The First Ancient Archons of Teyvat - Genshin Impact Theory

Hello everybody!
This is probably the most controversial theory I've ever made and uploaded on KZbin.
As you can tell by the title and thumbnail, we are going to talk about the possibility that there were seven Archons before the Archon War, and we will try to figure out who they were.
Please, keep a civil tone in the comment section, even if you fully disagree with this theory.
I really hope you liked the video!
As always, if you liked it, don't forget to leave a thumbs up and, if you want to watch more Genshin Impact Theory videos, subscribe and turn the notification bell on!
Obviously, feel free to tell me your theories and doubts in the comments. so that we can discuss them together!
---------CONTENTS OF THIS VIDEO---------
0:00 - Intro and Disclaimers
0:57 - Decarabian and the Divine Seats
4:28 - The Seven Ancient Archons
9:56 - Archon War and 3rd Descender
12:32 - 3rd Descender and Gnoses
14:35 - What Grants a Vision
15:23 - Archon War's Goal
16:08 - Ending Notes
17:22 - Outro
----------------------------------------------
Where Are The Natlan NPCs? - Genshin Impact Theory
• Where Are The Natlan N...
Natlan: Murata? - Archon Quest - Nation [NO LEAKS]
• Natlan: Murata? - Arch...
----------------------------------------------
FOLLOW ME ON:
INSTAGRAM: shadowx5452gaming
shadowx5452gaming
TIKTOK: shadowx5452gaming
www.tiktok.com/@shadowx5452gaming
TWITTER: ShadowX5452 Gaming - @shadowx5452g
/ shadowx5452g
#genshinimpact #genshinimpactlore #genshinimpacttheory #mihoyo #hoyoverse #visions #gaming #gamer #videogames

[@yairiscapellan4874]

First Great video, second this theory makes a lot of sense to me, because in the mission of the Sumeru desert, it is said that King Deshret knew about the Cycle of Seven, as well as seven wise men and that Teyvat lived under the rule of the seven. being at that time the Archon War had not yet begun and he had barely met Rukk. and the Goddess of Flowers. I also remember reading about Decarabian being Archon and many said it was a bad translation.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Thank you! I'm happy you liked it! Do you, by any chance, remember when it is said that Deshret talked about the seven before the Archon War? I honestly don't remember reading about it, but considering what this video is about, I would like to read it. As for Decarabian, yeah... It has been dismissed as a bad translation, but Hoyoverse did fix the Dendro Archon being a man, which was a bad translation, and they had to ask Ganyu's voice actress to record that sentence again, while they left Decarabian being an Archon even after they added two more languages, and it's just text, so it doesn't really look like a mistranslation

[@yairiscapellan4874]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Oh yes, about the Deshret thing if I remember correctly, I think it was in one of the books added in Sumeru about the history of Lilupar and the city of Damabad, or in the stone steles and obelisks in the desert (I'm not sure about Which of the two cases is it) but I do remember that something was mentioned about that. I also think the same about the translations, if they did not modify it it is because it was done on purpose. About the video and who the previous archons could be, before the Archon war, in the cryo set a creature similar to Kapatzir is mentioned which could be a candidate for Archon. And in the case of Liyue, the goddess of Chenyu Valley makes sense, but another candidate may have been the god that Zhongli imprisoned in the village where Yao Yao lives (I don't remember the name of the place) but there was a mission there about a powerful god. who had a colossal size and when he died his body became a mountain, his blood a river and his heart was locked in the mountain near the village and in the WQ where you go to where the heart is, the place was full of the Ruins guardians and a device from Khaenria.

[@ehlannahfhey2347]

Just wanted to add onto this, this most likely is a completely separate thing. From the wiki: Staff of the Scarlet Sands Spoken from the perspective of Deshret as far as I'm aware. "...Then the *seven sage monks were established again*, and they ruled the trajectories drawn by the earth, water, and stars. Even if the celestial sphere was just an illusion, myths are often born when people look up at the stars and moons....The cycle of seven must be removed, because the secret narrative will be blocked."

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@ehlannahfhey2347 oh... I completely forgot about this one! Well, my theory is starting to make a little bit more sense now XD

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@yairiscapellan4874 when it comes to Liloupar and Gurabad, my knowledge is very limited because the story is written in so many different places, it was a literal headache even thinking about trying to understand it. The obelisks? They're a nightmare! I don't remember what this creature similar to Kapatcir is. Which cryo set? And that god, Chi, does make sense as the previous Archon. I mean, we know there were a lot of gods, but we know very little about all of them, so anyone could be the right one and, as I said in the video, there's also the chance it's a God we still don't know. Every year, we get something new about Liyue both in lore and in locations, so this ancient Archon may end up being a God well learn about in a future lantern rite

[@shycracker]

No way finally, some youtubers talks about this theory. I hope this blows out. Because i still hold a firm and solid belief that Decabtian are one of the original Anemo Archon.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Thank you!!! I honestly thought I was going to be destroyed in the comment section, because this theory would destroy a certainty we all have since the beginning of the game. I was definitely ready for the worst XD

[@hanbeitakenakasama7735]

The thing is, Decarabian reigned before the Seven was established, and only the Seven had the title "Archon" bestowed upon them. Decarabian was never called as an "Archon" in the in-game lore material, he was mostly referred to by his title: "God of Storms." But here's the catch. The word "Archon" is only used in translations, the original Chinese translation (and Japanese as well) used a more generic term: god. The reason why Decarabian can also be called "Anemo Archon" is because one of his titles in Chinese translates to "God of Wind" where the characters used are also the same for the one that translates to "Anemo Archon." So there can be confusion there. However, Decarabian's status as the original Anemo Archon doesn't have much support in the game's lore as, for example, Deshret supposed to become the original Dendro Archon, except that he declined the status which left Rukkhadevata assuming the role in his stead. But in the end, what matters more is when in the timeline did the Seven get established, and when did the Gnoses get distributed, and that's also another part of Teyvat's history that is never made clear.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@hanbeitakenakasama7735 just like I said in the video, since the first chapter is all about the word used in Chinese that was then translated in the other language, yes, the Chinese term for anemo Archon is just "wind God", but the translations are not done by random people without any kind of supervision or approval of those translation. The fact that it was translated in every single language as the Anemo Archon (or a word that is used for Venti to define him an anemo Archon) and then, 2 years later, two more languages were added and they approved the translation of anemo Archon, means that Decarabian was, indeed, an anemo Archon, it's not just a mistranslation. Plus, in Venti's character story, venti himself says that Decarabian's ancient seat crumbled and a new one rose for Barbatos, and the seats are those of the Archons. So, hiding behind the "it's a mistranslation" when it clearly isn't, doesn't work anymore, not with two new languages added to the game years later, bearing the same exact definition. This alone proves that it's not a mistranslation that they somehow forgot to fix, because they had to approve two new translations. Yes, it doesn't really change much to the game whether there were ancient Archons or not, but as a theorist, my "job" is to talk about the hidden lore, check, double check, research, and try to prove things said in the game, despite their relevance to the story, and in this case, it's the possibility that the seven from the Archon War, may have not been the first gods to be defined as Archons. This, although it may seem irrelevant, may be one of the reasons why the Archon War happened in the first place, which makes it slightly more important and worth discussing.

[@shycracker]

​@@hanbeitakenakasama7735 Rukkhadrvata isn't even the first Dendro Archon. Because the previous one got completely erased by Irminsul, it's the primary reason why Deshret reject the offer by Celestia. Because of his whole deal with Apep, would not go well if he get memories and existence about him completely erased through the Irminsul used by whoever the next Dendro Archon is, this kind of contradiction doesn't happen with the Tree Elf Spirit Rukkhadevata, so that's why she's the one that ended up as the Dendro Archon.

[@Necrochaosium]

My feeling is that even the dragons themselves had the 'authority' and when they were killed or voluntarily gave their "authority" away (the geo one I suspect at least) then the primordial one simply reallocated this to another entity that was either MADE by their shades or to a creature that existed already in teyvat. So these were effectively archons as holders of this elemental authority. When focalors seat was destroyed the authority over that element was returned to nuevillette as his spirit was the same as the original hydro sovereign. In some ways it's possible that ALL the sovereigns that were killed in the primordial one takeover were actually reborn in the next samsara, and whether they survived the samsara or perished and were reborn their spirit is the same. The question still remains as to whether the dragons themselves were actually the original elemental authority holders or usurped them from some earlier incarnations.

[@arwinv9005]

well we know the authority were stolen as focalor says it not to mention Neuvilltte talks about it like every 3 voice lines he gets as for ressurection not all of them have died and we don't have enough info the dendro sovereign is pretty much the same one as before, when a dragon sovereign is ressurected they are their own unique person they just have their past lifes memories like Neuvilltte but apep hasn't changed like Neuvilltte or ( as far as we know natlanndragons) and we have nibelung wich is supposedly dead and hasn't been ressurected ever since i personally assume if he did he would try to nuke clestia 😂

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

As arwinv9005 said, we do know that the Primordial One stole part of the dragons' authorities. Neuvillette, who now holds the memories of his predecessor, told us without beating around the bush. We also know from Before Sun and Moon that the Primordial One arrived at the old world, that was rules by the seven dragon sovereigns, and fought and defeated them, so they originally held those full authorities, reason why, when Focalors destroyed her seat, the authority went straight back to Neuvillette, the one who was supposed to own it in the first place as the new water dragon. Not all dragons died, Apep is still the original one, but some of those who died, came back to life as their own successors, like Neuvillette and Niebelung, while others (Apep told us), chose to say dead, like probably the Electro one. So, I don't really see wht we would want to know if the dragons stole these authorities from other beings that came before them. I mean, it could be that, when they lived in peace in the old world before the arrival of the Primordial One, they died and came back to life with the authorities of their predecessors, or they were simply extremely long lived and they are were the original and only owners of those powers, but it doesn't sound too important

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@arwinv9005 agree with everything except for Niebelung, who actually came back to life. Apep told us something like "when the dragon king finally came back", and she was talking about the time she met Deshret, so that's when Niebelung's second Reincarnation appeared

[@Necrochaosium]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Niebelung is definitely different in some core ways to the other dragons we just dont have enough info yet, not just because we dont know what elements he wielded (if any) We just know what that when he came back he lost (whatever that entails) I mean you could have a crazy theory that says that niebelung is a sibling of the traveller and was the third descender, I'm sure one content creator has postulated that.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@Necrochaosium honestly, although the term dragon "king" makes it sound like it is different from the other dragons, I still go for the easiest explanation that he was just the leader, just like Zhongli was, in some way, the leader of the Archons, since they went to his gatherings and respected him. But yeah, we don't have much about the dragon king, so everything goes. and trust me, there are people who think Niebelung is the third descender and that it isn't even one of the dragons, for some reason...

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

As a Zhongli lore enthusiast, I have to disagree with the segment about the God of Chenyu vale being the original Archon for the following reasons: Akin to Egeria, when Zhongli descended into Teyvat he *descended* with authority over Geo. (Treasure lost treasure found sequel I believe). BUT we also know from Xianyun's lore that ''Adepti are elemental beings that were not created by the Gods'' and are ''closer to the reality of this world than humans'', so as the Prime of Adepti, amongst many other reasons, some speculative and some deductive, logic dictates that he also wasn't created by the Gods . Also we know that he was pretty much ''Alive'' and was not ''Born'' 6000 years Ago, as of his whereabouts prior to that, we are yet to know. Also Fujin's God wasn't the Original God of the ancient people of Chenyu vale in the sense that they were worshipping her from the time they still lived in the Chasm, she could possibly have come afterward, so she could be as old or as young as Zhongli, or Guizhong is, because what Fujin meant wasn't that she existed before him, but that she was specifically a God over Chenyu vale before him, that's just where people get it mixed, because at that time before they chose to quiet the Chasm, people used to, in the same fashion as in Enkanomiya, talk to the Gods above through emissaries. She wasn't the only god that reigned in the Liyue region before him, Guizhong did too, and Havria, and probably Oscial, she had dominion over dust, and she also had been recorded in Teyvat before him, so she could still be as old as the God of Chenyu vale herself so why couldn't it be her as well ? it's not a matter of who is older than who, Zhongli also Had his own domain, it just wasn't the entirety of Liyue, it was around the south to the west of Liyue where the harbor is and potentially to Jueyeun Karst. He also raised the land and dropped the sea, which is something even the mighty and illuminated Adepti of the south that Fujin praises for being so powerful, were in awe to witness. Also her losing her mind to idea of coveting the seat of Archonhood to the extent of trying to go down with her people while he went through the war under the motto off *I wish not for dominion, yet I cannot let the common folk suffer* sets the real tone of who cares truly about humanity the most, thus who is actually the closest to be an ''emissary'' than the other if you get what I mean 😅🤷‍♂

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

So, the thing about descending doesn't necessarily mean that they physically descended from the Heavens on earth. We need to remember that what Soraya was reading, is a stone tablet written by people of the past, the same people who (just like today anyway) think that the gods return to the heavens when they die. It's what people perceived of a God arriving and taking over the land. It's a God, so it must have come from the Heavens, but that's not a certain proof, it's just a belief. As for the Adepti as being not created by Gods and closer to the reality of this world, doesn't really prove much. The Adepti most likely don't know how Celestia works, who rules it or stuff like that, reason why the Archons can't talk about anything related to Celestia. So yeah, the Adepti are not created by a God, unlike the Oceanids for examples, but Xianyun saying that, doesn't prove that Zhongli wasn't created by a higher being, nor that being created that way, means that he's not close to the reality of Teyvat. Egeria was created by a shade to resemble and function like the Water Dragon but with the material and elements of Teyvat, so she was created by a "god", but she was also very, very close to the reality of the world. As for the "I have dwelt", my explanation has always been one: Zhongli uses archaic expressions. Yes, dwelling somewhere can mean that he could have lived somewhere else before, but when it's someone who just can't use modern English, he just meant "I have lived here for 6000 years", like he has been alive for 6000 years and he spent all of them in Liyue. As for the God from Chenyu Vale, we know that the people, like you said, used to talk with the emissaries of the Heavens, so before the nails descended, but we also know that Fujin was alive when people still lived in caves, so eve before that, and the three Adepti were already together and serving that God. This means that this God has been around since before the people started inhabiting the land again, so she would be way older than Zhongli. I wasn't talking about the people worshipping her, I was talking about Fujin, Lingyuan and Changsheng serving under her, and that predates the Envoy of Celestia and the other group of people moving to Chenyu Vale because a nail descended (and I'm not even sure it's the Chasm, but I have a video about it, the 4.4 analysis). When it comes to Guizhong, we don't really know when her story began, but considering that she seems to have "arrived" not too long before Zhongli, around 6000 years don't seem enough for Fujin's whole life span. Anyway, I don't think Guizhong could have been the previous Archon because, as I said in the video, her dominion was over an aspect of Geo, which is dust, so she doesn't fully represent the element in its fullest. Osial is clearly a Hydro god, so why would he be a Geo Archon anyway? On the other hand, the God of Chenyu Vale did manage the entirety of her land, she could change the geography as she did during the Archon War, and she could make dreams come true, so she sounded like a very powerful God, way stronger than Guizhong who was an expert in mechanics. Yes, she turned against the people and didn't even care about them, but that could have also been one of the reasons of the Archon War, although, I gotta say, didn't the Shogun do something very similar? Did she care about her people before we arrived in Inazuma? Still, we are talking about an Archon War to decide who was going to be included among the new Archons who would have received even more powers with the gnoses, so probably many gods simply went crazy, obsessed for power. I mean, Zhongli is all about not wanting dominion but protecting his people, but Havria, too, had the same ideal. She didn't want to dominate, all she cared was protecting her people from the horrors of the Archon War. She didn't even want to fight nor win, so that doesn't really feel like a quality a God had to have to be able to win the war. On the other hand, it's way too sus that the winners were specifically seven gods who were the most attuned with the element they represented...

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

​​​​​@@ShadowX5452GamingBut the people who wrote the stales knew about Guizhong about as much as Little mao knows about the ancient people form Chenyu vale, not every peice of lore needs to be factice otherwhise all the lore is false, keep that in mind. And I will spare you my rambeling over each and every point you made in your comment because at that point as far as I read into your text you're basically saying : all what we read in lore is inaccurate but my forged heacannons are the truth 😅 and excuse me for saying that so bluntly. Also I would much like if, akin to Klemtime, you made a cohesive tomeline, that could much benefit your videos for clarity because your timelines are shambles.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@citoyenneteavanttout7273 still, differently from ancient stone slabs, we got to talk directly with Lingyuan and Fujin, and they told us the same story, so what Little Mao told us (which was what Lingyuan told him anyway) was confirmed by being who actually lived those stories. As for the "my forged headcannons are the truth", that says a lot. First of all, I didn't forge anything. This is the result of my research, not something I invented out of boredom. Second, I never once tried to convince anybody that my theories are the truth, and being accused of it by someone who is trying to prove that my theory is wrong and forged, well, are you saying that your ideas are the truth? If you see my replies to your comments not as a discussion about lore and theories, but as a way to convince you that I know the truth, then there's literally nothing else to be said.

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

@ShadowX5452Gaming When you do research in a fictional story where you come up with conclusions that are not stated in the fiction, it's called a headcanon, I don't know why you took it as an insult, because theories are headcanon, and yours is as headcannony as it could be because you missed a huge slab from the Lore where it's stated that there was no need for the Archons prior to the second war of vengeance, so there is nothing such as "supposed to be", the supposed to be Archons were the Archons that are the Archons as for today. Okay so I don't wanna look just like a sore hater so I grabed by PC to break down each and every of your points so we can have a more constructive argument : -> Though I do agree with you, we don't know who wrote the stales, but we do know that they're not people form the current era that seems to know much more about Guizhong that you give them credit for and that's for a very subtle detail that you missed : the wording ! they lack vital information about the Geo Archon, they don't even call him the Lord of Geo, he's just a God in their tale. Also they dropped her by name so that's that. Also if you look closer into the Archritecture of the ruins of Chenyu Vale, it's very, very similar to the ruins of the Guili assembly, with a near abscence of any other kind of ruins, which just consolidates my theory, the three Gods Coexisted during the same period of time, for the ruins of the Guili asssembly to have been nearly the only prominent advanced kind of ancient Architecture there, the people of Chenyu vale might have been very primitive when the alliance happen. Which shortened consquently the age of their civilisation in comparision with those that had been in the other parts of Liyue because they obviouly lacked the maturity of a civilisation to have their own kind of settlement just yet. -> I don't know where you base your statement of the Adepti being clueless about Celestia when in your own words they served Gods that predates the seven and you base your analysis on the worlds of an Adeptus? sounds kinda of nonsensial to me. Also huge red flag, Fujin herself says the wisdom and knowledge of the Adepti of Morax/ the south shadow hers by far, not to mention that her memory is not great either. So not you saying you trust her and little Mao over Xianyun, who said verbatum, the Adepti did not WAIT for the Gods to add more emphasis to the ''were not created by the gods'', which came after Neuvillette describing the Gods as fragments of the primordial. And though I don't disagree with you on the fact that Egeria was created by a shade, we have information in lore stating that. Zhongli being created by a higher beign in the same Fashion just debunks your therory about the God of Chenyu vale being the one created to bear Archonhood because if it was the fact, then she should have had donionon over Geo, thing that we have Zero evidence for, but we do have clear lore that a certain someone descended with said dominon over Geo. I also want to remind you that, even if in the stales of Soraya's quest both Guizing and Zhongli were refered to as descended in the ENG text, you knwo the drill, it was just a funny translation. Guizhong as per the Chinese text did not ''Descend'' or got ''demoted'' in the same worlds used for Zhongli, you need to check that one out. Also you have that headcannon of a God might be created before the Adepti that serves them, where does it in lore prompt you to beleive that's the case ? if any, the current lore prevails the opposite, I kigh be streching here but Fujin might have predated the arrival of the God of Chenyu vale. --> We know that Fujin and the Adepti served the God of Chenyu around the time where the people lived in the caves? I don't remember reading that at all, at least I don't remember any section that would prompt me to delve into the same conclusions as ypu. I remember that Fujin was originally a giant golden carp who lived in the rivers of Chenyu Vale, she talked about how their ancestors used to lead those rites, but sh didn't speak of such a thing or anything that would indicate directly that her God is older than Morax. "Some people believe that the first lord of all Liyue was Rex Lapis. But in Chenyu Vale, we believe that before he came, there were other gods and adepti who protected our ancestors." He speaks about ALL LIYUE, context is key. As I already explained to you, all the comparision is based off who came to Chenyu Vale first, not who was a God first. As per whether the caves refer to the chasm or not, you might need to check Jade Splendor lore. And we have record that Zhongli was at least young before the creation of the Chasm, that you'd feel free to debunk but it remains a consequent piece of lore, matter of fact the only piece of lore that we have on the fall of the solar chariot, so until they release something else I will count it as true, especially that we have no other records on what created the chasm anyway. I also think you have the headcanon of the life in Chenyu vale was the first civilisation in Liyue which is mentionned NOWHERE. The people form Chenyu did came form the caves, that doesn't mean there had been no other civilisations nowhere else. -> Changing the Geography ? she merely managed to flood her people, sounds like Hydro to me if I follow your same logic. Making dream comes true might be just an expression to granting the wishes of her subject, and I think you're heavily lining into beleiving that means granting visions, which is NOT the case because we know as per Neuvilette that granting visions started after the second war of vengeance, so much much later. In any case, Guizhong had records of being the one ALSO who layed four commendments for her people and tought them agriculture. And why do you even compare her and Guizhong power whise ? you say Guizhong could not be the Archon because she's weak , but Zhongli is even more poerful than them both and yet he can't be because you made your mind about her being the Archon? And if it has to do with age we have zero evidence that the Goddess of Chenyu vale is older nor more nor less powerful to Guizhong, not even mentioning that strength was never a prerequesite of becomming an Archon in the first place, let's not even mention the fact that Gods did not ''Need'' to anahilate one another because they were still gods living in other parts of Teyvat after the Archon war, again, timeline issue. -> You mention yourself down bellow that Havria also didn't try to harm her people, also if you compare the Goddess of Chenyu vale to Ei, then Ei wasn't even the original Archon, that besides your comparision being irrelevant because maybe you need to grasp more the meanings and retributions behind the Inazuma Arc that mind you happened AFTER the Archon war, timeline issue once again, also on the topic of Havria, the main reason of her not actively covetting the seat was that she was, very, very weak to the point of having to make concessions not to upset other gods, that was NOT THE CASE OF ZHONGLI AT ALL ... so make your mind about what your arguement is because again, this whole ordeal is shambles... because as far as I see you have no slid ground for the Goddess of Chenyu vale being the Actual Archon other than : - She might be older than Moarx and Guizhong (might not be true) - She is kind of more powerful than Guizhong, which is weird that you always try to compare her to Guizhong as a reaso for her to be an Archon while you have to actually compare her to Morax which doesn't work either considering she could have been stopped by her own Adepti before confronting Morax - She is the original God of Chenyu vale (that does not constitute in any way the entirety of Liyue) - She might have had dominion over Geo (Highly doubt, since the first reflex of Morax was casting Geo spears where her first reflex was drowning the reagion). Well if any I would end up with the nail in the coffin : Our lord had all but gone mad *seeking the position of a god* who may rule this world... or perhaps seeking survival. Either way, she lacked the power to overcome Morax. I got tired writing, if I wans't exhausted I could have pointed more and more descrepencies in your arguments but maybe for another day.

[@Kynokefalos]

It is said in the Genshin wiki timeline : >6000 years ago ― Morax, a god with dominion over Geo, is born. And in that time when he was young, he witnessed the disaster with the moons and the seeles. And you both need to relax this archon war, or make a video with so much information of Liyue. Its too soon to ubicate the ancient archon without knowing the fate of the geo dragon, although i see a connection in Morax with the god kings such as Decarabian, Deshret and Remus. It really wonders me where they came from and why the use of the quinquanx.

[@lexical450]

The Decarabian example is probably the strongest point in your theory, i can't really think of someone being the Geo Archon aside from Zhongli to be honest. But i always thought that there had to be something/someone before Venti, especially because it was stated that he was a wind spirit originally, which to me means that some other powerful being was already alive and manifesting it's power over that element. So your theory definitely has merit and is great food for thought, however i don't believe that all of them had a predecessor.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

But then, how would it make sense for Decarabian to be defined as an Archon, and that "with the crumbling of an ancient seat crumbled" (focus on "an", which means that it's not the only one), if he was the only one? And what about Egeria being one of the seven when she turned the Oceanids into people? There were seven back then, it seems.

[@theprinceofflumes3674]

isnt istaroth the shade of time and wind? therefor istaroth likely did what you said

[@Kynokefalos]

Pantalone: Who needs a vision when you're rich ~

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Pantalone is basically batman at this point!

[@ashleyandanime4815]

@@ShadowX5452Gamingnah that’s diluc

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@ashleyandanime4815 oh, yeah, true

[@cherenmertens]

On the contrary, he's really salty he doesn't have a vision. That's his motivation for becoming rich.

[@kotarouinugami1745]

Ningguang and Diluc - laugh while being both rich and with a Vision.

[@erikboncoref.7020]

Well, the fact that Zhongli himself (the oldest Archon and God alive so far) says that the Anemo Archon and him are the remaining original ones makes me think that the actual Archon title was granted to Barbatos as Andrius gave up his body and Decarabian was defeated... Also, Zhongli was, afaik, the very first Geo Archon, and there is a lot of material to suggest that the God of Chenyu Vale might have been Guizhong, so... On the other side, Deshret was OFFERED an Authority that he rejected, and in his rejection and posterior search for Forbidden Knowledge and cataclysm, only then the Dendro Authority ended up being handed by Celestia to Rukkhadevata... About the Electro Gnosis, there is not enough material yet about it other than Makoto received it, but I could be wrong for all I know...

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Yes, they are the only original Archons of the seven who won the Archon War. He always talks about his seven friends from the Archon War, even Ganyu specifically says the seven from 2000 years ago, so they always specify that they're talking about the winners of the Archon War. And, to say that the Archon title was granted to Barbatos directly, means that you decided to ignore the material that calls Decarabian an Archon, but also Venti's character's story in which he says that Decarabian's ancient seat crumbled. You can only see Barbatos as the first ever Archon, if you choose to ignore what the game is actually telling you. We were never told that Zhongli has been the only even Geo Archon. He's been alive for 6000 years "only", which means there is a very high chance that, just like in Mondstadt, there was someone else who had dominion over Geo before him, and was defeated in the Archon War. Also, no, there's no material that says Guizhong was the God of Chenyu Vale, since we know that that God died in a foreign land, and Chenyu Vale was part of Liyue. Also, Guizhong and Zhongli met almost 6000 years ago and she was one of the first casualties of the Archon War. We literally see Zhongli and the Adepti arriving after she was already dead, while the God of Chenyu Vale fought against Rex Lapis. On the other side, Deshret was never offered anything, that's an interpretation of the actual sentence. It just says "Rejecting the gift granted by the divine throne". There's no offering here, which means that he could have already had the authority and he rejected it when he decided to go along with Nabu Malikata. I mean, it's grammar at this point. The sentence can be rewritten as "he sought a new path by rejecting the gift that the divine throne had granted him".

[@erikboncoref.7020]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming well, about Venti, I think it's best to settle with the CN version of most lore, so if it doesn't say the actual "demon-god" word used to refer to the Archons to refer Decarabian, then I still retain my doubts... (This means, I shall have to read the CN version of the Decarabian's Ruins weapon material to avoid translation mishaps, which there seem to be quite a lot) On the Zhongli topic, Cloud Retainer said that SHE got to the scene late and saw Guizhong sealed, but she didn't say "Morax got there late" or "Rex Lapis got there late". For all we know, especially after reading the Memory of Dust, it could've perfectly been Zhongli who, along with the Yakshas, sealed Guizhong, as the image actually suggests (MoD relates Guizhong's last words to Zhongli, which suggests he was there before the Adepti arrived)... Also, the Master of Fujin, Lingyuan and Changsheng was a Goddess who ruled the Northern lands of what will lately be called Liyue, and in CR's abode, the one who sat in the North was Guizhong, while Zhongli sat in the direction of Liyue Harbor and CR sat in the direction of the Adepti's abodes. Most of the material relating to Guizhong aims towards her being the master of Chenyu Vale... About Deshret, if he got the Gnosis and rejected it or if he was offered the Gnosis and then rejected it, the result is the same: he rejected the Gnosis; and if the statues are a reflection on what the Archons' state of mind was when receiving the Gnosis, then you can see that Rukkhadevata receives it with a lot of sadness and grief and after being "Guobafied", so no Archon Deshret either, I guess...

[@kotarouinugami1745]

About Guizhong being the God of Chenyu Vale, things don't add up. We do know Millelith were first established in Liyue Harbor, after destruction of Guili Assembly. And we do know that later, they fought God of Chenyu Vale. So it is possible that God of Chenyu Vale was the one who killed Guizong, they can't have been Guizhong. The "dying in a foreign land" part of God of Chenyu Vale's biography suggests they may have been Orobashi, who died in Inazuma. Because most gods in Archon War were either sealed, or died not far from where they lived. It would be ...interesting if they migrated to Sumeru instead, and were the one who gave Nahida and Rukkadevata the idea of the power of dreams.

[@kasuha]

The only thing I'd say, "first iteration" does not usually mean repetition of something past, rather just something that's meant to be repeated in some form in the future. I don't think Ganyu's statement proves or disproves anything, they were just the first "post-archon war seven".

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

So, what I think is that, if they were the first ever Archons, Ganyu would have probably said "the first instance" rather than "iteration". I mean, the one I showed, it's the actual definition of iteration, and it means "a new version of something". Even saying "the first post-Archon was seven" basically means the same. You wouldn't need to specify "post-Archon War", if there's no previous version of them. Think about this: if you say "the first government after WWII", does that meant that it's the first ever government or that we are talking about a specified government, one that was instituted after the war, as a way to distinguish it from the governments that existed before the war?

[@amouramarie]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming I think you're just misinterpreting that definition. Iteration does mean repeating instance, but the "first iteration" only means that there are iterations that follow, and this is the first. That's the only usage that I've ever seen. "First iteration" means "first instance (of many)" not "first repetition"

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@amouramarie well, no. I checked it up, again. An iteration is a peretition of a process and every single repetition, is an iteration. The first ever version of a process, the original, is not a repetition, so it's not an iteration. So the first iteration is the first repetition, hence there's a base version before them. The literal definition of an iteration is a repetition, so how can you say that first iteration does not mean first repetition?

[@amouramarie]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Well, if that's what you found in an official reference, I won't argue. But it isn't used that way in common speech.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@amouramarie how many times did you actually encounter the word "iteration" in common speech even?

[@strivyus]

I don't know where to start hahahah. Oh!, of course... Great video as always Shadow, everything shows hours of dedication, that's really amazing. Second, Your theory makes sense, my early thougts are with the "archon" title itself. I think Archons were known (by teyvat people) when the gnosis were just created. Before that, this gods were, like you said, the "chosen" ones. I think this is important because a lot of things changed after archon war. As a Remurian lore enthusiast I can complement your theory saying that Remus became a forced Hydro "Archon" when he "Took/stole/received?" the Primordial grail from the already imprisoned Egeria (my theory is that this was the "shard" or authority that is mentioned in Fontain's wings, to became the actual hydro "archon"). That's also explains why Erinnyes and the others Oceanids wanted the grail, and that's why in the vessel of "Song of Days Past" set says at the end: "'Twas not until twilight's end that she (Erinnyes) finally realized, just what that "primordial chalice" actually was...". Finally, that also explains why Remus is considered a usurper. I just got one question, what was the event that ends the archon war?.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Thank you! I'm happy you liked it!!! So yeah, I actually didn't think about it. The title Archon could have been something that only those specific gods knew about, but it wasn't public knowledge, but it became used by the people when the Archon War happened and the Archons were officially and publicly instituted. As for Remus, he was called the Golden Authority, so he could have become the second hydro Archon. Now, I think he's called the usurper not because he stole the grail (also because Egeria said she gave it to him, I think she told Erinnyes directly when she was freed form confinement), but because he stole the entire land. Erynnies was, indeed, looking for the grail to free Egeria, but she was looking for it because people used to believe it was capable of making every dreams come true, so I don't know if she could have really used it to free Egeria. Plus, Erinnyes would have dissolved and reverted back to an Oceanid if she touched the Primordial Water in the chalice anyway. As for the ending of the Archon War.... That's a good question. We should first start with the fact that when we say "Archon War", we actually mean "Archon wars", because every nation had its own version of it, and sometimes it wasn't even a war at all. Mondstadt, Liyue and Inazuma went to war, but Sumeru didn't. Once Deshret and Nabu Malikata (even though se could have never become an Archon, since she was a seelie that wasn't even supposed to retain a body and a mind), Rukkhadevata automatically became the Archon. She didn't fight. For Fontaine, it's a mix of War and not war. Remus didn't fight against another God, definitely not against Egeria. He fought against the people of the land, but they weren't really fighting the Archon War, they were trying to free themselves of the oppressor. Then Remus died and Egeria was released, becoming the Archon. So, I guess that what ended the 7 Archon Wars was Celestia itself. Everytime an Archon was pronounced, an Archon War ended, until every nation had an Archon.

[@xaviervigil5527]

I have something to say but I'll post it in another medium. TLDR, I disagree with this video. There are no Archons prior to Archon War.

[@amorimjt]

Talk about in-depth research!!! Holy cow! This was another impressive video and theory. That’s why i never miss a single video you put out. They always surpass expectations

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Thank you so much!! I'm happy you liked it!!! XD

[@emorynguyen1583]

Really good video and channel I’ll have to subscribe !

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Thank you!!! I'm happy you liked it! And welcome to the channel XD

[@coconeko7097]

This is a really cool theory. I hadn’t thought of it before!!

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Thank you! I'm happy you liked it!!! XD

[@bluestrider2562]

Great theory! I find it odd, we all just automatically believe Nahida about the Traveler being the 4th Descender. Even if Irminsul cannot erase things, it could change the "appearance" of the Descender order. Or another explanation is that the Traveler somehow fell twice. And Nahida, told only a partial truth to prevent from causing Aether trauma, since it seems he's oblivous. Perhaps at the end of the journey, Aether will get his power back but willingly give it up in order to enact some plan, or perhaps he already has done so, and had Istaroth move him back to position in time? But clearly, from the newest Trailer "The Road Not Taken", Lumine seems to have never lost her power, where Aether has. Also, in the flashbacks that are pov style where its centered left and centered right, it almost appears that the memories are of the twins spending time on Teyvat prior to the events of the unknown God. Or perhaps, the way they play as 'old movie' memories imply that they were only a dream or of a time yet to come? It just seems odd, the community doesn't even consider the possibility after what we learned about the 3rd Descender; they had their power taken and it was used to create the Gnosis. The Traveler has lost power at some point, most likely taken by someone... Also, I've said this before, but wouldn't that be ironic if Aether was the #rd Descender with how many times he's come close to a Gnosis? I don't think he's even physically laid hands on one? That's pretty weird. And funny that's he's actively trying to prevent someone from gathering them all in one place, if they did belong to him and he should be the one gathering them lol. In fact, with the exception of the Hydro Gnosis, the Traveler has literally been in the presence of the Gnosis passing into Harbinger hands. It almost seems like a gesture from the Archon's saying, "take it, we have no wish to fight the Traveler, when the times comes and he discovers the truth". You could even make the argument they are implying they intend to stand with them. Even if they don't really understand the full implications of the Gnosis because its more a kin to fate.

[@theRaika]

"First Iteration" to me means, It is used to refer to the first stage or instance of a repeating or cyclical process or event. In this regards, it's the 1st system of the "7 Archons", the origins of the 7 Archon System which is a repeadible system as shown with the new interaction of Archons after the previous dies. Other than that, great theory

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Well, no, I mean you can Google it, and I quote "Iteration is when the same procedure is repeated multiple times". Since iteration literally means "repetition", it can never be the first original product. Like genshin impact 1.0 is the base version, while 1.1 is the first iteration. And I know that it sound like I'm trying to defend my theory really hard, but when it comes to the meaning of words, it's my field of studies as a translator, so I always double check the different possible meanings of a word. In this case, an iteration is always a repetition. Still, thank you! I'm happy you like the video!

[@theRaika]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming honestly sometimes language is hard to understand, because even though you explained it, to me it's still feel like "first iteration" means the 1st implementation. I'll really have to do some research about how to really use that word lol. Instead of searching "iteration" in Google, try "first iteration" meaning and see if it changes your view. Yeah, it was really an entertaining video

[@osmial]

Ok so there's multiple differences when it comes to archons 1st when people talk about original 7 they're talking about the victors of the war 2nd there existed gods that ruled the land before archons can be said archons 3rd barbatos is a new god compared to decarabian it's just venti has taken over the people decarabian ruled thus called the victor 4th the archon title is for those who look after the material world(said by neuvillette) 5th gode exists that helps humans even tho they're not archons but for people they can be called archons but they're not 6th egeria morax decarabian murata rukkhadevata are probably the oldest god's (but again desert had a god that was too big to be ignored)but only 1 remains (idk about cryo one)

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

So, are you agreeing on the chance that there were Archons before the Archon War, even if their role was different form the current ones'? I didn't really understand what you meant with this comment, sorry!!!

[@osmial]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming basically yes tho they wouldn't have been called archons more like envoys maybe? Since gods who possess the divinity have purpose and most lead humans be it any way but yeah archon is a title that is most likely given to the victor of the war not the previous ones

[@ehlannahfhey2347]

Ahh woot 🎉 thanks for another sweet theory video shadow ❤

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Hope you like it!!! XD

[@mehrnaz_]

Your theory does make a lot of sense. I’m not the biggest lore reader but with your videos I can very clearly see how you connect the dots. That’s a form of art my friend! Also, you inspired me to start learning Latin. Thank you for the great videos!

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Thank you!!!!! XD And good luck with Latin... I mean, I studied it for 8 years and I hated every second of it, but it's finally being useful in my life!

[@mehrnaz_]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming well I’m getting help from my brief knowledge of French. Hope that helps. I have a weakness when it comes to learning new languages. Cannot resist my urge! XD

[@aguscm4175]

Currently praticing my Italian and picked it as a language as soon as it was released. When I notice the term Archon wasn't translated in favour for the english term I couldn't help but roll my eyes and still do to this day. The extreme use of anglicisms when not necessary tends to be seen as snob-ish or hood-ish attitude in most of the other western cultures I am familiar with but Italians seem to love it...

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Oh, Italians tend to use one too many anglicisms for no reason at all, which is something I just can't stand. You will hear someone say something that can easily said in full Italian, but they just have to add english words just to feel cool or "professional", while all they're doing is obstructing the comprehension of the sentence in the first place, especially when they use words they don't even know what they mean... Yeah, Italians love using English. I hate it, and I'm the one with the English channel! XD Also, good luck with the language, it's one of the hardest ones in the entire world because of the grammar.....

[@aguscm4175]

​@@ShadowX5452Gaming Thank you, it's not actually that hard for me, a native Spanish speaker. It mostly comes out as pointlessly convoluted.

[@alexprus7953]

About the Gnoses resonating with Celestia: What exactly do you think they resonate with? Is it something like a statue of the 7, made with the 3rd Descender's body? After all, it was never stated that the Descender's entire body was used. Their power might be like Aether's and he needs the statues to use the corresponding elements, except it's more of a curse because they're dead ("To live is in itself a blessing. But once a person dies, the bonds he once had with this world shall all turn to curses" - Skirk's words). Or I guess it might resonate with the divine thrones that have a dragon's stolen authority sealed inside? I know it's just a tiny fragment of the whole theory, but it's a fascinating topic.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

I mean, it could be both. Let's say that, in the past, the authorities were not contained into anything and the gods (the Archons I talk about in this video) could renosate directly with them. Then the third descender arrived in Celestia and, having the same abilities as the traveler, he absorbed the authorities in his body. When he was defeated, they split his body in 14 parts: 7 were used to contain the authorities that the descender already absorbed, and the other seven were turned into the gnoses. So an Archon uses a gnosis to resonate with the seat, meaning that two parts of his remains are linked because they belong to the same body, so the power of an authority is transmitted to an Archon through a gnosis. Something like that. I'm not saying that is the case, but it's a possibility at the very least.

[@user-fc7st1nu9m]

You do make some interesting points. The only gripe i have is that no where does it say that an ancient archon is even a thing. Afaik, it was stated that there were 7 original archons, one for each element, and now only two are still alive so if there was an "ancient archon" they likely won't have anything to do with Archons at all, they coukd simply be powerful beings that represented a certain element. I'm only saying this because Archons are only really recognized as such when they have a gnosis. If someone was called archon without a gnosis, Archon means Ruler in greek. And sure these oowerful beings can be rulers of a nation, but that still doesn't tell us what they are or what they're called

[@jinanimal1603]

They are god kings. There's no other term for that with and the only beings we know so far as god kings are Remus, Decarabian and Deshret.

[@knightmare4808]

I had a great feeling this would be a mega plot twist in the future when they decided to reveal it(if true of course)

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Thank you for giving the theory a chance. Trust me, not a lot of people have been doing it

[@knightmare4808]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming i can see why,but dayum the thought of possibly even more archons than we thought we knew excites me a lot,and i guess another point for genshin's worldbuilding^^,keep cooking^^

[@davidjohnson8273]

Geez now I feel under pressure to say something. Well I don't think anything of the Decarabian thing. I mean if he was an archon and had his seat destroyed then that means there could never be another Anemo Archon so - theory contradicts itself. As for Egeria Nevillette says she made the Oceanid-human hybrids after she became Archon. Sure you claim she was an Archon in the "original" set of Archons but the problem is that we know she was in the Seven. So are we supposed to believe she was in both sets of Archons? Contradiction. These are the only two that have ANY sort of in game contextual mention or hint, strained as they are. For the rest they are just guesses so there's little point in proving they cannot be right because of course the answer back can just be "oh well I guess the original Archon was someone else then". Rather the problem is that it's all too easy because in this theory being an archon is emptied of all meaning. Archon now means nothing more than "god". Why not just say all gods are/were archons? Havria was an Archon, Orobashi was an Archon, maybe some gods were two or three Archons at the same time? and why not? the word "Archon" means nothing. Archons no longer need an Ars Goetia name. Archons no longer need to rule over a nation. Archons no longer need to be powerful. They are no longer chosen in the Archon war. They don't have Gnoses. They don't have Statues of Seven. They don't have to be seven of them as Gnosticism predicts. 16:25 And no the "first iteration of the Seven" means the first and does not mean the second. It would have been better to argue that Ganyu was ignorant of any older Archons and so speaks falsely unintentionally. Unfortunately of course everyone is ignorant and not merely a 4000-odd years old Adeptus like Ganyu. Nobody's heard of any of them. Nobody can account for why they all disappeared. What were they supposed to do? Who could have removed them all? And why? There's nothing. And if they had existed then why were they not replaced the same way the "modern" day Archons are replaced if they die?

[@jinanimal1603]

Yep true, his theory is total bs and it contradicts everything that we have in the story now. Not all Archons are gods, and not all gods are Archons it's a pretty simple sentence and yet this channel didn't understand that Venti is not even a god in the first place.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

It's not like you feel under pressure to say something, you just enjoy trying to destroy my theories as if it was your only goal in life... Anyway, as I said in the video, the new Archons, those who won the Archon War, were different from the ancient one, and the Archon War was enacted to pick 7 new Archons who would receive a gnosis. Just as those theorized (even though they clearly state that they existed) 7 ancient seats were created, what exactly prevents Celestia to make 7 new ones that would work with the gnoses that didn't exist before? So an ancient seat crumbling simply means that a new one was created for Barbatos. "and why didn't they create one now after Focalors destroyed hers?", the authority went back to Neuvillette. What seat can they make now without the authority? Neuvillette said that she was part of the seven, but he also said that, as part of the seven, she didn't have the authority to completely create real humans, so the Oceanid-people were created. The sin was committed way before Remus arrived, so a long time before the Archon War. You don't need to believe me (as if you even would), you just need to read what the game says. She was in both sets of Archons, how is that a contradiction? Can she not? Where is it stated that she can't be part of the ancient seven and the new seven after the Archon War? Didn't Zhongli and Venti become Archons during the Archon War and they're still part of the seven even though this is a new generation of them, since 5 out of seven of them were changed? The second paragraph is just you trying too hard to disprove me theory, I hope you realize that on your own. Just because an Archon in the past didn't have a gnosis, doesn't mean that the word Archon didn't mean a thing. As Venti himself says about Decarabian, he had a seat in Celestia, so being an Archon definitely means that they had more power than the others. Decarabian created an enormous and inpenetrable storm barrier, Deshret had authority over the entire desert, so the entirety of Sumeru. If that means that they're not any different form any other god... And no, the first iteration means that it's the first repetition, not the first ever. The world you're looking for is "instance". The first instance means that they are the first ever to be considered Archons. The first iteration means that they're the first copy, the first improved version. And what do you even mean that we don't know how they were replaced? Do you remember the Archon War by any chance? Or even better, did you even really watch the video? Because at this point, I'm having some doubt....

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@jinanimal1603 if it's all bs and you hold the truth because you're so much better as to insult like you did, then what are you even doing here? This theory contradicts everything we know? So what? Do we know that there haven't been Archons in the past? We're we specifically told "the seven from the Archon War are the first ever Archon of Teyvat, never have there been other Archons before"? No. We're we told that there was an Archon with a seat in Celestia before the Archon War? Yes, in Venti's character stories. So it doesn't look like I'm saying anything that contradicts with "everything we know about the game". If anything, it sound like you decided not to consider everything that there actually is to know in the game... Talk about who's spewing bs, now...

[@davidjohnson8273]

The theory has issues and I'm trying to list what the issues are so as to get an idea about how to think about it overall. And while it doesn't have much backing from evidence it also has very little against it. So it wouldn't take much to swing the narrative to make this theory true or more likely. For example in the original Gnosticism there's five other Archons which are sort of underworld Archons. That might link up to the new people we hear about from Skirk, or the heart of Naberious, or what nation does the metal frame of Aloy represent? Yes I know - it's Aloy so who cares, but why didn't they just give her a Mondstadt frame? I could easily see the game taking a bit of a turn towards an alternative set of Archons, however if there were five they might not be elemental specific like the Seven. We know pretty much zip about the Abyssal world but it would hardly be a shock if it turned out to have stuff that mirrors in some sense, some stuff known from the overworld. That sort of approach would also answer some of the issues I raised like "why did these Archons disappear?" and "why don't they act like the modern ones?" Now are they going to take the game that way? Are we going to expand our knowledge of and adventuring in the Abyss greatly? Possibly it could happen after the "Teyvat Chapter" (which is what the entire story from Mondstadt through Snezhnaya and Khaenri'ah is called). I think the theory could work better by stressing the differences. For example as you say an Archon is always a god (even to the point where the exceptional cases have to become gods just to become Archons - said explicitly in Egeria's case and implicit with Venti). Perhaps this is not true of the old Archons? Or maybe the old Archons were creatures brought by the 2nd throne? that would allow them to be placed prior to the birth of the gods that seems to happen after the Nails come down. There's a lot of ways you could take this theory, but I do think it needs more differentiation between old and new. Of the top of my head.... * the hypostases are the remains of the old Archons -- experimental constructs rather than living beings * the old Archons were the first gods created, and initially the only ones, but somehow they rebelled and had to be replaced. now the new Archons are also rebelling? * the old Archons were illuminated beasts. But they fail somehow. Without the ideals that the new gods have, linking them to one of the ideals of the Heavenly Principles.. so 72 gods are created each embodying one of the 72 Heavenly Principle ideals. In this way the new gods are tied to Celestia. The first thing they must do is war on the old Archons, hence "Archon war" etc, etc, etc. it can't just be old Archons? Same as the New. having said that without any data to support the theory you can make up anything -- well like the 4 examples above. Took me about two minutes per option. You have to tell a little story on how to fold the concept into the real lore. But right now there's not enough there to make any of these stick the landing. But there could be in the future of course. @@jinanimal1603

[@davidjohnson8273]

If these old Seven were before the Archon war then there's not really much time for them to pop-up. After the war with the 2nd throne, the Nailing happens pretty quickly, the Seelies are cursed around the same time and then the gods are created, and then the Archon War begins. There's very little time between these events like a few short centuries. So how and when are these old Archons selected? There's no space for an old Archon war to pick the old Archons. And if Egeria is in both groups it is possible for an old Archon to become a new one so why don't they just do that with all of them? Were they dissatisfied with the old archons somehow? And if Decarabian is an Archon shouldn't he be more powerful than a mere god and shouldn't Celestia be pissed that anyone is fighting against his rule -- their rule? Instead they apparently bless it? And yet he's sealed into a tiny amount of Mondstadt while Andrius - who doesn't even want to be an Archon - effectively rules the other 95% of Mondstadt? Though he doesn't care. Egeria is also apparently beaten by Remus? You could stipulate the first set of archons were incredibly weak I suppose though Deshret seems strong. "Didn't Zhongli and Venti become Archons during the Archon War" No the war ends at different times in different nations as the Archons are declared - when they gain control of an entire nation. Zhongli wins first, then Venti. The last of the Seven is appointed about 2000 years ago. So they are all appointed at the end of the war, but the war ends seven times as it were. There was some debate about all that 3 years ago but this is the superior theory. On the question of the meaning of words in English I feel I have an unfair advantage. "first iteration" does not mean the first repetition. As I said it would bea easier to just say Ganyu had no knowledge of the old Archons. It's not like anyone else ever mentions them. "We're we told that there was an Archon with a seat in Celestia before the Archon War? Yes, in Venti's character stories" Do you just mean the thing about mentioning Decarabian's "throne" was broken? That's just a fancy way to say he was defeated in battle. It doesn't say the throne was in Celestia, or was magical throne containing elemental energy or something. it also might be a literal throne he sat his butt on, located inside his tower. @@ShadowX5452Gaming

[@VeraldoAncodini]

I don't think gods like Decarabian and Kapatcir had the Elemental(Dragon) Authorities. Egeria was the only exception, because with the original Hydro dragon dead, someone needed to wield the power ON Teyvat, so that the Hydro elemental energies(especially the Primordial Sea) and creatures wouldn't go haywire. Your confusion stems from a misunderstanding, there are many elemental gods on Teyvat, or at least used to be, but being a god and holding a Dragon Authority are two different things. Also, wasn't Rukkhadevata's story that she refused any dealings with Celestia during the Archon War, but when Deshret went insane because of forbidden knowledge, she then accepted the Gnosis and its Authority in order to save Sumeru? The Honeyed Final Feast is a misdirection, Malikata arrived way later and the Dendro power and Authority are one and the same, it couldn't be shared. Remember that Deshret could use all the elements and even the Primal light energy that constitutes the elemental powers. Celestial Envoys used to be everywhere, from Sal Vindagnyr to the ruined cities under Inazuma, all across Teyvat. They don't indicate who held the Dragon Authorities. Oh, and Zhongli has been merely dwelling on Teyvat for 6000 years, he was clearly part of Celestia's envoy and lived there before.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

If Egeria was given the authority because the water dragon died to prevent its powers from going haywire, then the Dendro Archon would have never existed, since she has never died. On the other hand, we know that part of the dragon's powers had been stolen, regardless of the fact that a dragon died or was still alive. So, just like Egeria had been given a dragon's authority, the other 6 authorities had to have been given to someone even before the Archon War. So no, it's not a misunderstanding of mine. Just because we were never told that some gods in the past could have held the authorities, doesn't mean that it's necessarily wrong. Yes, being a God and holding dragon authority are two different things, reason why Decarabian was an Archon and had a seat that later crumbled when barbatos defeated him, while Andrius, for example, was just a God. And no, Deshret didn't want to have anything to do with the heavenly principles, he rejected the "gift", and decided to go along with Nabu Malikata's rebellion. Only after he acquired forbidden knowledge, he went insane, not before, and when he sacrificed himself to erase forbidden knowledge, Rukkhadevata was the only god left alive, so she had to become the Archon whether she liked it or not. Dendro power and authority are not the same, I don't know what do you mean by that. Just being a dendro god, doesn't make them an Archon, and Deshret was specifically said to have had the authority over the desert. I don't remember Deshret being able to use all the elements, since no being can do that in Teyvat. Where do you take this from? On the other hand, when we get to the Orchard of Pairidaeza that he created, we see flowers bloom around his seat, and that really looks like dendro... And what about the celestial Envoy? I don't understand what you mean by that. And this thing about Zhongli, honestly, is just what everybody's been saying. Just because he said "I have dwelt", doesn't mean that he lived somewhere else before, he didn't live on Celestia and then was sent down 6000 years ago. "I have dwelt", for a person who speaks only in archaic forms, simply means "I have lived", so what he was saying is that he was born 6000 years ago and have lived in Liyue for those 6000 years. I even checked the Italian translation for that sentence, and he just says "I have lived", instead of something that would make us think that he used to live somewhere else before. Now this is a misunderstanding XD

[@VeraldoAncodini]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Egeria was created specifically, by the Shade of life, for the purpose of replacing the Hydro Dragon, AND to hold the Hydro Authority, because after the death of the original Hydro Dragon, the Primordial Sea threatened all life on Teyvat. That was not the case for the other Authorities which were held by Celestia, since their respective dragons were still alive and were keeping the elemental energies in check. Not to mention that the Hydro Authority is different than the rest, since it controls the Primordial Sea which is the origin of all life on Teyvat. It's obvious that even without their Authority, the Dragons still play a vital role in maintaining life on Teyvat. With the Hydro one being the key figure. The Dragons need to live, and their Authorities need to be wielded properly to maintain Teyvat. Why are you bringing Deshret up and putting words in my mouth? We know he wanted nothing to do with Celestia, I was talking about Rukkhadevata also rejecting Celestia at first, he wasn't her boss, if she wanted she could have joined Celestia from the start and waged war against Deshret to win the Gnosis. Also, Nabu Malikata didn't want to rebel, that was Deshret's plan, and Nabu Malikata advised him to not go against Celestia. Deshret persuaded Nabu Malikata to give him the secrets of Celestia, and that almost destroyed Sumeru with forbidden knowledge. That was the cause of her death, which also forced Deshret to seal off his consciousness in the cyberspace he created. Then Rukkhadevata had to throw everything and the kitchen sink at the problem to fix it, which included accepting the Gnosis and its Dragon Authority. And don't forget that Apep also played an important role by eating Deshret's body, to halt the spread of corruption, and that Rukkhadevata was supposed to help Apep cleanse herself otherwise Sumeru would've been destroyed, which then fell onto Nahida to accomplish with the help of the Dendro elementals and the Traveler. There are quite a few beings that are capable of using all the elements, Deshret, Remus, Irmin and Rhinedottir, all the Descenders and possibly many more outsiders. How else could Deshret create all those highly advanced devices that use the Primal light energy that can be then turned into all the elements. The main hint is that they had 'Golden' powers, just like the Traveler. I meant that Envoys weren't a sign that there was an Archon in the region where they were present. The current Archons being an iteration could very easily refer to the Dragons being the first holders of Authority, it doesn't mean that Celestia appointed other people before to act as Archons, powerful gods could have simply taken up the title of Archon after Celestia fell on hard times. Before they made the Gnoses it made no sense to give Elemental Authorities to gods that they didn't control, just look at Egeria, she was made by Celestia and still managed to cause problems when she improperly used the Authority to turn Oceanids into humans. IMO, the Gnoses are a replacement for Celestia, for the Primordial one and its Shades who themselves replaced Nibelung. The Gnoses link the Authorities to the Genesis Pearl. That's why Focalors destroyed the link between the Authority and the Gnosis, so that Neuvillette could fully merge with the Dragon Authority and connect directly to the Genesis Pearl, without Celestia being involved. That's why there always has to be - a Dragon Sovereign (or an artificial replacement like Egeria), - its respective Elemental Authority, - a holder for the Authority - the Genesis Pearl, - and a wielder of the Genesis Pearl, who connects everyone and effectively rules the entirety of Teyvat. With Celestia no longer being able to fulfill the role that Nibelung originally played, they created the Gnoses to serve as an auto-pilot for Teyvat while they regain their power and health. That's why they used the remains of the 3rd Descender, Celestia could have just left him alive and in charge of the Pearl, but for some reason Celestia teamed up with the 2nd Descender, who was also wounded or otherwise now lacked the power to use the Genesis Pearl, to create their temporary replacement - the Gnoses. The 2nd and 3rd Descenders could very well be the Princess and Prince from the Gnostic Chorus, and if they had taken the Genesis Pearl that would've destroyed Teyvat, that's why Celestia turned the 2nd(the Princess) to their side, and had to then also fight the Prince for the Pearl. Zhongli clearly comes from Celestia, and it's also likely that he can use all the elements, he's the one who came with the Solar Chariot after the near destruction of Celestia, he stayed on Teyvat to fix the problems caused by Abyssal corruption and to protect humanity. Hint - he didn't use Geo to rescue Xiao when he sacrificed himself to get us out of the Abyss.

[@iloveplumpgrannies174]

There's an in-game dialogue(I can't remember where I heard or read it) that says there are so many Gods in Teyvat but only few are considered Archons(non-verbatim). Archons are just Gods but with followers. By that definition alone, Decarabian is an Archon.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Hmm, the problem is that Guizhong and Havria had followers, or better yet, many gods during the Archon War, were simply trying to protect their lands and their people (I think it was said in Havria's quest), so by that definition, almost every god would be an Archon at that point. On the other hand, we could think that the gods of old were fragments of the dragons' authorities, and there were seven of them that were (it does sound stupid when way I'm about to say it) bigger fragments, so some gods that had more authority than the others or that could exert some kind of control over the other fragments. Then the Archon War was created to kill those countless minor gods, which allowed Celestia to retrieve those fragments of authority and get the full authority back, in order to be given to the new perfect gods, the ones that won the Archon War.

[@piolofernandez8490]

But what if the first ancient archons weren't called archons (arch demons), but rather archangels? Just like we have seven main archangels. And that Barbatos is refering to Decarabian as a tyrant because he is punishing the people in Old Mondstadt for they have sinned. You know like, Barbatos is seen as a good god but Decarabian is seen as a tyrant.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

The problem is that the scattered piece of Decarabian's dream defines Decarabian as an Archon, while venti only says that he had a seat that crumbled with his defeat. Plus, in Debris of Decarabian's City, he is called "the God of storms"

[@ehlannahfhey2347]

I had to watch this a second time around before commenting xD Thanks for crafting this amazing & in-depth theory for us! I definitely agree with at least most of this video. I definitely think that even if they weren't necessarily called "archons" that there was always divine seats from the start. We know that the shade of life created Egeria as if she would be the replacement for the hydro dragon. Which leads me to believe they did the same with the other sovereigns, too. It might not be decarabian, or Deshret, but I do think it would make sense if they had created the divine seats to supress the authorities & created a person/entity to fulfill that seat as well. I personally think that Deshret, Decarabian, Remus, they all seems like they're not the "crafted gods" like Egeria, Nahida, Venti, etc. Which i think is probably important context (maybe the po let them rule to have them fail and then bring in the crafted gods lmao [this is a joke...or is it 😂]) I'm not 100% sure if the thunderbird would qualify as a "orginial archon"/"god king" considering every other seat was filled with a humanoid - but we also have no idea of maybe the other god kings had a animal/non-human form too who knows at this point. But i also don't know jack about inazuma lore apart from they used to be inhabited by Tanuki's so idk that i have any good rebuttle 😅 i do think the thunderbird is more akin to andrius or Dvalin, maybe Azhdaha though and that maybe we just don't have good 'historical' context for Inazuma before Baal & Beelzebul 🤔

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

I mean the concept of the video is that, if there were such important gods in the past, we should talk about the possibility. The fact that they may have been called Archons, is just an plus that would explain Decarabian's text and why it has never been fixed, even with the new languages, which most likely means that the concept of "archon" existed before. Even though they could have been called Archons, they were different from the ones that won the Archon War. It's just a title that used to mean something in the past, and now it means something completely different. Despite this explanation, many who have commented (not you, definitely), just got way too defensive over the title of Archon, as if it needs to be something that defines the winners of the Archon War, and cannot have existed before, like no way at all, as if that changed anything. Whether Deshret was an Archon or not (even though it is clearly said that he had authority over the entirety of Sumeru, which can really mean just one thing), does it really make such a difference? Would the current Archons be less Archons if there were some other gods before them with the same title? Anyway, going back to your comment, thank you for considering the possibility, that is basically all I ask with my videos. I do agree that, if Egeria was created because a new water dragon, although an artifical one, was needed to use a Primordial element, it could very well mean, by logic, that the other Primordial elements had to be managed by artificial dragons as well, that is, at the end of the day, very special gods that can clearly die, like Egeria. And back to Decarabian, venti was born from the wind barrier Decarabian created around old Mondstadt, and he was also created by Istaroth, one of the shades, so wouldn't that mean that Decarabian could tap into the wind authority, which allowed him to make such a powerful barrier in the first place?

[@baronbunny7770]

If the people you say were crafted to be archons, then why was there an archon war in the first place?

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@baronbunny7770 because the gods of old were fragments of the authorities and only some of them, the ancient Archons, were more attuned to the element, so they had a seat. Then, the third descender happened, and the heavenly principles had to find a way to lock the authorities, so that no one could steal them anymore, so they enacted the Archon War to retrieve the fragments of powers, meaning they killed the gods. With the authorities back, they created new seats for these new specific beings, new seats that resonated with the gnoses. Now, this is a possibility, I'm not saying this is exactly what happened. We don't know much about the Archon War except for the fact that many gods suddenly went crazy for power and they all died except for a few of them, who coincidentally are the ones that best represent their own element as a whole, and this is what makes me think that these gods were specifically created for that purpose. Of course, I could be wrong, but at this point we can speculate and try to take a guess

[@ehlannahfhey2347]

@ShadowX5452Gaming yeah, idk that it matters all that much for the word itself, just the fact that Irminsul can change so much, tbh they could always have been called archons pre-archon war and everyone just forgot too lmao Although definitely no matter the language or whatnot, there always has to have been some kind of ruler to fill that seat. I'd have to assume Decarabian was able to tap into some sort of power whether through Istaroth or through the divine seat or both tbh. He was way too OP regardless 😂

[@ehlannahfhey2347]

@baronbunny7770 that's a great question. Tbh it's all speculation but regardless, we knoe Egeria was ancient and crafted by the shade of life. She did not yet have divine authority but she was still crafted to basically be the replacement of the sovereign. Idk why she was, or what exactly happened but Remus came to power at some point and obviously Egeria wasn't the archon at that point in time even though she was crafted to be special. 🤷🏽‍♀️

[@alexandertran2442]

97th view for this interesting theory!

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

It's still very early though XD

[@alexandertran2442]

​@@ShadowX5452Gaming i meant its cool to be one of the first as you'll soon have thousands

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@alexandertran2442 and you also get an almost instant reply, while the others will have to wait for me to wake up, since it's 1.30am and I'm about to go to sleep! XD

[@anycoloursyoulike]

wow 🤩 The overall timeline makes much more sense now!

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Just remember that it's a theory, so it's not guaranteed to be 100% right XD

[@rezadenyssen4196]

okay but what if we're literally just paimon's vision and she's using us to claim Celestia/Teyvat by using our power which is basically the same as the third descender. this would explain our lack of dialogue over paimon's, and she would be manipulating and betraying everybody we've met along the way for her own interest? also, our twin likely knows of, and is opposing us because of paimon's influence

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Ehm.... I mean, I do think Paimon is extremely sus, but maybe not that much evil? XD

[@skygazer8549]

Makes me wonder if the Archon war was more Sovereign's Archons (or Archon equivalent) vs Celestia's Archons... It kinda makes sense since Apep recalls Nibelung participating a devastating war that ravaged Teyvat. Now i'm not if Nibelung is a one-dragon-army, but i'm pretty sure a 'war' isn't something you fight alone by your self.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

I tend to believe that the war the dragons participated in, the one Apep talks about, is when the second who came arrived and fought against the Primordial One. Apep makes a difference between the usurper who took their powers, so the Primordial One, and the outsiders who came after, so the second who came and the heavenly principles, and as far as we know, there has been only one war against the heavenly principles. Maybe the dragons that fought the Primordial One (those who survived at least), joined the fight against the second who came. The world was almost destroyed and Apep kept looking for forbidden knowledge until the nails descended. This is how I interpreted her words

[@skygazer8549]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming I'll be honest with you man, i completely forgot about the war with The Second Who came when i wrote that, so i guess i kinda mixed up that battle with the Archon war xD

[@evapunk522]

I'm not really sure about Egeria because Neuvillette could just be referring to her as the archon because she became the archon. Maybe she wasn't always called that, but she ended up that way so why not continue to call her that even when referring to her before she became the archon. For example, if a prince becomes a king, he's still the king even if you are talking about his past self when he was a baby...before he was king. So...yeah. However, the Decarabian bit is sus...but I also think localizations are easily messed up.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

The problem is that he specifies "Egeria, as one of the seven", which seems to mean that she commit her sin when she already was one of the seven. I mean, it's the Hydro Archon, so specifying that she was one of the seven, in general, doesn't really make sense, because it's common knowledge. It's not like he's talking about someone no one knows. It's the way he said it, that feels too strange. Your example isn't exactly right, though. If you're talking about, for example, King Charles, if you want to say that he did something in his past, when he wasn't a king yet, you would say "Charles, as a prince, did something" or "Charles, back when he was still a prince", you wouldn't say "Charles the king did something", because it would imply that he did it after he became a king. So, Egeria as one of the seven, means that she was already one of the seven when she committed her sin, and we know that she did it before Remus arrived, so a long time before the Archon War. As for Decarabian, even though localizations are easily messed up, once they added two more languages 3 years later, they would have realized the mistake and fixed it, especially since it's just a written one, so very easily to fix. If they agreed on those two translations, then it most likely means that he was actually intended to be defined as an Archon

[@ralunix4612]

The statues of the 7th are graves for the descendent they split.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

How many graves would this guy even have though? XD

[@tirramasu7948]

16:37 She did say the first iterarion Which means its the first version.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Yes, she said "first iteration", and, as I showed on screen a moment after, an iteration is a repetition, a better version of something that already exists. An iteration of a software, is a new version of the software, not the first ever release of it. The way you're interpreting that, it should have been "the first instance". In that case, it would have meant that there hasn't been a previous version, that they were the first ever Archons.

[@tirramasu7948]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Augh, Language is so weird.

[@tirramasu7948]

@ShadowX5452Gaming Though I do have to account Ganyus perspective. To her it may well be the first interation

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@tirramasu7948 I studied to become a translator, so researching the meaning and intention of a word, is basically engraved in my brain. Languages are, indeed, weird, but if you see it from a different perspective, finding the right word to convey a specific meaning, can be both fun and satisfying, especially since even the most common word, will have a slightly different meaning from one language to the other, so you need to find a way to compensate for what's missing. As for Ganyu, it could be that she doesn't know, but she's a being that has lived through the Archon War, so if there were other Archons before that, she would have probably known about them, considering she's a higher being. Plus, there's still the "iteration" thing, that implies a previous version of the seven

[@tirramasu7948]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming We can't forget Irminsul tempering

[@user-xy3bs5pd9g]

2:10 It's actually Анемо Архонт without letter "a" ( infinitive form of this words ). The reason why here were letter "a" in a first place : It's Anemo Archon'S wine Это вино Анемо АрхонтА In Russian language this ending is like 's to show that it belongs to him or it's simply his in my example wine . Same logic is here with Genitive case: Des Anemo Archons Infinitive form: Der Anemo-Archon P.S I don't really remember the original text in Russian . The Russian ending "a" is also used for different situations but for simple correction you don't have to know everything. I hope I was able to help you ❤

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

I don't really know how Russian works. I started studying it at university, but I changed language as soon as they attempt teaching cursive writing by just writing it on the blackboard without explaining a thing.... As for German, yes I know, I studied German for more than 10 years, that's why I put "des" between brackets. I was still quoting the exact word used in the material description, despite the declination. Same goes for Russian. But thank you anyway!!! XD

[@user-xy3bs5pd9g]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Cursive writing is the worst part in the world because many words looks alike and you need to count " lll " ( idk how to call it) to recognize which letter it is and I don't even talking about bad handwriting when N looks like K or something 😅. Russian language has no logic sometimes and German language is actually easier because at least it follow some rules . Anyway , have nice day !

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@user-xy3bs5pd9g yeah, when the teacher started writing, it just looked like a bunch on same up and down symbols over and over again, and she was basically teaching Russian to those who already knew it, so someone like me who was just starting, was left completely behind, they didn't care. German is way easier. It has rules and exceptions are just a few. The problem comes with the gender of words, especially when most of them are the opposite as the Italian ones. The easiest example is the sun, which is male in Italian and female in German, and the moon, which is female in Italian and male in German...

[@user-xy3bs5pd9g]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Fun fact : Russian was poor language so they took words from French and German. Some words are exact copy of French words so Russians won't have that much problems to learn it unlike Germans who has same word but different Genus. Huge respect for Germans that they write words and pronounce them as the original language from which that word comes unlike Russians who speaks and write one word from French as they like to make it easier to use in their language. However, no matter which language you learn, some same words will always have different Genus even if they have same meaning. If you know German and Italian then I recommend you to study also Latin to support your knowledge of this both languages because it's Romance languages (same family). Latin is great for learning the grammar of German and studying other languages form same pedigree + Genshin impact whose developers love to use this language. Maybe my English grammar sucks because I know only spoken English from hearing different videos. I hope you could understand it immediately without reading it twice.

[@WayneZvidza-qh2dp]

He was a god of wind but not an archon

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Let's just ignore what the scattered piece of Decarabian's dream and what Venti's character story says, basically...

[@user-fc7st1nu9m]

​@@ShadowX5452Gamingyou're ignoring the fact that it was explicitly stated that Venti is and has been one of the two original archons in the entirety of Teyvat

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@user-fc7st1nu9m you're ignoring the entire video then. No one has ever said that the Archons from the Archon War were specifically the first ever Archons of Teyvat, but at the same time, they said that they were the first iteration, which is a repetition, a new and improved version of something (and this is a dictionary definition, it's not a theory, you can't say that it's wrong unless you want to say that the Oxford dictionary is inaccurate)

[@user-fc7st1nu9m]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming well I'll be lying if i said I did watch the entire video, I stopped a little after you said the Decarabian was the first anemo archon. The game said that there's only ever been one archon so I don't see why it's still up for debate. If you really want Decarabian to be an archon for some reason then sure, in greek the word archon means ruler and since Decarabian was ruling over Mondstadt at the time then that word can be applied to him but that only considers him to be an illegitimate archon since Celestia identifies the archons by the gnosis. Decarabian never had a gnosis. For the first iteration of archons it doesn't mean that there were a previous generation of archons, it could just be the step into becoming an archon. For example we know that all archons are gods but not all gods are archons. For example: Gods that won the war became -> the 1st gen. of Archons (The original 7), if one of the original archons died, the gnosis will be give to -> the 2nd gen. of Archons (Ei, Nahida, Focalors, etc.) -> and the process will repeat itself either indefinitely or until their seat is destroyed, preventing future iterations

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@user-fc7st1nu9m listen, I'm not going to explain or write down for you what I said in the video because you stopped watching it after the first few minutes. If you're sure about your ideas and you are not willing to give the video a chance, then I really don't see why you would be in the comment section commenting about something you decided not to watch. It just makes no sense that you're denying my theory without even knowing what it is

[@jessiellanes3004]

Finally someone made a video Decarabian wiki about anemo archon we'll have a rest Like seriously everyone still believes that it's mistranslation that we literally had 15 or 20 updates and its still there If it is a mistranslation they should have change on the first update version Someone before already reported about wanting to change decarabian anemo archon and there's no response or even change Also Jesus Christ this other comments had bunch of wall of text in their head

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

The thing is that it's easier to just assume it's a mistranslation, so he's never been an Archon before the Archon War, rather than considering the possibility that one certainty (that is the Archons of the Archon War being the first ones ever) may be wrong and that there might be something more that has been hidden but not too much really. Also, this channel usually has entire papers as replies, it's the norm here XD

[@jinanimal1603]

Decarabian can't become the Archon if Andrius is still aliveand after Andrius died Venti became the Archon

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@jinanimal1603 that's how we think the Archon War worked, even though we do know that not all gods had to be dead for one to become the Archon, since inazuma had both Makoto and Ei together and one was an Archon. In this video, we're talking about something that may have happened before the Archon War, a previous concept of Archon that didn't require only one God to exist in a single nation.

[@jinanimal1603]

@@ShadowX5452GamingYou proved to me that you didn't do your research about the Raiden sisters lmao and why Makoto became the Archon.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@jinanimal1603 and would you enlighten us with your knowledge then? But please, if it's the usual "Ei sacrificed herself to make Makoto the Archon, and then Makoto brought her back to life", just don't bother..

[@waitingtoberevived]

i recommend you to actually watch other theory videos to compare to yours to make your theory more strong. I'm not writing a hate comment. Just a suggestion for better video quality i'm expection from this chanel

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

The quality you talk about is the way the video is structured or the topics themselves?

[@waitingtoberevived]

yes@@ShadowX5452Gaming

[@waitingtoberevived]

yes but I'm not saying that the topic is bad or anything. It's actually good and interesting to see someone come up with a different way of seeing things.@@ShadowX5452Gaming

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@waitingtoberevived no, I was actually asking if it was the way the video is structured or the topic, to understand what needs fixing

[@waitingtoberevived]

well, it's quite complicated for me to say so since i actually have to use my brain cells.I can try. I assume that the first few minutes were confusing about what you were trying to say. Insted of that you could have put of some connections of past events or some short of clarification for better understanding. I'm no expert at this field or in the lore. Just a openion. It would have been better if you actually explained that the seats you meant were the seats of archons in celestia which is distroyed after focolor's since the seat is not just a physical thing. It's also part of an archon's authority that is a short of verifications stamp from celestia. You menthoned andrious attacking storm terrors lair but I not having such lore knowledge don't know if that really happend so it was confusing for me. While explaining egeria's past you skipped smaller details creating a hole in informations you were saying out. It was confusing since I had to manually read the context and match what you were saying. It's a bad strategy since people wouldn't wanna waste time on a chanel which is forcing the viewrs to use their own brain cells. Ofcourse as a theory video a normal viewer would wanna turn their brain cells off and listen the theory to let their brain be blown away but when we are actually trying to find the context ourselves it causes us to feel like it's we who are discovering the truth. For that reason it's hard to give credits even though in no facts we could have came up with such a creative theory. Just thinking about we having the chance to think that ruins your effort as a creator.@@ShadowX5452Gaming

[@Wolf-vy7et]

One thing that doesn't make about Decarabian is how did he get defeated by a bunch of humans with torches and a weak ass wind spirit as their leader even though he was most likely among the strongest gods in the Archon war with Andrius, Morax, Deshret ect, mf literraly could have destroyed the revolutionnaries in old Mondstast era but instead he got ganged up and did nothing

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Yeah, that's the thing, actually. Decarabian was powerful enough to protect the entirety of old mondstadt with a storm barrier that even prevented Andrius from harming anyone, but he lost to the people. This can easily mean that the storm barrier was probably something he created with the authority, while his personal power as a god, wasn't too strong. Although, there's a high chance that Barbatos wasn't that puny, insignificant wind spirit as he defined himself to be, and the power he gave to the people was not so little... Or maybe Decarabian already knew that is was over for him, so he didn't put up too much of a fight. We know so little about him to be sure...

[@Wolf-vy7et]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Honestly the only thing that would make sense in my opinion is that he just let himself get killed after realising how bad he was at ruling and didn't get angry at his people, it would explain why there no gods remains around Old Mondstadt which are created by the hatred of thoses dead gods, I remember reading In the Amos' bow I think that both Amos and Decarabian killed eachothers which make this theory more plausible in a way, the other one is that he got sealed but who did, not sure.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@Wolf-vy7et it is a possibility. Maybe it was Amos's betrayal, since she was his girlfriend, that made him understand that, what he thought to be protection, was hurting his people. You know, kinda like how the shogun thought that what she was doing was beneficial to the people of Inazuma and she realized her mistake only when the people rebelled and Yae Miko "betrayed" her. As for him being sealed... Well, we still don't know what's under the tower....

[@Wolf-vy7et]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Honestly yeah Ei's and Decarabian situations are really similar, only difference is Ei being aware of the chaos that the fatui caused to her region while Decarabian was genuinely clueless, and as Ei is, Decarabian was a bad ruler, the fact that he didn't tried to fight Andrius head on when Andrius didn't froze everywhere outside his territory just made his situation worse, also I have theory that it's Istaroth.

[@user-fc7st1nu9m]

Well we've only heard Barbatos considered a weak god by Venti himself. Barbatos is a part of the thousand winds, the shade of time. Before Venti came to Mondstadt he wasn't the god of anything and he was weak but as he gained followers from Mondstadters he gained more power, eventually getting strong enough to be a significant supportive figure in the rebellion. We do not know how powerful Venti was there but I believe his strength came in the form of his blessings, essentially powering up everyone he was with. After Decarabian died and Andrius refused the gnosis, being the only other god at the time, Barbatos was given the gnosis. The gnosis that was given to him was a queen which is considered one of the strongest chess pieces and fits his ideals perfectly. And, unlike the king, a pawn is capable of being a queen so long as it reaches the opposing end of the board which we clearly see in Barbatos' case. And before you say a chess piece has no correlation with strength, the Rook is also considered a strong piece in chess and Zhongli was a feared god at the time. It's also speculated that the Tsaritsa has the other Rook piece. After achieving archonhood, Venti reshaped Mondstadt with just a pluck of his lyre, sending large mountains flying, effortlessly. Weak wind or normal wind will not be able to do this. Even strong wind is capable of moving a mountain slightly every 100 or so years and this is largely thanks to erosion of consistent winds, Venti sliced the mountains clean off and send them away with his power alone

[@jinanimal1603]

There's no such thing as ancient Archons in teyvat. lmao

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

And you say that because you clearly are one of the writers of the game, right? You know exactly the whole story and you are qualified to say what is true and what is false. Decarabian being an Archon with a divine seat that crumbled is DEFINITELY something I invented, it's not something the game is telling us, and surely it's not Venti himself who's saying it.... Yeah.....

[@jinanimal1603]

@@ShadowX5452GamingNah, clearly it's just 1.0 game error that they continued to drag on the other language. Your only argument is decarabian being the anemo archon when clearly he's not if we follow the ingame lore. Yea, you're spouting bs at this point tbh and you're the only yt channel who came up with the most ridiculous theory that it's already proven wrong. Do you even know why the Archon war happened right? I think not since you claimed there are "ancient" archons which doesn't exist. stop the bs and came up with better theory next time. Just because there's an ancient elemental being in the past doesn't mean they are automatically an archon.

[@antonioturrin4706]

OH GOD I DIDN'T REALIZE YOU WERE ITALIAN

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Really? I say it pretty often in my videos, but yeah, I am Italian XD

[@davidjohnson8273]

You're going to get heat from the Zhongli lovers for suggesting he wasn't older than dirt.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

I made a video saying that there were other Archons before the seven from the Archon War. I think I'm way past beyond the "getting heat"...

[@davidjohnson8273]

So it seems like you're missing some stronger evidence for this whole theory and maybe you just didn't fit it in but I guess I'd like to go over it. We know (in the sense that the game shoves it in our face) that when Neuvillette takes over the job of handing out Visions unconsciously from Furina, that the metal casing of the Visions changes from the two it was before to a sort of double headed Vision casing which represents that Neuvillette has complete control over the Pneuma / Ousia aspect of Fontaine's waters - which he explicitly states, in a throwaway comment. This strongly suggests that when you get a new Archon / person who hands out Visions unconsciously, the national casing of the Vision may have small changes to it, though remaining pretty similar. We cannot test this easily because we don't know of any allogenes that are old enough that they got their Visions during one of the now dead Archon's reigns. They would need to be over 500 years old more or less and not be from Liyue or Mondstadt, who never changed Archon at least not in thousands of years. So... the closest is Yae Miko maybe. She's barely 500 so in theory could have gotten the Vision under Makoto. But she won't say how she got her Vision, or even if it is one. But it feels like she got it under Ei. Also it's a bad test case because the two archons are identical twins, so would they even have variant forms of Vision casing? No allogene in Sumeru is 500+ years old and even if they were the samsara shift might override their Vision casing. No one in Fontaine is old enough to have got their Vision 500 years ago, and no others than Furina since a few month ago. We do have Arelcchino who might be 500+ years old. She appears to have the same casing as Childe being the Snezhnaya or Fatui frame. But we haven't really got a good enough look in game except from leaks I think? And she probably didn't get the Vision 500+ years ago under the old Cryo Archon. But we do have one example of a variant casing in the case Kaeya who has what looks close to being a regular Mondstadt casing but with a variant form. This fact has long been pondered on. Is it intentional? Well it appear that the manga has the same image for Kaeya's unique Vision casing. If we assume it's intentional and intentionally a variant form of a Mondstadt casing, then the Neuvillette example suggests that Kaeya got his Mondstadt Vision at a time when someone other than Venti (or whoever really hands out Mondstadt Visions if not him) was the official person signed on as the Vision sender person. Now Kaeya's Vision story says that he got the Vision soon after Crepus' death a few years before the game begins. But this is a lie. It's very interesting that Kaeya's Vision story lies but we "know" it lies because the other lore contradicts it and the manga, once again, shows Kaeya wearing his Vision, at the scene of Crepus' deatha nd therefore hours before the lying Kaeya Story says he and Diluc had a fight at the Winery that evening. So again the specialness of Kaeya's Vision is shoved in our face. We don't know how old Kaeya is or when he got his Vision. But we know he lies about it. We know the devs wanted to tell us his frame is different. What does this all add up to? There's never been an alternative to Venti as Mondstadt Archon. And the Visions only appeared after the current Archons received Gnoses. So what is going on here? Is Venti not the real Archon? Did Kayea come from an alternative timeline? Was the original Venti replaced with an imposter? Has there been more than one Archon in Mondstadt?

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

I'll have to disagree with you first point. Furina is a character that can use both Pneuma and Ousia, differently from every other character from Fontaine, so her vision reflects her ability to draw from both arkhés, not because Neuvillette has authority over both Pneuma and Ousia. We can also test the fact that new Archons don't really give different inlays because in Imperatrix Umbrosa act II, we see a soldier from the cataclysm, so someone who lived when Makoto was still the Archon, and his vision was still the same exact vision people have today. The two are twins, but they're not identical, in the sense that they had different ideals when it comes to eternity, but also with their strengths. As for Yae Miko, she came to my mind as an example, but 500 years ago, she was a little Kitsune in Makoto's arms, so she probably got her vision (if hers is actually a vision) after, so when Ei had already become an Archon. Arlecchino is not 500 years old, she is the age she looks. We know that she became the new director of the House of Hearth when she was still a kid and one of the orphans, so that happened not too long ago. When it comes to Kaeya, it really makes no sense what you just said. Apart from "the game lies", when we clearly know that many things from the manga have been changed in the game, so the manga is obsolete and not 100% reliable, we know that Kaeya was brought to Mondstadt when he was a child and was left in front of the winery. We know that his father was a descendant of Chlothar Alberich, which means that Caribert had to be cured of the curse (and this seems to have happened about 100 years after the cataclysm, more or less) before he could have kids again and make a descendance that ends with Kaeya. So Kaeya is clearly not as old as to have been given his vision by someone who ruled over anemo before Barbatos, which means more that 2600 years ago, and even if he was more than 3000 years old, Neuvillette told us that visions started being given since the end of the Archons War, so he wouldn't have been able to get a vision under a different god anyway. Mondstadt's visions are weird because they seem to account for the nationality of a person, which is really the only thing that would make sense to explain why Kaeya's vision is slightly different, but it would be something that happens in Mondstadt alone, since Thoma, for example, had a regular Inazuman vision. The other possibility is that it's a Khaenri'ah related thing, since in theory, they shouldn't be allowed to have visions, but he did anyway. I mean, they don't believe in the gods of Teyvat, they literally oppose them. Anothe possibility is that, although Caribert had been cured of the desease, we don't really know if there's some underlying consequence or hidden residues of it, that interfered with the vision granting process. There's also the fact that Kaeya's father told him that he was Khaenri'ah's only hope (of ballads and brews), so that may have something to do with it. The other thing that we would need to find out is what those small wings at the bottom of a mondstadt vision actually represent. Normally they are six, but Kaeya has four of them. If we look at Venti's God form in the manga, the upper side of the vision, represents the gold circle with 5 arrows Venti has on his wings, and that's easy. The lower section may represent the wings themselves, but why six? Also, did you notice that in the Sumeru outfit, Kaeya's vision is a regular one, with six little wings?

[@davidjohnson8273]

That's crazy about that third guy without a hat from among the three ghost soldiers having a vision. Are there any other standard models that are edited to give them a vision like that? I assumed all the standard soldier models were standard . Why on earth did they feel the need to do that, that's kinda crazy. I don't think it helps us much because as I'd already said, they were twins, and also because it's not clear if the memory ghosts were from a timeline when Ei was the Archon before the Cataclysm or the timeline where Makoto is. It's possible that when the Sakura tree thing creates a whole new timeline that Ei is the original Archon in it instead of Makoto. Same as how after the samsara shift Nahida has always been the Dendro Archon and neve Rukkhadevata. Even if you go with the silly "only memories change" theory then -- well these are literally memories so wouldn't they have changed? In other words if you asked these guys if there was a big tree on the top of mount Yougou would they say yes or no? Arlecchinoo's probably 500 or so like all the other harbingers above rank 9. The story about 2 Knaves is misdirection. Not sure what you mean about the manga being wrong. It very clearly shows Visions that are identical to those in the game. They are all the same except for Kaeya's exactly the same as in the game. Are you saying they made a mistake and accidentally drew Kaeya's Vision wrong twice? In the game and in the manga? But yes it would be super weird if it was a double mistake, never fixed even though Zhongli's Vision was fixed, and now "fixed" in his Sumeru new dress, but left in his old clothes. More likely the Sumeru clothes are a mistake? "Thoma, for example, had a regular Inazuman vision" Wasn't he in Inazuma when he got it? What's odd about it? @@ShadowX5452Gaming

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@davidjohnson8273 what are you saying? Irminsul has never erased Makoto from the timeline. Makoto is still the Archon who won the Archon War. Don't you remember that, after the whole quest, we went to the shrine and we talked with Yae Miko and Ei about how Makoto was helped by a higher power in Khaenri'ah? So those soldiers were alive during Makoto's time as the Archon. If we asked those people about the tree, they probably would remember about it without knowing when it actually appeared, just like everybody else in Inazuma. "the story of two Knaves is misdirection" is just an excuse to be right, to be honest. You're arbitrarily deciding what needs to be considered and what not, ignoring the actual facts told in the game. When Lynette was saved by Arlecchino from the aristocrat that bought her, Arlecchino wasn't the Knave yet. She killed the previous director and took her place, which is what the woman in Inazuma (the one from the shrine quest with the fatuus spy, can't remember the name) told us about the House of the Hearth. By the way, Childe is not 500 years old, so not every single Harbinger needs to be a long lived being to be a Harbinger. There's also a chance that Pantalone is a "normal" human, as far as the Harbingers can be defined normal, but you know what I mean. We also know literally nothing about Colombina, we're just assuming she's some strange being just because it would justify her presence among the Harbingers. No, I mean that they probably didn't write down kaeya's story in detail when they made the manga, they had Diluc's story in mind, since he was the main character. So, between the manga showing Kaeya already having a vision when Crepus died, and the game story that talks about Kaeya specifically, saying he received his vision after Crepus died, while fighting with Diluc, the manga is obviously the one that got changed with the release of the game. I mean, Dottore doesn't remotely look like the one from the manga, for example... As for the Sumeru clothes, the most reasonable explanation is... That they forgot? I can't find an explanation for that, to be honest. It makes no sense, since a vision cannot be broken, even if you try your worst. Thoma, from Mondstadt, got a vision in Inazuma, and his vision is the same as the other Inazuman. Kaeya, from Khaenri'ah, got a vision in Mondstadt, and his vision is not the same as the other from Mondstadt. So, the fact that Kaeya has a different vision, most likely has nothing to do with his nationality.

[@davidjohnson8273]

So if the question is whether Furina's frame is different because she has some weird quality compared to every other allogene we see in Fontaine, or whether it's different because of some quality of Neuvillette, then the odds seem to favour the latter because (1) there's only one of him so the "each Archon-like figure has their own frame" works, whereas the former theory has to explain why Furina is so unique when almost every other allogene in the game conforms to a standard template of Vision frame. Given that Furina isn't meant to have any magical powers before she gets the Vision (apart from the title of ex-Archon I guess) it seems like a hard case to argue. The more so because there's so many many characters in the game with all sorts of weird qualities but entirely conforming to the Vision frame of their nationality. But if that was true the implications would be that Aloy has a weird frame because Aloy herself is odd? And the same for Kaeya. And these three all have something in common that allows them to get a different frame? If on the contrary the frame is from the Archon then these two support your Archon theory somewhat. For example, what Archon givens Aloy that frame? What nationality is that meant to represent? It seems more likely that Furina can use both Arkhe because she's the first to get one of Neuvillette's new Vision frames. In other words you are reversing cause and effect when you say the frame is that way because Furina can do both. If it were otherwise we'd have to say Furina had some special ability for Arkhe even before she got the Vision? @@ShadowX5452Gaming

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@davidjohnson8273 it still doesn't make sense. Her Inlay is literally the same as the other vision holders from Fontaine. The only difference is that, people usually get either the Pneuma or the Ousia inlay according to their arkhé, while Furina got both of them because she can use both Pneuma and Ousia. I really don't see why it has to do with Neuvillette being and "Archon-like figure". The vision is a regular one and it represents the arkhé as it always does. It's Furina the one that is different from every other person. Also, why wouldn't Furina be meant to have to have any magical power? She's a normal human just like everybody else, and she then got a vision. Nothing special there. If anything, she was supposed to have powers, since Focalors was part of her, was her, until she split the divinity from the body. Aloy doesn't have a vision. She doesn't have a voiceline about visions nor a vision story. When she was introduced officially on hoyolab, her element is defined as "cryo" only, not "vision: cryo" like every other characters. Plus, there are only 7 nations of Teyvat and 7 visions inlay, Aloy is from earth, where would she have got a vision? Not on earth, obviously, so if she got one in Genshin Impact, for the same reason as before, she would have the Inlay that represents the nation she was in when she got it. Finally, all her abilities are based on chillwater, a freezing material that you can get from specific (and bothering) enemies in Horizon, so she's not using the elements. And no, my theory about the ancient Archons doesn't even remotely explain why Kaeya would have a different vision. He is not 2600+ years old, he wasn't alive when Venti wasn't even a God. If he was, he wouldn't have received a vision, since visions appeared after the Archon War (Neuvillette says that very clearly), and he wouldn't be a descendant of the founder of the abyss order, he would be an ancestor! Furina can use both arkhés because she was supposed to be the Archon. Even if the divinity decided to split herself from the body, they are still one single person. Egeria chose Furina specifically and made her a God and an archon, most likely because she had "dominion" over both arkhés. It doesn't have anything to do with Neuvillette. Think about it: Egeria was created to be an artificial dragon that could substitute the water dragon and have dominion over the Primordial Water. This means that Egeria had to be able to command both Pneuma and Ousia. Focalors is a being created by Egeria, so there is a very high chance that, among the Oceanids, some were more similar to their creator and inherited her control over both arkhés, which made Focalors the perfect candidate to take Egeria's place when she died. The arkhe of a person is decided at birth, not when the vision is granted. It's a innate ability of the people of Fontaine. So yeah, Furina certainly had some special abilities for arkhe before she got her vision. She couldn't use them because those abilities were her divinity, the powers she would have had as a god, if Focalors didn't split.

[@InanisNihil]

So technically and legally speaking as well as biologically… there’s 4 “original archons” and only ONE confirmed non original.. Ei is CO ruler and actually solo reason makato even was alive to be GIVEN the OFFICAL title of archon by EI who CO RULED behind the scenes.. so offical not archon but u all aspects she was unofficially.. she OFFICIALLY got the title thst let’s be real was actually hers to take after sisters death a everyone in unazuma still thinks it’s Makato.. 😂💀 Rukka IS Nahida.. she passed down the title to herself from herself.. aka tree cut down but grown back is still THE SAME TREE just different form… basically if u irl list all ur memories and developed new memories become a “new person” legally all ur previous belongs are still property of ur new self.. 😂 nadhida IS Rukka.. Ei IS ruler and founder of inazums and by her own hand GOT THE GNOSIS and just gave it to makoto.. makato is just PUBLIC OFFICIAL/OFFICE ruler… remember Ei was absurdly powerful and had no need for a gnosis and gave it to makato cause she was actually WEAK and had no combat experience… fyi STUPID for makato to not stfu and let EI just go to kheariah.. both would be alive still probably.. 😂 y’all know I’m right… as far as pyro archon.. just my speculation.. she’s also original.. i think the former pyro Archon died.. resurrected as a new girl.. rose to archon again in their duels(some think current pyro archon is also dead) so I’m thinking the new pryo archon will be again the recent one that died reborn and rise up to archon again.. if correct that technically and biologically etc makes them still the original.. so conclusion 4 “originals” with only one focalors/Furina objectively being the only confirmed non original.. we can’t ignore all the points I made otherwise it’s bias and dishonest 💀

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

So, apart form all the "technically" "legally" and "biologically" that you listed, since Makoto was recognized THE Archon by Celestia, it doesn't really matter if Ei was stronger or if she let Makoto be the Archon, the official Archon was still Makoto, that doesn't change. Ei wasn't ruling from the shadows, she was just fighting instead of Makoto. The rest of the actual ruling, the laws and rules and everything else, is Makoto's. It's like saying that the president of a country is not the president, despite he's the one governing the country, just because there's the general of the army that is fighting the wars... Nahida and Rukkhadevata are a complicated concept. Even though Nahida was born from the same tree that created Rukkhadevata, they are still different people. It's like a mother (Irminsul) having two twins (although millennia apart). As twins they're identical, but they have individual aspirations, ambitions, ways to face life and reality. Then there's the Irminsul change that gave Nahida the memories of Rukkhadevata. Now, we're the traveler's and we're not affected by Irminsul, so that already removes the problem, but even if we want to consider it, Nahida received modified memories of Rukkhadevata, they're not the same exact ones. For Nahida to be exactly the same as Rukkhadevata, then she should have received the memories of what really happened up until her actual death. Since those memories were deleted, Nahida is not Rukkhadevata. As for Natlan, I do agree that Murata has been dying and coming back to life since her inception. I believe she's currently dead and, for some reason, she hasn't been able to come back to life, probably because of what happened in the Cataclysm, but that's going to be our role in version 5, since we solve all kinds of problems. As for the last part, pretending that people need to agree, otherwise they would be biased and dishonest, is what would make you biased and dishonest....

[@InanisNihil]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming duh of course she was recognized.. Ei won the archon war and passed the duty to makato.. why would Celestia refuse…? she was next in line as sibling of Ei.. I will not have ignore “technically and etc” as it’s true but it’s not convenient.. example earth is actually “round” it’s ellipsoid nor is earths orbit circle.. it’s just convenient to say they are round cause more details complicated things… am I wrong? just to be clear.. I’m a “as of matter of fact” personality when we get into digging into things… so u said “ putting those things aside” directly confirms u ignoring it.. so u don’t get to tell me “if ppl don’t agree with u u can’t say their ignoring it” 💀 nahida is a different person but she’s also the sane person.. so we a both right on being her being different but saying she’s not the same makes u wrong.. consider this.. if have a brain dead family member.. are they still ur family member despite being completely dead consciously.. or is ur family member who lose all memory of u as their kid still ur parent ? If I cut ur arm off and it grew back a new one.. is the cut off arm still YOU.. cause u have 3 arms now just one is cut off.. if I cut u vertically down the middle and each half grow back the missing half.. are u two or one person now.. 🤔 u’d be two but also one.. focalor is great example of it.. just cause y removed ur conscious from ur body doesn’t make it it body not you.. if u split my mind from my body and my body developed a new mind.. it’s still MY BODY even if my bodies new mind has no clue.. me(mind)and me(body and new mind) would both be the SOLO owner of all “my/our) property… Rukka outright said to nahida “ur me” even focalor said Furina is her… it’s complicated and more convenient to just bring it up their same but focus more so on new individuality… good understanding of Multicellular orgasms really would drive these things home.. but that’s not convenient for most ppl no? let me say this for CONNIVENCE I 100% agree.. but when we get messy with the details I disagree.. aka I’ll argue earth orbits in a circle for convince but if we get in depth I will state it’s false.. surface level I agree until we getter deeper in the water lol

[@shan_2933]

Most theories derives of plot holes lmao like u cant convince me that neuvillette saying eegiria as one of the seven is not a plot hole And its not like genshin doesn't have plotholes (scaramouche interlude quest intensifies)

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

I mean, that's something you're deciding for yourself. I'm not trying to convince you of anything, anyway. If what doesn't make apparent sense is just a plot hole that should be ignored, then why are you watching theory videos in the first place?

[@shan_2933]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming yoo man I'm not trying to be this negetive, i love hearing people's perspective and I love your videos too, i just meant some of the 'evidence' u used were to me plotholes. I hope u don't take it personally, I still liked this video and u made some great points also the presentation was great as always. I have been watching theory videos for ASOIAF for years(it's a hellscape lmao) and some very big theories are about inconsistency and plot holes so I was just saying that

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@shan_2933 then I misunderstood your intentions, sorry. It's just that I don't really see that Egeria being one of the seven is a plothole at all. The fact that Neuvillette clearly stated it, means something. He could have said that Egeria, as a god, didn't have the authority to do what she wanted to do, instead he specified that she was one of the seven.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

It could also be that I misunderstood your intentions because I've been replying to some heated comments, so I was expecting the worst

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

@shan_2933 Dude don't worry they are too defensive over their theroy. Can you tell me more about Scaramouche interlude plot please I am curious 😅

[@hirods9889]

Do I doubt your sanity ? Not really Is your idea interesting? Sure it has some good points I suppose Do I believe it ? No I don't flat out say you're wrong. Unlike a lot of people I have no memory of something we were told in the beginning which end up a total lie after later reveals. Like a lot of players though that Archons gave Visions until Ei reveal that they doesn't. And actually no character ever affirmed that the Archon gave them a vision. They at most thought it was from the Archon but nothing more. Also Venti giving a geo vision or zhongli giving vision to someone in mondstad (Noelle), none of theses options make sense anyway. All to say that if someone actually affirm something rather than guessing To give you an example, Ganyu affirmed that 5 of the 7 are actually dead. Which has been true so far One the other end Nahida speculate that the heavenly principle is the first descender. Obviously without further lead on this track we can't determine if she was correct or not. So even if we still don't know exactly the goal behind the archon war I still believe it ended with the OG 7 Archon rising

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Well, as with every theory I upload, I'm not trying to convince anybody, nor am I trying to tell people that I'm right. I'm just sharing something that I thought about and that I was able to research, which eventually turned into a coherent theory. Whether it's right or not, it's the game that will have to tell us. So, it's completely fine that you don't believe it. I mean, it would mean that something we thought to be true and sure, was wrong. There are, indeed, a lot of things that we give for certain even without any kind of proof, like who gives out visions, and sometimes we just overlook the obvious unexplainable details, like venti giving Geo visions or Zhongli giving visions in another nation. In the end, the Archons do kinda give the visions across Teyvat, but it's not something they decide to do, it's automatic and beyond their control, and we still don't know how it actually happens. As for Nahida, she speculates that the first Descenders are the heavenly principles, but even though it's a speculation, it comes from the wisest being of Teyvat. I mean, she shouldn't know anything about the Primordial One, but she still guessed right that the heavenly principles came after, that they are not from Teyvat, otherwise she wouldn't even think that they might be Descenders, considering what the term implies. That is what makes (in our eyes as players) her speculation accurate. As for the Archon War, I guess we will have to wait to really understand why it was enacted, and since it was a war.... Maybe it's something the Pyro Archon will explain to us...

[@hirods9889]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming well, we don't know if she shouldn't know about it actually, as far as we know she never met the sustainer and even so seem to know who or what she is. Even the traveler have no info on that aside what she looks like, her title and kinda her abilities. As for did she came after the PO... Even the ''best'' theory out there are unclear as to why she can't be the PO. If she just a shade she can't be a descender, unless all the shades are, and that will raises other questions. And of course I know your not trying to convince, same with me I just like to share ideas, that why I like your theory, I will never have go there on my own

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@hirods9889 the thing is that I think susty is a shade and she doesn't belong to the heavenly principles. I mean, she calls herself the "sustainer" of the heavenly principles, so she helps them, she makes sure that they are respected. It's like talking about a judge and a policeman: the judge is the law, and the policeman enforces it, so he would be the sustainer. In that case, the traveler just knows a shade, and she is definitely not a descender because she was created by the same being that created Teyvat. As for the reason why I think this, it's because she caught the twins and sent them back to Teyvat while she could have either disposed of them or simply let them leave. If her problem was their ability to destroy Teyvat, if she wanted to stop mortal arrogation, just let them go, the problem is solved. Instead, she kept them there, as if she's expecting them to do something, maybe something to free the shades from the clutches of the heavenly principles... Susty being the Primordial One.... Isn't the PO supposed to be something like broken down? It's functions are not working anymore (I can't recall the exact words from Neuvillette's story, not at 2am), while susty looks pretty fine to me. On the other hand, I think (complete speculation) that the heavenly principles are something like the shades, but they are just 3 and they were created by the second who came. I still need to really analyze the wall in the domains. I think those drawings and the Latin letters that apparently make no sense at all, are hiding something, some explanation that hasn't been found yet...

[@hirods9889]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming Nahida is the one who speculate that ''the heavenly principal, the entity that change our fate'' maybe the first descender. Of course it could be another odd ball from hoyo and susty was ordered to stop us by the actual HP.... Like with Furina As for the being broken/malfunctioning..... Odd words to use if you talk about a living being... Just saying But if the thing goes PO create 4 shades and Sustainer and istaroth being 2 of them. Where does the actual Heavenly principal come into that? Another shade? Why one of them would be higher in the hierarchy? And why would it be a descender ?

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@hirods9889 I mean, the heavenly principles could have commanded susty to stop us, but then again, if you want to stop mortal arrogation, would you release the ones who are the walking mortal arrogation back into the world? Wouldn't you stop, like definitely stop them? Or at least imprison them for all eternity? Lumine was released in an instant, since she appeared in the Vourukasha Oasis not long after the cataclysm... As for the Primordial One... Have you ever played Final Fantasy XIII? It sounds like a Fal'Cie at this point... Though, I still think the Primordial One is the Aeon Sophia, since it's Story is pretty much the same as hers, and that would make the second who came Theletos. What I think is that the Primordial One arrived and created 4 copies of itself, the shades. Then the second who came arrived, fought and won against the Primordial One, created 3 shades of himself, the heavenly principles, and enslaved the shades, who are now the sustainers of the heavenly principles, like helpers/servants/enforcers. And the reason for the numbers is the same as in my visions video: 4 cardinal Virtues and 3 theological (heavenly) Virtues

[@user-zu8py9gy3h]

Why most genshin lore content creators have a kind of weird accent?...

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

Because I'm Italian, probably....

[@citoyenneteavanttout7273]

Because there are actually countries outside of yours? wow, shocker right ?

[@user-zu8py9gy3h]

@@citoyenneteavanttout7273 not even to the point of what I'm saying, because if that is the case, they could very well create content in their language targeting people in their own country, what I meant, because I have noticed it for some time, is that most creators are actually foreigners or at least have an accent... In which case, this youtuber's answer clarifying he is italian was on point... That's why I simply didn't say anything else. Shocking isn't it? That the poster of the question has motives to ask something, guess you wouldn't have believed it.

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@citoyenneteavanttout7273 by the amount of rude comments you're leaving here and there under this channel, both toward me and the other viewers, it sure does look like you're desperate for attention. If you want it so bad, I could reward you with a very wonderful prize! You could be the very first person to be banned on this channel! Keep up with your immature manners!

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@user-zu8py9gy3h just don't mind that person. He's desperate for attention and he's been extremely rude to both me and other viewers. Hurt people hurt people, you know?

[@isaiahhaley4816]

Tbh I actually saw a similar theory about this by minslef I think talking abt the god kings of teyvat and how they were predestined to be archons I kinda actually like the idea of their being an ancient seven but never officially having the title of archon but until we find out more information on chanyu vales god we can’t be sure but it is very possible that Celestia intended or tried to create celestial descendants who best represented the authorities of the seven elements to be the new seven of teyvat but the plan was possibly Put to a hold due to the third descenders arrival and so Celestia decided to create to archon war despite already having an idea of the gods that they wanted to choose i personally believe zhongli was predestined to be chosen as an archon since liyue has made it clear that zhongli is that the very least 6000 or more years old even zhongli himself says that he has dwell among this world for 6000 years whether you take that as him being born or him already being alive and officially made his descent over liyue 6000 years ago it’s kinda hard to tell but with the current seven well six… we have now I feel as though the best represent the elements, not by sheer strength, but more so how their ideals correspond to the elements at all and their titles best represents the elements even in your lower video about what the elements best represents it also corresponds with the archons ideals Venti: freedom and hope Zhongli: contacts and fortitude Raiden ei: eternity and faith Nahida: wisdom, and prudence Furina/folcalors: justice and existence Murata: war and passion I think? I don’t know. I think it was something similar to that Tsaritsa: love/peace charity Yet another reason why I’m always on the side of the archons also i’m a bit hesitant about kind deshret being the predestiny dendro archon since well he never really gave dendro to me at all more like geo or pyro but ok then Also did you get sparkle? I’m skipping her for Acheron but I just wanted to know also you need to make more Starrow theories honestly

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

I mean, we have too little information about the Archon War, so at this point in time everything could be right or wrong. My explanation, Celestia removing inferior gods to leave seven predestined ones, is slightly on the easy and predictable side, but for now it's what feels most comfortable to me. As for their ideals representing the elements, what I meant in the visions video was the opposite. Their ideals (expect for hydro) don't necessarily represent the elements. I still regret not adding this to that video... So, the ideals of the Archons are specific to their nations, not to their element. The easiest examples are Fontaine and Liyue. Regardless of the element of a person's vision or if a person doesn't even have a vision at all, in Fontaine they will all believe in Justice and in Liyue they will all use contracts. Wriothesely is a cryo character, but he has a very strong sense of Justice that he shows in his job, or Yanfei is pyro but she uses more contracts than anybody else in Liyue. So the ideal of an Archon is not exactly the most important aspect of their divinity. Except for some cases, the ideals and the elements are really not connected. Freedom doesn't really mean hope by definition, for example, nor contracts and fortitude have anything to do with each other. I mean, eternity would make more sense with fortitude... As for Deshret, to be honest, I've always thought he was a dendro character ever since I saw the flowers grow and bloom around his seat in the Orchard of Pairidaeza, and if I have to be completely honest, even though it may not make sense, I still think Deshret is gonna appear sooner or later somehow. Those flowers blooming only on his seat and not on Rukkhadevata's and Nabu Malikata's, who we know 100% are dead, make me think he may be still alive, somehow, in some form... As for Sparkle, although I like the idea of having 7 skill points.... I AM GETTING ACHERON NO MATTER WHAT! Like, if I lose the 50/50, I'm going for the guaranteed pull without even thinking once XD

[@isaiahhaley4816]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming hope you get her and I’m hoping to get firefly

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@isaiahhaley4816 I honestly don't remember if I lost my last 50/50, so she might be guaranteed. Either way, I'm getting her and Gallagher! Oh I forgot to reply the the last thing you said. I didn't really go in depth with Star Rail's hidden lore, that's why I don't really make lore videos about it. To be honest, the only aspect I really like reading about, it's the Aeons, and my video about them, didn't really go that well... But that doesn't mean I won't make any lore videos about it. Who knows, one day I'll just want to read everything that's in the game!

[@isaiahhaley4816]

@@ShadowX5452Gaming ye star rail well it really wasn’t that interesting in the very beginning of the game the concept was good but it wasn’t until penacony was when it finally felt interesting belabog was ok just any ordinary introduction into the game story like mondstadt the loufu was… well it honestly felt kind of boring to me. It didn’t feel as though anything major was happening, and even in the major parts against the fight with phantilya I wasn’t too particularly interested and I wasn’t that in a rush to get through the story either it wasn’t until Ryan mei was drip market that I finally started to get into the game so I can get her and when penacony was teased that’s when I became really interested, and tried to catch up on some of star rails lore specifically the aeons then black swan got drip marketed and I really started playing btw This is completely unnecessary but after reading the aeons lore and a couple of videos about them I think akavili qlipoth and fuli are my faves mainly because they don look particularly menacing, or have ever done anything that harmed the universe there is xipe but I have a very weird feeling about her She gives off this unsettling vibe despite looking very relaxing anyways when penacony released I stayed up all night playing the story and I found myself interested in it more then the past planets we’ve been too also I have this theory on how the trailblazer could be an eminatorbof akavili or possibly be the only eminator of akavili I don’t have much proof but it feels reasonable

[@ShadowX5452Gaming]

@@isaiahhaley4816 I actually liked it since the beginning, but yeah, Belabog was a simple introduction, but slightly less interesting than Mondstadt. I still go back to mondstadt before quitting the game because that feels like home, Belabog doesn't. The Xianzhou was interesting in the beginning, but then I got really bored. It got better with Dan Heng's story and it got boring again. Then it got slightly better with the Heliobi, because it was interisting, but at that point, I was just waiting to be able to explore another planet, like I was done with the Xianzhou. I mean, I played Jingliu's story after Penacony... Then I got obsessed with the builds, and I started playing a little bit too much! Penacony is the most interesting and fun planet, obviously. When dreams are involved, it means that everything can happen, so the developers can go crazy, and they did. The story was addicting, I also finished playing the quest in the night at 3am. I started it and I couldn't stop. My favorite Aeons are the Hunt and IX actually, maybe Aha, too. The hunt is also my go-to aeon in the Simulated universe, eben though, lately, I started using the Elation a lot because I now have a playstyle, and it's all about following attacks. IX is just too cute. You think your theory is crazy? I think March is Akivili and PomPom is related to Fuli....

[@hoangcute2k5]

Archons are selfish, vain, narcissists

[@JoeMama-1diot]

I enjoy your videos.. but I really don’t know what you’re saying 10% of the time..