The Liberal Escapism of Bridgerton

[@BroeyDeschanel]

This is one video where I'm gonna beg you guys to watch the full thing before you disagree with me haha, please!! (also sorry I know BIPOC and POC is redundant, got confused with the terminology!)

[@Kevin-rg3yc]

Watched it and agreed with all of your points I especially love your part on revisionist history your critique is the exact same critique I’ve had on Quinton Tarantino last two revisionist films (Django unchained and once upon a time in Hollywood)

[@k80_]

@@Kevin-rg3yc I feel that way with Tarantino as well. Like django/ once upon a time in Hollywood/ inglorious basterds are fun to watch if you don’t think about it, but if you turn on your brain and look at the themes you’re just like wait a second,,,,,

[@Kevin-rg3yc]

@@k80_ right I loved Django unchained for years and I thought quinton was a genius for taking slavery into a western but then I thought about the whole film and I’m like “ohh hell no this is not good”

[@jaydeehervey2145]

This is why I don't watch time piece periods, I mean is there even one movie, ever made that is 100% accurate?!

[@BroeyDeschanel]

@Malachi Bines The Black characters/actors in this show are not American, which is why I use the wider term of "BIPOC".

[@leelizard7738]

I think “colorblind” casting can work in historical inspired fantasy settings when it’s made clear it’s a fantasy setting bc otherwise it rly comes off as rewriting history esp when there’s social issues at the heart of the story.

[@KC-ep6sg]

Right? If it's a fantasy setting there's no need for an explanation, you could just have a diverse set of cast and characters and just let them... exist. Sounds pretty nice to me

[@adesolaoghenekevwe7264]

Exactly they from the onset said it's a make believe world ...

[@saf4433]

@@KC-ep6sg I don't think giving no explanation is a good thing for the world building of the fantasy setting but it's not that hard to just explain it as "in this fantasy world, humans aren't as shitty"

[@solarcowgirl]

I think it’s why Hamilton worked so well. They didn’t address their own races because almost all of them were white, and they few that did were played by black people, because they were actually black!

[@als2480]

Or at the very least a period inspired AU, and not in our world.

[@wildcosmia5018]

It's so frustrating that 'period piece' means almost exclusively a regency or victorian American/British setting. History is vast and complex yet we keep reusing the same five sets over and over again

[@antoniacapellaborges6566]

@Charisma Girl girl hush 🙄 nobody cares about that. She didn’t mean it in that sense, she meant presenting other time periods from other cultures than shoving "Britannia" down our throats.

[@emi-ts1ko]

we can have the regency era but in Africa or the dynasty period in China or Japan but it's always focused on Europe 🙄

[@antoniacapellaborges6566]

@@emi-ts1ko unless I’m wrong, I don’t think there was a regency period in the whole Continent tho...it’s a continent girl....there’s no single country nor ethnicities from North to South to West and East. The closest to a political regency would’ve be in the late 17th century in Kongo kingdom but this one is more bloody than cute 😭

[@emi-ts1ko]

@@antoniacapellaborges6566 i'm not talking about the regency but the period i mean during 1800

[@antoniacapellaborges6566]

@@emi-ts1ko ahh...sorry then. It’s because you wrote "the regency era but in Africa" that’s what confused me. My bad

[@angryowl5972]

To Bridgerton, racial assimilation is preferred over cultural pluralism.

[@chaoticfreshman_draws]

Thisssss is all I was thinking

[@mayas3422]

exactly!!

[@noellesydney8495]

EXACTLY !

[@matcha.clouds]

The world is stressful. I just want to enjoy hot people in ridiculously lush outfits.

[@cory9268]

Yes.... that is the point. Literally, that is the point of the show. It's a wish-fulfillment fantasy regency novel produced by Shonda Rhimes. I get the feeling yall don't really watch Shondaland shows or read regency novels. I like critical discourse, but one should also understand the point and context of the media you're consuming.

[@isaacleguin2171]

Oh god, that "Love Conquers All" scene made every cell in my body cringe, it's so uncomfortable to hear black-white race relations described in the same terms as, like, elves and dwarves or sth. Augh, who would decide to do that over a Hamilton sort of situation or a simple "racism has never existed in this universe" AU??? Surely this has all of the same downsides and more!

[@mainchannel1566]

Netflix made a movie called "Bright" that describes race relations in the same terms as dwarves and elves. Literally. The movie has dwarves and elves living in near future Los Angeles.

[@maximeteppe7627]

​@@mainchannel1566 TBH, with a good writer, (or writers plural), such a setting could have great potential (fantastical race in a modern setting is nice twist on the usual fantasy tropes- shadowrun has been and still is a popular setting)... it's just that having fantastical race relations on top of the real ones is going to be at least as, if not more complex, as just dealing with the real thing and requires someone who knows what they're talking about.

[@danyms4082]

@@mainchannel1566 Bright could have been great if it actually looked at how typical fantasy cultures developed into the modern day, instead they just dropped them into LA and coded orcs as black and elves as rich white people.

[@matcha.clouds]

Given that it was only one stupid, poorly thought out scene I just don’t think about it. It doesn’t make sense with the rest of the show at all especially the amount of time that would need to pass for everyone to have land and titles and money and all this stuff. It feels like something that they tossed around as an idea and someone secretly edited the scene in so now they can’t take it back.

[@roseclouds5838]

@@mainchannel1566 the way Bright had white and black people live among elves and dwarfs was so weird though it’s even centred on will smith and his sidekick (an orc) as cops

[@dominican5683]

I really liked the show....BUT I really wish it were presented as a fairy tale vs an alternate version of reality as they never expanded on that enough to make sense in the real world. This could have been so good if it were explained as just fantasy...because we know that racism is very real and you cannot just rewrite history to make money...thats how you end up with future generations of ignorant people who believe racism never existed in the past and anyone still suffering or benefiting from that past can be explained away as nonsense.

[@luer2202]

What a beautiful thought: imagine one day everyone has forgotten about racism! It would immediately stop. Everyone would be treated as individuals without prejudice, no matter the visual appearance. Nothing to worry about for people with color. Nothing to be scared of. Nothing to fight against. Just the peace we desperately need. We can only change the reality, by imagine a better one. Bridgerton made an awesome step in the right direction 🙏

[@antoniacapellaborges6566]

@@luer2202 are you nut?! Stfu! That’s NOT how real life works! Only a privileged person could be spewing this nonsense 🤦🏾‍♀️ and then what? Are YOU suddenly going to help ALL those poor countries terrorized by Western backed despots? Are Westerners now going to care enough to ACTUALLY go and do something to their leaders? I guess not -.-

[@luer2202]

@@antoniacapellaborges6566 thank you for your "respectful" tone and "not" Being judging. I am obviously a Person of color. I'm deeply mixed with nationalities you probably didn't even know they can coexist. But let's forget about that fact. I'm a optimistic person. And I I know very well, that in the moment I feel as a victim, I give the power to those who enjoy being suppressive. I'm not doing that and I feel good about it. If I would go through the world with my discrimination glasses I would completely feel like shit 24/7. Why should I do that to my precious soul? I am not my skin color. I haven't even an ethnicity, since I'm a mix of 7 nationalities and four religions. I am a soul and I see people as souls and I wanna be seen as a soul. That's why I loved Bridgerton,because for the first time I was seeing souls acting and not stereotypes ethnicities and a bad, boring historic novel... Because that's what Bridgerton would have been without the diverse cast: boring! Sometimes I feel like people are enjoying it to fight against something, to feel miserable, by searching in every non existing conor just to point the finger and say: "Ha! There is it! A sparkle of racism! This whole story is racism! Boycott it otherwise you're a racist too!" Even in a serie where there is awarely no supression of colored people, where supresst people are lifted up. Black people being racists against their own race! How absurd is that? Producer's are trying to finally give everyone a real chance and still they can only do it wrong by doing so. Even without the conversation between the Duke and his aunt, you would find other things to feel discriminated about. Imagine the shitstorm if they would have done it historicaly correct! You would complain anyways! Probably didn't even watched it, because there is no one you can identify with! I loved to see black people being empowered. I love to see people in upper class roles, I could finally identify with. As I enjoyed black Panther. I wanna see more of it, because it helps me and society to imagine a world without thinking about black people as the weaker ones. And I believe that those stories and movies are exactly the thing we desperately needed the most. Thanks for reading till here. Wish you a lovely day ❤

[@antoniacapellaborges6566]

@@luer2202 I won’t even waste my time reading that 🧹 "POC" could literally be anything! It’s an umbrella term MANY Black folks aren’t in accordance with. You and I (and multiple black people) don’t share the same life experiences. I will NOT coddle you! What you wrote was pure BS! And obviously comes from a place of privilege not "races" that you’re supposedly mixed with 🙄. I don’t give a shit if you liked Black Panther I BLACK/AFRICAN Woman did not! Stop detracting. Religion is not an ethnicity dummy, you can’t be "7" religious affiliations unless you’re an active adherent of each 🤦🏾‍♀️ which makes no sense. Again outside your Kumbaya fantasy do YOU do smtg about the oppression the Southern Hemisphere is experiencing -.-?

[@antoniacapellaborges6566]

@@luer2202 it has NOTHING to do with "seEiNg YouSElf As A viCtIm"ttchipzz... no you’re an idiot. One of those Voltaire wrote about 🤦🏾‍♀️ we’re not in Lassie or a movie. Go tell poor Black/Brown people in the Southern Hemisphere that they need to be POsiTivE and they’re in their predicament by their own devices

[@georgier9151]

I love the sentiment that "not everything has to be serious, but that doesn't mean it can't be thoughtful". It would be great to get a show like bridgerton which papers through the cracks and actually does the work necessary to have joyful escapism, without any hollowness of representation.

[@sircalifornia]

Definitely agree with your take on Hamilton. I get that it's a great piece of art and all, but something about a black Alexander Hamilton rapping to us about history without a whisper about slavery just seems... off.

[@aaronrivera6732]

No to millions of people.

[@milk_bath]

“A polite fiction” is a quote I’ve read to describe Hamilton that rang true to me.

[@JaserJas]

Lin Manuel Miranda isn't black I don't think? So that's also something that made me feel wierd about Hamilton too.

[@knivves0ut]

@@JaserJas exactly! It’s like you don’t get to rehabilitate these historical figures lin

[@ifeeltiredsleepy]

There are several mentions of slavery in the play though. John Laurens mentions his goal to emancipate the slaves many times in the first Act. And Hamilton criticizes Jefferson in the second Act for his support of slavery.

[@bubbles4897]

The fact that they had no time to delve into race but had all the time to delve into gender relations is very much giving me “white feminist that thinks interracial relationships conquer all”

[@corydk4834]

Speaking of White Feminist, the reveal of lady whistle down is seen as a positive thing, a female writer who has a lot of power. However, I just find it terribly weird that the writers give a pass for lady whistle down to uphold the problematic views of that time period just because she happens to be a woman doing it.

[@bubbles4897]

@@corydk4834 lol especially a white woman, who came after a biracial black woman’s pregnancy at that. just a load of bull.

[@angelazayn4878]

@@bubbles4897 So True I despised Penelope so much after I found out it was her. She destroyed Marina's life over a crush that wasn't even reciprocated.

[@ilincabogza]

@@angelazayn4878 True! I mean it was really bad that she was going to trick him so i know she felt bad for someone she knew all her life but i tought this whole thing happened as a plot device to show that her actual lover was alive. Now seeing how it ends up it's very fucked up.

[@matcha.clouds]

@@angelazayn4878 Marina made her bed. It’s no ones fault but her own when she had to lie in it.

[@Damelady]

Yeah as a black British woman who really enjoyed Bridgerton this is probably the one time I wish they kept race out of it 😂. Like we’re really meant to believe in this age of hyper colonialism that race would just get overlooked, cause of love? Also the fact that some kind of domino effect would happen to every other POC just because black people happen to be on top now?

[@BlackLikeInque]

@Charisma Girl So most of the Black speaking characters are clearly biracial so I'm guessing for them it was passed down on their white side which is....wow...okay. That ignores a lot

[@mchjsosde]

@Charisma Girl idk how much you know about race back then, but if you had any black heritage that was the only heritage that mattered. The concept of biracialness wasn't really a thing. If you could pass as white you were white and if you couldn't you were just as black as any fully black person

[@BlackLikeInque]

@Charisma Girl I googled it. Most of them are biracial which is cool. But when most of your Black representation takes the lightest, phentotypically more ambiguous and less overtly Afrocentric featured performers you can find, that's a problem. When the only dark skinned character in the film is a villain, that's a problem. The conceit of this show introduces way more questions and problematic things than it tries to assuage. Not all forms of Blackness are treated the same. Cardi B and Meg Thee Stallion are great examples of how two women who may be considered 'Black' receive incredibly different treatment based on how that Blackness is presented. To ignore that is harmful. Also this show pretends as if all of the racial tensions that existed previously disappeared. But it has a very intense focus on gender. Yet the racial issues are almost wholly ignored. It's bad world building. If they had simply just never brought it up that almost would work better in regard to the actual premise. I also find it incredibly interesting that the non white characters exist almost entirely as love interests to white characters. Apparently none of this nouveau riche Black folk care for one another very much

[@andrea-ns6vq]

@@mchjsosde but that’s perpetuating a racist ideology??? why would you continue the one drop rule?

[@LM-ix7pk]

@@mchjsosde biracialness was always a thing, just not in British territories. In Spanish colonies, biracial people were recognized as mixed and as part of both races.

[@MakedaPhillips]

I watched BLACK VENUS while watching Bridgerton. It's the story of Sarah Baartman, a black woman whose life of was filled with violence and exploitation during the rrgency period. The stark contrast of real biographical black women and made up black women who serve as the best black friend, the comedic relief, and backbone without much nuance is real.

[@LM-ix7pk]

Bridgeton never went out of their way to make an historically accurate drama. It was made clear that the show wouldn’t stay strict to the times. Even the fashion is not periodically correct. I don’t know why anyone would watch Bridgeton as an realistic representation

[@MakedaPhillips]

@@LM-ix7pk Why did you post this under my comment? Are you disagreeing with me?

[@LM-ix7pk]

@@MakedaPhillips I mean, I can comment if I want. And no, I’m not disagreeing with what you say. I just don’t understand why you are equating a drama that never set itself up to be historically accurate to be as periodically correct to Black Venus, an historical movie about an actual person that existed.

[@MakedaPhillips]

@@LM-ix7pk It's because they decided to try to make it diverse without it being colorblind. They very deliberately casted actors in regards to color (i.e the families of the same being all white or all black or mixed, unlike Cinderella where the mom is black the dad is white and the kid is Asian). In addition, as discussed in this video essay, episode 4 acknowledges that in this world slavery or some form if oppression did exist until "a king fell in love with us" which is highly problematic. They want to have their cake and eat it too. To include some diversity, mostly for clout or virtue signaling and for profit, acknowledge the effects of slavery, colonialism and imperialism, while also failing to explore those themes within the show. It's lazy writing, and it's tokenism.

[@ennasf9419]

could you link it to me ? i cant seem to find it anywhere

[@TheBlackCinephile]

This is a different perspective on Bridgerton that I haven't been exposed to, so thank you! Hollywood wants to pat itself on the back for showing racism in a film, but also doesn't want to shake the table by showing a more complex depiction of how racism actually is. Race is almost always shown in a palatable way in the media. I'm not sure if we'd ever see a widely-released/highly publicized film or TV show that addresses racial history/racial themes in a way that isn't extremely simplified I really loved the font you used for your title cards :)

[@BroeyDeschanel]

Such a good point!! and thank you :) the font is "Glimmer of Light"!

[@jtzoltan]

Have you watched "The Wire"? If so, what did you think?

[@Crawlingdreams418]

Have you watched X (with Denzel Washington) and The Rosa Parks Story? The former was very interesting, considering how they touched on him.

[@amanshah8864]

black sails is a show that talks pretty intelligently about race/colonialism/the horrors of imperialism if you're ever looking for something to watch (tw // multiple SA scenes in s1 but it gets significantly better)

[@saccharinesilk]

"everyone loves it" [fashion history youtube disliked that]

[@saf8514]

lol exactly the corset tightlacing scenes too I just threw up looking at that bs

[@MsFairymusic]

Mina haha

[@NataliaNNS]

That’s so true hahaha

[@blackhare1346]

Yess hahahaha

[@keetard]

Frock flicks who are actually quite vocal on the bad costuming bs actually like the aesthetic and the execution...so

[@sophie7780]

the idea that a king marrying a black woman would erase racism is so horribly out of touch. we've seen how a biracial woman has been treated after marrying into the british royal family, and racism is unfortunately still alive and well

[@daphnehuari4655]

Could not agree with you more. If Meghan Markle was so viciously targeted in 2020 then how could we be expected to believe that one royal marriage in the regency era could completely transform society? Please.

[@Sleipnirseight]

THANK YOU. Honestly, poor fucking Meghan. Her treatment has been ridiculous

[@enfleuri]

So true! Some people are so out of touch with reality.

[@hannaheve868]

It's also an idea that fails to properly humanise black people as a collective in the show. As established by the main plot, we can see that marriages are often shallow and either money or lust-based. In my opinion this plot-line reduces black people (not the main characters, but black people as a collective, or at least black women) to beautiful props, because at the time that's what many women were reduced to when being selected for marriage. I really don't know how to word it, but that's how it made me feel. Like because one king had the hots for a black woman racism = over? Black people are more than just being attractive prospects to white people. But that background plot never goes any further than that. And with the real world's long history of white men over-sexualising and having affairs with black women (historically without their consent) it seems... off.

[@vikthya1711]

it's right up there with someone insisting that having a black president ended racism in the U.S. and there was no white supremacist backlash at all. 🙄

[@noorjehan86]

The character of Eloise was also a major example of the shows failure at making social commentary. She spends the entire series complaining about how her life is hard bc she doesn’t want to get married, she has multiple moments that think are meant to be “girl boss” moments where she schools the men in her life about how hard it is to me a woman, but every time it made me cringe. the show completely ignores her class privilege. Unlike the other girls in the series, Eloise could actually AFFORD not to marry but the show was so committed to making women the most oppressed members of the society. It felt so tone deaf and I was so surprised when it turned out she was a fan favorite.

[@NataliaNNS]

I found her character super annoying, as she was basically just a feminist wannabe trope that didn’t seem to have much charcthter other than that. I’m also surprised to hear she’s a fan favorite 😅

[@als2480]

Not just that, how she treated the more traditional women in her life.... That's not feminism. That's elitism.

[@Me-ss2gq]

I saw this perspective from one of my friends, and while I definitely see your point, I respectfully disagree. I think while at first glance she seems it, Eloise is much more than a stereotypical feminist character. I heavily related to her fear of not living up to her older sister's glory; I loved how her need to find Whistledown ended up seriously hurting one of her only true friendships; and I thought that her anger at the plight of being a woman was perfectly understandable for her age. I mean I know that I was angry at anything and everything as a teenager realising that I was basically bottom of the barrel. But I also DEFINITELY see how she could have been better written, and understand why people might find her cringe. I just personally didn't see it that way and wanted to give my perspective :)

[@noorjehan86]

@@Me-ss2gq I totally see your point! I definitely think a lot of people related to her and I thought her relationships with daphne and Penelope had the most potential. Her fight scene with Penelope was one of the best scenes but I wish her arc was better written. It was just so jarring how she would talk about marriage and ambition like she was a millennial in 2018 and not a young aristocrat from the regency era. It’s fine that she doesn’t want to get married but her arc should have been about gaining perspective on her privilege and life situation but they never really followed through. I could see them writing her better in the later seasons tho.

[@mariahmorgan469]

Omg I couldn’t have said this more perfect 🥺👏🏾

[@lena_pythia]

I generally liked Bridgerton, assuming it was a fictional world. But when the "love fixes racism" scene came up I was super confused. There was no previous signs of race related struggles or any mention of it previous to that scene. The characters all seemed absolutely oblivious to the concept of race entirely. Racism doesn't completely disappear with one royal marriage as we've seen time and time again in real life history. So it seemed completely random and unthoughtful to throw that concept into a single scene and then never talk of it again.

[@HoldinContempt]

If love conquers racism then why are the most violent, abusive and dysfunctional relationships always interracial ones?

[@alexemy221]

Wonder how many issues like this could be avoided more easily if we stopped writing period pieces exclusively about the ruling class who were most responsible for the inequalities

[@angelikaskoroszyn8495]

But, but they wore cool dresses

[@CT_Phipps]

I mean, no one wants to fantasize about being an oppressed servant girl.

[@alexemy221]

People fantasise about whatever you put in front of them if you write it well

[@geniesRus]

Based

[@lsamoa]

Good point

[@presidenttogekiss635]

Another thing that the show ignores is the fact that George would be the first white nobleman to fall in love with a woman of color. Plenty of Conquistadors and colonial masters fell in love with native and black women. But they didn´t magically end all the systems of opression for them. If anything, at best, they would make "exceptions" in the rules for them, which is how you get slave owning people of color in places like Brazil, Haiti and Louisiana. In fact, this was the norm for nobility in the past, even before colonialism. If a king fell in love with a peasent girl, he could make her lot in life better, but he defenetly wouldn´t free all her family from servitude.

[@heatheredgcombe3156]

Bridgerton was really weird for me. At first I thought it was a blind casting. I loked the idea that black people could just exist in a historical drama without their race being the subject. Their presence didnt need to be justified. It got really weird when I realized that their race was a point of contention in their universe

[@sseraphim2818]

*biracial, light skinned people

[@machuverigjummai4484]

​@@sseraphim2818😂 there were black, dark skinned people in the show too.

[@KillahMate]

14:45 Worth mentioning that Paul Atreides (Timothy's character) in Dune is the lead but not what one would call a hero, and the story recognizes him as the oppressor. This aspect is _so_ easy to lose when adapting the book, and I _really_ hope it's preserved - Paul is a White Savior _within_ the actual story, and though he didn't quite make himself that, he lives in a society which has weaponized the trope. He may be a 'good person' within his boundaries, but he is also part of the nobility of his universe, with everything that that entails. His family is victimized by the politics of the moment, but even when associating with the 'common folk' he remains defined as resolutely _upper class_ by the way he both wittingly and unwittingly exploits the people around him - people who he genuinely considers his friends. That Dune not just pays attention to this but does it on purpose is part of the reason why it is the story that it is, instead of just some warmed-over planetary romance. Also this is usually the first thing to get lost whenever someone tries to adapt it ☹

[@lsamoa]

Spot on. At the same time Dune is problematic in its own way, using a ton of Arabic symbols and cultural references without ever acknowledging them.

[@twofriendsreact]

Yes to both of these comments! Herbert was very intentionally criticizing the White Savior trope, along with Western imperialism and the exploitation of indigenous resources and cultures (and of course, the inevitable corruption of power). His decision to so heavily integrate real Islamic and Middle Eastern cultures into a fantasy one (in an attempt to make clear the analogy of spice to oil) was a poor choice, though.

[@alittlepotato546]

I really disliked the sex scene where she raped him in a sense. Their relationship is dreadful and I really don't find the characters that interesting. They are very superficial. I also couldn't believe that just because a white king (because of course it's a white man that makes everything better 😩) fell in love with an Asian woman that racism just vanished. I wished it was just a fantasy or something. It was okay but it isn't amazing...

[@mchjsosde]

@Charisma Girl take a breath

[@ilincabogza]

True! I mean i found the series entertaining but all the characters where half assed and i felt no emotional attachment to them. Really, the basic feminist trope? Nothing even to make her stand up from this cliche? Nothing wrong with feminists in period dramas, they are my favourit trope, but this was done only for brownie points. The only reason it could be cool was for the romance. And it had potential with all those fanfic fave tropes but they also disn't execute it well enough, wasted potential. Anyway, they messed that up now, with the rape scene. Nothing shippable about that anymore.

[@ilincabogza]

@Charisma Girl but this show is supposed to be fantasy girl. Do you really think a feminist girl could act like dephne's sister? Or that a boxer could be invited to a noble's wedding? This isn't supposed to match the year presented, but our valors right now incorporeted in that setting. If this was a serious peeiod drama it would make sense but even there it would have to be presented in a certain light to evidentiate her lack of knowledge but not presented as if she is right in her fury. And omg thats victim blaming. Ofc he was stronger but that doesnt justufy what she did. Maybe he was shocked, maybe something else. It doesn't matter. It was obviously meant to illustrate her tricking him and tacking advantage of him.

[@alittlepotato546]

@Charisma Girl Just because it was different during that time it doesn't make it okay. I'm really confused by your arguments. All I'm saying is that I felt that the sex scene where in my opinion she rapes him is highly disturbing and it wasn't addressed at all. Plus, when you're being raped sometimes you're completely in shock that you can't move so weight doesn't matter. Plus, I stated that their relationship was dreadful meaning they are both very unlikeable and the way he acts with here is also disturbing

[@ilincabogza]

@Charisma Girl we are not talking of the books though! The tv show is definetly a fantasy otherwise it is completely unacceptable tge way pocs where treated. It's already bad wnough but that....would be marginally worse. The series in itself is meant to give exactly what people in our days value as important. That's why the characters where bland and only meant to represent some of our modern day ideas. Why do you think eloise was only defined by her feminism? No nuance, no context, no personality, nothing. Just the obligatory dose of white woman feminism that the modern viewer would want to insert. You can show some nuance of female rebellion or desire for feminism but do it with nunace, even if it is a fantasy! Otherwise just bad writing. So yeah this show is supposed to show our modern day morals. And even so they could have shown how the unconsensual act was complex and all the consequences of that. Instead it was just daphne s anger and that's all. And please read my comment again about how that could have been done in a historical drama too, but ot is important how.

[@TheSneezefreak]

As a Puertorican myself, I see the cracks within Lin Manuel Mirandas' treatment of Hamilton as this sort of confusion experienced by a lot of Puerto Ricans' speicifcally within the diaspora. He says he "relates to the immigrant narrative" even though people from Puertorico have been recognized citizens since 1917. People (usually not always) in the diaspora have a very detached attitude towards race, instead focusing on national identity rather racial, but they tend to never fill the void left by a lack of racial identity. So Hamilton being the way it is, doesn't surprise me.

[@NankitaBR]

"Queen Charlotte has the best costumes" they are beautiful.... Except they are about 60 years out of fashion for the time of the show....

[@charlieparker5346]

She made people wear weird half out of date, half blended with modern tends monstrosities to court because she was kind of old fashioned like that, so that's probably accurate. Have you seen regency court gowns? They're awful 🤣

[@NankitaBR]

@@charlieparker5346 no, court dresses were the way they were because they *had* to be different from "normal" dresses, because people that were not invited to the court were literally forbidden to wear court dresses, even if they could afford them. It was not because she was "out of fashion", it was for the nobles to prove they were different from everybody else. She herself very often didn't wear "court dresses", this were just dresses that people had to wear in front of her on formal occasions. But that's beside the point, because her dresses on the show were based on normal dresses of about 60 years before, not on court dresses of the time. Those were the dresses she *could* be using when she was literally a child. So she wouldn't be wearing those dresses one way or another.

[@amelialalllalala3914]

I thought that was because of her husband

[@valleryshakira]

@@amelialalllalala3914it is

[@EpwnaExeter]

Bridgerton strikes me as a show that tried to be anti-racist but ended up being assimilationist.

[@purplelove3666]

And colorist lol

[@joshjonson2368]

What you think victorian england is meant to be tolerant and multicultural? Lol

[@leahalexander6847]

@@joshjonson2368 Regency Era. The Victorian Era happened 17 years after the Regency Era.

[@joshjonson2368]

@Dilligent Yeoman go to space and stare into the abyss, until the cries of the head voices have finally being deciphered 😏

[@joshjonson2368]

@Dilligent Yeoman being sober is for consoomers

[@katherinealvarez9216]

2:37 yeah, I wondered about that. I mean, if they want to do alternate history, fine, they were already kind of doing it, but why did they provide that as the explanation? How did that change things?

[@georgier9151]

Completely! If you're going to have a jonbar point, don't just half heartedly go "love conquers all", when love didn't conquer all in reality (if we treat the theory that Queen Charlotte was a poc as fact). As suggested in the video, going all in on no slave trade at all, and diverting from our timeline much earlier, might have led to the more AU tone that they were clearly going for.

[@katherinealvarez9216]

@@georgier9151 personally, I think they're selling a fairytale version of events, covering up the fact that a lot of opportunities were taken and a lot of politics were going on to abolish slavery sooner in England and set up the king and queen. But honestly, I think I'm putting more thought into this universe than the writers and showrunnwr did.

[@SuperDoNotWant]

God I hate Hamilton. Per Current Affairs magazine: "The musical flatters both right and left sensibilities. Conservatives get to see their beloved Founding Fathers exonerated for their horrendous crimes, and liberals get to have nationalism packaged in a feel-good multicultural form." Real black people are erased from the narrative. Apropos of your commentary on Bridgerton: "The actual racial injustices of our time will continue unabated, but the power structure will be diversified so that nobody feels quite so bad about it. Hamilton is simply this tendency’s cultural-historical equivalent; instead of worrying ourselves about the brutal origins of the American state, and the lasting economic effects of those early inequities, we can simply turn the Founding Fathers black and enjoy the show."

[@will8647]

Also love how literally love how they wanted to tell a story about diverse America and instead of writing about BIPOC historical figures they literally erase actual historical figures and make a show idolizes slave owners and never once mentions indegenous people.

[@DidixGil]

@@will8647 Exactly! I was absolutely jaw-dropped at the fact that they never bring up Indigenous peoples.

[@anteaterhands]

@@will8647 this show is literally set in England not America 🙄

[@timastimeline]

I agree with your comment completely except for the first line only because Hamilton is also a really great work of art that did give a stage to many POC actors in the Broadway world. Because of Lin Manuel Miranda (with who I also have separate issues), Hamilton was also able to bring awareness to Puerto Rican issues. It's hard for me to completely throw it away when I see all the good it does.

[@DidixGil]

@@anteaterhands He's talking about Hamilton, not Bridgerton.

[@KerrySunny]

“If we keep buying it we’ll continue to need a reason to escape” literally broke my brain. Actually mind blown I never thought of this. Great essay.

[@sharontafoya2878]

All I’m asking for is a period piece based on the Mali empire. It would be so dope! Come on!

[@anguavonubervald7539]

I've never slammed the thumbs up button so fast in my life. GIMME MANSA MUSA MAYBE?

[@unfazedjae2645]

We need Mali, Benin, Kongo, Berbers, Amhara! I need films/series based on em

[@OkurkaBinLadin]

Truth is, Mali Empire would never appeal to the white liberal crowd, because no "self insert" characters. It is not entirely about race either. Pre-modern empire builders were all tough dudes. I can already hear the WOKE tards screeching at watching actual strong, self-assured characters.

[@michaelclayton7945]

@@anguavonubervald7539 or film series about these historical figures. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piye en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taharqa en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amanirenas en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qalidurut

[@michaelclayton7945]

@@unfazedjae2645 Nubia is by far the most underrated African civilisation.

[@Kevin-rg3yc]

This revisionist history for escapism fantasy is literally the type of reason why I’ve grown to dislike quinton Tarantino’s last revisionist films Django unchained and once upon a time in Hollywood. It’s like why take such a unforgettable historical era that was basically a Holocaust a certain marginalized group and make it into a faux interracial fantasy and makes it worst, refuses to take accountability for playing a part of continuing to erase the history of those marginalized groups? Idk I did like bridgerton for the first like 3 episodes but when the colorism hit me in the second episode Simon’s father I gave myself a big sign and knew I was getting into something that was toxic and problematic

[@marinettedorien8236]

Yeah I thought Brigerton was aiming to be a fantasy, as the costumes were not too accurate and neither were the beauty standards (Penelope would have had a lot of suitors as back then you would have been views as very attractive, the actress is gorgeous nowadays but back then having a fuller frame was considered desirable) I thought the show was just going for a pretty romance but then they threw in some half baked ideas about race which they should have fully covered or not mentioned

[@Kevin-rg3yc]

@@marinettedorien8236 right when you are a fantasy with colorblind casting there is no mention of race at all so seeing that episode ruined it only for the creator to say the diverse casting is done on purpose, that was a let down and it kinda made me not be excited for the series as I was initially was

[@marinettedorien8236]

@@Kevin-rg3yc yeah after the reveal that there was still racism in brigerton I was expecting a bigger plot point about racism. You either have to go for it and address it or ignore and pretend that it is set in almost a parallel universe

[@roxanartventures]

at least in django it’s clear that it’s a fairytale don’t you think? it is a bit blaxploitation ish and it’s awkward for lack of better term because it’s made by a white man. as a foreigner i never thought that it revised history or something .

[@marinettedorien8236]

@@roxanartventures yeah I saw django as a fantasy, it’s still a blaxploitation but I don’t think it was meant to be a ‘this is how it wouldn’t have gone’

[@PayondeAwsome]

Still haven't seen the show, I just feel like I'll be missing out if I miss a video, you know. Glad I did, this is very well made and informative.

[@yellowcrocs9000]

the more tv shows i watch the more i've come to realise i hate it when they're apolitical. i love history and i love it when a show talks about a topic that many historians like to pretend didn't exist back then like racial diversity and varied sexuality but i hate when shows act like everything was fine and dandy when it has the opportunity to tell a much more nuanced story, obviously bridgerton is meant to be fantastical but the acknowledgment of race just felt like a last minute decision. I recommend Harlots and Black Sails if anyone else feels the same as me.

[@katfujioka212]

The movie Belle (2013) is also really good, and a bit more realistic/political than Bridgerton in terms of race relations in England (though 1700s rather than 1800s). It’s still very cinematic but combines commentary on the racism and sexism of the time :’)

[@yellowcrocs9000]

@@katfujioka212 is that the one with gugu mbatha-raw in? ive been meaning to watch that for a while now

[@chillandrelax348]

Haven’t watched the show, and had no idea this was happening... but glad to be here nonetheless

[@kat8559]

Netflix thinks that if enough people watch it, it's good. That's why I didn't watch it.

[@kat8559]

I /really/ hope we start moving away from ahistorical fiction written by white people or lin manuel miranda

[@nbucwa6621]

I feel like this is a double-edged sword because if people don't watch it netflix certainly does not assume that its bad writing or bad execution but that people must not like diverse casts and just reduces the amount of diverse shows they fund. This is often why female-led movies or poc-led movies aren't/weren't made by big networks/production companies. It takes more than not watching unfortunately, it takes speaking up about the specific reasons you are not watching. . .and even then it has to become a big deal or they still don't notice.

[@NaomiVirshbo]

@@kat8559 Ah yes, the two races, white people and Lin Manuel Miranda 😂

[@GrainneMhaol]

You expressed this better than I could. People don't like criticism of their fave period dramas and their problematic aspects. I would argue that colourblind casting of this type erases historical injustices and the heinous brutality perpetrated under the British Empire. But hey, pretty costumes, right?

[@luer2202]

Well yes... Pretty costumes work in our society, where people are living in Instagram, love watching perfect pictures of perfect persons, perfect outfits, perfect things and perfect locations, where people are spending plenty of money to decorate their Instagram accounts with pretty photos, even if plastic surgery is needed. So yes. It's all about optical pleasure and this is totally fine in my eyes...

[@Mazadepizza]

@@luer2202 shows can look pretty and fashionable and not undermine racial issues... you may be fine with it but you also shouldn't encorage it

[@randomthoughts0829]

Genuine question; should all stories that have multiple people of color HAVE to touch on race and racism? Is it not enough to allow people of color stories where they can be the heroes? If people don't want to touch on race, should they just write all white characters? Isnt this the exact thing people DONT want?

[@GrainneMhaol]

@@randomthoughts0829 Because it wasn't me that brought race and racism into it, it was the show. The whole scene between Simon and Lady Dansbury where they retcon history. The whole 'We were two separate societies, divided by color, until a king fell in love with one of us. Love, Your Grace, conquers all' line. If they wanted to create post-racial fantasy, then why did the show have to justify itself?

[@randomthoughts0829]

@@GrainneMhaol you still didn't answer the question. Even if they don't bring race into it, you would have probably criticized bridgerton for not bringing race into the show and pretending like everything is okay. I've seen that critique so many times. So where do we draw the line?

[@paperlionkid1787]

I discovered your channel a few months ago. I really enjoy your content. Keep up the good work and I hope you'll continue to grow on the platform.

[@MariaCJ]

While I really enjoyed Bridgerton the flaws were just so needless. I would've much preferred that would have been handled as Cinderella, OR gone with more of the history of the situation How would this new, elevated class of Black Britons interacted with the institution of slavery? They tried to have it both ways and that just does not work. Further, it's not as diverse as folks make it out to be. There are far more white characters than any others, and only one Asian person has an actual line. The colorism is an issue and Marina, the only young BW with a significant role is that of strife.

[@purplelove3666]

Marina is not black.i am going to really need people to try their best to use every cell of their brain to know that biracial IS NOT BLACK

[@ashleysimmons31]

@@purplelove3666 exactly ! biracial does not equal black

[@Dom-fx4kt]

@@ashleysimmons31 Tell that to all these Americans saying being 10% black makes them black

[@kahkah1986]

Historically, there were men oc in the British parliament dramatically early, from the middle of the 18th century, as these were the sons of people who were involved in the slave trade, it was normal to put sons/ illegitimate sons in positions of power to try and get ahead 'dynastically', although much rarer for them to be of colour. I want to see a TV series that tells their story, although I feel like it would struggle with the honesty angle, it would try and make them into the figures we would have liked them to be rather than the people they were, this is the curse of a lot of 18th century drama. I thought Bridgerton was going to be it but it just isn't that show, alas.

[@saf8514]

also I can’t even bare to look at this shown after they just showed a rape scene and glossed over it. totally disgusting

[@applejuice29]

lit rally !!!!

[@sun_yu_lu]

broey, this is SO well made! you really know your shit and approach all your critiques with a lot of care. i’m sure these take a while to it together and i want you to know that your voice is needed! more of the video essay girls need to be discussing neoliberalism!

[@sun_yu_lu]

and i’m also reading braiding sweet grass! such a good read

[@prenuptials5925]

People are mad at the Oscars and Golden Globes like they were even worth paying attention to in the first place

[@Kevin-rg3yc]

I wouldn’t be surprised for the upcoming Oscars they will snub ma Rainey’s black bottom, Minari, one night in Miami and Judas and the black messiah

[@gh0s1wav]

@@Kevin-rg3yc "Judas and the black...who?" That's what's gonna be said when they are considering nominations.

[@DrGregoryHouseIT]

@@gh0s1wav Well, it's got two Awards now.

[@virginiawhidbee8393]

Rege did not deserve his Emmy nomination, NAACP and other awards he got in 2021. He's not a great actor and his role in Bridgerton was wooden.

[@ruthcrean2316]

Excellent video as always. I enjoyed the escapist fantasy of the show while having the background noise of all these concerns. I'm really glad to see this stuff being discussed online, and I think it's great that you referred to both Khadija and the group zoom discussion. In my naivety I hope that the writers take on board some of this criticism before embarking on Season 2 and weave what they've learned from the discourse into their writing. Surely with another season they have the space to inject some interesting questions into this imagined history.

[@athenajaxon2397]

it seems they're already addressing some of the criticisms by casting a south east asian woman as the lead for next season

[@TheBoringAddress]

Birdgerton's showrunners really did themselves in with that shoehorned, "love conquers racism" alternate history aside, because it opens the series towards a line of inquiry, that might seem like overthinking, but it's actually valid. It forces you to think about the history of that universe, the points of divergence and how it just... doesn't fit. They should've never tried to explain the diversity, it's a romanticized version of the past, it's not supposed to be accurate. Downton Abbey gets away with it all the time, why should Bridgerton play by a different set of rules?

[@TheBoringAddress]

I mean, for a society to be as racially integrated as in Bridgerton, considering our reality now, the whole process should've started by the time of the Danelaw or something. See what I mean? I'm not sure the showrunners were ready to back up these questions.

[@ilincabogza]

Exactly!!!!!

[@ilincabogza]

I mean c'mon even now we are not that integrated or equal, while fighting for something at leadt akin to that for far longer and far much more then an isolate case of love. It comepletely takes you out of the story with its stupidity.

[@missstar5449]

That scene actually took me out of the show though I was initially kind of going with it. I began to question myself what if the King dies will black people go back to being separated and what does that mean? 😌

[@kahkah1986]

@@missstar5449 Not to mention that it completely validates non-democratic institutions like the aristocracy. According to this rhetoric, there is nothing problematic about inheriting a dukedom as long as poc can inherit too; the Duke owns vast estates in comparison to the ordinary Regency person who didn't have access to basics like a pension, healthcare, education or property ownership. Millions of laborers had actually very few rights, voting rights for example were only guaranteed for landowning men like Simon.

[@thepostmancometh]

Also worth mentioning that the original off-Broadway run of Hamilton featured a very on-the-nose number about how Washington, among others, were prominent slave owners - but LMM was told to remove it before the show went to the main stage.

[@matthewfors114]

“Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.”

[@vikthya1711]

this was a really good one. I love how much depth you go to with seemingly "shallow" properties, without having to reach or make wild jumps. I wish there were more recognition of the scholarship that goes into media crit on KZbin.

[@may.k_me]

I hated the "love conquers all" moment. It was so ridiculous but I'm not even surprised because it's such a Hollywood/ American entertainment industry fairy tale that they want to feed people

[@brokengirl8619]

But at the core of everything, if people treated each other good and equally, the world would be peaceful, so love really would conquor all.

[@thenablade858]

@@brokengirl8619But it doesn’t, because people don’t.

[@figuremeoutyourself]

ok prefacing w the fact im white so lmao im not really the voice ppl need to be hearing but this is a youtube comment section so. im currently in my final year of school and ive been studying both illustration and history and can i just say? anyone who studies history can and should be hesitant about portraying it in narratives. people who write historical fiction SHOULD be nervous about doing it. it's SO loaded and if you think you can just go in and make it lighthearted while still including people of color in an integrated cast then you should maybe be doing a low fantasy/alternate world because.........the cultural amnesia is so problematic. melinapendulum made a great point in one of her videos (i think it was about antebellum? idr) that there really arent that many good movies about slavery. there's a time and place for lighthearted content, and we absolutely need to make space for that kind of storytelling to thrive, but there's a time and place for narratives about things that are truly awful to discuss. a lot of this is still in living memory and by writing something like slavery as nothing but trauma porn, we erase the cultural and social realities of the african diaspora. i took a caribbean history class last semester, and my prof mentioned that he wanted his next project to focus on the lives of slaves. not where they were sold or how they were treated, but what they did in the few moments of downtime and recreation. he wanted to look at the evolution of music and dance and food across the african diaspora during slavery, or how hes traveled too so many different parts of the diaspora and found both variety and recurring elements. because Black people, esp in historic narratives, are only allowed to be traumatized. and you can portray the resiliency and creativity of the african diaspora in a way that thinks critically without erasing the real trauma that still affects us or making it trauma porn meant to get white guilt in theatre seats. also just overall we should have more stories from a gaze that isnt white or eurocentric. like........holy fuck why has nobody done a historical drama about the haitian revolution. that revolution has been so destroyed from our cultural memory and its crazy because its a) the only slave revolt to fully destroy the institution of slavery within the bounds of a society and b) still leads to the sociopolitical alienation of haiti because the global north has essentially made the nation a pariah for daring to defy the set order of european imperialism. anyways this is long as fuck TLDR this is a great video and articulates really well a lot of stuff ive thought about while watching stuff like bridgerton come out (hollywood last year was......wild) so thank you for making it!

[@SpanishCebolleta]

I have to say, I started watching Bridgerton because I really needed some sort of escapism from everything (we all know what) and... Yeah, maybe I got that on the first chapters (I was in love with the colors and music), but then I started noticing some of the things you mentioned. I still enjoyed the show, but this essay gave me a lot more to think about. Thank you for your excelent work, I hope your channel keeps growing ✨

[@oyinkansolaadebajo9716]

16:09 I was literally like, "WHERE'S THE HAMILTON SHADE???" EDIT: Just finished watching, I agree with everything you said here, great video!

[@marybethlake1135]

OMG- Kristen J. Warner is a professor at the University of Alabama and she's AMAZING!!! Her course on Ethics & Representation in Media is great and the article you referenced is just one of her MANY insightful takes

[@BelieveMeAllyie]

This is the best take on Bridgerton that I have seen. I have met a person who thinks Hamilton is a fair representation of the historical figure. It was an interesting conversation. Great video! Very well researched.

[@UniquelyElla]

You are my favourite KZbin account! I'm in my final year studying English at Cambridge uni and I find so much inspiration from your videos! I was talking about these exact frustrations with Bridgerton in my class this week, and wrote an essay on 'Portrait of a Lady on Fire' inspired by your video - huge fan! keep up with the uh-mazing content! xx

[@katherinealvarez9216]

3:57 yes! That! I know this is a romance novel made into a tv show but how did all that change in one generation!? Was Queen Charlotte that determined?!

[@lithat8581]

@Charisma Girl it's a historical fantasy. It's just not well developed but it's not trying to reflect reality.

[@mchjsosde]

@Charisma Girl fantasy is not just limited to stories about magic..... Fantasies are fanciful depictions of the world and most historical romance books are fantasies

[@lithat8581]

@Charisma Girl it is a Fantasy. There wasn't a black Queen. Its fiction.shitty fiction but still fiction

[@lithat8581]

@@mchjsosde exactly.

[@lithat8581]

@@izzyNFT69 bridgerton had the most shittiest colorblind casting. The black mains are no darker than a paper bag (minus that one lady)

[@augustt.646]

The show "The Great" on Hulu is a perfect example of good race blind casting.

[@monkyfist]

I love this take, I've been seeing comments praising Bridgerton for being a "progressive" show in terms of representation but that often grossly glosses over the fact that representation isn't a means to an end. I don't think this is as much of a social commentary as the director would have believed, liberal escapism has convinced us that this is as much as we can push for in terms of progress.

[@lennonmanners-lolley7981]

they couldve done an actually historically accurate tv show with lots of divercity. but it would be about the working class

[@Nonviableaccount]

I can promise you 1812 working class England was even less diverse than the English Nobility. The courts hosted people from all over Europe and the British Empire. Cardiff, Swansea, Oxford and Yorkshire did not.

[@Lahiwe]

This was so interesting to watch as I’ve been thinking about this exact topic recently, linking Bridgerton and Hamilton to Obama-era neoliberal “representation” and post-racial ideology. I think the negative effects of such works can be seen in how it has the potential to affect young people of color viewing these stories: by making us feel accepted in rather than alienated by our countries’ past and present, there’s the potential to make us less and less critical of the state. I’m actually pitching an article to Bitch magazine that ties all this together with the inaugural poet Amanda Gorman and her poem “The Hill We Climb,” and the response that got from the United States. Thinking about your question about how to create period dramas that meaningfully incorporate Black, Indigenous, and other POC characters into times when their existences would have been brutal without veering into subjugation porn, I think the answer is in the genre techniques that POC writers have been employing since the various US and global freedom movements of the sixties and seventies: magical realism, fantasy, and speculation. I’m most critically familiar with African-American literature so Toni Morrison, Alice Walker, and Octavia Butler are the big three in my mind, and more recently Coleson Whitehead and Yaa Gyasi come to mind. These writers draw on those three techniques to visit extremely painful periods in history and imagine restricted Black interiority to the point of fullness while grasping a totem that allows us as readers and possibly them as writers (I say that as a black woman writer who can only do this type of writing with an approach or technique that offers me an escape valve) to take breaks from the brutality of the real by pondering parallel surreal events, or allows us forward progress not through actual events but through literary device and structure. In Octavia Butler’s “Kindred,” for example, a modern Black woman has to experience what I believe might be the ultimate terror for African descendants of slaves: being trapped in an alternate universe/timeline where the slaveholding past is present. However, she is allowed to transport to and ultimately find safety within her freer modern existence. In Yaa Gyasi’s “Homegoing,” there is no such escape for the characters, but the book is multigenerational and therefore characters become less and less constrained as the reader passes through the book, and we are allowed to speculate about what might happen if we could reconnect with the exact families from which we were separated-if we could trace our lineage this way at all. These pieces of fiction are not escapist, but they give us what we are so often robbed of in discussions or depictions of our history and present: collective and individual humanity, personality, and dimensionality. If one really wants to escape, though, writers can do so responsibly by applying a speculative framework to actual historical events that tips the scales in favor of the oppressed people just enough for basic world building purposes (an England with openly recognized Black nobility, for example) and from there, delves into the questions of how they got there (was a certain rebellion/period of rebellion successful at an earlier point in history? Was technology invented that prevented invasion?) and what they must deal with in this speculative present. In the case of Bridgerton: are Black nobility obliged to marry white or light skinned families and produce “exceptional” lighter and lighter skinned heirs in order to maintain their status? Is it a big social experiment? That would explain much more in the show than that ridiculous conversation, including the original Duke’s reaction to his wife’s many miscarriages and his son’s stutter-if this dark skinned man did “everything right” but fathered an heir who would be ridiculed in a society that is apparently still unabashedly ableist, and that rejection by white society meant that he would lose his title and perhaps even be returned to non-citizen status, that would make for a much more developed character and circumstance in general. The black characters operate as though this rule is in place, so why not explore that? Because that requires confrontation rather than elimination of white/European brutality, and it requires writers who write actual POC characters, rather than white characters in brown skins. And unfortunately this doesn’t just mean diversifying the writer’s room, because as we see with Hamilton, POC writers are more than capable of doing the latter. But Lin-Manuel Miranda wrote with great cultural specificity in “In the Heights”-that type of story just isn’t rewarded with the accolades that slavery porn or white heroes in brown skins or white savior narratives are. Writers rooms must be diversified, *AND* POC writers who write real POC stories with depth and interiority, without the white gaze, must be given the critical attention and acclaim that they are due. Thank you so much for making this incredibly thoughtful video and adding to the critical response by other creators. This has been a long comment, lol, but I’m so glad to participate in this discourse!

[@clarence5211]

i love your take on this! the alternate idea for how bridgerton could’ve dealt with race you describe here would’ve been super interesting and compelling imo!

[@StewNWT]

I am fascinated by the potential topic of your article on Amanda Gorman’s ‘The hill we climb’, - without giving away too much of the article - how do the two relate??

[@sweetmeme1987]

I remember i didnt like the show , i was really uncomfortable with it , but I couldn’t put my thoughts into words, so thank you so much for this video.

[@bananaboatcharlie]

I would be fascinated to hear your take on Jonathan Strange and Mr. Norrel. There is one black main character who is AMAZING. While a servant, his personality and inner life is explored within and outside of that context. And he is a superior servant, a butler. His past is very much a part of him, but the way he reacts to it and who he becomes are wholly him.

[@Chrissy123-t2x]

I think that Downton Abbey does it the best when it comes to issues such as race, gender and sexuality. On the show Lady Rose dated a black man from a jazz club but broke up because of how society would of reacted to a higher class women dating outside of her race. Thomas who is the gay character almost got jailed for his sexuality, many of his co workers did not hate him for his sexuality yet still felt uncomfortable with homosexuality. Downton is a very aesthetic show and at the same time is realistic about social issues at that time period. I just wish that Bridgeton went more into social issues while maintaining a fantasy aesthetic.

[@rehan5766]

ms broey...I could honestly listen to you talk all day...you are such a well read , well informed person..I aspire to be as knowledgable as you are

[@johnifity]

tysm for making this! love when media criticism on yt is thorough, fair, AND avoids hyperbole!

[@receivinglemons4245]

OMIGODS, THANK YOU FOR TALKING ABOUT THIS!!! I watched this with my friends, some of which are POC, and when we heard Lady Dansbury say that the whole room just grew uncomfortably stale. The way that this now affects Marina’s standing becomes especially scary when you put your mind to it.

[@alexlovessamoyeds]

It feels like Bridgerton was supposed to be the purely fictional universe (Like Hammerstein's cinderella), but someone up high said "oh wait, we need to make it more 'woke'" or something (likely a white man) and they had to shoehorn in those individual scenes addressing racism and social inequity without putting much deep thought or nuance into it.

[@skyt8327]

I really liked the setting and cast but I honestly hate the characters, story, and the writing in general

[@skyt8327]

EXCEPT the Duke I don’t remember his name but he’s the only exception

[@mcchilde2903]

@@skyt8327 I feel like there were certain aspects of each character that I did like, especially Eloise, but they were pretty bland I the first few episodes.

[@dgm66]

I tried. Couldn't get past the first episode.

[@reemasabrina]

I remember getting to the "love conquers all" scene and being so weirdly disappointed? I was just hoping they'd never address it because all that was in the back of my mind was, "oh, snap, your society is really hanging by a shoestring, huh?"

[@a.e5220]

thank you for saying what needs to be said, and in such a smart yet entertaining way!! I watched the first episode and was honestly shocked by the complete decontextualizing of race & history, which, I guess on its own can be okay if you make that approach explicit, but knowing that it's so popular, it stunk of wanting to erase nuance in the name of "diversity." also, just want to say, academics in the humanities who use platforms like YT to make nuance and critical thinking entertaining are doing God's work, lol.

[@whitneyr6182]

I was SO confused by the "all you need is love" scene because I thought I was watching a race-blind casting situation and then, when I was informed that I was not, I was disappointed. Like, a big part of what I was liking about the show was just like "nope! Wrong!!" Why??

[@lillyevans5824]

I for one would really like a video exploding voluntourism, its so such a vast topic with so many impacts and implications that I would love to see it explored by someone who has researched it properly :)

[@mcchilde2903]

Agree,tell me if you find a good video!

[@helenbranyan6275]

Also, it is very telling that almost no "revisional" historical dramas feature a cast with ALL BIPOCs! It is almost also a mix that heavily features white characters in the lead. I wonder what a story that truly places BIPOCs at the center would even entail... maybe one day they will give us the chance to create shit without white interference...

[@ominousbiscuit]

You should start by having some actual history that anyone cares about

[@BallsTheDog]

Why would they do that instead of just doing historical dramas set in different countries. Why do you want to revise white history it's been done to death.

[@treborkroy5280]

"without white interference" anti racism becoming racism. Ahhh the future is bleak. Unfortunately for people like you the number of white people in a predominantly white society in a predominantly white business can't avoid "white interference" until you find someone not white to do it. And do it without white people. Which sounds like segregation to me.

[@charmainemcc6799]

I watched it from the beginning and it was captivating I didn't need your prompting-it was excellent - thank you for all the references

[@arlequinelunaire418]

I watched another period piece recently, the 2018 Colette biopic, and your video instantly brought it back into mind for me, as (like many biopics) it also presents a sanitised, almost fantasy-like depiction of its source material. Its portrayal of Colette is basically how most people (including me, hence why I have her as my avatar) would like to remember her: as a talented author who was openly LGBT+ (bi specifically) pre-WWI... while not mentioning her otherwise very of-her-time traits like her feminist rope-cutting or, relevant to this video, her racism (even though she had slave ancestors). Whether or not she was an anti-semite is a more... hard-to-answer question, but anyway I've probably gone long off-topic by now

[@helenawoods]

fabulous work in your research and video creation!!! This video is spot ON :)

[@emi-ts1ko]

the show was okay in our fantasy world where racism didn't exist but then there was that scene and the sexual abuse scene and everything was ruined

[@jhonni13]

This is the first video I've seen from your channel. Absolutely thought provoking. Looking forward to diving into your uploads.

[@jhonni13]

Oh and also, loved seeing Kristen Warner's work discussed so prominently.

[@justinejustice_league1857]

This is an oldie but the woman who wrote I may Destroy you Michaela Coel omg she is phenomenal. That show was so good and address pain without making it yet another black struggle movie Also, another good one written by her is Black Earth Rising, the entire cast of that carries thier own performances..wonderful depiction of telling the truth in history, not sugar coating anythimg but also gives us a modernized script

[@structureoflight]

one of my favorites youve done yet! gonna share this one w/ friends

[@carpools5434]

Just gonna put this quote from Gail Dines here: Systems of oppression are flexible enough to absorb some members of subordinated groups; indeed, they draw strength from the illusion of neutrality provided by these exceptions”

[@leontinec3957]

You seriously never miss. Right down to your language usage and precision with constructing criticisms that bring valuable questions to the table. these videos constantly expand my mind

[@poetryprose9810]

this is super small, but it’s a bit redundant to say “bipoc and people of color” since bipoc stands for Black, Indigenous, People of Color! sorry if you’ve already gotten this comment, thank you so much for this really thoughtful video!! i enjoyed it sm

[@lausenvanch4628]

I love when you explain big words or concepts because I usually struggle with understanding these kinds of videos, but you helped me understand!

[@christieomojo]

This is such a great channel I really learn a lot from listening. As a black woman from the UK I love period dramas, but i didnt enjoy bridgerton.It lacked the witty and tense drama of court. I found the romance plot tired. The black characters were given no context, and the viewer is just meant to accept they are part of high society England in the 19th century. Just couldn't get in to it. I stopped watching halfway 🤷‍♀️

[@Anasteroiddestroyer]

Glad I wasn't the only one who found it superficial and contrived.

[@Jenny-dx1ln]

@Charisma Girl Your arguement was fine until that last paragraph, of course they wouldn't cast a white MLK that would be highly disrespectful to the civil rights movement. Bridgerton is a fictional piece which is why they're able to do a colourblind casting. I see what you're getting at because people were commenting on the lack of diversity in 'The Crown', which is based on real history, but it is not the same.

[@ilincabogza]

I agree with everything but Omg the wasted potential of the love story. It had all those tropes that done right are literally amazing, but somehow managed to waste all of that potential. It lacked any personality and didn't get attached to the characters or their love. The tension was barely there, not because of lack of chemistry, but lack of motivation for them to act in whatever way. Just thinking about Jane Eyre and her love story or any Jane Austen novel and that's how you do period drama love! It just seemed like they tried to thick off fanfiction tropes to hint at them in the trailer and then half-ass them. And of course it got so toxic that i can't even begin to root for these two together. And anyway what do i even know about them? There is nothing personal about them, or make them individuals that stand out. Superficial characteristics done hundreds of times before, and that's not even the problem, the problem is that it's been done better then this already. If you could make the "afeminate that doesnt want love" trope better then it's been already been done i'm all for it. But it was a let down because it looked like a cheap copy. Am i seeing them as actual human beings i should care about or their one defining characteristic that hasn't been delved into deep enough. What makes Daphne real? Why should i care about her? When i think about heroines like Jane Eyre and Anne Shirely they are never just a trope. They can be put into one but they are always so much more developed and personal. And that is the problem of the whole show. Token feminist character, token smart fat friend, token rebel brother, token leader that falls for the wrong person etc. A couple of those could have been amazing if done right! Why would i watch a caricature instead of the real thing?

[@forickgrimaldus8301]

In this case no, such a scandal in Victorian England would have caused racial violence considering the time period.

[@forickgrimaldus8301]

It would be like in the Medieval period the Church found out of a new christian movement, off course they would be open after all the medieval period is, who am I kidding they would be excommunicated or worst.

[@heartlknj]

*Regency

[@ositaiza888]

yeah it's hard to take the "love conquers all" narrative seriously when we know how much of the media and public treated meghan markle after she married into the royal family

[@chaiidoost]

Acknowledging the negative side of history is important , and Ive never see a film that depicts the cruelty of the trans Atlantic slave trade, With complex characters done correctly. If we go down this route, we will forget our own history. And believe in the fantasy make believe that we conjure up for ourselves. The queen in bridgeton for episode 4 basically stated that a white king saved everyone from the racism and disputes that was happening. Can we stop with the white saviour tropes pls Okay here’s another thing I was quite upset about. I understand that Bridgerton is fiction and is just a mix bag of gossip girl and pride and prejudice. However the representation for diversity wasn’t that great. I was excited for the show since I’m a huge dork for period dramas, but I felt like coloured people ( such as myself) usually had no lines or were used a decorative stances. Broey as always such a great video 🥺 Edit: hey umm 😂 😂 thanks for the responses it’s actually a first so I’m excited 😌. We all have different opinions and anyone who watched the show will have different expectations or likes about the show. I’m British Afghan so I guess I was expecting a little bit more from the show considering I am from where the place they set it and they hired a majority British cast whom I love 😂 ( Waterloo road, Derry girls and mihigh fans here) And who can blame me for just being a bit disappointed with bridgerton. I understand it’s a historical drama but they made their show based on race with the posters and before they aired it and that’s why lots of people watched it, however it just didn’t reach the standard I was hoping for considering the budget for it. Still this is a first and hopefully it gets better. Another edit: And the comment about forgetting our colour is a bit insensitive. How can someone see your soul, it’s not physical plus not everyone is that nice 😂 trust me. As humans we judge and make assumptions. That’s why we enjoy putting people in little boxes to check off. It’s simpler to understand then. Plus theatres need more people of colour 😂 god I love musicals, but it’s slowly changing so that’s good.

[@luer2202]

Actually I wonder, if we can change anything if we've been constantly reminded that black people are always the suppressed ones and the white are always in the dominant roles. I love the diversity in Bridgeston, because it's not a historical drama. It's a modern alternative reality story, covert in beautiful costumes and locations. It's not playing in our world. Please stop comparing it to real life history. I love to see more black people in high class roles. We need to forget about skin color and start to see the souls. And giving people with colour any available role, especially supreme ones, is one step further in the right direction: forgetting about the horrible history black people have been through,even if it's just for one moment. And enjoying to see people you can identify with, in upper class roles. It's a complete other energy level. And at least Bridgerton made a start. Nobody can expect that an experiment goes totally right on the first try. They did the best of it and we loved it. Give people of color the chance they barely get in theaters! It's wonderful. I love it.

[@mchjsosde]

Maybe we are looking in the wrong place. I personally don't want to see the reality of the trade on the screen in an entertainment setting. I would rather sit down knowing I am reading the history of real people and I am not meant to be pleased by that media and only educated.

[@ilincabogza]

@@luer2202 if it was a fantasy it would be ok. The idea that love erased racism is something that messed this whole thing up. And it would be easy to see people for their sould once actual problems still relevant dissapear. That hasn't happened yet, and so poc can't be let to deal with that alone while you're off chasing butterflies

[@luer2202]

@@ilincabogza okay I understand the issue now. Thanks for explaining.

[@naomilamont3277]

"Rather than speaking for, we can learn to speak with," I hope I learn to do that. This was VERY good. I never thought I'd say that about a video that critiques Hamilton, but you made fair points. I need to learn to spot historical revisionism and it's issues.

[@shreyc]

Broey Deschanel for President 🥺 (Edit: For a second there, forgot I'm an Anarchist)

[@BTNSTR]

thank you for articulating exactly what has always bothered me about period pieces. ive never been able to stomach them and now i have the words for it. this was so beautifully put together, thank you for sharing!

[@kartik3719]

The videos by readwithcindy where she talks about and contrasts the representation in two books: The Invisible Life of Addie LaRue & A Deadly Education are also great videos talking about the complexities of representation and writing albeit in a less academic way I highly recommend them! Likewise I also recommend the video Coco's Feel Good Oppression by eliquorice

[@NataliaNNS]

Yes! This made me think of the videos and of the discussion cindy brought up about whe5her or not white writers should be writing bipod characters, and I hadn’t thought of applying the same questions to film

[@sildarmillion]

OMG this is what I've been feeling but did not have the vocabulary or the historical knowledge to verbalize. Thank you. I officially love your videos now.

[@sildarmillion]

I CANNOT STRESS HOW MUCH I LOVE AND NEEDED THIS VIDEO

[@kelseyraymer8854]

I all ways feel 10 times smarter when watching your videos

[@RedShoes29]

Genuinely loved this. Thanks for giving layers to a relatively vanilla series. Segue but you look amazing. I want that corset/top ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

[@enta_nae_mere7590]

The problem with race in Bridgerton and Hamilton is that is just placing black characters in the role of historical class oppressors. This appeals to upperclass liberals but does absolutely nothing for working class viewers and actually means those that are us d to being told to relate to historical oppressors due to superficial(racial) similarities in the audience surrogate character. This can either result in laundering a class alienation into racial alienation, Counterintuitively this results in more racism or of the liberal delusion that both issues are solved when they obviously aren't. This just kicks the can down the road until the viewer is more alienated and more likely to radicalise towards the right.

[@aberrantcow]

Great video! As soon as I saw I episode 4 I was like: “whoaaaa wait......you can’t just gloss past that detail guys...” I’m kind of stuck in this in-between where I like Bridgerton for it’s fun fan-fiction like qualities and romantic structure, but I also cannot ignore it’s glossed over relationship with the story’s racial societal politics. It’s fun but if the series continues, they need to commit to addressing these criticisms.

[@CyberStockholmSyndrome]

This is why I’ve become super cynical when it comes to diverse casting. So many higher ups in the industry learned that people will pat them on the back for throwing a few black and brown faces in a project, but care very little about the nuances that come with it. Like yeah you have 4 black actors. One is a Queen, and one is a Duke. Fantastic. But it sucks when the the Duke is a victim of sexual assault (and it isn’t talked about), when the Duke’s aunt (I think?) is a single strong black woman who exists to give advice, and when the other black woman is pregnant out of wedlock and considered a manipulative user. I hardly ever watch these shows unless I know for a fact that poc are behind it, and it’s been vetted by other poc. It’s really exhausting to be lured in with the promise of representation only to be cast aside, or worse, framed as just props to a white narrative.

[@victoriap4987]

Ok queen. I see you with the well thought out video 😍 I really loved this video

[@TheDarkAgez]

I love how I stopped the video to look up the writers room... and you literally did all that research for me. lol As a writer, I always look at the writers room when it comes to these things. Also, too often is a "diverse" writers room used as a shield against criticism and usually exhibits tokenism. It being an (assumingly) women led writers room but NOT letting the POC write that scene is a problem. And we also don't know the dynamics of that room. Did they feel comfortable speaking on it? Can we even assume they would have disagreed? And at the end of the day, as mentioned, it's still being helmed by a cis white man. If they had made any real effort to get actual critique on this before they went into production, they would have got it. The excuses are getting thinner and thinner. Thank you for your thorough work and also introducing Plastic Representation to me!

[@katyrea3923]

Your necklace is gorgeous! Don't know if you know about the pendant on it, but it's called the claddagh hands and can usually be found on a ring not a necklace. The direction the hands face indicates whether your heart is open to love or closed (single or in a relationship basically). It's an Irish tradition, so cool to see it randomly! ☀️

[@trneighty5941]

“Liberal escapism” basically defines all Shonda Rhimes’ stuff

[@blameitoncapitalism]

most intelligent video I've seen about this! Thank you so much for the nuanced view!

[@strange0gatherings]

Damn Broey you are a STAR!!!

[@tomdemartomdemarreally5878]

This is what makes a film like Fruitvale Station so much more worth my time to experience than something like Bridgerton, which leaves me with a hollow cheap feeling like I just wasted my time. To me it's similar to learning a new recipe and making myself a nutritiously delicious meal or instead opening a package of junk food and downing it. I guess one could look at the health of a nation as relative to its popular culture.