The Emma Chamberlain podcast controversy: when audiences start to desire more...

[@carles2623]

Tara will never stop edging us with that cow reveal 😔

[@danielsedan]

She knows what she is doing 😏 ❤

[@aawillma]

When she said "it's almost like she doesn't exist" I almost screamed HOW DARE YOU JOKE ABOUT THAT TARA

[@keyarrma]

i hope that one day she just starts taking photos with random cows at zoos or whatever and we're left to figure out which one is writing the videos

[@Mondomeyer]

​@keyaraval8591 I smell a triple-twist coming! The first, that they will all be the same cow in different costumes, the second will be that she's not a cow, but a male zebra. The third twist will be the dance. Zoos😅

[@SeventhWhiteCat]

Is the cow is actually a vTuber?

[@Yrie27]

From what I've seen so far it sounds like she doesn't need a college education so much as she needs just more life experience.

[@t_ylr]

Exactly. Like I get what ppl are trying to say. There's a certain kind of "fake deep" conversation that you really only have time for when you're trapped in a freshman dorm lol. You can have these conversations outside of college. And she's not dumb haha. Like I hate when I see fellow millennials making fun of younger ppl on the internet for having kinda obvious realizations for the first time. Why is that a bad thing? Also, "go to college" is so condescending and gross. I went college. I know ppl with degrees are still stupid. Wdym lmao???

[@temporaryoffline]

yes!!! and she hasn't lived that long for her experiences to be "thick" enough for her to be... profound,, as the tik tok commenters put it. its redundant, and not useful, she isn't saying anything that can be considered out of touch imo!

[@caseyw.6550]

College is just where a lot of people get that "life experience". Regular non-college people's life experience at her age where I'm from is husbands and babies, living in the same place they grew up. Like, I hope they are happy and all....but probably not listening to their podcast. But that's the thing, Emma has FOR SURE experienced more than any typical college grad EVER will.

[@AuthentiKaate]

College is life experience.

[@AuthentiKaate]

@@caseyw.6550what, like fame? I mean sure, but that’s still far from the average person’s experience. She is incredibly privileged in every single way.

[@kingnorkaiser]

the idea that love isn't real because it doesn't always last forever is making me insane

[@patriciahopkins8348]

Love is real like any emotional state is real. Emotional states are fluid and totally dependent on our thoughts. . our feelings will and should change if experience proves our original thoughts and feelings were in error...... Imo, believing yourself captive to an emotional state is flawed thinking and can have severe consequences..

[@margicates553]

Love is real. It’s a web of people who are supporting us and thinking of us with tenderness. You can’t always see it, and people don’t tell you. But people love you, in a thousand tiny ways and it’s just because you’re you. If you need a less rainbows and sunshine approach, grief is evidence of deep love. It’s the upside down of the web. The love that eddies and falls in on itself until you can find somewhere else for that grief/ love to go. That deep alone is only there because we once felt something full and warm. Romantic love, erotic love are placed higher up in our society, but the person at the bus stop, the cashier, the woman who still wears a hat to church, your friends kid who hides behind her dads legs and sneaks peeks at you. That’s all love. Those relationships and interactions are to be treasured. That’s how I know love is real.

[@felixthehuman]

Not knowing which gran cheated with my dad is driviing me insane (26:59)

[@deirenne]

You see, humans die and therefore, they have never been alive at all in the first place, so you don't have to stress about it, cause you don't exist. Hope I helped 🖤

[@piligay6969]

​@@deirenneth..anks

[@jungjaehyuns]

people do get very elitist about higher education, but as an ex listener her podcast really would benefit from her just getting out a bit more in general, especially academically if she wants to keep doing episodes where she pulls up statistics. college is not for everyone but i think in emma’s case specifically she would thrive/enjoy the environment where she has more access to peers that she can academically debate. i think if people were throwing this ‘go to college’ criticism at some random joe online i would find it a bit more distasteful, but when it’s someone like emma chamberlain who absolutely could afford college i can’t find it in myself to care really 😭 some of the comments towards her are expressing it in ways that are a bit too mean for my liking but i understand the underlying criticism

[@themelonsoup]

I mean if she likes to debate then yeah maybe she'd like college but I don't think it's that serious. She's just vibing.

[@shbeebop]

@@themelonsoup she clearly wants to learn and form arguments around these topics she talks about but she doesn’t seem to have much structure around it, so college would make sense. But obviously “just vibing” is not working out for her. The podcast is getting less and less popular as she tries to talk less about herself and more about these abstract topics, because people don’t want to listen to her sheltered and un-nuanced/shallow view of the world.

[@teodorasavoiu4664]

Yeah, it sounds like she'd enjoy college, rather than needing it. Especially since she's got the funds for it, why not.

[@parkerisles7256]

She could even just take a non-credited college course online

[@aidk23]

She's an Introvert so just getting out a bit at college probably wouldn't be fun or fulfilling for her. She's getting real world education that can't be learned by an online course , or by following a curriculum set by ppl who haven't achieved whatever it is that she's trying to do

[@manderly33]

I would say, listening to these clips of her podcast, that it is very low effort. As a listener, I can choose not to listen to an 22 year old explain why love doesn’t exist because people get divorced, because I’m almost 50 and to me that is the kind of shallow reasoning I might expect from a privileged young person; but I also think her fans deserve better than whatever this drivel is. I’m just very very very tired of famous people making money off podcasts that have lack depth or curiosity, or feeling like everyone is entitled to their opinion. Expertise still matters. I don’t think she’s dumb or needs college necessarily; but I think the podcast sounds bad. And that just makes it one among many bad podcasts in an oversaturated market. I also wouldn’t call harsh criticism of a wealthy and famous woman “bullying.”

[@cdw2468]

i’d push back and say that everyone *is* entitled to their opinion, but not everyone’s opinion should be taken equally seriously or is equally valid

[@tiaslays255]

I disagree with the last sentence. Just because someone is more privileged than you does not mean that you are exempt from being a bully or rude to them because you feel it doesn’t matter. This sounds like projecting.

[@GenerationNextNextNext]

Just because someone is rich and famous doesn't mean they can't be bullied or affected by harsh takes online. People seem to think fame and money end all worries. We know this isn't the truth. But because we believe it, we throw all empathy and compassion out of the water.

[@LoveAndSnapple]

@@tiaslays255 Bullying no, harsh criticisms yes.

[@deirenne]

​@@tiaslays255literally nothing you stated there was even in the comment your responding to and the "projecting" bit at the end makes me wonder if you're even serious, because taking what someone said and running off a cliff of negative assumptions about them to call them out on stuff that wasn't even there in the first place is a form of psychological projection, so at this point it's pot calling the kettle black to an absurd degree. No, the main comment did not say anything about being a bully of being rude to anyone, let alone say someone's feelings don't matter or that you can hurt someone because they're privileged. They literally only said that "Criticism isn't bullying" and you misconstrued it somehow into "Bullying is okay". How? Also, they are very much right, criticism isn't bullying, period. Tara criticizes both Emma and some of the tiktokers that are calling her out and none of those critiques were bullying, so just stop imagining ill intent into someone's comment.

[@user-rx6gb5uz2l]

Her problem seems to be a lack of understanding of established paths of philosophy and poor understanding of statistical analysis. Those problems can be solved in college. A college education is not absolutely needed to solve those problems, but it is the easiest way to solve it given the resources Emma has at her disposal.

[@bluester7177]

These problems can be solved with an online course, and you can go to college and not learnt it, I don't understand this argument, most college educated people are not good at analysing data and understanding statistical analysis if it's not what they specialized in, the world would be incredibly different if that was true.

[@user-rx6gb5uz2l]

@@bluester7177 I think you could benefit from rereading my comment, making note of the last sentence and the usage of "can".

[@esikazemese]

Depends on the major as well.@@bluester7177

[@venuslove-i1v]

I highly disagree with these takes. College has often been a vacuum of thought, especially by the white elite. It's an argument of the privileged and elite in my opinion to believe that going to college will give you "superior" knowledge. So, no, I can't say being college educated is the easiest way to solve problems regarding philosophy and statistical analysis. Even if she has the resources, it does not mean it is worth wasting time and money on. I think there are many ways to gain knowledge and we as a society would do better to challenge this.

[@esikazemese]

You know that there are universities in Europe where you can study for free? Because knowledge and education is not elitist everywhere. And your comment is a great example of how well the internet is educating people....@@venuslove-i1v

[@rfldss89]

I think she should go to college but really only because 1) college is really fun when you're as affluent as her, and 2) as the girl around the 10:00 said, if she goes into a philosophy or theology major, she'd literally be discussing all the topics she's talking about in her podcast, but with feedback and a true dialogue, not just her own stream of consciousness.

[@bisexualantigone]

College is also fun when you can take twice as long and live in a place where it doesn't cost 14.000

[@justine4581]

​@@bisexualantigoneshe has the money and time though, that's not really a question in her case right?

[@tgime1]

Yeah, I didn’t have a problem with the girls take. It didn’t even seem like a diss, but rather a solid suggestion

[@venuslove-i1v]

College can be a vacuum of thought sometimes that centers only white elite thought.

[@anjieeee]

this. money isn’t an issue for her. I don’t think most people mean any harm when they say she should go to college. it’s not for the degree, it’s just to learn and have discussions about the topics she clearly already has interests in. it should be seen more as a hobby like thing. and with community college a couple hundred is nothing for her so might as well spend a $100 to learn more about topics you like to learn about

[@claire2088]

I think it's the air of authority she uses that puts people's back up, and I kinda think they have a point, not about college, but if you're going to present things as if you're a neutral party reporting on the facts you need to consider more than your own opinion

[@istilldontknowmyname7324]

You explained very well amd that's what is what I think too

[@eshanatiti1733]

THIS ! emma just has this pretentious tone in a lot of her 'philisophical' podcasts that truly feels condescending and silly given the fact that she is just saying nonsense sometimes

[@Fellinlovewithawarlol]

one thing i find humorous about the Brittany Broski comparisons is that yes, she did go to college and talks about educational and philosophical things like parasocial relationships and History Brittany has a communications degree from her time in college and is at least four years Emma's senior i dont think it's fair to link two women in such different places in life as superior nor inferior to each other even if they both have similar podcast formats

[@Fellinlovewithawarlol]

i think Brittany did share a take on the whole chamberlain podcast discourse but i forgot what her opinion was on it all

[@tsuki3752]

brittany gained fame 3 years after emma did too. she worked in a “real” job for some times, rather than emma who has pretty much been super famous since she was 17. also, emma is a LOT more famous than brittany, by name, and she does a lot more in general. no hate to brittany btw she makes the most out of her game and i think her lifestyle is something i would personally aspire towards since it’s more laidback. emma just does a lot more so she wouldn’t have the time to go to college unless she dropped a lot of her work stuff. they’re very different and i don’t like the comparison :’)

[@TaraMooknee]

exactly, also Brittany is a comedian. Totally different content?!

[@ducky19991]

@@TaraMookneeI don’t know if you follow her podcast but Brittany is known to get pretty philosophical in many episode segments, she goes into similar topics as Emma but goes much deeper

[@FernBlackwood1995]

Brittany is King Mother, and they’re not even trying to live the same kind of life. Comparing women is silly.

[@RememberTheDead]

I think there's a zig-zag problem here where there's both a college-driven elitism and there is a serious problem with anti-intellectualism in the US disregarding college (or any sort of academicism) entirely.

[@anotherhuman3221]

Honestly I think this is more universal case, not only in US. But this is the best summary of this debate. From my perspective people want her to expand her potential which could also elevate the content. I think it is also important that in today's era of parasocial relationships people can also be frustrated because she has the resources to do so much in the educational field, but she is not using it for that. I don't mean it in a judgemental way, more just pointing out what people may think. It's honestly none of our business what she will do - go to collage or not. In the end, I think that most of the people are trying to voice their criticism because they know the podcast could be something interesting and not to shame her for being "stupid". I've seen a lot of so called "criticism in good spirit" online, but in this case I think that it is mostly the case. Sincerely a tired collage student

[@eddiearniwhatever]

Donald Trump rode that anti intellectualism all the way to the White House and has been a virus in our body politic ever since.

[@GenerationNextNextNext]

@@anotherhuman3221 The problem is they think the solution is to support elitist expensive universities, guided by racism, sexism, and nepotism, to "expand her potential". Just because someone has the resources doesn't mean that's what's best to do with them. And the people that are frustrated they can't get into the educational field because their own income bars them from it should rethink whether those institutions are actually worth it in the first place.

[@anotherhuman3221]

@@GenerationNextNextNext Well how are we supposed to change all those problems without people studying there? Just boycotting unis won't change anything honestly, we need people educated in certain field to replace bigots. Oh and also maybe important info - I'm not American, nor I study in America, nor I support the egregious fee's. In my opinion studying can be def worth it, in my case I study veterinary medicine and I wouldn't be able to become a vet in any other way. But at the same time I wouldn't be able to study if I had to pay so much money like in America. The system is corrupt, but in my opinion completly boycotting uni's isn't the way, it should be a cumulative effort from government and universities. Ofc without outside pressure they won't do anything, but I think even with the pressure they won't because 'money'. The situation would need right people in high places, which well, in my opinion should be highly educated and have experience to not fuck it up, as it's a complex problem (IF THEY DON'T GET THOSE THINGS FROM UNI IT'S FINE BY ME, JUST SAYING MY OPINION!) I

[@kfkkfk7995]

Also, there IS a correlation between intelligence and academic success, but especially between effort and academic success, and SO MANY people who complain about how elitist colleges are the same ones completely undermining effort and only valuing what intelligence is, which is something that for the most part you're just, well, born with. THAT is elitism at it's peak. They value people for something they just can't work on. Doesn't matter how much effort you put in and how much you succeed in life if you're not naturally gifted 🤓

[@Dixiedingo_LBB]

Honestly, I think the critiques people are having are harsh bit shallow. I didn't get to finish university because I defaulted on my tuition, and now I'm barred from any institution until I pay it in full-- I've only attended one semester. But! Clearly I'm capable of understanding these concepts and discussing them. The REAL problem here is that since she became famous at such a young age, and has never worked, has never been in "real life," she lacks experience, and so she can only present a very shallow analysis. It would be better honestly if the podcast were her exploring different topics the same way the Ologies podcast does. The host is not a scientist, nor is she that familiar with academia. But she's super into science and that's all she needs. She's done interviews with all kinds of obscure fields, including fire forensics. So tl;dr: Emma just needs to go outside a bit, but I think people are being really fucking mean about telling her.

[@xdani_thethinkingneko]

I agree 99% of what you say,bu whatt she does is work+is her job. A job by definition is work that you get paid for. Which she is paid for it. Therefore it is a job, and she is working. It's just a different kind of work. Sure there's jobs out there that are more important, like a doctor, nurses, teachers, etc. But, there are entertainers in the world. It is a valid form of work. I feel personally strong about this because, people often say what I do for work is not work. ( I restore barbie dolls+ resell sold out vintage/ long sold out items for a living on mercari+ebay) Even though I'm putting in 40 or 50 hours a week...and worked my butt off to get where I am. & I'm sure she did too. So I can relate in that regard. There's just way too much rhetoric online of people trying to tell others what they do for work isn't a job.Which is why I feel this is important to say this. Edit: typo was talk texting

[@qwertyTRiG]

One of the best podcasts is In Our Time from BBC Radio 4, in which every episode is the host interviewing three experts. One episode was on gravitational waves, and the three guests were two physicists and one historian of science. They discussed the history of the idea, the physical evidence, and the implications. At the very end, he said "next week, Greek and Roman love poetry". The range of topics really is that broad. There's an excellent episode called "Guilt", which I've listened to numerous times.

[@Dixiedingo_LBB]

​@joelleweetjewel9948 I mean I'm not. I'm specifically calling out the elitist notion that you HAVE to have gone to college to be able to talk about these things. You can learn to read scientific papers in high school. It does teach practical skills but not skills you can't learn from anywhere else.

[@Dixiedingo_LBB]

​@@xdani_thethinkingnekoI don't mean her influencer job isn't "real work," but when you're an influencer there's a need to aestheticize your life until the point your life is almost an Ikea show room. /that's/ what I mean-- that there are aspects of her life where she hasn't experienced conflict that someone might need to in order to be relatable to a broader audience. Like: I promise she's probably never feared going homeless. She's probably never wondered where he next meal is going to come from. She's probably never experienced a week without clean water. These are experiences that are important to help you understand the circumstances of reality better. Not saying you HAVE to go through those things to understand them, but it helps.

[@bluester7177]

@joelleweetjewel9948 It helps, but it's also not the only way, and it also depends on the college, the course, among other things, you can learn this things by yourself, and you can go to college and get out of it without knowing how to do it, most people actually fall in this category.

[@t3tsuyaguy1]

I agree with your comments critiquing Chamberlain's misuse of statistics. To add my own concern to the pile, I think she demonstrates that she doesn't have a good understanding of how to responsibly draw conclusions from the statistics she is citing. You pointed out that the fact that marriage ends does not demonstrate that the parties to the marriage never experienced romantic love. In addition, if we assume that somehow it _does_ mean no romantic love ever existed between those two individuals, what are we to make of 50-60% of 1st marriages that don't end in divorce. It's very telling that she doesn't seem to be aware that the very statistic she is citing, demonstrates that more marriages last than fail, which contradicts even the fuzzy logic she's applying to use this statistic, in support of her position.

[@lyndonwesthaven6623]

I'll also admit to being profoundly concerned by the 'the older an idea it is, the more I try to give it credit' as painfully vulnerable to right wing arguments....

[@Boahemaa]

@@lyndonwesthaven6623 That was actually scary. She may not be harmless afterall.

[@orsolyafekete7485]

@@lyndonwesthaven6623 "Ah yes, the divine right of kings, truly the most validest of ideas we should consider very carefully" :P

[@aaronhoy3410]

Well I mean to be fair the biggest misuse of statistics is that those numbers don't actually refer to the likelihood of divorce. This myth comes down to people comparing the divorce rate of the country to the marriage rate. I would hope it is obvious why this is not the same as the likelihood of a marriage ending in divorce. If you look at the numbers for percentage of men or women who were ever married who have ever divorced the most recent data is from 2016 & is 33.7% for women age 20 & older vs. 33.0% for men age 20 & older. In both men & women the percentage increases as age increases with the highest age ranges being 45-54 & 55-64 in both men & women with the percentage being above 40% for both sexes & age groups. Over half of those who have divorced had their first marriage ended in divorce within 5-6 years of being married. Around two-thirds of them ended within 10 years.

[@t3tsuyaguy1]

@lyndonwesthaven6623 I don't know that there is any real connection between how old an idea is and how right wing it is. There is certainly a tendency on the right to _claim_ they want to preserve tradition, but they are often doing the opposite. Take abortion for example. It was legal in all states at the beginning of the Union and remained so for a hundred years. In addition to that, American Christian churches were broadly in support of abortion until the late 1800s. Truly, the "traditional" position on abortion is actually pro choice. There are many examples like this. I actually think she has the beginnings of a solid point on this. I would present it differently. I would say that the longer an idea has endured, the more important it is to understand why, before dismissing or opposing it. We all have limited time to engage with anything. You can probably safely dismiss the shower thoughts of a 15 year old tik toker, in order to focus on other things, but you should probably invest the time to understand exactly why the freedom of speech is the second thing listed in the first ammendment, before you hand waive it away as "and old idea" or "a tool of the oppressor".

[@sabrinamehereen]

she doesnt need college, she just needs to read some articles on the topic, do some valid research and give her opinion. thats what all the video essayists are doing so can she. my only problem with her podcast is that she doesnt seem to put any effort. okay, if she doesnt want to have a well thought out , intellectual podcast then just say that its "in my opinion"

[@bluester7177]

But to my knowledge, that's exactly what her podcast is, just her talking about random things in her mind.

[@heyspeckle8782]

agreed, but how to properly research and know what to do with that info is a skill that takes quite a bit of time and effort to learn as well, and most video essayists who are the most successful have been able to do that before they started their channels

[@msk-qp6fn]

Not even articles, just books that challenges her.

[@black-nails]

A lot of good video essays take months to make and literally have citations and book materials in the description. Like they literally focus on one topic because it's their passion/ job/ hobby and dive into specifics, so they got a lot of experience on the topic. I have tried watching some f the more laid back ones and so many of them don't go any deeper than BuzzFeed article

[@annabel706]

Also the guy talking about how you need to have someone in the room who disagrees with your points while the girl in the room with him nods along to everything he says is so funny

[@gamingmama360]

My thoughts exactly!

[@sujammaz]

😂

[@enochgraham4957]

The cow is keeping us WELL fed!

[@PotatoKing86]

Because we keep eating her

[@criticalboot2567]

The cow is keeping us WELL fed!

[@Candicedickinsonllc]

are y’all eating the cow ?

[@PotatoKing86]

@@Candicedickinsonllc I am. They grow back so it's fine

[@AleTitan]

​@@CandicedickinsonllcBLASPHEMY

[@bmaze944]

Going to college is not gonna make you an expert in everything. I got a math degree, but idk shit about philosophy. People should just always be learning, seeking out real experts on topics, and developing critical thinking skills in order make informed opinions/decisions.

[@juliagil4909]

When you have resources it’s easier to go to college to learn how to learn. And know how to make researches and analyze data for example. And Emma obviously is missing that in her podcasts

[@bluester7177]

@@juliagil4909 But going to college doesn't mean you will, I've gone to two, and I'm certainly not an expert on how to learn or how to make researches and analyse data, and that is true for most college graduates, I learn to analyse data for a very specific field of expertise, psychology, and in my first degree I didn't learn to analyse data at all because it was a fine art degree, and it's not part of the curriculum.

[@Boahemaa]

Me neither but I became a student of philosophy following the same structure I used in my college education. The structure is applicable especially for analyzing data.

[@Boahemaa]

@@bluester7177 Sounds like your curriculum was missing something. A business/admin course could've supplemented an art degree.

[@sighcantthinkofaname]

I have a bachelors and a masters and a professional liscence all in the same subject, and I still get imposter syndrome over it because it's impossible to know everything. I think Emma would benefit from talking to someone about her ideas and expanding on them, but a blanket "Go to college" isn't at all nuanced.

[@lollipopcrazed]

I think it all boils down to Emma is not equipped to have some of the conversations she's wanting to have. The reason people keep pointing to not going to college as the reason why is because college is the most traditional way of gaining the knowledge and experience needed to be equipped. However, it's not the only way, as evident in the existence of alternate programs like certifications, apprenticeships, etc. I think what Emma needs is to take a class or shadow someone.,

[@FernBlackwood1995]

Eh, she should probably talk to her therapist about how to make leaving her home easier because of her anxiety first and then just talk to more people. She thinks what she does is the plain truth, but she just doesn’t know other people.

[@mordecaiissad8529]

​​@@FernBlackwood1995working on anxiety is obviously always great but just talking to more people doesn't necessarily do much I don't think, especially for introverts. While college and talking to people are both classic paths, in this day and age? If you're curious and interested you can find everything and anything to listen or read about and learn about. From actual scientific research to "for dummies" explanations to testimonials and people telling their experiences and stories. There's really so many routes if you're genuenly interested in exploring these topics.

[@lollipopcrazed]

@@mordecaiissad8529 even then, it's not even if you don't know how to use that information. You can see from the way she used the divorce statistics, Emma doesn't. She needs someone who can teach her how to understand data, how to develop and frame an argument, how to analyze and make connections on a deeper level

[@eddiearniwhatever]

The thing about a "college" curriculum is, you're compelled to read books you did not choose yourself, then to discuss the content and intent of those books with other folks who have read the same books, and you're also compelled to take a variety of classes and to illustrate that you have learned what all those classes have to teach. And this is a good thing because it teaches you how to think critically and how to research, and how to present what you've learned coherently, even if you didn't choose the subject matter. College is a good idea because most BA curricula are well rounded, including elective courses in language, history, literature, art, etc. along with the core curriculum - an economics major will leave college with some understanding of a dozen other subjects. Certifications and apprenticeships don't offer that, they're too narrow in scope.

[@GenerationNextNextNext]

In fact, college has been the worst way. Look at over half of the right-wingers in the USA who have all been to college but don't have one intelligent thing to say because they like people skills.

[@bobdagno4036]

I felt that “pontificate” disclaimer. I got into the habit of using “ostensibly” a lot, and recently found out it means something completely different than I thought. I was using it like it meant “without a doubt” but it actually is more like “well yes, but actually no”.

[@Incrediblugh]

You’ve just flipped my world upside down

[@JeanPaulBeaubier]

@@Incrediblugh Ostensibly just means "apparently"....

[@XxNvr_stopUxX]

a lot of podcasters would benefit from a visit to their local library

[@MagisterialVoyager]

this is actually a genuine pillar of healthy society, lol. while i don't always have the capacity to read book, there are tons of legit writings online, especially from genuine professionals, my usual being academic ones since it's my field. the sorting it takes energy and practice if you're not used to it, which i suppose what college/uni trained you for. The Marginalian is a good and rich start, imo, but read (good) books too when you can!

[@a1exneedsahamdleplease]

And if you need book recommendations then Jack Edward’s channel is a goldmine:)

[@rboehm13]

I don’t watch Emma Chamberlain content…but I don’t see why people put in so much effort into criticizing her… so what if she’s just talking out of her arse…that’s like 90% of podcasts!!!

[@fortunamajor7239]

THIS! She's just never been my cup of tea, but these criticisms are so clearly abt people disliking her in particular lol. Plenty of people have degrees yet put out fake deep/poorly-argued content constantly.

[@cantyangel]

Yeah I was kinda confused bc I’m like no offense this is the problem/how all podcasts come off lmao if I was her I would be feeling a little like “now why am I in it”😂

[@aidanbozeman7976]

The reason people do this is due to the massive brand deals they have with platforms. Spotify is paying her millions to pump out trash, while making changes to the platform that bar small artists and creators form being paid. I don't watch or dislike her, but some of the critique definitely is valid, even if it should also be directed at Spotify.

[@lyndonwesthaven6623]

*Listens to a freestyle solo podcast by a twenty year old* "My god, the *injustice* that I'm being subjected to rambling opinions of a twenty year old 😡"

[@bluester7177]

@@aidanbozeman7976 but what does she have to do with it? Spotify is to blame, they chose her presumably because they think people want to hear from her, she just accepted the money and continue to put out content, I don't understand this argument, these people should be mad at capitalism, not her.

[@msj5492]

I’m an engineer and while I learned a lot at college the main thing it taught me was how to think and problem solve through research and group discussion. This is what I think Emma would benefit from. Being creative and having your own ideas is great but knowing existing input on them can help you further develop them or move into more innovative things.

[@GenerationNextNextNext]

Depends on what you go to college for. I know plenty of people who went to college who don't challenge creatively what they've been taught in college because they were groomed to believe that's the way it "should" be. Einstein never went to college. The Wright Brothers never went to college. College could teach people things, but it isn't the only way to learn. It's an incredibly elitist, racist, and capitalist institution that is only accessible to the privileged few, especially in the USA.

[@whatisupbruh2738]

I think the “go to college” thing is just a statement ppl are using bc it’s catchy and gets the point across quickly. It’s pretty obvious that these people are saying she needs to be around other people that challenge her ideology and opinions on a regular basis and that it feels as though she is saying obvious perspectives abt the world around us. It may be unfair but ppl generally don’t have empathy for rich ppl especially if they’re in a lower socioeconomic bracket and honestly it is frustrating to hear her speak from an educated perspective after Google a few statics on her topics and calling it a day. Regardless, She’ll be just fine after this discourse

[@araiksims6322]

@heyyitsjudethings are different for everyone but I think most people find that college is were they were pushed beyond they're comfort zone. Like fine it might not work for some but many find that they learnt important skills such as tolerance, independence, how to interact with ppl from diff backgrounds, self control from college. Is that the only way to learn those things, no, but it is the easiest

[@artisseriechicken]

​@heyyitsjudethere are exceptions to everything. Like yeah of course people who aren't open to criticism will never change even when challenged. I personally think she should go to a library and read a stack of books on philosophy if she wants to learn concepts with more depth. She doesn't necessarily need people literally arguing with her to learn and grow, she could just read ideas from people who argued about those topics before she was born and get the gist of it.

[@firstnamelast5474]

Poor people having little empathy for hoarders of wealth is entirely fair and natural :)

[@Bekind94]

This isn’t lack of education- it’s a lack of life experience and being told no.

[@itchypigie]

Emma could obviously benefit from analysing her thoughts a bit more, but her podcast is bacically an online diary and theres nothing wrong with that. In the end people are holding a 22 year old who has just gone through a painful breakup to a higher standard 30+ year old guys whose main thesis is bacically wahmen = bad. Societies general hatred for things concerning teen girls/young women is appalling as always.

[@idalarsen2540]

I love the cow's input. She's so highly analytical. What a queen.

[@kayenjee]

I used to be an elitist college graduate who didn't appreciate the opinions of those I deemed undereducated...until I came across Cardi B. Seriously. I wanted to dismiss her so badly, but she made so much sense, regardless of how she talked or dressed or her line of work. I found her to be so insightful at times. That realization made me reevaluate how I assign value to people's views and opinions.

[@abandonedalienlizardbaby]

Also, think of all the idiots with degrees. There's so many of them lol.

[@enVschat]

I watched the hot ones interview and hearing her talk about her love of history was amazing.

[@xdani_thethinkingneko]

That's honestly really awesome, that she was able to change your opinion and you were able to grow as a human/ have more empathy ❤

[@JaseekaRawr]

☹️ it's not our fault we come from a bad spawn point. There's a real particular pain you feel in your stomach when ppl judge you for being poor. I don't wish it on anyone. I'm out of the hood now, but that feeling hasn't gone away. I'm glad you stopped judging ppl, but this comment just reminded me that ppl still judge us. 🥲 As you can see it still hurts lol 😅

[@Boahemaa]

Cardi B is college educated though. She may have dropped out but was quite good when she went.

[@lila7663]

it feels like people feel the need to intellectualize or medicalize all their feelings and moods the last couple years. Like at 22 when I got my heart broken of course my urge was to think that love was impossible, but back then it wasn't so common to try to further intellectualize that sentiment as some sort of biological determinism.

[@lyndonwesthaven6623]

I dunno, you can go back to, say, philosophers in the 1800s and find a *bunch* of salty essays and poems about how they understand the illusory nature of love and fidelity immediately after a breakup 😂

[@Olivetree80]

That tendency isn't anything new

[@patriciahopkins8348]

@heyyitsjudeAnd understanding leads to healing. If only I had known about narcissism and lovebombing 40 years ago lol...knowledge is our friend.

[@luizafernandes3955]

​@@lyndonwesthaven6623​ yes, there are modern philosophers and psychologists who challenge the concept of romantic love and study how the feeling has been idealized in history...

[@katelyn.l]

completely agree academic achievement is not the only path to intelligence or necessary to be regarded as intelligent. but I actually agree with the original take -- I interpreted OP as saying it seems like she'd enjoy a college philosophy class and would be able to contribute more to the conversation if she had someone pointing her in those "deep" directions she's interested in, which makes sense to me!

[@missmiadelrey]

I didn’t go to college but I’ve written published articles on DEI topics & created trans-inclusive policy for the company I work for that employs over 11,000 people. I hate that people are using the fact that she didn’t go to college to shame her bc they’re shaming other people in the process.

[@xdani_thethinkingneko]

Love it!!!❤❤ Your story reminds me of my grandmother, who in the 80s- early 2000s , she worked for anthem Blue Cross Blue shield. She started there, and only had a high school diploma. When she left, she was making more than people with masters degress. She was just that good. Sounds like you and her are cut from the same cloth + I mean that as the highest compliment. She is my hero tbh! ❤

[@TaraMooknee]

YESSSSS 👏

[@Kimberly_Sparkles]

Exactly. They are framing debate and discussion in a way that centers college education above all else--which denies access to others whose access to college education is not as easy as Emma Chamberlain.

[@eddiearniwhatever]

Thing is, she's attempting to explain or discuss things that have been better discussed and explained by others, and if she were better educated she'd be aware of this, plus she'd know how to research the subject matter and then present her discussion more convincingly. It is too bad people are shaming her, that isn't right, but it seems some folks are discussing ways she could be a little better informed, and her content would benefit from that.

[@essneyallen6777]

But what if she just read some books? I know, different stereotype, but you don't need college to pick up a book and learn some interesting stuff you can use to talk about topics in a podcast. I'm not touting this as a solution for Emma Chamberlain, I'm just very surprised that's not where the conversation went. Why college?

[@catie5939]

I was "homeschooled" and have the equivalent of a 6th grade education. Couldn't figure out why I'd been avoiding this discourse so completely until I watched this. As someone who was kept from education and has no college degree, I absolutely feel the gatekeeping at times. I know it's not people's intention and folks usually assume I have a degree, but it still cuts. Of course Emma has the opportunity to go to college anytime she wants to, but loads of us don't have that. And we're just here, hearing what everybody else is saying. I think mainly, I wanted to say that your content is exactly what I need to hear sometimes, thanks Tara. 😭💜

[@kelb6073]

Don't feel bad. People always move the goal posts. I have a degree and it doesn't mean you aren't criticized. Everybody thinks "you should have done this or that". Fuck em.

[@edithputhy4948]

You should be angry with your parents for depriving you of an education. This is why homeschooling is illegal in my country, the child's right to an education beats the parents right to take their child out of school.

[@sorormimm493]

Thank you for this comment. I’m currently homeschooling my children (14 and 10) and have for the past 5 years. I appreciate the perspective!

[@Chachixo]

I don't think I understand what you mean by gatekeeping in this context. Who is gatekeeping what thing?

[@catie5939]

@@edithputhy4948 I absolutely am. The US unfortunately doesn't allow children to have rights. No kids in the US have a right to an education. It's absolutely awful. In my state, you can literally just tell the school that you're "homeschooling", provide no proof whatsoever, and your kid will never be required to see another doctor or teacher ever again. So many kids die this way in the US, but the rightwing uses it to control their children and abuse them, so they bury all of it. Absolutely bizarre. I'm SO glad other countries do better on that front. 💜

[@chantebrand1581]

It reminds me of that idea that celebrities stop growing at the age they become famous. Her general vibe is that she’s still a teenager in her mind, she hasn’t emotionally progressed.

[@howdyitsren]

imo as a phd student and researched, research isn’t necessary to talk philosophy. it can definitely be very helpful, but we learn so much about philosophy by living. you don’t need to know names and terms to explore concepts. i think that needs to come with the understanding that no research is objective. talking philosophy is taking opinions and experiences, just approaching it with a different lens. the more i learn and the more pieces of paper im given from schools, i understand that my philosophy hasn’t changed. im just better able to articulate it in an academic way and evoke the memories and thoughts of other academics.

[@electricmagnetic]

Just wanna say that the first thing you learn about philosophy is its inclusivity. Anyone can be a philosopher, as long as your questioning the status quo. Philosophy is the birthplace of "there are no stupid questions". I hold a master's degree in ethics and philo. anthropology and tbh the comments are exactly the comments of her peers, exactly the ones that 1st year philosophy majors would say about about anyone just trying to figure things out on their own. I'll admit, I was the elitist person (elite doesn't only apply to wealth but a status in a given hierarchy) and would be annoyed by ppl like Emma. Now I'm just happy that kids are exercising their brains and explaining the world around them to themselves. Yes, it's nice to have a degree but not every thinker in history of philosophy has had a degree. Let the girl live ffs.

[@crimeny]

+

[@msk-qp6fn]

👍👍👍

[@amandaboutourline4070]

She's talking about these philosophical subjects without doing any research and then acting like she's the first person to come up with these ideas. I think that's the real crux of the criticism and I think it's fair.

[@xdani_thethinkingneko]

12:26 It's pretty wild that he would think all children of divorce had the same exact experience. My parents got divorced, and while it was difficult. I still believe in love. I still believe marriage has its merits, if that's what both people want. & My parents divorce was the best thing that ever happened to them. They are actually both happier now.

[@TwelvetreeZ]

People say "go to college" as though everyone develops critical thinking there. It is a place where growth is facilitated, but I met some deeply foolish people while I was there. A lot of people learn more from their life experiences outside of uni

[@rayay248]

I just think we need to start incorporating topics like “logic and reasoning” and “how to evaluate research” into primary and secondary education. Everyone needs to know these things, and you can absolutely teach at least aspects of these concepts to children and adolescents.

[@user-unfriendly_-o-]

I think the right way to express that opinion is "they need to get some real world experience". Leaving school and being around other adults is very important for forming emotional intelligence and for general education. Like work (no matter if it's office, customer service, physical work or anything else) or any post-school education. I think it should be "go out and look at anything that's not an echo chamber of a school"

[@xdani_thethinkingneko]

18:06 You can also see the fallacy within this, because with that line of thinking then asexual people wouldn't be able to fall in love... But they do. There are many asexual people who fall in love. They just don't have sex.( although some do for their partners ofc, don't want to generalize too much)

[@rubyxaruby]

I think in a way people have a point, especially the first video. Emma clearly would want to have a philosophical discussion in an environment where such discussions are encouraged and such attitudes are fed and not suppressed. Academia is the easiest (not the only!) environment she could reach. Other avenues of such discovery would take a lot of intellectual curiosity and self reflection and to be frank I don't think she is motivated to do so.

[@sharos.d2323]

I'm not a defender of College education, because much of the time is very limited because is primarily western conceived, but I do believe that if this woman is going to talk about these kind of topics she indeed needs some education, maybe not necessarily college education but maybe read more and have someone giving her some feedback and guidance. There's many different ways to educate yourself without having to go to college, the problem here is that she's trying to make a live in something that she clearly doesn't take seriously enough to invest time on it....

[@EF-kk3vh]

Well said! This is also how I feel

[@FernBlackwood1995]

Yeah, even if it’s not college, she needs education from talking to other people about their life experiences.

[@jackieeg]

I get that the criticism sounds elitist… but as an older adult returning to college, I agree that emma would benefit from a formal education.

[@theoriginalnik]

I dropped out of college three times lmao for various reasons (depression, undiagnosed adhd, financial problems) but I am still pretty well-informed on a lot of things because idk I READ. I do think maybe she would benefit from a bit of a read on some subjects before going off about them and maybe comparing her opinion with those resources. BUT okay, she grew up on the internet where just spouting off every little thought you ever have is like the thing you do. Thought vom is kind of the culture! So like broadcasting her bad takes is kind of par for the course, the difference is that she’s a large creator who is held up to a different standard, rather than looked at as a20-something human being who just doesn’t have that kind of life experience. It’s not a good practice, but it’s a symptom of a bigger problem in my elder millennial opinion. I mean I live in the “debunking tiktok bs” section of the internet so she’s definitely not the only person just saying things out there.

[@reiinon]

the hair is SUCHH a nice look on you omg. so windswept and fluffed up, truly finding your glow up in this regard like.. ✨✨ ps: knowing i’m exactly a week older than emma chamberlain is.. kinda wild.

[@chaosdestructionlove]

It's kind of interesting hearing the more good faith crits of her romantic love not existing line, though I am surprised she could say the "it's an illusion bc it's a biological lie to make us breed"quote bc it ignores aaaaaaall sorts of relationships between people who cannot have biological children for whatever reason. I can really see why folks were side eyeing her for it.

[@tenebrousoul9368]

Much love Tara and Moolisa

[@GalooGameLady]

The beauty of the internet is that even tho I'm fairly online, it seems like there's not a week that I don't hear about some random person on youtube who has millions of followers that I've never heard of.

[@whotfisliz]

i have to be honest: i dont understand why people care? they act as if emma only ever sits on her couch and speaks into a mic by herself (when that one dude said that she's created an echo-chamber for herself in her room, i lost it) while she probably does talk about these topics with her friends and family (i would assume, like any other person does.) also, i will never understand the internet's obsession with "humbling" someone/their opinions

[@oliviaann9946]

agreed for the most part! I don't think there's really anything wrong with saying to her, hey the way you talk about love is concerning, but the fixation on it is super weird. I listened to the podcast a few weeks ago and I was like, okay that's kinda dumb but I moved on with my day! It's not like she was spreading misinformation, she just made a poor argument.

[@whotfisliz]

​@@oliviaann9946i agree with that part, I mostly (if not wholly) agree with the whole part on that specific love-episode, my comment was directed at the internet discourse on her/her podcast/her statements generally

[@whotfisliz]

​@heyyitsjudeMe too! But I guess I just cannot relate to people wanting to shape someone's behavior to how they think is right (whatever or whomever gave them the highground to decide what behavior is right in that situation) as I, too, have grown and "adulted" and learned that sometimes, people need to make (obvious) mistakes and learn from them for themselves

[@themelonsoup]

They're upset because she's young and wealthy and we're all just nobodies lol

[@bibsp3556]

When you say wrong shit online, someone will always feel the need to point it out?

[@julienne152]

I feel like the people saying "don't critique her, it's not that serious" are more insulting than the criticisms themselves. They're basically implying that nothing she says has significant substance. Criticism can come from a bad place but if it comes from a good place it can show that you at least take someone's words seriously.

[@ChryskylodonInstitute]

love how you blink with each eye separately ❤❤❤

[@xXxNeonPrincessxXx]

I don't think Emma is outrageously out of touch, I think she's as out of touch with life as any other kid/young adult in a 1st world country who are middle class/upper middle class. People being mad at her for not having a profound thought is also ridiculous. Not a lot people have profound thoughts, even 3/4ths of college educated people I know do not have profound thoughts. I'm pretty sure kids who are making fun of her don't either. Most of them just parrot what they learn in Psych101 which is silly. College doesn't make you a genius nor does it improve your grasp in reality more than any other life experience. People who hate on her honestly sound like they're just insecure because she's somehow famous even though she's mostly average (which isn't bad!!!!).

[@kerycktotebag8164]

perspective is what I'd want someone that popular, speaking on so many topics, to have. Specifically, practiced multi-perspective "taking", the verb. not necessarily formal education, but perspective. She's young enough to get away with lacking perspective, but she's popular enough that it matters when she doesn't on some topics

[@AresThePacifist]

Twp videos in one week? Tara you're spoiling us !!!

[@L1ncore]

Its really really weird that she thinks love isnt real because its technically a biological/chemical reaction. Many mental illnesses are also a result of chemical reaction/imbalance, does that mean they arent real…?

[@tdelioncourt1268]

maybe she's aromantic, her discourse really sounds like some sh*t I'd say before realising it isn't the general human experience ^^

[@bluester7177]

@@tdelioncourt1268 She just broke up with someone recently, so it's probably that, I'm also Aro, and I also have thought this things from time to time so it can go either way. Also, I don't think chemical reactions make something necessarily real in the way we understand , we know most humans have chemical reactions which make bonding happening, but we don't understand well any of it, to say that they are responsible for what we understand to be love, specially because it seems like people tend to have different experiences with what would be the same emotion/concept, but I don't love anyone, so who knows.

[@kdekuir]

I agree that her analysis is shallow. But I don't know why people are so pressed about it and having such high expectations. Her podcast is just her rambling, she's not claiming to know better than anyone. I don't make a tiktok for every shallow person I hear on the Internet, that would be a very frustrating way to spend my day.

[@egorpozdnyakov8812]

I feel like Emma is just a young person who is figuring life out but instead of doing it in small a friend group like the rest of us she’s broadcasting her ideas to a huge internet audience (due to the specifics of her job). I do however think that if she wants to delve into this philosophical style of content she needs to learn more. Not necessarily at a college, there are lots of amazing sources for self education these days. But from my experience some form of teacher or tutor would help a lot with getting started at least (not a universal advice but Emma can obviously afford that)

[@Worgiewoo]

According to science, I think the issue is another celeb trying to sound like an expert having the platform to promote their opinions (toxic or not) is always going to divide. Someone having the ability to spread a message without whatever credentials make people happy can feel hinky.

[@Thuwomp]

I JUST FOUND OUT LAST WEEK IVE BEEN USING PONTIFICATE WRONG TOO. I thought it meant “to ponder” 😭

[@ohimdying]

I think it is about the way people criticise her stuff. I feel like people often cant differentiate that not everything should be cricised the same way - there is a difference between criticising a person because you think their content is boring/flat or because you disagree with a point they make (f.e. emmas episode about love being an illusion) and cricising someone for being biggoted or having opinions that can infuelnce people in a very bad way. I think some people go WAY too hard on Emma for not a good enough reason

[@partehpatty9131]

A degree doesn’t always mean you’re an intellectual. Some of us out here just passed through college with C’s all the way through. And also college doesn’t teach everyone everything. So to those saying school is what makes you an intellectual. That’s not always the case.

[@bibsp3556]

It teaches you how to learn properly though. Let's you know that you don't know shit.

[@tvmayer]

I’ve always loved Emma. I’m about 10 years older than her and I’ve always been so impressed by her natural authenticity. She seemed so wise and adjusted even when she was doing nothing at all. Idk it’s hard to describe… She’s charming but in such a sincere, uncalculated way. It’s so odd to me that her rise was due to her just sharing her thoughts and now that’s why folks are turning against her. Also, in all the clips I’ve seen of her being ~not educated~, I actually respect her trains of thought. Perhaps having a second person with whom to discuss these ideas would land more with her listeners? As a college grad let me tell you, plenty of people that go to college are stupid as hell. I went to the university of Nebraska so you can probably infer the topics of some of the gReAT cOLLegIAtE DiScuSsioNs~~ that took place while I was there (racism!!). People are obviously entitled to their opinions but I am seeing a resurgence in bullying and casual group mudslinging that I thought we had escaped in 2012. THAT is a big problem for me. I am actually a fan of ~cancel culture~ but that’s not what this is. It antagonistic and cruel and has no point. Not related but Tara you look extra beautiful in this vid. That hairstyle really suits you. 😊

[@bluester7177]

I agree with you and I also don't understand the argument, going to college often makes you specialized in one particular field, I have a fine art degree with a painting specialization, It doesn't make me qualified to talk about physics.

[@kaitlynm9463]

Wise?

[@jamiepandaman]

Honestly, I'm so glad this was the first I'd seen of this ✨discourse✨ and I don't really feel the need to see anything else about it because you and the cow were so thorough and nuanced.

[@saraisreading4231]

Honestly I think a lot of this comes down to poor phrasing. Does she NEED to go to college? Of course not. From what she's been talking about lately, does it seem like she might really value and enjoy some of the experiences that college can offer? Yeah. I think she'd really enjoy even just taking a class or two, and she has the resources, so why not? It's almost a bit of a shame, because like you said, she is too famous to have a normal college experience. I think if she would have been able to have the experience of being a freshman in like a philosophy 101 discussion class, she would have loved it.

[@lenapawlek7295]

I agree with your point on college but i think the orginal poster was actually saying that she needs to talk with other people and less that she needs to go to college specifically. I think the original poster thought that the only way to get a good discussion going is at college, which i dont agree with at all - as you mentioned there are many ways to discuss topics and you can have a rigorous discussion outside of college

[@imyugimuto]

I hate the elitism people have when they know you didn't go to college. Yeah, not everyone goes to college that doesn't mean they don't have intelligence or capacity to live a normal life. Not to mention it's not exactly affordable to just go to college especially in the states or was never able to have an opportunity whether it's because of systemic issues or life circumstances.

[@melowlw8638]

totally!! ppl dont realise that many ppl who "sound" uneducated while trying to articulate stuff havent been given access to the conventional academic tools to do so + not everything needs to be formulated in an academical manner many things can be told/understood without "sounding educated"

[@CaseyAvalon]

My friend went to college for 13 years. He was a professional student. He got a Bachelor's in like Public Administration. He's actually a dumbass and he's not the sharpest knife in the drawer 😂

[@bluester7177]

@@melowlw8638 Also, not everyone is articulate, I went to college twice, for two different degrees and most of the time I sound dumb, going to college and having a degree does not make anyone smart, articulate or well-rounded, it says that you had the means and spent whatever many years it takes to complete a course and get a paper proving it.

[@melowlw8638]

@@bluester7177 yes absolutely!! thank u for adding this i can see it in my professors some of which are alone working in their fields many of them have a hard time being articulate and we as students have to throw out the info thats not rly relevant or sometimes they dont have the best pedagogy and dont rly break down the concepts to make us understand them as for me, ik im not going to become a professor but i know that if i do im also going to struggle being articulate so obviously im not gonna shit on them for that

[@lol-qc5if]

Not to mention the elitism of whether you "deserve" to go to college in the first place. I'm the first person in my family to go to college and could only go because I earned a full ride to a top school because it was either that or give up on college entirely. The amount of times I saw resentment toward first-gen, low-income students was ridiculous and obviously came from people who didn't know what it's like to be in a situation like mine. Don't get me started on how people make it about race, ethnicity, and other demographics too...

[@zozocchini1157]

yesss i've been so fascinated with this emma chamberlain discourse i'm so happy you've made a video about it!

[@fakecorny9807]

Your Channel helps me alleviate depression. Thank you.

[@MagisterialVoyager]

sorry, tara, i gotta stop at the clip of emma talking about karma. i remember attending a decolonial discussion with scholars from all over the globe and a south asian's scholar annoyance, despair, and just unbridled energy of "it's actually so wrong" regarding the usual usage of the word/term "karma" is making it too hard for me to see emma throwing that term so easily. it doesn't mean that emma is evil (lol) or 100% wrong, it's just that i don't think i'm going to spend much more time going down into this rabbit hole of discussion without references adequate to my standards, whether academic or personal, but i might get back to this video in the future. regardless, i'm stoked that this brings discussion about philosophy and education! well done, tara!

[@abandonedalienlizardbaby]

As a society, it seems that people give more grace and validity to the views of misogynistic incels than heartbroken young women. Its disturbing. Like you are allowed to not see women as people, if you have the excuse that they once treated you badly... but if you're a woman going through it who says anything bad about love or relationships watch out. 🙃

[@Thrak94]

Call me crazy, but Emma here seems like a woman who is just figuring things out, which is what you're supposed to do in your 20s. She's not always right, but I don't think we need her to be right all the time just because she was such a spotlight on her. I think we've all been in a similar situation to her, but no one was giving us this type of criticism for it. I don't see this as this big of a deal, but still a great video Tara!

[@samprice1302]

I think the big difference is that most people in their 20s don't try to speak authoritatively on these things to their audience of millions. She's young, inexperienced, and uninformed. That's fine, everyone was at some point, but she doesn't put forward her views as opinions she's presenting them as facts. That's potentially harmful to her audience of people who are young and impressionable, so it's worth criticising.

[@Thrak94]

@@samprice1302 That's fair. Hopefully she learns and grows from all this.

[@goma3088]

I'm evidence that you can be college educated and still dumb. I ranked very poorly on a test of critical thinking...a test I took at the end of time in college. I went to a liberal arts college and did nothing with my BA. Still working entry level jobs over a decade after finishing school because I can't seem to figure out what I want to be "when I grow up" and I've never stuck with any job/company for longer than 3 years. I was the kid who went to college because that was what was expected for my generation. I don't regret my time in college but I think I would have benefitted more from going to a technical or vocational school than a liberal arts one, if I was going to go to one at all. I was the "smart" or at least "smart because I was hard working" kid in high school. But the older I get, the more I realize how averagely dumb I am...at least in the type of intelligence I've always measured in myself. I've met many people who are much more intelligent than I am who'd be considered less educated on paper.

[@MagisterialVoyager]

don't feel to bad. i'm an academic with two degrees looking to do a phd. i just like studying. yet, in my field, i met really shallow and emotionally immature professors. they somehow exist. it's better to be self-aware - as you've shown - and kind anyway.

[@sarahmarie4760]

I relate to this so much.

[@saiyamoru]

Low INT, maybe, but high WIS demonstrated by the self-awareness.

[@SarahBright]

I could have written this for how much I relate.

[@sparkymularkey6970]

Same, dude! I was always told that I was "smart" and "intelligent," and even though I went to college and graduated with excellent grades, I am still working the same retail job that I've been working for years and I don't feel particularly smart or accomplished. The older I get, the more and more I realize that I really don't know anything. 😅

[@amjadalbrahim4286]

Tara your hair looks extra good in this video

[@HeySlothKid]

Oooohhh maaannn some of these takes are super elitist. Oh oh oh not a good look. A rather "only a certain class of people are allowed to have opinions " look. Also do any of these people realise they can just choose not to listen to the podcast if they don't like it? Edit: I do think she'd probably *enjoy* college and having people to debate with / bounce ideas off of / spark new ways of thinking but that's because I loved that experience and would have stayed there forever had it not been for the whole "needing to eat and have a place to live" thing

[@Reaper1770]

Completely agree. I originally wanted to go to university and i just struggled with motivating myself in just going through 3 or 4 years to get a higher education. I decided to become a train driver and become qualified in the trade. It feels like im constantly looked down upon because i chose to not go.

[@SevWildfang]

ngl there are college classes that would help with her inability to read scientific sources correctly. theyre not written to be easily accessible to people without a certain kind of education. its really hard to just amateur ones way into understanding them.

[@gnomie3908]

I never NEVER want to be referred to as a child of divorce. My parents divorce had nothing to do with me.

[@r.w.bottorff7735]

Oh my goodness, that contextual segment at the beginning all leading to twitter "discourse" really threw me off, being in my mid thirties and generally being blissfully unaware of KZbin celebrities, I was expecting something different. Thank you for the video.

[@majjr7]

Dev limes made a good point in her recent vid about spotify, that talks about how it's problematic in some way that Emma can make this type of content and make huge bank on spotify, while people, who are working really hard, are hardly making any money at all (she explains it better than me) but I also think that Emma is entitled to talk about whatever she wants and it's up to people if they wanna listen.. plus this idea of "oh I had this thought when I was 8" seems to me like someone who is trying to up themselves by beating someone else down - yes absolutely critisise, but personally I find it hard to learn from someone who is talking down to me

[@bluester7177]

That's a capitalism problem, though.

[@majjr7]

@@bluester7177 well yes... it's just another way to look at the situation

[@JutaStokes]

I feel the same way about this as I do about the recent criticism of Billie Eilish talking about women's bodies being judged "when men's aren't". These young women have had to live in tiny bubbles from a cery young age for their own safety, because of their fame. This will naturally diminish their ability to grow from the normal life experiences the rest of us have, whether or not we attend a tertiary educational institution. Add to that the fact that we all say stupid stuff sometimes (I'm 48 and far from immune, I'm just grateful that the opinions I held at 20 weren't blasted out to the world!) and it's obvious that the incredibly wealthy, famous young people living in their bubbles are going to give opinions that are out of touch. I agree with other commenters that having expert guests to discuss serious or academic issues WITH her on her podcast would be a better way. She could still talk about how she feels that way, but wouldn't be positioning herself as any kind of "authority" to her audience. And lastly, men really can spout any rubbish on podcasts without it being examined under a microscope. *sigh*

[@finnilyenough]

I didn't get to finish college. I am very self conscious of it because I get it thrown in my face frequently. I work in software development and I am for sure the least educated at my workplace. But I am competent and capable my manager and the CEO love me and the quality work I do. It makes me sad that we value humans differently based on something which ones access to is predictable by income bracket.

[@alejandramoreno6625]

To be honest, for me going to uni opened my world because I left my cocoon of upper-middle class people and met all sorts. But then again, I went to a state university which is actually free. Maybe that's the problem, that higher education in the US and UK is elitist, when it shouldn't be.

[@user-ek6sr9mz1p]

Yeah I think ppl are saying she needs to go to university when they really just mean she’s kinda shallow and her points are facile.

[@michaelseitz8938]

Hang in there 💖 In my experience, you don't hear about bad things happening to other people because most people don't talk about them. Ever. I admire you for showing us how life really is, be it with an upside down or a right side up frown 😊

[@Hippolyta.]

im a year older than emma and used to watch her in high school. she was chill and funny and just vlogged everyday life, but her life was pretty different to mine so i liked getting a look into it. eventually, i had to stop watching because (to put this as nicely as possible) i felt myself getting stupider when i watched her. her "thing" was never being an intellectual. she just offers up her thoughts and opinions for anyone to hear. sometimes they dont hit, but such is life. emma seems like a very curious person. maybe it would serve her well to speak with an expert on the topic she's discussing (a la JVN's Getting Curious) or maybe not. she's learning and growing just like the rest of us, just in a different way. may i also say, i met some of the dumbest people in university? going to uni does not make you smart. YOU make you smart. the system of secondary education is just a tool.

[@TheChelseaHanna]

The irony of the other podcasters talking about her and her echo chamber and how no one wants listen to her ramble… as they ramble about her…

[@nebeskyranc]

I see this from two perspectives - first, there's the entertainment, "real-life" one. I think that's the direction of Emma's podcast, essentially. It's like sitting down with a friend and talking a bunch of crap based on how we feel about things and what we think about them, jumping to conclusions, making assumptions and basically having fun. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. The other perspective is the academic one and as you said, it's kind of problematic once you start using statistics and trying to present your argument as a sort of a thesis or even fact. From the academic perspective, as a uni student myself, I agree that Emma would benefit from learning a bit more about academic criticism, using sources, etc. I do find it annoying when people use a source and stretch it into something that is completely unrelated and it is something you learn very quickly is wrong when going to uni. At the same time, there are ways to learn these things on your own. Or simply keeping in mind that you want to stick to the first kind of discussion, I guess.

[@desertels5119]

Yeah, at first I was like let the heartbroken girl feel her feelings. Then I heard the statistic bit and I was like correlation does not equal causation, I can see why people were bringing up college now.

[@abbymyers5072]

This *discourse* makes me think of a few things… elitism and mysogony. Joe Rogan dives into far more dicey waters on his hellscape of a show and some of the folks who mock Emma absolutely never miss an episode from Rogan. Not to say I don’t think there are limitations to Emma’s podcast, but I also don’t think it is alone in those 🤷‍♀️

[@gnomie3908]

Your hair looks amazing in this style!

[@PostingCringeOnMain]

I love that the well of KZbin is so deep that I can discover massively influential creators that I've never heard of despite having written multiple essays for my masters degree on KZbin content creators... like, I literally have Ma. KZbin Studies in all but name... and yet here I am, right here, in the year of our lord 2023 learning the name of someone I had no idea existed and it's all because of a cow

[@von186]

emma needs to hang out with some aro and ace people. like, not all of us experience these very cliche ideas of love and attraction

[@Hollyberrystreats]

You said that attendance of a prestigious university would likely only expose her to wealthy students who had only attended private school....but going to college does not have to equal studying at a prestigious university! She could go to a state school or a community college and learn from a challenging academic environment with all kinds of people. You get out of college what you put into it, it doesnt matter if you go to a 'good' school or a 'bad' one

[@PokhrajRoy.]

7:19 We should retire Karma from our vocabulary because it’s based on a rigged, rigid and regressive system where no one wins.

[@strohhut_tufi]

If you don't mind, could you explain what you mean?

[@shivanginirai5087]

​@@strohhut_tufiIt kind of justifies caste system in India and various other injustices.

[@hisokamorow1816]

The discourse should be that she has never gone to college OR had a normal job Going to college is not a requirement for relatability but being an influencer for her entire adult life means that she has never been a normal adult

[@imanysol]

Emma has the chance to do the funniest thing and name her first child echo chamberlain

[@atinyevil1383]

This comes from someone who has a degree in philosophy: you do not need to go to school to have philosophical thoughts. Having peers to talk to helps in a lot of ways, like not putting yourself into an echo chamber or being introduced to new thoughts. But you don't need to go to school for it.

[@MeowCatReturns]

The criticism of Emma is mean spirited-but the general critique that someone who wants to discuss weighty topics should seek out more education is not a bad one. I get frustrated by people who say college is meaningless, because it doesn’t have to be. If you’re interested in higher education that actually provides you with critical thinking skills and knowledge-you can find it. And it doesn’t have to be expensive. I’ve taken community college courses that were life changing. I went to college with people that felt like all they got a piece of paper at the end of their degree program. most of those people also weren’t participating in class discussions, doing the reading, or engaging with their professors outside of class. There are absolutely bad programs and professors-but in my 7 years of higher education I have seen a lot more apathetic students. You usually get out of your education what you put in to your education. Just want to add that informal education is great too (looking at you philosophy tube). College is just a more straightforward way to have structure and discipline around your studies. Especially when you’re young and don’t know where to start.

[@GenerationNextNextNext]

Community College was expensive for me. My loans from that were harsh. Further, yes, if someone is interested in higher education, then sure, people can find the benefit of it. But if someone is not, there's nothing wrong with rejecting it and finding a better way to gain deeper insights, like through travel and personal study. Most Universities are morally corrupt, pushing capitalist agendas and supporting prejudiced elites and sketchy politicians. If someone doesn't morally feel right supporting that kind of system, they can feel good by not pouring their resources into that, too.

[@espinita.]

The way she talked above romantic love reflects the same vibe i had when i got out of a really abusive relationship. Hope shes okay-

[@thedudewhoeatspianos]

I'm so old that not only have I never heard of her, but even after watching your video I still don't understand what she does. But I am old enough to have met a few generations of pretentious 25 year olds telling you that their academic studies made their ideas sharper, when it actually made them more polished and bland.

[@cal6137]

sooo glad you took this topic on. i didn't trust a lot of the takes on it so far , but since you are not familiar it is giving an outside perspective

[@aanonymousamanda1711]

As a person with a Master's degree, I know a lot of people without formal education that are far more intelligent than I am. I don't even know if that sentence was properly structured.

[@himenyx153]

I just think that people can argue all day about whether or not Emma Chamberlain needs to "go to college" (literally whatever that means), but the biggest problem here is the RUDE PEOPLE leaving RUDE COMMENTS. Like seriously, the little anonymous comments insinuating that Emma is stupid come across as very smug and annoying. I'd rather be dumb than be a jerk lol.