The Eastern Front | National Perspectives: Austria-Hungary, Germany and Russia

Dr. Richard Faulkner, Command and General Staff College, serves as moderator of a panel discussion on the Eastern Front in World War I. Dr. Scott Stephenson, Dr. Graydon Tunstall and Dr. Bruce Menning provide expertise on the Eastern Front in the national perspectives of Austria-Hungary, Germany and Russia.
Recorded April 13, 2013 in J.C. Nichols Auditorium at the National World War I Museum at Liberty Memorial.
For more information about the National WWI Museum and Memorial visit theworldwar.org

[@roynormannlee]

This just makes it clear that the history of Austria Hungary and its role in WW1 is still very lackluster

[@nickjohnson6368]

Exactly!

[@WildBillCox13]

Very useful perspectives well presented. Thanks for posting this enjoyable panel and forum.

[@BrorealeK]

Gotta love how everyone laughs when Austria-Hungary is mentioned going through a crisis.

[@lucius1976]

It may gain you points - but it is historically not really correct. Coming from professional historians it is just unprofessional. Austria-Hungary was far from being as fragile as it is depicted. Remember it lasted longer than Imperial Russia in First World War.

[@Souledex]

​@@lucius1976 his point was literally that it was economically crucial and fundamental to the structure of the region, but militarily mismanaged and not culturally unified. Which is very true. My take away from this was literally that it was more integrated and the emperor more essential than I initially thought so you must have listened to a different lecture. And that's notable, because if they weren't in that much of a crisis its actually pretty crazy how terrible their army was. As well, your one off comment about Russia is like a wildly oversimplified perspective to pretend to make a statement about the endurance and function of any country. Iceland has been largely culturally homogenous and under self rule for a millennia clearly all empires are more fragile than it's majestic eons atop the pinnacle of culture - see how dumb it sounds.

[@Corvinuswargaming1444]

This is an old presentation but I have to once again voice as I did on another video here that the museum in the future would be better served getting experts from Central Europe to discuss Austria Hungary in particular, even if it is on a Zoom event. It’s particularly disappointing when the videos here have gotten very thoughtful and accomplished scholars of the Ottoman Empire.

[@dongilleo9743]

Gray Tide in the East by Andrew Heller is an interesting alternative history read about the eastern front in WW1. The Germans stay on the defensive in the west, and concentrate their Armies in the east. With no German invasion of Belgium or France, England stays neutral. The collapse of the Russian army, and then the Tsarist government comes even much faster than historically.

[@fullmontyuk]

I agree, It's been a while since I read it but as alternative history books go I remember enjoying more than many others I'd perused.

[@rhysnichols8608]

Ridiculous tho, as Britain was going to get involved either way. This whole Belgium neutrality was just a decent casus beli to sell to the public. In 1908 Edward gray promised British forces to support France regardless of German action.

[@nickjohnson6368]

This was awesome guys

[@steveo976]

It seems if I’ve listened to this correctly, There army was close to starving before they even suited up for battle . If true , that is the first sign on defeat. “ An army marches on its stomach “ - Napoleon Bonaparte

[@robertroberts5090]

Is there anything good in English on the performance of the Austrian Hungarian navy? I heard they had quite modern ships.

[@nunodossantos7147]

Try the osprey book refering to the austrian-hungaian navy.

[@powerdriller4124]

Captain Georg Ludwig Ritter von Trapp, the one of the movie "The Sound of Music" with Julie Andrews, was on command of an Austrian submarine SM-U2, which sank 19 ships in WWI, French, Brit and Italians; including one Italian submarine. The guy killed about 4000 people! And ironically, his wife was the granddaughter of the British Engineer, Robert White Head, who invented the auto-propulsed torpedo. -- Captain Trap received the Iron Cross Medal and other recognitions. Before WWII he became anti-Nazi and escaped from Austria when this country was annexed to Nazi Germany. He went as a refugee to the USA, and in 1941 offered his service to the USA Navy, but he was already age 60, and his offering was rejected.

[@chrismath149]

Try Drachinifel: He has a view videos about the Austrian campaigns during world war 1. kzbin.info

[@rhysnichols8608]

For all its failings, the Hapsburg army was able to fight on 2, and for a while 3 fronts for over 4 years against some tough opponents. They did get some things right.

[@Alexander_Rezner]

Most of the new states were not created by the treaty of Versailles. Austria signed in Saint Germain and Hungary in Trianon.

[@steveo976]

Most were. Just not what you mentioned. Example of new independent countries formed after WW 1 were Poland, Finland, Yugoslavia, and Czechoslovakia. Russia became the Soviet Union and the Ottoman Empire later became the country of Turkey. Germany also had to give up the provinces of Alsace-Lorraine to France also , Estonia, Latvia,

[@fullmontyuk]

@@steveo976 'The Versailles Settlement' is often used as shorthand for the variety of treaties and agreements than ended WW1. Many were signed at Versailles and some were never ratified or simply abandoned in the face of geopolitical concerns. In the context of a panel discussion I think lumping them all together under 'The Versailles Treaty' is acceptable. 🙂

[@wuestenkamel]

I don't think the information about the languages in the Austrian-Hungarian army is correct. As far is I know the command language was German and each soldier had to learn 200 commands or something.

[@michealohaodha9351]

Correct. The basic command language was German, and every soldier learned about 80-100 (if I remember correctly) command phrases. However other than this every other communication was done through the 'regimental language', the native language majority of the soldiers.

[@carlhansen6802]

Yes. What's fascinating to me is how all these different nations were mobilized so easily for the war. I truly think that Austria-Hungary would've survived if not for the war. It would've been reformed, with the Slavs getting more say, just like the Habsburg Monarchy had been reformed into Austria-Hungary before that. But it likely would've survived as a federation.

[@mns8732]

Carl Hansen : nope, the political intelligence necessary to government was missing.

[@unzicek]

Slavs, Czechs in particular, were pushing hard for federalization of the empire since 1848. However, Franz Josef I. (the incompetent emperor who never accepted the Czech crown, insulting the entire nation) and an increasingly chauvinistic Austrian Germans refused any meaningful compromise. As the result, the Czechs played a major role in the demise of the empire. And rightly so.

[@tomasvlcek4476]

It was only 40 German words. Each unit was recruited from the same place so the officers spoke the same language as their men.

[@hamilkarB]

Apparently very unprofessional speakers. I am not sure if their source are correct at all, mostly kind of urban legends. Austrian army spoke German not English, and all soldiers learnt the basic command words. The officers spoke the same language as the soldiers, and a lot of people were able to speak multiple languages.

[@Dav1Gv]

It is widely reported - look up the source for this to check - that at least one Austro-Hungarian regiment's regimental language was English as this was the second language which most ot the troops had in common. Yes, the command language was German and troops had to learn the basic words of command in German but this is not the same as the language generally used.

[@leme5639]

@@Dav1Gv ignore him, he;s an hungarian coping

[@rhysnichols8608]

@@Dav1Gv That’s true, but the speaker ought to have clarified that. He should have said “we know of at least 1, and possibly more regiments that spoke English as a common language” but he made it seem like it was the common practice. It is true most spoke German as the common language and the soldiers all had to learn 80 German phrases. 1 regiment out of the entire army isn’t that much. He needed to clarify it more

[@tomasvlcek4476]

I feel its so sad how Churchill gets quoted every single time. Shows an incredible laziness and unimaginitive aproach.

[@simonbagel]

Churchill was good at self-promotion

[@anchorbait6662]

7:12 😂

[@renefrey6220]

great panel, good insights. just hungarians are not slavians

[@jezalb2710]

Slavs

[@Alexander_Rezner]

May I make clear that Hungary used to have three times the territory it has after the treaty of Trianon. Many parts were more slavic than hungarian. And concerning the whole monarchy ethnic Germans and ethnic Hungarians were even together a minority of about 40 percent. Greatings from Vienna/Wien/Bécs/Beč/Dunaj/Vídeň/Viedeň/Wiedeń/Відень/Viena.

[@godgreat1414]

Hungary language is the only language in Europe does not have root or any link with other European languages

[@johnfleming7879]

a disintegrating army provides fertile ground for a mass movement

[@rhysnichols8608]

The Germans set Eastern Europe free from Bolshevism and the states had more autonomy under the Germans than the Russians. It was essentially a change of hands, people make out like it’s such a bad thing that Germany created satellite states out of Eastern Europe, but was it any worse than Russia controlling these lands? The Germans did give them a bit more autonomy than the Russian imperial rule did. They were also not subject to the horrors of communism until 1940. They also provided Central Europe with a buffer against the Bolsheviks. Would you guys have preferred the Soviet Union to be right up to Germany’s boarder? It was in the interests of the west to have a buffer zone. Also Germany needed the resources, so it’s understandable at Brest Litovsk they took as much as they could, their populace was staving and they needed material for the war effort. Also millions of Germans had died fighting in those lands, they HAD to have something to show for it, it would be a potential political disaster if the Germans just went ‘good show now have it all back’ in 1918 after they’d spent years fighting. So given these points I feel the treaty of Brest Litovsk was not as bad as people like to claim. It was essential a change of imperial hands for the states in question, one which actually gave them a bit more autonomy, and it set them free from the Bolsheviks, much to the adulation of many Eastern European peoples. And of course as the war progresses, aims change, if the war lasted 6 months, nothing like Brest Litovsks would’ve happened. So it’s unrealistic to say ‘see this was Germany’s aim the whole time’

[@yukikaze3436]

for more on the KUK armee behaving badly: Kingdom of Serbia Astro-Hungarian atrocities Report Rodolphe A Reiss on archive.org Book "A Mad Catastrophe" video clip on youtube "Krieg Der Bilder" Russian Army behaving badly: Nationalizing the Russian Empire Prologe to the Revolution the minutes of the Council of ministers The Eastern Front 1914-1917 A whole Empire walking

[@user-yk4ey3xl9s]

Google ‘How Austria Hungary waged war in Serbia’.

[@rhysnichols8608]

Yeah but Serbians also engaged in illegal partisan warfare, and had mutilated and brutalised prisoners, both sides did atrocities. I’m not justifying the acts by the KUK, but these things don’t happen in a vacuum. There was a lot of rage on both sides, Serbians and been behind multiple terror attacks on Habsburg lands in the decade prior to the war too. Which is one reason Hötzendorff wanted to go to war all the time.

[@sandorferi]

Each time Austria-Hungary or even Russia is mentioned one can not but notice the smirking, belittling and condescending laughter and chuckles from the presenters. They obviously think and feel being superior and vastly more advanced that the "retarded, illiterate, backwards, mentally inferior" nations of the east. This is an absolute loss of impartial approach when assessing this part of Europe and it's role in WWI. On top of it - hey even have the nerve to admit that most of English language literature regarding that issue is garbage - because it is. Have any one of these "experts" studied the direct sources of the K.u. K army in all 11 languages? Do they speak any central European language at all?? Mostly German or Hungarian?? Have they gone through the national archives and did their job as any good historian would?? St. Germain and Trianon Treaties utterly destroyed our region and yes, directly lead to WWII. Gróf Apponyi Albert Trianonban: “Önök most megásták Magyarország sírját, de Magyarország ott lesz a temetésén mindazon országoknak, amelyek most itt megásták Magyarország sírját.” Looking at the situation in the west (France, UK, US, etc) - all we have to do is just wait. And once all those colonial empires implode - revenge is a dish best served cold. And after 101 years after the shameful Trianon treaty - the dish is cold at this time. I will enjoy the show.

[@jozette-pierce]

If this is any consolation. Americans love Glock pistols.

[@leme5639]

Austria Hungary was trash, especially because of Hungary. Stop complaining, you lost, the peace was in fact merciful with HU

[@rhysnichols8608]

I’m English and I largely agree with you, apart from the last few sentences, you need to get over petty anger over events that happened over 100 years ago, why should the people of the west pay for the wrongs of their governments last century? Don’t be petty like that. I wish Eastern European prosperity. You are indeed correct that these American historians have a tendency to be very arrogant, condescending and pretty inaccurate, which makes their arrogance all the more cringe. They repeat a lot of myths and don’t give a fair view to events of the time. Didn’t America utterly fail to beat peasants in Vietnam? Didn’t they get beaten by farmers in sandals in Afghanistan?? Yet they act like they know best and everyone else was dumb and stupid. It’s a very narrow and bias narrative most western historians have of this era.