the idol who was BASHED out of his group by fans-The Story of Seryun Sejun (TVXQ)

[@shine199723]

SM has been pushing this rotation in their boy groups for yearssssss, that’s crazy. They tried with TVXQ, it didn’t work. They tried with Super Junior, and that also had massive backlash. Then they finally just did NCT where from jump they were like this is a rotational group. And even that didn’t fully work. They tried to make NCT Dream a rotational group and fans pushed back hard. I don’t understand why they don’t get it lol, that the fans don’t want it lol.

[@Yointrovert]

I agree with the last point. Sm, Idk have this cult like ideas and mindset. I'm not sure, but RV was too supposed to have a similar concept, but it was scrapped due to Yeri's hate when she debuted. They're doing the same thing with Kwangya. Kwangya should only be exclusive to Aespa. There's no need to push on every group.

[@sadmochineko]

the irony of going "tvxq is 5" only to have them split, and now i understand why cassies had bad blood with elfs initially... one look and you can see its siwon LMAO

[@akiharu2474]

History repeats itself with the latest Riize drama.

[@alexandria_g]

Yep more than 20 years later and SM hasn’t learned

[@Queenofskill]

Kpop fans never change huh, protesting outside of SM's buildings has been a thing since H.O.T's disbandment, also the unreasonable hate towards members of groups based solely off of rumors..jeez... Even if TVXQ didn't last long as a five member group, they were still all extremely strong for lasting 5 years in the first place, with rumors like these becoming part of their already hectic daily lives.

[@lll.24601]

They also protested for Chen when he got married.

[@amesora1553]

It only getting advanced with the fancy trucks 😅 same goes with the internet. Today we got lots of social medias platform to make everything & nothing going viral and trending. The fans back then getting older, then there were younger generation today. Wondering if the fans from the past regreting things that happened before. I can't fathom it myself. When all these TVXQ's incident happened, I'm busy playing in the primary school. Now I'm in my 30's, quite a wild ride to know all of this.

[@kkurajam]

Crazy how NCT concept has been in SM's mind since inception

[@ricezzz2665]

and they keep fucking it up each time 😂

[@amesora1553]

When hill LSM stop??​@@ricezzz2665 I pitied the test subjects the most 🤧 I know all of this was about money & profit, but no one should be subject like this.

[@fijardim7]

​@@ricezzz2665I wonder why that never worked

[@brennathecatlover4360]

@@kkurajam I think sm got it from morning musume and tried with suju but failed lol

[@springss1861]

Similar to aespa’s concept. SM marinates on concepts for a long time, especially when LSM was in charge. He had very particular visions

[@bastetowl3258]

and SM still doesn’t get that fans don’t like the rotational concept. we appreciate the chemistry and friendship feeling of a fixed group but SM had always seen its artists as cogs in a machine or chess pieces to move around

[@rachelmaddowswife8713]

I've always wondered if they finally tried it with NCT because they got so burned with exo? Like they invested so much in the Chinese members only for most of them to abandon the group pretty much immediately after getting famous. With a rotational concept, a member's departure or military service isn't such a big deal, they can just see who among their trainees can fill the gap. It has major drawbacks though, I think some of the general public didn't get into NCT because there are too many members and it seems too complicated. If they had focused on a smaller number of them in a fixed group, each of the members of that group would have been more popular, but some wouldn't have debuted at all.

[@bastetowl3258]

@@rachelmaddowswife8713if SM actually treated their artists better and were willing to make some compromises in their negotiations, then all of these artists wouldn’t be leaving in the first place. what other company has so many artists leaving in the middle of their first contract before renewal even?

[@rachelmaddowswife8713]

@@bastetowl3258 I'm not saying there were never problems in kpop, clearly with dbsk there were some contract problems. That wasn't why Kris and Luhan left, they left for more money in China.

[@theepoopydoodoo]

​@rachelmaddowswife8713 this wording about what happened with the Chinese members of EXO is so disgusting. They were abused, their health was disregarded, the weren't given proper medication. They didn't "leave after they got famous", they used the money they earned from getting famous to represent themselves and stick up for themselves.

[@rachelmaddowswife8713]

@@theepoopydoodoo Then why did the other members not leave and in fact kept renewing their contracts multiple times? Why did the courts rule in SM's favor? The dbsk court case was a lot different, it massively changed the whole idol industry.

[@maxkim7937]

as a fan of dbsk/tvxq, i can confirm that the fans were crazy... i was just a korean american boy who thought they looked and sounded really cool and badass. this part of their history happened when i returned to the states and i missed this part as it didn't reach the states the same way. i found out later through a friend who were went through denial when i went to visit during summer vacation. she was devastated. so much has changed since then...

[@NatalieH-r5j]

Wow I knew about the original super junior line up story but never anything about the tvxq line up changing. I feel smarter after learning the lore lol. Also those pics are so cute 😭

[@Oceaniac]

Same! I’m so surprised! And dbsk is the first kpop group I really liked!

[@starjoy]

man lee sooman has been relentless about the rotational/unit group project of his like damn, lmao????

[@alexandria_g]

Fr he was so determined lol. Most SM have attempted it

[@skys4959]

Yunho was replaced by sm for a contract issue. But it was jae joong and junsu fought for him with sm and made him into team again. But yunho didn't have issue with same contract, when jae joong was fighting with sm and suffered for years. Jae joong(main person) and junsu always stood for what they felt as right. Even if its not their fight. Respect jx for that.

[@azuretran7395]

@skys4959 This goes to show the integrity and good character in JaeJoong and Junsu. This is exactly why I only follow them, and to mention they have the better vocals. 🙂

[@monotzukokuureshii]

​@@azuretran7395 yes no matter how times fly people still don't like people who stand up for themselves so many people hated junsu and Jaejoong for standing up for themselves now people are hating newjeans for doing the same

[@sonder8310]

​@@monotzukokuureshiiweird comparison when you take into account NewJeans are standing up for MHJ. A woman who made them sing about sex at age 15? In the most pedo way ever. Or took sultry shirtless promo pics of Taemin when he was underage (around 16?). Sorry but I think people have every right to not like their obsession with a woman they perceive had groomed them. While we don't know if that is true, it sure seems possible.

[@AndrèDeMedici]

Mad respect for JX

[@brennathecatlover4360]

@@azuretran7395it sounds like you’re dragging tvxq for staying

[@liberte2016]

SM had always wanted to incorporate the concept of Johnny’s Jr, perhaps a method to gain exposure for potential trainees, but fans never accepted this concept

[@fluffybearcubs3491]

Watching this in 2024 is crazy. An anti-cafe for someone who doesn't exist...

[@beautyssi1646]

"I found an anti cafe for a K-pop idol who doesn't exist" lowkey sounds like a creepypasta title. But it's real... it's all too real

[@xxmaxv6279]

That’s funny I was about say Seryun Sejun looks like Suju Siwon later in the video it’s conform my suspicion 😂

[@ToadyMcgee]

And people have learned nothing since

[@amesora1553]

I think they learned, but not incorporated it 😅

[@EclesysGalaxy]

@@amesora1553 I think they just enjoy being horrible people lol. Ain't no way someone can be stupid enough to think that sending death threats as "i'm gonna k1ll lee soman" over a kpop group, is an acceptable behavior.

[@Z0MB13R0T]

as a briize, hearing about all the stuff the fans were doing is giving me ptsd 😵‍💫

[@shemoww]

Typical SM behavior…this all could’ve stopped if they just addressed the rumors properly

[@all-kulture]

also, i think this is a clear example of how people used to underestimate the power of the internet. SM knew about it since the beginning but only clarified everything after it reached the general public

[@scro910]

Ima go ahead and say it : I don’t condone bulling but T-ara Stans had that same energy for hwayoung getting added their whole success trajectory would have been so different.

[@Slm99]

Hatingon Siwon while relatable really shows how unhinge fans can be and how they don't mind going into xenophobia and racism.

[@JosefinaCL]

As I know, the group was officially formed 6 months before debut, they all were going for other groups, but suddenly someone decided to put the five together, best choice tho it didn’t last long😢

[@cmhha6479]

definitely sm had done good in putting them together, lee soo man had once said that each of the five members are way too good to be a group cos each of them had so much potential as a soloist, but junsu mentioned that sm had put them together as a 'last resort' cos the idol industry was dying at that time,,but it was also sm's mistake for not treasuring the group enough and working them to their bones until they can't take it anymore :((

[@urvampmari]

funny how choi suwon is always involved in the downfall of something

[@bbvoxlover]

i thought Seryun Sejun looks familiar. Lolz, until the reveal at the end, it all make sense.

[@greywhale]

But SM didn't learn and tried to put the rotational concept on Super Junior.

[@peachxtaehyung]

Woooow I never knew this and I've been a fan for years!! Great video and thank you

[@anikalee9012]

I can identify from the start that he is Siwon😅

[@akarimingliminjee]

Back then companies were actually scared of boycotts by fans. Now international fans have too much power and they'll get sales through online listens anyways so they don't care anymore. I'm proud to be a Cassie and supporting them back then (not in the crazy crazy way). And I feel sad for current groups where fans want to help there group for better circumstances but really nowadays you have not that much influence unless you are aligned with those freakin international fans. Only Loona succeeded in this.

[@beautyssi1646]

I always thought the Seryun Sejun case was very interesting as, to be frank, it was a case of massively dedicated stupidity only fired up because the majority of TVXQ's fandom of the time were really young. I made a post about this on Reddit's r/hobbydrama, which it seems you were quite inspired by, but you also unearthed some new things even I didn't know - I can see the effort put into this. I also think the "wheelchair" whatever is a mistranslation, as the text you zoom into just says "Seryun Sejun Official Anti" (I can speak Korean). Unless there's an anti cafe I don't know about, then whatever~

[@leriety]

I wouldn't be surprised if SM really planned them to be rotational and backtracked because of this, they've been trying that concept for years, my older sister was a Cassie around this time but we actually never heard about this before.

[@ATWTMVTVFTVSGAVRALPS]

0:14 ngl, those hairstyles are crazy good.

[@Yvesswntual]

2:22 wasnt super junior also supposed to have a system like that?

[@mingkyumin]

Yes and when kyuhyun join they think he will replace them so they hate him, when Henry zhoumi join they buy sm stocks to get them out

[@theepoopydoodoo]

Super Junior, then NCT Dream, and it still didn't work out

[@MagnaX-Games]

SM want to penetrate chinese market, cuz it will be hard without any chinese member.. and their most ultimate weapon back then is TVXQ fans😂

[@CassiezenLuv]

4:08 It's not the main topic of the video, but I think this detail was the part that broke me down the most😔💔

[@isabellevoldy]

Hating on siwon is honestly pretty relatable

[@tricksgrl2]

TVXQ and Super Junior once shared the same dorm

[@Ladolcevitaprincess]

Yeah they trained together

[@plantadelbosque]

This is so fun I am an ELF not a Cassie, so I am not super familiar with Toho's lore and did not know this rumor at all. But yeah, sound sus AF, considering the names mentioned in the 'joining friends' are all, in fact, Suju members AND as it is well known Suju started with a rotational system. I wouldn't be surprised that the brief idea was to have Toho as rotational, and with the backlash they just decided to create a brand new group that could have that concept. Also, yeah, that old rivalry between the fandoms... so effin stupid considering how the members were all together I am much more happy with the current status of the pepsi fandom than that ole rivalry

[@kaden_the_libra]

idk the fans were kinda acting crazy… how many times did they have to let y’all know what was going on 😭😭😭

[@rachelmaddowswife8713]

Huh, sounds like the original plan for dbsk was NCT!

[@abcd-jk4zb]

Then why is the story that "jaejoong was the one going to be replaced because he dudnt gave fans and in fan meets his line was always the one empty" spread on twitter?? Wth!!

[@all-kulture]

i actually never heard this version, but considering how people would just believe and spread anything, i don’t doubt that this version was also spread back then but on a smaller scale

[@kaosprinvess]

0:20 wut??? What did I just hear??? TVXQ can only work cause of Jaejoong, Yunho, Changmin, Junsu and Yoochun 😊😊😊😊😊

[@Oceaniac]

As a long time dbsk fan…. Why tf did I never know about this.

[@cmhha6479]

honestly same

[@aligensa]

It's not complete paranoia though, because the rotation concept was already used in Japan and a short time later was actually planned for Super Junior as well, but fans protested against it then too, and successfully so. SM later tried it again with NCT and it didn't work there either. I think it works better for girl groups with many members and that have more male audiences in Japan, because female fans tend to get more attached to individuals than male fans do, and that's true in general and a nice thing, it doesn't have to be "hysterical", because just think how awful such an even shorter career would be for idols whose career mostly is already short.

[@abc_jv_xyz]

10:38 oh.................................

[@MJAYMONONOKE]

That did not age well at all 👀👀

[@abc_jv_xyz]

@@MJAYMONONOKE Not at all lmao At least it wasn't said by JYJ, I guess

[@mingkyumin]

Jaejoong also say if a member leves, dbsk will not be dbsk xD who got tell him

[@abc_jv_xyz]

@@mingkyumin lmfaoooo

[@bastetowl3258]

that was not a wise thing to say tbh. they should’ve said “stay together as long as possible” but they probably had to say that to keep the fans invested in them

[@19x97x_M]

Oh so sm was doing nct u before nct u ok

[@tiffanys358]

Not that Japanese idols are treated well but I never understood the extreme hate towards Chinese trainees and idols. This is not to say that I agree with xenophobic hate towards anyone but I always found it odd how Chinese people are hated more than Japanese ppl in Korea despite the history of Japan 😅. I remember watching this video of a Korean-American KZbinr who was visiting Korea and some lady started yelling at her at the convenience store and accused her of being Chinese. Instead of addressing the sinophobia, all the korean comments on that video were shaming the KZbinr and saying that she paid someone to say that & she was making Korea look bad.

[@clns45]

because they need their (japan) validation and china already has a bad image to everyone i suppose

[@gj7854]

Looks like lee soo man was trying to take a book from Morning Musume system who had been following that system since 1998. Tbh I don’t like that system I think it disreguards the idol and the fans of the idol. It’s different if they leave on their own accord but to be mascually pushed out after training for so long is kind a messed up.

[@suhocidal]

Riize stans thinking the Seunghan situation is an entirely new thing

[@yontonmonpon]

No but it’s still something that shouldn’t have happened

[@1224thetami]

Ah... I remember all of this

[@AA-ed6ek]

A bunch of divisive clowns in this comment section. Kpop fans deserve their reputation.

[@abc_jv_xyz]

Do you think Hangeng was supposed to join TVXQ?

[@mingkyumin]

I do not think for dbsk was form as vocel a Capella grup and Hangeng was only a sub vocelist who focus on dance. Tiffany snsd has spoke before abot a trainee from china who was a good singer but can’t dance 4 shiz so I think that unown trainee mite of ended up in dbsk if they went to make a Chinese album

[@abc_jv_xyz]

@@mingkyumin Tiffany said someone couldn't dance for shit??? Wow, they must have been pretty bad for her to notice

[@all-kulture]

probably before the whole concept of TVXQ was formed as he’s more of a dancer than vocalist, he appears during 3:24 in the right

[@mingkyumin]

@@abc_jv_xyzyes xP but when she say it she was only teenager so maby she a bit dramatic, but Hangeng I think is one of the best dansers in kpop so it won’t be him

[@rachelmaddowswife8713]

@@abc_jv_xyz Lol, ikr? She's not exactly the company's best dancer.

[@peachxtaehyung]

Also btw the keyword tags you have at the bottom of the description box is against tos on yt! Its called "tag stuffing" youre supposed to just make a paragraph or 2 using natural language saying what the video is about etc and then before uploading the video just going to the tags section and put the keyword tags in there instead. If you dont do it likr that you can get banned on youtube

[@all-kulture]

oh really? i was suggested to put this kind of keywords a while ago but only did it now,i guess the rules changed recently then? thank you so much for warning me 🤍

[@peachxtaehyung]

@@all-kulture i heard about it a few months ago but I'm not sure how recently it's changed. Unfortunately alot of kpop KZbinrs don't know that it's not allowed. You can put hashtags but not just the words like how you have it currently. If you want more info there is pages on the KZbin help pages about it and also there's a KZbin coach type channel who has direct contact with people at KZbin and people who are his mods some of them work at KZbin and he has talked about it before about it as well. His name is Nick nimmin ❤️🙂 hope I helped

[@whenfinish]

I wouldn’t worry about this honestly. Lots of commentary youtubers do this. There’s no basis for youtube banning people for putting relevant keywords in video descriptions, it makes no sense. KZbin doesn’t even detect negative comments from positive ones, that’s why videos can go viral even if everyone is hating them. For comments to get flagged it has to be things like obvious slurs and such. So to get flagged for excessive keywords they have to be completely irrelevant like “how to make chili” or something. And putting those keywords in the tags section of your video will actually do more harm than good. KZbin uses tags to figure out what audience to push out your content and they’ve said multiple times tags have little impact on your reach.

[@peachxtaehyung]

@@whenfinish i mean people can do what they want but I've seen people get banned for doing this before because yt says to do a paragraph or two with keywords using natural language and then doing up to 60 actual hashtags and once you're banned you're not supposed to have another so you can get banned again if they catch you, so i warn people whenever I can and then they can decide to do what they want.

[@whenfinish]

@@peachxtaehyung okay, this was the first time I heard about this and was surprised. I used to watch a lot of youtube growth content and no one mentioned this and they talked more about avoiding mass hashtags. This is good to know, thank you. I’m gonna fix up my descriptions now. I didn’t get flagged before but maybe I just got lucky. So basically instead of having a keyword paragraph, find a way to include those keywords in a description paragraph for your video. In that case, as long as you’re writing full sentences it should be fine to have lots of keywords.

[@abc_jv_xyz]

6:52 Oh wow, they wanted to kill uncle Sooman?

[@seriousleh]

if you're up to it, i could recommend you something i told you abt a while ago.... There was this nugu gg called vivid that debuted in 2012 and disbanded in 2016 due to a scandal they had which involved sexual harassment but the problem is there is little to no info about this group that idk if thats even true. I'd like for you to check it out if you could, thanks!!!

[@all-kulture]

oh thank you so much!! i will do it soon :)

[@jhonarldamarles3064]

Can I ask who's seryun sejun

[@all-kulture]

13:26

[@Queenofskill]

@@jhonarldamarles3064 this was a genuine question im sure but this made me giggle cause it’s answered at the end of the video

[@jhonarldamarles3064]

@@Queenofskill me too I'm so confused

[@terryfoparson4324]

Clark Daniel Moore Lisa Wilson David

[@pokpok3037]

So NCT is what basically they wanted to do with TVXQ