The First Attack Helicopter (Sort Of); Bell 207 Sioux Scout

[@tacticalmanatee]

It's a nice looking little helo. The visibility looks amazing though I can see why it got a bit more restrictive in later designs. The crew are rather exposed to ground fire in the 207, but of course it was never intended for combat use and so the visibility was a good decision on that model.

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

And yes, the sound goes odd. I had to change room during recording.

[@265justy]

This was an interesting vid... But how about another prototype chopper from Bell in this era. The experimental jet powered version off the UH-1 Huey called the Bell 533. A very overlooked helicopter and probably the fastest ever flown to this day!

[@ConorD1990]

You can definitely see the lineage between some of the early generations of helicobacter like the Bell 47 and what came afterwards like the Cobra. It's almost like a missing link of sorts. Cheers for video Ed.

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

More than welcome:)

[@skaldlouiscyphre2453]

Helicobacter is the new official name for this machinamajig.

[@ConorD1990]

@@skaldlouiscyphre2453 yeah I really should have spell checked the above before posting, wrote it after a long work day/week so my brain was just dead. 🙄

[@skaldlouiscyphre2453]

@@ConorD1990 For what it's worth, I'm sincere and not mocking you.

[@antisoda]

@@skaldlouiscyphre2453 Maybe we can start calling very small piloted helicopters like these, helicobacters. Helicopterettes, if you will. Maybe it'll catch on. :)

[@FirstDagger]

Fort Rucker also houses the RAH-66 Comanche prototypes.

[@peterszar]

My Dad worked at Bell for a few years before becoming a state trooper. He always had good things to say about working there. When they left our area, WNY, Buffalo, NY quite a few folks didn't follow them, and lost their jobs. But that was Buffalo back then, like the other so called rust belt regions.

[@grahambuckerfield4640]

Another fascinating one, thanks. I was also reminded of the experiments the French did with armed helicopters a few years before in Algeria.

[@TheShrike616]

My thoughts exactly. No innovation exists in a vacuum and the "Pirate" improvisations developed by France in this ugly conflict seem worthy of a mention.

[@mikearmstrong8483]

The basic Bell 47 was tested during the Korean war with 2 .30 cal Brownings, not to meet any requirement issued but as a field mod by innovative pilots.

[@stonehaven]

I just finished reading your book. I enjoyed it immensely, but I agree with those who said you were/are mad. I'm glad you survived.

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

:D

[@Paladin1873]

This helicopter reminds me of some earlier tests the Army ran in the 1950s. I had the good fortune to talk with one of the former test pilots while l was in college in 1977. He said they modified a standard Bell Model 47 by mounting several Browning 1919 air cooled 30'06 caliber machine guns on the skids. The pilot aimed the guns by turning the nose of the aircraft toward the intended target. He made fine adjustments by watching the path of the tracers and the dust of bullet strikes. It was crude and primitive, but a start.

[@supersixbravo1610]

I highly recommend the United States Army Aviation Museum at Fort Rucker. I've seen it while visiting the U.S. and it's a gem. It's not just rotary wing. They have all kinds of goodies there. It's worth it.

[@ericrmd1448]

Great video! Stub wings are not actually for agility, they produce lift when in forward flight reducing the angle of pitch necessary on the main rotor therefore reducing retreating blade stall and allowing for faster airspeeds. And of course they're a good spot to stick a missile.

[@pdxbohica]

Hugh Thompson was flying a OH-23 (Sioux) with 2 door gunners when he stopped the Mỹ Lai Massacre.

[@twunt2000]

Are you sure you don't mean the OH-13 Sioux? The OH-23 Raven was a similar era Hiller design.

[@pdxbohica]

@@twunt2000 He was flying an OH-23, I just got the names mixed with the video. I should know better as I trained at Ft. Rucker and was a crew chief on a Cobra (VN 68-69)

[@twunt2000]

@@pdxbohica No worries, mistakes can be made in comments :)

[@roybennett9284]

Quite rightly too..a complete disaster.

[@josephking6515]

6:42 Interesting outlines in the field under the rotor.

[@adrianrutterford762]

Thanks for another interesting video.

[@marioacevedo5077]

Great video. First time I've seen the Bell 207 in action. Maybe do a video about the US Army's attempts at fixed-wing close air support? The OV1 Mohawk had been planned for that before the USAF lobbied against it. And the US Army tested the Fiat G91, crashing one example. When I was in flight school, I found its wreckage stashed in the woods of Ft. Rucker.

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

Oooooo! Now that's quite a find. Yep will do the Mohawk and Bronco one of these days 😁

[@RedXlV]

The USAF was a mistake.

[@rogerkay8603]

Nice one Ed, like attack choppers, they rock.

[@davidwaller5698]

I’ve seen it! The museum is excellent

[@whitewidowgaming4887]

Very interesting as always, Thanks.

[@petesheppard1709]

That would be a cool custom job for a flyable 47; it should be a head-turner at airshows. The H-13s (Bell 47) were the first scout helos, and the Air Cav armed some with machine guns and rockets on the landing skids for field tests.

[@hueydoc]

I saw this at the museum there at Rucker when I went thru flight school there in the 70's. Even more impressive was the Cheyenne prototype, which we all would shake our heads at, wondering why they never built it. (Probably because it wasn't a Bell) I flew both Hueys and cobras and all around, I liked the Huey better- though the cobra did have an air conditioner

[@oniwaban3198]

lockheed is king.. its a sad and frustrating story please read up in the comments as i have lamented at great length.. thank you for your service! i had the honor of flying around a door gunner from your era in a video game once (battlefield3). he said to me "youre the first ingame pilot to take me back to nam flying all in them trees, natural stick and rudder man" we laughed and dominated that game and many others, the praise i recived was a great honor for me still makes me all warm n fuzzy inside even though that was over a decade ago, i digress. you guys did some iron ball flying ill never know the extent of that pucker factor i am an unworthy and i told that door gunner the same thing!! however even someone untouched by that crucible born in 83 looses their while entire sh you know what in regard to the ah56 cheyenne especialy considering the new bell360 incase you havnt heard theres a whole new reason to shake your head... im done lamenting about this now i will try my best to enjoy the new era of rotorwing dispite the disgrace...

[@dogsnads5634]

The Cheyenne was a daft idea ultimately... As soon as the ZSU-23 and SA-7 Strela turned up its entire concept of operations, high speed attack runs, at enemy armoured formations was blown out of the water. When it came to stable pop-up ATGM attacks at distance using TOW the AH-1F was a far better platform, and far cheaper too...

[@ColdWarAviator]

The resemblance between the Sioux Scout and Cobra 🐍 is remarkable! I spent 9 years in the U.S. army as a Cobra Crew Chief and finally an instructor for the new mechanics from 1983 to1992. All new Cobra mechanics were taught about the Huey because maybe of the parts were interchangeable! In fact the T-53l703 turbine engine was the same the Huey used. One of the Vietnam era Cobra pilots I worked with who also flew hueys during Vietnam said Bell asked him "if you could have your dream helicopter, what would it look like?" He told the guy from Bell "well I'd take the Huey and make it about 3 feet wide so it was very hard to hit if it was coming straight at the enemy". I'd use all the same parts so if a Huey got shot up to the point it couldn't fly, then we could cannibalize parts off of it to use on the new helicopter" That is exactly what Bell did. The engine AND Transmission of the Huey and Cobra were interchangeable, along with various other flight control rods as well as main and tail rotor blades. One thing that many folks don't realize about the U.S. Army is that all army helicopters (with the exception of one) are named after American Indian tribes. The exception is the Cobra. But wait! You say... The Huey isn't an Indian tribe. That's true... But it's production name is the UH-1 Iroquois. Not the Huey.... Hurry was a nickname.

[@MM22966]

Another great one, Nash! I had never heard of this thing!

[@teddyduncan1046]

Another quality video. Thank you!

[@donebeenshadowbanned1198]

Great video

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

Many thanks :)

[@TJ-USMC]

Excellent Video !!!

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

Thanks, glad you enjoyed it :)

[@BatMan-oe2gh]

Another awesome video Ed, you have an excellent channel.

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

Many thanks:D

[@heinrichzerbe]

A lovely looking helicopter.

[@FinsburyPhil]

You can also see the Gazelle's inspiration in the 207, especially with the prototype

[@Einwetok]

Not loud enough.

[@chuckp8705]

Nice video. Any plans to do a story on the Lockheed AH-56 Cheyenne?

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

Though about it, but other have covered it on youtube already. So maybe one day, but I'm in no rush to cover it. Plenty of other interesting ones still to do. :)

[@cvjanzen550]

Love your videos! Very well done 👊

[@ironwolfF1]

Thanks for the video...I'd heard of, but never seen this heli until now. And yes, the lineage is strikingly obvious. As to the 'ground support' issue, while the advancement of attack helis have (for the most part) smoothed things out, the US Army has kept the A10 in service by quietly stating that if the USAF wanted rid itself of the A10, the US Army would quite happy to take them off the Air Force's hands...and yes, the US Army's aviation branch still maintains a fixed wing training program capable of adopting new platforms. 😉 Please note that A10 is currently getting rejuvenated airframes, upgraded wings, and doesn't look like it's going away anytime soon...apparently a little prodding works from time to time.

[@robertharper3754]

The Air Force needs to have several copies of the Key West Agreement shoved up their rear ends, just for their disdain of the ground support roles. The A-10 is great, but in a contested environment it needs a TON of upgrades the Air Force won't consider, such as built in decoys, a better missile defense system, maybe going to a cased telescoped round for the 30mm to increase capacity, ect. The A-10 is a hell of a moral booster, when you're on the ground you feel a hell of a lot better knowing one is in your AO, but against near peers/peers, it's days are numbered and I doubt the Air Force is giving a replacement the consideration it needs. They still think you can win a war by bombing only.

[@oniwaban3198]

dont even get me started.. now we are full circle with this single engine bell 360 invictus tinky toy and sikorsky raiderX i wonder if the airforce will start bitching again about their doctrine integrity and limit army helos to under 400 knots just to complain about the a10 once they got it dispite pushing congress so hard to block the ah56 for it.. idefk its just dumb at this point give the a10 to the army/marines tell bell to go fuck itself back to the cobra and never come back give lockheed a call and let them finally build the helicopter we never knew we needed and let sikorsky finish the s67 real fucking simple.. foh uggh the system sucks somuch

[@oniwaban3198]

one more thing.. they got the bell360 against the md969 for christ sake... i mean we got the KFC fed little bird on steriods that thing is the god of little birds that identifys as an "attack helicopter" vs a basically economy version single engine s67/comanche hybrid attack helo that identifys as a "scout helicopter"??? and then the raiderX comes out of nowhere like a giant black flying torpedo dildo idefk whats going on anymore and toss in a economy version osprey and that other flying box with the large trunk space and rear hatch config i forgot the name of and just let them all fight to the death there can be only one?.. its just nuts im litterally loosing my whole shit over this rn nobody understands lol

[@iandaniel1748]

Love see OV 10d gunship next time

[@TeemarkConvair]

well done.. new to me,, thanks

[@IvorMektin1701]

Dothan, Alabama, home to Ft. Rucker and tourist hotspot 😂. At least the beaches of Florida aren't too far away.

[@stansbornak8116]

I wonder what kind of aircraft the newly formed Space Force will come up with?

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

Something from Buck Roger's? Yhe black and white one :D

[@Ob1sdarkside]

Read somewhere that huey pilots would put flack jackets on the window in floor for a bit of protection in Vietnam. Didn't do much but made them feel better

[@burtbacarach5034]

Of COURSE the USAF was not concerned about close ground support!It was common knowledge that the 'next' war was going to be fought at 50,000 feet (or 15.24KM) and at mach two or higher.That's one of the reasons the USAF wasn't really prepared for the fight in Nam.But then neither was the US Army if we're honest.Nuclear doctrine only works if you're ACTUALLY willing to use it. BTW Ed,i read your book,and found it very interesting.You did a great job explaining what was actually going on over there.What a massive CF it was,and I guess still is.

[@johnladuke6475]

2:51 ♫Cause suicide is painless It brings on many changes And I can take or leave it if I choose♫

[@martentrudeau6948]

Interesting history, Bell did good in the development of the attack helicopter. -- But, I wonder about Robert Mcnamara's role in putting American troops into Vietnam, As Secretary of Defense and his relationship to the military industrial complex, were they motivated by the prospective profits that they would make by launching the war in Vietnam? -- I would say YES! War is good for THEIR business, but not for the average man's business. -- Good video Ed, thank you.

[@martentrudeau6948]

@@WALTERBROADDUS ~ The Vietnam war demoralized America in so many ways, damaged American society and killed maybe a million Vietnamese, for no good reason. kzbin.info/www/bejne/e57Ki4JmlJ6jnZI

[@snarkymatt585]

I've nothing really to say just thought this video should have 100 comments rather than 99... the 100th comment now posted lol. As usual great video thanks for making it.

[@raypurchase801]

I'm surprised BAe / Aerospatiale never created a single-seat ground-attack version of the Gazelle.

[@comentedonakeyboard]

The Bell-255 shows a pasing Similarity with the Mi-24 Hind 🤔

[@NakulDalakoti]

Seriously I think some company like Robinson or Hill Helicopters should buy its design rights and build a civil version of it. This will be a great light sport helicopter aimed for G.A. market. I would love to own one myself (only if I have bucks to own one 😅)

[@terrysmith4831]

It should be in the museum at Ft. Eustis, the home of ARMY AVIATION 😎

[@centaur1a]

You forgot the Bell helicopter from the Korean War. They did experience on by putting machine gun on the skids, rocket pods underneath the cockpit too.

[@dogsnads5634]

The French were also using MG's, rockets and SS.10 guided missiles from their helos over Algeria in the 1950's....

[@mikeholland1031]

That one mock up looks a lot like a soviet hind gunship

[@donjones4719]

3:45 Yes, Bell indeed nailed it! One seldom sees an initial design concept that has been so little altered from inception to generations later. This is still the AH-1Z Viper.

[@donjones4719]

@@WALTERBROADDUS Dammit! I knew that. Yup, edited Sikorsky to Bell.

[@Idahoguy10157]

The only two Attack aircraft the USAF has had since the 1970’s . The A-7 and A-10. The A-7 Corsair is a derivative of the Navy A-7. Which the AF got rid of as soon as the F-16 was procured. The F-16 being a “real fighter”,. The A-10 was a response by the AF only when the Army was going to get a serious attack helicopter, the AH-56 Cheyenne. Outside of the A-10 community the Warthog is to the AF Generals not “proper” aircraft. So since the 1980’s the USAF HQ has schemed up proposals to get rid of it. To the USAF Close Air Support is an etcetera mission.

[@geordiedog1749]

Gotta start somewhere, innit!

[@grizwoldphantasia5005]

One little known fact about Army aviation has always intrigued me: they were forbidden to have any decent-sized airplanes when the Air Force was split off in 1947. I suppose the restriction still stands. That is one part of the Air Force detesting the ground support mission; they'd rather cruise at 50,000 feet and be away from all that nasty mud. It's also one reason Marine pilots take such pride in supporting their own, and refuse to outsource it to the Navy. The very early helicopters were not very reliable and couldn't carry much load. I wonder ... if the army had been able to field their own unlimited close air support airplanes, would they have developed attack helicopters to soon? Helicopters today are so much more powerful than the early ones, and so flexible and mobile on the battlefield, that I think they probably would have been developed anyway, matching today's end result. But I wonder how the development process would have differed.

[@ABrit-bt6ce]

AH-56 would have happened. Lord knows what would be flying today following that.

[@robertharper3754]

@@ABrit-bt6ce, truly an underrated helicopter, it did have it's problems but they all could have been solved with enough time/money/attention. It was way ahead in it's day and what would have come after it would still be kicking ass today!

[@oniwaban3198]

@@ABrit-bt6ce you are a man of taste and culture, the visuals of your point raised have been living in my head rent free for some time yet this sight pales in comparison to the wonders of a world without eddison.. imagine..... pisses me off honestly

[@stingcobra8538]

Philippines is still waiting for the Turkish T129 ATAK.

[@mathewkelly9968]

A production version of this would certainly have been in all the wars the US has been in since .

[@MrArgus11111]

That Bell concept mock up looks a LOT like a Hind... I wonder if it was a reference point for the Soviets

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

That struck me too, but suspect it is just a logical design choice. Though the Hind A had that big crew deck, so guess the Soviets had plenty of time to look around and think about what was the best option for the following models.

[@oniwaban3198]

why the airforce and bell killed lockheeds attempt at rotorwing right here

[@PeteCourtier]

What are the chances! I identify as an attack helicopter😂 But seriously, another great video. The channel gets better and better👍

[@craigs71]

This could be an event vehicle for War Thunder, at least it actually flew.

[@劉家宏-n6f]

00:45

[@劉家宏-n6f]

04:33

[@jlvfr]

Sidenote: the french tried armed helis in Algeria, before the US even got into Vietnam.

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

Yes! USMC put bazooka on helis in korea as well. That must have scary!

[@martentrudeau6948]

@@EdNashsMilitaryMatters ~ Bazooka on helis, you would not want to F that up, it would be a very bad day.

[@robertharper3754]

@@EdNashsMilitaryMatters, there was a VERY brave man who attached them to his tiny spotter plane in WW2, I wonder how he fight in that small plane with all of his balls?

[@orneryokinawan4529]

It is cute and could be used in our anime

[@spyridon3089]

Ukraine showed how vulnerable attack-helicopters are in a symetrical war

[@IainYoung-hp1xw]

Hence the reason the British AAC in the 70’s learnt low flying at approx 20+ feet. Any higher made helicopters at risk from Soviet weapons systems such as ZSU 23/4.

[@brianford8493]

Sexy looking kit!

[@steveshoemaker6347]

👍👀

[@terrygardner3031]

The Key West agreement was forced down the Army's throat. If the army had the ability to have cargo planes, close air support fixed wing as well as rotor wing, then the Air Force could play with it's stealth fighters and bombers to their hearts content. But then the Army would get more money and the Airforce has so many black programs that funnel billions to planes we don't know about they can't let that happen. That is one of the reasons they keep wanting to get rid of the A10.

[@michaelgautreaux3168]

👍👍😉

[@Allan_aka_RocKITEman]

​@EdNashsMilitaryMatters >>> 👍👍

[@aeroflip97]

The Attack Helicopter, my favorite gender

[@spudgunn8695]

I'd hardly call existing in Alabama a happy ending! Lol.

[@evanulven8249]

Unpopular Opinion: The air force is the worst thing to happen to the US military since the battle of Bull Run.

[@robertharper3754]

We just need to take all their officers and senior enlisted and toss them in a ground war for a few years, that MIGHT be able to slightly pull their heads out their rear ends by a bit! I have massive respect for those who fly/maintain the A 10, the PJs and Combat Controllers, and a few others, but way too many people in the Air Force still think they can win any war by bombing alone it seems.

[@kwazar221]

The first ? 😂😂😂 No it's NOT the first, in 1956 was born the first armed combat helicopter with the French Mammouth

[@salty4496]

:)

[@EdNashsMilitaryMatters]

How's it going salty?

[@wonkachocolates6133]

I love helicopters.

[@howegav]

Another excellent video. Thanks. 👍