Thai Con will NEVER be CHEAP | The Thai Constellation ROT Problem

[@reignyell3614]

I agree.I think the durable Thai were from 2 years ago or around 2020.Those we’re growing nicely and not prone to root rot.The TC now are very sensitive and just luck of the draw.

[@prettyingreen]

THIS. I forgot to mention this in the video. So SOO vital!

[@DesireeStamat]

I think Kaylee Ellen was talking about this. I'm struggling to know which Monstera to choose, I want stable variegation but don't want to deal with root rot.

[@reignyell3614]

@@DesireeStamat Yeah I heard it from Kaylee so I just did my research and bought a mature Thai that was propagated from a mother plant 3-4 years old.I have the plant for about 5 months now and she’s doing great.If you have the budget just go for a mature Thai instead of the small ones now.

[@DesireeStamat]

@@reignyell3614 I almost pulled the trigger on a baby at Steve's Leaves this week....glad I waited. I don't want any diva plants right now, especially if they cost a fortune and I might kill them.

[@VeryKinkyCurl]

@@reignyell3614 thank you for that info!💚

[@renatecormick7399]

Well explained, thank you. I think it’s obvious that TC has its good as well as at times not so good points. I’m just starting to understand a lot more about plants with these types of videos. Thanks again.

[@prettyingreen]

Absolutely! I love TC in so many different ways. It’s fascinating. But there are certainly drawbacks

[@qrxzl]

I bought a Thai Con cutting in 2020, from a motherplant which was a few years old already, so predating the big flooding of TC thais after 2020. This plant is literally the hardiest plant I have ever owned. It has never had a single rottet root, I have propagated it so many times by now and never had any problems whatsoever.

[@theplantedeye]

Hey Chris. I know when I click on your video I am going to learn something. I got a MTC seedling last year and it took a looooong time to size up. Its about the size of the ones you showed now. After watching you video, I realize getting it to that size is an accomplishment to be proud of 😅. Thanks again for another great video

[@prettyingreen]

That means a lot, Michael! I appreciate it. Yes if you got a Thai into a 4-5” pot, that’s an accomplishment for sure! Especially with the new batches of Thai coming out of TC so weak. Appreciate you checking out the vid!

[@BerylBerry]

I must say you really educate people and I love the fact that your so eco friendly

[@prettyingreen]

Awww thank you! 😄

[@BerylBerry]

@@prettyingreen my pleasure

[@valerieclark5695]

Thank you, I had been planning to buy a Thai Con someday and have taken it off my list. I don't want to have to make my living room as sterile as they require. And so interesting to know why the damping off occurs.

[@ChiaChinchilla92]

If you love it you should keep it on your list. I got my bf 1 for his birthday in October (it was a cutting with 4 leaves, not a TC baby) it was a learning curve to figure out how to take care of it vs the other monsteras. We almost lost it and I convinced him to cut it 1 last time and put it in Leca.. we watered it with distilled and just recently potted it in a very airy soil mix (mostly bark and pearlite). It put off a new leaf finally and it's very rewarding! I would recommend getting a decent cutting or multiple TC babies so even if you do start to lose it/them you still have a chance to fix it. Also our thai was in a glass Starbucks bottle, we just made sure the leca around the roots was wet but never filled the glass with water more than a couple CM high. It's with multiple other plants and definitely isn't a "highly sterile" environment.

[@prettyingreen]

Yeah I think early on, smaller than 4” can be really challenging to grow. But once you acclimate them to the biology of the world, and they survive it, they are truly awesome plants!

[@redgriffen]

I have a Thai and I enjoy your videos. I can tell you put a lot of work into your videos. Good job.

[@hedgewitch59]

I'm so glad I found your channel. You've explained things beautifully.

[@chrisnakruger1743]

This actually makes me feel better cause i thought i was losing my mind with the Thai con stem rot

[@josiehile5445]

I was doing research this morning on tissue culture and came across your video! I wanted to let you know that thai cons have spread all over the country into grocery stores! I bought 2 yesterday in pretty large size for $30!

[@northliu1196]

8 month later, 6in Thai Cons are going for 20$ in big buck grocery stores. This video did not age well.

[@prettyingreen]

U right about that

[@Southern.Nappiness]

Wal-Mart is selling nice Thai Constellation, plants for $45 as of 2 weeks ago.

[@Soluvly09]

⁠@@Southern.Nappinessdon’t buy it. My Thai Con rots at the sight of water. I have 1 leaf and roots in perlite.

[@meikahidenori]

I ended up doing full hyro & leca with mine as the only way they thrived was submerged in water. I attempted repot once re rooted, they gave a new leaf and instantly rotted at the root. I had 5 and luckily have been able to rescue 2 (one is being re rooted for the 3rd time, was VERY lucky it had alot of nodes and the one I just didn't bother repotting in soil after I regrew the roots as it rotted after 1 watering and wasn't risking it a second time.) And they're doing quite well now despite temps dropping here in Victoria and living in jars. I give them fish pond water instead of regular fertiliser and they're doing fine, giving me new leaves. My friend got me a 6th one a bit more grown than the ones i had gotten and that has instantly gone into a pickle jar with leca & water... and it's pushed out two leaves since doing it. I know it's not the recommended way to do leca/semi/full hyrdro but if they're going to survive in water like that then well.... I'll just keep doing that. I think with the TC process they need to get the plants used to non sterilised conditions sooner or at least let someone grow them outside of thailand as part of the problem is shipping to Australia, UK or the US and then them getting shipped out once they arrive in the country without much time to acclimatise. (Especially here in Australia, most go to Queensland plant shops making it even HARDER to get these plants to acclimatise to the colder winters/ more humid summers here in Melbourne.

[@prettyingreen]

I’m having to most success in full hydro LECA with the Thai cons. More air circulation and in the root zone, the better! You’re spot on with the acclimation of the TC to the biology of the surrounding area. It just seems they are very very susceptible to damping off and root rot, compared to other TC. It’s my theory, that the Pythium survives the TC sterilization process, and rears its head when exposed to the environment

[@meikahidenori]

@@prettyingreen was reading some blog where they were saying a little bit of chlorine in the water can kill some of the fungal problems plants get (not suprised how so many hydroponic blogs are in regards to growing weed) but I've never seen that anywhere else. The water here in Melbourne isn't bad as per se but where I am it is a little on the higher chlorinated side and I'm curious if that's why the plants are doing better in the water. Would there be any truth in that?

[@silviap4478]

So well explained, thank you! I have been thinking about getting a Thai constellation for a few months now, as the prices came down to double digits for a 4 inch pot. But it's still a lot of money for a plant that's prone to just rot away. I read a recommendation somewhere to avoid fungi and root rot by watering the plant with a weak hydroperoxide solution dissolved in water. Would this help with this issue? I never used it before.

[@prettyingreen]

Hey! Yes watering with hydrogen peroxide can definitely help keep Pythium and stem rot to a manageable level 😄 Once the plants get to about 1ft tall they are almost invincible…but getting them to survive to that size can be a challenge

[@carolstuff]

Wow! Now i understand the scarcity & pricing. Sorry you lost so many. Thanks for sharing.

[@prettyingreen]

Absolutely! Yeah it’s all part of growing plants!

[@TheLecaQueen]

Really enjoyed the information. Thanks

[@prettyingreen]

Thank you for checking it out 🤗

[@appyb1]

Buy from a seller who has started it in leca and continue to grow it in leca. You won't have any issues, grow this plant hydroponically, it's the best way to grow

[@snappyplants]

If I add a Thai con to my collection, will I infect the rest of my plants with the Pythium?

[@veronicav2478]

Thank you for the info, learned a lot just now

[@prettyingreen]

Absolutely!

[@miad.4976]

Yeah, it just happened with mine perfectly acclimated cream Brulee in Pon. Roots healthy leafs healthy but stems rot out for no reason. There even wasn't contact with the soil (pon)😅 Prices are definitely reasonable, plus all of those highly variegated Thai Con ts revert very fast, not only mine, a lot of people say the same. Maybe when they get older variegation comeback, but most of them look average after a few leaves so I'd definitely prefer to get a 4+ inch pot established plant with a visible pattern for more money than play with still quite pricy ts which can die on me so easily and/or lose its high variegation 😮

[@prettyingreen]

This is my FAVORITE comment. I feel exactly the same about it! Buy a plant that is bigger (4”+) and through what we’re now calling, “The Valley of Death”. Get good stem variegation, and don’t worry about the early leaves. It’s worth the little bit extra, and will make sure you get a solid future mother plant 🌱

[@jillianleblanc9370]

Thank you for sharing beautiful and amazing plants lovely collection please tell me what you put in the water with the Leca for the plants

[@prettyingreen]

Absolutely! Here is what I put in my water: prettyingreen.com/products/part-a-b-leca-fertilizer?_pos=2&_sid=82c6a1f76&_ss=r

[@manjuk1708]

Thanks to you its off my list now. I am happy with the regular one.

[@prettyingreen]

Agreed the regular is beautiful!

[@HipyoTech]

Do you have any citation for the Pythium tinfoil theory? To me it really reads as a plant store trying to create drama to scare people into thinking Thai Con should be more expensive to sell them for more.

[@prettyingreen]

Alright. We're about to nerd out. CLAIM 1: Tissue Culture plants are just young and the acclimation process kills off the Thai Constellation. We grow ~10 species from Tissue Culture. Given all the same environmental and chemical treatments, they survive at DRASTICALLY different rates. Varying disease resilience through a single species is very common. For example, in production of Caladium hortulanum, the following study proves the varying Pythium resilience in the same species, with root rot incidence rates of 35-94% in Eight cultivars, all the way to 5-14% incidences of root rot in three Cultivars. Source: edis.ifas.ufl.edu/publication/EP259 CLAIM 2: Pythium cannot survive the aseptic process of tissue culture One way Pythium spp. reproduces is via oospores. (photo of Oospore here: cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/2570/3692/files/Oospores.jpg?v=1688346786) Oospores are INCREDIBLY resilient, and can remain ungerminated UNTIL unsterile conditions exist. In the author's words: "Oospores are extremely durable and have survived for more than 10 years. Pythium spp. have survived passage through the intestinal tracts or earthworms, snails, and birds." This means they could ABSOLUTELY survive inside the Xylem/Phloem/Vascular system of a plant via the root, and live in the Tissue. Source of photo and quote: plantpath.ifas.ufl.edu/misc/media/factsheets/pp0053.pdf Additionally, the Oospores remain dormant until nonsterile environmental conditions exist, then they germinate: "Oospores of Pythium ultimum were dormant, at first, but became increasingly germinable with time of exposure to nonsterile soil extract. Germination exceeded 90% after about 6 weeks in soil extract" p.1094 Source: www.apsnet.org/publications/phytopathology/backissues/Documents/1975Articles/Phyto65n10_1094.PDF Also, oospores are resistant to Chemical Sterilants: "Oospores are also resistant to chemical sterilants.(310)" Source: www.researchgate.net/publication/242625771_Etiology_and_epidemiology_of_Pythium_root_rot_in_hydroponic_crops_current_knowledge_and_perspectives Further reading on oospores: www.sciencedirect.com/topics/agricultural-and-biological-sciences/oospore Additionally, Pythium exists in the tissues of hostplants, once they are cloned of the mother plant. "Pythium spp. are not seedborne, but they can reside in clonally propagated stock such as seed pieces of potatoes, sweet potatoes, sugarcane or transplants of strawberry." Source: plantpath.ifas.ufl.edu/misc/media/factsheets/pp0053.pdf CLAIM 3: We are not in V2 of Thai Constellation. We might be in V54 of Thai Constellation tissue culture. I don't know. But I can tell you, and many other Thai Constellation growers corroborate that this batch has LESS resilience to root rot causing parasites. Tissue plants come from other tissue plants. They all originate from initial chunks of monstera stems, usually with axial buds (because of the size of the plant). After multiple years, it IS possible there is some form of genetic breakdown/mutation occurring which is being displayed as a susceptibility to root parasites. (Source for genetic drift in asexual propagation: www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3686192/ Compared to previous 2018 versions, as well as Monstera deliciosa (unvariegated), philodendron tortum, philodendron paraiso verde, and musa etc etc they survive at drastically lower rates. I'll do a side by side batch for you. CLAIM 4: It's not even Pythium. You're right. It might be Fusarium, Phytophthora, or Pythium? I can't definitively say, but I'm losing Thai Cons via a blackening (wettening) of the stem (see video here: cdn.shopify.com/videos/c/o/v/705aa86a4be747d9be3d6774bbdb3f63.mov This looks like classical damping off caused by Pythium. But it's probably time I turned on my microscope :) My infections look like the ones described below. "Often, infections from Pythium spp. have a greasy or water-soaked appearance in the plant tissue because of leakage of the moist cellular contents from plant cells that occurs from the enzymatic activity mentioned earlier. " Source: plantpath.ifas.ufl.edu/misc/media/factsheets/pp0053.pdf CLAIM 5: I'm saying Thai Con has issues so that I can keep prices high? If anything, it's made us sell less Thai Constellation. It's like saying "Calatheas get spider mites". They do, and it increases their wholesale price to retailers. And it would make a retailer sell less of them if they said this.

[@HipyoTech]

@@prettyingreen Really looking forward to the follow up vid, thanks for addressing the comment

[@prettyingreen]

Hope you got a chance to see it: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iJjJf6qKiLmVosk

[@Yamileydd]

Does orchides soil works for Thai ??? I JUST REPPOT IT EITH THAT SOILD PLEASEEEEEE HELPPP

[@a.b.r.6248]

That makes so much sense. Do you see the problem in larger plants too? I know they are subjected to root rot easily, but is it because of the parasite or just a bit of sesitivity to being overwatered?

[@ChiaChinchilla92]

I got a decent top cutting (4 leaves with established roots) that I almost lost because of rot. I've learned from here the only thing you can really do is not have any of the stem under dirt if you can help it. Also to have a very arid dirt or leca to grow it in so serious moisture doesn't stick around too long.

[@a.b.r.6248]

@@ChiaChinchilla92 that's a very helpful tip. I got my first thai just a day back and tbh it was pretty unaffordable for me. So I'm trying not to kill it. Maybe planting in a perlite rich medium with the stem out would help.

[@ChiaChinchilla92]

@A.B.R. I believe I paid $130 usd for the cutting. It was back in October and I got it for my bfs birthday as he's the one into plants and that is one of his favorites :) We used just a little bit of actual soil. Otherwise it's a lot of large bark, tons of pearlite, and leca. The only thing we forgot is activated charcoal which it seems to be doing ok without for now.

[@prettyingreen]

There’s a bit of a “valley of death” up until about the 4” pot size. Once there or beyond, it’s usually a good plant and had built up its resilience to biology. Great idea from Sara to add in activate charcoal, since it is anti microbial in nature! I think Thai will always have sensitivity to overwatering. Partly bc it’s a Monstera deliciosa, part bc an overwatered plant is EXACTLY what Pythium waits for to take over a root zone.

[@flanneryrebekah1176]

A lady I buy plants from told me to message here anytime I wanted to get one because she warned me about the tissue cultures, she gave me 2 free Thai cons, one as a rehab off of a dead one, an one a 5 year old one that she had been chopping for a while and selling up until it got pests, pests are gone but she doesn’t trust selling it so I told her it was fine to me and she gave it to me and it’s been doing great, so glad she saved me from the tissue culture disaster 😂

[@prettyingreen]

So glad yours is thriving!! Our big mother from 2018 is doing amazing!! The smaller TC ones sometimes struggle more

[@sarmachulianov]

I just bought a Tahi monstera in your website. Regars from Mexico

[@michelejoerres4165]

I just purchased my first Thai from a nursery a few days ago 6 inch pot. It's got a good root system, but in a soil with just perlite. No chunky bark or anything. So I was researching for when it's time to repot it down the road, and came across PafCal. People seem to be having great success with it. Have you ever heard of it and what are your thoughts? Thanks.

[@plantypittsburgh]

Nice timing. My thai is in a 5 inch. I've been growing it from a 2 inch. (Acclimated tissue culture). The roots keep busting out of the pot and it grows out of its pot quickly. Soo... Leca no drainage? Terrible idea? My other monstera are big fans, and I'm lucky to have a hardy thai. It's high variagation... potential for half moon...I don't want to kill it!

[@ChiaChinchilla92]

My thai did great in leca with no drainage! We just made sure the pebbles were moist, but never allowed water to sit higher than a couple CM at the bottom and waited for it to dry out before watering again with distilled water.

[@plantypittsburgh]

@@ChiaChinchilla92 Interesting! It doesn't dry out? These roots are just so crazy. In a month they're growing out of the pot and all around. Clearly my thai is pretty happy in its soil, so I just can't decide!

[@prettyingreen]

I like to say, when a plant is happy (especially roots), don’t mess with it. Something is working with the soil you’re giving that plant-just keep uppoting it! One day, you can transition into LECA, but make sure you have those cord-like Monstera roots by then. The thin, young roots are really susceptible to rot. I hope this helps! Sorry it took a few days to reply 😄

[@plantypittsburgh]

@@prettyingreen oh my gosh, no apologies! Thank you for responding. I needed to read that advice before I kill my thai. 😆

[@npwroblewski]

Have you considered including a diluted hypochlorous acid in your foliar sprays and waterings?

[@prettyingreen]

That’s not a bad idea for sterilization!

[@Dani-tw8cy]

This variegation pattern is very beautiful

[@prettyingreen]

It is!!

[@marisakirisame2366]

It’s not contagious to other species of plants is it?

[@graceaxisa4213]

Aah! A work colleague gifted me a Thai Constellation a couple of days ago. I knew very little about the plant prior to this....now I'm worried 😅

[@francgauthier]

Love your content!

[@dark.and.planty]

Hi, i just bought a Thai Cons yesterday. It has 4 leaves, one with fenestration, but it’s in a pretty large por (I’d say 8 inches) and bot a chunky mix. I am wondering if I should just leave it, since it’s already grown in there ti this point most likely? I am kind of nervous about it. It is very moist! And also, I wonder if the varigation comes and goes… it doesn’t have a whole lot except on the tinier leaves 🤔 (also I wish I had known to check the stem instead, not that much variegation there that I can tell). Thanks for the great info in your videos!!!

[@shnuggumz]

💚So I have to ask you this Chris. *I’ve lost 50% of my 2-3” tinies. Since pythium is the culprit of this dampening off issue, can’t something like adding Tribus to your nutrient regime prevent this? My understanding is that this bacteria “eats” pythium. I’m thinking about trying it out. Curious about your thoughts Chris.. any experience with this?

[@prettyingreen]

This is a great question! Tribus contains Bacillus subtilis (I show effect at 5:35), pumilus, amyloliquefaciens. These all fall into the "beneficials" category of controlling root rot! And are likely incredibly useful for destroying Pythium! I personally haven't tried Tribus, but I might give it a go!

[@MermaidGunner]

I got one recently (2 weeks ago) and it’s in dirt. Do you recommend transplanting now? It’s in a 4in pot.

[@prettyingreen]

As long as it’s in we’ll draining healthy soil you’ll be good! It might shock it if you transplant so soon again

[@mollycontent]

Do I need to worry about this with my 2 babies? They are already 3 and 4 inch pot sized.

[@prettyingreen]

You might be good by 4” pot size!

[@mollycontent]

@@prettyingreen ok thank you! One I inherited and the other was a gift so I kinda obsess over their health😅 and I've been worried about this.

[@KaraKay]

Its August 2024 now and thai constellations are literally flooding Walmart and Costco for $40

[@giacomobianchi6854]

Thai constellation in Berlin you can found for 20neuro far a juvenile plant!!!

[@ahai1990]

Here in Germany 2024, you can find thai con in every plants store and Baumärkte

[@giogaro1338]

I hate you are so right 😢 I was one of those who used to say "Thai is just a deliciosa it's not more prone to root rot".. until the roots of my thai started rooting off 😢😢😢.

[@prettyingreen]

😭 it’s just different than the others!!! I wish it weren’t!!!!

[@CLINNYY_1]

My Thai I have had for about 4 years and is about 3ft tall larger leaf is 18inch

[@prettyingreen]

That's awesome! Once they get large they take off

[@CLINNYY_1]

@@prettyingreen I got 3 leaves last season

[@Dieppaloveplants]

I gpt my thai 2021 she is 6 feet tall i need to propagate he but she is huge i dont want to she have second and third little fenestracion she is a beast leave are hugeeee

[@prettyingreen]

That’s amazing! Maybe try air layering

[@kaylamarte9735]

I just purchased one from you. If it rots do I get a refund?

[@prettyingreen]

If you have any issues reach out to us! [e-mail] we’ll take care of you!

[@SyedR14]

Home Depot now sell them at $39.99 (Feb 2024) 😊

[@prettyingreen]

Great deal! Which Home Depot?

[@SyedR14]

@@prettyingreen almost all Home Depots in Illinois. Limited distribution…about 10 or so came to each store last week.

[@hollyc8356]

I’ve been using mycorrhizal fungi ants love it they carry it away in hoards it’s quite horrifying…

[@shopthimm1211]

Do you use it on indoor plants which live in mineral substrate or organic?

[@prettyingreen]

Interesting!

[@txoovlouquieusvaj]

If I didn't know any better, I'd say this was a business strategy to prevent being undercut by foreign competitors lol

[@prettyingreen]

Oooo good one - like Illuminati level of strategy?? I like your imagination. But imagine, if I was just sharing my honest experience with a plant, and showing strategies to combat the issue, with zero ill intention for personal gain (other than you to watch the video). People would never be that good, right?

[@13BulliTs]

Ok you better eat your hat, since they go now for around $ 30,- a plant.

[@prettyingreen]

Yeah I’ve eaten it! Check the recent vids

[@alexg.5850]

I don't want to sound disrespectful but can't you just breed another plant with similar markings and more resistance instead of insisting on a CV that is already doing bad? Seems like a very troubling thing to do in my eyes

[@mtgtomescourer]

Oof, this didn't age well haha... Still love ya bro!

[@justjanice1973]

Great, I just put mine in the ground.

[@prettyingreen]

Your Thai con tissue cultures? Straight into the earth? No issues?

[@LydiaChanNYC]

The new Thais are so weak. I won’t suggest Thai Con tissue cultures. They are massed produced for maximum profit and so cheap now. But you’re basically throwing your money away and adding on stress to your life. I really enjoyed this video and hope to see more of these type of content.

[@prettyingreen]

The new Thais are very weak. It’s best to wait until they are in 4” or larger pots-then the risk is much lower!

[@DaveYaban]

Costa

[@OsirusHandle]

Its the result of repeat cloning poor genetically healthy plants chosen for their unique (here detrimental!) appearance. If you can bring a singular thai con to flower you might have a better chance at a healthier plant!

[@CoffeeCakeCrumble]

Plant herpes😢

[@prettyingreen]

Yooooo this is ACCURATE

[@briankimberly7767]

I love them but they are straight up an abomination lol

[@prettyingreen]

Agreed!