The Incredibly Genius BMW F2 Engine Was A Failure

[@MrsMcMuffin]

The head you're showing at 9:14 is actually not a head designed by BMW, it's a head designed by Schnitzer for the M10, called 20-4. It was the main competitor of the Apfelbeck 16 valve head. It was used in F2, in BMW 2002 touring cars and in various hillclimb cars and it was sold as a tuning kit for street cars. Its simpler parallel design proved to be better than the Apfelbeck head, which prompted Rosche to design a very similar parallel 16V head. The 20-4 got a turbo version too, used in the Schnitzer Rodenstock BMW 2002 turbo group 5 and later in multiple BMW 320 group 5, raced by Schnitzer in the DRM. A feature on it might be interesting.

[@speedyjhonny4092]

Complexity does not always means better, but simplicity can be

[@ktkace]

Easy + strong. might not be charming but man these type of designs endure.

[@MattBrownbill]

Yeah, please tell Dyson and Audi that. 😊

[@dantheman1998]

I bet that that valve arrangement has some extreme power potential if it was designed with modern CAE flow design. The angle, flow characteristics, valve size and port size have to be adjusted probabily to a very fine degree for piston volume to properly work.

[@mandrakejake]

The benefits of this layout are a compromise for combustion chamber shape

[@posniknelb6114]

Similar to Lancia triflux engine. That had massive potential

[@stephenkeen6044]

Crossflow head is easier to achieve good scavenging which can offset the "swirl" advantage of the radial design (not to mention better pressure angles / concentrations at the piston edges). I do love the concept, though, and think it's a great achievement to design and build the cam / rocker assembly that could withstand the rpm it was capable of.

[@ArneChristianRosenfeldt]

@@stephenkeen6044F1 4 valves today and BMW boxer have radial valves and cross flow. Scavenging actually works better on diametral engines because you have 4 times the area to flow through at valve overlap. Diametral valves don’t collide in the radial arrangement. They move away from the walls more and allow scavenging there, too. With crossflow ideally, valves would be of different size and lift and timing ( small valves for overlap ).

[@michaelgideon8944]

​@@mandrakejakeThere really aren't any benefits to this layout. The chamber has worse combustion and it's a mechanical nightmare. At the same time Keith Duckworth was developing his F2 engines that became the DFV. Narrow included angle 4v layouts have much better combustion, rev higher and make more power.

[@longkeithdiablo8812]

An interesting setup with inlet and exhaust valves on both cams. I like the theory of better mixed air and fuel. I can see why they abandoned trying to "VVT" it. ☠️

[@jozsef6453]

Honda also uses the radial valve design since the 80s to this day in the RFVC single cylinder engines.

[@georgevasilopoulos5359]

Unreal engine 5

[@kensterfr33k]

this shouldnt be so funny

[@PaulMclaren-xv4lv]

Looks like road cars are utter shite.... Hahaha

[@古峻瑋-s6n]

bruh 💀

[@markmcgrath9098]

Awesome to watch and learn from. Thank you. I’d saved several pics of this motor to a Pinterest board but the layout was so fascinating and I wanted to learn more. Job done now, 👍😁

[@michaelguerin56]

Thank you for another excellent video. I suspect that, in addition to extra mass, the radial head design may have introduced significant friction losses. Complexity has to be kept in context however, given that : according to Harry Ricardo, the Rolls Royce Eagle was both the most complex aero engine of WW1 and the most reliable aero engine of WW1. Good to be a Patron.

[@gregshamieh6339]

Illuminating, this. The version of the engine that was the endpoint of development -- when they trashed all the cool opposed ports and reverted to a conventional parallel valve head -- became the basis for BMW's K series motorcycle. Engineers literally scaled all the dimensions down 50% to turn the 2.0 L motorsport engine into a 1.0 L motorcycle engine. The head that shows up at kzbin.info/www/bejne/ianbdqt6n6ugjpY appears identical to the heads from my K1200. Sorry that the race thing didn't work out, but it did provide 20 years of great road bikes .

[@Michael_Michaels]

I just love these 4 cylinder engines with exhausts in both sides of the block! I thought that it was Lancia the only brand who developed this type of engine.

[@brianb-p6586]

Did Lancia do that? There were racing modifications of Lancia V4s that had exhausts on both sides... but they were V4s, not inline-4s.

[@bigjoe65459]

@@brianb-p6586 Lancia triflux engine of the ECV prototype.

[@brianb-p6586]

@bigjoe65459 Thanks - I had not heard of that engine. The Triflux did have diametral valves and the expected exhaust from both sides, although it has parallel rather than radial valves.

[@Ocato92]

I feel like this diagonal valve layout would have great synergy with pneumatic valve system like FreeValve. FreeValve alone provides too small of an advantage compared to conventional Variable Valve Timing. Diagonal Valve Layout brings too much complexity to the valvetrain to be feasible. But together they can have all the advantages of Diagonal Valve Layout without all the complexity (besides more complex manifold).

[@paulreilly3904]

Sir, you make brilliant videos and may I say that your pronunciation adds to them. We all know that your pronunciation is not, how can I put this? Conventional, but we can all understand you, and this just adds to the charm. I am serious when I say that I mean absolutely no disrespect. Thank you for your work.

[@VisioRacer]

Thank you!

[@FateOfLate]

I seen the caption "unreal engine" and the engine and thought "oh interesting didn't think you could do that in unreal" then I saw the title :D

[@PaulG.x]

3:11 Typical German design - complexity for complexity's sake. The radial valve designs and five and six valve designs offer minimal to zero advantage over four valves

[@bunta_wrx5851]

yes but we're talking about years when all these dynamics weren't much clear even to engine designers

[@km6832]

True. But 5 valve are proven to be better than 4. Its just that 5 valves are extra cost for the same power potential

[@Terraceview]

No it's not. They were trying everything to get the maximum performance out of a known design, it was innovative. You're looking at it in hindsight.

[@bunta_wrx5851]

@@km6832 5 valves in theory should allow for better valve control due to smaller and lighter valves, so high revving engines should benefit. But nowadays it's become useless because of spring evolution/other systems and we can make valves that are light enough

[@hoodedcreeper2465]

I believe either Yamaha or Suzuki did some testing with increasing the number valves per cylinder. 5 valves don't really increase airflow at the top end but they do benefit low end torque.​ Any more valves and you make the airflow worse@@bunta_wrx5851

[@atomicgarage5606]

BMW and failure is like trust and government

[@samiraperi467]

So you're saying you trust the government?

[@bzilla-d4i]

I think you're confusing BMW with Toyota, they're the only manufacturer which has had 5 major recalls since November. Also, BMW has won World titles in every major racing competition. You must be confused my son. Also thank BMW for Jet engines, because they were the first guys on the planet who worked on the development. Broke people will always try to hate😂

[@CraigLandsberg-lk1ep]

Great video thanks 😅😅

[@clutchkicker392ison5]

Swirl is good for flame front and faster burn too .

[@edwardroberts5660]

I had a honda xr650 motorcycle which had a radial head it was single ohc and then used a double rocker arms. They were expensive to repair and did not make much more power than a the conventional four valve heads so it was dropped after a few years.

[@adamweston4152]

There's a story about BMW engineers urinating on M10 engine blocks to strengthen them before being made into the F1 turbo race car engines.

[@reubenmosman9466]

So cool . . . got to be a great breather.

[@TurbineResearch]

The only part even close to the road car engine was the block. Everything else was bespoke

[@coelhovinicius140]

Wonder how a freevalve system could work alongside this.

[@Birb_of_Judge]

It would probably make it a lot simpler to have this arrangement

[@edilsonmartins6653]

Interessante.

[@dabyd64]

Last 20 years of BMW engines have been a failure, at least the diesel ones. They clearly give zero f*** at the broken chains or ingested swirl flaps.

[@proxypanda4156]

Different marketing team, its failures are designed into it.

[@cromo7743]

The Koenigsegg freevalve system could use this arrangment of valves.

[@Michael_Michaels]

7:42 Dear @VisioRacer, don't get me wrong, I mean no disrespect, but I would like to suggest you to change the "necessitated" for "required" in your texts. It's not wrong, but in the context you're applying, it requires you to use "require" (no pun intended). _Require_ means to need something or make it necessary in order to achieve a certain goal or outcome. It implies that there may be other options or alternatives, but this particular thing is needed to achieve the desired result. Thank you.

[@fastinradfordable]

That is something Micheal - Michaels would say😂

[@whizzo94]

Keith Duckworth had the same idea and was well on the way to building the engine until he realised that it wouldn't work. Then he designed and built the FVA, which was very successful. BMW then bought an FVA and copied it.

[@hiha2108]

No, not true. It was an Apfelbeck-Patent from the early 30ies. The BMR Supermono motorcycle worked great with this arrangement.

[@whizzo94]

@@hiha2108 Not saying that Apfelbeck didn't have the idea first, just that Duckworth designed a similar engine with diagonally opposed inlet and exhaust valves. Fortunately for Duckworth, he realised that it wouldn't work before he actually built it.

[@mariusfridlund55]

///M power lead the way for the others to follow😁

[@Grasshopper.80]

Hey have you seen the delta hawk airplane engine. Looks really cool. Would love to get your take.

[@josvandencamp8441]

The Apfelbeck engine was destined to be a failure. It was too complicated with too many unnecessary parts. Von Falkenhausen was the better engineer and his engine was more flexible and more reliable.

[@bryanlimbag6945]

First 4cylinder F1 ENGINE SOUND REVING LIKE 4CYLINDER &F1 ENGINE REVING

[@xtnuser5338]

"A four cylinder that looks like a V8." Um...no. No it doesn't look like a V8. It looks like an I4 with a weird head.

[@TysonEngineer]

i love your videos man, but saying it was a failure is not correct.

[@pazsion]

they should have kept the design

[@GIGABACHI]

German Engineers. Making shit overcomplicated just because . . . since EVER.

[@michaelgideon8944]

It's more that they take an initially flawed concept and then come up with all kinds of crazy engineering solutions to make the concept work. For example, how long did Porsche and BMW stick with compromised semi trailing arm suspension? They made it work, but why do it in the first place.

[@taomicioli]

Lancia did the same in thier engines

[@mpetersen6]

One of the Soviet aeroengine manufacturers went down this path in the late 30 early 40s. Electronically operated valve train would make this a lot easier to manufacture.

[@ArneChristianRosenfeldt]

I would love to see this on a Reno racer. Then again I actually want to see a working compound engine, which doesn’t allow valve overlap.

[@-DC-]

Unlike the Germans to over complicate things lol 🤔

[@aquilaaudax6033]

✋🏼🇦🇺👍🏼

[@quasimodo8215]

I'm still wondering how's not possible to improve your pronunciation....

[@RohanSanjith]

Too many mistakes in the video

[@GuitarTherapy144]

correct the mistakes on my mahindra please. it rides horrible since 2023.

[@Terraceview]

Please let us know then?

[@RohanSanjith]

Please commentary more clearly

[@cornishcat11]

in english please