Terminating The Terminator (Part 2) - Val Verde After Hours

[@MitchellHammond]

The thing for me when it comes to the Cameron films, and especially with T2 being his last, is that they contain genuinely distressing and disturbing scenes along with great, raw acting talent. Just think of everything that occurs at Pescadero State Hospital from Sarah's interrogation tape to her breaking out of her cell, all very intense imagery, sound, music, atmosphere - and this is before any Terminator arrives. Both films carry a lot of real dramatic weight. I think people get hung up on the lore and timeline inconsistencies but from an artistic edge they show a director and his cast/crew on their A game making a real piece of work. Unfortunately every film after just doesn't have any of this, even if one were to find any of them decent they're just derivative of their contemporaries and will forever be shroulded in the shadow of the originals.

[@postercereal3654]

Enjoying these casual chats.

[@tph2010]

@11:20 Thank you, Duncan. Nothing lazier than a sequel that ignores other sequels.

[@SparkyNarwhal]

This is awesome. Should do this more! It could be a more frequent version of RLM's ReView!

[@boing615]

I was born in the early 70's and I'm frequently bamboozled by the fact that films which I consider to be 'modern' like Alien/Blade Runner are now 40 years old. During the 70's a 40 year old film would have been made in the 30's, Frankenstein was as far away from me as a kid as Alien is from me now as an adult and yet those old movies felt SO far away from me as a kid whilst 70's sci-fi still feels so close and relevant. Cinema from the 40's to the 70's changed so much in its acting, directing, choices of story and cinematography not to mention technological advancements that everything pre 70's feels old, some of it still amazing but notably old and amazing whilst post 70's stuff still feels new. That's why people from my generation wern't digging up old franchises to reboot and extend like they are now because there was no appetite to go back and watch something that felt old and from a different generation. Today though you have half a century of cinema that feels modern and there's an obvious appetite to revisit and extend those stories because they feel like they still belong to this generation and as long as there's an appetite there's a market and those films will continue to be made to tap into it.

[@davidjames579]

I had an interesting conversation about this with someone on Georg Rockall-Schmidt's channel. 'The change' seemed to happen in the 60's. Most noticeably in acting that went away from a more Showbizzy Stage Acting style to something more like how people are. John Wayne's Westerns even late ones like True Grit (1968) and The Shootist (1976) are in the former style, but a Clint Eastwood Western generally isn't. You can even see the change in individual directors. Kubrick's films up to Doctor Strangelove are in that older style, but from 2001: A Space Odyssey (filmed only 3 years after Dr S) are modern in acting, dialogue, and editing.

[@MegaJetty1]

Terminator 1 was a closed-loop story because the studio pressured Cameron to cut scenes that were about trying to change time. If you see the Terminator 1 deleted scenes, you'll see a scene where Sarah and Kyle Reese are planning to destroy Cyberdyne but the Terminator chase hindered this. T2 was about resolving this. Cameron never intended a closed loop.

[@vladmomot5058]

Hey, honestly, this gave me the biggest kick of all the content so far - and all of it is pretty good. Make more!

[@ValVerdeBroadcasting]

We're really happy about how this has gone down, more will follow! -R

[@vladmomot5058]

@@ValVerdeBroadcasting Oh yeah, that'd be awesome. Of course I think that the speciality of such content is only highlighted when it's delivered in doses in between the actual episodes of main shows You're producing, so yeah, it's only going to make it all more sweet when delivered in right doses at right times!

[@Draliseth]

This is really fun guys. Would not mind if you guys did more "unstructured" videos like this. I just noticed that there's a RoboCop poster next to The Terminator poster. 😊

[@louisburke8927]

I luv Robocop

[@Draliseth]

@@louisburke8927 RoboCop is the shit.

[@Aeon2Flux]

Duncan's "Fierce" Pierce Brosnan is so hilarious...

[@stitcha123]

I'll pay to see any of the following films/tv shows over another toilet Terminator film release: 'Silberman' 'Sarah Connor: How A Waitress Got Her Groove Back.' (Sponsored by Honda Elite Scooters) 'Big Buns. What Went Wrong?' 'Pepsi Asian' 'T-800: The Puberty Years' 'Miles Bennet Dyson: How My Vacuum Cleaner Sucked Up Three Billion Human Lives' 'Rat Cooking with Kyle Reece' 'The Killing of Punks 123' 'Hal n Ed, Back on Patrol' (Ramps permitting) 'Pops: How I spent my lunch breaks'

[@spandexraygun5325]

I agree lads...lest we not forget The Sarah Connor Chronicles TV series. It's a dead horse for me and I remember I was 12 when T2 came out. I sneaked into The Showcase to see it with my older brother. I had a T800 t shirt from C&A. I was there I remember the hype. I also at that age remember being aware that this was the bug budget kid friendly Terminator sort of despite the f bombs and violence. Switching it and making Arnie the hero. It is the typical sequel, more of the same but bigger, louder, more fun. I remember wanting the third one to be about the future war, as a kid wanting it to be a trilogy. And JC saying that elements of the T2 3-D ride in florida forming the basis of a third film that never came to fruition. I always felt the third one shouldve been the future war, or, and I say 'or' lower case with a Whisper, the third to go back to being a smaller urban sci film horror like the first one again with the Lance Henrikson type Terminator. You can't go any bigger than T2 so why try topping it? Strip it back to its roots, at least we could've had a trilogy we didn't need, to be proud of!

[@TechnicolourTV]

To Live and Die for Val Verde...

[@Thewingkongexchange]

"I just imagined being spoon-fed a cold shit" - Richard Jackson

[@JHallenbeck]

Nice to see Richard cracking into the Woodford Reserve there.

[@runningsuperska]

Good Toolstation ad dunc!

[@1dbanner]

22:52 Richard, I was drinking a bit myself watching this, and the way you pointed at the camera had me almost expecting you to tell me to screw off 😄

[@Thewingkongexchange]

Apparently 'Highlander III' ignores the second film and follows the first one, but I'll let you guys investigate that....

[@hypnocilicdreams]

This was great

[@louisburke8927]

"Spoon fed a cold shit" :D

[@TheCosmicFireStar]

Other examples of retcon/soft reboot include how Halloween H20 ignore Halloween 4, 5 and 6. Then how Highlander 2 the Quickening was ignored by Highlander 3.

[@GamerGuysReviews]

Terminator has become one of those franchises running on fumes at this point. You don't have to recycle the Connors, Judgment Day, Arnie, and plot devices that have been done to death. Someone else mentioned this in the comments, but I think it's possible to go back to basics and produce a low-budget, grimy B-movie Terminator film where the Terminator actually feels like a scary threat rather than a nuisance.

[@4Everlast]

They got the same problem like folks behind the Matrix (aparently both were written by a lady called Sofia, and both movies were merged into a book series and the film franchises are derivatives of the book, it is curious there's a black lady called the oracle who looks a lot like Sofia) as they didn't start the series from obscure characters who only hurd the legends of their savior John Connor, but they went with the legend him self on the first go so now anything else seams less important, same goes for the Star Wars universe, and on some levels Predator and Alien.

[@URBONED]

I agree with Duncan on this lazy attitude of ignoring sequels for your 'quintessential sequel'. There's so many things about this I really don't like, but the biggest for me is that the director/filmmakers are essentially saying, "All those sequels suck, and we are going to make a great one - too bad if you liked any of the others, because we're telling you they suck and you'll thank us once you see our film." I bloody love Alien 3 (specifically the workprint cut), and think it is one of the best and one of the last big epic sci-fi films that came out of the 90s. So I'm glad Blomkamp's sequel never came to fruition because based on the concept art alone it would have been another duplicate of his past 3 films with Aliens characters pasted in it (big evil corporation want alien technology and the good guys have said technology and use it to defeat the bad guys. Literally all of his films are this, which is why I'm more interested in seeing him do a Robocop film because that suits that franchise far more.) But back to my point, look at Terminator Genisys; it's like look at our superior sequel.. oh damn it actually sucked.... guess we'll try again until we make one that works *five sequels later, still trying.

[@davidjames579]

Apparently Cameron's now helping Blomkamp get his Alien 3 made. So he's doing both Robocop and Alien sequels that ret-con.

[@URBONED]

@@davidjames579 ugh. And after the failure of Alien Covenant I can see the possibility of it being made still on the table. Never the less, could be years off with Robocop well under way.

[@davidjames579]

@@URBONED Ridley previously torpedoed it as he wanted the focus (and money) to be on his ill-conceived prequel series (two more films to go!). After Covenant under-performing, and Cameron stepping in to ensure Blomkamp gets his film made, this seems to be the next step. Given Cameron's influence at Fox, and him making 4 back-to-back Avatars with them, I think he has the pull to make it so.

[@bronzewand]

If it was up to me I'd go back to the roots of the series and make a lower budget horror film. Maybe go back to the original concept of having a Lance Henriksen type Terminator who blends into the crowd. Anything apart from another story about the Connors and Arnold's Terminator, there are hundreds of other stories that could be told in the Terminator universe.

[@turtleflipper9935]

10:22 at this point i half expected richard to say fuck you to camera like an angry drunk of the back of the slurreyness of fucking internet if it wasn't for the picture of his mom I would have an explanation of how the time travel worked

[@colinthedogfromspaced9365]

I'm drunk but I think I really enjoyed this.

[@casbyness]

Duncan's nightmare: It's a sequel to Terminator 3, ignores Terminator 2, takes scenes 6-11 from the original and Act 2 from Salvation but plays out as if Lance Henrickson's character was Sarah Connor, Ellen Ripley shot Miles Dyson and Genisys was built by Christian Bale's mum who's actually a T-1000 who first did have a human heart but then because of a time vortex became a T-600 with the rubber skin of five dogs stapled together to resemble a horse that's referred to by the chairs in Skynet HQ as 'T-0.01'.

[@casbyness]

Oh, and Arnie is in the movie but plays a new character named Dutch Matrix. He's Welsh.

[@shockz16]

You know what makes me laugh about the Termintor timeline? The fact everytime Skynet sends a Terminator back and fail they essentially are making John a better resistance leader as they are giving him more future information and a head start of knowing all the weaknesses of each improved Terminator model every time he beats one in present day. By the time Termintor 3 plays out future John Connor should be winning that war on like day 1 lol.

[@leonvansteensel5300]

13:05 You are likely thinking of the Jurassic Park / Jurassic World reboot...

[@Frellyouall]

When will Richard take his Christmas decorations down? :D

[@1dbanner]

Hopefully, more mentions of Arnold's maid "furtively peeing on a stick in Maria Schriver's bathroom"

[@misspiggys_cousin]

did you watch the 47 minute interview with Tim miller and James? where they talk about this and mention they have mapped out a total of 3 MOVIES. so we could get 2 more after this...

[@McSuperfly101]

The thing is, _every_ movie after T2 was supposed to set up a new continuity and each time they failed the _next_ film would basically reboot the franchise again with a whole new cast (except for Arnie). In all likelihood Dark Fate with flop and we'll get yet _another_ attempt at jumpstarting this franchise in 5 or 6 years.

[@j-asher]

Skynet only had time to send two Terminators back before the resistance broke in, it sent two back to different times to better it's chances. Reese is only briefed for his mission alone. After he's sent, the resistance re-programme a T-800 to intercept the T-1000. The closed loop still works (And the movies work better as a whole because of this) even with T2, because even with Dyson's death, and the destruction the Cyberdyne office, someone else could've been backing up/stealing his files, since they already covered up finding the remains of the 1st T-800, they're no stranger to shady business practices. Plus like Reese says, a lot of information was lost after the war, so any info regarding dates or names Skynet knows shouldn't be taken as 100% fact. As such, nothing they actually do negates Judgement Day from happening, and the fact that John's "No Fate" message feels like a contradiction, he knew it would actually be the drive force Sarah needed to survive and raise him up to be the leader the future needed.

[@walter_the_wobot2349]

Sorry Duncan, but i'm fully onboard for these seboots. Robocop, Terminator, whatever... I have zero hope that the new T3 will be any good, but I would prefer this than a sequel to Genesis. I'd also like a sequel to Batman Returns with Tim Burton and Michael Keaton that ignores Batman Forever and Batman&Robin

[@led926]

This is going to be fun

[@stephenkissane4268]

Never thought I would say it but the terminator, jurassic Park, star wars, star trek, Alien prequels and Ghostbusters need to end

[@vendettaukiain]

do you guys know about the Alien: The Play put on by an american high school recently?

[@hanshotfurst]

Instead of Terminator: Dark Fate it should be called Terminator: Mulligan.

[@lancelindqvist8848]

Do u guys prefer the original cut or extended cut of t2? Personally haven seen the original cut in 15 years

[@saxbend]

Skynet would have sent both terminators to 1984. It would have given the best chance of success. That's the ONE thing Genisys got right. It's just a shame that Genisys didn't stay in 1984, and also didn't explain why the T-800 from T2 ended up in the 70s in Genisys.

[@josephcooper8754]

I think the response to last year's Halloween trumps your "French Connection V" argument. Maybe it is "problematic" to the average person when sequels completely ignore other films in their franchises, but maybe movie-goers are more tuned-in to all of this than you give them credit for. If people are okay with the reboot idea and understand that Adam West, Michael Keaton, Christian Bale etc are all playing separate characters in their own universes, then there's no reason why franchise films ignoring other entries can't also work for audiences.

[@filmandpage1138]

I don't think there is much more you can do with the Terminator now. The only place they could go is the future war. They tried that with salvation, and screwed it up. I just think the whole concept is dead.

[@davidjames579]

I personally don't mind them flipping continuities like this. If it frees up the writer to ignore bad previous decisions, and do exactly what they think is best then why not? It's kind of an Elseworld thing to do. And much better than a sequel to Jenny's Sis. If you want the king of continuity shuffles just look at Fox's X-Men movie series. Aside from time travel making the events of everything before Days Of Future Past irrelevant (to the point that Dark Phoenix is remaking that story from X Men 3), you've also got things like Caliban being German and Richard O'Brian like in Apocalypse and then being a bald Stephen Merchant complete with his West Country accent in the very next film! I'm cautiously hopeful for Dark Fate. I just keep thinking it's James Cameron's Terminator 3, and Linda Hamilton's in it, so....... Buy are they really doing that Sergeant Candy/Charles Weyland Bishop thing, with the T-800 being based off a real person? Shit! Yeah Arnie is exactly what an AI would design. You'd never find a human like him. Also, well done on After Hours, very off-the-cuff, with some first class drinking. Although Richard never did finish that story about his friend's Mum having a poster of Terminator 2 on her wall.

[@jamstonjulian6947]

Dalton impression please.

[@Sam_Montgomery]

18:55 sure it was. . .if it was opposite day.

[@KibaRanger_Kou]

The second I heard that Arnold was getting dusted off as another fucking T-800 I immediately stopped giving a shit. These writers have got to be taking the piss now.

[@YggdrasilMedia]

Terminator: Phoenix Annihilation You're welcome, Skydance.

[@specknacken6507]

7:47 is this a reference to something or are they just joking around? xD

[@neilhutchinson4545]

The lads are just referencing (taking the piss about) Dante's Peak because it features Linda Hamilton, and Pierce Brosnan was her co-star.

[@specknacken6507]

@@neilhutchinson4545 But was that "Volcalno there! Linda there!" from an interview or were they just "memeing" around? It sounded like Duncan was imitating the director of that movie or something that's why i'm asking xD

[@neilhutchinson4545]

@@specknacken6507 I'm not sure what they were riffing on really, as I have next to no knowledge of the film and it's production. Hopefully Richard/Duncan will reply to you🤞

[@chumpey]

Mate...no grand references going on here. It’s just improve darling.

[@1bottlejackdaniels]

WTF??! ...upcoming livestream in 1 hour ...and the first comments are 5 days old??! (o.0)

[@ValVerdeBroadcasting]

Don't worry, we're using the "premiere" function; this is a pre-record that went out on Patreon last week! -R

[@TheBeird]

Terminator Dark Fate? More like . . . Terminator Dark FART! A fruity fart, like that from a man who shuns water and consumes only cider. A terrible miasma that, when encountered, clings to the back of one’s throat like morning dew after a night of spring rain. Won’t be good basically 😎

[@matthewpollock9685]

I will interpret your paragraphical break post flatulence pun as a pause for applause. I don't know how old you are but there is an age when such jokes are no longer funny. Personally I'm 38 and have not yet reached that age, so 10 out of 10. Ha ha... fart.

[@TheBeird]

Matthew Pollock I think fart jokes are funny ton men aged 6 to Death

[@floyd75dylan]

Have you seen Arnie’s interview when Arsenio Hall asked if there would be a Termination 3? Arnie’s response was, ‘Sperminator 3, I come again’. Oh and when Arnie is promoting the special olympics, he, starts off really cool, then he drops the R word, & basically tarnishing the entire disabled community with that word!

[@floyd75dylan]

This is the interview kzbin.info/www/bejne/opmzmaSbnqmlarM

[@Alacarte614]

Titanic 2 already exists! and I've watched it, was fookin wank like

[@robobrando]

Nobody: Duncan Casey: My dad... (Made in jest, love u beautiful boys)

[@rossross9281]

Woodford reserve 🥃

[@nathanchalmers9857]

Together on the track. The boys are back. I hate the T-X design robot design too. And the awfully dated and crappy red outfit she has wears in disguise was wank too.

[@tko4051]

I don't get the argument that you can't begin again with "what if sequels" to franchises. That "directors/writers shouldn't EVER change the timeline" of a flimsy narrative with a barely coherent through-line at all. Halloween sequels make almost no sense so why not? Many various horror movie sequels make no sense. Terminator sequels - same thing. The negative buzz about Terminator Dark Fate reeks of entitlement, cynicism, and also an alt-right aligned smear campaign based on something an actress said. Genisys had no returning characters apart from Arnold (the audacity to recast Sarah Connor and cast Jai Courtney as Kyle Reese), and no one who worked on Terminator 1 or 2, the writer of Dracula 2000 and Alexander with a fairly mediocre director. Dark Fate on the other hand has multiple aspects that made the first two good. It has the director of Deadpool which was a box office success (the highest earning R-Rated movie ever if memory serves me) and a total crowd pleaser, and the sole creator, yet that apparently makes Dark Fate (which hasn't even had a teaser trailer) a bad movie?

[@RichardJackson83]

Wow. Allow me to be perfectly clear; I take exception to the concept that I am in any way "aligned with the alt-right". Also I am not aware of any actors having said anything controversial. My politics are about as far away from those bile spitting nazi shitehawks as you could possibly imagine. Furthermore, having sat through three, *three* awful Terminator sequels I don't think it's "entitled" or "cynical" to expect so little of this one, particularly since Cameron himself came out and endorsed Terminator Genisys.

[@chumpey]

I'll ignore the political aspersion, because I refuse to get dragged down into that particular mire. People should be free to criticise art without being accused of extremism. I will tell you the problem I have with sequels that selectively ignore other films in their continuity: it robs all of the films in that series of any sense of weight or suspense. If we can just cherry pick what we consider to have happened to any of the characters, then why should we care about any of it?! Sara Connor's off screen death in T3, however misguided a choice, holds no meaning anymore, and if that's the case: why care about Miles Dyson's death? If they wanted, he could still be alive too. Now I hope the reasoning is sound and that they find an intelligent way to square this particular circle, but If we're asked to just 'go with it "because 'Cameron' and 'Hamilton' you guys"...I think people will have a tough time with it. I will be VERY happy to be proven wrong.