried to eat hansel and gretel, but gretel burned the witch in the oven in the nick of time. when i first read that story i wasn't creeped out though. but now i think it's really disturbing...

[@RingoSalver]

As a kid i remember being so interested in the lives of adults that I watched my dads scary movies behind his back. I was scared at the time and after I grew up I realized how much those movies helped me be less scared of fictions and gave me a spine to face the challenges of reality.

[@username42080]

When I was younger, my mum would try to make me in love with Disney princesses. That failed, at a young age, I became obsessed with horror movies and scary stories. They never told me to stop watching it, they just didn't want to watch it with me because it was ,,too scary'' for them.

[@tsm688]

LOL. You sound like one of those kids that would catch a garter snake and chase their parents around with it.

[@SupersuMC]

LEGO BIONICLE is one of those examples of a story that "grew up" with its initial audience. '01 through '03 took place on a relatively calm tropical island that, despite some of its problems, the residents called a paradise. Going into '04, we had a flashback to an island city with a lot of 1984 tropes involved, and then the ruined state of it in '05 showed the monsters within even the biggest heroes. And then there was '06-'08, where the universe was literally dying and we encounter some of the darkest stuff. And then '09 came with a whole new world that has a whole slew of problems, and quite the secret to reveal... The comics were relatively sanitized in comparison to the novels, while the web serials starting in '07 were definitely aimed at the older kids - some of the darkest stuff took place in those, as back then kids were advised to ask their parents' permission before going online. Needless to say, one of the reasons BIONICLE G1 is considered one of the classic LEGO themes is how its story wasn't afraid to get dark, especially with TV Tropes calling the main villain The Villain To End All Villains. There's quite a lot of nightmare fuel, awesome moments that will have you whooping in your room at 1 AM, funny moments to lighten the mood, and heroic sacrifices where even men cry. From a simple foundation on a tropical island leading into a lore that literally spans multiverses, BIONICLE G1 lives on in the hearts of its fans and its fans' children. Unity, Duty, Destiny!

[@koirankieli]

Beautiful. You said everything I've always thought about this topic! As an artist who works with media whose primary target is children, this is something I will always be preaching and fighting upper management with.