The Archer's Hook

[@zachariatekawaare4761]

Well presented and extremely informative. Positions are well evidenced, not just statements or options. Kia mihi. !

[@tyreagan9942]

This is a good explanation of the hook! It does not change much for the 3 under technique overall, but I find archers adding higher percentages on the ring finger when string walking down the string.

[@fahlvfaust677]

One of the techniques in Olympic-style archery that I took a long time to learn is the correct way to hook and finger-pressure on the string. As I recall, it took me almost a year to learn the right way.

[@oscarmedina1303]

Thank you for your well explained and informative video. I shoot three fingers under with string walking (bare bow) and now split finger with a tab (Olympic style) recurve. Your video has helped me develop a consistent anchor point and smooth release. I group tightly out to 40 yards and I'm working my way up to 70 meters (77 yards).

[@got2kittys]

This is very good and correct. Without a balanced hook in the right proportions it is more difficult to just let the bow take the arrow. The archer will add strange torque or twist from bad finger hook. Due to higher or lower pressure above or below the arrow. Thanks! Great instructions!

[@zimgeo]

The deeper my hook the more relaxed my hand is. A deep hook allows my hand to remain vertical. When the string is to close to my finger tips I have to strain to let the string to release because of the muscle effort to hold it in the first place.

[@ArcheryWinchester]

I understand your point, and many top archers hold a deeper grip.As I said at the end, the top archers in the world vary considerably. I think it is important to be informed about other ideas, and the rationale behind them. Every choice has a trade-off.Each technique has its advantages and disadvantages If you understand what those tradeoffs are, you can make a better decision based upon what you are able to use best.

[@MrCGangsta]

train your fingers

[@TrickyTables]

Thank you, I think your videos are excellent, please keep making them

[@jamesholley1189]

Thank you sharing this video!!!

[@goodolfashion]

Thanks so much for the informative video! I noticed I was over pulling with my index, correcting for a slight injury I had on my middle finger when I started. I corrected that and had my tightest grouping yet. Cheers from Canada !

[@wyzkrax]

Keep the videos up, very helpful😊

[@lindasharaf]

Great point

[@ZolcsiBB]

This is super informative. Thanks!

[@ArcheryWinchester]

Thank you. I'm glad you like it and hope it helps you out a lot.

[@jonedwards7019]

Interesting video, thanks. Like the presentation - lots of detail and a lot to think about! One question I have is, what defect with the hook is likely to cause the arrow to come off the shelf at full draw? I'm mainly a target shooter and don't seem to have the issue when using my target bow and finger tab, but do run into it sometimes when using a longbow and traditional shooting glove. Thanks!

[@ArcheryWinchester]

Oh, I can tell you exactly what you are doing. If, as you draw with the arm, you also pull the fingers in (a common error), the natural hand action will rotate the string and arrow off the rest. To solve this, make sure you do not pull back with the fingers doo. Keep them steady as the arm pulls back. A drill that can test this is to start with you fingers pulled, and as you pull back, you let the fingers stretch out more. This action will cause the arrow to be pivoted onto the rest. If this cures your problem,then we have nailed it. Oc course, the correction I just suggested is a quick check. Ultimately, you want to set the hook with your hand and keep it constant as you pull back. You do not want to pull the fingers fingers in at all as you draw.

[@jonedwards7019]

Thank you for the reply and for the helpful tips. That must be what I'm doing, I'll definitely work on it.

[@VijaySingh-qz6gp]

Awesome explanation sir. 🙏🏻 Please make a vedio on neck position in recurve archery ❤️.

[@guru253]

Thank you so much for this.

[@joseluiszenizo5070]

Hi, nice video, although i've been there with that type of hook. And as it gave me good consistent release it is also very twitchy and hard to keep firm on the wind. That without considering the huge calists on each finger reducing sensibility. I find that a deeper hook, just behind middle finger's 1st junction, index just in front of junction and a vertical backhand works a little better, as one can keep a more firm yet with less blood pressure to the fingers. Something you don't adress is the hand tenssion and its effect. In my experience if the string arm is as relaxed as possible, just keeping tenssion where needed, is much more consistent and forgiving than any hook variation. Is the only effective way to achieve all the alignment you show and keep good grouping. Best regards

[@ArcheryWinchester]

You bring up some very good points, and I understand that some things work better for some archers than others. That is why I made the statement at the end about the top archers in the world varying considerably on technique. Each coach and archer must ultimately determine the best personal solution. My goal here was to present ideas for people to consider as they make their decisions.

[@foglalatazanyad]

well , what , one finger above the arrow ? i am used to anchor under my jaw with two fingers below the nock, if i put one finger over the nock and two below, and aim at target from distance of 15m i see nothing of the target but shoot blindly , so i assume not every bow is fit for hook like this , i have Ragim impala recurve bow,. also when installed my bow sights i couldnt set it up right to actually see the sights cuz my shaft blocked it have it. when i could see the pinpoint dot and aim at terget my arrows went way above the target. so any ideas ?

[@lopaka34]

I was taught 3 under and I like it. Would the weight distribution be the same with 3 under, or would I carry a little bit more on the index finger since my hand is a little lower in relation to the arrow? Or am I doing myself a major disservice and need to bite the bullet and learn to shoot split finger? (I shoot barebow)

[@oscarmedina1303]

Three fingers under is what I use to shoot bare bow. It is very effective for string walking or string crawling. Split finger is better if you are using a sight and aperture or pin. If you are using "gap" shooting for bare bow, the split finger technique may give you a more consistent anchor.

[@eqlzr2]

It appears that you are primarily (only?) discussing archers here that just draw back to the chin, not to the cheek or corner of mouth or whatever. I think that would absolutely affect the pinching of the index finger. In fact, I've developed a lot of soreness where my index finger contacts the arrow and have had to switch to a 3-under draw to prevent the problem.

[@TheNunoCarneiro]

What should i do with the pinky?

[@gravTrox]

Have made a video regarding techniques nuance shooting three under?

[@ArcheryWinchester]

Barebow shooters often use the three under technique, and some sighted Oly Recurve shooters use it. The technique works for many people. Many traditional Asian shooters use a thumb release. But, when teaching technique, I usually start with the baseline of one finger over and two fingers under, since this is by far the most common technique

[@thomasburrows7806]

What about 3 under?

[@ArcheryWinchester]

Many barebow hunters use 3 under, and with string walking things are even more different. On occasions I have even taught a student with 3 under for specific reasons. But, for this video, I had to restrict myself to one type of hook or else the video would have gone on for hours.

[@greenhoodedvigilante458]

Jake Kaminski once said in a video of his youtube channnel that index finger should hold most of the pressure. Then middle finger and then the ring finger.

[@rickmansberger4136]

See Jeff Kavanugh "The Deep Hook" which will keep your release constant.

[@jamesstrength5405]

With the deep hook you are more susceptible to pluck the string on the release.

[@stefanobressan6113]

very well

[@kirkboswell2575]

And thus the push for the thumb release.

[@ArcheryWinchester]

There is certainly merit to that argument. I have experimented with it, and use it when I shoot my Japanese Yumi with Kyudo,

[@VUO4E]

great vid. Will ask someone at the club to tak pics of my hand - I'm curious about the result...

[@ArcheryWinchester]

Thank you. I'm glad you like the video. I could easily have gone on for another 20 minutes but I had to condense it down to the essentials.

[@horohorosrin]

My high school pe teacher taught us to shoot with just the index and middle finger... no ring finger at all. With this in mind, now that I'm an adult, I got a bow and shot today with just those fingers. Now my middle finger is numb as hell. :(

[@ArcheryWinchester]

This is one reason why you should use 3 fingers. Very few coaches today recommend 2 fingers.

[@user-bo8yt4uc8b]

I think it is unproductive to talk about the load distribution between the finger. I think it is more important to get a steady anchor, right alignment and nose contact with the string, and after those things the load distribution may be what ever it happens to be. My theory is that the shape and size of the chin and nose basically dictates the load distribution.

[@ArcheryWinchester]

I agree that the position of the hand is critical but in this video I wanted to discuss only the hand because people are all over the place on this issue. Since we cannot measure the percentages, the numbers aren't critical, but the qualitative idea of reducing the reliance on the index finger is important, for the reasons I described here. As for the position on the hand in the face, I agree with you 100%. It is most critical and it must be adjusted to meet the facial profile of the archer. I thought about doing a video on this topic but the problem is that there are too the topic becomes too wide ranging because there are so many facial profiles. For instance, I have a large nose that stick far forward of my chin, so I anchor twith the string to my nose and the front of my chin. People with a shorter nose, often have to come to the side of the chin, or tilt the head forward. This is a very tricky topic and I may take it on in a later video, but for now I am accepting the idea that every case is an exception to some extent and a coach has to work with the archer to determine the best position.

[@user-bo8yt4uc8b]

Sorry for this off topic question, but I'd like to know your opinion about the anchor of the first archer you showed at 3:04. Even if his fingering looks good, what do you think of the gap between the back of the chin and the hand? For me that kind of anchor feels too unstable and I would even trade the nose contact to more stable anchor where the hand rests against the chin all the way, if my face didn't allow to get both.

[@ArcheryWinchester]

Actually, I am enjoying this discussion and exchange of ideas, so please keep the questions coming. Remember, the video is about the hook and not the anchor. I selected this picture because it shows the hook, hand, and wrist very clearly. I understand your point, but this archer is using a AAE Cavalier tak. They have shorter leather than many and thus they are work a little farther out on the fingers. This puts the shelf farther out on the fingers, so his position is actually very secure. If you look at this archer's anchor position, his string is at the front, center, of his chin. and that is where the shelf is. If he had his anchor at the corner, or side, of the chin, his hand would come in contact with the jawline more completely Many people prefer tabs like the KSL and Win-Win, which puts the shelf way back at the base of the fingers, so they have the hand in more complete contact with the jawline. Also, many archers don't use a shelf on the tab and their hand is always right along the entire jawline. When I looked at those pictures, the hand was not always as clear. As I said earlier, this picture was selected to shows the hand and the hook I selected the other archers in that first set, and throughout, to show a range of how it could look. I'm sure you noticed that the other archers are more in line with what you are describing. For this first picture, I considered simply showing a hand and arm in position on the string at full draw, but not at anchor. The hand would have been very clear but the picture would have been less helpful because it would not have shown the hook in the actual application. This picture may not be the ideal anchor for all, but none is; however, this picture shows the hand, fingers and forearm alignment very well.

[@b12khx89]

ArcheryWinchester I can't exactly go into the science of it but I tried the string position today... I normally hook at the crease or just behind the crease of the first, middle and ring finger making them even and inline... Although not a full on deep hook I know I've been holdling or riding up against the crease of the middle as there is a callus developing... My groups at 20 yards are give or take 2-3inches from left to right... I can however feel the left right judder of the string leaving my hand on occasions on my chin (more string movement I guess coming off the fingers when I collapse in form - I have been working on identifying form issues from shot reflection) - now setting the hook on the crease of the middle and on the pad of the first and ring finger gave less side to side movement at the moment of release when I knew my form collapsed... I got more shafts touching today with the occasional flyer off 2 inches which are my own bow hand inconsistencies (still grab the bow as I'm anticipating the release) From this archers perspective today I felt less string judder on my chin as I would normally get from the deep hook Hopefully provide some long term feedback after a month or two of shooting and seeing how this setup effects my fingers

[@b12khx89]

Sami Anttila I would definitely like to know more about the idea of chin/nose and string load.... I have noticed that most archers that have a less protruding and set back at the base chin compared to others tend to shoot more in the middle whereas myslef and others with a pointy chin to get more reference points are slightly off centre and on the side - I haven't noticed a major shift in load on the fingers depending on the location of the anchor,... It is however more noticeable depending on the position of the draw elbow (low vs high) which causes my arrow pinch when I don't use a finger spacer between the first and middle finger

[@nevin3123]

why do most of these target archers go to the bottom of the chin, while it seems like most hunters go to the side of the mouth?

[@tyreagan9942]

Most hunters will opt for a release aid that adds length to the archer's draw, thus a deeper anchor is needed. Also, target archers typically have different sights that necessitate the chin anchor for accuracy and consistency. Target archers will use the arrow to aim, and the chin anchor keeps the arrow straighter to the target. Olympic recurve archers also use the chin release because they do not use a release aid and because of the position of the smaller sight as compared to compound archery. In the perfect world for a recurve target archer, the string, arrow, and riser are in an alignment that assists in aiming. There is another video from this channel better explaining this alignment. Hope this helps!

[@draven3838]

Poor instructor allowing the bad habit to continue and not correcting the student