The history of the Belgian Leopard and its variants

At a now-closed War Heritage Institute facility near Antwerp (They will be re-opening at another location), we get a tour firstly of the various leopard variants the Belgians used, and then look at one which has been partially disassembled to learn the components. Finally, we go for a spin.
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[@mr_boo.]

Poor guy looks so nervous, i talked to him about a week after the Chieftain when i visited the museum , very nice guy!

[@ForeverDoubting]

I think the English was a bit of a problem :D As a Belgian, this was really cool to see though, I've visited that museum a couple of times, great place.

[@lostsoul489]

He tried his best and it works

[@mr_boo.]

@@ForeverDoubting Last time i went there they were in the process of moving the tanks to Ypres but i can't seem to find info on the WHI website :(

[@john_in_phoenix]

People tend to get nervous when speaking in a foreign language. It is perfectly normal and not a lot you can do to alleviate the feeling.

[@mattycakes1161]

He actually did quite well. I think people second guess themselves a lot more than they should when speaking.

[@verstappen9937]

When will the chieftain actually talk about or visit a chieftain????

[@feedingravens]

Does the Chieftain fit into a Chieftain? How does the Chieftain get tensioned? Oh My God, the Chieftain is on fire!

[@jon9021]

I agree!

[@thorbjrnsuther6540]

He has Look for his snapshot video on it.

[@CaptainSeato]

You must be new; he's done a vid.

[@chaosXP3RT]

They named a tank after The Chieftain?!

[@homebase5934]

Really appreciate the effort that Belgian bloke put into this informative interview. Even though English isn't his first language and i assume he was also nervous about being filmed, he did a great job. Thanks Cheiftain and Belgian bloke.

[@LayronPK]

How much i understand that feeling of nervuosness... The guy is doing great actually!

[@justin3275]

I am a volunteer at Site Gunfire Brasschaat, seeing one of my fellow volunteers being interviewed puts a smile on my face.

[@warci]

wow never knew this place even existed, looks ace!!

[@charlesemerson6763]

The look on your face when Vim offered you a drive , priceless.

[@nobbynobbs8182]

29:43 for the time stamp

[@ZaphodHarkonnen]

That was a very "Twist my arm why don't you." look. lol

[@doughudgens9275]

Chieftain knows how to do interviews: ask your question and let the subject answer. Don’t interrupt like news reporters do too often. In this case, he also did a good job helping his subject where English was obviously a second language.

[@aragorn_]

My thoughts exactly. Great work Chieftan!

[@SonsOfLorgar]

News reporters, unlike historians, have a duty to interrupt if the interviewed is trying to lie, deflect or weasel out of an important question. Unfortunately, too many reporters doesn't do that anymore and presumes honest intent and too many misinformation agents are allowed to false flag as reporters which creates a negative spiral.

[@Ben-fk9ey]

You know news reporters letting people speak unquestioned for ages isn't usually a good thing right? Otherwise the interviewee has a tendency to mumble about taking up interview time to avoid difficult questions.

[@annadalassena5460]

For someone of that generation, with an army career, probably his 3rd or 4th language. Back then you'd get Dutch + French + German + English in secondary school. In the miltary speaking French fluently was almost obligatory (as about 50% of the army was Walloon), and the units were based in Germany for long periods where they usually were rather integrated in local communities.

[@Direwoof]

Likely a 3rd or 4th for a belgian XD usually they learn french german and dutch before english.

[@erikverstrepen3373]

It’s completely run with volunteers. Very worth the visit. Chieftain pops up ? Getting a free Leopard ride 😅. How jealous are we ? 🤔

[@markfryer9880]

How envious; try olive drab! 😅

[@michaelpowell6023]

always loved the leopard . Like all tank designs, it is choosing the balance of firepower, mobility, and protection.

[@dennisvandermarkt8263]

English is a hard language. You pulled it off chieftain

[@12LOGIC12]

Its an easy language only English slang is hard

[@zhufortheimpaler4041]

english is about as easy as it gets in respect to foreign languageges. Older generations just are not fluent in it. But i would bet on it, that he is fluent in french.

[@oo7killer1]

I am baffeld by how a multiple ton tank stops in less distance than my car

[@pex_the_unalivedrunk6785]

tracks, yo.

[@SonsOfLorgar]

Friction surface area provided by the two to three dozen rubber pads on the tracks always touching the road compared to the four to six narrow rubber tyres on a car... A tank with all steel tracks will slide on hard surfaces like a hovercraft or soap on wet shower floors...

[@justforever96]

That and the brakes are very powerful. They need to be if you are going to be using them to steer with, and it's just a big heavy vehicle. The brakes on your car are sized to the weight of your car. You can make them stronger, but after a certain limit, the traction of the tires is the limiting factor and there is no reason to make them any larger, it won't help. A tank can install and use about as much braking power as you want. They make brakes to stop 747s from 200kts to 0 in a couple thousand feet. And they need fancy anti-lock brake systems to do it. The tires will lock up easily.

[@Direwoof]

@@justforever96 ye my jonda CRV hardly has bigger brakes then a motorbike XD

[@thomasschumacher5318]

@@justforever96 you cant run as much braking power as you want on a tank either. even on asphalt leo2 will completely lock up its tracks under heavy braking. Auto motor and sport magazine tested a leo2a4 against a porsche 993 and there are nice pictures of that test with leo2 leaving massive skid marks on the asphalt and the magazine wrote over the picture that 911 brakes with abs hence no skidmarks on the ground compared to the leo2 which has no abs and left a massive skidmark on the ground.

[@michaelscaplis]

Fun facts, the Leopard without turret is also in driving condition. The Leopard 1A1 was a later version downgraded back to A1 standard by Wim’s son who’s also a volunteer at the museum.

[@ottovonbismarck2443]

We had one "convertible" in our basic tank mechanic training unit with the Bundeswehr. This thing was dismantled and re-assembled for decades by raw recruits (at least one of which still has two left hands ...) and it still ran. After reassembly, the "drill" sergeant took us all on a ride.

[@Deltarious]

You looked absolutely smitten and at home when you were being driven in the tank, and it certainly wasn't being babied either! Was awesome to see

[@Yandarval]

As a Light Colonel. Nick will spend more time commanding a desk than anything with tracks and armour on it. So the chance to do what got him into the army in the first place...

[@DuoDoUrden]

Love the sound of the leopard.

[@philstaples8122]

My memory may be a bit hazy as I'm an old git now but after basic training in The Royal Armored Corp at Catterick ( 5 weeks basic infantry training ) we did about 4 months of trade training that would be either driving and maintenance ( D&M ) or gunnery, first aid, NBC and phase one signals then we'd go to holding troop or straight to our regiments. Most of that would be either D&M or gunnery. At the end if your first trade was driving you'd sit your driving test and get a H license I got mine in May 1984. The same driving test rules applied for people in the forces as for civilians so no easy pass, you had to be able to drive on the road legally. Then in around a year you would have done your other major trade training either gunnery ( range period in Honer then live firing in Canada ( BATUS )) in my case or driving at your regiment and become a RAC Crewman with a bump in pay. Gunners who got to the regiment usually did at least one scheme driving so they knew how to drive a tank at least in a basic fashion. It's relatively easy to drive a tank but it takes a lot of time to learn how to drive one well and not destroy the engine, gearbox and running gear or beat the hell out of the rest of the crew. I learned on Chieftain then did a conversion to Challenger in late1986.

[@sydney4814]

The smile at 31:00... you can really tell he missed being in the TC position in a tank being driven relatively hard in comparison to other tanks he's ridden in! (ALSO SORRY I SKIPPED TO THE DRIVING PART!! am going back to the start now to watch in full)

[@Elkarlo77]

You have to compare the performance of a Leopard 1 to other Tanks, the Leopard is not driven hard, the back would rise further when realy hard bracking. The Leopard is an old tank but the Abrams had to match the Leopards performance. I think he enjoys riding a Steel Beast which got the Performance of his old M1 Abrams again, that is what he misses and enjoys a fast Tank to ride. The old Leopard 1 is in the same Speed Bracket of 65 -70kph like the M1 Abrams, Leopard 2, T-80, T-90, K2 Black Panther. And that is it only those MBT of 40+ tons which are in this Speedbracket. He is the slowest and lightest of the pack but still a blast to sit in.

[@expiredwater9019]

Never thought I’d see a chieftain video series devoted to Belgium, lots learned so far!

[@maastomunkki]

I really do like the sound of that V10. Puts a smile on my face every time I hear it.

[@markgouthro7375]

It's cool to listen to two professionals talk shop.

[@scottbruner9266]

You could tell how disappointed Vim sounded when asked if the Belgian Army had the knowledge and capability to bring back tanks. 😢

[@davidlefranc6240]

Its a budget thing probably Belgium ain't a big country.

[@tomminsart1205]

Belgium is putting more money in being eco friendly then self defence

[@yarnickgoovaerts]

@@davidlefranc6240it’s partly budgetary. The main reason they gave for retiring all our tracked vehicles is because wheeled vehicles are supposedly more mobile and they intended the Belgian army to be a small but elite fast reaction force. Let’s just say it didn’t work out to well

[@davidlefranc6240]

@@yarnickgoovaerts Well wheeled tanks are much more mobile it is a fact like it or not .

[@yarnickgoovaerts]

@@davidlefranc6240 only on roads. Tracked vehicles are faster of road and because of their superior armor protection are also faster while under fire

[@peterjanvanbijnen226]

I visited this army museum Gunfire in Brasschaat Belgium it is an very nice museum it has not only thanks but also an very good section of the history of the second world war in Antwerp. The have also an very good display on leapards gunners learning tools. If you are interested in the matter it is the place to visit.

[@grumpyboomer61]

Wow! When Vim says lets go for a ride, he's not kidding around.

[@pex_the_unalivedrunk6785]

I like how Nicholas's system of checking armor thickness on a tank is the same I use...the knock acoustic test! if it sounds like a rock...it's probably over 5cm thick. if you hear a clang, you can sorta accurately guess somewhere between .5cm-3cm depending on the resonance...if you have a good ear.

[@ansonle1975]

The quality of the videos has improved significantly. Both the video and audio are very clear and crisp.

[@williamharvey8895]

Loved the end where the Chieftain is in the TCs hatch. I miss being in the TC hatch.

[@bobsmalser8304]

Love the Belgiques. When their reserves sold off their last WWII vehicles in 1982 they first invited us across the border to have our pick of monument vehicles. I took a Scout car for my Brigade S-3 shop and 2-68 Armor an upgraded Sherman with ammo. They got in a lot of trouble by later railing it to Graf for gunnery.

[@Optimusprimerib36]

I love this guy, he's struggling, but pulls off very well. I wish I could just speak English

[@markfryer9880]

OK, who here was expecting a RSM to come running out screaming at Vim and the Chieftain for driving the Leopard 1 too fast inside the base compound? Yes, I realised later that this is a Museum, but I fully expected an RSM or Belgian equivalent to appear. Maybe it's just my own personal Reserve Service PTSD showing through? 😢 I never got yelled at for driving too fast inside the unit compound, but that doesn't mean that I wasn't expecting to be yelled at for something? Usually it was the Squadron Sergeant Majors that were the worst. The RSM was usually pretty cool because he had made RSM, the others were still wanting to climb the slippery pole. Mark from Melbourne Australia 🇦🇺 Former Australian Army Reservist '88 to mid 90s.

[@Yandarval]

Active force. it will all be about the maintenance time and pad wear. A museum tank does not have to worry about having the vehicle in combat ready condition, just drivable and safe. Besides, Vim is showing of to a visiting "Treadhead".

[@maartencautereels1206]

Greetings from Antwerpen, Belgium. Looking forward to this because i saw these in service and always regretted their retirement.

[@Lonewolfmike]

Offering a tank ride to the Cheiftain you know he will ALWAYS say YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@PavewayJDAM]

Chieftain is a gem because he throws softballs to let these guys talk about how much they know and or did. BZ.

[@fonspaulussen7353]

The facility is not closed at all, and the “new” location won’t open for quite some years to come. Opening hours can be found on gunfire artillery museum.

[@davefost]

Wow. what a great museum to put on the list! Did anyone else notice some of the other stuff as he was driving around? Very interesting! This is what my place is going to look like if/when I win the lottery. Great to see them thumping that Leo around like it was meant to be and not coddling it. I liked the smile on the Chieftain's face after the first stop. I hope he will do some more videos from here! EDIT: Aha! I was in the Royal Military Museum in the 90's and personally ranked it as one of the best military museums I have been to. And the staff was incredibly welcoming, despite my only being able to speak english with some terrible high-school French... I didn't have time to do any other locations but will definitely put them on my bucket list now.

[@gareththompson2708]

The Leopard has got to be one of my favorite tanks of all time. Obviously it's well past its prime right now. But I think I would have felt very confident going onto a large scale conventional battlefield in the 1970s surrounded by a few of these things.

[@SonsOfLorgar]

It's still good enough to serve as a protected infantry assault/support gun or heavy recon element.

[@gareththompson2708]

@@SonsOfLorgar Indeed. I'm a firm believer in the mantra that any tank is better than no tank. Even on a modern battlefield the Leopard can still do nearly every job we'd ask of a modern tank (albiet less efficiently), with the only exception being the job of fighting other tanks. That's why I was always a supporter of the idea of sending Leopard 1s to Ukraine (on the understanding that they would be "in addition to" and not "instead of" any Leopard 2s sent).

[@MrSamgillis]

all the Belgian leopard 1A5BE's are now in Ukraine, i hope they perform very well i personally remember when these tanks where still in service until 2014 and i think it's a big offense (if not an outright crime) not only towards the military but also the country to allow it's army to have no tanks (or AA or 155 SPG's)

[@davidgoodnow269]

An interesting conundrum. For many years, any danger to Belgium would have to approach through a threat corridor by sea -- past Scotland and England -- or through the Netherlands, or France, or Germany. So coastal patrol frigates and coastal submarines would make sense, but all likely threats would be entering the country legally (or illegally, but via the same means). Meanwhile, Fabrique National de Belgiac (spelling?) has maintained the policy of keeping on-hand a new rifle, submachine-gun, or pistol, of the latest types, for every Belgian citizen, as it has since something like 1950; the military and police are to maintain custody and training for crew-served weapons including anti-tank and anti-aircraft, also of the latest types, as a core to provide leadership in the event of a need for national defense, as per resolutions passed 1947 (1946?)-1965 inclusive.

[@Toolazyfornewname]

@@davidgoodnow269 Very interesting

[@davidgoodnow269]

@@Toolazyfornewname It was an eye-opener, one that stuck with me! Have you watched Perun's channel, the update on Global Arms Trade dropped this morning; FN, "We arm the World, (so we can afford to keep sufficient of all our latest for domestic use)!"

[@annadalassena5460]

@@davidgoodnow269 The second part of your post is patently not true......

[@davidgoodnow269]

@@annadalassena5460 I take it you have never bothered to read the Defense Council's typed records in Brussels for that time period, and then asked around to see if it's still S.O.P. As of 1997, it was.

[@bryangrote8781]

First time the Chieftain has had no issues getting in and out of an armored vehicle lol

[@chesterfield7770]

Why ignore the jagpanter ? During my time in the Belgian army I saw one of these everyday . The most beauty tank in the Belgian army ! Thanks for these interviews about Belgian tanks

[@martrose]

Great Video, and btw my favorite Tank with the best engine sound ever!

[@kommissarkillemall2848]

what a coincidense, as yesterday i was in the National Military Museum at Soesterberg, The Netherlands to see a Leopard A1 driving in the arena. Old, but still a nice beast to see running around.

[@grud8495]

gotta love that engine purr.

[@john_in_phoenix]

Really nice he took you for a spin!

[@waltergolston6187]

Great fun of a ride!!!

Very nice Video. Thanks a lot to the War Heritage Institute for hosting the Chiftain. It would be nice to see this collection one day in person

[@michaelguerin56]

Thank you for an excellent video. Wim certainly enjoyed his playtime at the end😁. Cheers from NZ.

[@LexieAssassin]

Talks about how intimidating IS-3 was, but on video at least, Leopard 1 is much more intimidating IMO b/c of it's speed.

[@evilfingers4302]

Mind Blown, someone who knows more about other tanks than the Chief?

[@1stpaintballmaster]

If your offering YES! Thanks for the video.

[@MililaniJag]

Great Job! Great Info! Cheers!

[@martincurran-gray2287]

Very interesting, thanks!

[@shaider1982]

It's incredible to see somethig that big seemingly move and change direction effortlessly.

[@mootpointjones8488]

Excellent insight 👍

[@thurin84]

that ride was fun!

[@slikerdet]

very cool and not so much known feature on leopard 1 tanks is the exaust sound, this will make so much noise that you cant tell how many leopard 1 tanks that are coming or where they come from.... you hear a sound coming closer and higher towards you but where does is come from.................. norwegian leaoprd 1 tanks welded steel inforced guides under the enginebay floor because it was worn fast down by rocks and other hard materials in the nature...

[@paullavallee1631]

Happy Easter to you and yours Kelly

[@chrisgeddes26]

Compared to our 60's, those were the hot rods!

[@fluffycat087]

Sounds great.

[@davidlefranc6240]

Those a beautiful machines for sure its still a really good potent platform to modernise its modular!

[@RonI-qz2tz]

Great video.

[@justforever96]

Guy seems to be the classic nerd type, just really loves his tanks and can tell you all about them, but is pretty socially awkward and not at all militaristic or anything. I love guys like this, the same ones that get into cars or trains or airplanes or whatever. They are usually the best sort of people.

[@SportbikerNZ]

Make no mistake, he's ex military. See him drive the heck out of the tank at the end.

[@herosstratos]

10:12 Leopard 1A5BE cdr sight: TRP 5A, in principle the same TRP as before, but longer tube for moving line of sight above new gunners sight.

[@Esa826]

Thank you for the awesome video. Any plans of doing video of Merkava tank? Always wanted to know about those tanks.

[@raphaelcurzon7486]

Theres stationary merkava displays out in the open in the desert near Jerusalem. Visited a few years ago and sat in the drivers seat through the hatch. Very cool

[@oo7killer1]

The panzer museum in munster has one on display

[@jangustl_wt2358]

Saumur has an Merkava 1B

[@ibalrog]

Those brakes are amazing.

[@SportbikerNZ]

Super cool seeing that leopard ripping at the end! That Stops on a dime. Vin can sure drive! The driver's head looks like it's touching the turret. Wouldn't want the turret to be spinning with your head out.

[@kristofnys3212]

A small heads up to people wanting to visit the Gunfire museum in Brasschaat where this was filmed. The area with all the heavy equipment (like tanks) is now closed to the public, as I found out today unfortunately… Apparently they are preparing all the vehicles to be moved to Ieper.

[@davydatwood3158]

Assuming that was Vim driving, I'm not sure I believe his claim to have never raced his tank. :D

[@flitsertheo]

What you call racing Belgian tank drivers call driving. We knew very well we had to keep out of the way of those Leopards as we didn't know if they were even willing to brake for an obstacle.

[@SonsOfLorgar]

​@@flitsertheo obstacle... that's a very interesting way to spell "flight time opportunity" 😂

[@cmck472]

One hell of an emergency stop! I can feel my fillings rattling just looking at it .

[@bert26a]

Chieftain will have to go check out a Canadian C-2 Mexas for a comparison.

[@unpaintedleadsyndrome]

I'll be visiting that place in 2 weeks...

[@Emdee5632]

Wim. It's not Vim, but Wim (short for Willem). Vim is a cleaning product.

[@steelhammer96]

very informative and hell is this leopard agile!

[@andrewdenzov3303]

Well this people are fun! When they are asked: we have one in the world prototype of the tank. Would you like to play with it? What kind of answer they expect?

[@krakke3188]

HAHA that drive at the end was great. Leopard sure breaks!

[@Tyrt1994]

AS a belgian guys. It's paintfull to watch this video. The guest had hard time with Englsih. It could be beter to translate what he was saying. Because I think we miss a lot of information. But thanks for the video

[@RenshawYT]

Thanks for the video. Thanks also to Vim (spelling?) for his wealth of information!

[@mbr5742]

The WTS in Koblenz has a Leo 1 with the side opened up

[@schwabrichard9829]

If your offering, Yes!!!!

[@vanguard9067]

You should check out Drachinifel today and provide the ground forces used in that incident:-). As always, love your stuff.

[@carlll6101]

Vim was flooring it :D

[@martinpollak7039]

Missing comments on the ride from the Chieftain

[@MrLeo2A6]

Oh the sweet sound of a Leo 1

[@user-qi3mv9dx4r]

Faz um vídeo mostrando o m551

[@Matticus333]

It breaks my heart that Canada paid to have its ~45 remaining Leopard C2 (1A5) tanks (including MEXAS variants) turned into target pieces in December 2021. Those 45 tanks would've been useful for Ukraine in its war against Russia and been a sizable contribution to the 🇩🇪🇩🇰🇳🇱 Leopard 1 consortium. At least 25-50 Belgian 1A5BEs will end up in Ukraine, thanks to Rheinmetall buying them off OIP.

[@Marcus-ki1en]

Go for a ride? No, I would hate that...NOT! You looked like a kid in a candy store. Too cool.

[@Hokum_Paints]

Nicolas looked to be enjoying himself with Vim showing off the speed of the leopard. Vim certainly likes putting the brakes on!

[@SlinkyTWF]

M60 had the same issues with driver egress when the gun was at 12-o'clock.

[@zhufortheimpaler4041]

The german Leopard 1´s didnt get a late 80´s early 90´s armor upgrade. MEXAS-H as mounted on the belgian and canadian Leopard 1´s improves protection vs RPG´s and 30mm cannons and is a mid to late 90´s applique armor. You could mount it on german Leopard 1A5´s, as its mounting is universal for the cast turret. MEXAS-H is a ceramic-steel-rubber layered composite

[@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623]

The Belgian army was weird. When the Germans and the Dutch applied applique armor to their Leo 1's and had the Leo 2 enter service the Belgians stuck with the basic Leo 1. They only began to upgrade their Leo 1's when the Cold War was over and everyone else was downsizing and ditching their Leo 1's.

[@davidgoodnow269]

"No one expects . . . _the Spanish Inquisition!"_ Buy the upgrades when they're on clearance, just in case everyone else is being duped!

[@chaptermasterpedrokantor1623]

@@davidgoodnow269😂😂😂

[@GsusMcNutty]

My first thought: Bernard got a bit old and lost his amazing accent?!

[@jimminey-fooking-cricket4903]

The Panther and Tiger at looking at the quick stop and screaming about the transmission.

[@chrissouthgate4554]

Drive normally, but when I tap on the dash I would like you to safely perform an emergency stop!

[@matthayward7889]

Vim really driving it like he stole it 👌

[@LessAiredvanU]

The people the searchlight was illuminating could not see the Leopard, due to retinue burnout!

[@MrPirax]

I do miss that sound, especially when my driver pushed it a bit

[@charlesvaughan3517]

My dog started growling at the leopard😂

[@neilgibbs3880]

Wow those Leopards are proper little sports cars aren’t they.

[@Valkanna.Nublet]

I've always wondered how they get electricity into the turret without wires that will just get tangled as the turret rotates.

[@SonsOfLorgar]

Slip rings. On the turret ring or under the turret floor there's two sets of of a copper slip ring and a spring loaded copper pickup, one for each polarity. As the turret turns, the pickups slide along the rings, maintaining contact and power transfer. Modern tanks probably has some kind of UIP or APU system with it's own battery in the turret that is kept topped up though the slip rings to keep the electronics fed without risk of micro glitches.

[@jcadult101]

19:06 How cool would that be in rush hour?

[@sneakysnek8416]

Mister Chieftain, do you think youll ever get to cover modernized Turkish M60s? Thank you :)

[@TheChieftainsHatch]

Really depends on if any become available

[@sneakysnek8416]

@TheChieftainsHatch you might be able to cover the Sabres, a Isreali modernization of the M60s for the turkish landforces. They were on display a few tines to my knowledge, but I don't know if they still are on displays nowadays. Regardless, thank you for the reply :D

[@WhatIfBrigade]

If Belgium needs to restart a tank program they should partner with Ukrainian tank trainers. Belgium buys tanks for both countries and both train together in Belgium.

[@markfryer9880]

Where are they going to buy them from? Germany is busy trying to produce enough Leopard 2s to rebuild their own Army strength? 😮 Mark from Melbourne Australia 🇦🇺

[@WhatIfBrigade]

@@markfryer9880 Living in Europe, I'm starting to lose patience with the idea that European countries cannot adjust production levels of tanks or 155mm shells, etc. If Germany really cannot figure it out, buy US Abrams or South Korean K2s with an EU factory deal like Poland did. It isn't as if anyone in Belgium even remembers the Leopard anyways. There isn't a worker shortage in the EU. Open a bid process and see which company steps up.

[@davidgoodnow269]

There's more money going to Ukraine than the entire Belgian defense budget, by more than an order of magnitude! As for the idea of training together . . . not bad, especially if crews with combat experience from various tanks (Leopard 1, Leopard 2, T-64/T-80, T-72/T-84, T-62, Chieftain, Abrams) can be sent from Ukraine to Belgium to update the instruction materials and offer in-person hands-on training and lecture, alongside "school" instructors for technical matters, instruction in maintenance and repair by-the-book, et cetera. Experienced crew men saying, "It was a dark and stormy night, and the mud would drag you to your death if you got out to piss, but there we were on a sheet of plywood doing track maintenance . . . when _name_ saw the T-80 coming through the woods. "He was the first to catch it as he stood up into a burst from the Russian tank's machine gun . . . " "Keep low!" I yelled, "Get around to the other side to get in!" Lessons to be learned: Don't wait to do maintenance, a better time might not happen. Keep some plywood around. Keep an alert watch, that's what infantry is for. Don't stand up to point out the danger, it tells the enemy that the gig is up. Use available cover. It really helps if you have an ATGM to pull security with, because you may have trouble getting your tank rolling and rocking if the enemy comes knocking. As for delays expanding manufacturing production, that's the product of atrophy. Just as in the biological, suddenly straining the sinews to take a formerly capable load will predictably result in debilitating self-injury. There has to be a build-out to build-up. That takes _years,_ historically three years to start making progress and five years to hit stride, when speaking of heavy industrial manufacturing of any form whatsoever. The tools to make the tools to make the tools have to be made, buildings built to house factories, where an industrial foundation to stabilize the equipment may have to set for three years just for the concrete to cure! The kind of concrete used for that during World War II set more strongly, faster, because it used _coral_ as fill -- and mining coral is _illegal_ now. EDIT: Where would they buy them from? Germany has several thousands of Leopard 1 tanks sitting abandoned in the woods, if you want to buy and upgrade to the standards of the former Belgian Army Leopards upgraded and sent on to Ukraine, or similar. You should be able to buy those for scrap metal prices, minus transportation costs, as many no doubt _are_ scrap metal after thirty-five years unmaintained; the German government has not sold them for scrap already because it doesn't cost them anything to leave them, while the German government would have to _pay_ to dispose of them!

[@timovilkki5209]

👍👍👍👍👍

[@ABrit-bt6ce]

Had to look it up but Gunfire is a rum tea.