The Cherished Doctrine of Heavenly Mother - A Conversation with McArthur Krishna and Michal Thomas

[@maryfrankralls9985]

Wonderful!!!! Thank you for sharing!!

[@kirsty1227]

I received my patriarchal blessing 56 years ago and was told about my heavenly Mother. I have always cherished this part of my blessing and been aware of her basically all my life. I am not an American and we talk about Heavenly mother from time to time in relief society.

[@bbbarham6264]

I think members generally have a huge misunderstanding about how revelation comes to the brethren. They don’t meet face to face with the Lord where He just tells them what’s up. I’ve heard Elder Bednar say multiple times that revelation works the exact same way for them as if does for us. Almost every revelation recorded in the D&C came when Joseph was seeking an answer to a question, including the First Vision, the restoration of the priesthood, and the temple ordinances. If the brethren receive guidance it is because they are seeking an answer. If they don’t think to ask about it, or are unwilling to accept it, no answer will be given. The revelation on the priesthood ban reversal didn’t come until the entire quorum was open to the possibility. What I’m getting at is even though there has been little revealed about Heavenly Mother that does not mean that’s all God wants to reveal. We choose how much God reveals by the faith and diligence we exercise in seeking, receiving, and applying further light and knowledge (Alma 37: 40-47) We, and the brethren, must seek an answer, be open to whatever God may reveal, and that’s when further knowledge will come.

[@growinggrowthfromtree]

Exactly. Ask seek and knock. This doctrine could really use some revelation on. Maybe the second coming Jesus will be revealing Mother similar as he did Father. But it would be great if that wasn’t the case

[@kahina937]

Seeking the revelation about Heavenly Mother can become messy very quickly considering what the general authority taught about this doctrine in the past. It was believed that there was more than one Heavenly Mother. This will inevitably bring up the doctrine of eternal polygamy to the light. Most members feel uncomfortable about polygamy doctrine in the church. Although, we do not practice carnal polygamy anymore, we do believe it will be restored later and for sure will be practiced in the Celestial Kingdom. Right now most of us prefer to ignore it. So I can see why the general authority would rather avoid the topic of Heavenly Mother at all costs. The church history is already messy enough. They don't need make it more complicated as it already is.

[@bbbarham6264]

@@kahina937 You make a great point that eternal polygamy is a direct stumbling block to further understanding about Heavenly Mother. I, for one, don’t believe in it. It’s not as clear a doctrine as you might think. William Marks, a close friend to Joseph, said the following about an exchange he had with Joseph shortly before his death: “Joseph, however, became convinced before his death that he had done wrong; for about three weeks before his death, I met him one morning in the street, and he said to me, Brother Marks, I have something to communicate to you, we retired to a by-place, and set down together, when he said: ‘We are a ruined people.’ I asked, how so? He said: ‘This doctrine of polygamy of Spiritual wife system, that has been taught and practiced among us, will prove our destruction and overthrow. I have been deceived,’ said he, ‘in reference to its practice; it is wrong; it is a curse to mankind, and we shall have to leave the United States soon, unless it can be put down, and its practice stopped in the church.” (William Marks, Zion's Harbinger and Baneemy's Organ, 7 July 1853, pg. 53) No one seems to give that MINOR account much thought…

[@growinggrowthfromtree]

@@bbbarham6264 Never heard this quote. It's almost completely in-line with how I have felt as I've prayed on the subject. It was misunderstood and malpracticed. But thats just me. Who knows.

[@maryfrankralls9985]

I really love your comments on revelation. I have always felt this is how the brethren receive revelation.

[@DaisyMountain]

Just wonderful!! I am blessed by this conversation. An increase of joy, perspective and growth. “I’ll never grow up to be Heavenly Father” ❤ Thank you once again Chavez Team ! Thank you Thank you

[@markchristiansen9611]

This is such a wonderful doctrine. The more you think about it, the more meaningful I realize it is.

[@traditionalwoman5648]

All we know about Heavenly Mother, is that she has a womb, she has disappeared into relative obscurity. What do I teach my daughter?

[@joshua_sykes]

¡Gracias a McArthur, Michal, y Faith Matters! 🙏 =] • An excerpt from the Gospel Topics Essay entitled Mother in Heaven: Elder Rudger Clawson wrote, “We honor woman when we acknowledge Godhood in her eternal Prototype.” 🤱

[@LevittownHS]

I wish there was a true church and following of both Heavenly Parents. Is there one?

[@DevonFine-mz8cu]

Five women saved / delived Moses

[@traditionalwoman5648]

Can you clarify or explain about Heavenly Father having many wives? I had always assumed that that was why we didn't know much about her, or talked about her much because there were many Heavenly Mothers.

[@Robo1818]

How does this doctrine square with D&C 132? It’s like the one thing that no one wants to touch. Logically don’t you need to square up your Heavenly Mother with D&C 132? And the verbiage associated to be less assumptive on your part. Or at least acknowledge your openness to finding out more in that area and steel woman your argument (pun intended)? I many times find those that preach Heavenly Mother also invalidate 132 and don’t believe in it.

[@Robo1818]

The other thing I will say is this topic can take your focus away from Jesus Christ and that is not the mission of the restored church. It’s just not. So we should talk more and most about Him. And run an analysis of how much time this topic may actually detract from the Savior of this world. He who atoned for the sins of all men and women in the world. If this topic is all you think or talk about - your mind has been high jacked away from Him and to another master.

[@beckywalton5200]

Amen to the comment made at 27:15 ish…about why men would care about this topic. They don’t care as much because THEY are represented in the plan of salvation and throughout history The female is not represented in the the Godhead. Women throughout history have been marginalized and often mistreated. If the true theology was matriarchal in nature with God The Mother, The Daughter and The Holy Ghost….and roles were exactly reversed then, and only then would men understand our perspective. In life there are clearly females with an integral role in bringing to mortality the children of God but in theology were absent. Not talked about. Unknown. Having a knowledge of a Heavenly Mother is integral in building any sort of eternal self worth, in my opinion because it shows we were not created solely for man’s use. We know Eve was created as a help meet FOR Adam…and painted as subservient to Adam and from then in without having more information on Eve’s eternal worth, the rest as they say is “history” in the way women have been viewed and treated.

[@nonrepublicrat]

Without a knowledge of Heavenly Mother, the doctrines of the LDS church would be just as ridiculous as the doctrines of all the other churches.

[@NealSmith-v2x]

I found it a bit disingenuous to assert Elder Relund's talk freed us up to discuss Mother in Heaven and then feeling the need to reassure listeners they were on the right side of the Brethren several times. I love what they're doing but would like more. For artists/writers who may have had a different experience with church authority on this topic check in with Fiona Givens and/or Caitlin Connolly. I'd love to see more on the Josiah reforms, where Mother in Heaven fits in the godhead, MIH in the BofM, Holy Ghost and MIH, etc. from scholars like Fiona Givens, Margaret Barker, Dan Peterson, Valerie Cassler, etc. How about it Faith Matters? Is this a book you dare publish?

[@faithmattersfoundation]

Check out our discussion with Dan McClellan for more on the Josiah Reforms! And if you search "Valerie Cassler" on faithmatters.org you'll see an essay she wrote for us on this very topic, where she cites Margaret Barker.

[@faithmattersfoundation]

Fiona Givens is on our board and will be speaking this fall at Restore! (FaithMatters.org/Restore for the full lineup)

[@esthercampanella8428]

This is a false doctrine with no biblical basis . Read your Bible.

[@jeannieab5218]

I never read that anywhere in the Bible….list me some scriptures.

[@trudymanning1951]

Genesis 1:26 In OUR image.

[@richarner3856]

​@trudymanning1951 does God have male and female parts?

[@mpress469]

"When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it" - Genesis 3:6 Spiritually speaking (gender aside), matriarchy can begin with a fundamental understanding of the cyclical nature of reality (God). Represented by the snake in many creation myths, the living cycle has a trinity of a beginning (head), a middle and end (tail). As above so below, the sexes were created in the image of God's cyclical nature where Mother is the head and opening to all beginnings and Father holds the tail to all endings (through which the sowing of seeds allow for the next great matriarchal rebirth).The joining of the two (symbolized by the Ouroborus or the marriage ring) is the sacred union needed in assuring the creation and continuation of new life cycles. To speak of the present day God as "Our Father" is simply an admission to our collective positioning within the bigger cycle. As all mothers have direct experience with the creator quality of birthing, so is the direct experience of rebirthing the divinity within (baptism) belong to that which is spiritually matriarchal. (John 3, verse 3-8). Sekhmet statues (ancient Egyptian) carry most of their weight in symbolic memory of what was a mother culture dedicated to the direct experience of baptism. As the leg shaped hairlocks extend from maternal breasts to the womb of rebirth, the lioness's head proportions are such that they highlight the bust of a second animal figure. The Lioness's ears as eyes and eyes as nose (nostrils) brings to life the figure of a reptile. 'Neath the halo headress of the solar egg, the lioness's egg fertilization process being internal (Set) and the reptile's egg fertilization process being external (Setting), such being key components to the safety of entering the trans-egoic or "born again" state. The life threatening fear associated with the predatory nature of a lion and/or crocodile encounter are reflective of the intense ego death experiences associated with the transpersonal awakening process. In spiritually matriarchal times, illumination could be seen as wearing the false beard (ancient Egyptian funerary "ego" death mask) as the high state of cyclical self knowing; high awareness of both our upper matriarchal half and our lower (later) patriarchal half (compared with a mini lower body replica, an "as above so below" tail end beard extension); in full recognition of her civilizational Underworld; her inevitable cyclical destiny. The male pharaoh wears his beard tapered in reverse, indicating a pointing upwards towards the patriarchal head, divine representative of God's tail end cycle. Mary's anointing and wiping of Jesus's feet with her hair can then be seen as "Head to tail" (toe) imagery as she descends her matriarchal head to his patriarchal feet, thus reenacting the high understanding of the divine cyclical process. (John 12, verse 3) To carry the Ankh (now the female symbol ♀️) was perhaps to symbolically carry that upper and lower understanding. As the upper matriarchal womb symbolised the fertile birthing of civilization, below, the now Christian cross is carried to place emphasis on the lower (later) "End Times" Father principle of the great cycle. Lord Ganesha, the elephant headed Hindu diety, displays a cyclical head to trunk symbolism and points to the Mother head of his matriarchal elephant society. Ganesha (like the elephant) wears God's cyclical nature on his face. A whole temple was dedicated to Hathor (ancient Egyptian diety), who is the matriarchal "Uterus" personified. kzbin.info/www/bejne/gGHQYa2AiKp5gZI "See all women as mothers, serve them as your mother. when you see the entire world as the mother, the ego falls away. See everything as Mother and you will know God." - Neem Karoli Baba "My son, keep thy father's commandment and forsake not the law of thy mother" - Proverbs 6 : 20

[@johnrowley310]

I am concerned. I have married a spirit daughter who is my spirit sister. I think the word is incest. I have decided I want to return and live with my godly parents I am sure mother in heaven loves me more than this spirit sister wife I married. I just want to live with my heavenly parents...is that so wrong?