✅ Subscribe: kzbin.info 🖱 Support the channel: www.patreon.com/ben_plays_games Intrigued to hear whether this is a spicy take or not - it could go either way, I suppose!
@cynoflads9 ай бұрын
This Mission alone is Extreme parallel to the war on terror in the United States how one act of Senseless violence let it be an example terrorist attacks can shift the entire nation into war and have those of the top take advantage of said war always love that detail.
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
Great comment, can definitely see where you're coming from. It's a shame, in my view, that there's a failure to fully commit, in both gameplay and story terms, to the concept within the campaign.
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
@@cosmictreason2242 Sure. As mentioned in the video, no real stakes are built in story terms, with Allan barely introduced before the mission occurs, with the justification for its content also being quite flimsy. Gameplay wise, the choice of shooting or not shooting is a cop out too, an obvious compromise because I'd imagine Infinity Ward wanted the plausible deniability of "well, you don't have to shoot". Finally, its reversion to the standard Call of Duty fare for its second half is a decision I'll never understand. If you want something to be poignant - which this should be considering how sensitive the subject is - the last thing you should do is throw in an over the top shootout to conclude things. It borders on being military action pulp and is completely at odds with the rest of No Russian's tone.
@cpMetis9 ай бұрын
@@BenPlaysGames I have to wonder if there originally WAS meant to be a penalty for not participating, but they cut it out as a way to pseudo-censor and avoid the controversy being even worse. We all know how much critics HATE being forced to do bad things then be told it's our fault - those criticisms of Spec Ops: The Line and even Undertale g-route have been around, loud, and annoying since day 1 of both of those legends. Then the option to skip it entirely came about after it was done and they realized it was STILL too disturbing even if you don't participate. Granted, I'm completely speculating, but that timeline of decisions just makes sense to explain the weird half-choices.
@nathanstevenson75059 ай бұрын
Ive always never understood why Allen at any point just waits for everyone to get ahead of him a bit and just clap Makarov or clap everyone in the elevator at the start of the mission...
@jaxastro30729 ай бұрын
Shepherd wanted war
@TheLastArbiter9 ай бұрын
Well none of this plan really makes sense, but under the rules of the game, Allen is under the impression that he is earning Makarov’s trust to put them in a position to dismantle him and his group at a later date. I’m assuming he has been told it won’t work if you take him out now because xyz and he will become a martyr like Zakhaev. As Shepherd says “It will cost you a piece of yourself. It will cost nothing compared to everything you'll save.” That said, Makarov’s plan and Shepherd’s plan make zero sense. An internationally wanted terrorist is clearly seen and recorded at the scene of the attack. One or more of the other Russians involved died too and their bodies would be found. Allen was shown to have gotten Russian tattoos on his body to come off as a Russian, so why would he be identified or considered an American by the authorities? Why would their government ignore Makarov’s involvement, not look into the identity of the other bodies, and even if they found an American, why would they just full send a red dawn situation? There would be no evidence suggesting it was a U.S. sanctioned operation, aside from the assailants happening to use American armaments and using English.
@jadenbowers46079 ай бұрын
Well cuz we wouldn't have a great story to enjoy for the last 6 hours of the game if it was that simple lol
@thisisthisis5429 ай бұрын
I’m pretty sure the knowledge of the mission was kept on down low and went something like this: -Yuri rats on Makarov to the Americans -Shepherd finds out and keeps it quiet, finds Allen in Afghanistan and recruits him -Tells Allen he’ll be a part of Makarov’s crew, but tells him not to kill Makarov (probably some legal justification, but Shepherd wants a war) -Makarov learns Yuri ratted, shoots Yuri in parking garage -Knowing Allen is a spy, goes through the mission and kills him, leaving thousands of Russians at the feet of an American. -Plays right into Shepherd’s hands, provoking a war that he’ll easily win and afterwards he’ll cover his tracks by executing his own men. Definitely supported retroactively by MW3, but all second entries are made with a third in mind in any trilogy. Pretty genius plan by Shepherd, especially given that Yuri’s notice was probably pretty short
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
Cracking plan on Shepherd's part, but seems crazy to me that no one else in the US government said something to him along the lines "erm, actually no mate, we're not going to send one of our own off to shoot up an airport".
@thisisthisis5429 ай бұрын
@@BenPlaysGames yeah, maybe. But, I guess that’s where suspense of disbelief has to come in
@thegreenpatriot88969 ай бұрын
Except Shepherd killing his own men kind of exposes that he did something wrong, if he never turned on the 141 he would probably have gotten away with his plan
@thisisthisis5429 ай бұрын
@@BenPlaysGames well, later in the game, Soap does say “No one else knew about the op, our credibility died with Allen.” Seems like Shepherd was the only one who knew about it, and that also played into his plan.
@beeno34879 ай бұрын
Fist time I played this as a kid I didn’t fire a single shot on a civilian. I couldnt believe what the game wanted me to do
@Jacob-3609 ай бұрын
This Mission doesn’t make much sense it was made to attract people, but it did one thing right. It showed you how evil was makarov, in comparison to the new makarov who feels like a looney tunes villain.
@Shotout4249 ай бұрын
Also, you don’t need to fire a single shot until you get outside. The whole massacre is done by Makarov and his men. You don’t need to fire a single shot, unless you want to
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
You don't... and I hate that. Commit or don't, giving players this strange middle ground that doesn't really make sense doesn't work for me at all.
@caramelldansen22049 ай бұрын
An innocent man at a table with 4 mass murderers means there are 5 mass murderers at that table. Even if you were able to not fire a shot while still convincing Makarov, you still participated in the massacre and were holding a weapon the whole time. It's a distinction without meaning.
@jyapp44899 ай бұрын
My personal take is that if No Russian had to be included, there should've been a level beforehand where you don't exactly know what he's going to do, and you're raiding an arms stash from American PMCs (Shadow Company) to get American weapons, of course provided by General Shepard. Yes, this is inspired by the recent MWII. Shepard, of course, set it up that way so that Makarov would have the weapons, something you'd only realize late into the game with Soap and Price fighting Shadow Company. You get the weapons, and get a few lines from Makarov with him thinking he can outwit the US and how he believes that Russia has gone soft (a commentary on Russia's own extremism problem). Once the mission is done, your briefing is with Makarov and his crew, going over the plan but leaving out Allen, as he is placed on getaway duty. No Russian occurs with you playing as either Makarov or one of his henchmen, and Pvt Allen goes to pick the crew up. Realizing what the plan was, he attempts to betray Makarov, but Makarov is a step ahead - Allen is shot and killed, and the rest of the game happens as normal. It keeps the parallels between the War on Terror and 9/11, keeps the shock value, cuts unnecessary fluff while adding a few more clues as to Makarov and Shepard's motivations, keeps the intent behind No Russian, and does it all in a way that fits in with the rest of the story. The US is deceived because they had information kept from them by Shepard, and Russia is deceived in the same way as the original game. The rest of the game should stay the same, as I think MW3 does a decent job of exploring how not all Russians wanted the war with Yuri.
@inductivegrunt949 ай бұрын
This mission really cannot be topped in terms of dramatic controversial events. This level isn't gameplay, it's a story you are forced to participate in by your own actions. Even if it was more placed for bombastic effect rather than somber tragedy. I'm glad you can skip this mission for gameplay and personal reasons, but this mission definitely has plot holes with how Allen can't shoot Makarov and his men prior to everything and prevent all of what happens afterwards from happening.
@katanafourzeronine9 ай бұрын
Ben's feeling saucy, spicy, and daring all at once.
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
Just one of those days haha.
@jdapaul13519 ай бұрын
I believe Shepherd wanted war because of his reputation that was stained by the events of the first Modern Warfare. He said along the lines of, "i lost 30000 men in a single day", which was a reference to Shock and Awe. The war he waged would hope that his reputation as a war hero would be restored, and he was successful at first.
@HazopGaze9 ай бұрын
Regarding the "business as usual" thing, I think that serves a purpose often missed in these discussion pieces. Any person with a reasonable degree of competency can mow down innocents and catch stressed, possibly even panicking security guards out of position - shooting them when they shout to 'drop the weapon'. This happens several times throughout the massacre section, showing the security guards to be hopelessly outmatched. What comes in the second part, however, is the Russian SWAT forces, in full riot gear, taking up high positions and using SMGs and frag grenades on Makarov's group. And Makarov comes out of it on top. Odds are, most typical terrorists would end up killed or captured in an engagement like this. That Makarov's group wins here tells the player that they're not just evil men, but they're trained. Ex-military, possibly special forces. This is technically shown during the pre-mission briefing, but it flashes by so quickly that most people will probably miss it. The words "military history" and what he was involved in are on screen for a little over one second. This is contrasted by the way the big, obvious newspaper headlines paint Makarov as insane. Even Shepherd himself says that he's "A mad dog killer for the highest bidder." That info on Makarov's military career is replaced by big, bold letters that say "known terrorist associations" "Hijacking" "multiple bombings" "assassinations" etc, all things often associated with people who are often dangerous because they're unhinged. While ending the level right after the massacre might have left a fresher experience in the player's mind, they'd lose a key factor in Makarov's character. He's not a madman, unhinged and unstable. He's ex-Spetsnaz. He has training, experience, and focus. Allen, also an elite soldier, is able to keep pace with that, as does Viktor. Lev and Kiril are eventually killed, but the fact remains that a group of five took on many times their number and only suffered two casualties. That firefight on the tarmac is the player's way of seeing past how he's initially portrayed and getting a clearer view of what they're really dealing with. It also further reinforces how Makarov outmaneuvers TF141 at nearly every junction all the way up until Yuri and Price catch up to him at the end of MW3.
@zhoufang9969 ай бұрын
That's an argument that doing this conveys information, but not really a good reason for inclusion. Because as you say, Makarov *does outmanouevre TF141 at every turn*. So his competence is already part of the story. Showing that he's competent at this point actually just undercuts the plot later, since you could have made a good story out of TF141 underestimating him and having to learn he's a real threat the hard way. You are putting the player in a different position from the guys the story is following, and to no clear purpose.
@Sticwick9 ай бұрын
This is the level that almost ended call of duty as a series
@aegis64859 ай бұрын
Skipping this mission always felt wrong to me. It it the linchpin for the plot going forward. All action afterwards is caused by this single incident.
@zhoufang9969 ай бұрын
This mission is an example of what I think should be a rule in videogame storytelling - if your plot needs the player character to be outrageously dumb, don't force the player to do it interactively. It's not going to build immersion, it's not going to make the decision less dumb, it's not going to make the player feel guilty, it's going to just highlight he fact that there's clearly other decisions that could have been made and you contrived this to happen. Spec Ops the Line IMO has a similar issue.
@annasoH3239 ай бұрын
I remember watching my friend play this. I didn't get into the game series myself until later. At that time, I was younger and didn't fully get what was going on. When I did approach the series myself later, I still sort of had those plot questions in my head. Overall, it just seems MW2 was less tightly written. Zooming out, I can see what they were getting at but I wish I didn't have to zoom out and smudge details in and out to make it work.
@SergioMach79 ай бұрын
I have been teaching lessons about gaming, and while the questions about violence in games does come up, this is still the mission that sets the bar for me. No Call of Duty since has done a mission like this, and I feel gaming as a whole has not dared to try anything similar either. It likely wouldn't be made in todays world.
@gabe12989 ай бұрын
love you Ben.
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
Right back at you dude.
@michaelguernsey12069 ай бұрын
In my own head canon, I think the US trusted shepherd to handle makarov, and shepherd kept the cia plant a secret so he could gain his own personal information on makarov considering he wants to start a war as well. Great video tho! I personally still love this mission for the way it makes you hate makarov and you see how brutal he is in person instead of hearing about it through some exposition dump.
@jadoyon9 ай бұрын
Ya it's just unrealistic that a CIA operative would not have just killed Makarov before it happened.
@mandarin111129 ай бұрын
Cod and halo videos are your best, keep it up
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
Nice one mandarin, will do.
@OliTayler9 ай бұрын
I never played the MW3 campaign, that child death is messed up. Your commentary at this point I'm afraid to say made me laugh. Great review
@KRawatXP20039 ай бұрын
I want to say this about Allen. He's a evil man, killing civilians and police is just intolerable.
@ashleykirin38939 ай бұрын
Honestly I wouldn't say that's what makes Allen a terrible person. The nail in the coffin for me is that he followed an unlawful order. As a member of any branch of the US military, you are not only allowed to say no to any order you feel is unlawful but you are EXPECTED to do so. Not doing so is an extreme crime. Clearly this is fiction but it is in no way realistic. Unless Allen was a sadistic sociopath chosen specifically for this mission, which we see nothing to suggest that, he should have balked at the thought of killing hundreds of civilians when he simply could have taken out Makarov and a few top lieutenants.
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
I did not know this, thank you - makes it all make even less sense!
@Cappuccino_Rabbit9 ай бұрын
All those years of young me feeling bad for Allen dying are gone, thank you
@K_End9 ай бұрын
This was my first game on my first console when i was 10, i wss not phazed by this level, but im glad my parents didnt see my playing through this 😂
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
I remember the first time my mum saw me playing the Resident Evil 2 demo when I was 10 or 11 years old, she was appalled and hid it haha.
@caramelldansen22049 ай бұрын
I've always struggled, in Call of Duty games, to tell when you're playing as one army man versus this other one. In Halo 2, I know when I'm playing as the Arbiter or the Chief. In CoD games, I don't even know the names of any of the POV protagonists, never mind which one I'm supposed to be at any given moment or what that means for the story. If I were more invested in the franchise, I would say they should work on letting you know and "feel" which character you are. Then again, the cynical side of me knows the Department of Defense care less about worldbuilding and more about propagandising to kids and conditioning them to support American aggression worldwide.
@alexbarker99049 ай бұрын
Even to this day… I still don’t shoot the civies 😅 great stuff man. OG MW2 was the best hands down ❤
@michaelmccaffety31319 ай бұрын
I’m in full agreement Ben, this mission served only to shock the player. The studios have been chasing the magic of COD 4 since its release, but who can blame them?
@Cappuccino_Rabbit9 ай бұрын
Also notice how CoD 4 missions are more grounded while MW2 and 3 are more over the top action
@TheIvanMilky9 ай бұрын
Im glad I had watched full metal jacket before playing this level or might have forgotten to lead the woman and kids less
@Cappuccino_Rabbit9 ай бұрын
You know i always found weird how you're not obliged to shoot the civilians, even if Makarov knew you were a spy. More over how you can't just kill Makarov on sight (could've been a funny easter egg) Also regarding the sending a CIA agent thing, i wonder if changing Allen into an american mercenary or a PMC hired by Shepherd could've fixed that plot hole. But i'm probably wrong on that Always wanted No Russian had more substance both narrative and gameplay-wise, even if it's the sole reason why the rest of the MW2 and 3 plot happened
@HitmanKingJay8 ай бұрын
It helped call of duty goes up in sells and it made videogames history
@katanafourzeronine9 ай бұрын
Hey ben, you ever considered doing any of these introspectives for Crysis 2? I've always considered it S-Tier when it comes to FPS and storytelling.
@Cappuccino_Rabbit9 ай бұрын
Imo Crysis 2 is one of the worst of the trilogy, except for a few missions most of it just feels..."eh?" It felt like going from a Halo experience to a CoD experience if you know what i mean I also hate how they changed the design of the aliens, missed those blue/frost looking squids
@ArcticVXR19 ай бұрын
Back when the cod games were good 👍
@TheLastArbiter9 ай бұрын
It’s iconic and sparks an iconic campaign. Very shocking the first time and powerful. Shows the reason he must be stopped. That said, Makarov’s plan make zero sense. An internationally wanted terrorist is clearly seen and recorded at the scene of the attack. One or more of the other Russians involved died too and their bodies would be found. Allen was shown to have gotten Russian tattoos on his body to come off as a Russian, so why would he be identified or considered an American by the authorities? Why would their government ignore Makarov’s involvement, not look into the identity of the other bodies, and even if they found an American, why would they just full send a red dawn situation? There would be no evidence suggesting it was a U.S. sanctioned operation, aside from the assailants happening to use American armaments and using English.
@lingricen80779 ай бұрын
Nah, you americans would be throwing a MASSIVE b*tch-fit had the nationalities been reversed
@PineApple-vq9xv9 ай бұрын
Hellloo there Ben.
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
A very late good afternoon to you!
@felipegutierrez90879 ай бұрын
I do like the way the game asks you if you wanna be a horrible human or not, usually it’s not
@BenPlaysGames9 ай бұрын
Maybe it says something about me that I always shoot!
@torb-no9 ай бұрын
Agree. Without one specific mission exception (”…but now it's a ghost town”), I think CoD campaigns are utterly mediocre, like a mediocre B-action movie… but with none of the charm. Thanks for making the video, I think considerations beyond purely entertainment value is also important in analysis of art (and videogames are absolutely art!), so thanks for bringing that perspective here in a thoughtful manner. Whether Cod is jingoistic propaganda or a commentary on the horrors has been discussed by a lot of people, and AFAIK what I remember some seeing is that on the first couple of Modern Warfare series you had team members with both perspectives. So the studio literally did not have a consensus on that, there was internal divisions. This aspect is also kinda interesting with regards to Halo (tho, more cartoony, and less realistically violent). In the games you and the spartans are always praised… but reading the books (how the Spartan program was created to brutally oppress militant independence movements, and the why was kidnapping literally children… Master Chief was literally a child soldier)… you get a more ”are we the baddies?” vibe. It's kinda interesting!
@Inferryu9 ай бұрын
Is amusing to see this spark such a controversy when we had games like GTA and the such for years, but then again the media also went crazy over Mass Effect because a blue butt showed for like a second in one of the several romantic paths, IF persued.
@majesticglass9 ай бұрын
Hmm, Mass Effect you say?.. Sounds like an interesting game, I'll give it a go
@andrewpepper31459 ай бұрын
I've never been able to reconcile the existence of No Russian. Its always felt completely unnecessary and makes no sense.
@peterlawson80409 ай бұрын
Comment
@chrisk_nfl41209 ай бұрын
It's a frustrating mission which I think should've been reversed. Have a shootout with security before entering the airport and then starting the massacre. That way you think you're doing the right thing, or getting a target, but in actuality you're being used for a massacre and a message. I also think this mission needed to come maybe 1 or 2 missions later. With Allen participating in a couple of TF141 missions with Soap/Roach/Ghost and seeing what type of person they are (you play from Roach's POV). It felt a little like the MW 2019 game, where it just threw in a controversial set piece to add drama, when it should've been remembered as "THE mission" in this game. Sadly, MW2 is a bit of a mess with level design and placement, and No Russian is only remembered for the controversy, rather than the story impact. Also I fully agree with the cop-out stuff, if you are going to put in a controversial mission, you stick to being controversial. The game had an 18 on the box in the UK, after all.
@zhoufang9969 ай бұрын
Oh I thought you meant it should be reversed in that you should be playing one of the mall cops. I think that would have been a better way to do it, have a horror/stealth mission where you are trying to avoid the attackers, your pistol useless against them, and then in the end you meet Allen, who shoots you. You could build up the mystery of what's going on and then reveal it later.
@ff05t81t9 ай бұрын
In a vacuum yes this mission makes no sense but with added context and info is the reason why this mission is such a great mission. Generally infiltrating and “going along” with the plan is standard practice especially for undercover police units. And whether the player shoots or not is handled great as when makarov kills you, the Russian civilians don’t care, there was a dead American with weapons that took part in a terrorist attack killing civilians and law enforcement. And you weren’t suppose to care about Allen either, the whole point of the Ranger side of the story is that you’re another cog in the machine. Shepard literally took a random soldier that had a promising future and killed him. After Allen’s death, you’re the new guy to foleys squad. It’s perfect.
@zhoufang9969 ай бұрын
While undercover cops are allowed to do stuff like possess and sometimes sell drugs, they absolutely are not allowed to commit major crimes like mass murder.
@ff05t81t9 ай бұрын
@@zhoufang996 yes, if a crime lord were to plan such a thing, either the under cop would be dead due to being compromised or the crime lord would be dead or in cuffs.