The Evolution of Technology Post-Machine Crusade | Dune Lore

A discussion of how the society of Frank Herbert's Dune and its technology evolved in the wake of this interstellar machine crusade. The result of this crusade forced humanity to look inward, to start schools to train and refine their own natural talents and to make advancements as a species.
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[@celozzip]

the lack of computers and the reason behind it are my favourite thing about the dune universe. its such a crazy thing to do in a science fiction universe and makes dune stand out from everything else.

[@DeathBYDesign666]

They have computers in some form guaranteed, this level of technological sophistication requires some manner of computer guidance, but it's not about the hardware, it's about the software driving them. My guess is that they function somewhere on our level of data processing but probably with a much higher memory capacity.

[@Vhailor_Mithras]

Paul did use a computer in the original movie when he was studying the different houses and their worlds. It's just it couldn't think for itself, only following commands.

[@ngcastronerd4791]

Warhammer 40k has a very similar thing in it's lore. Wonder which one came first.....

[@awesomebydefault3877]

@@ngcastronerd4791 dune

[@sentinel501]

@@ngcastronerd4791 dune by almost 20 years I think. 40k always kind of had a lazy way of integrating other sci fi universes in it, but the 40k “navigators” the “god-emperor” are all clearly taken from dune.

[@TheSmokingMustache]

The lazgun and shield reaction makes a scene in the new movie where soldiers are getting sniped by lasers and one yells "No shields!" makes way more sense now.

[@bajscast]

Yeah though the whole concept does become a bit weird because the harkonnen soldiers use swords even though the fremen don't have shields for the most part

[@Gunnar001]

In the books, firearms were mentioned being used quite a bit more. Old weapons like rocket launchers and slugthrowers slowly made a comeback on all sides as the fighting escalated in the desert. Arrakis became a brutally unique “old school” battleground in the galaxy. I think it took a little longer for the Harkonnens and Sardaukar to adapt because they were so used to traditional shield combat. Nobody from the larger Imperium were really trained or skilled with these ancient guns that were almost completely abandoned many millennia ago. Swords and other melee weapons were still being used alongside these guns though because it was familiar to everyone and probably a preferred way to fight.

[@iiexpress9888]

it wasn’t lasers it was fremen projectiles the reason for no shields is because it draws sandworms and drives them into a killing frenzy per quote the movie

[@Robert-hz9bj]

The personal defense shield is easily one of the greatest concepts in science fiction. With a single, clever plot device, Herbert was able to craft an aesthetically distinct vision of future warfare, in which battles on land were fought between armies of the future equivalent of knights or samurai battling with melee weapons, while above them highly advanced air and space vehicles waged high-tech dogfights with one another. And the contrast is magnificent. The man was a genius...

[@CUBETechie]

I also like the battlestar Galactica reboot it is different from the old version

[@SxSxG666]

I just wonder why they don't use artillery. Even if the explosions can't hurt the solders directly the shockwave most certainly would and troops could be buried under debris.

[@Robert-hz9bj]

@@SxSxG666 I would wager it's because they have orbital craft. You don't really need traditional artillery when you can just drop kinetic-energy projectiles from orbit and let gravity do its thing.

[@pathfinder2reality]

To be honest, you need to suspend your disbelief on that. It is not probable that because a certain weapon was developed, people would revert to melee weapons and proceed to butcher themselves that way. Every time in history when a new game changing weapon was developed and the balance of power was shifted, people IMMEDIATELY started work on developing means and counter weapons that would negate that advantage. When ICBM-S were developed the industry immediately started working on weapons to shoot them down or disable them. We didn't say: Oh, now ICBM-s exist. Let's bring back swords and knives. It is against human nature and quite silly.

[@Robert-hz9bj]

@@pathfinder2reality See, if not for the extremely specific world-building Herbert did, I might agree. First, the universal ban on thinking machines is the kind of thing that really impedes further technological progress. Without computers, there is likely an upper-limit on certain rates of scientific progress, simply because the calculations required become too complicated or time-consuming to do by hand. Imagine trying to do, say, a finite-element analysis on an even slightly complicated geometry without a computer. That's the kind of calculation that would likely take you weeks to perform. I find it highly probable that the technology needed to defeat a shield besides just a sufficiently slow-moving object would require calculations and specialized manufacturing techniques that are simply not possible (or practical) without forbidden thinking machines. MAYBE the Ixians could pull it off, but that's a big maybe since they are very careful to never technically cross the line. Second, I also find it extremely probable that this situation is being maintained by the Bene Geserit. Remember, their plans to produce the Kwisatz Haderach was the work of dozens of generations over thousands of years. For that kind of planning to work, you need as stable a social and political dynamic as possible. And one of the most disruptive things to these dynamics are revolutionary technological change. I find it highly probable that, beyond merely engineering the religious and social order of the Universe, they also kept a close eye on any potential leaps that might threaten the preexisting balance of the Empire.

[@SeaGLGaming]

Dune's technology and human evolution is my favorite thing about series and why it has become my favorite universe to explore. I love the idea of humanity being able to evolve and spread throughout the universe without AI. I feel so many scifi universes focus too much on the wonders of technology making Dune's focus on humanity so much more unique and inspiring. Also, the Dune subreddit banning AI generated art is one of the best moderation decisions of all time.

[@SzymonNatanRajca]

And thus Buttlerian Jihad has started.

[@electriceyeball]

@@SzymonNatanRajca Gurney Halleck/Picard lol: "The Speaker has awoken!!!"

[@jhtsurvival]

Reddit is trash. It's one of the major contributors to the current downfall of society. Moderators turn every Sub into their own echo chambers.

[@ThatDragonGuy]

What's wrong with focusing on technology lol

[@squamish4244]

Frank Herbert: *needs cool futuristic technologies* Answer: *Holtzman Effect* *Holtzman Effect* *Holtzman Effect* *Holtzman Effect* *Holtzman Effect*

[@WrynnCZ]

Well its all we need right now. So... yes! :D

[@dinoflagella4185]

Frank Herbert: (Tries to imagine technology 10,000 years in the future) Answer: Computers bad.

[@squamish4244]

@@dinoflagella4185Obviously, he did this so that humanity would still be recognizable and relatable. If you keep computers around, we won't be. You can't have quasi-feudal societies IN SPACE with dukes, barons, emperors and shit. And you don't have to try and imagine what super-duper future tech will be like. You don't end up with Asimov's vacuum tube computers in 50,000 years.

[@OldClassTreky]

Dune might be the only scifi universe with a good explanation of why everyone runs around with a sword

[@JH-lo9ut]

Oh, but it's a more elegant weapon, from a simpler time.

[@dinoflagella4185]

Meh, I like the Dune universe. However, I feel that it was kind of a lazy way to avoid imagining technology 10,000 years in the future. I mean 100 years ago would people have imagined that we would all have smart phones and the internet? Could you imagine what technology we’ll have in another 100 years… if we don’t blow ourselves up of course.

[@jingalls9142]

​@@dinoflagella4185 lmao I love your name. You dinoflagellate you.

[@baitposter]

It's actually a pretty shitty reason. Laser + Shield = Nuke? You just found cheap mass-produced nukes, prepare for all-out nuclear war. Light also clearly still passes through the shields, so they should be able to field lasers that bypass them anyway. They could also field hunter-seeker projectile weapons en masse, as well as chemical weapons and flamethrowers, before it comes down to a sword fight. Even spears would better make a comeback.

[@TheJohnnyJohnny]

They should use more spears or pole arm rather than swords.

[@regis_red]

I’ve always liked the intro of Lynch’s version where the navigator refers to “new machines on Ix”. It’s not in the book but I’ve always found it great exposition.

[@shanenolan8252]

Not in the first book but its in the others.

[@AlexanderNixonArtHistory]

me too. I also LOVE the sound weapons.

[@jeremyevans8374]

2 things I love about Dune: 1. Because this takes place thousands and thousands of years in the future, that means right now we are living in the middle of a REALLY LONG TIME AGO. That's fun. 2. Herbert found a logically coherent way to put swords and spaceships in the same story. That's even more fun. Yes, it goes a lot deeper than that, but those are the parts that entertain me the most.

[@patrickleitzen9752]

all I could think of was "or attached to heavy objects such as the Baron Harkonnen"

[@lsporter88]

Herbert has in my humble opinion, created a very plausible Universe. The Personal Shield I find particularly interesting. It negates much of the stand far off and shoot warfare that we like to employ currently. It forces one to face one's enemy in close quarters, making it almost impossible to hide one's deadly intentions, or avoid the risk and consequences for having them. The nature of the Shield itself forces one to be "Fast on the Defense and Slow on the Attack". I believe that to be a good rule of thumb for all of life. Superb presentation.

[@sid2112]

The best defense is a good offense my friend.

[@lsporter88]

@@sid2112 Certainly, if and when you've been attacked. I was trying to say it's not good to be the one who, "Created ", the violence or the violent situation to begin with.

[@ibashcommunists6847]

Its not plausible. Otherwise the dune soldiers would have copied roman legionary tactics like tower shields and shield wall.

[@lsporter88]

@@ibashcommunists6847 You may be missing the bigger picture. What if we didn't use computers and Specialized Humans had to fill that role to maintain a Space Faring Civilization? What would that look like? I think Frank Herbert did a pretty good job of imagining that. And even though you have directed energy weapons and personal shields, there will always be limitations in some way was another thing Herbert was seemingly trying to show us. I tend to agree, no Human Civilization has ever been Omnipotent, or Perfect. Can you think of one?

[@kingssman2]

We're starting to see thinking machines take over artwork

[@stxrobstar]

We may need to throw a Butlerian Jihad to rein in Yootoob's A.I. at some point as well.

[@summer7603]

just wait until 4chan gets a hold of that technology

[@ThePartisan13]

Lol I don't know about that. Like sure it's fascinating to see but it's not taking over.

[@electriceyeball]

Not on the Dune subreddit!!!

[@joshallen4848]

I've yet to see AI create an artwork that couldn't have been created by a person. To me they're just clever 'abstract art creators.' But it's definitely not magic. It's creative programming no doubt, but otherwise more of a parlor trick than actual machine intelligence.

[@DemitriVladMaximov]

Something I just thought of, while bullets wouldn't work against a shield, and shrapnell would also be not very effective, projectile weapons would still be useful in the case of RPGs, or as delivery systems of thermal and chemical weapons. So you would still have long range combat with say an incendiary rocket detonating near a bunch of shielded targets releasing a huge amount of heat and perhaps, like with napalm, suck all the air out of the area suffocating the targets in an AOE detonation.

[@earlware4322]

Yeah, I could definitely see a fuel/air bomb being of great use in Dune combat. It basically creates an explosion so intense that all the air is sucked out of the blast zone, creating a vacuum that then draws in the white hot gases and debris in a close radius from the initial impact area. The resulting force compression would crush the human body and virtually liquefy bones. Personal shield or not, a hit from one of these, even if not a direct one, would obliterate an opponent on the battlefield. As an added bonus the missle could be a simple line-of-sight delivery system, no worries about the Thinking Machine ban.

[@wesleygoodwin798]

You do see some bombs being used in all three film adaptations. I would posit that implementing a large carpet bombing campaign would either: 1) destroy too much of the infrastructure and labor force that you would want to conquer or 2) anger other houses to move that the tactic be banned just like the use of atomics, thus putting a death sentence on the house crazy enough to try it.

[@SportyMabamba]

I particularly enjoyed the portrayal of the ‘drill bombs’ in Villeneuve’s Dune, which almost seemed to sit on top of the Atreides ships’ shields then penetrate and detonate

[@kimsoares3271]

Yep. Personal shield cannot negate destructive blastwave from an explosion.

[@toddkes5890]

The other fun question - if you shoot a personal shield with a gun, what happens to the momentum from the bullet? Does the momentum: 1) just go away (violating physics) 2) get absorbed and dissipated by the shield (using up more energy to slow down the bullet) 3) get transferred to the wearer (so the bullet hits the shield, and the wearer feels their shield generator shove against them; less energy than #2, but hope the shield is anchored well)

[@TillionTirrion]

The Dune videos you create are what originally drew me in to your channel, great stuff and trying to give support to continued efforts.

[@NerdCookies]

Thank you so much for the support!

[@rolux4853]

You give 5 dollars to a channel that uploads AI generated content? Which in this case is hilarious because that’s all what the Duneiverse is against.. Low effort AI KZbin channels should be forbidden! Only creators who write their own command present it on camera should be allowed to! Only exemptions should be handicapped people!

[@TillionTirrion]

@@rolux4853 I support this channel across various platforms and am happy to do so. I've watched the host speak extemporaneously to other "prominent" KZbinrs so I am not quite certain you are ranting on about.

[@lolwhat7178]

Thank you for putting this stuff together. I can listen to Dune lore for hours and I do 🤣

[@markghammartist]

i love this about dune. being an artist and seeing the possibility of my job being replaced by A.I recently has got me a little worried. i feel like frank was onto something with this. i completely agree that being so reliant on technology to think for us is ultimatly a bad thing and will make humanity worse not better, and learning to be a better person is the way to go. great vid!

[@markghammartist]

and i just noticed a couple of the images on this video where A.I art haha how ironic

[@rhoydplaz2853]

WHY JUST IMPROVE IF YOU CANT COMPETE DON'T COMPLAIN

[@Carribla]

​@@rhoydplaz2853thank you. The fear of ai is ridiculous, people just need to stfu. "I'm an artist" is what every middle schooler is saying about it. Like calm down it can barely get hands right, you can keep drawing you anime and skulls with flowers around them on your note pad

[@lewisleslie2821]

I know the whole “air can pass through shields” thing is convenient, but in statistical mechanics we learn that the average speed of a room-temperature air molecule is hundreds of meters per second.

[@Jared_Wignall]

These Dune videos are always interesting. Keep up the great work, take care!

[@carloscrecelius9597]

I've always found the Tleilaxu tech fascinating, especially their axlotl tanks. I'd love to hear your thoughts on it.

[@seanpowell3755]

There axlotl tanks are their women

[@carloscrecelius9597]

@@seanpowell3755 makes you wonder what kind of society would condone the practice.

[@paulhunter6742]

Those axlotl tanks made females obsolete, I wonder what female half of humanity thinks about this?

[@carloscrecelius9597]

@@paulhunter6742 the BG of the Scattering weren't very happy about it. It's said that is why the Honored Matres were so savage and disdainful of males and held a particular hatred for the Tleilaxu.

[@go.gleisson]

It’d be great if you’d explain more about the anatomy of all the space ships - interior design, control room, the whole structure in general. Thanks for all the insightful videos!

[@jymbo1969]

There's not much in Dune lore about the design of spaceships. The heighliner and the no-ship are probably the best described.

[@burger_kinghorn]

How do any of the internal systems (like life support) work without any computers?

[@jerrysstories711]

Hmm... This vid was mostly about the Holtzman Effect. You could do a whole series on post-Butlerian tech. How do the Ixians work around or navigate Butlerian strictures? Same question for the Bene Tlielaxu. And does anyone really follow those strictures after the God Emperor and the Famine times? There's waaay more to this topic than the Holtzman Effect.

[@jb-xs8bo]

frank herbert deliberately made the information about the technology in dune limited, so it wouldnt distract from the human and political focus of the story. there isnt much lore about the specific technology, only very broad descriptions. although I would love to see it, are humans building all these shield generators by hand? who knows.

[@jaidarling8855]

Lmao, when you explained the part about everyday objects having a version of the personal shields, my brain for some reason jumped to Macgyver being trapped in a room with a floating lamp and then stripping the generator from the lamp to build himself a personal shield.

[@summer7603]

yey your voice is so mellow I will slowly slip into sleep to the sound of knowledge from nerdcookies

[@samiam.402]

More Dune videos!!!! Yes thank you!!

[@kel3747]

The more we advance in technology the more I see this as an inevitable outcome.

[@Schnittertm1]

It is by far the only outcome. A merging with technology (i.e. cyborgs) is another one. No matter what shape the future will take, if humans survive that long and don't wipe themselves out, our descendants may take wildly different forms than our usualy, bipedal form.

[@kineticstar]

I've always been curious about how the Guild Highliners could fold into a position just above a planet. How could they not be effected the gravity or get yanked down by said planet? From their size description they are about the size of a moon. That's got to do some crazy things when a new moon just pops into existence. Frank really messed up generations of astrophysicist with not giving more details on his tech.

[@changsangma1915]

Trying to make too much sense out of a space fantasy movie is least of actual scientist's worries.

[@HBG313]

ITS SCI FI

[@araknas3981]

@@changsangma1915 Dune is a nearly 60 year old book, not a "space fantasy movie".

[@changsangma1915]

@@araknas3981 ....ah good, thanks for the fact check of something i already know. The point still stands thank you.

[@michaelpipkin9942]

This is crazy. Yesterday I was hoping you would make a video on this. I swear I've been taking to much, "spice".

[@coryrichmond2039]

I love how Herbert found a way around computers. As I was watching this I wonder how a shield in Dune would hold up against Covenant plasma weapons from Halo. The lasguns have continuous laser that results in the catastrophic effects. The plasma moves slowly. I wonder if there would be similar results of if the plasma could damage the target.

[@Schnittertm1]

I would also wonder if one could design a projectile weapon that can detect shields, slow down the projectile enough to pass the shield and then either explode or get a boost from a miniature rocket motor. Although the first option would be preferable, as the gas trapped within the shield couldn't get out if it were accelerated by an explosion. The pressure differential would be deadly in most cases, too.

[@toddkes5890]

Depends on how slow the speed is. From the Dune wikia the upper limit is often 9 cm/s (less than 4 inches per second), while an AK-47's bullet is over 7000 times faster. As to lasguns, I figure that the Dune lasguns use Holtzman effects to cut, while a regular laser weapon might get blocked by the shields (concentrated light). The detonation of a Holtzman shield should not exceed the total energy stored in the shield/battery/lasgun setup, otherwise it is creating energy from nowhere. It might have nuclear-like characteristics, but if there is a total of 80 MegaJoules in the system then the explosion will not exceed 80 MegaJoules. Another idea might be where in a lasgun-shield interaction, the explosion is more likely to occur near the smaller setup. So a personal lasgun fired at a House shield will likely have the personal lasgun blowing up and the House shield getting a minor flicker. Similarly a dreadnought-scale lasgun firing at a regiment of individuals with personal shields will pop them easily. You can then get into sensors, surge protectors, emergency shutdowns, temporary high-capacity shields and lasguns, etc. Sensors on a shield or lasgun might detect the buildup and hut down the shield or weapon before it blows up. Surge protectors would handle excess feedback and shut down the Lasgun/Shield before they explode (lower tech, but you need to reset the lasgun/shield before it can be used again). Temporary shields ejected during a space battle might only last a few seconds, but if it is enough to cause a dreadnought's lasgun to detonate then that is enough. You might have some groups that protect their troops more (Atreides) and have more safety systems, but their Lasguns and shields are weaker. Harkonnen ships might not has as many safety systems, but their lasguns & shields are stronger.

[@arthurofalsen2110]

This is a compliment. Your monotonous narrator voice reminds me of the narrator computer from the movie and somehow fits the subject very well

[@lucagiovanetti9870]

In villeneuve's movie, this important issue was completely left out but it's a great movie regardless!

[@sectorgovernor]

I think he simply doesn't have time for it. It would be good for part 2, but part 2 already should explain lot of things what has been left out from part 1. This book should have been a trilogy.

[@leoh2251]

Thought it was a great detail at the start of Dune Part 2 when the leader of the Harkonnen combatants at the start of the film called out "no shields!"

[@marknovak6498]

I liked how the devices were so advanced the issue became human's ability to regulate. Leto II knew that the problem with agreements was that eventually there would emerge a group who would skirt and later just ignore the agreement over time or a group would emerge that was never a party to such an agreement and the order it enforced would fall.

[@jammer2isme]

one thing i never understood, but had a small clue towards, was the lack of using Holtzmann generators for the spice harvesters and ornithopters. yes, shields would attract a worm and shield tech is based on Holtzmann tech... but if the worms are coming anyway.. then why not put Holtzmann effect generators on the spice harvesters and then just lift them away from danger anytime the worms came near? with ornithopters i can see the static from sand storms interfering but they could still have used them... unless they DID use them and they weren't mentioned? small plot hole but one to ponder.

[@BenjaminWeimer]

interesting as always.

[@shinjukucalling763]

Least pleasing reading of this script I couldn't imagined

[@anthonypinkerton1809]

As stated on an earlier episode, the Holtzman Effect was probably the most interesting invention in the Dune Universe. Frank Herbert's description is extremely vague as to how the effect is produced; partly because in most Science Fiction books, the authors are speculating about the development of technology meant to make it easier for mankind to achieve greater and greater results. But, in Dune, Frank Herbert correctly shows us that technology needs to be carefully considered. Whether any form of technology is deemed good or bad, depends on its application. In point of fact, the Omnious A.I. was developed to assist humanity, but eventually Omnious saw humanity as a disease and therefore needed eradication. Thus, causing the Great Revolt. What's actually interesting is that Frank Herbert never actually described how the Holtzman Effect was achieved, leaving the actual scientific principles open to interpretation. Unlike, on Star Trek, where technology is seen as monovalent. Except when Star Trek encounters the Borg; its Frank Herbert's worst nightmare unleashed.

[@MySamurai77]

Please do not denigrate the memory of Frank Herbert by associating his work with the childish inventions of his son. "Omnious" what a joke, B. Herbert doesn't understand the books his dad wrote.. or he doesn't care

[@30chillipalmer]

Cookies your back! 🤙🏾✌🏾😂 Love my Dune lore.

[@botondkalocsai5322]

Considering the Maxwell-Boltzmann velocity distribution for air, the average velocity of an oxygen molecule is on the order of multiple hundreds of metre per second. While air molecules can go out unrestricted, only a very tiny fraction of outside air molecules can go inside because of the velocity limit imposed by the shield. This should result in a near vacuum-like low pressure environment inside the volume enclosed by the shield. Basically everyone who use the personal shield without a pressurised suit ought to suffocate. Holtzmann shield technology is basically a Maxwell demon.

[@rattlesnakeprospecting875]

Would be really cool to see a series/mini series about Holtzman this is an untapped area in the Dune universe the Brian hasn't messed with yet!!

[@champisthebunny6003]

Are not all of Dunes smaller spacecraft for in-system use, IE frigates and shuttles and the like, also, basically Anti-grav as well? They would have to be, because interstellar commerce at the scope and scale of the Dune universe would simply not make economic or energetic sense if they had to rely on rockets or impulse type systems to move goods and people in and out of planetary gravity wells. But, if you can nullify gravity, suddenly, the economics of interstellar trade can be made to work, even for relatively low cost items. The Atreidies for example, became a great house selling fine rice to the....galaxy?. For the Harkonen, it was whale furs. W/o the holtzman effect to side-step gravity, the intricate trades networks of CHOAM and the SG would be impossible. Lifting mundane goods like Furs and Rice out of gravity wells via rockets, then transporting them LY to other star systems, would not be economically viable no matter the price. W/O holtzman nullifiers, about the only interstellar trade good that would work, would be certain high-tech goods, the spice itself, and possibly some other low weight, high value items.

[@UnquenchableHarvest]

These are indeed great videos and I always jump at the opportunity to watch muh Nerd Cookies.

[@jtownjumpcity5937]

Thank you for staying with Frank.

[@XyZed1000]

I always liked how Frank Herbet saw the possible future of computing technologies and humans reliance on it. It's too bad his son didn't do that fictional past justice(at least his son actually wrote stuff...and then went out to publish it....and then...and then...). Too much, 'and then this stuff happened and then....'. There was too much, opera? My, you have come to far in your journey, when I subbed, less than 260 subs, now, 110k! Wait, 111k!! Passion! I guess Mr Lucas wasn't in the writing room when they said passion leads to the dark side. If that were so, we wouldn't have....well....all of this! Except recent TV and movie events....anyway, I'm off on a tangent. ...Well Done!! 🖖🖖👏

[@danelamoreaux4166]

Don't have a good day.......Have a great day.

[@qontoh2s872]

Great way to start a morning, another great video!

[@dariustiapula]

All my favorite medieval youtuber would probably love the Dune universe. Imagine Shadeversity or others running their own weapons school.

[@bocktordaytona5656]

What? The other Day I Just mentioned that would be cool a vid about the machines and how technology evolved in dune universe and here we have this! My lady you deserve a crown.

[@_ariosto1519]

Excellent video! Thank you, subscribed to the channel! Actually the shield was discovered first, and was what saved mankind from extinction in the first part of the war with the machines. The space folding and the guild came much later.

[@Name-ot3xw]

I could use a few of them anti-grav things for my fish tank. It weighs ~900lbs when full and I need to scooch it about 2 feet to the left.

[@mattymaple1976]

Great video, as always. Thanks for what u do :)

[@wk8219]

Thx, Great Dune content.

[@williamlee5313]

One of the best analysis of Dune and our current path with AI.

[@hobbyistnetwork]

So instead of everything relying on silicone chips, everything relies on the Holtzman effect

[@ninam6826]

Great video! The Butlerian Jihad and the novel take on humanity's technological development is by far my favorite aspect of the Dune universe! I have always wondered though, how does humanity create massive, complex machines without even basic circuit technology? I have read that even simple calculators were banned. For the example of space ships: even if navigators can calculate the correct trajectories through space and even if mentats can design and engineer these machines, when it comes time to "make the jump", surely there will be components of the ship that need to sense their internal state and communicate with other parts of the ship in processes that would need to be faster than I think a mentat could do. How do you allow for such sensing and intercomponent interaction without basic circuits? Would love anyone else's thoughts on this!

[@SportyMabamba]

You could mimic electronic circuits and logic gates with fluidic circuits and valves. It would be much more bulky but the size of the Highliners has always been enormous. Just my thought

[@kol9495]

I Always enjoy your videos

[@Davepool-hs7vr]

The personal defense shield looked great in Dune 2021

[@117AROD]

Who keeps mass producing the DUNE technology?? 🤔

[@scottvergin4732]

Thinking Machines

[@AdeptCharon]

Great overview!

[@davidplowman6149]

I’m not personally a fan of Frank Herbert’s writing style but I’ve read the first book and devoured the lore videos on KZbin. The universe he creates, along with its history, characters, and science are logically explained and not only stuck to but have an incredible impact on the plot. Unlike the universe of a recent show that shall not be named Herbert’s universe feels lived in. It is the opposite of contrived and exhibits none of the falsities that it’s fantasy (or sci-fi) so anything can happen. Tolkien called it sub-creation and I think that is fitting. Herbert created a universe that feels real. The lore is solid and you can extrapolate without devolving into nonsense. Though I would love an explanation of the fast travel in the show that must not be name. Maybe a nerd who bakes cookies could do a satyrical video on it along with how a fictional race literally doesn’t need to sleep or eat and, who a certain member of, believes she can swim across thousands of miles of ocean and can somehow breathe rock heated to over a thousand degrees Fahrenheit or Celsius (take your pick). Also, regular humans survive this too, not just those from a special island of Uber-mensch, so I don’t think those who created this particular show are actually human. Or maybe they’re just incredibly untalented but there mommies told them they could be anything even if they literally couldn’t be it and a certain Abrams who isn’t a tank got them a job for, I don’t know, revealing he’s Epstein’s love child or something. Seriously, who hired these idiots? Also, please bake more nerd cookies and for gods sake don’t use raisins. I loved my grandma but always felt cheated when she didn’t use chocolate chips.

[@sid2112]

Saturday afternoon with Cookies! Hey you! Thanks for another cool video!

[@ucheuchema1081]

Great explanation of what the "Golden Path" was and why,. The example of the Hunter seekers was excellent. These details are missing in most Dune Lore.

[@smoore6461]

Love these videos Nerd Cookies!!! This sort of lore breakdown is fascinating to me. I always enjoyed the fact that Duncan Idaho planted house shield in the sand for he forces attacking arakis to take a shot with lazguns 😀 I Also loved the Fremsn distain for shield use

[@peraticti]

I look forward to your videos to lead use into the next dune movie.

[@Psyrus88]

What would prevent someone from using a leaf blower to suffocate the wearer of a Holtzman shield?

[@wadewilson524]

Always outstanding content! You deserve many times the number of subscribers!

[@marksanzone4948]

Fascinating creativity!! 😮😮😊

[@Claire-xq6lk]

Love your channel :)

[@Kelkschiz]

In Dune, I love the rich layers of humanity (politics, culture, science, religion) surrounding man's relation to machines. In the original Dune, this history is sensed throughout. In the prequals this history is thoroughly experienced. Though, strangely enough, one of the machines in Dune that has fascinated me most is the stillsuit.

[@kipclifton9403]

Yay cookies today

[@vladimirsmitran2378]

i think that contact of the lass gun and the shield, causes inevitable destruction of both objects - i.e. both person who shot the las gun, and the person wearing the shield? at least in herbert's books (and also in RTS Dune2000 - btw, one of the best RTS games ever made, although it is almost 25 years old?!?). so, i beleive that is the main reason why they almost exclusively use cold weapons - swords, knives, spears and so on, wich entailed use of those magnificent shields (based on holtzman effect, as well as all deep space travel-so called traveling without moving, levitation - in books those machines were called suspensors or suspenders, if i am not mistaken?); those are some kind of orbs that allowed him to float and to move with such ease (much like the devices that sardaukars, harkonnen soldiers etc, use in the villeneuve movies, in which baron has implanted some sort of biomechanical, transhumanistic machinery inside his spine, so he could move that enormous body of his. baron has (or rather had), and he has been living most part of his life with it - some sort of micromolecular desease that causes abnormal fatness and some bizzare body's hormone transformations, that reverend mother gaius helen mohiam had infected him at some point.... (spoilers!). fans who read the books probably knows all about it, and it would not be fair for the rest of the fans (who has not read that concrete book), to uncover until they alone would want it. for real dune lovers, dont miss tv mini series from around 2000, and 2003. perhaps - all in all 6,7 shows. for instance, william hart is duke leto atreides and so on... sorry for annoying to everyone who's been annoyed... does anyone know will there be another sequel, perhaps series, anything connected to any dune? maybe next novels screened, in any form - series, movies, whatever? heard that could be bene gesserit series (sisterhood?), maybe even dune mesiah? maybe more...?

[@iancowan3527]

It's wild that one tech with three phases cover the multitude of demands we now come to expect in most every futuristic movie or story!

[@exposingproxystalkingorgan4164]

Omnibus and the thinking machine empire is still out in the intergalactic void, waiting to return.

[@richardsimmons9880]

Sorry I haven't tuned in for a while - really enjoyed this 😊 I think it was a stroke if genius to make the technology in Dune 'post-A.I.', and works well with huge timescale of the whole saga

[@CrudeBuster]

i think it was just a scapegoat to make knife fights in the desert relevant to a scifi work. imagine engineering a shield so fantastically advanced to prevent laser beams from hitting a person to be pierced by pointy metal sticks? next innovation is gonna be space warfare with vibranium clubs?

[@davidrobertson2735]

Curious as to why the highly mechanical ornithopter would be necessary given the existence of repulsor technology. But if the rationale is "because an ornithopter is incredibly cool" that would be a completely satisfactory reason.

[@earlware4322]

AFAIK, the orinthopter was developed for planets where the suspensor field was unable to operate as intended (for example on Arrakis). Or when something in the environment interfered with the Holtzman effect. Through the use of opposing ossilating blades, their movements were configured in such a way that vibration was minimalized and stable flight was achieved. Pretty complex and amazing system of transport, especially when you realize that control of each individual blade had to be handled by the pilot since anything sophisticated enough to do anything other than monitor fuel levels and fluid pressure would be a really big violation on the Thinking Machine ban.

[@kallistiX1]

I think people forget about the Jihad because it wasn't a terminator/matrix-style machine takeover. The machines were still machines and they did control every aspect of human life BUT they did so at the behest of the humans who controlled them. It was this control the humans rebelled against. Then, Frank's child came along and thought he had a better story about brains in jars in mech suits and telekinetic amazons.

[@NR-rv8rz]

There are all kinds of medium to long range weapons that could have gotten around the shields without having to engage in hand to hand blade fighting. For example, the South American Indian weapon 'bola' which could be fired from a gun and wrap around the target then slowly constrict so it cuts through the shield and then the target.

[@CrudeBuster]

of course a scifi writer trying to avoid inventing effective advanced technology just ignores all kinds of melee weaponry because it was just an excuse to make knife fights in the desert. it could be a really creative effort to make advanced melee using traditional and native inspiration but you see, that's why Dune is so niche, any normal person can see the problem with "wait, guns don't work but pointy sticks do? what kind of dumb shield is this?"

[@RogueSabre]

Las guns were absolutely not the main weapon used before personal shields. They were relics nearly never used. They only discovered its destructive reaction to shields during a slave revolt. If I remember correctly a slave got a las gun out of an old museum or something and shot it at a shielded person, causing a giant explosion.

[@ssshhhjjj192]

Another nerdy day! Nerd and proud of it!!! 😜

[@tgillies101]

Considering what we are doing with AI now even what we trust basic algorithms for, that Herberts work is not becoming a self fulfilling prophecy. Its almost legitimently scary how much we turn over to computers and machines and normally in the name of profit. But that just brands me a Luddite I guess.

[@CrudeBuster]

nah when humans understand intelligence enough to create thinking machines and not immortal intelligent slaves we'll have Asimov's dillemas around, not a monocratic ban of all technology by some autocratic entity because it would be as stupid as stupid gets.

[@longwlenguyen4214]

Or we can teach the AI humanity like those scientist back in the 60s program a computer to sing Daisy Bell, who knows when humanity all gone the AI will continue our legacy and head to the stars where we failed.

[@taw1967]

I never understood why they just didn’t turn to flame throwers to get at shielded opponents.

[@seanpowell3755]

These books are a forwarning of things to come, no machine should be created in the likeness of a human mind.

[@bailiffbacchus4916]

The irony of listening to you digest dune for me is too much 😁

[@brotherkellymatthewbarnes8882]

I just subscribed to Nerd Cookies She's Really Good.

[@FlameOfRoyeca]

The books are brilliant. The delicate balance between the emperor, spacing guild and the great houses made the universe somewhat functional and well, balanced. And Paul, the supposed hero, disrupts this balance with catastrophic consequences for billions of lives.

[@12oshinko]

Interesting insights from Herbert again with the current conversations about AI and healthcare, criminal justice, commerce, etc...

[@AudraT]

Very cool universe. I guess that's why it still stands in present day pop culture.

[@danielriley7380]

I’d like to delve into the non-mechanics in which a crysknife works.

[@SantamanitaClauscaria]

I would very much like to see a video about the no-rooms and no-ships.

[@SantamanitaClauscaria]

and more of the Ixian technology

[@johnro5650]

Creeper mines. Repulser cylinder, one drive keeps it aloft and moving slowly below a shields threshold. Other repulsors at 90 degrees spin the cylinder like a drill. The cylinder can be filled with poison, explosives, thousands of needles, venemous bugs ect ect.. It's an improved hunter seeker. It cant be grabbed because of the repulsion, it has no friction so the spin is only limited by the material not ripping apart, fast enough to damage anything trying to stop it, make it diamond coated and cut thru any door even miles of rock to get to you. It can go thru out a siech or a fortress releasing radiation, imagine a ball of uranium floating around shooting uranium needles and dust making it uninhabitable

[@TimParker-Chambers]

8:32 When I first read the passage of the first time a laz gun's beam hit Holtzman's shield, I had to laugh at the cosmic irony of it 🥴🥴🥴🥴🙈🙈🙈🙈

[@m.s.9744]

I don't remember unchecked autonomous hunter - seekers in Leto II or Paul's prescient visions for humanities future destruction?

[@ciprianlica]

Technology is not only hardware, nuts and bolts. It is also technique, and the Ancient Greeks called both these aspects with the word "techné", the technical, comprising both the production of mechanical works and of what we would call arts: music, poetry, persuasion etc. You mention the Guild Navigators. But there are also other influential schools of thought within the Empire: the mentats as general pupose AI replacements, the Bene Gesserit with their expertise in religious programming, eugenics and erotic manipulation, the Tleilaxu with genetic engineering and espionage, even the school of the swordmasters.

[@krasuratos]

It’s like a what if universe if humans beat machines in the matrix instead of lost

[@centurion8446]

Worth mentioning it's not just think8ng machines but those who designed snd yielded it whovenslaved people as well

[@vtrbswarmachine]

Much Support keep doing what you're doing. It's a stretch to go far into as much as you did whilst not mentioning the accurate and effective means of anti Spice navigation systems. Future video content I'm sure. It goes full circle.

[@sgt.grinch3299]

I could live in that world. Other than a phone and tablet I have zero use for devices. I use the iPad to watch Nerd Cookies.

[@Osahashi]

Does ancient forbidden technology still exist somewhere in the Dune timeline we know through the movies and maybe books? Is it used by houses? As terrible as the time may have been, seeing technology and robots at their highest level of development would be incredibly interesting.

[@marcoboscarol2420]

there is a planet that still uses computers and other forbidden tech en masse, I dont remember the name tho...

[@sectorgovernor]

@@marcoboscarol2420 IX, if I remember well. They are the most advanced in Dune

[@VoodooV1]

Alternate title of this video based on thumbnail. CHURROSSSS INNNN SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE!!

[@1mocast421]

Have you done a video on the No Ship?

[@shanenolan8252]

I like the technology to download information. ( sort of like the matrix) that would be very useful.

[@doomedtolinger3333]

I have always found poison to be a most effective way around a personal shield.

[@evilemperorcake4984]

Just wait till you hear about the chair dogs :P