THE LORD OF THE RINGS- Priest reacts to GANDALF vs BALROG

Reaction and insight from a real Priest about this iconic Lord of the Rings scene. A great image of Jesus' sacrifice on the Cross and his Rising again, something Christians recognise epescially during Easter!
I hope this blesses you and helps you understand the Christain message.

[@justsmashing4628]

Tolkien made no secret of the catholic themes throughout Lotr’s

[@petern1938]

Might need a reference there, because I think you're talking BS.

[@justsmashing4628]

@@petern1938 read Tolkien's biography…do you know how to read a book?

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

​@@petern1938 Tolkien was a strong Catholic. He always made fun of C.S. Lewis (they were good friends) for making The Chronicles of Narnia too on-the-nose for Catholicism. He noted that a story involving Christian themes should be more complex and subtle.

[@polaullon5116]

Actually he was far more inspired by norse mytology. Gandalf basically is Odin

[@1995IpMan]

Hello, first time watching you... I have been huge fan of lord of the rings since childhood and never noticed that Gandalf fell in a cross shape, this books and movies still continues to amaze me to this day. Tolkien writes that Gandalf fell with the Balrog far beyond that the dwarves dug, they encountered so called "nameless things" (In Tolkein lore no one knows where they came from and they are old as earth) from which Balrog fled and Gandalf chased after him... For me that little detail adds to whole good is invincible in front of evil and perfectly simbolises Jesus's victory over devil and death. Nice reaction, god bless :)

[@MrPriestcontent]

Really interesting! Great to hear your insight and thanks for taking the time to watch and comment 🙂

[@joshman531]

I think Gandalf is more supposed to be an Angelic force than an algory for Jesus in Tolkiens broader worldview, although I'm sure all the non Angelic bible refernces (resserection etc) are obviously deliberate. Although when he's alluding to the secret fire he's referring to Eru who is God, in the films (but more in the books) Gandalf will also heavily imply a lot of "chance" events are part of Gods plan. When your talking about sacrifice you might find it interesting to know that in the Silmarillion during the fall of Gondolin two Elves manage to kill balrogs but give their lives in the attempt to allow refugees to escape. The sword Gandalf fights the Balrog with is actually from Gondolin.

[@KateDerrett]

Thank you I hadn’t realised there are so many parallels. So interesting and inspiring .

[@RachaelPalmer-rs8qb]

Wow! Great video. I never realised how many references there were in this scene!

[@Cenindo]

Notice Gandalf's words: "I am a servant of the secret fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. The dark fire will not avail you, flame of Udûn." * Elsewhere, the "secret fire" is described as the special power of God (Eru Ilúvatar, "the "One Father of All") to give independent existence to his creations. In a wider sense, the "secret fire" has been likened to the Holy Spirit, used by God to make his influence felt in the world. Gandalf describes himself as a servant of God's power. * "Anor" can be simply the Elvish word for the Sun, but here Gandalf is probably saying that he wields the power of Light in a higher sense. * "Udûn", better known in the form Utumno, was back in the First Age the hellish underground stronghold of Morgoth, the original "devil" in Tolkien's mythology (Sauron was originally just a servant of Morgoth). So freely translated, Gandalf is calling the Balrog a "flame of Hell."

[@MrPriestcontent]

Wow thanks, so much depth to it!

[@blackeyedlily]

Having just watched this video I was going to leave a comment to explain the same things you have already done here so well. So many casual viewers of these films love this scene but never realize the significance of what Gandalf’s words are.

[@Aronprovz]

​@@blackeyedlilylol same

[@gregw74]

Perhaps it could also be argued that Gandalf is like a new Adam by way of him being a new Saruman, or rather, "...Saruman as he should have been".

[@joshman531]

While possible Tolkien had such symbolism in mind in the deeper lore Gandalf is more an Angel in a mans body sent with a specific task. The "Saruman as he should have been" remark is a reference to the switch in roles post reserection, Gandalf the Grey was sent as a sort of touring advisor, Gandalf the White is sent to help lead the free peoples through the darkness as Saruman had failed to do.

[@roddo1955]

Gandalf is like the Holy ghost. He inspires and enlightens.

[@rikk319]

@@roddo1955 When he says, "I am a servant of the Secret Fire", he's talking about the Flame Imperishable that dwells within Illuvatar and is used to create life. I always connected the Secret Fire with the Holy Spirit.

[@falhacritica539]

Both of them are Maiars, the Balrog (it's the last one in middle earth from what I've heard) as is Sauron, Morgoth is an Ainur. So Maiar is a lower cast of "angel" and Ainurs are a higher cast in tolkiens work, they where the first creations of Eru (god in the middle earth universe). Balrogs are fallen Maiars that transformed and could not transform back, Sauron was once good but turned to evil (he was also a shapshifter) and also lost the hability to look human. Now Gandalf showed up in the 3rd age to help fight the incoming threat as did Saruman and the other wizards, Saruman was seduced by evil and Gandalf was not. He has a ring that enhances his powers from the flame of Arnor. The Balrog knew he screwed up when he went toe to toe with Gandalf, since he was a Maiar, imune to his fire.

[@JWJ_Holloway]

Love this man ^_^ keep it up ! And Thank you 🙏

[@dupplinmuir113]

I just noticed that when Gandalf returns there's a shot where the camera looks down past him at Aragorn, Gimli, and Legoland, which is similar to a shot of Sauron in the Prologue.

[@Giovanni_Gabrielli]

It is exactly how MrPriest said. Most people don't pay attention to what Gandalf says to the Balrog (Baal, radical for demons BaalPeor, in greek Belphagor, BaalZabub, in greek Belzebub,ecc..) Gandalf was SENT from God for the purpose of helping destroy evil, and resurrects in the only exeption by the will of God. Anyway, what Gandalf says is not random gibberish, they are 2 kinds of different fire, the one that destroy and the white fire that warms and restores. The Balrog is very well aware of what Gandalf is talking about. It is speculated that the Balrog actually is not capable of following them from Moria (he CANNOT pass) because the sunlight might weaken him.

[@MrPriestcontent]

Amazing, thanks

[@MrPriestcontent]

Brilliant, thanks for sharing your insight!

[@Giovanni_Gabrielli]

@@MrPriestcontent Thank you Father!

[@PakToh]

I think there is another interesting thing: Gandalf as an istari ia a maiar, something like an angel, but the balrog is also a maiar, corrupted by morgoth, the first evil that brought disharmonies to the original song eru illuvatar and all his "angels" sung to finally form all of existence. So here we see an angel fighting a fallen angel, a demon, while falling themselves. But Gandalf faith was so strong that eru illuvatar hinself brought him back to fulfill his destiny. And yes it is not one allegory, it combines several aspects, using similar pictures, but gives a new spin and a new way to access these themes to a new audience.

[@pillmuncher67]

In the beginning, Eru Iluvátar, the God of Tolkien's world, created the Ainur (angelic beings) as offspring of his mind, each representing a different aspect of said mind. Eru taught them each a musical theme and then gathered them so they would sing togerther. In this Music of the Ainur he gave them visions of his plan for the universe, Eä, and the world, Arda. After the Music of the Ainur, Eru gave each of the Ainur the choice to stay with him or to enter Arda and fashion the world according to his plan. The Valar who went to Arda became known as the High Ones or The Powers of Arda. They correspond roughly to the Greek/Norse gods, except for Melkor, the Satan figure of Tolkien's universe, and Nienna, who weeps forever and at all times "mourns for every wound that Arda has suffered in the marring of Melkor" (see below). She teaches pity and patience. The Maia Olorin was her student. He was known as the wisest of the Maiar and was later sent with four other Maiar to Middle Earth (the main continent on Arda) to help guide its people in their fight against Sauron (see also below). He was known by many names: Mithrandir, Greyhame, Old Greybeard, Grey Pilgrim, and, of course, Gandalf. The greatest of the Valar, Melkor, who had part in all of the other Valar's gifts, wanted to make his own creation and sang his own melody in the Music of the Ainur, which led to a great dissonance. He became the first Big Bad in Arda, with the Maia Mairon ("The Admirable") becoming his lieutenant. Melkor was henceforth called Morgoth ("Dark Enemy" or "Black Foe") and Mairon was called Sauron ("The Abominable"). Morgoth tried to destroy everything the other Valar had built on Arda, which became known as the Marring of Arda. After he was finally caught, he was bound in chains by the other Valar and cast into the Void. It is prophesied that at the end of times Morgoth will return, but will ultimately be defeated in a great battle - Dagor Dagorath. After that Arda will be remade in the way Eru intended it to be. Also this: The Elves, Eru's firstborn, are bound to Arda. When they die, their souls go to the Halls of Mandos (a Valar, originally named Námo) in Valinor, the Undying Lands, where they dwell for a while as spirits and are then re-incorporated, IOW, they cannot truly die. Men, Eru's secondborn, can die and where their souls go after their death only Eru knows. Elves call that The Gift of Eru and they become envious of that gift. The Dwarves, having been made in secret by the Valar Aulë the Smith and originally lacking the Flame Imperishable (what Gandalf called the Flame of Anor in his speech to the Balrog), are Eru's adopted children. After Aulë showed humility and offered to destroy the Dwarves, Eru told him that he had already given them the Flame Imperishable, but insisted that they go to sleep under the mountain where they were created until his true children had awoken. What happens to them after they die is also not known, but they believe that their souls go to Aulë - who they call Mahal - and that after the end of times, when Arda is remade, Eru will give them a place in his creation.

[@rikk319]

Excellent synopsis of the Ainulindale.

[@Cloofinder]

Gandalf and the Balrog are both of the Maiar. So Gamdalf amd the Balrog could be representations of Angels. The Balrog being a fallen angel and Gamdalf being a devine angel.

[@KayakerDude-cw1kk]

CS Lewis and Tolkien were best friends and Christian themes influenced them both heavily. Notice Gandalf was baptized by both water and fire (baptism by fire is what it means to be baptized by the holy spirit) when he fought the Balrog aka Satan and was resurrected into a more powerful, pure(Gandalf the white) and eternal form - A transformation we as Christians look to attain through Christ after he defeated Satan and death by suffering and sacrificing his flesh body for us and raised and glorified 3 days later - Greatest act of love and mercy ever

[@raderadumilo7899]

Actually, if you read Silmarilion, then Eru/Iluvatar is the God, Valars are archangels, and Mayars are angels. Morgoth is Satan, and Sauron and balrogs are fallen angels. Gandalf is a Mayar.

[@Theeighthdoctor1996]

I genuinely think the balrog was thinking "yeah this is gonna be an open and shut battle" until he heard that shit about "I am the servant of the secret fire" and then he thought "no he can't be he's not a maiar is he?" Only for it to be confirmed as gandalf comes rushing down towards him with the sword in the intro of two towers and from what I can remember of the books gandalf apparently spent somewhere from 8 days to a millienia fighting the balrog under middle earth

[@rikk319]

He spent several days fighting the balrog, then when he was resurrected, he spent some days laying on the top of the mountain until Gwaihir found him, sent by Galadriel. While he was dead, time doesn't pass the same in Eru's Timeless Halls, so he may have spent eons there basically leveling up, so that when he returned, it had been so long to him that he didn't recall the name of Gandalf very well anymore.

[@NotANameist]

Very nice, thanks Father!

[@Fletcherinho]

Yes, that why I celebrate Easter. Beacuase Jesus fought a balrog.

[@philgonzalez5953]

Very important, gandalf realized he had this one chance to rid the world of a demon. Just like the Hobbit, he realized what sauron would do with control of a dragon.

[@susannewehrmaker1303]

Good take, thank you! Only one thing... Gandalf did actually die, but he was sent back by the Valar (Holy Ones) to complete his task. And he takes the form of the "White Wizard" as Saruman had already fallen and betrayed the cause for which he had been sent.

[@eddietucker7005]

I had the same thoughts, not knowing Tolkien was a Cristian.

[@Fuchs320]

i mean Gandalaf is Maiar a Servant of Eru Iluvatar so yeah he is a divine Servant

[@williamfoster4150]

The most Christian reference in LotR is the ending. In any ordinary movie we would have a heroes story, but in LotR Frodo, in the end, succumbs to the ring, because he also is only mortal, resilient as he is (and in a Christian sense has original sin). The ring is destroyed by gods grace by using Gollum as a vessel. Gods grace is enabled by Frodo's compassion and kindness towards Gollum. So the statement here is that humanity cannot defeat all evil, but if we are good within our own means it will allow gods grace and salvation. This lessons was Tolkien's takeaway from WWI where he encountered so much death and misery and where LoTR was conceived.

[@williamfoster4150]

Also Gandalf is not really an allegory to Jesus in a literal sense but more to an angel in the literal sense (messenger). Tolkien's backstory to LotR is the Christian creation mythology. Both the Balrog and Gandalf are lesser angels. According to Tolkien the "Maia" (the lesser angels) and Valar (the archangels so to speak) appear according to their essence and state of spirit. The Balrog is therefore not a demon but a fallen angel, and his appearance - rage and destruction - is the form he chooses because it matches his spirit. Gandalf spirit is that of a guide to mortals and therefore his form is that of an old wise man.

[@williamfoster4150]

The "secret fire" is taunt towards the Balrog. It is the privilege of god which is original creation. In LotR it is explicitly stated that evil cannot create but only corrupt (the orcs are corrupted and warped elves). The "secret fire" is what Morgoth (satan) searched for desperately in the void and could never find. It is cause for his original envy towards god fueled by his pride. He wanted to defy the original "song of creation" and wanted to create by himself (pride) but he only could corrupt. There is another reference to this in the movie most people probably won't get: when Frodo puts on the ring in the tavern and Sauron speaks to him "there is no life in the void", he is referencing this.

[@MrPriestcontent]

Amazing mate love that take never thought of the ending like that 😲

[@williamfoster4150]

@@MrPriestcontent It is somewhat in plain sight, though the dots are fairly scattered :-) When Frodo's initial instinct was to wish death on Gollum in the mines of Moriah, Gandalf said this: "Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends. I have not much hope that Gollum can be cured before he dies, but there is a chance of it. And he is bound up with the fate of the Ring. My heart tells me that he has some part to play yet, for good or ill, before the end; and when that comes, the pity of Bilbo may rule the fate of many - yours not least." So clearly, right from the beginning Gandalf was aware that there was Gods plan. And it was Bilbo's and Frodo's free will towards good that would allow it to happen (or not). Frodo could never defeat Sauron or resist the ring (neither could Gollum or Isildur) but he had the free will to show mercy towards Gollum, and that was what he was ultimately judged upon and would determine the fate of the world.

[@johndimick1767]

​@@williamfoster4150 Knowledgeable commentary. Good stuff.

[@custardflan]

I never did notice Gandalfs crucifixion pose. Thanks

[@petern1938]

I'm sorry, he's clutching at straws. Why is the crucifix the shape it is? You take a person and extend their arms (with their head forming the top of the cross) and you have a cross. Crucifixion was a normal form of execution before any religious symbolism. Gandalf is an 'angel' (Maiar) not even a god (valar) and not the 'son' of the creator Eru Iluvatar. It is correctly stated that Tolkien disliked allegory, any parallels are therefore projections of MrPriest.

[@custardflan]

@@petern1938 so it was an accident? PJ didn't catch that? I kind of agree with your general review of the reaction video, however.

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

​@petern1938 Tolkien stated that he disliked "direct allegory." Meaning, he wanted his stories to be interpreted based on each individuals experience and not force them to come to specific conclusions. It is pretty clear Tolkien had some rough ideas of what all of the characters represented. He just didn't want to force his ideas on someone.

[@custardflan]

@@joshuawiedenbeck6944 Riiiiiiiiight. That's not allegory, however. That's a decision by PJ. Pilgrim's Progress is allegory.

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

@@custardflan Absolutely, there is a difference between Tolkien and the movies. The movies are an interpretation of what Tolkien wrote, so there will be liberties taken.

[@user-zb1ri9fn3n]

Think the Wizards represent Angels.

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

Wizards are definitely what we would understand as angels. They serve Eru (LOTRs version of god). Balrogs are equivalent to wizards in terms of power and served on behalf of Morgoth (LOTRs version of satan). The book version of Balrogs has them as more shadow figures whose darkness consumes everything around them than firey devils.

[@scottmccabe7586]

The scene is loaded with symbolism, I can’t help thinking your analysis is quite basic. I didn’t notice the shape Gandalf falls in before, so I’ll give you that. It is the fundamental story of man. The hero’s journey. The descent into the depths, defeat of ones dragon, death, rebirth and finally the return. The bridge is important. It separates two worlds, one of heaven and one of hell. Gandalf is a leader, and like all good leaders he does not lead from the front, but the back. He leads by encouraging others to to lead, specifically Aragorn. Gandalf is the archetype of the wise old man, he is representative of the holy trinity. In the conflict between Gandalf and Balrog, the light vs darkness is not simple or basic. Light is representative of truth, and darkness is the antithesis of truth. Flames are destructive, and of course symbolic of hell. Gandalf appears hurt when he blocks the attack with his shield. This is to signify that Gandalf is at his limit when confronting this foe. Since Gandalf is of a higher type, perhaps the highest type, this informs us that this evil is an opposing and equally capable force. Gandalf tells the Balrog to go back to the shadow. This highlights how Gandalf is not the aggressor. This is an important aspect of goodness. To not simply be harmless, but not look for conflict or pursue it. Doing so always originates from the prince of lies, and it is a lie to oneself most of all. The whip Balrog wields is significant and represents dominance, the pursuit of material gain and domination over the world. It signifies a narcissistic love of oneself as well as a deluded conceptualisation of oneself as wholly good. Something only true evil can ever believe. The whip grabbing Gandalfs ankle has symbolic meaning but I can’t put my finger on it unfortunately. Gandalf does not fall into the abyss, he lets go. This is an important distinction. The voluntarily descent into the depths with his arms wide open is similar to the crucifixion, as you point out. The splaying of the arms in Christ is not meaningless. To be committed to the good, to truth, one must let go of the outcome and trust in fate. This is the essence of faith. Arms splayed demonstrates letting go of the material, of the temptation to manipulate the world and to trust in God. Your comments on the disciples and grief are bang on, however it is an internal and psychological grief. The death of an old aspect of oneself must occur in order to bring about a new and more capable self. It is the internal pain associated with travelling to the special world as Joseph Campbell would put it. The fall is into oneself, into the very depths of who one is. Gandalf and Balrog land into water. The reference to water is symbolic of the unconscious. Water often appears in dreams to signify unconscious aspects which must be brought forward. Your reference to Good Friday and Easter Sunday is exactly right. During the return Gandalf is not recognised by his followers. He is the same, but also different. Again Campbell speaks about two rebirths that occur. The first being the birth of the new self and the second being the rebirth of the old self in conjunction with the new self. Obviously the analysis ends here but I think there are some additional elements from Gandalfs recollection of the events in hell. When Aragorn says “you fell” and Gandalf replied “too far”. This is referring to how the journey leads to Gandalfs ultimate demise at the end of the series. Both himself and Frodo die as a result of their confrontation with death. Whilst this seems sad, it is not. We all die. What it is saying is that this confrontation gave meaning to their lives. It became their path. What stands in the way becomes the way. The things that call to your conscience are your destiny. Gandalf has his final confrontation on the highest peak of hell. The reference to altitude is of self overcoming. The lightning is of the power of the divine. It is both light and fire. The combination of these allows is the defeat of the devil. Psychologically this is the integration of the shadow. And then finally comes the second death as previously mentioned. The long road back after the descent into the underworld. As Gandalf had to die to enter into hell, he must die again to return back to his people. He returns back whiter, again symbolic of truth, purity and newness. He forgets his name and only remembers it after Aragorn reminds him. This is the letting go of the ego, of who you think you are, to become who you are. His sense of comfort on remembering his name is perfect. Like returning home after a long absence. The ego is a part of oneself and must remain so. There we go, these are my thoughts on the scene. Brilliant scene from a brilliant series.

[@MrPriestcontent]

Wow this is immense! You certainly understand this on a much more in depth level then I ever could. Really insightful so thank you 🙏🏼

[@crawfordroses]

Love this breakdown! An intellectual delight! Thank you so much for sharing it here!

[@medieval420]

Gandolf is an INTP ( Logician ) just as Neo, Bruce Banner, the Hulk, and Sherlock Holmes. There are a few variations of the INTP, and just as there are a few variations of every personality.. It all just depends on what your purpose is to do and experience in this world. Please do some massive research on this. Then you will understand. Here are some movies that will gain you some extra views on KZbin. All four of the Matrix series ( the Matrix is loosely based on Plato's Allegory of the Cave written 380 yrs B.C. ) the Marvel Comic Universe series, especially the Hulk ( INTP ), Sherlock Holmes, INTP, and Good Will Hunting INTP. There are many more I could go on forever on here with a list. Just do some research. Knowledge and experience are the only things you can take with someone when they pass. No money or materialistic items can be taken, just the knowledge and experiences gained along the journey.

[@jeromeburoker1770]

You've been drinking the kool-aide too long!

[@user-wl4wo1nm6q]

I disagree with what you're saying totally. You read😅way too much 😔 n this movie. No only you see this in your own mind just like the rest of the world do

[@anni.68]

“The Lord of the Rings' is of course a fundamentally religious and Catholic work; unconsciously so at first, but consciously in the revision. That is why I have not put in, or have cut out practically all references to anything like 'religion,' to cults or practices, in the imaginary world. For the religious element is absorbed into the story and symbolism.” (J.R.R. Tolkien)

[@user-cy2er8qe7v]

If you dig a little deeper into Tolkien's lore and contrast it with Catholic doctrine, you'll find Gandalf is definitely not intended as a parallel for Jesus, despite some thematic similarities. Gandalf is one of many angelic beings created by Eru Ilúvatar, the one supreme God; Jesus is not a created being, but inseparable from God the Father. Jesus' death and resurrection redeems humanity from sin and opens a pathway to immortality; Gandalf's sacrifice is a straight-forward effort to save his companions from mortal danger, and his resurrection is necessary because his task (i.e., the defeat of Sauron) is not complete. There are a lot of other details, but the basic difference is that Gandalf is a secondary agent of the divine whereas Jesus is a direct manifestation of the divine. Subtle, but anybody who made it through a Catholic seminary no doubt has an affinity for theological hair-splitting. :)

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

Most of Tolkiens' work holds a lot of elements of Catholocism without being a direct representation of it. You see themes of Jesus in both Gandalf and Aragorn, even though neither character represents Jesus directly. Similarly to the languages of LOTR, none of the languages are directly tied to "real" languages used in the real world. But you can still see which real-world languages influenced the ones that Tolkien created.

[@rikk319]

@@joshuawiedenbeck6944 There are aspects of Jesus in Gandalf, Frodo, and Aragorn. I don't remember the author, but he likened them to prophet, priest, and king aspects of Jesus.