The age of insufferable Disney princesses...

[@SydneyWatson]

I have just accepted that I almost always say everyone's name wrong because my accent is stupid and words are hard. 😂 I left some deeper analysis out of this vid because I felt like I covered so much of it already in my "failure of feminist Hollywood" video. So, if you're keen to hear more, that's where I'd start. :D

[@tonarojo9081]

Your accent is definitely not stupid.

[@UteHeggenTranswidowHeals]

Preach, honey! (I say this as a woman older than your mother, most likely)

[@nicbrone1846]

The point you made about replacing a one dimensional trope with another one dimensional trope was spot on.

[@SocraticMethodGuy]

If there was a version of you local to me, Id want to spend my precious time and money to see what youre like offline. Ive always enjoyed your courage and personality. Hmm...

[@CrownOfRoses541]

As far as I know, the first, legitimately, TRULY INTELLIGENT, Disney Princess, was Belle, from "Beauty and the Beast", and she ended up being struck down by Stockholm Syndrome. 👋🙄 Yes, I do believe that Belle would have been better off marrying Gaston. I actually like Channel Frederator's video on it. However, I think the best Disney Princess (technically NOT a princess, though. Because, she doesn't marry a prince, or her case, a son of the Emperor) would have to be Mulan (animated). She, especially in Disney's example, is how a "girl boss" SHOULD be! She incredibly intelligent, she's not afraid to get dirty when called for, etc. It just went downhill from there, though. 😞

[@aimee6839]

Hearing Knightly badmouth Cinderella like that literally brings tears of rage to my eyes. Girls like me who grew up in situations of abuse don’t HAVE the option of ‘just saving themselves.’ Cinderella is an excellent role model because she held on to her kindness and goodness despite everything, and when the opportunity came she just wanted to go dance at the ball. She didn’t sit around waiting for the Prince. And even when the duke came by with the glass slipper, she played an active role in making sure he knew she was there and needed help! Why is the new feminist messaging that if you can’t girlboss your way out of abuse it’s because you just aren’t girlbossing hard enough? There’s nothing wrong with needing help!

[@Aaarandom]

I’ve always loved Cinderella but never thought about all your points. Now I love the story even more and I understand why it appealed to me. Thank you ❤

[@nixie6077]

That's so true, and I've heard similar sentiments being echoed through victims of abuse. Cinderella has an innocence to her - she retains her kindness even in the face of adversity, whereas many people would fall bitter and angry. That's what makes that fairy tale special, and why so many of us look up to her as a REAL girlboss. She saves herself by maintaining a pure heart, and her pure heart is rewarded with a fairy godmother and true love. It just goes to show that most celebrities have these huge platforms but they're still just stupid actors who do not understand the characters they're playing or watching. No critical thinking behind them. Just jesters in clown suits portrayed to be smarter than they actually are through [sometimes] decent writing.

[@Aaarandom]

@@nixie6077 strange considering you’d think it’s an actors JOB to understand their role, story and character so completely that they “become” them for the next few hours. Otherwise why pay them 🙄🙄

[@Alte.Kameraden]

Some Feminist latched onto Marxist theorems of Opressed vs Oppressor. If a women gets help from a man it would shatter their entire world view that all Men are Oppressors of Women. This they can not do. So must reject the idea. It's the same mentality that Racist also use. There are even quotes by Confederate officers from the American Civil War who were opposed to conscripting slaves to fight because it could lead to the possibility of them performing better than White Troops, the possibility of that was deemed dangerous as it would undermind their entire view of Society.

[@laiorwyn]

Ms knightly simply demonstrates with her words that she has lived a privileged life, to not understand the nuance of the story, that people don't always have the opportunity to save themselves. I have not been through abuse but I'm not ignorant of the difficulties of getting away from it. I hope you have found peace and happiness now.

[@JoeSyxpack]

It's weird to criticize Cinderella - a victim of a long history of physical and mental abuse - for not rescuing herself from the situation. And really, she DOES rescue herself by staying strong and never allowing herself to be beaten down to her step-mother's level. Cinderella could easily have become a bitter reflection of her step-sisters and been overlooked by the prince, instead of maintaining the charm and grace that won him over. Sure, the fairy godmother did provide her with the dress to attract his attention, but everything after that was entirely up to Cinderella.

[@varnix1006]

Because they want Cinderella to end up as bitter trauma ridden woman who just resents her entire life and ended up repeating her step-mom's behavior. Woke women and hollywood writes literally think this is interesting character development cause they don't understand sincerity. These people are kind not because of their personality but because everyone around them can throw each other off the cliff just for being "wrong".

[@neigeshusband5327]

​@@varnix1006You don't know how many times I fandom spaces I see people pretending any character that isn't a bitter, immature, and obnoxious abuser who puts everyone down is "boring". "They're mean so they're better written!" When the sad fact is, the assholes they worship are objectively mot interesting unless they're clashed with a genuine and kind soul

[@edwardcarlisle5580]

That's exactly right! Thank you.

[@Starwarsdude8221991]

Girl wanted to go to a party and meet royalty accidentally won the heart of the prince girl wanted a day off and accidentally bagged the richest guy in the kingdom woman is a saint still my favorite princess out of the lot didn’t help my mom kept calling me cinder(my real name) as a kid when doing chores so I really empathize with her even as a boy.

[@TheMindofagenius1]

The fairy godmother wouldn't have provided her with the dress and all that stuff if Cinderella wasn't who she is.... so yeah, even the fairy godmother's help is a result of Cinderella's strength!

[@zilkill09]

One thing I didn’t notice until I was older when watching Snow White, was how she treated Grumpy. Grumpy was just like his name, and was not a fan of Snow living with them. He argued and fought and was stand off-ish to Snow at every turn, but Snow saw that he was just a man in need of showing love to. I didn’t even realize as a kid that the pie she bakes is specifically for Grumpy! She was continuously kind and warm to him, which over time made him melt and not be so grumpy anymore. She actually changed his demeanor, his character- through kindness. In the end, Grumpy is the first to lead the charge back to the house to go rescue Snow, and upon her death, he is the only dwarf to place a bouquet upon her hands, and upon leaving with the prince Snow White calls out his name specifically to say goodbye. She definitely made an impact on him, and his life is forever changed due to her. I think it’s a wonderful example of how kind, gentle women can bring peace to men, that notion has become lost in modern times.

[@gwenp3450]

It's those little details that really makes the story timeless.❤

[@Maderlololohio]

Thank you for sharing

[@therose1277]

This is a beautiful point I had not seen before.

[@mikeconcino4022]

As an old man, you almost made me cry. Thank you!

[@ShamanSage]

🥲

[@codinghusky5196]

"It's never OK to give up your voice for..." IS LITERALLY THE MESSAGE OF THE MOVIE. Now I'm all for inclusivity, but "too stupid to understand art" should NOT be put in charge of art!

[@Nethan2000]

Next they're gonna do a shocking revelation that "Hakuna Matata" is not a good life philosophy.

[@ashley5899]

Like did these people not see the whole movie through?? Giving up her voice for someone was clearly shown to have negative consequences and the end was about Ariel reclaiming that...I don't see how that's negative messaging and it's hilarious that people shoot down anything and everything that remotely clashes with their beliefs

[@maxsommers6843]

Same with Snow White: don't take candy from strangers, or rather don't take fruit from creepy old hags. But the message, if you must glean one from it, is clear as day.

[@ghoul-l9q]

a white character should be played by a white actor actress not someoneblack, theyre deleting white history. if you want inclusive stuff make new stuff with that dont overwrite centuries of history

[@X_MissMary_X]

Seriously! This is such an infuriating take. "How will my daughter ever be able to figure out that the evil seawitch who turns humans into seaweed is giving Ariel bad advice???!!??"

[@AlmostArrynt]

Demi calling Ariel a "ho" while also acknowledging she's a 16 yo character is so trashy.

[@usonohoshi6165]

And it's all the more amusing when Demi was mocking a girl who knows who she is, and what she wants. Meanwhile, Demi is fickle about what she wants to be called. First a she/her. Then a They/them. And then apparently went BACK to a she/her because. It was tiring to keep explaining that she was a they/them and why she's a they/them.

[@jimthar17]

Well Demi is a big ole drug addict so you have to consider the source.

[@liampatrick3110]

And I thought feminists DENOUNCED slut-shaming! :/

[@thefifthaceassociation]

The fact that any of them even want to play a part in a movie they so despise is trashy. I just dont understand why they dont make their own shyt, they were doing fine for a while there with movies like Moana and Tangled and Brave. Why not just remake those and have your girl boss movie. Why can there no longer or ever be a love story unless its a love story about lesbians or superman finding his g spot on the subway. 2023 version of a love story is basically people using the grinder app until they settle cuz they have no other choice, fin.

[@Cheerleader644860]

@@liampatrick3110 but Ariel is wearing a bra in her movie. You may not think of it as exactly wrong but I do. If she is 16 she shouldnt be showing everything shes got. Its not modest imo. Doesnt have 2b yours though. Please respect it. And demi may not have been talking abt that particular thing but I am.

[@CrisTc86]

Funny how Zegler hates Snow White and wants to reenvision the role, while Henry Cavill is fired for being too devoted to his role.

[@blondiemom25]

Henry Cavill wasn’t fired he quit because they weren’t sticking to the source materials. ☹️

[@CrisTc86]

@@blondiemom25 he was given the chance to quit rather than have a black mark of being fired on his record

[@MechbossBoogie]

@@CrisTc86 I would have let them fire me. They can call that a black mark all they want, but getting fired from a shit show for wanting it to keep to the source material and watching it fail miserably as they violate the source material would be a crowning achievement in me telling people "I told you so." Then I'd go start my career as a director.

[@wrmusic8736]

because she's a Strong Diverse Woman and he's a lowly white male. Don't forget this important difference.

[@silashurd3597]

He wasn’t fired. He QUIT. If you’re going to prove a point, at least get your facts correct

[@Klikoderat]

Some of these movies come from a time period when people lived very harsh lives. To hear these spoiled brats who lived a life of luxury since they where infants belittle these stories is infuriating and disrespectful to our ancestors.

[@Bipolar_Weasel]

Well life will come full circle and the things that Gen-Z watched and celibrated will be reviled and their Generation will be called bigotted and hateful. Seems like every generation does this to older Generations. Baby Boomers thought their parents and grandparents generations were too closed-minded. Gen X hated on the Boomers and "The Greatest Generation". Millenials hated on the Boomers and Gen X. Gen-Z is hating on Gen-X, Millenials and Boomers. Gen Alpha is already showing signs of hating Gen-X, Millenials and Gen-Z.

[@JasonJJS]

Excellent point, I agree!

[@johnpruett5258]

Yes...spoiled little twats.

[@Real_SkyRipper]

well as the actress said "it came out in 1930 and evidently so" well yes the movies gives hope which now they want to remove, makes sense, harsh times need hope, great times need despair, humans just can't be happy i guess.

[@Hirpina81]

@@Real_SkyRipper - Yep. Swapping a fairy-tale with the worst things ever is more scary than the demon trees in Snowhite's run in the forest.

[@Epicpeaches1]

I’d like to mention Mulan was a great representation “girl boss” or “women power” because it showed she can do things on her own, yet find love and not have this mindset of “I don’t need a man” or “men devalue my power”. I absolutely loved Mulan for this, great example of women power & finding love.

[@rektdedrip]

Mulan has always been one of my favorite Disney movies. I had always assumed women valued it over other "princess" movies because Mulan had great development from being the uncertain girl being prepped as a bride to becoming a warrior to ensure her father's safety, to make her ancestors proud, and to defend her nation.

[@milktank8338]

Also in Mulans case they did not devalue her relationships with shang and her friends in order to make her seem more powerful. She needed their help to win just as much as they needed her. This is what is missing from the reboots. This idea of working together to become stronger. That asking for help and relying on others is not a weakness. That there is more to having a relationship then just the intimate stuff. Mulan fell in love with shang because he earned her respect not just because he was physically attractive. There is lots of nuisance here to work with that you lose when you view relationships as purely for bedroom stuff.

[@Epicpeaches1]

@@milktank8338 I completely agree

[@gcklo]

Mulan is played by a CCP loyalist who supports crackdown on freedom and democracy, just so you know!

[@mindlessautomaton2.0]

yes

[@Zen-anarchy]

What people seem to conveniently forget is that being “saved by the prince “ in a time where these fairy tales take place was the equivalent to winning a power ball lottery today.

[@sallystribrny9693]

This is a really good point. Medieval life was pretty rough.....

[@leilav2976]

I REALLY recommend people learn about fairytale shorthand! The book Saving Cinderella is my favorite but any one will do! These story elements MEAN something that modern Disney could NEVER 😂

[@Amun-Re3235]

Ask Meghan Markel 😀😀

[@r3mm13arts]

Ironically you also see a lot of "sugardaddy" talk nowadays....pretty hypocritical lol.

[@Furienna]

Yes, lots of people don't seem to get that things were different in the past.

[@jacobwolf3900]

It's funny that Peter Dinklage complains about stereotypical dwarfs in film and yet played a large bearded dwarf that lives underground in Chronicles of Narnia Prince Caspian.

[@jamba622]

He kept 7 actual dwarves from getting the same opportunity he received. So if he thinks that he has advanced the cause he is kidding himself.

[@ThePeeppeeppeep]

kicking the ladder out beneath him, i mean its only a little ladder but all the same

[@dRoscoAZ]

​@@jamba622Good point, he's actually holding back other LP's!?! 😮

[@LadyPhoenix20]

He also played a large space dwarf in Avengers Infinity War. Just recently he was Rumpelstiltskin in a short film of the same name and is in production for a movie called The Dwarf playing you guessed it The Dwarf. Dinklage is the biggest hypocrite.

[@stevearno9726]

​@@jamba622of course he prevented 7 other dwarf actors from kick-starting their career, Dinklage wants to be the next Warwick Davis and monopolise every role for himself.

[@Grizzlegone]

All of these celebrities putting fictional women down in very visceral often hateful ways, is extremely ironic

[@M4dM4n96]

It's actually delicious. After so many years of watching everything I love burn to ashes it is at least mildly satisfying to watch them cover themselves in petrol for a change

[@KaleRylan]

There's a sociological concept that I always forget the name of that my friend told me about describing how if you go too extreme in your direction, you end up seeming a lot like the belief system you're attacking. Circularization? I don't remember. Point is, I think this is an example of it. This kind of extreme feminist develops such a specific outlook on what a woman is 'supposed' to be that they end up spending a surprising amount of time attacking women for not fitting their image. I first noticed it (years ago now) in the discussions surrounding sexualization/objectification. They were so concerned about a woman's body being sexualized that they ended up sounding a lot like the kind of sexist men that want women to not even show their ankles or their hair.

[@wheeliebin18]

You mean all these FEMALE celebrities putting fictional women down.

[@noahlarson1861]

@KaleRylan Abortion is another good example. Original feminists were staunchly against it because married men were sleeping around and demanding their mistresses abort the resulting child. It's very telling as to who "rules over" us to see what gets turned around. Churches used to staunchly oppose homosexuality, but now there are churches shrugging their shoulders on the matter and even some outright promoting it. And none of it is based on doctrine... it's all just social pressure.

[@noahlarson1861]

@@KaleRylan That's also an example of the corrupting nature of power.

[@Kugrox]

so if you were put in a coma and you can be woken up if someone kisses you, you'd rather stay in the coma and die than have someones lips touch yours for 1 second. thats some top tier narcissism that you value yourself above your own life.

[@Maickl2004]

Это "Спящая красавица", а "Белоснежка" - вообще мертва. Какое согласие она должна дать?

[@Glitch1082-g8f]

Funny thing is in Snow White the prince doesn't know she's asleep and thinks she died so it's a kiss goodbye like grieving people sometimes do at a wake. In Sleeping Beauty Philip knew she loved him because Maleficent taunted him by saying he was the only one who could wake her with "love's first kiss". Should he just leave her to sleep forever because he can't ask her permission? The people who complain about Classic Disney and even The Little Mermaid should read the original fairytales they are based on. I think they'd probably pass out from how dark and twisted most of them are. Disney was always great at taking a dark, tragic story and somehow making it beautiful and something that brought people enjoyment. Now they're too busy misunderstanding the original messages to come up with anything of their own to say at all which leaves us with movies that are basically empty shells.

[@hyomin_live_4_heichou]

Those are the same people who would file sexual assault charges to a guy who performed CPR on you(which actually happens irl smh)

[@brookiebarreto3633]

It’s crazy that we’re just ignoring the stress and hardship the Princess go through in their movies. Snow White survived 2 assassinations, could be positive and happy without parents, to try and survive on her own alone. Cinderella was mentally emotionally and physically abused by her “family” while having to deal with the death of both parents! These are mentally physically and emotionally strong women!

[@Attmay]

Bashing them is victim-blaming. This remake is different from all the others in the sense that now I actually want the so-called villain in this one to win and win BIGLY! I want the “wicked“ Queen to triumph and become the fairest of them all. I want the Jewish girl from ISRAEL to win, especially when you consider the antisemitism of the Grimm brothers; this would be the perfect way to subvert that. Don’t just let her win, let her win the same way Wonder Woman beat the tribe of mustache man before anyone had even heard of mustache man. And I want the seven heightist deadbeats to get replaced by Emmanuel Lewis, Tony Cox, and five more little MEN of *COLOR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!* As a Gay Jewish man who identifies as a Black MAN because str8 yt m@13 baby boomers not named Donald Trump just aren’t cutting it anymore and never did, and as someone who is short compared to the very, very tall, I demand it.

[@vlo4829]

Snow White didn't even survive. She was killed by the queen. The prince didn't "save" her. He arrived at her funeral. He revived her.

[@ALovelyBunchOfDragonballz]

They arent ignored, theyre literally _in the fucking movies_

[@scottgg74]

Totally agree. Maybe I am misremembering or interpreting things wrong, but Snow White didn't seem to be pining for the Prince much past the opening scene where she sings a song about it. Her focus is how to stay hidden to avoid being killed by her evil stepmother and help the dwarves who took her in. Even the prince "saving" her is about him loving her, not the other way around. He is almost an afterthought showing up. Same with Cinderella. The prince is not important until the end, and again, it is his infatuation for Cinderella that drives him to find her, not her scheming to marry him (which is what her evil step-sisters are doing).

[@TrangDB9]

The purpose if fairy tails are a diffe one though, hidden messages. It's not about a single individuals, but about nations. It's an actual scripted story told.

[@Werewolf.with.Internet.Access]

It really pisses me off how Snow White is literally treasured by the dwarves, forest creatures and the Prince for being as beautiful on the inside as she is on the out, but these hack writers are just *bamBOOZLED* at the idea of a woman being strong because she is soft, kind, and compassionate, not some quippy Marvel superhero wannabe who punches men and calls them dumb

[@theguybehindyou4762]

An example of how hate can blind people.

[@pinobluevogel6458]

The quippy Marvel character that everyone in the comics already hated, because she was so one-dimensional and annoying and had none of the qualities of a 'hero'. Being powerful without a moral framework does not make you a hero, it makes you a villian. In those marvel movies, even Thanos had a better moral framework than Captain Marvel.

[@black-aliss]

Ooo, you just neatly summed up why I can't stomach modern cinema. Nice.

[@johndzwon1966]

The writers are not bamboozled, they are simply following the doctrine of politically correct feminist propaganda, because all self-respecting sheeple need to conform to whatever the current trend dictates.

[@paulman34340]

No they know! I refuse to let them pull the "Ignorant" game anymore! They know, but their counting on "ignorant people" not to. Which is why they talk shit! They know it works and people tend to be IGNORANT AS FUCK! Surprising with how they have PHONES to look stuff up but they're too lazy to do so! A simple Google/KZbin search would DASH all their BULLSHIT in seconds! Which is why they do as they do! In this case miss SNOW WHITE is a Tone Deaf idiot who thinks she's going to be the NEXT BIG THING! When she's going to CRASH AND BURN. But she likely thinks she'll just whine about "haters of women, ETC" like the rest and hide away till she gets a second shot at the big leagues! Only people have LONG memories! And frankly! It's easier to throw her under the bus for the ones letting her speak without a censor/coach then tell her to stop so the blame is thrown HER way later! Ignorance is just so sad for her because it's going to hurt her REAL bad when it comes LOL

[@whatalansaid]

It really cannot be overemphasized that Ariel’s deal with Ursula is supposed to be an unfair deal. Ursula, as the villain, does not believe in true love. Making the deal contingent about love is intended - by Ursula - as a way to steal Ariel’s voice. Ariel does not trade her voice for love. She trades her voice for legs - for freedom and a new world. Love is what frees her from the consequences of that decision, and guarantees her happy ending.

[@zynpkrdg]

YES THIS.

[@Bipolar_Weasel]

While I agree with you fully, I also as a parent of a young daughter, understand why parents need to review a movie before showing it to young children. Parents should know their kids better than anyone and should know if a child is, at a particular point in their lives, mature enough or too sensitive/not mature enough, to view the movie or at least certain parts of movies. To be fair, there are parts of certain disney movies that can be scary for toddlers to watch.

[@RegularCupOfJoe]

The operational nature of modern feminism is modeled by the Ursula-Ariel interaction, basically. Older woman manipulates younger woman for narcissistic reasons-- feminism in a nutshell.

[@kingandrewcecil348]

Good point. Oh, this reminds me, some context here: 1. If it weren't for her bigoted father King Triton destroying her human collection, Ariel wouldn't have been so tempted to accept such a life-threatening deal with Ursula just so that she could experience life as a human on land for herself. 2. Speaking of Ursula not believing in true love, ironically Ursula secretly LUSTS for Eric. I mean, she transforms herself into a beautiful girl named Vanessa, and then literally steals Eric away from Ariel with Ariel's stolen voice just to break her heart, with zero consent on either part, and practically uses Eric as her puppet the whole time via hypnosis until Eric snaps out of it when Ariel gets her voice back thanks to Scuttle and the lagoon creatures. Heck, at one scene Ursula even remarks that Eric is "quite a catch" and she even says "So long, lover-boy!" when abducting Ariel away from Eric, which clearly hints that Ursula believes more on lust than true love. 3. Ariel's happy ending in the film is, ironically enough, actually contributed by her own father King Triton - the very same person who basically oppressed her from her desires of humanity at the start of the movie - because after seeing that Eric saved him and his entire kingdom from Ursula's tyranny by KILLING her, he finally learns thar not all humans are bad, and as apology for being too controlling towards Ariel, he transforms Ariel into a human so that she could be with Eric - complete without costing her voice and gifting her a free dress in the process - all entirely out of love. 4. Contrary to what the haters seem to think about Ariel nowadays, Ariel actually regretted trading her voice for legs when Ursula double-crossed her on the deal by stealing Eric from her which is evident when she cries over losing Eric on her third day as human, and Ariel actually did show remorse over unintentionally endangering her father and her entire merfolk under the hands of Ursula, which is heavily supported by the fact that she not only apologized to King Triton when the latter found out of the deal she made with Ursula, yet she actually stood up for him when Ursula turned her father into a polyp and stole his crown (albeit unsuccessfully). If Ariel really was that heartless and traitorous like what the haters falsely accuse her as nowadays, she definitely would've showed zero sympathy towards her father turned into a polyp by Ursula and just left him to rot along with the other damned merfolk out of utter resentment, which clearly wasn't the case though 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♂️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️🤦‍♀️

[@0ryxxx]

Its so funny how easy and cleatly this message is.. yet they don't seem to see this at all? or understand it?

[@eskimospy77]

If Disney would ever like to go for realism over fantasy, they can make a movie about a 40 year old Disney princess ranting into the magic mirror about how none of the prince charming's want her anymore and she only gets hit on by dwarves.

[@lessismore8533]

😂😂😂😂

[@Balouthegreat]

I think we need this 😂

[@mittens3000]

😂😂😂😂😂

[@arwenstrong2818]

We used to teach little girls they could be anything. Now we teach them that to be "strong" they have to act like toxic men. Equality. 🤦‍♀️

[@dennisrounds1996]

Exactly

[@FilthyBitchGunClub]

Well in current culture we can't teach them to be women because women are being erased, and most of them are just standing there with big stupid grins on their faces letting it happen.

[@nerychristian]

The problem with teaching girls they could be anything is, they believed it.

[@theworldmayneverknow3876]

not entirely. we teach them that it's good to take on the toxic traits of both genders

[@awilliams3841]

@@theworldmayneverknow3876Then you have to stop teaching them that. Enough!

[@Jonathan_Collins]

Imagine redoing an entire film, taking out everything that made it wholesome and timeless, and turning it into a souless, mean spirited cash grab.

[@dRoscoAZ]

Legit every Gisney production at this point

[@Lonovavir]

So, most movies and series now?

[@TheSilversepiroth]

Did you mean: Modern Disney?

[@LegendaryDorkKnight]

Disney: Wait, I was only supposed to IMAGINE that? *looks at their back catalog* Uh...whoops...

[@TaoScribble]

I seriously don't even see how this is even a remake of the Disney film anymore. This is an entirely different take at this point.

[@slashbash1347]

"Cinderella sits around and waits for a rich man to save her" She wanted to go to the ball and because of the connections she made (the mice), she was able to do it. She was proactive in her own salvation. Hell, if anyone saved her, it was the Fairy Godmother, a WOMAN. Meeting the prince was just a lucky break.

[@paulgibbon5991]

Also, there are real people in that sort of situation right now--trying to survive an abusive family who financially control them without becoming bitter and twisted, while performing what acts of kindness they can for others. Many people in real abusive relationships DO need someone else to help them escape--a friend, another family member, a social worker, etc--and until then, the best victory they can hope for is surviving and not being ground down into a copy of their abuser. I'm sure they'd love to hear that they're inadequate because they didn't just instantly break free with the power of girlboss.

[@loren1350]

A lucky break... for both of them!

[@tasmeenbaker9912]

Cinderella only went to the ball because she wanted to have some fun and get away from her abusive step mother. The Prince was the LAST THING on her mind.

[@godsgospelgirl]

Yeah, she didn't even realize he was the prince until the day after the ball.

[@dancedancelauren]

I'd say the princes in both Cinderella and even Snow White are more plot devices than characters that "save" their princesses - they are literally the reward Cinderella and Snow White get for being kind-hearted and persevering in the face of hardship/violence from others.

[@ariacloudnine]

It shouldn’t even need to matter if the princesses were strong or not. Just the fact that Disney allowed her to go on a national press tour publicly slamming and tearing down their most iconic and well respected legacy masterpiece was such a bizarre move. This movie is legendary for a reason. Why was Disney okay with her going around and insulting the characters and writers, saying the movie was “weird” and “creepy” and that she refused to actually watch it? What kind of PR person okay’d that?

[@evandewind4264]

As someone who'd already been in the industry for at least a few years, it's incredible she wasn't experienced enough to know that's bad. Rule number one of marketing, don't trash talk your own product! If she said something reasonable about wanting to add modern elements to the story, many would've disliked it but wouldn't have found it baffling and outrageous.

[@helenestiernstrand6575]

A socialist.

[@exomake_mehorololo]

Considering that every of their female actors lately behaves like this... Disney didn't "allow" it. They want that

[@jaydemutnodjmet3914]

Thank you! Ariel sang part of your world before she even saw Eric! She wanted to go to the surface before she even saw him. She always wanted to walk. I'm tired of people saying she gave up her legs for a man. He was only the motivation to hear Ursula out.

[@TDKiller415]

Well technically she did give it up for a man she didn't know. After she saved Eric her main goal was to be with him, she was obsessing over him and making plans to get his attention etc etc And the main talk with Ursula was that she was in love with "this prince fellow who was quite a catch". It was only in the first Kingdom Hearts game where she made a deal with Ursula just for her own curiosity, to see other worlds.

[@inuandkagome4eva]

Ariel was naive but never a victim in my eyes ever. She was strong and independent. Also she was 16! Of course she was naive, as in naive by trusting Ursula to keep the contract and not meddle. Also the 2 other movies show how strong she was. And the show that had a short run that predated the first movie.

[@wabalubdub]

RIGHT

[@meredithcarroll6209]

THIS.

[@sarcasm-83]

​@@inuandkagome4evaNaive yeah and I also always considered a "Grass is greener on the other side"-kinda fascination she had. I think it's a good cautinary tale too about not being too hasty

[@Mraidsan]

It’s apt that modern feminism would hate Cinderella…the two sisters tearing her dress up is the perfect display of toxic femininity 😂

[@kingcosworth2643]

Bibbity bobbity boop

[@Lucky-Charm-547]

​@@kingcosworth2643bibbity bobbity box office bomb

[@ChoiceQueenxoxo]

Well at least that live action was a good one. Can you imagine Disney screwing up that one😅

[@isturbo1984]

Ya, not that she actually would say it, but the common theme between the three Disney films Knightly has banned her kid from watching, is that the main villain in all three are evil women.

[@garreonlefay6703]

​@ChoiceQueenxoxo Honestly it was not a good one. It opens up a ton of plot holes while trying to patch up holes in the original. They were so concerned with making her intelligent and empowered, that she ends up being kind of an idiot I do love the fact they flesh out the relationship with the Prince, who was basically a cardboard cutout in the original, something fixed in the third animated movie Honestly, Ever After a Cinderella Story is basically what the Remake wanted to be, but failed at.

[@jedimasters1462]

It's funny how Rachel calls the prince a stalker when he literally gets no more than 5 minutes to screen time.

[@PattisKarriereKarten]

I think she confuses the prince with the huntsman. It’s pathetic.

[@pessoafail]

And only bc Walt Disney had trouble drawing a realistic male human character back in 1936. Many of then scenes involving the Prince were cut out. A live action movie could bring those scenes to life and show us how close the Prince and Snow actually were. But nooooo let’s get rid of the Prince! *facepalms* it’s like Disney directors didn’t even watch the animation! The Prince never kissed Snow out of nowhere, he spends 6 months searching for the girl he loved, finds out she died, attends her funeral and gives her a goodbye kiss -- an act of true love that turned out to be the cure for the Sleeping Curse, which is the whole point of the story--how true love conquers all.

[@thetruth4116]

I swear that was the most asinine thing I have ever heard anyone say: Reminds me of the instagram chick in the gym that went on a tirade against a dudebecause he looked in her direction and dared to ask if she was still using the equipment she had.

[@StarryKitsuKat]

​@@pessoafailExactly, incredible that even as kids we got the message of these movies just fine but these people nowadays need the messages spelled out in ink in every scene. They don't understand subtlety so they end up ruining the stories and making unnecessary/dumb changes most of the time.

[@GothLady1987]

@@pessoafail Same with Aurora, although there is dramatic irony in her relationship w/ Philip. He met her as a princess when he was a child, was betrothed to her. When he meets her as an adult, he believes her to be a stranger, unaware that she's been in hiding. The Good Fairies discover their true connection and ultimately bring them together again. It's really sweet, much more romantic but with actual depth and growth. The OG Grimm tale is a hell of a lot darker.

[@MusicalErika]

Sometimes as a woman looking at feminist Hollywood, I want to say "Guys! Not everything is about us! Not everything was meant to tread on women, not everything is an injustice. Can we step outside of our myopic agendas for five minutes and see the world and history around us?" Thank you for this thoughtful video!

[@maxsommers6843]

"Can we step outside of our myopic agendas for five minutes and see the world and history around us?" They can't even see the rather obvious plot points of 80 minute cartoons made for children, so... I doubt it! 🤣

[@alyssastorch]

Modern people misunderstand the princesses, Cindy wanted to have fun at a party, Snow was forced to leave her home and through her kindness found a new family who loved her, Ariel wanted to be human even at the cost of what made the prince love her. They taught young girls love, humility, compassion and to follow your heart, they were NEVER the damsel in distress.

[@stonerbaby895]

Preach!!!

[@kyriss12]

Sleeping beauty gets the most flack, but that was one of the better early Disney romances. Prince Phillip didn’t just storm a castle to start making out with some strange unconscious woman. There was an entire movie worth of buildup where both characters were engaged from birth because neighboring kingdoms. When Phillip had to visit Aurora’s kingdom to get aquatinted with his bride he got lost in the woods, ran into aurora who was living in a cabin, and continued to blow off further betrothal meetings to hangout with who he thought was just an interesting peasant girl.

[@jedimasters1462]

​@kyriss12 If they ever really read the original story, they would realize that the kiss was nothing to complain about. In the original, the king that found her actually raped her and got her pregnant. His wife also tried to cook his children with Sleeping Beauty in a stew to feed to him.

[@EXL714]

The difference between classic and modern Disney is that classic tried to match the desires of audiences of the time, while modern Disney tries to reshape their audience to match their vision of society.

[@dreamwithinadreamfilms]

EXACTLY this! 👍

[@anthonyhovens7488]

I think its really telling how much of a disconnect there is between modern Disney and modern society when this controversy exists. If they were adapting to the times properly, they wouldn't have to defend it so much, people would just watch it and enjoy. But instead they chose the route of forcing an agenda that doesn't reflect the majority of society and calling everyone that doesn't agree with it a bigot. I think Ricky Gervais said it best at his last Golden Globes: "You [Hollywood] are in no position to lecture the public about anything. You [Hollywood] know nothing about the real world... ...accept your award, thank your agent, and your god, and f*ck off."

[@jerrymylove1754]

Also the difference is that the new stuff sucks ass on every level. The old stuff was great and stood the test of time.

[@Minenotyours58]

100%

[@kthx1138]

And their vision of society is dystopian, where just one person rules and everyone else are obedient slaves.

[@tacitus6384]

Because if there's someone I want my little girls looking up to, it's obnoxious, entitled actresses who mistake their talent for their pay-check.

[@Lisargarza]

Happily, it looks like her paychecks may be drying up! Good comment!

[@limpchees]

She went on a strike complaining about her millions during the writer strike. The strike meant for people who don't even make a quarter of what she does. She's delulu.

[@MzCraziLady]

Okay so we swapped “unrealistic beauty standards” for unrealistic resumes, got it 👌🏻

[@moringlory23]

I consider Tiana to be a girl boss while still displaying feminity. She had her own ambition, she did what she had to do to get herself where she wanted, and in the end ended up teaching Navien life skills that helped him grow as a person and act as her partner instead of just some shallow prince from the start of the movie. Idk why Disney acts like all their princesses are "trash". Especially when you consider that Disney did not create those stories. It was the Brothers Grimm who compiled different folk and fairy tales from all over. Disney just animated them with slight changes.

[@jjkhawaiian]

Hans Christian Andersen had some great fables, too.

[@sequoiajackson-brice6973]

Frfr, The Princess and the Frog was such a good movie brought out by Disney, and I feel like the last truly good movie they produced xD

[@SonicGirlsGeek]

Fun fact: Walt Disney himself regretted that he didn't get to flesh out the Prince and make his and Snow White's love story more believable! He said that because of the technology and lack of experience drawing humans, they only barely figured out Snow White's functional design, made the Evil Queen more cartoonish, and then managed to make the prince based off Snow (you might remember the prince looking very feminine in some scenes, this is why) so they couldn't put him in as much of the film as they wanted to. They then later put the deleted scenes they planned for the Prince and used them for Prince Phillip (you know, that notoriously fleshed out for early Disney prince?). That's what's so frustrating about this, is that there IS a legitimate need to redo the original and flesh out the story to Walt's full vision in a way that wasn't possible at the time, but they're misinterpreting the why and trashing on the original any chance they get

[@kellharris2491]

People don't understand that the origin story wasn't romantic at all. Prince Charming actually raped Cinderella. It wasn't supposed to be a romance.

[@SonicGirlsGeek]

@@kellharris2491 1. Not the fairy tale I was referring to, and that wasn't even the point I was making. In fact, why are you even in my replies? 2. Even if you did just confuse names, I've read the original versions of both Cinderella and Snow White? I've read some fucked up shit about birds plucking eyes and Snow White getting suffocated, and you're right that they weren't originally about the love stories, but there was never rape? I think you're talking about the Basile version of the Sleeping Beauty story, which was absolutely horrific and even the Grimm brothers had a lighter version (which they adapted from the Perrault version). But even then, Sleeping Beauty was known in many different cultures with many different versions, the true original (at least as far as it's been recorded) being the Ancient French version written in the book Penceforest (which did not include rape), so it wasn't even "the original" it was just one fucked up Italian's version. If you wanna make a point, please research first instead of reading one article and proclaiming yourself thoroughly knowledgeable on the subject, it makes the rest of us look bad

[@mramisuzuki6962]

Which is ironic that caused them to have to cut the market scene, which was later added to Aladdin as an homage to the cute story board.

[@dxv3d]

@@kellharris2491 Huh? I don't think Cinderella appears in Snow White.

[@DustinBarlow8P]

To be fair most Prince's where semi feminine during the time period (I'm assuming it is France during between 1700 - 1830)

[@GothLady1987]

This modern look at the Classics is scary. Ariel of '89 was motivated by her dream of living on land; rescuing Eric was her "time to act". Cinderella is an abuse survival story: her night at the ball was an escape, the prince was a perk that ended up changing her life. Belle is another favorite of mine: her love for her father motivated her to trade her life for his, and she ends up transforming (literally) the cursed prince who imprisoned her. He saves her life when he realizes "omg i'm such an ass"; when he loses the fight with the wolves, she brings him home and heals him, forming a bond that gives him humility and ultimately breaking his curse. These modern remakes trash all of this, defeating the whole "girl power" purpose. It's downright ironic.

[@rey_nemaattori]

The classics exemplify the women social skills, cunning, perseverance, intellect and courage to tackle problems they cannot do by strength alone. This makes female heroines who rely soley on strength so unlikable. During war its the men who fight _because_ of their strength, whereas well written women often win by outsmarting a much stronger enemy.

[@asimov9250]

Exactly, I think that original princesses were much more powerful with their "Kill'em with kindness" attitude 💪 Instead, actual princesses are just mean and bossy

[@psychodrummer1567]

The strategy those people have is called "Gaslighting" and it's behavior typically found in domestic abusers. That itself tells you all you ever need to know about those people.

[@tonyjanney1654]

It's Snow White's kindness that reforms the Huntsman from a potential murderer to gentler man who spares her life. Her kindness wins the forest animals over. She changes the dwarves from, frankly slobs, to decent fellows and inspires them to resist the cruelty of the queen. Finally, the prince is so moved by her story, his kiss is a token of respect and a mourning of her loss. @@asimov9250

[@watertrooper]

Thank you for this comment. I don't know if it helps, but I'm a male and I always treated the female leads the same as the male. Care to add in your take on Jasmine and Mulan?

[@goobly3044]

Fun fact: the little mermaid didn’t try to become human just for a prince. She really wanted an immortal soul, which as a mermaid she does not have.

[@amouramarie]

That may be true in the original fairy tale, but not in the Disney movie. She just likes the human world, and fell in lust with a dude. Which is fine, anyway. She had goals, haha. She went about achieving those goals in stupid ways, which is also fine for a movie plot, because we do that sometimes. XD

[@bored_potato]

​@loveutilltheendoftimesthey're likely referring to the original version, not the disney one

[@theretrodragonyope]

I think in the Disney version she had always really wanted to go to the human world.

[@ray2swaggy]

@@amouramarieno, even in the disney cartoon she already wanted to become human and adventure onto land BEFORE meeting the prince. the prince was just an additional but worthy reason

[@deltazulu2848]

About Ariel and Eric, they had trouble connecting because they literally couldn’t communicate. This places emphasis on the importance of communication in relationships. As a matter of fact, they almost blew it because of poor communication! And the best part, she didn’t “give up” her voice, it was a toxic manipulative girl boss who took away her voice away.

[@SioxerNikita]

Interestingly, the original story had a better point. Because she was scared and ran away, the Prince thought it was another girl that had saved him, she tries to sacrifice so much to get him, but unless she could get him, she'd turn into sea foam. In the end she doesn't get the Prince. Moral being: You can't always get what you want, no matter how much you sacrifice. A worthy lesson for kids.

[@AuntLoopy123]

@@SioxerNikita Oh, and then, her sisters sacrifice their own things to try to get her back safely home. But, the price is that she has to murder the prince and the woman he married, on their wedding night. And she is on the verge of doing it, when she decides that she's rather die, and let the man she loves live in happiness and love of his own. And because of her unselfishness, she is rewarded to become a helping angel, instead of seafoam. That's a good message, too. Don't be the one who says, "If I can't have him, nobody can." If you love someone, let them be happy with the one they love, even if that is not you. Take your own happiness in seeing them happy.

[@SioxerNikita]

​@@AuntLoopy123A lot of the original stories that Disney reinterprets, are very dark, although have good morals

[@DarkEclipse23]

But wasn’t that the point and morale of the story? She shouldn’t have to give him everything that makes her 𝙝𝙚𝙧 for some guy? I fee like she and I watched different movies.

[@Rembreiker_lychec9257]

It's amazing to see how the Walt Disney Company allows the talent to trash talk something that Walt Disney himself had a hand in creating.

[@outregis]

literally must be rolling over in his grave. It's amazing how low the company can get.

[@acidz0037]

Because none of them give 2shits about Disney’s legacy.. or anything decent…😑

[@Annatar_Lord_of_Gifts]

Funny enough, Snow White was the movie that put Disney on the map. Weird they would allow this activist to trash talk their start

[@daemok4752]

talent ? where do you see that at Disney these days ? it's trash woke trashing down the company over and over, can't wait to see Disney out of business.

[@Xander1Sheridan]

The Walt Disney Company absolutely despises Walt. They hate his guts to the point his books are not allowed on property. They will be seized everywhere they are seen. Note that the Disney family hates the company and what it has become as well.

[@sweethistortea]

The moral of the story is that kindness gets someone far, while vanity doesn’t. Also, if the prince was stalking Snow White, then his little hat would be popping out of the bushes the whole movie. Prince Florian is in the movie for maybe two minutes. The movie focuses on Snow White trying to get away from her wicked step mother trying to commit life removal on her.

[@MintyCow101]

he has a name?!

[@sweethistortea]

@@MintyCow101Yes, his name is apparently Florian.

[@BrokensoulRider]

It's a fun trivia fact most actually don't know about. XD Even I didn't until the last few years. @@MintyCow101

[@jonathandevereaux298]

Fun trivia: the prince never had a name. Disney this century occasionally marketed him as Florian but in the original book and later the Disney film he had no name. He was always simply prince charming.

[@promisedjubileedaniels]

Yes!! I totally agree. This has been my favorite Disney animated film my whole life. The "Prince Charming" finds Snow White the most lovely princess ever because she has a KIND HEART. This little mindless twat is making up what she thinks about Snow White without knowing anything about the actual story. Made-up woke GARBAGE.

[@notdeadjustyet8136]

Agreed. Firstly, the early princesses show the kids how to make the best out of bad situation that's not up to you to change or chose, which is a valuable lesson. Secondly, some things are definitely dated in fairly tales but kids don't learn only from them, most of the kids can understand fairy tales aren't a direct representation of life. Thirdly, remaking a timeless classic and making million whilst dunking on it is sooooo disgusting and hypocritical. Fourthly, love doesn't make a person weak or stupid.

[@leonardoD81]

How is it that so many Hollywood actresses don't know the story of Snow White? The prince didn't think she was asleep. He and the dwarves thought she was dead and while lamenting her loss kisses her goodbye knowing he would never be able to see her alive again. Ariel wanted to experience what humans experienced and even collected human things.

[@leichtmeister]

In the original Snow White fairy tale there is definitely some form of necrophilia going on. While the prince doesn't kiss Sno White in the glass coffin, he buys her corpse and the coffin from the dwarves to display it at his castel. She wakes up when the cart goes over a bumb in the road and the impact dislodges the piece of apple in her throat. Meanwhile, Sleeping Beauty originally doesn't wake up from the kiss and gets defacto raped by the prince. All this fairy tales are fucked up to the core in the original and Disney already took the water down kids versions to make their original movies.

[@MsEnglishtea]

"Man can't kiss you while you're sleeping without your consent" In Snow White they thought she was dead! All of them including the Prince, there is even a part in that scene when he put his head down in grief because he thought she was gone. He didn't even know she was under a spell, nor did he know that in order to break it was true love's kiss. The idea of all these forced girl boss films is getting pretty sickening. Did they forget that the men in the film were heroes, the Prince, the dwarves, even huntsman all saved her and that the villain in the story was a woman, a girl boss, the evil queen.

[@me_rio_sola]

And what is this bs that NO MAN should kiss you when you sleep? I would say, your boyfriend, husband, partner may definitely kiss you when you sleep. Maybe not french, but that little peck, I love knowing my wife kisses me like this even when I'm already asleep.

[@saymyname2417]

Many of the audience don't even notice who the heroes and villains are because good and evil have gotten twisted all the time and many people have a distorted perception on this. The first example I know of is Bram Stoker's "Dracula" and many such stories followed. Anyway, only a traditional female can be a villain today. Anyone else is just "misunderstood". At least if they wreak enough havoc...

[@kristinmartin2899]

I agree he was a grieving man who just gave a kiss goodbye. He wasn’t sinister?

[@robertmarshall2502]

​@@me_rio_solaIt's like they're arguing that all human intimacy is wrong. In an age where a bunch of ppl are chronically lacking in basic human touch. Remember to get displays of affection legally signed off everyone. Make sure not to hug your children until they're of a legal age to consent.

[@andersandersen6295]

Well we cant have kids growing up to be necrophiliacs 🤪

[@pageachatter229]

Listening to these women speak their minds shows just how little they understand the stories they're shitting on.

[@ahhamartin]

When you say these Disney women "speak their minds", my first thought is "this won't last long".

[@meretchen]

They do come across as very shallow.

[@bulletant880]

There's nothing to understand, stories are just that, stories, fictional characters. To live your life based on fictional writing is delusional at best on both sides. In the real world shit happens and you have to get back up and dust yourself off, if someone has a issue with me not putting movies/series on the top of my list of worries, go outside, join the real world. It's great to escape, at some point you have to snap back to reality.

[@pageachatter229]

@@bulletant880 You clearly lack any sense of imagination then.

[@Kayra-r9e]

@@meretchen My thought exactly! The first actress interviewed behaves like she's a mentally impaired 13 year old girl. Besides, what's with her body language? All this fidgeting, squirming, grimacing... Was she probably taught it makes her look lively and charming? IMO, it makes her look restless and unable to focus.

[@ardliellevilla6725]

I think (based on my memory of the movies which I haven't seen in a long while) that Snow White has less romance involved in the story, it's mostly the jealousy of the stepmother that drives the story forward so I find it funny how Zegler said that there's a BIG focus on her love story in the original where we literally only saw the prince like maybe 1 or 2 minutes total. Also stalking? The prince was just wandering around living his best life. If anyone's stalking its the stepmom with the mirror mirror on the wall

[@GothLady1987]

There's exposition in the OG film of the prince hearing rumors about the "maiden who slept in the glass coffin." He goes looking for her out of curiosity, same as Philip when he hears Briar Rose/Aurora singing in the forest.

[@mrsm9974]

These stories already had a power hungry boss woman. Snow White - Evil Queen Cinderella - Wicked Step Mother The Little Mermaid - Ursula Sleeping Beauty - Maleficent Hunger for power and being ‘the boss’ is not a trait that many people like. It is very shallow.

[@lareolanKFP]

Yes, but what about equality. If the villain is an example of a reprehensible human being, then the hero has to be one as well, otherwise it's just not fair! 😂

[@christopherknight7739]

@@lareolanKFPah, I see the logic in this!

[@Violet-tz1jj]

This is a really good point…

[@protorhinocerator142]

...because I'm evil...

[@souvikmitra6161]

It's like saying we should have more heroes like Patrick Bateman instead of the kind ones. They're villains or anti-heroes for a reason.

[@RhettegettBorshow]

I think the biggest harm Disney is doing with this is devaluing all types of relationships. Everyone needs to be saved from time to time. Guys and girls alike. It's OK to ask for help, it's good to have someone who has your back or provides emotional support. We don't HAVE TO be strong all the time, and we most definietly do have to make compromises with other people even in a relationship, because these are symptoms of compassion and caring. Disney tries to sell us the idea that being a leader is the most important thing rather than being a genuinely good human being.

[@rachaelmcgill7653]

Which is why Anna & Kristoff are a dynamite Disney couple because they accidentally take turns saving each other and calling each other out on their bullsh** and still love the crap out of each other at the end of the day

[@kirito3082]

The saving doesn't even matter, they are educating children that they shouldn't care about their partners, that fucks relationships in a whole other level

[@breejones9147]

And tweaking the "damsel in distress" part like Bell is fine. But what's wrong with finding true love? I think taking the love stories out is really losing people. Not everyone wants to be a lonely "girl boss."

[@nothingamerican]

They all have such negative opinions of these popular movies, yet they have to steal the movie because they are too stupid to write their own script.

[@esunablizzard6482]

The prince in Snow White didn't even stalk her in the least! He was just passing by and heard her pretty singing! When you hear someone while out for a walk playing an instrument beautifully or they have a hell of a voice, you tend to go towards them to see. That's how buskers make money. You don't even see the prince again until she's in that enchanted coma in that fancy glass and wood coffin because before then, HE DIDN'T KNOW WHERE SHE WAS because he was never stalking Snow White! Otherwise he would have been there when the huntsman was supposed to murder her! But maybe for women today, any man who stops and looks at you is a stalker now🙄

[@pinkraven7043]

Reading comprehension/Media literacy has died over the generations. Anyone who watches Disney's Snow White and Cinderella and only sees "DAMSELS/VICTIMS" is not paying attention. Both female characters are stuck in abusive households where they are treated like dirt by the people who should be taking care of them. Instead of giving into (justified) resentment or despair, they persevered with smiles on their faces. Neither Snow White nor Cinderella gave up on their empathy and kindness, even in the face of potential death (SW) or humiliation (Cinderella). And it's because they continued to be kind, loving women that they eventually find characters who do come to love them and value them for who they are. The dwarves for SW and the mice for Cinderella. Their abusers may try to beat them down, but the people who love them will go to hell and back for them. I need to emphasize this- neither girl let their trauma take away their ability to be kind and loving to other people, even if they may not get anything out of it. People these days mock that as a "safe" personality for a girl character, but those who do don't realize how difficult that feat actually is. I can even write an essay on how powerful a character Disney's Cinderella is. Go back and watch the movie, and you'll notice that she stays strong throughout the entire movie. This is a woman who is bullied by her own *family* and has no contact with the outside world. She works everyday to survive and tries to make the best of it. The one time she is driven into despair is when her dress is destroyed by her own step-sisters- one of the most heartbreaking scenes in Disney movie history. She would have probably given up if the Fairy Godmother didn't come to bless her with at least one night of happiness. Cinderella wasn't going to the ball just to find a man who could save her that night. The ball was big deal because it's the first and only time we've seen Cinderella out of her house. She gets to be the pretty girl with the pretty dress and enjoy a night out after *years* of domestic abuse. And she sees there's more to the world outside of her abusive step-family through experiencing the dance and love-at-first-sight with the prince. And even in the final act, when Cinderella is locked int he attic by her step-mother when the prince comes over with the glass slipper, Cinderella doesn't just wallow in despair. She tries her damned hardest to get out with the help of her mice friends. And the prince going out of his way to find Cinderella is a romantic and positive reminder to everyone about love. That even though your home life may be terrible and you feel like no one loves you- there *is* someone out there in the world who can see your worth and come to love you for you. As simple as this whole set up is, there's more layers to Disney's Cinderella as a character than any one in modern Hollywood will admit to or recognize. This is a movie made so simple that 5 year olds can see the magic in it. What happened to Gen X/GenZ to make them so hateful toward the magic of love, bravery, and the beauty found in kindness.

[@wombat4583]

I think part of it is also people haven't watched things in so long that the memory only remembers parts which leads to the deconstruction of thoughts, out of context, leaving the ideas quite flat, oversimplified version which then get twisted.

[@RachelNichols-writer]

Critics could be seen as guilty of victim blaming.

[@OfTHESnakeholeLounge]

Well said!! 👏🏻🤩 that is exactly how I viewed Cinderella and Snow White. Honestly, cannot even remember the prince’s names in Snow White, sleeping beauty, or Cinderella. Because it’s not what I took away from the movie and they were barely in it. So pretending those stories are all about a princess being saved by the prince is just ludicrous.

[@Deathisdark05]

Absolutely all of this! It astounds me how absolutely terrible people have become at basic reading comprehension/media literacy. Both Snow White and Cinderella are stories about abused girls and their strength is a strength of character, in persevering when those who should care would rather break them down. Much of the criticism the films get is ridiculous. Most of the movie of Snow White is NOT about romance, but revolves around her trying to get away from her step-mother. The romance comes second and is actually sweet if you think about it. The prince technically NEVER knows she is royalty; it is very much a story about love transcending social boundaries. And when he kisses her? The man thinks she's DEAD; what he does is the equivalent of someone giving a goodbye kiss at a funeral. Cinderella is much the same. The story revolves far more on how Cinderella is treated. Her going to the ball is never about the prince. It's an escape, wanting to enjoy the event EVERYBODY is going to and it is an act of humiliation by her family to exclude her (as THEY are the ones who presume she wants to go because of the prince). The prince happens to dance with her, they enjoy each other's company, and then he seeks her out. It's also so laughable to hear people complain about Ariel giving away her voice. The story of the Little Mermaid has, on some level, always been about naivete. Disney made the story a lot gentler but it is still a similar message. Ariel is naive and thus does not realize that because she and Eric do not know each other he would only recognize her through her most recognizable feature: her voice. Taking that away forces the two to not only have to get to know each other but forces her to learn hard lessons. Not only about herself but also to eventually realize that her father was just being protective. I could go on forever. A huge problem with people who criticize these stories is that they seem to not understand that there is strength in character and you don't need to swing around a sword to be strong.

[@SorinaLehaci]

❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤

[@smolexfundie6458]

I think people are forgetting that a lot of us like to watch movies to ESCAPE FROM REALITY not be reminded of it.

[@chazzmccloud36]

Exactly

[@1977Yakko]

Tearing men down does not equate uplifting women. That's what all too many of these movies do these days unfortunately.

[@markadams9946]

Agree wholeheartedly. That’s the common thread no one wants to talk about. It makes men embittered

[@TeaTimeTable]

Tearing down women doesn't equal uplifting men either but men still have Centuries to make up for that so kick rocks bud.

[@MorinehtarTheBlue]

​@@TeaTimeTableAnd nobody that you could have responded to said anything of the kind. Being embittered and petty doesn't actually accomplish much in the way of helping the situation. Or do you think that having it the other way with entirely different people for a time is going to be some form of reparations? SMDH. Get your head out of your arse. Or at least get off the internet and touch grass.

[@Mobius118]

@TeaTimeTable I would go kick rocks, but unfortunately they would crash through your oh so fragile glass house… what’s past is past, we’re speaking on the current issues society faces

[@TheCreatorNFE]

Meh. 🥱😪

[@ShootingStarStudio]

Rachel Zegler can sing. I will give her that much. She was incredible in West Side Story. But here’s the kicker: she LOOKED the part of Maria. Normally, I wouldn’t be quite so picky about looks in film adaptations, but in cases where the character’s visuals are important, that changes. Maria in WSS is Puerto Rican, and her heritage is a key part of the story. In The School for Good and Evil, Agatha is described as “ugly” (for lack of a better term) because visually, her character is supposed to be the opposite of what the school deems as “Good” (like how Sophie is meant to be extremely beautiful to reflect how Evil can disguise itself as Good). Snow White was literally named for her “skin as white as snow”, and the Evil Queen envies her for this because she wants to be the fairest of them all. Now, I don’t think it even matters that Rachel doesn’t look the part because she dug her own grave with her comments about the movie. The whole point of promoting a movie is to get people to want to watch it. If the lead actress is trash-talking the source material, no one will want to see it. Especially when that source material is a treasured memory of most people’s childhoods (it came out when my great-grandmother was a kid) and is the reason Walt Disney Studios is what it is today. Rachel’s career is kinda in the toilet, but the PR team also needs to get fired for letting her get away with this, or maybe even telling her to say these things.

[@hailey7596]

I like how Gal Gadot is just sitting there smiling and laughing nervously like "you know this film is paying your bills".

[@123soistes7]

No she does the same ..

[@catandrobbyflores]

​@@123soistes7at least she has the brain cells not to keep running her mouth.

[@lohengrin4009]

I’m thinking the mirror lied to the casting crew director, Gal Gadot was the fairest of them all 😊

[@hailey7596]

@@lohengrin4009 she's been very level headed and quite honestly charming on this press tour. I also think it's because she's very thankful for these opportunities and she's already played very well known roles. Rachel on the other hand is like the spoiled bratty teenager pissed off because Daddy said no Starbucks.

[@dreamwithinadreamfilms]

Gal is technically already on thin ice in Hollywood for serving in the IDF, an organization known for torturing and killing Palestinian children… But I agree that she’s much classier than Zegler, prettier, too. ❤

[@i_am_ergo]

When I eventually have kids, I'll do the "reverse Keira Knightley" and have the Disney remakes banned in my household, because _they_ send bad messages. Messages like extreme egocentrism, unearned sense of importance and privilege, general hate towards strong men and an overall hysterical, delusional image of the world.

[@moyosoreoluwabajo9552]

Me too

[@austinmoe4865]

Hahaha yes

[@KaitlinLuksa]

Lol this is already my reality. 😂

[@wednesdaydemchok825]

It’s a case by case basis in my house. The remake of Beauty and the Beast is pretty good. To me, Belle is still the same. It just adds more examples of her intelligence and I liked the back story bit.

[@KaitlinLuksa]

@@wednesdaydemchok825 I can't work past Emma Watson's "singing" 😬

[@UncleMikeDrop]

Snow White is literally named for her complexion.

[@Onorel]

I have a 12 year old daughter and I don't want her to grow up believing that she's doing something wrong if at any point in her life, she needs help from someone. Relationships are great BECAUSE you get to have someone to rely on, not despite it.

[@carl_anderson9315]

"The original cartoon came on 1937... and very evidently so". Agreed, it's a frigging masterpiece and one of the greatest films of all time.

[@CalloCallay]

And it will still be considered a masterpiece long after this turkey is forgotten.

[@Yarblocosifilitico]

you can tell she has a massive ego by the way she says it

[@laiorwyn]

😂 It's kinda obvious whatsherface never watched classic film or read classic literature. Actually I'd be surprised if she's finished a single novel from one cover to the other. She really shows a level of ignorance that is almost painful to see. What were her parents doing while she grew up?? Evidently not teaching her anything meaningful.

[@MK-Hogan]

The original Belle was a badass. She rebelled against the small town expectations, was well read and wanted to explore the world, she rejected the town hunk who all the other bimbo’s swooned over, and instead of loving Gaston for his shallow attributes, she developed love with the beast through compassion & empathy while teaching him to be tempered and vulnerable, and then holding him to those qualities. She literally saved the man, not the other way around! She was always my fave and most relatable as a child because of those things.

[@ab7974]

Yeah but she wasn’t in STEM so today Belle has to also be an engineer

[@anb2456]

Thank you, this is a lovely comment. She doesn’t judge people by the colour of their skin or by the size of their muscles, but by the content of their character. She sees with crystal clarity the serious flaws in Gaston’s character, his arrogance, his bullying, his stupidity, his aggression (because she’s intelligent). These are typical character flaws in modern men that we see so much of today. She sees the wonderful spirit and passion in her father, his desire to make the world a better place through his ingenuity, his intelligence, determination, dedication, devotion, humbleness and kindness, that we rarely see in modern men. This is true masculinity. It is the version of men that women love. She quickly identifies that the beast actually has kindness, but like so many modern men, he struggles with his emotions. She soothes his soul, and like you said, saves his life. She is beautiful outside and inside, she cares for everyone and everything around her, she is well read and intelligent, and she makes the world a better place. This is true femininity. These traits are magnificently attractive to men, and it is the version of women that men adore! The socialists of this troubled modern world are forcing young men to less masculine, and young women to be less feminine. I see some modern women with biceps, aggression, stupidity, bullying - like Gaston! It’s impossible for most men to be attracted to women like this. It is the opposite of magnificent femininity. It is toxic masculinity. And the socialists love modern men like Dylan Mulveny who show signs of stupidity, absurdity, vanity, narcissism, bitchiness, selfishness - toxic femininity. What would Belle think of these men?

[@MK-Hogan]

@@anb2456 Well said. Belle’s father is actually the “damsel in distress” in the movie and Belle defends & saves him too!

[@tomaszstramel3594]

Why do you need a "badass" character to feel better?

[@davidgoodnow269]

I have not watched Disney's Beauty and the Beast. When I read the story, I was struck by the fact that (in the version I read) that while she came to love Beast's courage in life, hard work, intelligence and diligence, and was horrified and saddened by his death at the hands of the villagers, she was initially self-absorbed, hateful of the Beast and villagers (serfs and tenant-farmers) alike, remarkably ignorant (Beast taught her to read, write, and do accounts so that she could assist him in his duties to his lands). What did Disney do to the story?

[@laurafreeman8360]

As a young woman who is an aspiring storyteller, the thought that modern feminists would likely disdain and despise my heroines brings me so much joy.

[@nerychristian]

I'm a guy. And even I spend a lot of time thinking about love. So I find it hard to believe that women don't want love and marriage and children. The only ones that I know who don't want those things are women who are miserable and ugly.

[@liamwarner5749]

@@nerychristian I'm not so sure I'd agree with that. A lot of the less attractive women I've run into are just as interested in love as anyone else, the one's who've tended to despise it are often the pretty and popular ones. I think its the people who have always had it there and take it for granted it always be there combined with a constant reinforcement that everything is about them. They feel free to despise it because they don't appreciate the lack of it.

[@nerychristian]

@@liamwarner5749 Not in my experience. I know a couple of women at work who are older, but single. And I can see why. They are plain looking women. But their personalities are also not very attractive. They are very picky and judgmental. And the women who are usually the friendliest are the ones who look healthy and thin and attractive. The ones who are fat and out of shape are usually not approachable. There is always a reason why a person is single. There are lots of guys who are willing to look past the exterior, but very few guys will put up with a woman who has a bad personality. Beauty comes from the heart. And women who are ugly on the inside, are usually also ugly on the outside.

[@liamwarner5749]

@@nerychristian Guess it comes down to who you run into, maybe a social thing depending on where you live. Here its generally been the prettier its all about me types who were the issue.

[@nerychristian]

@@liamwarner5749 There's different types of pretty. There's the "pretty" bimbo types who dress like sluts and post selfies every day. But I'm talking about genuinely beautiful and classy women that men dream of having as a wife. I also used to think like you. My default way of thinking was that if a person is unattractive, then it must mean the person must be really humble and friendly and have a nice heart. But it's not always the case. In fact, a lot of the time those women are usually bitter, or have issues, or are gossips, or lack self discipline or desire to improve themselves. People who are healthy, fit, and attractive usually are more optimistic about life.

[@RaymondCore]

This isn't a 'failure to understand', it is a conscious effort to remake society.

[@litigioussociety4249]

They werent kissed without any consent whatsoever. Snow White and Sleeping Beauty had already shown affection for the princes in the movies. It's like these people don't even remember the most intimate parts of the movies with songs like One Song and Once Upon a Dream. Saying they never gave consent is like saying a husband isn't allowed to give his wife a wake up kiss.

[@Xander1Sheridan]

they never watched the movies and they certainly don't understand them. Unfortunately these actresses don't understand much of anything at all.

[@liamwarner5749]

Yep Ariel tries to kiss the prince and he is the one to pull away to her frustration then her friends sing a song about kiss the girl. She is very clearly and obviously chasing him and given she can't speak the consent has to be inferred from those actions and the way she looks at him. Its not like she can't do the same thing he did and pull away if she doesn't like it.

[@pineapplesaucedaboss]

It's True Love's kiss, too, so it's not like the 7 Dwarves are all taking turns like it's the sword in the stone.

[@liamwarner5749]

@@pineapplesaucedaboss "Whomsoever awakens yonder ass with a kiss is the rightful king of England."

[@margeryojije7862]

"is like saying a husband isn't allowed to give his wife a wake up kiss" doesn't matter if you're married, if he/she isn't comfortable being kissed then don't do it lmao

[@1faithchick7]

Snow White also had agency. She saved herself by running away from everything she knew, with no weapon. She ran through a terrifying forest full of danger. She had never been outside the castle grounds before, but instead of waiting to be killed she escaped. She was so kind even her killer couldn't bring himself to kill her. She found the dwarves and imediatly figured out a way to, cheerfully, pay them for letting her stay with them by cleaning up the place. Also, reportedly, she was 14 during all this. Seems like a pretty empowering story for a 14 year old to me. Even her 'death' was caused by her being young and kind to who she thought was just a old lady needing help. Had she been a 14 year old boy the story wouldn't have changed.

[@almerindaromeira8352]

She trashed the seven dwarves' cabin and they took pity on her. She could stay with them as long as she took care of the house. A decade is then gone by until the queen found out she is alive. It is not important at all, but it shiws that the original story has nothing of virtuous. It's just a 300+ years old german folkstale

[@Christinafan2002]

14? I don’t think she was 14 in the original movie. 14 is like a baby. I'd think she was more like 17-19.

[@KathyH684]

​@@almerindaromeira8352 No, Snow White cleans the cottage. If she left it as is, the dwarfs would've gotten extremely sick.

[@almerindaromeira8352]

@@KathyH684 have you ever read the actual tale? It doesn't match up with Disney's animation.

[@KathyH684]

@@almerindaromeira8352 Oh, I thought you were talking about the classic movie since that's what the original comment was about. My bad. But yes, I have read the original fairytale. 3 versions of it actually.

[@TNTITAN]

I still don’t understand how “A woman should save herself” isn’t one of the most condescending messages to give to women in abusive households.

[@raidanforster6273]

Yeah it really shows that they’ve never been put in a situation or position like that, worst they’ve probably endured is whether a guy looks in their direction a little too long

[@TNTITAN]

@@axeSyntax As someone who considers themselves saved by his wife emotionally, completely agree.

[@firstnamelastname8058]

This reminds me of the phrase "such is life" used by the bad boys!. We're strong, We're rebellious and unlawful.. just look at my tattoos and listen to my car... So why not use the most pacifist saying out there?!

[@thenonexistinghero]

I think it's good if a woman can save herself, but it's also okay if she's saved by someone else (including men). Same thing for men. Sometimes there's no way out of a situation without the help of someone else.

[@heikki1623]

Women in abusive households actually should save themselves.

[@angrymeowngi]

I mean, to keira's point on "being kissed while unconscious" the princess story is closer to being given a "mouth to mouth" to save your life. I mean, if that will save me, you can even use a bit of tongue.

[@TheSoulCalledZuzia]

But she wasn't even unconscious, she was dead. I think kissing someone as a form of very last goodbye isn't that bad. It may be weird, but not bad.

[@lord_ozymandias]

@@TheSoulCalledZuziayeah like if i died and a random dude kissed my corpse id be weirded out but i’d also be dead and ergo no longer giving a shit what happened to my body DJDJDJ

[@StarrySoakedSkiess]

LMAOOO I love this comment

[@TheSoulCalledZuzia]

@@lord_ozymandias It wasn't even "random" dude, I'd argue. They've seen each other before and didn't seem to hate each other

[@bunille]

exactly

[@TheLastAshbringer]

The fact this actress who honestly I’ve never even heard of, hated the original just says this is a terrible casting choice

[@Ruinwyn]

Hated the original, apparently, because the scary forest part was too scary for her as a child. So now she is great girl boss Snow-white who isn't scared of anything. She didn't even know the original story and just parroted some memes because she was too scared to watch it. The original can be too scary to little kids, but using that as source of pride while girl bossing show incredible lack of self awareness.

[@13redlion13]

but that is the way things are done nowadays. and in the movies or series like the witcher where the main actor actually loves the source material he gets sidelined and finally removed because he's a thorn for the writers

[@kellharris2491]

The forest scene was pretty scary as a child and snow white was only 14. Snow white was scared of him and ran away. And he shows up out of no where just to kiss her while she is unconscious. I mean these are the facts of the story.

[@BB25_25]

@@kellharris2491 yep, better she stays in a coma for the rest of her life than find true love and live happily ever after. Or shame she can’t work in an office for the rest of life looking at spreadsheets and bossing people around, that sounds like a much better existence.

[@TheLastAshbringer]

@@kellharris2491 being scared sometimes is part of growing up.

[@maxdoles5806]

My favorite Disney couple is a largely overlooked one. I love Tarzan's parents. They work together, overcoming challenges side-by-side. Neither one is explicitly shown as superior to the other. They both are shown with strengths, and they support each other in their shortcomings. This is how couples should be.

[@reberee677]

Extremely underrated Disney couple!❤❤❤

[@hydrolito]

Jane was also a strong character knew how to shoot a rifle, ride a horse, swim and swing from vines in various Tarzan stories.

[@kingandrewcecil348]

​​@@hydrolitoIndeed. Even in the 1999 Disney movie, she (along with her father) even separately helped Tarzan save his gorilla family from Clayton while Tarzan deals with Clayton personally, and after marrying her man Tarzan she is occasionally shown to be a tough fighter in addition to being a damsel-in-distress in the 2001 follow-up TV show "The Legend Of Tarzan".

[@natylopez5]

Why can't we just enjoy a simple love and fantasy story? Why does everything need to reflect the real world??

[@JerbilKonai]

If I were to be malicious, I would say that some people don't have an ounce of fantasy. And now that I think about it, there was something true in the original telling of the Snow Queen: shards of the devil's broken mirror stuck in the eyes and hearts of people, making them see only the worst in others or making them cold and bitter. Having no fantasy (no ability to "see"/imagine) or love (cold heart) would fit and would probably from that premise alone make a better story than any Disney remake: some person (most likely in a position of power) having shards in eyes and heart, making everyone around them suffer and along comes someone who warms the heart and opens the eyes to the world (it basically writes itself :b)

[@GothLady1987]

Because we somehow have decided that laughing at ourselves and/or enjoying the escape of fantasy isn't good enough. This SJW approach has destroyed our ability to laugh and enjoy the little rarities in life. "Injustice" is too important to be distracted by fantasy. As if films like Snow White, the Wizard of Oz, etc. weren't made as an escape from the realities of WWII and the Great Depression, no. We can't have that anymore, we have to see that and only that.

[@luvu33]

Because it's about a 14 yo that is a people pleaser who have no personality through the movie that doesn't get a character development and is going to get married by a 31 yo guy who have a 5 min screen time with we don't know if he's actually a good character

[@Window4503]

Because media in general has turned away from art for art’s sake and toward art for the sake of the message. It’s a philosophical issue.

[@Diana-qp2rw]

It’s sad and, honestly, frightening that movies have turned into a medium for woke messages. I tend to enjoy the stories of older movies much more because I can find another world in them. Sometimes I don’t want to think, I just want to watch a beautiful or entertaining story. And while not everything needs to be a love story, I still want to watch a beautiful love story that doesn’t have any political messages. But apparently Disney wants to tell us how to think and what we should want in our lives.

[@cormacpwalsh]

I am a drama teacher and I thoroughly enjoy the richness and strength of your accent. You put a very timely point across so well. I am sick and tired how the wonderful world of drama has become a pseudo gripe world for race, gender, heightism and any other chancers who are putting down the actual graft of working in drama to use media to put them in the spotlight. Did our new Snow White spend as much time working on the set as she did faffing in interviews? She's a deeply ageist person to be so unanalytical and dismissive of the work that has gone before her.

[@ShadyDoorags]

I'm beyond fed up with people who have no knowledge of IPs while also vehemently hating them, somehow getting complete control over them. Obviously, Rachel isn't writing nor directing the movie, but her attitude is exemplary of those that are. This happening to Snow White is hitting me harder than other IPs because it's one of, if not the, most important movies in animation. Even if it's not perfect, it deserves a certain amount of respect that these Hollywood elites refuse to provide.

[@KatieLHall-fy1hw]

I feel like the original animated film deserves SO much respect. But at the end of the day it’s still another fairytale. If they want to make it weird, sure, they can. I will probably skip and keep going through all the animated films that I own already (I really like Cinderella, myself, and I LOVE the Jungle Book!)

[@lizzie0x077]

Can we talk about Eric for a moment. Dude was all about consent. He didn't push himself onto her, he didn't take advantage of her, and was a solid role model for boys. Ariel wanted to see the world and he took in a girl into a safe environment to help her learn about basic things that, in his eyes, everyone should know. Also Kiss the Girl is my fav Disney song and I got my hubs to dance to it at our wedding (not first dance but second).

[@vegeta002]

So big on consent, Ariel had to practically _throw herself_ at him and conspire with Sebastian just to get one kiss.

[@GingerZombie29]

They also keep saying that Ariel wanted to go to the surface because of Eric. Didn't she want to see the surface before she even knew he existed?

[@vegeta002]

@@GingerZombie29 Aye, she already had a large collection of Human stuff before she even saw him. The animated prequel series to the film also showed her obsession quite often, with Eric being mostly absent (his discarded _boots_ made a cameo, but she never saw Eric himself).

[@zynpkrdg]

Eric was GREAT. He is a hero fr. He goes back to a BURNING SHIP to save his dog, he can play the flute and dance, he goes to towns in disguise to see how they are doing regularly, he fricking KILLED URSULA WITH HIS SHIP AND SAVED EVERYONE, and he loved ariel without even hearing her talk. He's amazing. Ariel loved the land even before meeting Eric, but meeting Eric sealed that love. She thought her future should be up there with him, she saw him be kind and have fun, then save the dog from fires heroicly, so she saved him too. Theirs was a beautiful story.

[@thing1thing2themediamaniac43]

It was Prince Eric who pulled back and it was Ariel who leaned in for the kiss during The Song Kiss The Girl in The original Disney film. Which is what makes the song about consent in The Remake SO DAMN FUNNY IN A SO BAD IT'S SO PAINFUL YET FUNNY WAY

[@swordrush]

"You should never give up your voice for a man." That's...that's the whole point of the film. That's part of the lesson Ariel learns.

[@Fuzz82]

Meanwhile they 'Yass Queen' Ursula.

[@AuntLoopy123]

I think that they often judge the movie without actually watching it all the way through. And when they do watch, they already have their rainbow-colored glasses on, and can't see its true colors.

[@Hydraulic67]

So kissing a woman that’s sleeping is horrible, but the wicked Witch performing evil magic isn’t a concern? WOW, how did you become a parent?

[@renamon5658]

Princesses went from wanting something more. To being a girl boss

[@SydneyWatson]

Writers these days don't understand actual people. They live in a bubble and think that bubble is representative of the wider community. It's insane.

[@dennisrounds1996]

A princess is accustomed to being waited on by servants. Men aren’t going to wait on them hand and foot . Chivalry went out the door when they cried for “equality”

[@nerychristian]

I'm a guy, and even I spend a lot of time thinking about finding true love. So I doubt women don't spend time thinking about that too. Which makes all of this woke bullshit even more insufferable and fake.

[@claraf.6833]

I don't hate the idea of not needing a prince to tell a story. There is different types of love, like the love for your family, your friends or your home. I don't like the idea of taking classic Disney movies, changing everything about them for the sake of being more "modern" and then slapping the old name on them to fill seats. Just create new stories for crying out loud.

[@morrigankasa570]

​@@dennisrounds1996 I'm a 30 yr old Man and I still practice some forms of "Chivalry". I still hold the doors open for people, I sometimes pull out chairs to help Senior Citizens at certain events, I sometimes help the Old Women in my apartment building with their groceries, and other general decent things. More good people should be like that!!!

[@diveforknowledge]

Its not just Disney, its the Age of Insufferability.

[@lovetolovefairytales]

Rachel has no taste. Snow White is a gorgeous animated film.

[@Poosaysukah9]

A gorgeous film filled with racism and predatory behavior 💀. Why is Snow White 14 but the “prince” who kisses her is 31? 🤔

[@lovetolovefairytales]

@@Poosaysukah9 no way he's actually meant to be 31. That's an urban myth. Also, did you know in the original fairytale, she's seven, and he doesn't kiss her at all? His servant trips carrying her glass coffin and the apple bite gets jolted out of her throat. Also Racism??? What the 🦆?

[@SyLuX636]

Seems like people like to talk too much about a film or fairytale they don't know anything about or even read.

[@pbluma]

@@Poosaysukah9 Because age is a modern thing and even still, there are plenty of countries where aoc is 14-16. That means that not so long ago nobody would care if I as a 29yo male dated a 16yo. Actually, here in central Europe most people wouldn't care, and I don't have to time travel either.

[@Wishmaster787]

​@@pblumaAge of consent in my country is 16 but if a 29 year old man here was dating a 16 year old girl it wouldn't be viewed very favourably and people would see him as a pedo.

[@VoidVoic]

I think the biggest issue with looking back at media and people from decades past is that we forget that those periods of time were completely different. Societally, a lot of behaviors and attitudes were completely normal for the time. Trying to hold them up to today’s standards and getting upset that they don’t have the same mindset towards race and gender as us is like getting upset that a horse-drawn carriage from the 1800’s isn’t as fast as a 2024 jeep wrangler

[@JustaGuy_Gaming]

The biggest joke about the attacks on the old princesses... the men were worse. In fact I think the prince in Snow White didn't even have a name. For all the talk about the portrayal of women in old Disney movies they had more agency and depth than the male characters.

[@kenbrown2808]

traditionally, his name was Charming.

[@Poosaysukah9]

Because it’s about the women in royalty and princesses which is why it’s called disney princesses. It’s not abt the men .

[@peterg76yt]

Even Ken in the Barbie movie had a name.

[@shannongodin]

The prince in Cinderella and Snow White are both called Prince Charming, Aurora gets Phillip and Belle has Adam/Beast

[@JustaGuy_Gaming]

@@shannongodin Nah only Cinderalla is the prince called Charming. While Snow white does fit the sterotype, he has no name. I guess he was called Prince Florian for Disney on ice. Basically Disney Princes were the most boring characters in the world for a long time.

[@brendantailor3852]

It’s always been hilarious to me that Rachel calls the prince a stalker, last time I checked in the movie the one who stalks her is the EVIL WITCH. Not to mention the prince has an accumulative screen time of like 5 minutes💀

[@joefish6091]

It must say something about Rachel Zaglers sex and emotional life that she is so hostile to a hetro male, is she a closet carpet muncher !?

[@doll.ov.poetrii4682]

Exactly! Not to mention, she was singing a song about "wishing for my love to find me today" when the prince popped up next to her. She WANTED him to come near her! She's also a princess by birth, why wouldn't a prince from another kingdom naturally not want to check out his likely counterpart?

[@Astonelle]

@@doll.ov.poetrii4682 FR THOUGH 👁👄👁

[@KingofL85]

Evil witch is turning good this time n prince gonna get jail time or death.also queen n nowhite will probably lesbian lovers this tim.😂😂

[@chenstormstout9456]

He has so little screen time that you don’t even know his name! I had to look it up, it’s Prince Florian!

[@sheilaparkins1402]

I think putting down Cinderella and Snow White is pretty messed up actually. Both *were* victims, of horrific parental and family abuse. Both maintained resilience, hope, and good moral character through it all. That's something amazing, not lowly. And who cares of they ended up with guys in the end? Heaven forbid people fall in love with someone great 🙄 And in Cinderella's case it is a nice fantasy, not a weakness. I had trouble in my family but couldn't afford to move out, and you get your boots I was dreaming of getting married, mainly because I love my husband, but secondarily because it would be a stable, sustainable way to not love with my parents and their issues. Telling a victim that they're *weak* and less-than for needing help from others to overcome their abusers is insanely messed up.

[@kadran3263]

Completely agree. If all these actresses were man-hating lesbians I would understand part of their motivation to denigrate men but people do help each other and fall in love if all goes well. However, as they seem to be straight, I have no idea what they're getting at. They want a man who does not help them and who does not fall in love with them? They are offended that they might not be human i.e. need others to function better? I hadn't realised the trauma aspect of these stories until you stated it in your post and I love what you said. I had a chaotic childhood, too. I still dream of a man to whisk me away because I still have trouble managing and I want to be in love with someone who is in love with me. I really don't understand how narcissistic these women are or how they can be promoted with no critical thought. Not the mainstream media's strength, I know. I'm glad you escaped your family and made a healthy family of your own. You rock!

[@Blashyrk00]

I really like your analysis, and agree with the fact that maybe Cinderella wanted to have fun and a better life. And also, who wouldn't want a lovely elder woman to help you achieve that? That was what I personally loved about the story, and it even has a more empowering message than these remakes: a woman helping another woman, who happens to meet a nice man 😊

[@MiniFi_]

Kinda crazy how she thought Cinderella was just waiting for a man to save her. Like that isn't even the plot, just how it ends. Cinderella did make her own dress to go to the ball and did all of her chores, but then the powers that be still forced her down until she was 'rescued' by the fairy godmother. If anything, the story resonates with audiences because it's a story of someone who did everything right and still gets screwed, but good things come to her in the end. It seems like many people are remembering these movies through their childlike eyes but analyzing them with their now adult thoughts. It makes sense the takes come off as fairly shallow.

[@mak7587]

Walt Disney will be rolling over in his freezer. 🤣

[@methosimortal]

I was thinking the same thing when Knightly said Cinderella should save herself. Save herself how? She's a victim of parental abuse, she's being exploited for labour, she has no other relatives, no money, nowhere to go. How is she supposed to save herself?!? There are situations in life where you can't girl boss your way out. The whole moral of the story of Cinderella is that even when you are being treated terribly, if you can find it in you to be kind and generous the way she is to her mice friends and to her fairy godmother, eventually that kindness will be returned to you. It's a pretty nice message to send to young kids about resilience and fortitude in the face of adversity. Also she's making these characters sound like they're all out there fishing for husbands. Cinderella doesn't want to go to the ball to "seduce" the prince. She just wants to have a little bit of fun, a night off so to speak. It just so happens that when she does arrive at the ball, the prince notices her and they fall in love. It's actually a confirmation of how wonderful Cinderella is that with just one dance, the prince falls in love with her. It's a twist of fate, a bit of whimsy and magic. These people are treating these characters as if they're Instagram models. 🤦

[@marianabuhl]

Dude, I don't know what is up with people these days that they think to love someone or being helped by someone is oh so terrible... I literally am my own boss and I have a business and I do dream of finding the true love I haven't found yet, it won't make me less worthy or weaker or anything. What's so wrong with that?!

[@microcolonel]

“All of Andrew's scenes could get cut..” was just the most callous imaginable thing... Imagine working with somebody who jokes about how your character is secondary, and how literally your entire performance could be cut from the film...

[@aw3someinc175]

Imagine how necessary those scenes might be…if Zegler isn’t sure that he will be in the final product then one can at least hypothesize that whatever the script asked him to do has such little effect on the story that he might be in there just because the source material has a prince

[@suddenlycrows]

If I was him, I'd find a way to make sure I never have to work with her again.

[@Miluielle]

Absolutely. Those words of Rachel Zegler are the best evidence to demonstrate how opposite she is to the character of the original Disney Snow White. Snow White was kind, empathetic, innocent and well meaning toward everyone. Renee on the other hand is casual and callous in dismissing a colleagues work and value.

[@Nyet-Zdyes]

It reveals a lot about her personality... none of it good.

[@jessicaandtrains7768]

Being sexist only goes one way

[@CrownOfRoses541]

The character is SNOW WHITE, a PRINCESS in need of RESCUE FROM HER EVIL STEPMOTHER. NOT St. Joan of friggin' Arcadia. Gods. 👋🙄 I've been saying that Walt wouldn't like what's been happening with his company for YEARS NOW. And yet, whenever I, or someone else, says something like that, the critters that "hate Walt Disney" for whatever reason, all come out of the woodwork, and start demonizing the man. They're just a bunch of Dizni Apologists, that wouldn't know a good movie if it walked up, and kicked them in their a**es. 👋🙄

[@nour2146]

They didn’t even honour the man during the 100 year anniversary which is insulting and disrespectful

[@bigtomcutter7804]

The life of a visionary american commie crusher isn't and easy one, but by God does it bear fruit. Such a shame the new gardeners wouldn't know a hoe from an underage hoe.

[@Xander1Sheridan]

@@nour2146 The company has hated Walt for a very long time.

[@Onnarashi]

Disney didn't create Snow White or most of the other stories. They're centuries old folktales. Americans didn't invvent fairytales, they just copied them.

[@frameshoot8567]

@@nour2146 i couldnt agree more... as is tradic just thinking about

[@remylebeau4699]

The Little Mermaid thing just gets me every time. Ariel giving up her voice was supposed to be a bad choice. No one at the end of the movie thinks she should have done that. THATS THE POINT OF THE MOVIE!

[@Skidibibapbap]

It shows that desperation will get you no where but even at the end her own charm and being herself won over the prince

[@Dragblacker]

But little girls like playing Ariel, instead of hating her, thus it is "evil".

[@Intrinsiccan]

I felt the same, it’s a cautionary tale about giving up your voice… always thought that was the point. I remember as a teenager talking with my little sisters about this at length.

[@neredya7605]

Also she wanted to go to the human world way long before she even saw the prince, she was alway fascinated by it The prince just added to it and her father destroying her things was the final straw

[@Dragblacker]

I wonder if part of their mindset has to do with the way pop culture describes these movies. Pop culture boils them down to this inaccurate vision, and they run with it. It's the same thing as people thinking Star Trek TOS is about Kirk bedding green aliens, when that never really happened, and a "green alien" was only the focus of one episode.@@neredya7605

[@andrewdevine3920]

In "Living in Oblivion' a pre-fame Peter Dinklage played an extra who got angry about little people being typecast (quite hilariously, actually), and apparently he's now reprising that exact role in real life.

[@crowmedicine3890]

Fun fact: my grandmother's cousin was Adriana Caselotti, the voice of Snow white. I remember as a child her singing "some day my prince will come" to me. She WAS a girl boss, as was her mother Maria, a pretty famous opera singer.

[@carla8687]

That's super cool! What a lovely memory

[@ericlehman6841]

That's neat!

[@luvbeinghiswife1148]

That's awesome! Thank you so much for sharing! 👍

[@dennisweidner288]

It is so refreshing to hear a rational person honestly discussing these issues.

[@tomsanders5584]

I dunno man, I think the wisdom of a 22 year-old air head is something we should all marvel at (not).

[@dennisweidner288]

@@tomsanders5584 I assume you are talking about Rachel Zeglar. The thing is that she is just being honest about what Iger is doing with Disney. As insufferable as Zeglar is, unlike Iger at least she is honest.

[@livefree3282]

"Rational" being the key point lol thank God

[@franccoeurguy4735]

every normal persons think like her.... not really refreshing

[@dennisweidner288]

@@franccoeurguy4735 If every normal person thinks like here, why is there such a backlash. I suggest you look at how Disney's woke movies and programming actually do.

[@brennaceron2628]

Am I wrong? I was certain the Prince thought Snow White was dead. He was kissing her goodbye. And in Sleeping Beauty, the only way to wake her was true love's kiss and he truly loved her. Was he supposed to leave her languishing in that sleep for eternity?

[@nerychristian]

And people wonder why so many men have just chosen to remain single. It's just not worth it to deal with these insufferable women. You're damned if you do, and damned if you don't.

[@shawnmcdaniel435]

Others in the comments have made that same case...and you are right. The kissed without consent narrative is just simplistic misinformation. But the feminists will just ignore the facts and try to sell you their truth.

[@GameFreakSucks]

These activists don’t even understand the whole point of these classic movies

[@noneofyourbusiness2766]

I thought she was presumed to be dead. Wasn't it a funeral?

[@slightlymad5724]

Why do people dislike the Damsel in Distress trope? It has a lot of potential for developing the character of both the damsel and the knight.

[@EA-gv2ph]

The thing is people don't dislike "girl bosses", Mulan, Moana, Brave and Tangled were very well received. People like good characters, people don't like old characters reimagined because it's lazy writing.

[@poisonedyoyo]

And yet it sounds like Moana isnt DEI enough for Disneys current tastes. Then again, maybe it was just listed because that live action remake is coming, but I do know for a fact that Hercules, Tarzan, Sword in the Stone, and Lilo and Stitch are all getting DEI makeovers. I assume for a lot of these that means girl bossery, it definitely does in the case of Hercules, the others might be too far off to know. Lilo and Stitch kind of too, but Im not sure to what extent. What I have heard though is that Nani is now academically focused, with her future lanned out or something, and maybe with that in mind, having to raise her younger sister seems like a burden to her, but...that does not describe original Nani at all.

[@EA-gv2ph]

@@JonJangerson there was nothing humble about Merida though. It's not a specific characteristic that is endearing. The thing is that there is actual character development and that this women aren't perfect because they are women, they evolve and get better because they face challenges. In recent adaptations the only "flaw" they have is that they don't believe in themselves, other than that they are perfect. Which is why they aren't relatable.

[@lareolanKFP]

Not quite. We like well-written characters, we don't like characters whose entire bio reads "she's a kickass girl-boss" and that's all you need to know to 100% describe the character...

[@RobertManzano]

I guess the major difference is those characters were demonstrably oppressed by the society/family they were born into. When they pushed against the world, it pushed back and knocked them down, several times, and they had to change and grow and win over allies to help them accomplish their goals. Their talents and moral strengths were balanced against weakness and vulnerability and that's why the audience wanted them to succeed.

[@protorhinocerator142]

Hollywood has portrayed tough/smart women for decades. Literally nobody had a problem with it. What they're pushing today is nothing like Princess Leia, Cleopatra Jones, Ripley from Alien, or Sarah Connor from The Terminator.

[@sim5737]

They ruined Mulan by taking away her relatability and character development. As children we saw ourselves in Mulan's flaws and her wish to be a better child to her parents. Watching her grow and bring honour to her family gave us hope that we could do the same. By making her an inherent girl boss with the power of Chi they took away that reflection we saw of ourselves because she was no longer normal, she became Superman who is unattainable from the get go .-.

[@DiademAce]

Yeah the point was she trained like everyone else. She had value in the skills she learned in the army. And the men around her were still capable and liked to be around her and not used to make a point. Making her “perfect” doesn’t make her Mulan. It makes her some annoying blank slate with a superiority complex.

[@patrickporter6536]

Really?

[@Sam-U-S-i4z]

That remake simply said a woman can't beat men unless she has superpowers. The original mulan depicted that although she had physical disadvantages as a woman, she used her brains and cleverness as well to overcome challenges and at the same time help the other men training with her. Also proved at the end that a woman can also become a valiant warrior

[@Dernachtmachen]

"Empty vessels void of personality" describes a lot of Hollywood actresses, not Disney characters. The more I watch this video, the more I get the sense that Hollywood...hollows out the souls of these women so that they are nothing more than trained parrots who repeat back talking points given to them by their agents and media personalities. The price of fame and fortune. Great video Sydney!

[@AuntLoopy123]

I am reminded of a certain scene in the "Worldwide Privacy Tour" episode of South Park, where Harry lifts Megan's head, and shouts "Hellooooo!" into the hollow chamber that should house her soul.

[@rebelyellmeh]

I'm sure you mean well but this take isn't helpful. Of course they're repeating talking points given to them, that's literally their job. They're trying to market the movie the way the studio wants it to be marketed. When you see them in interviews, they have hours of training beforehand. You don't know these women, but you choose to demote them to only what the media portrays of them. Why would you expect a woman to seem well rounded when you only get to see one side of them, and it's their professional side lol

[@pinobluevogel6458]

@@rebelyellmeh How is your take any more helpful? Just accepting how bad hollywood is and how actors and actresses all just play along to an agenda that has a bad influence on its audience? I much prefer Hollywood stars to use their platform to speak out against this. The big ones can't be ignored as they can sell movies and series by themselves. Even smaller ones that have a strong moral frame like for example Gina Carano can still make an impact to stop all this nonsense. She might have gotten fired, but she was picked up by the more conservative counterculture immediately.

[@BB25_25]

@@rebelyellmeh your take is literally worse, they are marketing the movies as themselves, if these aren’t their personal views they’re spouting then they have no integrity and are just empty vessels devoid of personality.

[@jillsauder8340]

The Disney princesses are anything but empty vessels. They get the lion's share of the screen time, and they use it to develop their personalities, until you feel like you know them. On the other hand, I think the princes get short shrift. Think of Snow White's beau Prince Ferdinand (I think-? Not even sure of his name). His big scenes were cut, and all we know about him is he is good, he can sing, and he is in love with Snow White. In other words, like many Disney princes, he got the Ken treatment! I wish I knew them better.

[@LilaGalicia]

Narcism disguised as empowerment is bad for business 😂

[@kyacook5702]

what's so interesting is that the majority of the cartoon princesses' movies featured the princesses saving the day. Mulan saved China, Rapunzel saved Flinn, Ariel saved Aric, Anna saved Elsa, Meridth saved her family, Belle saved the beast and his servants, and Mona saved her tribe. Also, Pocahontas saved John Smith, and Tina and Naveen saved each other. I do not understand why people like Rachel think that there are no princesses that save the day. Most of them did and fell in love during their journey.

[@varnix1006]

They forget that romance is the side quest, not the main quest.

[@nightmarishcompositions4536]

And they did it while still being very sweet, kind and lovable. Not hateful, miserable and toxic.

[@bappo2693]

Because these woke types didn’t even watch those pictures. It’s like with Andrew Tate - I hate him, but no idea what he said to make me hate him. They do what they are told to do.

[@winnetouch]

Because it doesn't fit their narrative. It's that simple. They are cherry picking because otherwise their whole woke agenda falls apart.

[@AZodiacCancer]

Never seen it but doesn't Anastasia save her country or something?

[@Knowbody42]

Basically, she doesn't want love, she wants power. I'm pretty sure that's called narcissism.

[@merieem88]

For men who want power too, and more than women, why don't you call this narcissism

[@Yarblocosifilitico]

@@merieem88 who says he doesn't? Narcissism is narcissism. But there's one important aspect to consider: social status has always been the way men got to have a wife they desired and a family to provide for. Evolution has engraved in us the need to climb the social ladder. So, don't make the reductionist mistake of equating all search for status as narcissism. Men have to impress women in various aspects of life; women only have to be beautiful and nice for men to desire them. And you won't hear many obese, ugly men saying they'll only settle for a 10/10 woman. But you will hear plenty obese, ugly women DEMANDING a 10/10 man. Also, we're talking about films, and in classic films with a male lead, he's always seeking power in order to be a hero, not for the sake of power. In fact, that very important point is often adressed through the antagonist (people who want power for the sake of it have always been the villains... until recently).

[@idontevenknowatthispoint7664]

I think she should’ve been cast as the evil queen since they both obviously hate Snow white with a burning passion. 😒

[@チコべスティア]

Adding the perfect match of self-centered personality and vanity of both.

[@brucekeys4910]

I had no idea Rachel Zegler actually co-wrote the story.

[@Solar_Corpus]

This girl boss isn’t only brainwashing to young women, but I feel like it effects male audiences as well, I feel like it puts this idea into men’s heads that we don’t need them, and their companionship. We do. Humans need each other, to survive, to go on. I’m not saying if you choose the single life, you’re bad, but that’s not the majority of people. I feel so pressured to be “girl boss” that I think I’m so pathetic half of the time for just being normal. It hurts. I’m not some perfect, bad ass woman, I’m just your regular lady, who wants to get her companion, and carry on her lineage, it seems like future potential husbands see this trope and they might also start looking for these perfect girl bosses thinking it’s the norm. It’s NOT.

[@varnix1006]

I find most men that gave up on relationship not out of the idea of not needing a woman, but they just gave up cause pleasing woman is too much work for so little reward. Meanwhile most women who don't need no man are like that because they see men as either stepping stone or competition.

[@KaleRylan]

I think this is a BIT strong, but I do agree that pushing the idea of self-sufficiency to its logical extreme interferes with the idea that relationships are good because we can make up for each others' flaws and be better for it. It's OKAY to want a guy to carry things for you. It doesn't make you a weak person.

[@unstablesyn1306]

I'm generalizing here, but men aren't avoiding women to seek the girl boss, they're avoiding women and relationships because of the girl boss. We've been told so many times we're not wanted or needed, and many women's standards have gone up so high, it's not worth it. For proof there are entire youtube channels that make careers out of pointing this out, such as Better Bachelor

[@leburger5160]

Though I agree that it can, and does, have a negative effect on men. I also would like to point out that this "girl boss" trope, is a red flag. Any self respecting dude would see that and walk right out the door he came in. I would never subject myself to the mental gymnastics of a woman who "doesn't need no man." Being an independent woman is fine. Taking care of yourself is fine. Being self sufficient is fine. However, the girl boss mentality isn't fine. Its the first indication that you will never be valued or viewed as an equal in your relationship, if you're the man... So don't fret. There are plenty of dudes out here that would be over the moon to be with a woman who doesn't subscribe to this girl boss nonsense, such as yourself. You'll find your companion one day...

[@nrrork]

No, guys hate this girl boss crap. Even the simps who claim to support it would be like Ken and immediately turn into a real man the instant they met a real woman who treated him well.

[@jasonxoc]

Her irritation has NOTHING to do with her being a girl.... She's just insane. Point for consideration : She calls the prince a weird stalker while her character breaks into a house, cleans it without permission and takes a nap in their beds...weird. WiERD. She's just like every other young person who thinks access to knowledge == knowledge and thinks other people value thier opinions. Most people don't care about your opinions unless your opinions are hyper insightful. Took me till my 20's to realize this.

[@BartdeBoisblanc]

That is hard won knowledge that no one can take from you.

[@Nickpetronio]

That is a great point!

[@jasonxoc]

@@BartdeBoisblanc Your balls will drop one day, keep that chin up there buddy.

[@glauciamsq]

And also, upon rewatching, cinderella didn't want a prince, she wanted a day off!!!!! And got it because of her own attitudes and kindness. The prince was totally a plus. And when he came to her house, she actually rescued herself with the help of the animal friends SHE had because she was a KIND person. She saved the day herself, by being herself, and not losing her spirit after a lifetime of suffering abuse and violence, she managed to keep sane by giving and receiving love in whichever manner she could (the main story for me is not the prince, but the rats)

[@TrafalgarWaterDLaw-dl5cm]

Its funny because thats what id say is the core "message". Cinderella is a diamont purposely kept dirty and hidden while her stepsisters are piles of shit dressed in silk. The fairy godmother simply ler all her good qualities and beauty shine out for once and gave her some freedom from her caged live as servant. The Prince falls for her first, and it is him who searches for her once they connected during the Ball. Her motovation wasnt to get the prince, the prince serves booth as confirmation of how great and pure she is that he who could have any woman choses her. As well as her out of misery into a happy live with love her personality deserves. Wich.. for the time makes sense and if properly analyzed still works today.

[@charleshartley9597]

Wow, as a guy Cinderella wasn't exactly marketed to me, but I have seen it. Not my point though. I hadn't thought of her story in this light and that message, that story to me makes her story so much more impressive, powerful. In the face of adversity, she maintains her sense of self. I also note that it is other women who are her oppressors, which is in its own way a sad commentary on contemporary society. Anyway, I grew up with female hero's like Sarah Connor and Ellen Ripley, and I think I need to add Cinderella to that list! Thank you for the insight!

[@saigyl9149]

1 dimensional hollywood NPCs are incapable of seeing the depth of the stories

[@AuntLoopy123]

@@charleshartley9597 Cinderella is a great example of a "strong female lead" who is still soft and feminine. Her strengths are all mental and emotional. She does the emotional labor of taking care of her little friends, and they help her, in return. If she hadn't helped them first, she wouldn't have been saved, in the end. She shows strength of character, staying true to herself, her ideals, her character, her core moral values. These are "soft," but they are strengths, nevertheless. And her ideals and character are more "feminine," however caring for others, nurturing those in need, being kind are things that are just as valid from a man as from a woman. For another excellent example of a victim of domestic violence (without the physical violence, but definitely the financial/emotional abuse), who seems weak, because she doesn't "rescue herself," but shows her strength in the end, by staying true to herself, and her ideals, and what she KNOWS is right, please read "Mansfield Park" by Jane Austen. If you can't read it, then watch the BBC version from 1983. Do NOT watch any other version of it. Just... don't. Ick. Ick, ICK! Especially the Frances O'Connor version. IIIIIIIICK! They Feministed her. Waaaaah! Oh, and by the way, if/when you do read/watch Mansfield Park, here is some Jane Austen Pop Culture you should know: "Lover's Vows" was downright scandalous, and was well-known for being scandalous, at the time. In fact, the stage direction for the scene where Agatha and her son, Frederick, are reunited is kind of incestuous. Like, with "She places his head on her breast," and kissing and stuff. Acting was not considered proper for young ladies of social position, anyway. Acting out an incestuous scene, involving a woman who had given birth out of wedlock, was soooooooo scandalous! It was sort of like saying, "Hey! We're bored, so let's make a pr0n, for funzies! Don't worry, Ma! We'll tone it down, so it's only soft-core. It'll be FINE!" Keep that in mind, and the book will make a LOT more sense. Families COULD take part in little family theatricals, like telling fairy tales (the clean ones, not Sleeping Beauty) or a bit of farce, or even some Shakespeare. But only the bare minimum of minimalist theater, with a blanket for a curtain, and NO OUTSIDERS INVOLVED. And while many people would watch a scandalous play, and even keep multiple salacious plays in their libraries to read, it was NOT ON for the young ladies to actually ACT in one, and definitely not to involve someone who was not part of the actual household! The culture in which Jane Austen wrote Mansfield Park was VERY strict about keeping young ladies innocent in the ways of sex, and even innuendo. So, Lovers' Vows, with its actual bastard hero and "fallen" heroine, and their OVERLY PHYSICAL intimacy, was just waaaaaaaay overboard for a household of gentility and actual rank. Sir Thomas was a literal nobleman. Low on the totem pole, but still, literal nobility, not a mere knight. And you have to bear that in mind when you read about the "home theatricals," they did. Fanny Price is like Cinderella. She is put-upon and emotionally abused. She's even physically abused, to a point (not by actual violence, but by withholding of physical comforts), and she is STUCK, and completely dependent. She CANNOT "rescue herself." She has NO resources, and not to mention, the law would be against her, should she choose to run away. And even though she gives in on almost everything, even so far as denying that she wants something (because she knows full well that, if she actually asserts that she wants something, her aunt will ensure that she DOES NOT get it. At least, by denying that she wants things, she has a small chance of actually getting it, anyway), in almost all respects, she is firm as can be, when it comes to something she KNOWS to be wrong, or she KNOWS she cannot endure. And she can endure an awful lot. She is soft. Fragile, even. But her soul is STRONG. And I, for one, adore her. I admire her. I think she's a Steel Magnolia, and I love her so much!

[@Allan_aka_RocKITEman]

*_"It's Hollywood, baby."_* 🙄

[@justinschnoor9459]

I've never understood how someone can say that "It's about a bigger purpose, it's about herself" and not understand the irony. Thinking only about yourself is about the smallest thing you can do.

[@Furienna]

I think all of this is about wanting to teach girls to avoid abusive relationships and live up to their potential and not "throw it away for some guy" But yeah, there seems to be little room these days for exploring romance as a good thing or teaching girls that some guys are good partners.

[@KaleRylan]

@@Furienna There isn't enough romance in Snow White to qualify it as abusive or not abusive. You have to read Fable for that (loved that comic, at least the first half or so), which absolutely chose to depict it as kind of low-level abusive.

[@Furienna]

@@KaleRylan You're right, but it seems that many people think that the "love at first sight" trope teaches girls to rush into relationships and be abused. Just look at "Frozen", which seems to say that only manipulative creeps will propose to you that quickly (even if royals could do that in the 19th and early 20th centuries).

[@Pherim_]

​@@FuriennaThey want girls to grow up bitter singles, like them

[@Furienna]

@@Pherim_ Or not, since Anna did find a new love interest in Kristoff.

[@erichaury7663]

My basic view is simple: If it attacks normal human relationships and reality, it's garbage. Disney is on my long and growing list of companies to avoid like the plague and not give my dollars to.

[@nerychristian]

Sadly most movies attack human relationships. Which is why you see so many divorced couples in movies.

[@morrigankasa570]

I'm a 30 yr old Man. I mostly agree with you. However, I still have my VHS Disney Movies I grew up with. I ideally want to replace all of them with DVD versions. So yes, I won't purchase any of their new stuff from Disney. But I do try to acquire all the DVDs of Disney Movies & Shows I grew up with and others that are earlier.

[@TheAbandonedAccount7]

you comment, on youtube, a google-owned platform lol

[@humrH2360]

Amusingly enough, Disney themselves had already taken apart the whole "Girlboss" trope with their 2009 _The Princess and the Frog._ The main girl, Tiana, is a workaholic who wears the pants in her dynamic with the hedonistic Prince Naveen, but the narrative is dedicated to teaching her that her single-minded ambition won't satisfy her because it would deny her the happiness she needs. Her relationship and journey with Naveen is about the both of them giving each other what they need: Tiana, the perspective to enjoy the little things in life, and Naveen, the perspective to understand the efforts that make life's pleasures worthwhile. Humans are at their best together, regardless of differences, but the "girlboss" trope is all about solitary control, as expected of woke homogeneous sophistry.

[@CaptainPoseidon282]

I'm going to watch that it sounds good