The Final Empire: Characters & Relationships | SpanReads

[@GoErikTheRed]

That Kelsier-11th metal connection is great! Love it

[@Laloslawyer]

I’m… kind of shocked and disappointed no one talked about Kelsier and Vin? I know there’s a lot of Kelsier hate in the 17th Shard but their relationship is literally the emotional through-line of the whole book. One of my favorite scenes in any Brandon book is when Vin calls out the crew for being nobles in all but name, and Kelsier feels real shame for the first time we see on screen - the ways in which they grow together and teach each other in life AND death are genuinely beautiful IMO.

[@17thShard]

They talked about Kelsier and Vin in the last episode! -Eric

[@17thShard]

Also don't let Alyx fool you, I think a lot of us love Kelsier a lot, myself included! But yeah, since these are recorded back to back, especially the recaps and reactions can contain stuff that could be in the next episode, but since we already talked about it in the first one, we don't in the second. -Eric

[@rashenditrash]

I absolutely agree - Vin and Kelsier's relationship is a really key/interesting one. I think we do discuss it eventually in some manner, but there's a lot there that could warrant further discussion for sure. And I'll confess to bringing the shameless Kelsier Fanboy Rep to 17th Shard :).

[@jamesporrell5687]

Matt coming in hot with his analysis of Vin’a feelings for Elend! Well said

[@edelopo]

The thing I like the least about TFE is just how little we see about the Lord Ruler. He is like one of the most powerful people in the cosmere and here we just see him die "randomly".

[@glass12]

22:48 Matt's reaction needs to be a GIF xD

[@rashenditrash]

The editing did me so dirty 🤣

[@geosustento8894]

The love story is also one of my biggest gripe with the novel. Vin has been shown to have trust issues all throughout the whole trilogy, but this had never been an issue with Elend, who was everything she was raised to hate. I had been told that this is common for people who had PTSD to be unusually easily attached to someone when they're distrustful of everyone else, but I would assume this response is something we shouldn't be encouraging even in real life, so portraying it in this romantic life is jarring to me

[@jaredpoulter6762]

Yeden's most vital role in the crew is providing the reader an easy answer for least favorite member of the crew.

[@geosustento8894]

She's very good at reading people: not really. She had trouble finding out who the traitor was. She also was very antagonistic and suspicious towards Tindwyl even after being assured by both Elend and Sazed that she is no threat

[@currentlyprocastinating5334]

For some reason this is the one sanderson book where I still remember my feelings when first reading it very clearly and I do therefore wonder if some of the love for the crew is influenced by the later books. I love the characters but final empire might be one of his weakest in terms of characterization. I remember how I couldn’t tell breeze and ham apart until halfway through woa when breeze started getting chapters, and to this I still envision dox and ham as the same character mold just with different clothes/haircut. It’s not necessarily a bad thing tho, as I said I still love the characters and the story. But I also have a distinct memory of reading wax and wayne and stormlight and going “oh sanderson can write distinct characters”. Shows the improvement how much more character he managed to fit in the way of kings first 600 pages compared to the 600 he had in the final empire.

[@hodsinay6969]

At 10:30 Ian is wrong, Vin didn't use only the emotional metals for a lot of time, she also used puter a lot, and I think that it's said that she used tin as well. But the emotional metals are really the first metals she uses intentionally (it was only one of them, but I don't remember which).

[@saltychipguy865]

She used brass (assuming the chart I looked at was right) because she, self described “used her luck to push” on people emotions.

[@17thShard]

I think we actually mentioned her pewter usage in the last episode, but I could misremembering. -Eric

[@Rockwell218]

I personally think Brandon should go an extra 100-200 pages in every book

[@jaredpoulter6762]

My wife recently read Mistborn Era 1. She read it as a gift for me for our anniversary. I think that Sanderson could have told the same story, but focused more on the balls and it would have been very much more a book for her, but much less a book for me. She liked the romance and wanted more.

[@BayleeWharton]

Speaking of Shan being a mean girl, all I can envision if they make this a movie/tv show within the next 5 years i need the girl who plays Cheryl in Riverdale to be Shan

[@Dynnen]

My wife and I fell in love with me after working with each other for 2 weeks It does happen ❤️

[@JessietheSleepyKoala]

Definitely- Chaos and I fell I love quickly and were engaged in a year so hard agree. For me though, it’s more Vin and Elend’s ages and the whole stereotype of teenagers thinking they’re in love, when they don’t really have the life experience to full evaluate things. That being said, it does happen and I’ve always been fond of Vin and Elend together so it didn’t really bother me. - Jessie

[@jonathanbost8427]

Will the other books have the same crew? I assume so because that only makes sense, and all of you are great, but I am missing Eric a bit; he's who got me sucked into 17th Shard lol. I'm sure he's busy though.

[@17thShard]

The Mistborn cast will mostly be similar, but you'll just see me on Well of Ascension's SpanReads, but not any of the other Mistborn ones this year. Realistically, I have to delegate so that we can get more content out, so you won't see me in Diceborn or SpanReads, unfortunately! -Eric

[@jonathanbost8427]

@@17thShard Makes sense, you can only stretch yourself so far. I'm excited for Well of Ascension's SpanReads then, though!

[@17thShard]

I had to talk about Zane on a clean read of this!! -Eric

[@jonathanbost8427]

@@17thShard Of course, as one does. I'm excited for that because my memory of Zane is a bit fuzzy, and I've realized now that he's more important than I thought when I was first reading through.

[@rashenditrash]

@@jonathanbost8427 your memory of Zane is likely better than Eric's was before this reread 😅

[@geosustento8894]

Also, as a malnourished 16yo girl who had only had three months of comfortable life, she's must look outwardly way younger than 16. In fact both Kelsier and Dox remarked that she can pass for a 9 or 10yo boy. In that first night, Vin also remarked how the hasn't quite filled out her dress. Malnourishment can cause developmental delays to adolescents so I'm willing to bet that she must look to be about 14 to anyone who doesn't know her, so a 21yo Elend taking a liking to her before even knowing her name is kinda... icky. If you think about it. Not to mention the power dynamic of him being from the most powerful family and her (as far as he knows) being a country bumpkin.

[@rbkskillz]

Power dynamic? She doesn't work for him. He has no authority over her house. Straff might be able to abuse some power there but it would be more like threatening her house as a whole. Elend can't really do anything. I did always find the age difference icky though. In the end they are both over 20 when they get married, but he meets her as a 16 Year old while he is already 21. 5 years isn't much when it's 30 vs 35, but it is when it's 21 vs 16 ya know? Edit because I went back and found the proper ages

[@geosustento8894]

@@rbkskillz they weren't. Vin was 17/18 at the end of book 2 and 19 when she died.

[@geosustento8894]

@@rbkskillz she was 16 when they met. He was 21.

[@geosustento8894]

@@rbkskillz also power dynamic isn't just in an employee/employer relationship. It's in anything where one has considerable influence compared to another. An older man and a teenage girl, especially when that man is practically royalry, holds so much power in a relationship.

[@rbkskillz]

@@geosustento8894 I thought this too but go back and read the HoA. She specifically tells Hammond her age. "It's been five years Ham, I'm 21 now." -Capter 30 Elend was born 1000 FE Vin was born 1005 FE 5years apart. As I was saying, 26 vs 21 is reasonable. But 21 vs 16 not so much.

[@ashleyromero1996]

I always thought Dockson should have been a woman.