The Low-Trust Society: A Conversation with David Brooks (Episode

Sam Harris speaks with David Brooks about the state of American democracy and the liberal world order. They discuss the weakness of moral individualism, the loss of social trust, the dangers of identity politics, what happened to the Republican Party, the hatred of elites, the 2024 Presidential Election, the Trump indictments, the war in Ukraine, moral force, the roots of liberalism, the various flavors of Trump support, the Biden presidency, Hunter Biden’s laptop scandal, Biden’s prospects in 2024, Nikki Haley, economic inequality, the problems with meritocracy, the state of media and social media, the lure of conspiracy thinking, the politics of recognition, our handling of the Covid pandemic, our difficulties acknowledging uncertainty, our withdrawal from Afghanistan, the limits of American power, and other topics.
David Brooks is a columnist for The New York Times and a contributor to The Atlantic. He is a commentator on “The PBS Newshour." His forthcoming book How To Know A Person: The Art of Seeing Others Deeply and Being Deeply Seen will be published in October. His previous three books were The Second Mountain, The Road to Character, and The Social Animal: The Hidden Sources of Love, Character, and Achievement, all #1 New York Times bestsellers. Mr. Brooks has taught at Yale and Duke and now teaches at the University of Chicago. He has received over 30 honorary degrees from American universities and is a member of the American Academy of Arts & Sciences.
Twitter: @nytdavidbrooks
September 18, 2023
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[@gamlielsassoon9039]

Thank you Sam for the hard work you are doing. Hearing your voice of reason is helpful to me staying mindful.

[@AA-cg3gd]

Sam Harris has 0 credibility at this point. Not sure why anyone is watching but the idea of him talking about distrust is pretty hilarious.

[@abstractnonsense3253]

It's not that your class has too much power David. It's that many in your class have too much power AND are using it to do abominable things. It's VERY different from what you're saying.

[@MichaelJohnson-vi6eh]

Aren't the abominable things done by the investor, lobbyist class? Why are Trumpians attacking cultural stuff and not super rich stock brokers and international capitalists?

[@Coconut-219]

Do untrustworthy things win untrustworthy prizes.

[@cmdrsliman]

Perhaps people are less trusting because they've seen that by accepting the traditional norms that they're constantly told are good for them and society, this has not actually been proven true. In fact what people have seen is the wealthy and powerful taking more than their fair share. Being resource greedy while the people remain poor and the environment they live in becomes polluted and desolate.

[@elliominati]

Agreed. Don't let the neolibs call you a doomer. They will and you will doubt yourself. Remind yourself that an addiction to positivity is how we got into this "enlightened centrist" nightmare.

[@teagame1011]

Maybe I'm misinterpreting this, but alot of the things that are causing distrust in Americans and some European countries I wouldn't call "traditional norms" more the exact opposite, more counter-cultural if you will.

[@Malt454]

Then erase the current system, replace it with nothing more than might makes right and the ends justify the means and see how the lot of the little guy and society improves then. It's where we're heading with the GOP... and if you think it cares about the poor or the environment, I have some bridges I'd like to sell you.

[@cmdrsliman]

@@Malt454 That's a bit extreme, the system works extremely well. It's the distribution of resources that causes the real problem. People want to feel that they're getting a fair share.

[@Malt454]

@@cmdrsliman - Right, but some want to get it by trashing everything we currently have; when the ends justify the means, you get bad results.

[@SuspendedLogic]

At least David Brooks knows he is part of the hated class. I love the introspection. ❤

[@twntwrs]

He's just recently come to that realization under duress. Doesn't look as if anything will move Sam in that direction.

[@mrpopo8298]

You sound really condescending: oh look at this wretch who I hate, he's learned to introspect, good boy *pat pat* have a bonio

[@karagi101]

The hated class is hated because they are educated and successful. Not a great reason to hate people unless you’re a loser that didn’t bother doing the hard work needed to succeed in life.

[@mrpopo8298]

@@karagi101 I am a loser who sucks, but I don't hate. I guess these guys are losers who suck - like me - but they probably refuse to accept responsibility for that and scapegoat others.

[@never2yield20]

@@karagi101 No, two things. 1)Meritocracy is a myth, the syetem is gamed (Univerity Legacy admissions is one example. 2) Both parties who had leaders from "hated elites" abandoned the economic middle working class, and supported the "global free trade" which simply led to jobs moving out of the USA. But that had started way back in the 70's and only accelerated in the decades that followed. The economic shifts in this country would catch many ill prepared to manage. But hey Trump was offering hope to some to earn a decent wage digging coal out of the depths of earth. LoL. The guy was and is a complete effing con-man moron. The effing M a direct quote from one of the "hated corporate elites" that briefly worked for him.

[@IvanTokmenin]

Thank you Sam for everything you do!

[@wasdwasdedsf]

lol

[@jestermoon]

Take A Moment Professor Harris, my fellow ape. Thank you again and again. As a 28-year veteran of the RAF I have lived with PTSD for 40 years. After failing to move a mountain with my car, I woke up and realized I needed more help. Please don't try it. You don't need it. Talking is all we have. I have always wanted to subscribe. However, I don't have the money to support your vital information. Take the money from the ads. This world needs you. I don't have the funds to pay for a subscription. Would you think about it. Your audience will grow and grow. Thank you for your work 🙏 No god's required or seen in my foxhole Stay Safe and Stay Free 🌐 I believe that you

[@cathym3]

Loved this conversation! Thank you Sam!

[@ronkrate609]

Wealth inequality will put a big hurt on us.

[@uphillbill]

These two guys have nailed. So lucky to be able to get the actual lowdown without all the bravado and crap you get from many. Thanks!

[@Jake-Day]

Trust is earned.

[@lorenzo6868]

Western overnments are performing at least as good as 50 years ago. Historically they are doing great. Cut them some slack.

[@redaderoua8816]

Everybody and I literally mean everybody lies, I bet you lied a few times this month so far but you expect total and pure devotion and honesty to have any type of trust in people or organizations, you're a joker

[@williamthompson3288]

Well, apart from Sam, none of the bozos in the IDW are trustworthy, I can promise you that.

[@williamthompson3288]

You can trust them to be ignorant and blow a bunch of goddamn fucking nonsense out their asses, and that's about it.

[@thunderstruck1078]

@@lorenzo6868 you are delusional.

[@dmr6390]

I can’t believe that David Brooks said that the economic discontent in our country has been eased. Has he not seen the price of housing, education, and healthcare?!

[@DouwedeJong]

Macroeconomic figures seems to be the measure they take and individual suffering is not taken into account.

[@elliominati]

"Investors are doing well so maybe the peasants won't sharpen their pitchforks"

[@mathieuguillet4036]

Our elite are completely disconnected from economic reality.

[@bryguy306]

Brooks is either hilariously wrong about the modern economy, or he’s shamelessly carrying water for the Establishment. In either case, makes for a perfect guest on Sam’s show. Fits right in.

[@merlepatterson]

...and gas?

[@GenXersJustWalkItOff]

Housekeeping is my fave. Can’t wait!

[@DonaldAMisc]

I don't get it. Do people wait for Sam to post a video just so they can criticize him in the comments?! 🤷‍♂️

[@thereligionofrationality8257]

Some. Yes. Because he obviously deserves it.

[@GSDKXV]

They’re called bots and anyone above a room temp IQ doesn’t take them seriously

[@brian782]

Yes I do

[@brian782]

Yes I do

[@CP-nl2zb]

Sam is a world champion pseudo intellectual. Sammy The Pseudo Harris

[@mclarenf2165]

Matt taibbi a conspiracy theoriest now? Rrally Sam?

[@yamishogun6501]

Brooks is wrong to say GDP of the EU and US were about equal in 1990 and "now the U.S. is crushing Europe." In 1990, Europe was at $31,000 GDP per capita and the U.S. was at $39,000, so Europe was at 79% the U.S. In 2022, Europe was at $43,000 and the U.S. at $63,000 (2015 dollars for all), so Europe is at 68% GDP per capita of the U.S. Lower, but the US and Europe were never equal.

[@DennisMoore664]

Brooks is good, especially for a reporter who favors the conservative side of politics, but he definitely says things that discourage trust.

[@jlvandat69]

David Brooks is one of the precious few conservatives who has retained true to democratic principles and ethical conduct through the Trump era. As a dem, he has my sincere respect.

[@bryguy306]

As much as the Left wishes it were so, simply declaring something doesn’t make it true. You can say you’re anti-fascist; but when you beat up people in the street over a political disagreement… You can be a man and claim you’re a woman; but when you’re sick and the medication to make you well is gender-dependent… Brooks can claim he’s a conservative… See what I’m getting at?

[@twntwrs]

Brooks is the pet presentable conservative for hire palatable to the NPR types.

[@economist737]

Precocious? Hmm, maybe when he was reading Paddington.

[@bernardvance9041]

Brooks is in no way a conservative.

[@MichaelJohnson-vi6eh]

I have progressive friends academics even who despise him and I just don't get it. I've been a fan for years.

[@lsmlsm2115]

Thanks again Sam. Subscribed and listening.

[@lucaslovesyouiii]

The fade out at the end really got me this time. You’re a crafty old fox Mr Harris

[@srussifordwilliams]

Amazing thank you both

[@kropotkinbeard1]

Perhaps had read Chomsky he wouldn't have interpreted everything as being so "naive". NOTHING Brooks says wasn't discussed by Chomsky ad nauseam. At least he seems to recognize how arthritic the "invisible hand" is.

[@elliominati]

The old guard is slipping

[@automatofix]

I like your extended metaphor

[@jerrykaralis2679]

thank you for this

[@user-rs3nm6gl2k]

Love watching Brooks on PBS Newshour. Anyone else believe Sam would provide useful commentary on the same platform?

[@AdventureTrust]

Mr Harris will never be welcome on PBS. Emotional journalism cuts right and left.

[@user-rs3nm6gl2k]

Can you explain that last part to me please? @@AdventureTrust

[@gnubbiersh647]

@@user-rs3nm6gl2k it says a lot about the state of intellectual discussion when this JOURNALIST can defend bidens mental degradation and sam just accepts it. they dont even mention the shaking hands with nothing, or the ice cream debacle. "yeah biden was batting 93 now hes batting 87." "ok next question"

[@slashtrio]

I haven’t listed to this yet but look forward to. I’m a big fan of Sam and am definitely a pretty liberal guy. I have always liked David Brooks on PBS and find him to be intelligent and thoughtful. If most republicans were like him the country would be a lot better.

[@twntwrs]

That's his role on NPR/PBS: The token palatable to liberals conservative.

[@hannibalbarca2939]

“If only more conservatives were actually liberal, this country would be so much better.” 🤡

[@Sanosukeafo]

​@twntwrs Well to be fair, given the official GOP charter lists as goals things like "Ban gay marriage" and "Make abortions from the moment of conception illegal", it's no easy task to sound reasonable as a republican.

[@twntwrs]

@@Sanosukeafo I didn't say he wasn't earning his keep. 😉

[@JB-hq9yj]

@@Sanosukeafothat’s hardly the official charter, muppet. Enjoy your hyperbole in your little echo chamber here.

[@cathyallen3967]

In my opinion David Brook is still too naive and kind in his assessment of his classes moral blindness and characters like Tucker and Guiliani. As a Canadian l used to be annoyed by American pontificators who talk about Europe but don't even seem aware of our existence. But l now appreciate how being an outsider made it easy for me to see as far back as the late 70's all the problems their bashing of unions and the poor and their unfettered capitalist economic policies were going to do to the social fabric.

[@iiiooiiiooiiio]

I am half Ukranian so I follow the dynamics of this war closely, and I disagree about the idea that the USA "forced Putin's hand" by failing diplomatically. USA under Trump had very real problems when it comes to diplomacy, but Putin has isolated himself for years, especially during the pandemic, and started contemplating fascist ideology, reading authors like Goebbels (he said it publically). The narrative of the "Russian Empire that has been split apart by the rotting west" is an ideological statement that is sold to the public as the motive for the invasion, that leaves aside important factors like USA being a major help to the Soviet Union during WWII. His real purpose was to get himself a chunk of the Ukrainan territory, rich in natural resources to steal and personally benefit from (alongside the russian corrupt elite that supports him), and to remain in history as a "great unifiier of the Russian nation". This would have possibly risen his rating among the russian population, giving him an opportunity to continue to suck up all the finances from his own country, leaving the population to rot in poverty. I believe he is a deluded dictator, not someone who has been really provoked.

[@contemplativeidiot1]

If we had leaned on France and Germany harder during the initial vote to make Ukraine apart of NATO there would have been no gray zone or power vacuum for Russian influence to take advantage of. Do I think we could've have twisted their arms hard enough, not sure. Did we really try all that hard, not really.

[@glasszeraki9195]

Regarding the moral part of the discussion: there are people that seem to actively argue against moralization. Jordan Peterson has said, “Do not moralize at me.” Which to me just means: “Don’t tell me what to do, I can do whatever I want.”

[@stanley5394]

What does it mean to say “the market is healing” when, according to RFK jr., three companies-Black Rock, State Street and Vanguard-own 88% of the SNP 500? Brooks’ rosy economic analysis is like talking about today’s weather while ignoring the climate.

[@karagi101]

RFK Jr?! Seriously?! The guy’s a quack that sounds intelligent to uneducated people. Those 3 companies don’t own 88% of the SNP 500. Not even close. It’s not difficult to fact check that rubbish assertion. But you couldn’t be bothered to. Could you?

[@beefandbarley]

Brooks is a shill and mealy mouthed one at that.

[@Zak_Meents]

Excellent conversation. Brooks (and Sam) hit the nail on the head.

[@gnubbiersh647]

it says a lot about the state of intellectual discussion when this JOURNALIST can defend bidens mental degradation and sam just accepts it. they dont even mention the shaking hands with nothing, or the ice cream debacle. "yeah biden was batting 93 now hes batting 87." "ok next question"

[@goldenrod15]

Respectfully, the airplane argument didn't work for me because I saw what happened with the Palestine train derailment. I wonder if you could help me hold the two truths that some institutions are to be trusted and others are simply corrupt and where to go from there.

[@MightySheep]

One thing I've noticed about political pundits who try to analyze human behavior (like why people vote for Trump) is that they come at it from an overly serious angle. Whereas I think a lot of people don't take politics that seriously and just think he's funny in the random youtube clips they see of him and its just a basic case of him being more likable than someone like Hilary. It's not that deep. Where Sam might see calling the election rigged as some great world ending calamity of epic proportions, most people just see it as "a bad look" or "a bit petty".

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

Exactly this. I think people also underestimate how many people voted for Trump because they knew the establishment didn't want them too.

[@manneborg]

I recommend to read some Pinker too, he has more of a positive outlook and lots of data to back it up.

[@DouwedeJong]

Be careful. The data is not always what Pinker makes it to be. There is a crisis in Psychology and he is in the middle of it.

[@beefandbarley]

Pinker is a relativist and a hack for establishment power.

[@ak4good]

What a great conversation. Love David Brooks.

[@aaron2709]

Great.

[@DestroManiak]

Trust is so low in our society that we can't even believe claims of airport food bills on twitter...

[@EnglishUnlockedYT]

Waiting for the housekeeping episode!!

[@marcevan1141]

I am to the left of Brooks but I have to admit he came off well here. I was actually pleasantly surprised at his articulate defense of Biden's presidency. I just wish he could see that the seeds for the current Republican Party were planted long ago.

[@DUDEBroHey]

Biden tried relating to people who lost their homes in Maui Hawaii by talking about a small kitchen fire in his home. Biden doesn't even pretend to care about anyone.

[@wasdwasdedsf]

of course he came off well. hes a leftist establishmentarian

[@gnubbiersh647]

it says a lot about the state of intellectual discussion when this JOURNALIST can defend bidens mental degradation and sam just accepts it. they dont even mention the shaking hands with nothing, or the ice cream debacle. "yeah biden was batting 93 now hes batting 87." "ok next question"

[@gnubbiersh647]

??

[@witherbossbros1157]

"I was actually pleasantly surprised at his articulate defense of Biden's presidency." And then a couple days ago he show his real self by saying his $80 airport lunch shows Biden's failure.

[@Darhan62]

Sam Harris makes sense! David Brooks too.

[@BloggerMusicMan]

I've liked David Brooks for a long time. This episode reminded me of why.

[@paddydiddles4415]

Would like to see Sam debate some of these issues with Vivek to his face, suspect Sam wouldn’t come out of it so well

[@samdg1234]

Sam is in a silo. Won't interact in a real way with anyone he disagrees with anymore.

[@paddydiddles4415]

@@samdg1234 agreed

[@ChristineMontana-ut4zt]

Sam Harris like hiding behind someone else his M O

[@TheKifster]

Sincere and intellectually honest.

[@gnubbiersh647]

it says a lot about the state of intellectual discussion when this JOURNALIST can defend bidens mental degradation and sam just accepts it. they dont even mention the shaking hands with nothing, or the ice cream debacle. "yeah biden was batting 93 now hes batting 87." "ok next question"

[@stud6414]

Nothing about the evil invasion of Iraq - was that moral and good?

[@stud6414]

Why can't these people just leave the world alone and stop trying to socially engineer the world?

[@karagi101]

Because if it’s lefts to dumb people the world will revert to the middle ages.

[@Crimmo877]

This is an amazing episode. Thanks Sam

[@muay_khao]

These are big conversations. Make them FREE, Sam! The people who most need to hear them are the same people who certainly will not pay to do so.

[@GSDKXV]

They are free for anyone who sends in an email no questions asked

[@muay_khao]

@@GSDKXV I thought that was only for the meditation app.

[@jmc5335]

​@@GSDKXV Who processes these requests?

[@samdg1234]

@@jmc5335 Who knows and I'm not sure why it would matter. But I can confirm that it is true. They have granted me access. The only reason I come here is to interact with the commentary.

[@agentsmidt3209]

You should bring in the guy for The Middle nation. He has an interesting take on this.

[@peteMickeal33]

I wonder why we live in a low-trust society, Sam. What could it be? I'm as baffled as you.

[@brian782]

Sam proudly would suppress the laptop to steal the election. Sam’s the problem

[@Mac-ku3xu]

NYT

[@tcorourke2007]

23:50 "People are too partisan nowadays." Harris: "Yes. And how do you think the Republicans caused this?"

[@precisedime1377]

@@brian5001 Get deprogrammed.

[@tcorourke2007]

@@brian5001 We need unity, but those idiots on the other side won't listen!

[@0MoTheG]

How can a lack of trust be reconciled with voting for Trump? I wouldn't trust that guy with anything.

[@cyberhiker3892]

But you trust Joe Biden because the Democrat Party told you to do so.

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

The problem is people like you seem to think every Trump voter is the people who stormed the Capitol. Millions of people who voted for him think he's an immoral ass and never necessarily had that high of expectations from him in the first place.

[@juanReflex37]

Excelente Sam Harris

[@kristinmeyer489]

18:02 WHY are we still calling it "social," when by and large, the results clearly are NOT?

[@elliominati]

Monied feudalism, a product of the worst timeline imaginable. Just good enough to not look like slavery, all the while they steal your livelihood all the same.

[@TheWanderingPensioner]

Good point. Future reference could be to pot-stirring media, flame-throwing media, self-agrandisement media ... I'll keep working on this :-)

[@Sunfried1]

I enjoyed the conversation but Sam really enjoys speechifying in the lead up to his questions.

[@adamwright920]

It's amazing that these two come so close to essential issues but never acknowledge them. The admiration for Charles Murray and Tucker Carlson are breathtaking.

[@famfamfam5782]

Are you saying you have breathtaking admiration yourself for Murray and Tucker?

[@alibabaschultz352]

What essential issues?

[@tcorourke2007]

They are looking at the same thing and describing it accurately, but from the opposite side.

[@EyeOfTheTiger777]

Wtf are you on about

[@gnubbiersh647]

@@alibabaschultz352 it says a lot about the state of intellectual discussion when this JOURNALIST can defend bidens mental degradation and sam just accepts it. they dont even mention the shaking hands with nothing, or the ice cream debacle. "yeah biden was batting 93 now hes batting 87." "ok next question"

[@Saganist420]

Thank goodness we have trustworthy podcasts. In this day and age, where its so difficult to find a trustworthy opinions, we are blessed to have great, trustworthy shows with spotless reputation like for example dark horse and others

[@JE-im5nh]

😂

[@alibabaschultz352]

Lol Bret literally has no credibility anymore

[@tcorourke2007]

​@@alibabaschultz352FYI, the FDA just approved "horse paste" to treat Covid-19.

[@RafaleKez4]

"Sam Harris is the king of trustworthiness" Source: Sam Harris

[@RafaleKez4]

@@alibabaschultz352 Yeah tbh the only good thing he did was expose the covid science.

[@davidmccue3591]

I love everything you put out and would be willing to pay to hear more of your thoughts. But $15 a month??!!?? Jeeziss, I think that's more than KZbin Premium, but I haven't looked at my bill lately.

[@_SarahElizabeth]

My trust in my former psychiatrist shattered. He took advantage of me recently and over the course of the last few years. I am beyond devastated and my brain is exhausted from the various doctors and medications I have experienced in the short span of the summer and falling through the mental health system in America.

[@liviugeorge9103]

min 29:35 that's a smart man: he has seen that they changed so easily their allegiance (no more Trump, but the party), with such superficiality - and his conclusion was not about their lack of values but he gain hope!! mon dieu...!

[@peterthegreat996]

The petite bourgeois is what Brooks describes with the modern meritocracy.

[@never2yield20]

Well essentially you are correct. But the "petite bourgeois" reflect the extreme leftist take on the "merchant middle-class" that just happened to help bring about the progress of democracy in western Europe and then exported to America. Where a new version of economic liberalism got off to a very bad start exploiting a whole class of people by enslaving them and shoving the existing populations off their land. The modern "Wage slaves" are not much better off than serfs, but all races can play along now. What gets me is "do MAGAites think Trump will change all that? Because he has been an exploitative elite since he was born. But maybe it is because he just shovels a brand of entertaining scoff filled hate they can't help but enjoy.

[@jolyonyates3898]

Please have Stephan A. Schwartz on your podcast to talk about consciousness.

[@equalsine6355]

Brook's take on Biden's decline is shocking. I don't know if it's meant as an insult to a younger Biden or a wildly inaccurate assessment of current day, either way, I respect his boldness for making such a claim.

[@ChristineMontana-ut4zt]

It's not nice to talk about biden's age how are you going to feel when your biden's age and people are talking about you that you're declining are you going to feel then karma

[@MichaelJohnson-vi6eh]

Mental decline and physical frailty are not 100% predictable. Illness, genetics, fitness, attitude all make a difference. However - there is a larger difference between 80 and 83 than there is between 70 and 73. Incumbents just have too much power and it tells a story that we need great important crucial leaders instead of just leaders with the correct beliefs and values.

[@equalsine6355]

@@ChristineMontana-ut4zt I'm not trying to insult him. But he's the president. Athletes are typically retired from sports in their middle age -- if they're lucky. We need to consider people closer to their prime for our most important roles in society, or we're going to have a losing team.

[@joejohnson6327]

"I'm afraid of Americans No one needs anyone, they don't even just pretend I'm afraid of Americans, I'm afraid of the world I'm afraid I can't help it, I'm afraid I can't" -- D. Bowie

[@GSDKXV]

Love

[@donbemont7901]

I think that Mr. Brooks is on the right track when he points his finger at the post WWII change in what constituted merit. But before proceeding onto the depths to which this has altered not just economic power but also cultural power (which is central to this), it's really important to notice that this change was brought about by technology, more than anything else. Technology diminished demand for older forms of merit, and raised the demand for newer -- basically cognitive --merit. This is crucial, because when you understand this, you understand that the trend was not a conspiracy. Also, because the fair question is: If this social disruption is essentially rooted in rapid technological progress, should we slow down technology? That question needs to be discussed openly, because whether by instinct or by design, the populist right is attacking education and by extension technological advance. However, we tend to respond to these things in the worst possible way, by providing individualist argument. The individual right of a professor or teacher to academic freedom and expression, for example. But the reason not to smite education and progress... is essentially patriotic. Countries that fall behind are going to get leaned on in extremely uncomfortable ways. I'm not sure I have ever heard this basic historical truth expressed during these culture wars. On the other hand, I think it is important for my fellow liberals to appreciate the depth of pain that has been caused by cultural upheaval. They are far too quick to attribute it to racism. (I was sorry Mr. Brooks referred to that first. Maybe in some locations, racism is really the motivation -- I have heard that a disproportionate number of the January 6 defendants are from areas where whites are no longer a clear majority, and that is suggestive. But the tens of millions of people voting Republican? Including people I have known well all my adult life? This is absurd on the face of it. And this liberal "conspiracy theory" excuses a whole lot of taunting and trolling that is not just cruel, but incredibly counter-productive. Over the past few decades, people have lost the ability to raise their kids according to their own lights (used to be liberals and conservatives could both see that in regards to network TV) and choose lives similar to that of their parents and grandparents. Meanwhile, so many sources of self worth and respect, which propped up peoples' lives, have become meaningless, when machines do it all better. When tens of thousands of people experience this sort of thing, it is sad (and ought not to be taunted! even if the people react in anger to their plight), but when it happens to tens of millions of people, and when they are taunted, you invite the unraveling of a country. And that would be true, even if we didn't have a new communications system which massively assists disaffected peoples' organizing and intensifying.

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

Without the DEI/woke discourse conservatives wouldn't be attacking education so much. Alot of liberals also still seem to be in denial about it. They either seem to not get just how unpopular it is or they just pretend it doesn't exist.

[@donbemont7901]

@@chickenfishhybrid44 I certainly agree that a lot of liberals are in denial about it, and haven't any sense of how it's roughly as repulsive as Donald Trump. And in many cases, more salient because Donald Trump can be escaped by not reading his utterances compulsively. If things are going in in your own schools or workplace that you find objectionable, that's right in front of your eyes, every day. However, another important piece to this would be the bubbles. Not just that people only hear the facts (or fabrications) that their side focuses on, but because they talk politics online to the exclusion of talking to people they otherwise like and respect, yet disagree with on a political issue. Whether your are all in on diversity training or totally opposed, it would do you a lot of good to engage with people who point out their rational objections, as opposed to a troll comeback.

[@derekspringer1596]

Fantastic!

[@brandonwoldridge1417]

"I was a huge fan of Sam's, until he took a stand against Trump's pathological lying, conspiracy theories, and complete lack of ethics. Having been such a huge fan of his and having paid attention to the things he stood for up to that point, I would have never imagined Sam to be in opposition to these things. He's truly lost his way, what a disappointment!" - we totally believe you, SamBot4000 😂

[@heffreybuzz]

Congrats, you built a straw man. You really showed them!

[@brandonwoldridge1417]

@@heffreybuzz no really, they’re shocked at this surprising development! He’s truly gone mad!

[@genericusername8337]

@@heffreybuzz What are you talking about? These types of comments show up, like clockwork. If you've been early to Sam's videos for the past 3 years (at least) and scrolled the comments, you've seen them.

[@apokatastasian2831]

"I was a huge fan of sam, Until he took up a defense of big pharma's and left wing politicians unholy censorship alliance. their pathological lying, conspiracy theories, complete lack of ethics, censorship campaign, smearing scientific dissent and willing blindness to a corrupt, child-abusing, walking dead puppet Potus. Having been such a huge fan of his and having paid attention to the things he once stood for, I would never have imagined Sam would be in support of these things simply because he hates one man. He has truly lost his way, what a dissapointment!" -Not bots fixed it for you...

[@tcorourke2007]

But not his policies.

[@johnmce]

❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤

[@user-bj2sn2ff5i]

..when people started using the word "populist" in the same sentence as "Trump" I knew we were ( and are ) in trouble.

[@sunnyinvladivostok]

dang, I love Brooks dry humor

[@GSDKXV]

When is Annaka’s PBS docuseries coming out?

[@ahmetdogan5685]

I, like Sam, trust reason.

[@teagame1011]

Comedy.

[@sebastianag2966]

​@@teagame1011Why, what axe do you have to grind with Sam?

[@Jules-Was-a-Liberal]

Bari Weiss who you praised, would probably disagree with you abt Shellenberger and Taibbi (extended episode).

[@subboid]

"Low trust society", per the guy who refuses to admit fault and comes up with convoluted Reddit-esque logic to explain it away

[@daheikkinen]

Can you have James Lindsay on?

[@davidmireles9774]

Sam, if the transition was practical, and the end-goal wasn’t utopian but highly realistic given current technological circumstance, would you consider a Resourced Based Economic System as a better alternative to our current market system paradigm? No more labor for income.. curious if you’d bring on a guest to talk about this. 🎉

[@ProgPiglet]

Day 1320 of irrationally hating the word "podcatcher"

[@bensprague1002]

Since Trump and Trumpism weigh heavily in this discussion, and Jan 6th is accurately considered to be emblematic of that movement, what would folks say were the three most secure presidential elections of all time, and where did the 2020 election rank, relative to the other two? I’m curious what features of our approach to the last election made it stand out in terms of security, and whether the other two shared those. Obviously, 2020 was different from many elections due to the prevalence of mail-in voting, but I don’t know enough about how/whether this mechanism ensured greater security or, if it didn’t, what measures were introduced to counteract whatever risks it may have posed.

[@Raydensheraj]

Christopher Wray (Trump appointed head of FBI)= "2020 was the safest election in history." Bill Barr (Trump stooge and Head of DOJ at the time)= "2020 was the safest election in history." 60 Court cases brought on by Trump and stooges that proclaimed the election was rigged....some had Trump appointed judges.... Trump lost all of these 60+ court cases....no sufficient verifiable material EVIDENCE was presented by Trump and his cabal of neo confederate Christian Nationalist Southern Strategist Trumplican cultists.... In-between there were numerous recounts by Republican MAGA stooges....all lead to the same outcome.... ....2020 was the safest election in American history.

[@gnubbiersh647]

KZbin is cenzzoring replies to your comment?

[@bensprague1002]

@@gnubbiersh647 was a comment of yours removed?

[@gnubbiersh647]

@@bensprague1002 it says you have 3 replies but i only see us 2

[@bensprague1002]

@@gnubbiersh647 I’ve always wondered why, on certain comments, the tally of replies is higher than the number of actual replies. My thought was that the tally must not be decremented when a reply gets deleted. Not sure how it works, but I assume the system attempts to filter bot-generated replies, and I suspect there’s a fair amount of bot activity on posts that invite discussion of controversial issues, especially beneath the published content of major opinion leaders, like Sam. That said, do you think the mod algo might also filter human-written posts - e.g. by trying to identify comment patterns consistent with people being paid to submit replies with a particular political or emotional valence? I cannot assume that paid comments would be economic without understanding how opinions spread and coalesce across whatever topology enmeshes the KZbin network, and what incentives exist to manipulate that. But if this were a network whose behavior could be mapped and modeled, and where important political or financial outcomes could be influenced by the users’ input - especially in certain “locales” whose constituents/commenters could swing either way on a question - I could certainly see how failing to identify and restrict the input of bots or paid participants would undermine the integrity of that forum as a means of discerning people’s actual opinions. In fact, it is self-evident that such a failure would undermine the integrity of ANY system in which people imagine their voices are being heard. In light of this, and with respect to what I’ve recently learned about my original question, we should all be quite relieved to know that, before Obama’s departure, the El-ISAC system was used to network-together election districts and devices, enabling centrally-managed oversight and fraud prevention. Constitutionality aside - after all, what’s a constitution without election security? - one can only assume this was used to nip hacking attempts in the bud, and remove any fraudulent votes before counts were submitted. Granted, there have been no arrests or prosecutions for attempted voter fraud. At least not as far as I’m aware. But, to me, that just shows how effective the system was at preventing it: so effective, no one even attempted it. In fact, rather than fraud, itself, being a problem, it seemed as if our most visible enforcement efforts were directed against claims thereof. Indeed, rather than actual election tampering, it would appear the greatest threat is from voters’ inveterate distrust of secure, centrally-supervised tallying, by internet-connected machines, of mail-in ballots whose broadcast distribution to the mailboxes and apartment foyers of American citizens’ current or previous addresses helped ensure that we could all safely participate in the democratic process when we feared that doing so, in-person, might kill people. What endangers our republic is not systemic fraud, but our “low-trust society”, as Sam has so aptly titled it. And it is precisely this distrust that would allow a man whose demagoguery attracted thousands of people, in city after city across America, to be given credence when claiming victory over a highly-experienced career politician who, rather than resorting to such crowd-building theatrics, ensured his and others’ safety from viral infection by making brief, infrequent video appearances and enforcing/eliciting strict social distancing and minimal attendance when appearing in-person. For people to insist that their candidate was the winner, in willful denial of the updated results that were clearly visible on all mainstream networks - and to cleave to this view on the basis that the trends revealed by the previous day’s results should somehow preclude their overnight reversal after suspending the count - is symptomatic of a kind of distrust whose breathtaking extent can only be analogized to that of Sam Harris’ disdain for Trump voters. Hopefully you get my drift. Regrettably, I need not imagine what would happen if a critical mass of people believed the conceit.

[@insertname5057]

Is this the same David Brooks who lied about price of his burger? Kind of an ironic title in retrospect

[@toby9999]

You're going to make an issue out of something as trivial as a burger? LOL How do you know he lied?

[@puffwagon3410]

these two really is what is wrong they put themselves above others Educated Elite meeting them in a bar would bore me to death and end up gettting a punched

[@Calidastas]

You two do not live in the physical world. You live in a narrative of reality you’ve created in your mind.

[@Jole30]

If you lie constantly and dont face any consequenses then this is the result..People are not stupid..

[@liviugeorge9103]

oh... the blindness-creating ego of "we are rich / powerful because of meritocracy" :))))) Celine was writing something in this regard - the chief MUST believe that the subordinates are less-valuable than him... (i have not the patience now to make a better translation) and sure. it is the meritocracy not the absence of same morals here and there applied to business.

[@KGS922]

That's the longest intro list of topics I've ever heard on this podcast.

[@daheikkinen]

“In this episode, we talk about kittens, the trans-Atlantic slave trade, the scandal of Kate Moss’s less-than-flattering newly-surfaced pictures, the length of Putin’s dinner table, gastronomic health as an indication of moral virtue, the recent phenomenon of pickle ball, Donald Trump, Elon Musk’s estranged daughter, and artificial intelligence in stuffed animals.”

[@ullrichfischer5796]

You asked what word should replace "Tweet" now that Twitter has been renamed to X. I submit "Xeet" as a reasonable word. X pronounced "Sh" as in the leader of China's first name,

[@subcitizen2012]

Good talk. Sam redeems himself a little bit every time I hear him. And David Brooke's is one of my few republican heroes, I think I have like 2 or 3 lol.

[@LWT1331]

He doesn't need redemption.

[@Hjkkgg6788]

About time

[@tincanstantheman]

I like the talk yet i feel like he skipped the most important part. Proving that we actually are living in a low trust society. Low trust in institutions seems to have been conflated with low trust in anyone

[@WorldByTheTale]

I couldn't finish the last 10 minutes of this podcast. Despite some interesting perspective from Brooks, Sam's incessant bloviating about Trump, "ends justify the means" mentality about Trump and the pandemic, and frankly just gross, immoral, hypocrisy is too much. Over the years, Sam's made it exceedingly clear that he does not believe in accountability for academics, experts, or (by his own definition) liberal elites. He possesses a manic fear of anyone who does not share his worldview or life experience. The hypocrisy is laughable in a despairing sort of way. I understand that it's impossible to put one's thoughts on the record ad nauseam like Sam does without committing some blunders and faux pas. However, in one breath he'll say that Fauci clearly lied and did some pretty heinous things and in the next breath he'll say that anything Fauci did wrong were slight missteps caused by Trump and social media. He's so committed to his tribal, political mindset. It's incredible that he could ever criticize religious zealots with a straight face. He exhibits the exact same tendency towards self-justifying mental gymnastics or (as Sam likes to say) "playing tennis without the net". Any crimes committed by his political tribe are somehow blamed on the opposition in a completely irrational way. It's as bad as listening to CNN. I agree with most of Sam's thoughts and aims. On many topics, he's exceptionally even-handed and thoughtful to a degree that's almost impossible to find. For me, the Waking Up app has been the most essential technology created in the last 5 years. And it's mostly for the sake of being able to conceptualize Sam as a rational person in the context of Waking Up that I need to unsubscribe from "Making Sense".

[@holeshothunter5544]

I'm not a fan of pay per listen radio. If that's your game Sam, Goodbye.

[@robinbeers6689]

Bye, Felicia!

[@karagi101]

It’s free if you tell them you can’t afford it.

[@ardeshirjahanian2697]

These lunatics would rather talk tough and have wars and fight till the last Ukrainian rather than use basic persuasion on Putin to prevent major conflict.

[@killa3x]

Another never Trumper republican. Sweet. We will get to the bottom of this trump phenomenon now

[@YogGroove]

Sam. You can do your part of restoring a more trusting society by talking to all the "friends" you've shunned, strawmanned, and refused to talk to. I guarantee you that such a move would move the trust needle.

[@RafaleKez4]

'Apologizing and admitting you made a mistake' is Sam's kryptonite. Yes I wish that he could come together again in honest discussion, am I hopeful that will actually happen? Absolutely not.

[@haydenthompson7790]

Can you give me a quick catch up on this please. I assume its in reference to the 'intellectual dark web'. But other than the conspiracy style covid chatter from bret weinstein I'm not aware of anything else.

[@aguastheclown]

@@haydenthompson7790 sounds like you're all caught up. Years have gone by, these IDWers have had their own programs, every opportunity to back up their BS-nope. They're still with this "talk to your friends!" BS

[@Gurfmanj]

No it wouldn't. And he didn't strawman any of them... They did that to themselves.

[@YogGroove]

@@haydenthompson7790 Biden, COVID, .... it's hard to name a topic that all of them weren't ahead of Sam on. Yet Sam smuggly casts them off as "Conspiracy theorists".... he has no idea how embarrassing he has become. Sensemaking my ass

[@davidhanson7677]

Would be happy if Sam turned off comments. MAGA trolls love hating on thoughtful dialog between intelligent people.

[@ChristineMontana-ut4zt]

Open your mind to Al dialogue if you only listen to what you have to say you won't be able to broadening your surroundings ... your world will get bigger if you open your self up to all

[@ChristineMontana-ut4zt]

Did you listen

[@ChristineMontana-ut4zt]

Ok David Hanson stop with the labels & start listening you can see other perspectives

[@automatofix]

42:58

[@jahazielhernandez8746]

I have low trust of Sam Harris who wrote "In Defense of Torture" during the height of the Guantanamo Bay crimes against humanity.

[@WorldByTheTale]

Jesus. Really?

[@witherbossbros1157]

Brooks has never been a humble person and that has been his greatest weakness. He was arrogant for decades. Friedman handing him his ass should have been a real eye-opener - it wasn't. His surprise at the failure of globalization for Americans shows how disconnected he was. His need to discover and meet "real" Republicans in rural America because of Trump's effect is another perfect example of his disconnection. Go back and listen to any of his distant ideas - he helped build the Republican craziness of today that he now despises with his snide, ridiculing journalism - note I chose to say ridiculing, rather than critical.

[@beefandbarley]

Agreed. Brooks is a hack and always has been.

[@TheSeafoams]

The title for this episode should just be “Orange Man Bad, how I am dealing with TDS”

[@dejankeleman1918]

Great cover art, very appropriate to the title of the episode.

[@zackamania6534]

DAVID I HAVE A $78 burger to sell you, dum dum!

[@airbloomamplifiers]

I can’t respect anything Brooks says. I know too much about him.

[@samdg1234]

Is there someone who displays less epistemological modesty than Sam Harris? (epistemological modesty being raised at 5:42 and responded to with Harris's regulation, "H'mm")

[@bernardvance9041]

The guests Sam speaks to these days provide a perfect echo chamber. It's been years since he has spoken with anyone with whom he disagrees.

[@hannibalbarca2939]

Amen. There are countless right wing intellectuals he could debate.

[@TenTonNuke]

​@@hannibalbarca2939Like who?

[@abstractnonsense3253]

@@TenTonNuke Thomas Sowell, if he's not too old for it.

[@lisaseifert9118]

Agreed

[@karagi101]

Why give a platform to people that say untruthful things?

[@friedmac7146]

Respectfully, Hello Mr. Sam Harris I always look forward with regards towards the elevated thesaurus jr synonym terms that are use quite well with value. Respectfully, I would presume it can be quite the substantial undertaking some days? (Omaha Nebraska) 🌽✨✨🌽✨🌽✨😊