Tech Tip: How to Tie a Luthier's Knot When Changing Strings

#guitar #techtips #bluegrass #luthier #banjo #howto #howtochangestrings
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[@BanjoBen]

Now I know...at my next Thanksgiving family meal, I will not discuss religion, politics, or the Luthier's Knot.

[@altongiese4157]

Haha... good since of humor buddy... way to keep it lively... Thanks for the video..it helps and shared something lots of folks needed to know.. If not for practically and measure than fir culture and history.. you did grand!

[@essentialjudge2279]

That is the right way to lock the string. Or I learned it from the old guys.

[@5Bird5]

No-one is right or wrong. It's just your method (which always works, I have to say) so that's that. I use a different method that also works but that's just my preference. Interestingly, you didn't say this was the only way to install strings, just how to tie a luthier's knot. Thanks for taking the time to produce your excellent videos.

[@kennylynch9317]

I found this very helpful

[@eagles_s]

Lol. People act like you dont do this for a living. Thanks!

[@michaelvarney.]

The video clearly explained how to do this knot… but… This sort of knot is a pain in the ass to remove, and is not really needed if you know how to fold back properly.

[@johnnydropkicks]

I’ve just always done the first wrap around above the excess string and the rest of them below it in a coil fashion. That seems to work well for me.

[@banana1379]

Same concept different approach 👌

[@manbearpig2164]

Me too

[@mikepoirier2492]

Guitar tech 40 years-no no no 'knots' can always be pulled tighter. This knot will continue to tighten over time leading to tuning issues. And have fun with a sharp tool such as an awl to get that knot undone on the high E and B strings. I hate when guitars come into my shop with this knot...takes twice as long to remove strings. Not for me...

[@chrisbardolph]

Preach. One wind over the top and a few below is absolutely fine. And I don’t end up stabbing myself in the fingertip and wrestling with needle nose pliers every time I have to remove old strings.

[@SIN3JASON]

I've just been straight up winding my strings up exactly like you just said that you're not supposed to do and I've been doing it for 30 years with pretty much zero problems. I do a lot of bends and stretches on the strings almost constantly so that pretty much pulls all the slack out of whatever is in the headstock.

[@hudson3535]

I agree...my Grover tuners just don't slip once the string itself settles.

[@SIN3JASON]

@@hudson3535 yeah once you start bending the strings and doing a lot of lead they usually straighten out with a couple hours of playing. And if you have a double lock tremolo with a lock nut at the top of the neck it doesn't matter how you string it up because once it's locked into place it ain't going nowhere

[@michaelweiss9219]

I have changed at least a thousand sets of guitar strings, I did try this method one time but when I went to change the strings the next time, it was a real pain to remove them. I have found all you need to do is wrap the strings around the peg a couple times, stuff it thru the hole, bend it over, tighten it up, cut off the excess, done.

[@timruth8767]

Only an ass needs to make it appear hard to do,.....Pathetic.

[@rcstl8815]

Yeah but, You don't get to brag about using a luthier's knot so nady nady. lol

[@EddieJarnowski]

If you take a rope, wrap it around a post once, it slips. Twice it still slips but not as much. 3 times it won't slip. Same goes for strings. 3 wraps underneath the hole, done. The only time i've had a string slip is when i tried one of these unecessary so called luthier knots.

[@monkeysweeperguitar]

I hate to break it to y’all, but the luthier’s knot is utterly useless. It doesn’t hold your strings in place and only serves to be a pain in the ass when you go to change the strings. The luthier’s knot is one of my BIGGEST pet peeves that people do.

[@jladams61]

"Hope it helps."? Heck yeah it helps! I've heard of the Luthiers Knot but never seen it explained and demonstrated so simply before. Thanks a bunch!

[@RoyMcKaren]

DONT do this! Worst advice EVER. It's such a pain in the butt to remove this. This is just dumb.

[@stavrospapadimitriou7631]

Completely unnecessary and a total pain when changing strings. A fuckwit solution to a problem that doesn't exist!

[@bradh.689]

You'll never have to change strings again.....until the next time! That was great!! Thanks for a really well-explained way to do this!

[@mykylc]

He was 100% right. I didn't have to change my stings until the next time.

[@hawksights]

I never change my strings until the next time! Who does that?

[@garybrockwell2031]

Yes indeed Brad your comment says just what I thought, so yeah that, and regards from LONDON 😍🇬🇧

[@JusticeAlways]

You have to change strings?😄

[@coreygilbert871]

😂😂😂

[@MyName-nx1jj]

Been playing since 1974. This is the method I learned back then, and used for decades. I found a much easier way to secure the strings about 15 years ago. The first wrap of the string goes on top. Never had a slip, and removing the strings from the post is WAY easier than the knot.

[@periurban]

Someone showed me this years ago, and I forgot all about it! I have a guitar right here I'll be stringing soon. This wee discussion will be very useful!

[@chrisbardolph]

Yep. I work as a tech and builder. Having restrung hundreds of guitars, one wrap over and the rest under is perfectly stable, no weird knots to tie, and you don’t have to mangle the string and poke your finger to get it off. I can’t tell you how many guitars are strung up in such ridiculous ways I spend half the setup time just untangling and snipping strings from the tuners.

[@nasticanasta]

indeed, but I used to get blasted by others for using this what was called the Gibson wrap in the 70's because every Gibson came with a piece of paper showing this method, but as you stated and I always say, just one wrap above the string and the rest under grips the string without slippage and is far easier to remove, I've met many famous guitarists and none of them use this...they all do it the way you described...I really can't believe I'm seeing this pushed after so many decades.

[@maxmilligan8734]

Yes when I'm playing live if a string breaks, which it seldom does, I want it to fall off quickly so I don't wrestle with a knot. When I change strings on my acoustic I take the string end to the post I want, add the distance to the next post and that's good for over 2 full rotations on the capstan, there I put a 90 degree bend in the string. Slot in the post hole wrap over the top first winding then others go under. On my Telecasters I add the distance between 2 tuning pegs. Of course on the old Tele you had to put a 90 degree bend in the string and snip off the waste to insert in the hole before wrapping the string on the tuning peg. I try to avoid knots. :)

[@347Jimmy]

Also known as the "self locking" method If you buy a set of SIT brand strings, you'll find their Stay In Tune guarantee only applies if you use this method (as per their instructions) Good to see Gibson using it too

[@SSRT_JubyDuby8742]

My dad (rip) taught me this when I was sixteen because he was sick of changing my strings, his dad taught it him at thirteen, I taught my daughter it when she was eleven. She is twenty one now doing a music degree, I am fifty six. I watched this to confirm/teach 😂 Like deployed 👍

[@siddhantpanwar95]

Wow it runs in the family

[@Woody991]

Why would this mean you change strings less? Surely it’s purpose is just to reduce the amount you have to keep tuning it?

[@ROOKTABULA]

At 5, after 2 lessons, my piano teacher told me mum "He could be a prodigy." My "dad" (I WISH he was RIP instead of yours), cancelled the lessons when hockey season started. My mum's brother gave me his acoustic at age 8. "Dad" put it in the attic. 4 years later he brought it down cuz unc was coming for a visit for a week. When he left he told my mom, 'He's a natural. Really good ear too'. "Dad" cut the strings off. I was 22 before I got a guitar in uni. You're lucky AF dad only got upset about changing your strings mate.

[@SSRT_JubyDuby8742]

@@ROOKTABULA fair play, that's just, well you know what it is and I feel for you, my old man loved the music and was to all intents and purposes a respected member of the community, he reintergrated physically and mentally disabled people back into the community after a full career teaching them prior to that. He was also lionised by every musician in our small town as the pinnacle to aspire to, he also mapped a way for that integration that was picked up and ran with by not only our council but county ( possibly country wide). When I grew up every woman within his sphere of age acted as if he was a Demi-god and he played and acted to it, when I was eleven one of them 16 years his junior took him away until I was 17 and it was me that found him. Of the 6 children that he had it was only me that remained communicating with him continuously. He was everything to everyone except the people that mattered, I held his hand as he died and told him that I truly loved him, which I did, but he was a shit to all that loved him and if he knew he did not care one jot. All dad's are dick's. 🫂❤️ Edit:- I don't discount myself in this, though I truly wish that I could, for shame 😔, does anyone ever learn🤔

[@svenjansen2134]

Not all dads are dicks dude how can you say that? My father was a great guy, and I'm trying to be as much of a good father like he was. Sorry you had these experiences but not all fathers are like that!

[@mrkim3257]

A luthier's knot was relevant for gut strings. With steel strings however, the 'capstan' shape of the tuner post forces pressure on the winding below it, making a knot completely unnecessary and unhelpful. If capstan compression alone is able to hold a ship to harbour side without slip, holding a guitar string is no challenge at all.

[@mightyhammerhead]

Not needed ... and makes string changes needlessly complicated. 🎸🎶✨️

[@GodfreyGuitar]

Well done! The camera angle was perfect, and you gave a good explanation…and it's a short video! I'm going to save this so I can show it to my students.

[@mikedaniels4638]

The knot can make changing strings very difficult and if strung properly no need.

[@Stsilascousteau]

Agreed....its a headache.

[@drjonsguitarrepair]

Amen! This is passing on ignorance at it's finest.

[@jeffreese4194]

I've never used it yet

[@christineblack4654]

dfficult really? lol ever try clippers. omg they work soooo well.

[@mattrogers1946]

Yup!

[@Guitarpicker21]

Should be called the anti-luthier’s knot- no luthier I know uses it, and it’s a very effective way to tick your luthier right off if you need to have work done on your guitars. And for anyone who says that Taylor in their camp, D’Addario is in mine. 😁

[@kyles310]

Worst tip ever. Certified luthier here, and I wish I could charge extra when people bring this crap in.

[@Dgb12651]

I bought a Martin D35 in 1987 and there was instructions included to string this way. I don't recall it being called a "luthier's knot" but I've been using the method ever since. I don't know that I have ever run into anyone else who uses it. It does work well for me, never have had an issue with slippage. Thanks for sharing.

[@josephbrosk4384]

I've been using this technique for a year or so & it works great! I never knew it was called a Luthier's Knot. I'm looking forward to dropping that term in casual conversation! 😄

[@crackerjack3359]

Good but in addition I prefer that the first wrap Goes over the top of the knot.

[@whatsthebigfndeal]

Unnecessary and irritating. The posts are tapered for a reason.

[@TheNaturalust]

BAD IDEA! Not only does this knot, not provide a single benefit but it makes it a real hassle to yank that part of a broken string off in a hurry to replace it quickly in the event of any performance you are doing with that guitar. ALSO BAD ADVICE, is to use the same 1 1/2 or 2 inch extra string to wrap around the tuner! The guitar performs better when the strings are wound close to the BOTTOM of the tuning peg and this requires ALOT more for a thin high E string than a thick low E string. It takes practice to know how much that requires for each string but it is worth it. The only trick is to finally cut the unused end with enough left on the post to bend it down towards the center of the headstock so it won't poke you and cause a finger injury during handling or tuning. Trust me on both points. These knots are just a lazy way to start the winding process, imo.

[@mercse]

How about using physics and the design of the tuner post to insure that you don't need a knot. If you notice, most new tuning posts are concave and flare out above and below the string hole. After you put the string through the hole put the first wind over the top of the string coming through the hole, then all successive winds below the string end coming through the hole. The concave part of the tuning post then cinches the string tight from the top and bottom compressing the winds against the string end and making it almost impossible to slip. Cut off the leftover string. This makes it a lot easier to change strings in the future.

[@davewinkerson8221]

Yep.

[@hudson3535]

Thank you...this is the best way. I don't care for the knot when removing them.

[@petercallaway3376]

You should post a video.

[@flamencoprof]

That's the way I learned about 60 years ago, It has done me OK all this time.

[@CathyLahn]

Absolutely correct! That's the way I've been doing my strings since the age of 13 in 1979. And I'm a "get this fucker in tune and keep it that way!" kind of detail man. I watched this video to see what sort of backwoods method was being taught. And while it might work out fine, there is no better way than what you've described here. Hopefully, most newbies will question and scroll down to read your comments! Marc ⚡

[@jimmiehall7681]

This is the way all Martin guitars are strung at the factory. It allows you to group the tasks. Use the knot to put all the strings on, then come back and tighten, then stretch each string, then tune to pitch. The stretching part is important because when you tune to pitch, it stays in pitch.

[@Mikee535]

I learned this method from my guitar teacher some 44 years ago and have since found it unnecessary and makes removing strings troublesome. Just push string thru hole 1 5/8 - 2", depending on the thickness of the string... pull it back. I do 1st wind over the top of the hole and the rest underneath. Strings do not loosen I know this because if the string loosened as much as 3/16" it would pull right through the hole.

[@skygh]

Ditto

[@stinkychickentitty]

I've been doing one over, the rest under for years as well. This "luthier's knot" seems like a great way to scratch the piss out of a headstock and be a total annoyance come removal time. I'll take this video as advice on techniques to avoid 😆

[@jsmoker10]

@@stinkychickentitty lol

[@19tractor52]

YEP---your way holds just as well, and doesn't cause problems later.

[@ioodyssey3740]

Same here. It's worked for me since 1977. 😃

[@Glicksman1]

My best advice about the Luthier's Knot after many decades of professional guitar playing and countless string changes: Don't do it:

[@lc4754]

The only thing this does it make it harder to change your strings and annoying take them off. Stupid. ZERO BENEFITS.

[@SigGuy320]

I've been using this method for years and never knew it had a name. I honestly don't even remember where I learned it, but it's a great trick and this was an excellent presentation of it.

[@2m7b5]

Same. I always see people saying it's overkill, but I don't see any reason no to do it.

[@val13c59]

Same here, being doing this technique without knowing it had a name. I always thought it was my idea. Gosh darnit.

[@tridoc99]

I learned this very early in my guitar playing 33-35 years ago. I didn’t know this had a name until now other than “the right way.”

[@PieCompanyGuitars]

People, Don't do that, unless you hate your luthier and or guitar tech.... horrible advice

[@mattrogers1946]

Yup!

[@nedmilburn]

100% agree!! I'm a luthier. Knots are unnecessary and problematic.

[@nedmilburn]

I'll be adding more videos... Been planning for a few years... kzbin.info/www/bejne/jqKagoqcbd-obc0

[@PieCompanyGuitars]

@nedmilburn truly an annoying method. Absolutely unnecessary too.

[@shumakerguitarworkssgw9505]

Here’s how.. DONT!!! One wrap over the top of the tail, the rest below, and they’ll never slip. All the knot does is make it harder to change the strings for the next guy

[@jasonw4053]

That's how I've done it for 20 years and have never had a string slip. I do know a lot of repair guys who use this knot, and Martin Guitar recommends it, so there must be something to it I suppose...but it seems to be a somewhat complicated solution, when easier methods suffice. I guess if it's the way you're comfortable, go for it.

[@baabaabaa2293]

I've gotta put me hand up mate, l restring the slot head this way, the post is thinner, but on the electrics & post tuners naa.

[@christschin3708]

The way I’ve done it for years, never had any problems. The knot looks nice, but you can put a set of strings on and get them to stay in tune, by stretching your strings and tuning. Repeat the process until they stay in tune. No slippage and easy to change.

[@bmrbca3658]

Why is it harder to change the string? Don't you cut the string at the post and unwind it off?

[@TheEpicLinkFreeman]

@@jasonw4053 Martin recommends it because a guy like this got a job there and made it Martin's word. Just because a high-end brand does it one way doesn't make it gospel. Many high-end brands do it different ways. I don't wrap my strings this way and I've never had any problems with slipping or anything, and locking tuners just makes this method completely obsolete. There's really no excuse not to use them now unless you're dead-set on not modifying the guitar for whatever reason, or if it's not using standard guitar tuners, so like a classical. You can get a set of good locking tuners for less than a pickup upgrade and if you source them properly all you need to install them is a wrench and screwdriver. If you source them improperly and get ones that don't fit all you need is a power drill and some confidence, otherwise I'm sure you can find a luthier to do it for a reasonable price.

[@StevenKHarrison]

Don't do this, it's pointless and makes it more difficult to replace a string during a show. Bad advice.

[@davewinkerson8221]

This is just a cheap trip for lazy shop people to do a quicky stringing job, at the customer's expence. Both of my Martins came like this, and I cursed them trying to remove the freakin' strings, both times. Just wrap the first wrap over the string and the other two under. Three wraps is all you need, regardless of the guage. I've been stringing guitars for over forty years, and I've had ZERO problems with this method. Why would anyone think this is a good idea? I guess you want to scratch your headstock, trying get a knotted string off the peg.

[@ryankelly5060]

I've used this method for about 15 years and found it to be precise, but I try and keep the windings to a minimum (between one and two winds), and I don't bother going above the string at all so I can just flip the end back over while there is still tension when replacing, and it doesn't stretch as much over time. People find their own ways but I would say if I was charging to restring guitars, I would want to make certain the user will have zero issues every time and this method makes certain of that. A very informative video, I'm sure a lot of people are finding it helpful.

[@BigVine-m5i]

I agree. He puts too much slack before coming back around. You don't have to put any slack into it. Just go back around and under with no slack. His peg now has too many wraps on it which can stretch and loosen. If you go without slack, there is no extra to stretch and loosen. The lock is already there even if you don't wrap extra times as he does. The extra wraps are doing nothing good.

[@mandodude148]

I learned how to do this back in 1975 from the mandolin instruction book titled “Bluegrass Mandolin”, written by Jack Tottle. I’ve been using this technique ever since. I had no idea there was a term for it. Thanks Jake!

[@StephenWhite55]

I've been a full-time repair-tech for over 40 years ('Guitar Tech' - in the SF Bay Area), and in my opinion, this video is almost - but not completely - wrong. As has been said below, this 'knot' is completely unnecessary On The Wound Strings. However, on electric guitars using very light-gauge strings (9-42 or 8-38 sets), it can be very useful to perform this process on the 1st (high E) and 2nd (B) strings, because these strings (especially an .008"-gauge 1st string!) can be flexible enough to 'creep' through the tuner-hole, even when sharply-bent correctly, during installation. A 3rd string is too stiff to 'creep' (and the wound strings have plenty of friction against their adjacent windings), so this is not necessary for those strings. Stephen White

[@jasonw4053]

Good point! I've always just put one wind over the tag, and the rest under, and never have I had a string slip...but I don't use 9s. I use 13s on acoustic and 16s on Resonators, more cables than strings.

[@vincerusso5619]

Stephen White brilliantly repaired/set-up/modded many of my guitars and basses in the early 90s… I’ll follow his advice on this topic 👍🏻

[@theguitarguy777]

The luthiers knot is my worst nightmare when repairing a guitar. Always punches a hole in my finger somehow. One wind above one wind below. That's it. String locked by two winds. Luther's knot sucks.

[@Jack-tr2ul]

I HATE IT!!! I have changed strings on guitars for literally over 1,000 times and I always hate it when someone brings me a guitar where the strings have been tied in knots. When taking them off you always get stabbed by them and the cutoff point is never clean enough. Even Martin, who employs this method has been complained to for years for doing this. (The only reason I can surmise that they use it is to make it idiot proof so that anyone can put strings on without regard for the person who has to take them off.) There are numerous factors that come into play, and if anyone is still reading, I will explain. #1, string bends weaken the metal, providing easy break points. @2, all strings are not the same. Ideally, you will want multiple wraps on the capstan of the tuner, which can be more difficult with shorter capstans. Nonetheless, when you start with the thickest string you will, naturally, be able to wrap fewer times, which is not a big deal since the string windings grip the capstan. Because of the difference in string diameter you will be able to get more wraps on the higher (thinner) strings, which adds stability. Normally, the distance between the tuners is such that you can cut off the string BEFORE inserting it at about the distance to the next tuner for low strings and about 1 and 1/2 for the higher strings, changing length as you go. The amount of string you put through the tuner should be equal to the diameter of the string. Then, when you wind the tuner there are no sharp points sticking out. There are exceptions to this general rule... When using coated strings, such as Elixirs, you will find that they tend to slip. And so you must double the amount of string-through in order to get them to grip. The other problematic one is very thin strings, like an 8 on an electric or a high G on a 12 string. These also must have extra length through the capstan to keep them from slipping. Believe me, they will recede when you tighten the string. There are other techniques to deal with thin strings on electric guitars with a Floyd Rose or classical guitars. If you are able to contact me I will be happy to help with that. I will probably not post my own video as I am in the process of opening a music store in Chattanoog, TN. Wilson - Music.

[@jasonw4053]

I just wrap one wind on top of the tag end, and the rest underneath. It "clamps" the tag end in place, just like this knot, except it's easier. I've never had an issue in 20+ years. I do know a lot of luthiers who swear by this method, so I'm sure there's something to it, but I've never seen a reason to change.

[@brin57]

Yep! I usually pull the string tight and throw 2 or 3 or 4 wraps (depending on which string) around the post before I push the through the hole and under the 1st wind. Then give the end a sharp 90 degrees up. Then it only takes a little wind to get up to pitch. Saves a lot of key turning.

[@jasonw4053]

@@brin57 I've done that, too. I always give the tag end an upwards, 90 degree tug before I clip it, too. Never once have I had an issue.

[@niznikb]

I've found this knot works for me for plain strings on a classical guitar (on the wound ones I just use "one over, the rest under" technique). The nylon strings are more slippery and with this knot it's easier to keep them in tune. I don't have an acoustic guitar, but I guess it's similar to an electric, where indeed I've never had a problem with just 2-3 turns, without any knots. As always, YMMV.

[@larry6686st]

Good Luthiers will never recommend this. Knots belongs on fishing lines not guitars

[@gqftoast]

@@larry6686st Old dogs CAN learn new tricks that work well.

[@krimsonguitar]

This style of wrap is fine for players that don't gig. If you gig, or tech for other bands, this method absolutely creates issues when removing the strings. In most cases, needle nose pliers and good lighting are needed to remove the broken part of the string that is still wound on the tuner. This can really make it difficult to quickly change out a strings. I prefer the method of wrapping the first winding above tuner hole and the rest below. This will create enough tension to keep the strings in place without wasting time trying to remove the leftover broken string.

[@mxgr194]

Right, well I gigged for decades and used the mandolin method (AKA luthier's knot). I'm afraid I simply don't agree with your objections. First, if you change your strings as often as I think you should, you will RARELY break one. Second, there's a mindlessly simple way to remove strings. Cut them and push them back through the tuner. It takes seconds. This method works fine for gigging players, as do several other methods. Use the one you like. Again, this one works and works well if you do it correctly.

[@wulf67]

I do the "one over, and the rest under" method too. Three full wraps on the wound strings, and five or six on the unwound. Unless you're playing on cat-gut strings, they ain't slipping at all! None! Once they're stretched-in, if anyone has tuning issues it's probably because they didn't put graphite in the NUT slots, or they don't know that you have to always tune UP. If you need to go down, you have to go farther down, and then come back up. I tie knots when I rock climb, not when I Rock the Casbah.

[@truculenttones]

@@mxgr194 I absolutely agree. ALSO, if you gig with a guitar strung with this method, less tuning is required!!!!

[@michaelbarrett2855]

@@truculenttones Yes, been doing this knot for 20+ years. I teach this to every guitarist who comes to my shop. Definitely the most stable for sure.

[@davewinkerson8221]

Under/over, it doesn't get any simplier. Unwind one turn, pull, and your string is off the post.

[@donhammer186]

Thanks Jake! I was taught to use this knot in the late 60's, holds great! Another thing I was taught to do while the strings were off was to check the tightness of the tuning machine nuts to make sure they weren't walking around, about ten inch pounds is good. If the machine nuts are loose it can damage the head stock by wallowing out the machine head bores and cause the instrument to loose tune.

[@newfreenayshaun6651]

Foot-pound, hand-pound, bro. 😆 this is good info too, thx!

[@christineblack4654]

what is the tuning machine nuts. lol

[@donhammer186]

@@christineblack4654 The nut is on the face of the head around the tuning post where you palace the new string thru the pin. It's very important that you don't over tighten the nut as it will damage the head. Don't tighten more than 10in"pounds ( just a little more than finger tight). Not all tuners are attached this way, some are screwed on to the back side of the head. When in doubt take the guitar to the shop.

[@jankafka7330]

Don't do it. Scores of professional guitarists say this is the second most stupid thing you can do with a guitar. Making potato salad, a la Tatyana Ryzhkova, being number one.

[@christopheraaron8299]

I'm lazy, most of my guitars I put either locking tuners or kluson split post tuners on them. I do still have to do this with my old 1971 Ovation Balladeer, though. I won't replace those tuners, they're too nice and I want to keep the guitar with it's original parts.

[@jamesgalick5278]

Waste of time and an unnecessary pain in the ass. Ive used the over/under technique for 40 years and all my guitars play and stay in tune.

[@keithteel258]

Thank you sir! I had begun to think I was the only guy alive that strung guitars this way. My teacher showed me how to do this when I was 12. I still do it at 65. He said “ this is how they do it at the factory” I guess that is now “the good ole days” Keep up the good work sir! Peace!!

[@Richard_Lush]

Great video. Been doing it with one wind at the top and rest underneath for years. Tried this today and love it. Also like the inch and a half measurement. Will do this from now on. Cheers!

[@Fausto_4841]

which factory?

[@davewinkerson8221]

Martin. I suspect they do itt save time, then the customers have to try to undo the mess. Both of my Martins came knotted, and cursed them trying get the strings off the post.

[@IconOfSin]

Was having crazy trouble locking my baritone, this is the only video that explains to add extra slack before winding, makes all the difference. Thanks brother

[@joshdavis4219]

not a fan of this knot, in a lot of cases you end up having to cut the strings off the peg which is more opportunity for error. I'm fond of the 1 over 2 under method is plenty reliable and always easy to remove. Also, instead of guessing how much slack you need pinch the string at the nut and slide it back 1 fret for your 6th string and 1 1/2 fret for 1st threw 5th and you will see even results every time.

[@0321Dave]

Absolutely 100% agree with you.

[@flintdavis2]

Well make your own video!

[@0321Dave]

@@flintdavis2 🤣

[@ronraby4561]

Man sais 1 and 1l2 inches problem solved.

[@bajerovaquero]

Been repairing string instruments for 12 years. Luthiers knot is about 85% BS Very useful on nylon guitars. On electrics is a waste of time and makes harder to remove the strings.

[@wafdaddyrocks7028]

this way sucks when you try to remove them. i absolutely hate it when I have to deal with this. it's stupid and unnecessary. your chances of scratching he headstock is far greater than benefits of this way. in short ignore this foolishness.

[@conniefletcher6884]

I’ve seen a few explanations for the luthier’s knot, but this one makes the most sense!

[@BanjoBen]

Thank you, Connie! We aim to please!

[@bflo5210]

I agree! Now I'm excited for my strings to go bad so I can change them!

[@kenanpalangic7539]

AND it's not a 30 minute introductory video but straight to the point how-it's-done.

[@dudebro7698]

You mean “The rabbit goes around the tree, then under the sideways tree, then back up around the second tree, then the rabbit runs off. Then the first tree starts spinning around and the second tree gets like stuck under itself and gets pulled into the first tree. Or something.” wasn’t a clear and concise explanation?

[@bflo5210]

@@dudebro7698 🤣🤣🤣

[@Sl1mfit]

I've always done it like this. Tip for the right amount of slack is to use 1st and 2nd fret. Pull the string tight, grab the string at the 1st fret and pull it back to the 2nd fret and that's your slack. Then do the knot.

[@ryanpullin]

That’s smart. I always tried to use the distance of the tuning pegs as my measurement adjustments, but that’s way more consistent and easier than guesstimating on the D and G on 3x3s or the B and E on in-lines. I’m definitely trying this next string change.

[@ryans9029]

1.5 frets thickest 2 strings.. 2 full frets on the rest.

[@Will-wp2cp]

Cool video, but there's a much easier way and you'll never get pricked by the sharp end of the string poking out after you've tuned up! Just let the first wind around pass under the hole as you tighten each string (and each successive pass should go under the previous one), and make sure you leave enough slack to make 3-4 passes (except for the thicker strings, where you can get away with 2-3). That puts enough upward pressure on the part of the string that's going through the hole so that it will not come out. Finish tuning the string to whatever note it's designed for (EADGBE), and twist the end of the string back and forth until it snaps off clean. No cutter needed, no sharp end sticking out, and no goofy-looking loops made out of the extra string! Problem solved; no Luthier's knot needed. This works for the mandolin as well, and I am sure it would work for the banjo, although I don't have one and so I've never tried it.

[@TypewriterJustice]

literally came to the comments to mention exactly this. i've been breaking off strings at the post (after three wraps) for about thirty years now, and never once have i had a string slip or come undone. it's faster, safer, and easier.

[@Will-wp2cp]

@@TypewriterJustice Haha exactly!

[@lunacatfish]

Hi, your technique seems simple, would it also work for violin and ukulele strings? For bass? Thanks.

[@TypewriterJustice]

@@lunacatfish it pretty much just works for bare metal strings or wound strings with a metal core, so it that rules out nylon/gut strings and most flat-wound strings for classical instruments(which often have gut/fiber cores) - i tried it on an electric bass once to no avail, never even bothered to attempt it on my upright

[@Will-wp2cp]

@@lunacatfish I don't have much knowledge on those instruments, so I would consider what @TypewriterJustice said in Reply to you, whatever of it applies to your situation. Sorry!

[@DaleLSeth]

This is a lousy thing to do to yourself, as you'll realize upon your next string change. Fuck the luthiers knot...lithiers NOT. LOL

[@nasticanasta]

this is *NOT* the best way, as a professional musician, I remember getting blasted for doing this when I started playing in the 70's as a teen, this is the way Gibson showed you in a brochure when you bought a new Gibson, i think they still do. But it's bulky, you do not need to fold it over. Just run it under, then start tightened you just need one wrap above and the rest underneath, that perfectly hold it in place. check any pro's guitar, go check Allan Holdsworth putting strings on his Charvel in the IOU in Japan video....no pro uses this what everyone used to call the Gibson wrap. Again this is bulky and unneeded

[@MegaGuitarpicker]

As a guitar builder/player, I used to do this but removing strings after was very aggravating. Decided to use locking tuners and haven’t looked back since!

[@silverfr3ak]

locking tuners are life quality of life!

[@petemoore8923]

I’ve seen a lot of people complain about removing this knot. I don’t understand why. I have it down to a science.

[@jibicusmaximus4827]

@@petemoore8923 only just seen it but yeah, that would be easy to me already! lol.

[@jibicusmaximus4827]

@@silverfr3ak i ain't that fussy, western music is out of tune with the harmonic series any way and all good music has micro tonal quirks that give it soul, its possible to be too in tune, just like how it's possible to be too in time.. to play with these things sometimes is what makes it human and gives it swag, though, also, yeah, tuning sucks, mine stay in cus i bend up to 5 frets and use compound bends and stuff, i play hard in some styles too and guess got lot of vibratos going on in my hand.. interesting subject, like how van hallen dropped his b string so he could play A major bar shapes and the third would be purer / more in tune against that one note, same on my lap slide guitar, the B string is always flat because it's an open G chord, , if you tweak every note in a chord, you can make it pure, but if you change chord you end up, needing, many, sharper and flatter versions of each note, madness lol, hence we have 12TET.

[@oldguitarguy7528]

I thought we ALL did that? I use the knot on my acoustics but locking nut is way to go.

[@GYMROUSE1]

I am older than dirt and have been playing since the sixties. In all that time, I never knew how to properly start a new string installation. Thank you very much!

[@clipsfromfilms]

Interesting to see how many variations there are for "luthiers knots". I have actually been using this version of luthiers knot for the past couple of decades, since learning it from a guitar maintenance book, and it has pretty much eliminated all potential tuning issues. Possibly more time consuming than other "string wrapping" methods, but in my experience, it is well worth the extra time for the tuning stability. Excellent demonstration Ben!

[@J.C...]

Variations? Those would be different knots. There's only one way to do that knot and that's how it was shown.

[@highsocietysongchannel]

I have been using the Luthier's Knot for decades and find it quite easy. One thing I was taught is to go just once around the peg. Phil Tafoya, who taught me, was very specific about this.

[@gogi2883]

Metal can strip lol

[@gogi2883]

Only if is lossen too much

[@DavidRavenMoon]

No luthier does this. We curse at people who tie knots in the strings! Just stop! There’s zero reason to do this. Stick the string straight through and get about 3 wraps for the low strings and 4-5 for the treble strings. Then stretch your strings to tighten the wraps. I’ve been building and repairing guitars for 45 years.

[@wejax12]

Absolutely unnecessary to do this. I don't know what he's doing wrong but not once in over 30 years has a simple wind slackened up or unwound. Waste of time.

[@kukamunga7336]

This is by far the best video on how to do this on youtube. No one else zooms in with the good camera angles to show exactly what they're doing like this video does. Great job.

[@danstune]

I have been playing the guitar for 59 years and I have always wanted to be able to do this. Thank you for being so clear!

[@dyers1210]

seriously? 59 years and you didnt even do it once by accident?

[@271ossi]

This is "my special" method . I "developed" this 35 years ago. :-)

[@ragnaringibergsson562]

Same here. Been changing guitar strings for 40 years but didn't know about this knot.

[@martynsnan]

Same here at 65 years. I knew there was a method but everyone I asked had different ideas.

[@jsmoker10]

@@dyers1210 lol

[@TheMasonator777]

I wrap all the winds progressively down over the “tail” and the last wind under it, on the G, B, and high E. On the E, A, and D, I wrap one wind over the tail and the rest under. Works great on guitars with tremolos. It’s a modification of something I was taught when I worked for a guitar building shop.

[@ronraby4561]

Please post a video thanks for info like this

[@jamessv5020]

Was about to suggest if you could post of video, but that's already done... so... please?

[@sundaynightdrunk]

Can't really picture that from the description.

[@BluesInSeattle]

Being a luthier myself and a player of the guitar for 45 years, I shed a tear anytime someone brings me a guitar that's been strung this way. This is not a luthier's knot. This causes damage to pegs when having to remove the string and provides no benefit to the player. It's unnecessary and you don't see guitars strung this way from the factory. Don't do it.

[@augmented2nd666]

I cant stand when people do this, it can make removing strings from a new "used" guitar really annoying. How to properly put on a string Put it through the hole, give it about 3 inches of slack, hold string against the headstock, turn the tuning peg until its tuned up. Thats it, thats all you do and it will hold no problem. There is no knot tying involved, ever. This is soooooo wrong.

[@fadeskywards1245]

I like how short, simple and clear this was. Thank you!

[@BAgodmode]

Every time I use this technique there is so much slip it’s ridiculous. When I stick to the good ol’ “give one and a half or two around the peg” technique, I get minimal slip and it’s ready for play and stable in minutes.

[@NytronX]

You're doing it wrong.

[@christineblack4654]

good ol technique baddly explained lol

[@MalDagg]

I have been playing guitar since I was 15 [first guitar], I'm now 70 and still playing professionally. I have never used that knot and I've never had a problem. Keep it simple [Kiss].

[@moskitoh2651]

There is much to much winding on the post, which will make your guitar not stay in tune in the beginning. I started like this 30 years ago, but today, I once fiddle the string back through the loop, but pay attention, I do not have one full loop around the post when tuning. After restringing, bending and tuning once, intonation is stable. The overall time for changing strings and tuning is much shorter...

[@CA10Z]

Imagine, all this exposer to a true and useful technic. Void of all the hype of useless locking tuners. Thank you

[@DavidBolek]

.. ... And that can kinda work sometimes..." - Works 100% of the time for me, for the last 12 years. This can also make a lot of people play old rusty strings rather than lose nerves trying to unknot and restring. Fresh strings are important, it doesn't only apply in studio enviroment.

[@justinrayguitars6024]

When someone brings a guitar into the shop that's tied like that the price just went up!

[@Stsilascousteau]

Agreed.

[@algio3041]

It that I put strings on that way, but I have to ask, why? Does it create problems?

[@LayerDan]

Guy at the only shop I trust does my strings the same way. Are you incompetent? Or just lazy?

[@justinrayguitars6024]

@@LayerDan putting strings on like that serves no purpose. Neither does calling people names.

[@glennhynes5263]

​​​@@justinrayguitars6024putting strings on that way ensures no slippage, and calling people names for overcharging based on doing something properly ensures that they know that they are being quite jerkish.

[@tannertuner]

I’ve been restringing my own guitars for 40 years. My technique is to make sure I have 2 1/2 to 3 turns. For most 3+3 headstocks this means measuring to the next tuner post and cutting it off there. For inline 6 it’s just past the next or about half way to the 2nd. I start the first wrap above the becket and the rest below, just to keep the coil from bottoming out. Have never had slipping or tuning issues. I’ve been changing strings on pianos and even harpsichords for nearly 40 years. Some harpsichords don’t even have holes drilled in the pins. If piano makers tied their strings on you’d never been able to get them off the pin. You *may* need to do this for nylon, but with steel strings it is completely unnecessary.

[@christineblack4654]

but still good.

[@donnareedfan]

You don’t bend strings much if that method works. They don’t bend piano strings.

[@fretbuzz59]

@Sinned Gnillubnot Haha! Fantastic. I agree. Tying is unnecessary, especially on wound strings--which he uses for his demo! As long as there's a good kink where the string enters and exits the peg, and a couple of winds around, there'll be no problem.

[@geraldhickey4217]

I agree with tannertuner! I have been playing guitar for 50 years. I have also been a piano tech for about the same amount of time. I just changed my high e string to test luthier knot. Didn’t notice any real difference, and yes, I bend a lot of strings playing straight ahead blues! The key is a good tight becket(piano tech term for the bend at the hole), and 2( for wound) and 3(for plain steel) tight coils. Most guitar players do a sloppy restring, so I suppose the luthier knot will help in that case.

[@garfield8900]

Totally unnecessary, next to impossible to get off when changing strings…

[@scottsweet501]

Luthier of many years, and I refer to this as the dumbass wrap. I charge extra to deal with this crap. For the most part, the posts are convex so that when wrapped properly without this moronic solution, they cinch up like a capstan on a sailing vessel. Just put enough wraps and you’ll have more stable tuning after stretching your new strings properly.

[@njv1805]

Just watched a video on things techs hate that customers do. This was number one.....

[@bradsmith7311]

As a tech for 45 years,I can concur. No benefits, only hassles

[@donturnock5176]

@@bradsmith7311 Obviously not a very good tech.....

[@bradsmith7311]

@donturnock5176 of course you can back that up right?.cause you in your infinite wisdom and Supreme over-arcing judgement can just see through the web and brush aside thousands of guitars and hundreds upon hundreds of satisfied customers to make this on high proclamation. Take a pass Don next time it occurs to you to chime in something you know so very little of.post script: I will never waste my time or anyone else's tying instrument strings into birds nests in a futile attempt to skip the critical steps of properly installing strings.and every time another guitar shows up with that mess I will curse the rubes who believe in f@#$ing the next guy with their inability to reason themselves out of someone else's delusios.

[@mrboxcar100]

Totally unnecessary and it makes it harder to get off when the time comes. Strings just don't slip out from around the post and the post certainly doesn't turn backwards from the tension. Guitars go out of tune for other reasons such as temperature and humidity. And strings sometimes go sharp! This isn't explained here. A colder temp will make a string go sharp. Also, strings get stretched in places along their length. That is normal wear. I did this knot for a few years but I went back to just pulling the strings through the tuner post and making tree or so winds around the post. Easier to put on and take off.

[@RiddleKingOnline]

I love the knot, never looked back. However I do the tension tight so there's max one wind. That way theres no string binding against itself on the post which is the main cause of tuning instability. Looks clean too. The trick is experimenting with your individual guitar on where to position the hole for each string. I use the 54432 (o'clock) method on my strat.

[@williamj.sheehan2001]

Hi Rich, I suppose one reason to have several "windings" going down the post would be to increase the "break angle" of the string (from nut to post) a little bit, to the extent that is important.

[@PristineTX]

If you are a touring guitarist or guitar tech, and you want to be asked to leave the tour, use a knot.

[@mountainmanjim]

That did help . It posphones buying locking tuners . Thanks

[@bluarcher5941]

I played for a living for many years and never dealt with using a knot when changing strings; it made things much easier when removing them and changing again, which I did at least once a week. The key is giving the strings a very good stretching after the new ones are put on. (this was on a 73 LP with non-locking machine heads). Again, the real key is in the stretching...my opinion.

[@tacoconch7678]

I agree. Stretching the strings and a properly cut nut will keep your guitar in tune. I think the knot is useless.

[@antonwilding9744]

yep stretching and also tuning the guitar in playing position is most important

[@flyinsossers]

I have been playing since since the Jurassic and Cretaceous Era. Before I learned the Luthiers knot I was homeless and lived with a pack of wolves. I enjoy the ease with which they can be removed and the removal of slippage which is the sole source of tuning issues.

[@mattrogers1946]

Satire....😂

[@millsbobster]

i've been playing guitar for 60 years, 40 of that semi-pro (~1500 gigs), and none of the bad things mentioned if you don't do this have ever happened to me. in addition, this method is a nightmare if you're playing solo and break a string. if you just run the string through with the post hole at 90° instead of straight, you put a kink that holds the string just fine, but releases easily if you need to change strings. it never slips, that's a bogus belief.

[@mattriley3550]

This.

[@james9789]

Is right

[@jaezryl]

It does, specially slippery Elixir's.

[@millsbobster]

@@jaezryl i've used Elixirs on guitars occasionally, but always on my Swedish cittern. they never slip.

[@jaezryl]

@@millsbobster I have never believed it till it happened to me. The E string keeps getting detuned. When I investigated, it turns out the wrap slips up. So I did this and the problem went away.

[@1000-r3g]

I just run all strings through the hole, kink them in the opposite direction i want to wind them up and am all set. No knots, no going/under over something, no winding patterns, no hassle, nohing. Just run through hole, kink in the opposite direction and go. What am i missing?

[@timhofstetter5654]

Funny. I've been plain-winding all my guitar and mandolin and banjo strings for some fifty years, and I've never yet seen any sign of slippage.

[@glennweiser7465]

I coil the string several times around the post before threading the eye with the string at the top of the coil. That knot technique makes removing the string difficult. It's better suited for nylon strings than steel IMO.

[@christineblack4654]

ever heard of clippers. lol

[@GuMpAkC]

This was a phenomenal how-to. I started playing guitar about a month ago and the stock high e snapped while a friend and I were doing a "pinch harmonic squeal-off" and like a knuckle-head I snapped the string bringing it up too high. I was having such a difficult time trying to re-string the guitar until I watched your video a few times and I nailed it. Thank you so much! This is something I'll definitely be using for the rest of my life.

[@highsocietysongchannel]

Thank you so much Ben for sharing this trick. I once knew a luthier in Seattle named Phil Tafoya who taught me this trick. This was back when we didn't have those little clip on tuners, so tuning was an even bigger deal than now. I was playing 5-7 nights a week in those days an breaking strings fairly regularly. Also, I was (and still am) a big fan of the two-fret bend. Needless to say, the Tafoya knot, as I call it, was a game changer. One more thing. Phil was specific about going just once around the peg if possible. The more you wrap, the more they stretch. I find that once around works great. What's funny is whenever I show this trick to others, they think I'm nuts. They are correct, but it's not because of this knot.

[@talltale9760]

Is this just a technique that been carried over from a period when strings/tuners potentially weren’t as good? I have never used any form of knot or over/under winding and I’ve never had any issues.

[@pglavalle]

Instead of figuring out an inch or so, just pull the string through fully, then at the nut grab the string and pull back to the first fret. Each and every time you will get a perfect wind ...

[@rontarrant]

I've been a guitar player for 53 years and even made a living at it for a couple... I've never seen that. So much simpler than the way I was taught.

[@daveepelone6221]

Same here, 50+ years. This is a revelation. Should be the first thing taught to all new players in Guitar 101

[@Tonedog88]

I've been using the old bend n' spin method for over 50 years with no problems with any aspect of my playing. This was a far more complex method, and I see no need to change the way I've been doing it for nearly half a century.

[@dirkgibbens377]

Same for me… 42 years 👍👍

[@oldjoec3710]

Banjo Ben - I used this technique for years and I abandoned it as a bad job. Too many times, I tore bloody holes in my fingers trying to undo that "kink", particularly on the stiff B string (0.018 medium gauge). Same technique without the reverse bend holds very well and is far safer for the poor schnook (usually me) who has to take those strings off in a few weeks.

[@JonNewquist]

I hear you! I've been using the "Martin" knot for almost 40 years. As my eyes got worse, I discovered a solution. I leave 3/8ths inch of the string tag instead of clipping right next to the post. It's much easier to free the bend without donating/sacrificing blood.

[@CDRaff]

Why not unwrap the knot from the other side? If you are using an acoustic loosen the string and remove the peg in the bridge then unwrap it from the long end. With an electric you cut the string and again unwrap it from the other end.

[@JonNewquist]

@@CDRaff that doesn't help, especially with the B string. It's folded over like a tight u-turn, and the string is rigid. There's barely enough string to grab, and usually ends up stabbing your finger tip. That's why I cut them off to a 3/8ths length after winding, so I can grab it with needle nose pliers. Even with that, you have to be careful to avoid scraping the tool, or the string end, against the peghead. This knot prevents the string slipping either direction. You can't push it through with the long end until the fold is released.

[@CDRaff]

@@JonNewquist I have been doing this well over 20 years, no it doesn't.

[@JonNewquist]

@@CDRaff I've been doing it for forty. Maybe your eyes are better than mine, maybe your pinch strength is stronger than mine. 😁

[@bappi223]

Wish I could watch this video before installing strings on my guitar. I wouldn’t have to waste a full set of string only because of wrong knots

[@tswrench]

3 out of 4 luthiers/techs that I know do knot favor this method. with the consensus being that all it accomplishes is to make the string harder to remove. clean windings with sufficient coils is their preference .

[@johnpruett6980]

Great explanation. Slight improvement would be less slack and fewer winds around the tuner post. Less slippage during the first tuning after the string change. I try to get 1 1/2 winds around, 3 or 4 is too many.

[@TheMyguitarisblue]

Is less wraps better than more? I always assumed more wraps meant more grip and more stable tuning

[@johnpruett6980]

​@@TheMyguitarisblue You are right that extra wraps do actually allow the string more chances to catch on itself, but that doesn't make it more stable. The problem is that those "catch" points very often slip as you increase string tension when tuning. If you hear occasional popping noises and a sudden pitch drop when tightening a string, that is usually the extra winds slipping through and consequentially the string looses a small amount of tension. Doesn't happen with minimal winds. It's nit-picky for sure but it works better. :)

[@StopPanakinAnakin]

NO! STOP THIS!

[@XRP-fb9xh]

Been doing this for 31 years. Worked perfect every time.

[@MrBullethead63]

The “Luthier’s Knot” is stupid.

[@wxb200]

"You will never have to change strings again. Until the next time (you have to change strings again)"

[@derbyd10]

Nope, I’ll pass on the knot. I never wrap a string over itself. First wrap is over and the rest are under and it locks itself. There are no wraps over itself and no knots.