The Forgotten Pawn Of The Wars Of The Roses | Isabel Neville | Duchess of Clarence

[@WilliamGoeth]

If not for The White Queen tv series i would never know her.after i watched the series i became interested in Cousin's war.thank you for this.

[@RavenIdril2966]

Me too.

[@Butterflypegasus40]

Her dad didn't help much in regard to her happiness.

[@lilacgirl-z8w]

I hope anne and isabel were close when isabel died.

[@RavenIdril2966]

Both neville sisters didn't have happy endings which i blame their husbands for.

[@barbarak2836]

I am more inclined to blame the fact that they were both used as pawns to be used for political gain. Their father's ambition played a huge part in their tragic lives.

[@anweshabiswas1483]

Finally, 😃 an appropriate video after George duke of Clarence 's birthday 21st October, what a timing ❤❤❤❤

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

I didn't even realise that! I mean...er....I totally meant to do that! 😂

[@Butterflypegasus40]

Definitely perfect timing.

[@weaviejeebies]

I'm early! FINALLY! I've always been fascinated with the Neville sisters. Your choice of imagery always has a way of making people a bit more real for me, and choosing such a young, maidenly face for Isabel really hit that reality button for me. She very likely did look like a schoolgirl when she married George. She was just a young maiden when her parents were playing dynastic hardball. Modern girls are working in fast food and fretting over friend relationships and where to go to college; Isabel had a household to supervise and probably fretted about how long everyone she cared about was going to live. George lost the trust of his family and then also broke his deal with the Lancasters...that's just so many powerful people capable of killing a young women. I have no idea how she felt about Anne's situation but I imagine so much familial discord didn't feel very safe for anyone, and considering George was the primary agitator, it might've felt shameful...but obviously she had no control over any of it.

[@lilacgirl-z8w]

It's a crime their history is nearly forgotten.

[@RavenIdril2966]

Wouldn't it be awesome if some lost journal of one of the sisters were found.

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

Thank you, I'm glad you enjoyed it so much! 😊 And you're right about Isabel's image (I did give up on trying to form a proper 15th century hennin for her, the AI program wasn't having it), I did want her to look young. Both she and her sister were still so young when they died, and yet so much happened in their lives. And you're right, it must have felt at times like she had no control over what was happening around her, and so it's not surprising many women stuck to the men around them who could change everything about their lives in an instant.

[@Butterflypegasus40]

​@@HistorysForgottenPeople which queen of england do you have the most sympathy for in regard to being screwed over and forgotten.

[@lfgifu296]

Kudos on this! There’s so little information on both her and her sister, it’s admirable that you managed to muster up a vid on her- and a v good one at that :))

[@lilacgirl-z8w]

I wonder if the sisters looked alike or not?

[@RavenIdril2966]

I wonder if isabel actually loved her husband or not?

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

I've been asked for it so many times, and every time, I admit I was a bit 'meh' about getting started on it as there's so little known about her. Not poor Isabel's fault, of course! 😅 Often if you dig around, there's some little scrap about someone in another person's letter or legal document, but Isabel genuinely barely shows up.

[@Butterflypegasus40]

Was this the neville sisters the hardest research you've ever done?

[@MichelleBruce-lo4oc]

Hi, awesome live history video. I enjoyed it. How are you doing? I'm doing well, and so is my cat Benjamin. We have summer like weather in Ontario Canada. How is the weather where you are?. In the next video in the future, could you do Queen Isabella of france. They called her the she wolf. She was King Edward, the seconds wife. Have a great day. See you next video 😊

[@Butterflypegasus40]

I still can't decide if usurping her husband was a benefit to England or not.

[@carolynedwards9821]

I love your videos, I love how you tell their stories

[@RavenIdril2966]

It must have been hard work to find any info.

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

Thank you, I'm glad you enjoy them! 😊

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

@Ravenproctor2966 It wasn't easy, that's for sure! Poor Isabel hardly shows up in the record at all; there would be next to nothing if she hadn't married.

[@helpinyerdasellavon]

Beautiful video on Isabel Neville. Love your story telling. Excellent work 💯

[@JacqueScherrer]

I’m a direct descendant of Isabel Neville and George Plantagenet through their daughter, Margaret Pole. Thank you for profiling my many times great grandmother. ❤

[@RavenIdril2966]

I'm sorry the Tudors destroyed much of your ancestors history.

[@Butterflypegasus40]

Glad to know margaret pole got the last laugh.

[@monicacall7532]

The story about George of York accusing Anne Corrette of poisoning Isabel, putting poor Anne through hell, giving her a kangaroo court and then summarily executing her on the gallows 3 hours after having her found guilty is one of the most horrific stories I’ve ever heard. After learning this about him I think that being executed by being drowned in a butt of Malmsey wine was too good for him! Poor little Margaret and Edward! They lost both parents at a young age and then they were considered suspicious by both Henry VII and Henry VIII and lost their lives under these two men. Who needs Greek tragedy when you can learn about the lives of real people?😢

[@Butterflypegasus40]

You said it best.

[@auroramartell]

@@waverider8549 Ankarette, actually. Not "Anne Corette"

[@waverider8549]

@@auroramartell Thanks. Wow, that's an unusual name.

[@auroramartell]

@@waverider8549 No problem.

[@JangianTV]

Wahey, she's back! Glad to see you with another belter! 😁

[@goeegoanna]

Fascinating, as always. Soon you'll have a compendium of Nevilles... a familiar set of tales, the shenanigans of those who have everything, get greedy and lose the lot, ( or is it the plot?) and the people they took down with them along the way.

[@OnnikaJeffryes-m2m]

I blame their Father. He cared only about his own ambition.

[@A.Girl.Has.No.Name.]

Didn't the Duke of Clarence accuse Ankaret Twynho of poisoning Isabelle as an agent of Elizabeth Woodville? I thought that was part of why, along with his subsequent attempt at dethroning King Edward AGAIN (along with his resorting to highly frowned-upon means to do so) the King eventually imprisoned him in 1477.

[@RavenIdril2966]

George was a lunatic to me.

[@Butterflypegasus40]

What would elizabeth woodville gain by killing isabel when she had already given her husband heirs and her sister Anne was married to Richard so harming her would be completely stupid of elizabeth.

[@A.Girl.Has.No.Name.]

@leeannproctor47 she wouldn't, but Clarence was supposedly mad with grief over Isabelle's death, and like Warwick, was absolutely convinced that Elizabeth was a witch, that she'd used witchcraft to make the King love her, etc. After she became queen, Warwick and Clarence saw her hand in EVERYTHING bad that happened to them, whether by her own doing, or that of her family members, including Clarence initially being told that he couldn't marry Isabelle.

[@lfgifu296]

for the question, which of the Historical periods here would you avoid going back to at any cost? For me it’d prob be the 1520s/30s in England :)

[@RavenIdril2966]

I have to give that a lot of thought.

[@Butterflypegasus40]

Bubonic plague would be on my list.

[@neptunes3279]

@@Butterflypegasus40 Or the sweating sickness.

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

Yeah, I'm going to add my voice here to 'not during the Black Death'. Absolutely avoiding that one! 😂 Hmm, other periods....I think I would also avoid James I's reign as I feel like almost every woman who annoyed someone would be picked up for being a witch. Maybe Charles I as well, although part of me wants to stick around and see how the Civil War actually played out in person. 😅

[@lfgifu296]

@@HistorysForgottenPeople the black plague flew by me, somehow😭 it does eliminate a lot of periods, though, some of which I’d like to pay a visit to🥲 I’m also w you on James (just earlier yesterday I saw someone call him “one of England’s most magnificent kings” and say his view on witchcraft was “much more nuanced than that”- hmmmm I have my doubts, personally)

[@waverider8549]

Am I the only one getting sick of "I'm her descendant" comments? Where are all the peasants then?

[@texasgermancowgirl]

well the people that are most interested in this stuff usually either are curious, history buffs, or are from the genealogy community.

[@suzannehall5200]

The further back you go the narrower the gene pool gets and a sad fact is that the people higher up the social scale had a higher chance of survival during the Middle Ages. It’s hardly surprising that so many of the people on Who Do You Think You Are? are descendants of Edward III. It’s the way genealogy has evolved.

[@madelinevanderbunny607]

Thanks! I've always felt bad for Isabelle Neville especially once she's married to that ummm dip____ George. Sorry that was the nicest way I could think of to put it.

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

Thank you, Madeline! 😊 Haha, yes, I've got some very choice names for George as well, and none of them are repeatable on this channel. 😂 Poor Isabel really was stuck between a rock and a hard place in her lifetime - we can only hope he at least treated her well!

[@Butterflypegasus40]

I wonder who was the favorite daughter?

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

That's such an interesting point! I'm not even sure if their father saw them in that light, or if they were just pawns for him to further himself.

[@RavenIdril2966]

​@@HistorysForgottenPeople I hate the Tudors for destroying the paper trail of these 2 sisters.

[@jaimiesalid3141]

Neither, it seems. Used, lie many daughters of those times.

[@beckyboo5097]

I feel sad for Isobel and George's son Edward and how Henry IIV killed him just cause he was a Plantagenet!!

[@auroramartell]

Hi! Would you consider doing a video on Empress Barbara of Cilli? She's a very interesting woman.

[@Butterflypegasus40]

That peaked my interest.

[@RavenIdril2966]

Was she a slavic?

[@auroramartell]

@@RavenIdril2966 She came from modern-day Slovenia (:

[@brandyloutherback9288]

Could you do a biography of the Bronte sisters?

[@jenihansen7201]

Actually, Isabel was a ROYAL DUCHESS.

[@altinaykor364]

Living as such a nearly-unknown figure, only for your death to cause a huge drama and only because it turns your husband crazy and your children living a hundred times more dramatic lives than yours💔I must say, Isabel on this level, had it even worse than her sister, Anne, even though at least she had a legacy

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

I agree! Even though we know so little about Anne as well, at least she became queen of England so is somewhat known. It's so sad that both girls (and their mother, of course) were not able to make much of an impact for themselves when so many other women at the time managed. Although many of them were hated for it, like Margaret of Anjou, so perhaps it was self-preservation as well.

[@RavenIdril2966]

I wonder if isabel was power hunger like her husband?

[@lilacgirl-z8w]

If George was a cheater he may have passed a deadly std to his wife.

[@SSRT_JubyDuby8742]

Like deployed 👍

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

Thank you! 😊

[@RavenIdril2966]

​@@HistorysForgottenPeople of the 3 Brothers of York who is your favorite or do you despise them equally?

[@lilacgirl-z8w]

When henry viii arrested margaret pole did he destroy portraits, letters and journals of her mother and aunt queen anne.

[@nootcena6957]

Ankaret or Ankarette Twynyho née Hawkeston was innocent!🙏🥺

[@fleetcenturion]

Your videos would be a lot better, if every other sentence didn't come with a lecture about how oppressed everyone was. Yes, yes, they lived in the shadows of men. We get it... now tell the damn story!

[@HistorysForgottenPeople]

This says more about you than me - why are you here if you don't enjoy them? 😂

[@RavenIdril2966]

​@@HistorysForgottenPeople I like how your doing things.

[@lilacgirl-z8w]

​@@HistorysForgottenPeople just jealous that this hater can't do better.