THE LORD OF THE RINGS- Priest reacts to GANDALF vs BALROG

Reaction and insight from a real Priest about this iconic Lord of the Rings scene. A great image of Jesus' sacrifice on the Cross and his Rising again, something Christians recognise epescially during Easter!
I hope this blesses you and helps you understand the Christain message.

[@GraySotirMusic]

Hey there fellow atheists! It is a fact that Tolkien was himself Catholic and used the LOTR to explore many spiritual themes. He was also a scholar and drew from countless other traditions which are not related to the Bible (i.e., Beowulf, Nordic mythology, etc.). Aspects of Gandalf's character, including his sacrifice and resurrection, are certainly inspired by Jesus. This doesn't have to change the meaning of the books/movies for you, as Gandalf's character is not deliberately an attempt at glorifying or celebrating Jesus -- rather, Gandalf was a tool that Tolkien used in his exploration of human psychology and the innate craving we share for what some prefer to call "divinity." The LOTR is meant to be non-religious, but is deeply allegorical and draws from religious archetypes to create profound meaning. Peter Jackson was keenly aware of this and made directing decisions which reflected Tolkien's deep allusions to various traditions. That is one of many reasons that the imagery in LOTR is so effective at invoking deep emotion. One of the most interesting bits of LOTR/religion analysis comes from the end of the movie. It is extremely significant that Frodo did not destroy the ring himself. Even the most pure-hearted of us will fall to temptation. This belief was an essential premise of Tolkien's general spiritual philosophy. Tolkien believed that the good in man could not defeat or overcome evil. Instead, it was the evil of Gollum that ultimately destroyed the ring. Tolkien believed that evil is inherently unstable and ultimately destroys itself -- that wickedness creates wickedness which destroys wickedness in a never ending cycle of implosion and rebirth. Meanwhile, what is good in this world is what is stable and reliable -- Sam's service and friendship to Frodo, the enduring shared mission of the Fellowship despite physical separation, etc. This is a deeply profound message that we can all take real meaning from, as it shows that good is structurally designed to endure over evil, despite evil's constant reappearance. Thanks for reading! Cheers!

[@shawnthompson2303]

I always think of Gandalf and almost Tolkien himself when I read

[@tristan1392]

Well Gandalf's role in the story makes more sense when you realize that canonically he is an angel. He says he was "sent back" not resurrected.

[@justsmashing4628]

Tolkien made no secret of the catholic themes throughout Lotr’s

[@petern1938]

Might need a reference there, because I think you're talking BS.

[@justsmashing4628]

@@petern1938 read Tolkien's biography…do you know how to read a book?

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

​@@petern1938 Tolkien was a strong Catholic. He always made fun of C.S. Lewis (they were good friends) for making The Chronicles of Narnia too on-the-nose for Catholicism. He noted that a story involving Christian themes should be more complex and subtle.

[@polaullon5116]

Actually he was far more inspired by norse mytology. Gandalf basically is Odin

[@Makkaru112]

Sorry but he hated allegory and was restoring ancient knowledge and languages destroyed by Christianity of which he openly stated how sad he was about it all.

[@raderadumilo7899]

Actually, if you read Silmarilion, then Eru/Iluvatar is the God, Valars are archangels, and Mayars are angels. Morgoth is Satan, and Sauron and balrogs are fallen angels. Gandalf is a Mayar.

[@joshman531]

I think Gandalf is more supposed to be an Angelic force than an algory for Jesus in Tolkiens broader worldview, although I'm sure all the non Angelic bible refernces (resserection etc) are obviously deliberate. Although when he's alluding to the secret fire he's referring to Eru who is God, in the films (but more in the books) Gandalf will also heavily imply a lot of "chance" events are part of Gods plan. When your talking about sacrifice you might find it interesting to know that in the Silmarillion during the fall of Gondolin two Elves manage to kill balrogs but give their lives in the attempt to allow refugees to escape. The sword Gandalf fights the Balrog with is actually from Gondolin.

[@1995IpMan]

Hello, first time watching you... I have been huge fan of lord of the rings since childhood and never noticed that Gandalf fell in a cross shape, this books and movies still continues to amaze me to this day. Tolkien writes that Gandalf fell with the Balrog far beyond that the dwarves dug, they encountered so called "nameless things" (In Tolkein lore no one knows where they came from and they are old as earth) from which Balrog fled and Gandalf chased after him... For me that little detail adds to whole good is invincible in front of evil and perfectly simbolises Jesus's victory over devil and death. Nice reaction, god bless :)

[@MrPriestcontent]

Really interesting! Great to hear your insight and thanks for taking the time to watch and comment 🙂

[@Cloofinder]

Gandalf and the Balrog are both of the Maiar. So Gamdalf amd the Balrog could be representations of Angels. The Balrog being a fallen angel and Gamdalf being a devine angel.

[@Cenindo]

Notice Gandalf's words: "I am a servant of the secret fire, wielder of the flame of Anor. The dark fire will not avail you, flame of Udûn." * Elsewhere, the "secret fire" is described as the special power of God (Eru Ilúvatar, "the "One Father of All") to give independent existence to his creations. In a wider sense, the "secret fire" has been likened to the Holy Spirit, used by God to make his influence felt in the world. Gandalf describes himself as a servant of God's power. * "Anor" can be simply the Elvish word for the Sun, but here Gandalf is probably saying that he wields the power of Light in a higher sense. * "Udûn", better known in the form Utumno, was back in the First Age the hellish underground stronghold of Morgoth, the original "devil" in Tolkien's mythology (Sauron was originally just a servant of Morgoth). So freely translated, Gandalf is calling the Balrog a "flame of Hell."

[@MrPriestcontent]

Wow thanks, so much depth to it!

[@blackeyedlily]

Having just watched this video I was going to leave a comment to explain the same things you have already done here so well. So many casual viewers of these films love this scene but never realize the significance of what Gandalf’s words are.

[@Aronprovz]

​@@blackeyedlilylol same

[@gregw74]

Perhaps it could also be argued that Gandalf is like a new Adam by way of him being a new Saruman, or rather, "...Saruman as he should have been".

[@joshman531]

While possible Tolkien had such symbolism in mind in the deeper lore Gandalf is more an Angel in a mans body sent with a specific task. The "Saruman as he should have been" remark is a reference to the switch in roles post reserection, Gandalf the Grey was sent as a sort of touring advisor, Gandalf the White is sent to help lead the free peoples through the darkness as Saruman had failed to do.

[@roddo1955]

Gandalf is like the Holy ghost. He inspires and enlightens.

[@rikk319]

@@roddo1955 When he says, "I am a servant of the Secret Fire", he's talking about the Flame Imperishable that dwells within Illuvatar and is used to create life. I always connected the Secret Fire with the Holy Spirit.

[@Mr.FleshRot]

Gandalf is one of the Miar..the Istari.. he's basically an angel...Balrog are one of the Fallen Miar...a demon. Gandalf isn't meant to be Jesus. Just an angel, a warrior of light. Stop looking for extra....

[@PakToh]

I think there is another interesting thing: Gandalf as an istari ia a maiar, something like an angel, but the balrog is also a maiar, corrupted by morgoth, the first evil that brought disharmonies to the original song eru illuvatar and all his "angels" sung to finally form all of existence. So here we see an angel fighting a fallen angel, a demon, while falling themselves. But Gandalf faith was so strong that eru illuvatar hinself brought him back to fulfill his destiny. And yes it is not one allegory, it combines several aspects, using similar pictures, but gives a new spin and a new way to access these themes to a new audience.

[@Makkaru112]

Tolkien, (The OG of all Authors) was a veteran of the First World War and many other battles such as The Battle Of Somme etc. his works of art were to give back to the England as a form of restoring lost mythologies that he himself was a master of since he was a top professor of philology at Oxford. He did ALOT of his writing while in the trenches during WWI during small “breaks” while down in those trench forts built into the ground. And while he eldest son was in the Second World War; his Lord Of The Rings writings was strictly created above all else to give his eldest something to read while stationed wherever he was stationed. I forgot that part. They sent letters back and forth about it all the time. He was also the one and only son that actually protected his fathers legacy and work. A lot of his other work were put together BY his son after his father passed away. It’s well worth to react to the documentary behind the scenes film the director and crew and cast created together as well as the interview with the son Christopher Tolkien who you get to sort of enjoy a nice indoor and outdoor chat for like what came to about 1-2 hours of wonderful footage from an era that really must not be forgotten. His work shed a light on things like The Finnish Kalevala, Norwegian Elder Edda, The Welsh Mabinogion, The Norwegian Nibelungen, The Indian Bhagvagita & Several Irish Folklore + other Cultural things! The man also restored and translated ancient relics for the governments as one everyone trusted. Much of what’s in our dictionary come from his efforts as well. Anytime he spoke & even posted several comments into the paper as an editorial or response to certain issues as a very involved man for the world and the environment everyone turned their head to listen to him as everyone knew his worth and respected him greatly. His works show how NOT to glorify war; shows in the films if you pay close attention while watching the next films. Sharing what you know now via the after thoughts at the end of the second film! Remember. Extended edition. There is a lot missed out on especially in the second movie regarding Boromir backstory which there is much more in the books but the films WANTED to keep more but the cinemas and Harvey Weinstein literally harangued him into making a “theatrical cut” which is why you have two versions. The real version and the “theatrical cut”. It was all to make more money for the company that is the theatres/cinemas. To get more showings in per day during the year. And believe me. People were camping outside and travelling the country to watch it MORE THAN ONCE. His creations literally lead to inspiring the most currently famous books games & movies we all literally wouldn’t have enjoyed and be touched to our souls core without him and his spiritually connected brilliance. That and he was a philologist professor at Oxford first and foremost which covers so many things. Not just linguistic. The man was a true genius and Jack of all trades but ultimately LOVED the simple life. The inspiration for Lord of the Rings was not any war, but author J.R.R. Tolkien's love of language. Especially Welsh, Finnish and Old English. He lamented the loss of any true English folklore, that was wiped out after the Norman invasion of 1066, so Tolkien wrote many books on these new "legends" he came up with himself. Much of which is centered around three languages he fully developed himself. Two Elven languages and Dwarvish., Númenorean Adunaic, Black Speech(warped Numenorean and elvish) They all have syntax, vocabularies, and a whole writing system that can be learned as the Tengwar alphabet is moreso to match with the spoken elvish rather than one to one for other country’s alphabet. Hundreds of people worldwide speak elvish fluently. Tolkien did draw upon his personal experience in the trenches of World War ONE, not Two, as inspiration for some parts, most notably, the Dead Marshes that Frodo and Sam and Gollum pass through in The Two Towers. But war was not the inspiration for the entire series. World Of Warcraft. Skyrim, Harry Potter, Diablo, D&D, even Warhammer and so forth wouldn’t have. Existed without taking inspiration from and or completely ripping off from Tolkien. Many great documentaries to react to about him also more about him and AWESOME stuff from the hours & hours of behind the scenes documentaries from the DVDs of the movies which are also on KZbin & I can send you a playlist to react to from top to bottom on the channel called Pajasek99 - Let’s explore Gandalf even deeper now. - Tolkien kept the Norse/Finnish/Welsh/Irish mythology alive. Magical rings, Gandalf (Staff elf in old norse and Rohan’s Rohirric Éotheod language.), Gandalfs outfit (Ødin), Gandalfs title 'the grey wanderer' (Ødin), Shadowfaxe (The horses of day and night Rhimfaxe and Skinfaxe), Trolls, elves, dwarves etc. * Ødin had a legendary horse, Sleipnir, who had eight legs and was said to be one of the greatest horses known to the gods. Gandalf had Shadowfax, who had no equal among horses in Middle-earth and could understand the speech of men. * Ødin’s legendary gear-the spear Gungnir and the ring Draupnir-could have influenced Gandalf’s legendary sword Glamdring or, more likely, the magic staff he carries, while the ring possibly influenced Gandalf’s possession of the ring Narya (Sturlson 145). * Gandalf & Ødin both receive new wisdom as a result of sacrifice, as Gandalf is reincarnated after his fight with the Balrog, and Ødin gains power and wisdom after hanging himself on the tree Yggdrasil for nine days (Sigfusson 80-85). * One of the most apparent ways in which Gandalf and Odin are alike is that they both take the shape of an old, grey beggar with a wide-brimmed hat and grey cloak when they wander the mortal world and deal with the inhabitants (Pitts 7). * Gandalf and Ødin are virtually reflections of each other, as can be observed through examining their gear and animal companions, the way they sacrificed themselves and were rewarded with wisdom, and the fact that they walk the earth as old men in tattered clothing. The Renowned Steeds of Gandalf and Ødin: both have renowned horses and staves with magical properties. Ø carries the legendary spear Gungnir, which is said never to miss its mark when thrown (Sturlson 145); however, he also carries it as his staff when he wanders the earth as an old man. In the Poetic Edda, the Valkyrie Sigrdrifa advises Sigurd about the magical application of runes and tells him that there are runes inscribed on the tip of Gungnir (Sigfusson 291). This spear could be a parallel to Glamdring, the sword that was forged for the Goblin wars but is most likely influential to the staff Gandalf carries on his journeys. Strikingly similar to Shadowfax, Odin possesses a legendary horse named Sleipnir, who has eight legs and can run on the ground and through the air at great speeds. This sounds very similar, in some ways, to Tolkien’s description of Shadowfax in The Two Towers, “Shadowfax tossed his head and cried aloud as if a trumpet had summoned him to battle. Then he sprang forward. Fire flew from his feet; night rushed over him” (Tolkien 228). Gandalf was given the ring of fire (Narya) by one of the oldest remaining elves from the first clans to wake beneath the stars before the sun and moon ever existed; at the Cuiviènen river named Círdan. Its best attribute was it raises the spirits of those who wear it. Bolstering internal strength and so forth. He knew it would aid Gandalf in his quest from the Valar and Eru Îlluvatar (the one AllFather) themselves to bolster the spirits of the free peoples of middle earth and to sow seeds of hope within the hearts of Men, Elves and Dwarves alike. - - The sword Gandalf wielded caused the Balrog’s primordial sword to burst into a rain of molten lava in an almost majestic way. It too belong to high elven king Turgon of the great hidden realm of Gondolin, surrounded by tallest mountains. Named Glamdring; meaning “Foe Hammer”. Gandalf broke the balrog’s unholy weapon. Epic right? His original staff broke when he let some of his true powers show to grant a miracle from his own life force. This is the same thing for how the elves do “magic” Galadriel herself tells Frodo and Sam that things elves do may seem like magic but they don’t really use such a word since they are one with the world, symbiotic with it if the world perished so would they. Just so you know; the balrog and Gandalf fought for 10 days straight. Then eldrich terrors(nameless things) assailed them both and they begrudgingly fought them off together and Gandalf resumed his chase of the balrog up the endless stairs of Dúrin’s Tower where they fought up at the top of ZirakZigil Gandalf was given the ring of fire (Narya) by one of the oldest remaining elves from the first clans to wake beneath the stars before the sun and moon ever existed; at the Cuiviènen river named Círdan. Its best attribute was it raises the spirits of those who wear it. Bolstering internal strength and so forth. He knew it would aid Gandalf in his quest from the Valar and Eru Îlluvatar (the one AllFather) themselves to bolster the spirits of the free peoples of middle earth and to sow seeds of hope within the hearts of Men, Elves and Dwarves alike.

[@Giovanni_Gabrielli]

It is exactly how MrPriest said. Most people don't pay attention to what Gandalf says to the Balrog (Baal, radical for demons BaalPeor, in greek Belphagor, BaalZabub, in greek Belzebub,ecc..) Gandalf was SENT from God for the purpose of helping destroy evil, and resurrects in the only exeption by the will of God. Anyway, what Gandalf says is not random gibberish, they are 2 kinds of different fire, the one that destroy and the white fire that warms and restores. The Balrog is very well aware of what Gandalf is talking about. It is speculated that the Balrog actually is not capable of following them from Moria (he CANNOT pass) because the sunlight might weaken him.

[@MrPriestcontent]

Amazing, thanks

[@MrPriestcontent]

Brilliant, thanks for sharing your insight!

[@Giovanni_Gabrielli]

@@MrPriestcontent Thank you Father!

[@Mike-eg9ok]

Basically, Gandalf is a second tier angel, a Maiar. The Balrog a fallen Maiar. The "secret fire" is the Flame Imperishable. The Flame Imperishable is the Holy Spirit. Eru Ilúvatar resurrected Gandalf in one of his 2 interventions in Middle Earth. The first being the resurection of Gandalf, the second making Gollum trip over the edge of the chasm at Mt. Doom.

[@falhacritica539]

Both of them are Maiars, the Balrog (it's the last one in middle earth from what I've heard) as is Sauron, Morgoth is an Ainur. So Maiar is a lower cast of "angel" and Ainurs are a higher cast in tolkiens work, they where the first creations of Eru (god in the middle earth universe). Balrogs are fallen Maiars that transformed and could not transform back, Sauron was once good but turned to evil (he was also a shapshifter) and also lost the hability to look human. Now Gandalf showed up in the 3rd age to help fight the incoming threat as did Saruman and the other wizards, Saruman was seduced by evil and Gandalf was not. He has a ring that enhances his powers from the flame of Arnor. The Balrog knew he screwed up when he went toe to toe with Gandalf, since he was a Maiar, imune to his fire.

[@Hazard33]

My most raw reaction to this is ' DO NOT SPOIL ME'

[@Scar-Predator]

Since you mentioned ties and parallels of Gandalf to Jesus, and also Moses, with the Balrog, Durin's Bane, being akin to a demon, it should be noted that the villain, the corrupted Maiar originally known as Mairon, the admirable, now known as Sauron, the abhorred, the deceiver, is akin to the Devil, or Lucifer. Sauron doesn't step out onto a battlefield unless necessary, his greatest strength is his wit, and his ability to use it to manipulate others.

[@KateDerrett]

Thank you I hadn’t realised there are so many parallels. So interesting and inspiring .

[@supervastgut1568]

“The Lord of the Rings is of course fundamentally a religious and Catholic work; unconsciously so at first, but consciously so in the revision. That is why I have not put in, or have cut out, practically all references to anything like ‘religion,’ to cults or practices, in the imaginary world. For the religious element is absorbed into the story and the symbolism.” - 1953 letter to Robert Murray, S.J. for any of the nonces who dont think its a fundamentally christian/catholic work

[@susannewehrmaker1303]

Good take, thank you! Only one thing... Gandalf did actually die, but he was sent back by the Valar (Holy Ones) to complete his task. And he takes the form of the "White Wizard" as Saruman had already fallen and betrayed the cause for which he had been sent.

[@RachaelPalmer-rs8qb]

Wow! Great video. I never realised how many references there were in this scene!

[@pillmuncher67]

In the beginning, Eru Iluvátar, the God of Tolkien's world, created the Ainur (angelic beings) as offspring of his mind, each representing a different aspect of said mind. Eru taught them each a musical theme and then gathered them so they would sing togerther. In this Music of the Ainur he gave them visions of his plan for the universe, Eä, and the world, Arda. After the Music of the Ainur, Eru gave each of the Ainur the choice to stay with him or to enter Arda and fashion the world according to his plan. The Valar who went to Arda became known as the High Ones or The Powers of Arda. They correspond roughly to the Greek/Norse gods, except for Melkor, the Satan figure of Tolkien's universe, and Nienna, who weeps forever and at all times "mourns for every wound that Arda has suffered in the marring of Melkor" (see below). She teaches pity and patience. The Maia Olorin was her student. He was known as the wisest of the Maiar and was later sent with four other Maiar to Middle Earth (the main continent on Arda) to help guide its people in their fight against Sauron (see also below). He was known by many names: Mithrandir, Greyhame, Old Greybeard, Grey Pilgrim, and, of course, Gandalf. The greatest of the Valar, Melkor, who had part in all of the other Valar's gifts, wanted to make his own creation and sang his own melody in the Music of the Ainur, which led to a great dissonance. He became the first Big Bad in Arda, with the Maia Mairon ("The Admirable") becoming his lieutenant. Melkor was henceforth called Morgoth ("Dark Enemy" or "Black Foe") and Mairon was called Sauron ("The Abominable"). Morgoth tried to destroy everything the other Valar had built on Arda, which became known as the Marring of Arda. After he was finally caught, he was bound in chains by the other Valar and cast into the Void. It is prophesied that at the end of times Morgoth will return, but will ultimately be defeated in a great battle - Dagor Dagorath. After that Arda will be remade in the way Eru intended it to be. Also this: The Elves, Eru's firstborn, are bound to Arda. When they die, their souls go to the Halls of Mandos (a Valar, originally named Námo) in Valinor, the Undying Lands, where they dwell for a while as spirits and are then re-incorporated, IOW, they cannot truly die. Men, Eru's secondborn, can die and where their souls go after their death only Eru knows. Elves call that The Gift of Eru and they become envious of that gift. The Dwarves, having been made in secret by the Valar Aulë the Smith and originally lacking the Flame Imperishable (what Gandalf called the Flame of Anor in his speech to the Balrog), are Eru's adopted children. After Aulë showed humility and offered to destroy the Dwarves, Eru told him that he had already given them the Flame Imperishable, but insisted that they go to sleep under the mountain where they were created until his true children had awoken. What happens to them after they die is also not known, but they believe that their souls go to Aulë - who they call Mahal - and that after the end of times, when Arda is remade, Eru will give them a place in his creation.

[@rikk319]

Excellent synopsis of the Ainulindale.

[@dupplinmuir113]

I just noticed that when Gandalf returns there's a shot where the camera looks down past him at Aragorn, Gimli, and Legoland, which is similar to a shot of Sauron in the Prologue.

[@Theeighthdoctor1996]

I genuinely think the balrog was thinking "yeah this is gonna be an open and shut battle" until he heard that shit about "I am the servant of the secret fire" and then he thought "no he can't be he's not a maiar is he?" Only for it to be confirmed as gandalf comes rushing down towards him with the sword in the intro of two towers and from what I can remember of the books gandalf apparently spent somewhere from 8 days to a millienia fighting the balrog under middle earth

[@rikk319]

He spent several days fighting the balrog, then when he was resurrected, he spent some days laying on the top of the mountain until Gwaihir found him, sent by Galadriel. While he was dead, time doesn't pass the same in Eru's Timeless Halls, so he may have spent eons there basically leveling up, so that when he returned, it had been so long to him that he didn't recall the name of Gandalf very well anymore.

[@GRWelsh7]

Those were all good observations. In retrospect, and based on the writings in some of Tolkien's letters, I think Eru Ilúvatar (God) intervened in the story more than I first realized. It's most overt with sending Gandalf back, but it is also the 'luck' or the 'fate' that determines certain key events like Bilbo finding the One Ring and Gollum falling into the Fire.

[@Fletcherinho]

Yes, that why I celebrate Easter. Beacuase Jesus fought a balrog.

[@philgonzalez5953]

Very important, gandalf realized he had this one chance to rid the world of a demon. Just like the Hobbit, he realized what sauron would do with control of a dragon.

[@JWJ_Holloway]

Love this man ^_^ keep it up ! And Thank you 🙏

[@williamfoster4150]

The most Christian reference in LotR is the ending. In any ordinary movie we would have a heroes story, but in LotR Frodo, in the end, succumbs to the ring, because he also is only mortal, resilient as he is (and in a Christian sense has original sin). The ring is destroyed by gods grace by using Gollum as a vessel. Gods grace is enabled by Frodo's compassion and kindness towards Gollum. So the statement here is that humanity cannot defeat all evil, but if we are good within our own means it will allow gods grace and salvation. This lessons was Tolkien's takeaway from WWI where he encountered so much death and misery and where LoTR was conceived.

[@williamfoster4150]

Also Gandalf is not really an allegory to Jesus in a literal sense but more to an angel in the literal sense (messenger). Tolkien's backstory to LotR is the Christian creation mythology. Both the Balrog and Gandalf are lesser angels. According to Tolkien the "Maia" (the lesser angels) and Valar (the archangels so to speak) appear according to their essence and state of spirit. The Balrog is therefore not a demon but a fallen angel, and his appearance - rage and destruction - is the form he chooses because it matches his spirit. Gandalf spirit is that of a guide to mortals and therefore his form is that of an old wise man.

[@williamfoster4150]

The "secret fire" is taunt towards the Balrog. It is the privilege of god which is original creation. In LotR it is explicitly stated that evil cannot create but only corrupt (the orcs are corrupted and warped elves). The "secret fire" is what Morgoth (satan) searched for desperately in the void and could never find. It is cause for his original envy towards god fueled by his pride. He wanted to defy the original "song of creation" and wanted to create by himself (pride) but he only could corrupt. There is another reference to this in the movie most people probably won't get: when Frodo puts on the ring in the tavern and Sauron speaks to him "there is no life in the void", he is referencing this.

[@MrPriestcontent]

Amazing mate love that take never thought of the ending like that 😲

[@williamfoster4150]

@@MrPriestcontent It is somewhat in plain sight, though the dots are fairly scattered :-) When Frodo's initial instinct was to wish death on Gollum in the mines of Moriah, Gandalf said this: "Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgement. For even the very wise cannot see all ends. I have not much hope that Gollum can be cured before he dies, but there is a chance of it. And he is bound up with the fate of the Ring. My heart tells me that he has some part to play yet, for good or ill, before the end; and when that comes, the pity of Bilbo may rule the fate of many - yours not least." So clearly, right from the beginning Gandalf was aware that there was Gods plan. And it was Bilbo's and Frodo's free will towards good that would allow it to happen (or not). Frodo could never defeat Sauron or resist the ring (neither could Gollum or Isildur) but he had the free will to show mercy towards Gollum, and that was what he was ultimately judged upon and would determine the fate of the world.

[@johndimick1767]

​@@williamfoster4150 Knowledgeable commentary. Good stuff.

[@NotANameist]

Very nice, thanks Father!

[@Fuchs320]

i mean Gandalaf is Maiar a Servant of Eru Iluvatar so yeah he is a divine Servant

[@sonofculloden2]

I love Gandalf and his character. Inspiring. More than I can put into words.

[@eddietucker7005]

I had the same thoughts, not knowing Tolkien was a Cristian.

[@custardflan]

I never did notice Gandalfs crucifixion pose. Thanks

[@petern1938]

I'm sorry, he's clutching at straws. Why is the crucifix the shape it is? You take a person and extend their arms (with their head forming the top of the cross) and you have a cross. Crucifixion was a normal form of execution before any religious symbolism. Gandalf is an 'angel' (Maiar) not even a god (valar) and not the 'son' of the creator Eru Iluvatar. It is correctly stated that Tolkien disliked allegory, any parallels are therefore projections of MrPriest.

[@custardflan]

@@petern1938 so it was an accident? PJ didn't catch that? I kind of agree with your general review of the reaction video, however.

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

​@petern1938 Tolkien stated that he disliked "direct allegory." Meaning, he wanted his stories to be interpreted based on each individuals experience and not force them to come to specific conclusions. It is pretty clear Tolkien had some rough ideas of what all of the characters represented. He just didn't want to force his ideas on someone.

[@custardflan]

@@joshuawiedenbeck6944 Riiiiiiiiight. That's not allegory, however. That's a decision by PJ. Pilgrim's Progress is allegory.

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

@@custardflan Absolutely, there is a difference between Tolkien and the movies. The movies are an interpretation of what Tolkien wrote, so there will be liberties taken.

[@FREDERIKBK-q2m]

on direct parallels neither would i i like that gandalf is taken from tolkiens idea of a priestly or bisphoric person he actually based gandalf on a clergyman he knew and was friends with himself as for the false flame and the true flame this parallels the devils and the fallen angels and demons protrayal of themselves as beings of light and goodness when they are really not and how this false flame is outshined by the true flame which gandalfs holds gandalf being both symbolically and parallel to a priest while also being an angel a servant of the true flame and the true light sent to middle earth to bring light to the mortal world while the demon is covered in flames it is not lit nor does it light up anything as it instead enveloped in darkness and seems to only barely brighten the darkness around it as it's false fire cannot bring true light only a perverse apppearance of illumination and by parallel power as despite it's powerful appearance it is overcome by something much smaller in statue than it yet much bigger in true power ephesians 6:12 12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. this is a battle between the true light and the demonic world sauron presents himself t omiddle earth as a being of light from heaven but is in fact of the heavenlies and is false yet far more dangerous than the outright demon the balrog for he deceives a chines equote goes something like this "cao cao is far more devious than dong zhuo while dong zhuo openly usurped the han cao cao pretends to uphold the han while secretly usurping it " "cao cao cannot be compared to Dong Zhuo he is a hundred times more cunning and devious than Dong Zhuo was" and just the same the demonic cannot be compared to the heavenlies and their false divinity there are false heavens and paradises aerial toll houses and heavenlies great powers thrones and dominions one must understand that while Cao Cao's authority is presented as coming from the emperor or in the name thereof but each word in that scroll was dictated by Cao Cao once the lords of the realm accept the decree they will be forced to submit a memorial of submission that way it will mean that you acknowledge that Cao Cao's controlling of the emperor to command the lords is legitimate but if you reject the decree you would violate the code of a vassal then Cao Cao will say that you despite beinga vassal of the Han are in defiance of the imperial court besides if you accept this decree of grace today what if tomorrow they send us one that is undersirable? what if they order you to pay tribute in grain or withdraw your troops or even cede territory would the lords then acccept the decree or not? and thereefore that villain Cao Cao has alreayd fullfiled his wicked purpose why must cao cao control the emperor and coerce the lords? why must he grant promotions through the emperors decress t oall the lords but not himself ? because in his eyes he is already the emperor and the emperor is him he already is the undisputed leader of the realm so he has no need to promote himself anymore much the same the heavenlies present themselves as coming with the authority of the kingdom of the lord why must they offer gifts and all sorts of other things to the kings lords and judges of the earth but do not promote themselves beyond the position they already hold because they do not need to promote themselves higher as they are already the authority of heaven itself and their heavenly is the heaven and heaven is the heavenly and as such the tyrants and their aerial toll houses have already fullfilled their wicked purpose in deceiving man for man is not condemned by GOD but by man himself through his own decision or unwillingness for GOD has taken the price of sin which is death upon himself so that we may live for god so loved man if you believe in god no matter how much it may appear that thet have power and authority and dominion over you and your descendents that power is no more real than what they can convince you it is luke 10:19- "Behold, I give you the power of treading upon serpents and scorpions and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall in anywise injure you. " i.4pcdn.org/pol/1515714905834.jpg (i originally came across this on an image board on 8chan later endchan and neinchan on christian boards and threads later on in Christchannel.xyz while that was a thing and i was very interested in deepening my understanding of christendom and christianity to which is belong as well as christian art architecture and literature this was back when i wanted to start a translation of the bible of my own including aporcrypthia and verses both eastern and western inclduing additions to books and extra verses that do exist in cannon but are not commonly in print like ones found in psalms or the story about the dragon as well as the books of maccabee and notes about disputed translation for study purposes in notes after the main bread text and biblical cannon such as the matter of riginal vs acnestral sin that is being born with sin vs being born with a tendency towards sin could probably still find image floating around image board and forums but that is where is remember finding it and i know it is eastern stuff while this channel seems to be western we are all christians and i am linking it here because i think some people may find use of it ) SORRY FOR THE TEXT WALLS I JUST WROTE WHAT CAME TO MIND WHILST WATCHING THE VIDEO THANKS FOR THE CONTENT KEEP IT UP IN TEXT IN CASE YOU DO NOT WISH TO CLICK RANDOM LINKS THE SIX STAGES OF TEMPTATION Although it is common knowledge to many, I have met few Christian young people who un- derstand the Six Stages of Temptation as set forth by patristic and ascetic sources mainly within the Philokalia, The arena of daily battle for Christians is the mind and the mind is assualted daily by thoughts. As a young man, I viewed these thoughts as inseperable from my being and since the thoughts were usuallyfoul and blasphemous, I viewed myselfas such. When I first read about the 6 Stages, Iwas set free from agreat deal ofguilt and it became my desire to help others become free. It s important to note, that for many, the first fourstages take place imme- diately and without ourknowledge. With time, a person will be able to see the stages as they take place and fight against them. This is the beginning of the road to sinlessness, or at least the pursuit ofsuch, as Christ says, "Be ye perfect as I am perfect," and "Go and sin no more, lest something worse befall you." The Six Stages are as Follows: Suggestion: Our lives are absolutely overflowing with "suggestions" such as images, videos and blasphemous thoughts. This is the stage in which we must wage war. The temptation must be crushed with the various weapons of warfare, especially the sign of the cross and the Jesus Prayer. Remember that absolutely no sin is commit- ed at this stage. It is simply the demons pelting us with the arrows of suggestion. Disturbance of the Intellect: This stage is the "calm before the storm"- the brief pause as we come to the self-awareness that we have a choice to fight for good or evil by accepting or refusing the suggestion. No sin has been committed in this stage either, but we are already beginning to play with fire by allowing this slight pause to go unchecked. Coupling: The coupling stage is when we begin to become attached to the thought. We think of the possibilites and create our own thoughts and imagine sinful deeds. This is the beginning of sin and we are guilty of any new thoughts conceived but the root thought is not inacted, so do not give up but cast the thought aside! Assent: Once we decide to commit a sin, to act upon the thought, we have en- tered the 4th stage and we are guilty of commiting the sin at least in thought, even though God willing, we might be saved from the actual action. Predisposition: Continueslyslipping into stage 4 leads to a "predispition" to a particularsin orsinning. The fathers call this the "2"nature". Ourhuman nature is fallen and predisposed to sin but it is not our nature to sin. Sin can become our 2nd nature. In other words, our true nature is purity and sin is something foreign. "FR. SOPHRONY, HOW WILL WE BE SAVED?" Passion: In this final stage the thought has become a passion, dominating our lives, making us obsess over the sin and driving us to sin habitually and repeatedly. De- spite this, the passion can and must be rooted out and healed. The effort will take every ounce of strenght we have, but God is faithfull and will deliver us! "STAND ON THE EDGE OF THE ABYSS AND WHEN YOU FEEL THAT IT IS BEYOND YOUR STRENGTH, BREAK OFF AND HAVE A CUP OF TEA." I am neither clergy nor ordained nor professional learned or in any way an acedemic source i advice and should in no way be consulted or regarded as a theological authority and that you should do your own research on the matter and draw your own conclusions and consult the clergy or theologians on the matter and verify your self or with them not by me i may be very wrong

[@FREDERIKBK-q2m]

the staff thing and the shattering of the bridge could be compared to the shutting of the path through the sea by GOD through moses so that the pharaoh and his army could not pursue them i donøt know if you are eastern or western i just kinda stumbled upon your channel

[@scottmccabe7586]

The scene is loaded with symbolism, I can’t help thinking your analysis is quite basic. I didn’t notice the shape Gandalf falls in before, so I’ll give you that. It is the fundamental story of man. The hero’s journey. The descent into the depths, defeat of ones dragon, death, rebirth and finally the return. The bridge is important. It separates two worlds, one of heaven and one of hell. Gandalf is a leader, and like all good leaders he does not lead from the front, but the back. He leads by encouraging others to to lead, specifically Aragorn. Gandalf is the archetype of the wise old man, he is representative of the holy trinity. In the conflict between Gandalf and Balrog, the light vs darkness is not simple or basic. Light is representative of truth, and darkness is the antithesis of truth. Flames are destructive, and of course symbolic of hell. Gandalf appears hurt when he blocks the attack with his shield. This is to signify that Gandalf is at his limit when confronting this foe. Since Gandalf is of a higher type, perhaps the highest type, this informs us that this evil is an opposing and equally capable force. Gandalf tells the Balrog to go back to the shadow. This highlights how Gandalf is not the aggressor. This is an important aspect of goodness. To not simply be harmless, but not look for conflict or pursue it. Doing so always originates from the prince of lies, and it is a lie to oneself most of all. The whip Balrog wields is significant and represents dominance, the pursuit of material gain and domination over the world. It signifies a narcissistic love of oneself as well as a deluded conceptualisation of oneself as wholly good. Something only true evil can ever believe. The whip grabbing Gandalfs ankle has symbolic meaning but I can’t put my finger on it unfortunately. Gandalf does not fall into the abyss, he lets go. This is an important distinction. The voluntarily descent into the depths with his arms wide open is similar to the crucifixion, as you point out. The splaying of the arms in Christ is not meaningless. To be committed to the good, to truth, one must let go of the outcome and trust in fate. This is the essence of faith. Arms splayed demonstrates letting go of the material, of the temptation to manipulate the world and to trust in God. Your comments on the disciples and grief are bang on, however it is an internal and psychological grief. The death of an old aspect of oneself must occur in order to bring about a new and more capable self. It is the internal pain associated with travelling to the special world as Joseph Campbell would put it. The fall is into oneself, into the very depths of who one is. Gandalf and Balrog land into water. The reference to water is symbolic of the unconscious. Water often appears in dreams to signify unconscious aspects which must be brought forward. Your reference to Good Friday and Easter Sunday is exactly right. During the return Gandalf is not recognised by his followers. He is the same, but also different. Again Campbell speaks about two rebirths that occur. The first being the birth of the new self and the second being the rebirth of the old self in conjunction with the new self. Obviously the analysis ends here but I think there are some additional elements from Gandalfs recollection of the events in hell. When Aragorn says “you fell” and Gandalf replied “too far”. This is referring to how the journey leads to Gandalfs ultimate demise at the end of the series. Both himself and Frodo die as a result of their confrontation with death. Whilst this seems sad, it is not. We all die. What it is saying is that this confrontation gave meaning to their lives. It became their path. What stands in the way becomes the way. The things that call to your conscience are your destiny. Gandalf has his final confrontation on the highest peak of hell. The reference to altitude is of self overcoming. The lightning is of the power of the divine. It is both light and fire. The combination of these allows is the defeat of the devil. Psychologically this is the integration of the shadow. And then finally comes the second death as previously mentioned. The long road back after the descent into the underworld. As Gandalf had to die to enter into hell, he must die again to return back to his people. He returns back whiter, again symbolic of truth, purity and newness. He forgets his name and only remembers it after Aragorn reminds him. This is the letting go of the ego, of who you think you are, to become who you are. His sense of comfort on remembering his name is perfect. Like returning home after a long absence. The ego is a part of oneself and must remain so. There we go, these are my thoughts on the scene. Brilliant scene from a brilliant series.

[@MrPriestcontent]

Wow this is immense! You certainly understand this on a much more in depth level then I ever could. Really insightful so thank you 🙏🏼

[@crawfordroses]

Love this breakdown! An intellectual delight! Thank you so much for sharing it here!

[@Makkaru112]

Sorry but why the heck did you react to this 3 months before reacting to the fellowship movie you just posted. Spoiled yourself.

[@MrPriestcontent]

😳

[@Mike-e7s]

Think the Wizards represent Angels.

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

Wizards are definitely what we would understand as angels. They serve Eru (LOTRs version of god). Balrogs are equivalent to wizards in terms of power and served on behalf of Morgoth (LOTRs version of satan). The book version of Balrogs has them as more shadow figures whose darkness consumes everything around them than firey devils.

[@medieval420]

Gandolf is an INTP ( Logician ) just as Neo, Bruce Banner, the Hulk, and Sherlock Holmes. There are a few variations of the INTP, and just as there are a few variations of every personality.. It all just depends on what your purpose is to do and experience in this world. Please do some massive research on this. Then you will understand. Here are some movies that will gain you some extra views on KZbin. All four of the Matrix series ( the Matrix is loosely based on Plato's Allegory of the Cave written 380 yrs B.C. ) the Marvel Comic Universe series, especially the Hulk ( INTP ), Sherlock Holmes, INTP, and Good Will Hunting INTP. There are many more I could go on forever on here with a list. Just do some research. Knowledge and experience are the only things you can take with someone when they pass. No money or materialistic items can be taken, just the knowledge and experiences gained along the journey.

[@Gary-q6e6k]

I disagree with what you're saying totally. You read😅way too much 😔 n this movie. No only you see this in your own mind just like the rest of the world do

[@anni.68]

“The Lord of the Rings' is of course a fundamentally religious and Catholic work; unconsciously so at first, but consciously in the revision. That is why I have not put in, or have cut out practically all references to anything like 'religion,' to cults or practices, in the imaginary world. For the religious element is absorbed into the story and symbolism.” (J.R.R. Tolkien)

[@jeromeburoker1770]

You've been drinking the kool-aide too long!

[@jeremymaxwell7251]

Allegory to the divine?GANDALF WAS LITERALLY AN ANGELIC BEING SENT BY THE HIGHEST DIVINE AUTHORITY TO INSPIRE HUMANITY TO FIGHT THE DARKNESS,read the simmirilion,it explains why GANDALF was in middle earth and WHOM EXACTLY SENT HIM THERE. On the same note,sauruman was of the same order,an example of how the angels are fillable and human."wizard"-"angel" not much difference huh.at least in this genre.ty for the video.

[@MattMcHugh-o1l]

If you dig a little deeper into Tolkien's lore and contrast it with Catholic doctrine, you'll find Gandalf is definitely not intended as a parallel for Jesus, despite some thematic similarities. Gandalf is one of many angelic beings created by Eru Ilúvatar, the one supreme God; Jesus is not a created being, but inseparable from God the Father. Jesus' death and resurrection redeems humanity from sin and opens a pathway to immortality; Gandalf's sacrifice is a straight-forward effort to save his companions from mortal danger, and his resurrection is necessary because his task (i.e., the defeat of Sauron) is not complete. There are a lot of other details, but the basic difference is that Gandalf is a secondary agent of the divine whereas Jesus is a direct manifestation of the divine. Subtle, but anybody who made it through a Catholic seminary no doubt has an affinity for theological hair-splitting. :)

[@joshuawiedenbeck6944]

Most of Tolkiens' work holds a lot of elements of Catholocism without being a direct representation of it. You see themes of Jesus in both Gandalf and Aragorn, even though neither character represents Jesus directly. Similarly to the languages of LOTR, none of the languages are directly tied to "real" languages used in the real world. But you can still see which real-world languages influenced the ones that Tolkien created.

[@rikk319]

@@joshuawiedenbeck6944 There are aspects of Jesus in Gandalf, Frodo, and Aragorn. I don't remember the author, but he likened them to prophet, priest, and king aspects of Jesus.

[@KayakerDude-cw1kk]

CS Lewis and Tolkien were best friends and Christian themes influenced them both heavily. Notice Gandalf was baptized by both water and fire (baptism by fire is what it means to be baptized by the holy spirit) when he fought the Balrog aka Satan and was resurrected into a more powerful, pure(Gandalf the white) and eternal form - A transformation we as Christians look to attain through Christ after he defeated Satan and death by suffering and sacrificing his flesh body for us and raised and glorified 3 days later - Greatest act of love and mercy ever