Pokemon's Inverse Battle Metagame Is... Interesting

[@DyxoXinoro]

"Avalugg is the best defensive pokemon" sounds like something I'd see scribbled on the walls of a cell in an insane asylum.

[@lyzder7298]

Steel being what Ice is in the regular meta feels so cursed. Like this goes against Arceus' design

[@Sphylinder]

imagine a little flea nibbling on a literal block of metal and it just vehemently exploding

[@kurenian]

Ironically Arceus is even better in this format because E Killer is unresisted

[@unknownname3703]

and seeing dusk mane and dialga be legal in OU also feels so cursed

[@Necfreon]

@@kurenianoh yeah un resisted I know that rocks and steels are dead I just don’t know about immunity’s works does it turn into something else or are ghosts still death to normals like usual

[@redtaileddolphin1875]

@@Necfreon hey man 0:14

[@_shadiness]

"Electric is an interesting type because there's no immunity to Electric, besides Volt Absorb." Lightning Rod, Eviolite Rhydon being inmune to the electric type which it is now weak to, while also resisting ice and x4 resisting grass:

[@shardmaw]

normal bug and flying weak really sucks but yeah

[@emeraldblade3747]

@@shardmaw well....less weakness then regular rhydon :D am i right? edit: nvm it only loses 1 4x weakness because normal rhydon has a4x resistance to poison+4 other resist

[@lennartstockl5826]

There is another two abilities: wonder guard and motor drive.

[@kevinanders5570]

​@@shardmawrhydon is neutral to bug though? Neither ground or rock resist bug normally. However offensively, bug would be weak to ground and resist rock. It would also have a 4x resist to water.(grass already mentioned) It would only be weak to rock, fire, flying, normal, while 4x weak to poison. And resist fighting, ice, steel, ground, and 4x resist water,grass (Immunity to ground with ability) Ground would be super effective against, flying, grass, bug Resisted by electric, steel, fire, rock Rock would be super effective on ground, steel, fighting, but resisted by flying, fire, bug, ice. So only fire would be able to resist both stabs. With 6 types being weak to either stab. Overall id say it would be better both offensively and defensively in inverse than in normal, since EQ would be a high bp, and can only be blocked by air balloon, levitate, or earth eater. For coverage probably fire or ice punch for fires. Fire punch would add fire, water, dragon, rock Ice punch would add fire, water, ice, (steel*) So fire punch for burn/rock type or ice punch for ice. Thunder punch, and aqua tail wouldnt add anything (not counting dual types) Megahorn, super effective against poison( which its 4x weak to), fairy, ghost, (fire*, steel*, fighting*) I cannot think of more coverage it gets (almost forgot about megahorn, so i probably forgot others) so its only weakness it can't hit back would be normal.

[@_shadiness]

@@shardmaw At the very least, normal has to be possibly the most physical type in the game with Ursaluna Blood Moon banned in the format. Rhydon also learns Shadow Claw, Earthquake, and a bunch of other moves that can hit back for super effective.

[@usernametaken017]

Ambipom and Necrosma Duskmane being ranked in the same tier is so fucking funny

[@CratthewF]

I reeeaaaally wish they’d release an “inverse room” move that flips the type chart for 5 turns

[@shiftfire4511]

That'd break the game *so* hard, but would also be hilariously unreliable, because you'd be hard-pressed to know if it will make your situation better or worse, as it's reliant on not just your team and moves, but your opponent's team and moves. It could very easily turn a sweep into a total reversal, but at the same time it coild turn a sweep into an unstoppable domination, or even break a relativey even game against you. It might even get banned, either for enabling otherwise impossible but powerful strategies, or for being too effective at upending the game by itself, forcing less intuitive strategies that make the game worse.

[@Ren12333]

​@@shiftfire4511In doubles where bans don't exist that move would allow teams to spam same type mons freely, thus ruining the format. With it a team of five fire types could run over a rain team if they get the inverse room online.

[@squiddler7731]

I always thought it was kinda neat how there were technically two ways of creating an inverse battle, not just one. The inverse battle we see has them taking every individual type match up and inverting it, but another option would've been to mirror the entire type chart (replacing every offensive type match up with the defensive one). This would still make it where grass beats fire and fire beats water, but now you'd also have things like normal resisting rock and steel and being super effective against fighting. This method would also preserve immunities but in the opposite direction (electric is immune to ground, ground is immune to flying, psychic is immune to dark, normal and ghost are still immune to each other). Also instead of getting dumpstered defensively, Steel gets dumpstered offensively with it being resisted by most types and only super effective against fire, fighting and ground.

[@lusiferbt]

I like the second inverse type of battle, it was my first idea hearing the term does it exist or has it ever been used?

[@Kasaaz]

What does this do to the Bug - Fighting matchups?

[@olivergro7105]

​@@Kasaaz bug is weak against fighting - becomes strong Fighting is weak against bug - becomes strong It's like dragon - dragon

[@Kasaaz]

@@olivergro7105 Would that be the first type combo that is strong against each other? I know Dragon / Ghost do against themselves, but this is different ones.

[@NYKevin100]

@@Kasaaz I don't think you can do it with single types, but two dual-type Fighting/Normal would be super effective against each other when using fighting moves (and would also benefit from STAB). Similarly, two Fighting/Flying would be super effective (and STAB) with flying moves. There are (not very many) actual Pokémon with both of those type combos, too. Of course, you don't need STAB to use a move that's super effective against your own type, but if we drop that requirement, then there are likely a ton of examples.

[@et34t34fdf]

Ice types in inverse is actually what gamefreak envisioned for the type in the first place, actually bulky.

[@drillerkiller9]

how do you know? source?

[@lostindarkwaters3354]

@@drillerkiller9 i don't think there is a source lol but it does make sense looking at Gen 1 and 2 ice-type stats Articuno I feel being a good example that's only conjecture tho HP:90 Attack:85 Defense:100 Sp. Atk:125 Sp. Def:125 Speed:85

[@brunop.8745]

I mean it's gotta be since they keep making slow bulky ice types

[@marvalice3455]

​@@drillerkiller9 source: their actions.

[@homerman76]

​@@drillerkiller9 Ice types tend to lean towards slow bulk, like Regice, Cloyster or Avalug, even though the typing really would benefit more from speedy offense.

[@zdelrod829]

Stealth Rock being quad resisted by Charizard is hilarious.

[@njivwathomassilavwe2056]

Nice seeing my favorite Pokemon is good even here. Serperior spamming contrary leaf storm will always rock

[@Riwul]

Nono. It's grass. Not rock.

[@sunvaroya]

Based Serperior enjoyer

[@chopinfanclub6672]

Rock resists grass bro

[@AttmozGlaishur]

Serperior fan spotted Are you tired of me saying this still?

[@TheAstrobiologistOW]

A Pokemon with a horrible typing like Ice/Rock that had an ability that flipped its resistances and weaknesses would be cool af

[@briandigiovanni6159]

Crazy to see how mons like Avalugg actually have the stats and movepool to be great pokemon and how much a pokemon's type can drag it down

[@wastelandking]

Avalugg would be a solid physically defensive mon if it were any other type. It has a movepool other defensive mons would want for, but its Ice typing holds it back from true greatness.

[@grzechu63beta]

Parasect with 2 quad resists and 1 immunity (Dry Skin): allow me to introduce yourself

[@erfigueroa34]

My glorious king parasect

[@peet-janissen5838]

who is not in the game

[@pleaseendme69]

Wouldn't dry skin give it an 8x resistance to fire?

[@pleaseendme69]

Or maybe only make fire 2 times resisted since it's an ability??

[@jacobmorris6357]

Abilities aren't affected by the inverse though

[@ivanbluecool]

Inverse battles feel like my brain is exploding

[@_nolandd]

Just wait until you try out the Random Battle Mayhem format. 😂😂

[@lefay7637]

​@@_nolanddI love that format so much I was in the top 200 of the ladder at some point

[@bcotrim12]

This also means a Pikachu can hit an Onix with a super effective thundershock

[@renegade6578]

I like how the relation between Dragons now instead of Dragon type moves only being good against Dragons, Dragon is the only type that can resist those attacks.

[@fatcat22able]

So I assume in this format, ground hits flying for super effective damage but Pokemon with levitate are still immune to ground?

[@kats1646]

Yes, immunities from abilities are unchanged. So Rotom Fan finally has a reason for having Levitate

[@edgargaebolg9307]

​@@kats1646 Ground would only hit it neutral, but an immunity is an immunity

[@rubikonium9484]

Rotom Fan now ties with Rotom Mow for the best ground immunity gained (and now Rotom Heat in inverse is almost in Fan's original spot, having a x4 resistance to ground changed to an immunity.)

[@Kanbei11]

The inverse battles were always fun to play, would have liked more of them. Glad to learn how the meta works in this mode

[@BestgirlJordanfish]

I feel like there needs to be a dimensional "room" move like wonder and trick room that sets inverse type chart for a few turns

[@lucaspaiva8659]

If this is legal in standard play, that would complicate things a whole lot, especially with an ability that sets this condition up on switch-in and/or this move being used by prankster pokémon if that has normal priority

[@lucaslennan3356]

​@@lucaspaiva8659Yeah it definitely wouldn't be able to exist as anything but a move with Trick Room priority. But even then I feel like it would 90% of the time just end up frustrating players who have good match ups, mostly in VGC. Like Ally Switch coin flips but 200x worse. Honestly the gameplay sounds horrible. Keep it as an alt format.

[@azurai3934]

Nah we need abilities that auto set trick room and gravity having an ability that auto inverts the type matchup is way too complicated

[@olivergro7105]

​@@azurai3934 I want all of that

[@PaintedHoundie]

​@@lucaspaiva8659It wouldn't be that complicated. they'd just make it a trick room variant.

[@thunderbolt4567]

8:10 I was not ready to see great tusk take 50% from rocks ☠

[@DatMageDoe]

I'd like to see an overview of Godly Gift, primarily because it seems like such a weird and creative metagame. Giving your other Pokemon one Stat from an Uber, that sounds ripe for some cool buildarounds with mons like Shuckle being given the HP stat of Lunala.

[@nicobruno9062]

Here bug type have the true definition of glass canon only resisted by grass, psy, and dark, but hit super effective 7 types

[@june9914]

Welcome back Gen 1 normals

[@Forever-GM-Dusty]

0:18 "Avalugg is the best defensive pokémon" but how's that different from regular OU?

[@lemason5981]

Ice type sucks lil bro

[@Forever-GM-Dusty]

@lemason5981 I know. Pinkacross made an April Fools video at one point claiming Avalugg was destroying the meta with its defensive prowess, so I was making a joke off of that

[@Dv03_best]

@@lemason5981 It's a joke lil bro

[@fadeleaf845]

I enjoy the cult following behind RBY's 7U metagame and subsequent attempts to truly reach for the bottom of play

[@calvinnguyen1870]

The fact that it has to basically be opposite day for Avalugg to be good is a pretty good encapsulation of how bad defensive ice types are in standard play

[@schl1910]

I remember this inverse battle tourney on Showdown in gen 7 when they forgot to apply species clause. Well, one of the players used 6x E-Speed SD arceus and surprise, he won.

[@wolfherojohnson2766]

Grass Types are even better in this format because they can hit more than five types super effectively now. Contrary Serperior and Solar Blade Leafeon are borderline unstoppable in inverse

[@solitare4602]

How about Triple Battles and Rotation Battles? Those were weird and confusing in Gen5, so I'd love to see a metagame that makes sense of them.

[@gerardoalexandergarciamend7053]

I used to play Triple a lot back in Gen 6 in Smogon

[@ultimatehope549]

Avalugg being the best defensive Pokémon feels like an alternate reality

[@thealientree3821]

Now imagine the terror that would be Gen 1 Inverse Normal.

[@empty5013]

"normal is incredibly because nothing can switch in because nothing resists or is immune to it" gen5 and earlier players dealing with 4drag2mag: first time huh?

[@claudio6391]

Wo-Chien MUST be good in a metagame like this, where grass dark is good defensively. Right? Right???

[@ThisIsntAYoutuber]

Honestly, Bug is probably going to be a commonly used stab too since it has so many resisting enemy types. I can see Wo Chien finally being somewhat useable (though still not absolute because by god that defense is icky) in the face of all those bugs.

[@Kasaaz]

I never thought about how the Hail to Snow change might affect the Inverse Battle meta...

[@charliethielen8761]

one of my favorite formats is random battle mayhem, mainly because its an inverse battle where abilities are shared between the whole team. the types of the pokemon do change to match their first two moves, but that doesnt matter so much when you have 3 abilities that grant immunities

[@LoopDeLuuke]

I actually lost a Nuzlock in X&Y because I decided to try Inverse Battle thinking it would be fine and my brain fried within seconds-

[@aaaron9866]

So interesting that types like fire and ground are pretty well balanced so they stay great

[@pacoramon9468]

Steel got the biggest nerf possible.

[@Baltaczar]

I think it's so funny that Avalugg had to get a complete inversion of matchups to be what it was supposed to be, and also it's so funny that even with that inversion Mega Kangaskhan is just as broken as it always was

[@truthboom]

Sounds like a game tailored for Giratina Reverse World

[@lupusgirl64]

It's kind of interessting that the type dynamics of this feel similar to Gen 1 in a way with Normal, Psychic and to lesser extend Ice types being meta defining

[@smedgert1812]

It's so weird hearing it as kangas-can instead of kangaskhan

[@maggi98mw]

Especially because it is a play on Genghis Khan and should therefore be pronounced similar

[@a-s-greig]

Cane-Gas-Can?

[@smedgert1812]

@@maggi98mw no I think the kanga is from kangaroo or smth

[@maggi98mw]

@@smedgert1812 yes, kangaroo + genghis Khan. So you pronounce the kanga like in kangaroo and the khan like in Genghis Khan. Not that difficult

[@oscara1573]

Genghis Khan = female only 🤔

[@eliyaskiya]

Not exactly a metagame but I wanna see you talk about Random Battle Mayhem. It's combines Inverse Battles with the randomness of Random Battles with the chaoticity of a bunch of other mods ( Scalemons, Shared Power, & Camomons ).

[@djdrizzy9139]

It's my go-to meta. I enjoy the strategies you can make but sometimes you can't win against broken cores (especially Shadow tag, which isn't banned for some reason).

[@eliyaskiya]

@@djdrizzy9139 Same, it's really luck-based. There's just no winning some things unless your opponent is actually trash

[@PsychicJaylen]

So this means Psychic can actually deal with dark types like Incineroar, we are back to being resistant to ghost and we completely counter everything we previously were weak to. Fighting types can just be dealt with by using crunch, sucker punch etc so I don't really care about being weak to fighting.

[@bugorgans]

i think seeing 'it's super effective!' after seeing 'extreme speed' is cursed by itself

[@TornadoZX825]

funny how many bulky Ice-types we have despite the fact that Ice is an awful defensive type glad those bulky ice mons finally found a home

[@DrCoeloCephalo]

Did you know Yo-Kai Watch 3 for the Nintendo 3DS is a monster collector JRPG that has this meta as a counterplay option cuz the Yo-Kai Mython has a blanket effect Skill that inverses all elemental resistances and weaknesses? Immunities via Skills remain tho. Pretty cool, huh?

[@fortidogi8620]

yea that IS sick, ty for sharing

[@justingiesbrecht6969]

I had no idea that this format existed. And I'm so happy that Ice, my favorite type, is actually viable in it.

[@POKENAR]

Inverse Natdex Mega Sceptile sounds like it'd go hard, a now 4x weakness becomes an immunity.

[@edgargaebolg9307]

It becomes ×4 weak to Grass and Water, and would be ×4 weak to Electric too if it wasn't for Lightning Rod

[@entothechesnautknight1762]

Its funny how the thing that makes this metagame the most different has almost nothing to do with the inversion itself, and everything to do with immunities as a concept being gone.

[@Hello_World_not_taken]

Steel would be absolute dog water, and ghost and normal’d be swapped in their roles

[@junglecruiser4785]

Finally, a meta were bug can be freely spammed!

[@nishantdayama4558]

As far as I think of this meta, Normal, Grass and Psychic are insane, especially former and bug, poison and ice are great.

[@TLTheLegend]

Holy cow NDM and dialga having 10 weaknesses is insane

[@demi-femme4821]

Finally, a setting where Arceus would be as OP as the God of Pokémon ought to be.

[@Weavileiscool]

As a certified Ice type lover I love this format

[@Chibuga]

I still hope that one day they make an inverse room move.

[@Satanicks]

Surprised Gogoat hasn't carved out a niche for itself in this tier being Grass with Sap Sipper. Could easily do some interesting stuff here as a bulky HPwise attacker, considering it gets Milk Drink now and can set up with Bulk Up for more Defense and Attack and then clean house with Leaf Blade.

[@nowfelsajidkhan5165]

Of course Avalugg is busted in the Inverse format. They both debuted in the same game! It's like it was designed with this one time gimmick format in mind, and nothing else!

[@QwixLF]

Inverse battles are a criminally underused idea and I will not forgive GF for leaving the concept to rot in Gen 5 as a single gimmick fight in a random house. Should have been a standard function.

[@edgargaebolg9307]

6*

[@thoughtprism2963]

PorygonZ and Staraptor are both bonkers in this meta, among others

[@JohnHunterPlayerr]

The boost strat makes me think of iron defenses alolan muk in let's go. If you wait to bring it out behind a screen it can boost out of eq damage, and bricks most special mons 1v1 so minimize and rest against them... Crunch still can break thru most teams . Even resisted mons across from you.

[@John-yk4bp]

I played the random inverse format with a friend and my head hurt

[@silvesta5027]

This is the nerdiest thing I’ve ever watched. I enjoyed it though

[@harukaze7388]

this should've been Zygarde's ability

[@shimaumaaa]

So my GOAT glastrier is good now..?

[@TomAmit42]

There is theoretically another different way of making inverse macth-ups, where we'd still have immunities. Instead of inverting the *title* of each match-up ("Super effective" becomes "Not very effective" and vice-versa), We could invert the *direction* of each match-up, Example: [Ground is immune to Electric] becomes [Electric is immune to Ground]. This way, the game would fully maintain the total number of immunities.

[@dimensionvisitor7689]

bug and grass would be cracked offensively

[@rockowlgamer631]

I like inverse battle, probably one of my favorite gimmicks. Takes everything you would know and flip it on its head. If i had a fakemon region id literally make inverse battles my go to gimmick for the region

[@legitimatelycameron6294]

You *must* cover the most CHAD of all meta games next, the 1v1 Challenge Cup metagame

[@shiruotakuno28]

It's epic to see that my favorite Pokemon of all time (Maushold) was so good they had to be banned. Long live Normal types!!

[@_DayDreamR]

cool video, always wondered what inverse battles were and how the meta works :D

[@Sintra4]

I remember doing the inverse battle when I played Pokémon Y, and it weirded me out quite a bit more than I was expecting. Can't say I'm too surprised that there's people taking it seriously to this day, though. There're enough Pokémon fans for every minute detail in the franchise's history to have dedicated communities built around them. It's a little silly, I guess, but I personally think it's pretty neat.

[@lyoukeefen7199]

You can get normal immunity if you have a Pokémon with volt absorb use ion deluge/plasma fists. Not good for switching into normal moves, but once you’re in you force them to heal you

[@wraith4978]

now if we had this gimmick from gen 1 to now it would likely make the vanilla game a bit more balanced to really show how the type match-ups mean a lot. yes steel, fairy and dark had yet to exist, but most types were made in gen 1 and i like the idea of more type effective triangles that would just go in the other direction in inverse battles.

[@michabaron4129]

I remember checking out inverse battles back in gen 6 when i barely started playing competitive. I thought im a genius for putting together bunch of slow shitmons (like tropius and amaura) with little to no synergy and I got absolutely wrecked by very 'regular OU' looking teams. Good times.

[@pandosham]

Inverse Battles could be such a fun Battle Frontier (or equivalent) station

[@liamnelson9691]

I still remember the moment i send a Aegislash against a Snorlax the first time entering the Inverse House back in XY.

[@Elementroar]

Inverse battles having zero type immunities (except from abilities) is an interesting aspect too, makes it an inherently more aggressive metagame.

[@taylorevandale4261]

I like how the inverse battle’s meta sounds like Gen 1’s meta, which is dominated by Normal types (Psychics scared off the Fighting types which is why Normal is dominate).

[@luxlumine8602]

I have been yapping about this ages ago. Generation 10 should introduce new mechanic gimmick where a trainer can activate inverse field once the requirements are met where all type matchup are inverted. It's going to be a battle of wit and momentum, just like tera and dynamax. Except now all pokemon typing have the chance to shine

[@thejiggler7780]

a video on that weird evolutions metagame where pokemon all "evolve" again would be cool

[@Juanchoperez05]

Id love to see some random battle Mayhem. Maybe some gameplay in your other channel

[@Nosretep]

This would be great for a Battle Frontier.

[@jamesgiles4517]

Ah... so this is why Gamefreak keeps making bulky ice types...

[@SeonilKim-ry5lj]

I wonder how Little Cup feels like with this.

[@todmustache2884]

I feel like golisipod would be good in this format. Bug is the best offensive type in inverse, and golisipod gets a stab 90 bp priority move, on top of the stats to take advantage of it.

[@dativo1631]

Wait, Bug should be insane hitting everything for SE, why you didnt mention it ?

[@DaikoruArtwin]

If Normal type is such a powerful type, it sounds like Zeraora would be a powerful anti-meta Pokemon, with Volt Absorb and Plasma Fists to turn normal type moves into free heals.

[@henryalberts539]

Inverse battles as a whole have always been a Lot to wrap your head around, but I’ve always kinda wished there was a Pokemon or two that had an Ability that inverted their type chart.

[@matigamer329]

Is seriously nobory will talk about how good the bug type is?

[@PlayrR3D156]

1:36 Hey! That's my birthday!

[@Henkita2]

immunities should be inverted too, ground is immune to flying, electric is immune to ground, dragon is immune to fairy, and ghost and normal are still immune to each other

[@vgpharaoh1344]

isn't bug really good here too? I'd imagine volcarona could be really great as well actually couldn't it? It has bug type attacks, its got giga drain coverage, fire can hit a lot of the stuff one might use to resist bug such as other fire types super effectively in inverse... wouldn't some bugs like volcarona who were held back by their typing become rather great here too?

[@darktemplar446]

I wish there was a format to play with the Radical Red changes. That would be really interesting/fun.

[@bassman9261995]

I’d love to see a move like trick room that changes the battle into an inverse battle.

[@pielord177]

hear me out: Inverse battles but all pokemon have contrary (on top of their own ability) PURE INVERSE!

[@edgargaebolg9307]

Not inverse enough, you have to rework Fly, Dig and Dive's semi-invul turn, as well as reversing the weather effects

[@quiverdancervolca]

Do a vid on LGPE OU. It’s surprisingly interesting as it’s RBY with megas and alolan forms

[@JackLeighton-uh6sl]

You should 100% go over Shared Power, its a really interesting ability stacking metagame with so many funky bans.

[@carlnapolitano9314]

I’d love to see a video about the random battle mayhem format

[@HouYi-b6g]

guessing Brock in the Anime is an inverse battle gym leader. i remember his ground types getting ko'd by electric types.