The Not-So-Intelligent Designer (with Dr. Abby Hafer)

Biologist, professor and author Dr. Abby Hafer gives specific examples of "Intelligent Design" that aren't intelligent at all.
Dr. Hafer's Book, "The Not-So-Intelligent Designer: Why Evolution Explains the Human Body and Intelligent Design Does Not:" a.co/dUWs4ze
Support our sponsor The Great Courses Plus: www.thegreatcou...
Los Angeles event with Matt Dillahunty, Cara Santa Maria, and Seth Andrews: / 2022525981403467

[@eddieking2976]

Screw "Eye of the tiger." Give me "Eye of the squid."

[@kevinmorgan8782]

Eddie, shall we line you up for a transplant?

[@Anacronian]

Pfft squid..give me the eyes of a Mantis Shrimp.

[@bengal4047]

@@Anacronian Mantis shrimp are fucking terrifying. Those things can punch through aqauarium glass. They scared the hell out of me as a kid, and there were only like 2-3 years where we weren't landlocked and literally nowhere near mantis shrimp

[@annaceciliafuglestad1120]

😂🤲🙏👏👍🙂🤝🤗

[@annaceciliafuglestad1120]

@@Anacronian 😂🤲🙏👏👍🤝🤗☺

[@dienekes4364]

My wife is 65 and I'm 55. Every time another of either of our body parts breaks down (back spasms, rotator cuff tears, glaucoma, cataracts, arthritis, etc.), I look at my wife and say "intelligent design my ass!"

[@ericscaillet2232]

Exactly ,however our penance is as such.😒

[@dienekes4364]

@@ericscaillet2232 Penance for what?

[@kevinmorgan8782]

@Dienekes You have given great examples of degeneration of good design. When your car breaks down after years of abuse, do you conclude that it really wasn't designed? As to your final statement in quotation marks, a call for the redesigning of your ass in unnecessary. If it weren't properly designed already, you would have been in trouble at birth.

[@munstrumridcully]

Teeth! We are so well designed that we have teeth that can, and do, rot and fall out in excruciating pain and then don't grow back. Shark's teeth, however, _do_ grow back. If we are more important to the "designer" than a bunch of lousy killer fish, how come _they_ can regrow teeth while _we_ get stuck with the options of gumming our food, implants, or dentures (the latter two options being quite expensive)? Damnit!?

[@1weirddoe571]

munstrumridcully I feel jipped and ripped off too.

[@SooziinCa]

Hahahahaha! So true!!!!!

[@SMILEY-bu2hj]

Dumbshits, I thought the designer was evolution. Didn't we evolve? Why are you blaming God? What are you a bunch of idiots?

[@munstrumridcully]

Jenerik Are you joking? Or do you really not get that the point of those comments are that _if intelligent design is true_ then the designer did a bad job. All these issues fit perfectly with evolution, an unguided natural process, but does not fit an intelligent designer, which the comments point out.

[@munstrumridcully]

Ronove I see, you are so embarrassed about not understanding how hypotheticals work that you feel the need to toss out feeble insults. Well, at least your comment makes clear that you accept evolution is true. Have a nice day, and don't worry, I won't tell anyone how you don't get adopting a premise for sake of argument and then pointing out problems with it. Nor will I tell anyone that you have no arguments or insightful observations, so rely on sophomoric insults and baseless assertions. People can read it for themselves in your amusing comments. Thanks for making me chuckle :)

[@SecularFelinist]

Also the allergic response, which kills many people with extreme allergies to shellfish, peanuts, etc.

[@ddwkc]

My favorite allergy is to water in a being that is basically a water balloon in a mostly water covered planet. It's a genius design from the most sadistic being in the multiverse.

[@1toniah]

he has to be the devil

[@nerychristian]

Idiot. Without your immune system response, you wouldn't survive a day. A single germ or virus would kill you within minutes.

[@ddwkc]

​@@nerychristian What I'm saying if a being that one claims is responsible for the designs and creations of everything would be sadistic to create people who are allergic to water (just look up for this rare allergy). Last time I read Aquaman, his super power is not NOT BEING ALLERGIC TO WATER, so your comeback is utterly nonsense. Learn to read and interpret what you read first, fool.

[@nerychristian]

@@ddwkc God didnt make people allergic to water. That is either a disease or rare mutation.

[@taiya001]

I have done a lot of tutoring and I find tutors with a masters degree or more are so trained in their high up levels that they lose the ability to talk to those in the beginning courses. It was my specialty to tutor those in the beginner courses because I could talk to them in simple language. It is not that they were stupid or anything, but they had to start with simple terminology before heading into the jargon. We need more educators like Dr. Hafer.

[@6chhelipilot]

Creationist: ' But the Human body is so perfectly designed!' Response: Bollocks!!!

[@gaylesmith2987]

Intelligent design? With one tube for breathing and swallowing? Oh, that’s brilliant.

[@weaseldragon]

First time hearing Abby Hafer and wondering WHY that is. She's awesome.

[@restlessfrager]

Holy crap I love that lady, her examples are so simple, so easy to understand.

[@kevinmorgan8782]

The explicative is very well put--the theory of evolution has deified the feces of human rationalizations.

[@forgednotcast612]

Because you both stupid.

[@robertmiller9735]

Long-term aspiration of small amounts of liquids is a bigger problem than traumatic choking: many, many elderly people die of pneumonia because of it.

[@trishayamada807]

Robert Miller my great gran died of pneumonia at 93 because she broke her femur and couldn’t move. She built up fluid in her lungs and then pneumonia. And yes 93 is long life and she was a vibrant elderly woman who was still gardening, baking and living. Amazing that not being mobile can flood your lungs slowly.

[@petermetcalfe6722]

Hospitals, doctor's surgeries and mental institutions are all full of God's perfect design.

[@FlockOfHawks]

jails and graveyards too

[@petermetcalfe6722]

Indeed.

[@rexbettencourt3800]

That's becuase if sinnnn. that is why that is ... gawd Luvs those little sinning bastards so much that he just smattered them with his holy spirit all over.... DAMN I think I'm getting horny over this... Mmmm holy spirit.... rub me gawd with your holy spirit....

[@kariahlukemacchan2230]

imperfections aplenty from "perfection". deluded will say that's because we are fallen, ate an apple. OmFg! Please ask yourself, Who's responsible? The "perfect" parent who puts a bomb in a childcare center that kills all or the child who touches it and sets it off?

[@rexbettencourt3800]

Isn't that what gawd fills his people with? You know magic sperm.

[@freddylubin]

Not so intelligent that I have spots where I can't get to scratch my back.

[@kevinmorgan8782]

@Freddy Lubin If you can't figure out how to scratch them, then I too would question the intelligent part. If you still have difficulty, permit me to suggest what works for me. I use a stiff hairbrush. It feels great!

[@tylercampbell6365]

That's why God made a woman

[@ashleyklug4538]

i love this conversation! when talking to creationists and those who believe in intelligent design on the topic of intelligent design i always like to bring up starfish. if starfish should lose one of their arms, the arm will regenerate. and yet, human beings - who are supposed to be god’s favorite and made in his perfect image - are unable to regenerate limbs, failing organs, etc.. seems to me that god might favor starfish over human beings...just saying 🤷🏼‍♀️

[@gageblackwood8832]

Ashley Klug Stem cell research might one day enable humans to do this. Yet this is the very research some Christian fundamentalists want banned!

[@5ynthesizerpatel]

Ashley Klug - actually you're wrong - it is possible for humans to grow back limbs - the answer is in the Bible. in Mark 11:24 Jesus says, "Therefore I tell you, whatever you ask for in prayer, believe that you have received it, and it will be yours." So if you pray - and if god is real - your lost limbs will grow back as a result of that prayer.

[@ashleyklug4538]

Synthesizerpatel i really do hope your comment was meant to be taken as sarcasm. if not, i feel awful that you think enough prayer will regenerate a human limb. that’s just absurd!

[@5ynthesizerpatel]

read what I said again: "So if you pray - and if god is real - your lost limbs will grow back as a result of that prayer."

[@ashleyklug4538]

amanda baranou i’m not slow, thank you. i just wanted to make sure that i interpreted the comment correctly.

[@IndeedVancho]

Your videos are important to me. Thanks for all the work you do

[@kariahlukemacchan2230]

Austin Esquillin I learn so much from Seth, admiration aplenty

[@RobbyRaccoon]

Talk to your doctor about adjusting your dosage.

[@ddwkc]

The cephalopods were indeed based on God's Image, our sleeping lord Cthulhu.

[@Spiller333]

Hell yeah gud one

[@mlwsf]

Bwahaha. Love it

[@annaceciliafuglestad1120]

😂

[@annaceciliafuglestad1120]

😂🤲🙏👏👍😎🤩🤗😍😘😻🤝☺

[@annaceciliafuglestad1120]

GOOD ONE !

[@honestlyna]

This was very insightful! I am now informed with the trivia that squid and whales are more efficiently "designed" than humans. More of this!

[@jecker91946]

In my entire long life, I have never found a more profound set of information as this one. This professor is simply incredible, as is Seth Andrews.

[@ericscaillet2232]

Just shows you how dumb the whole world is....😒

[@dillonhamilton2914]

This is such a good, education, informative conversation. I’m totally buying that book.

[@donaldcook2484]

This is reality 101 at it's finest!! Creationist hate biology and the pure evidence of evolution because it makes sense and destroys their perfect design ideas.. this lady biologist is incredible..

[@wolf1066]

astigmatism in both eyes, long-sighted - to a different degree in each eye - and now succumbing to age-related optical issues... on top of the fact that there's a blind spot on the retina that makes small distant objects vanish from view if I try to look directly at them, and a whole bunch of blood vessels and nerves in the way of the light . Absolutely frigging awesome "design", eh.

[@Noromdiputs]

26:40 "the real standard for evolution I must emphasize is good enough to not kill you before reproduction too much of the time"

[@DanielBrownsan]

That's a good point. Everyone says "survival of the fittest", which is wrong AND misleading. "Survival" is only necessary until reproduction happens. "Fittest" means the _best_ fit, not the _most_ fit (or, more specifically, "sufficient" fit) in a given environment. Being the biggest, strongest male isn't beneficial if you require more calories than your surroundings can provide.

[@nerychristian]

@boxersnatcher Neither will survive long. Heart disease will kill an obese person.

[@ilovewiki]

Dr. Abby Hafer is asbolutely wonderful., Seth. Please have her on here again! I have a biology background, (and I'm currently in graduate school conducting my own research), so I already knew most or all of what she was discussing, but it was so refreshing to hear such an exemplary illustration of educating. Simple, informative, and engaging. I hope I can be half as instructive as Dr. Hafer when I'm a professor someday. Cheers!

[@guslama9130]

What a wonderful woman. Wise, intelligent, a great experience listening to her. Thank you, lady.

[@flipphone582]

"... God is the world's busiest abortionist." Daaaamn

[@Chamelionroses]

I am glad there are some pro science and those willing to understand science. I do think science is awesome. Thanks to all those using science to make the world a better place.

[@vylbird8014]

Even the centaur design puts the brain in a bad place. The most vital organ should not be in a sticky-out head, even with a thick skull. It should be inside of a protective bone enclosure, yes... and that enclosure tucked safely away inside the ribcage. Nice and central and shielded. Somewhere in between the heart and the secondary heart, which humans also seriously lack. They are one thrown clot away from instant death. Lesson for the designer: Stop putting in "poke here to die" switches!

[@MrDwicker]

The real bad design is in human's brains that believe in an invisible, magical, wizard. That lives in the cosmos that can't be detected. If this the best this designer can do. I would believe god needs some suggestions or help.

[@inertiaforce7846]

Dennis Wicker thats the best argument ive ever heard against intelligent design, hahahahahaha.

[@ihatereligion9744]

Dennis Wicker he obviously didn't buy "how to properly create things for Dummy's"

[@1toniah]

ha haaaaa I like what you are saying.

[@nerychristian]

So you are saying there is no intelligent design? If there is no intelligent design, then no person can be intelligent. Because according to you, unless something is perfect, it cannot be intelligent. Since we are not perfect, none of us is intelligent. Every thought that crosses your brain is stupidity.

[@akmagee]

I had to come back to this video again and have my kids listen to it! A few minutes ago, my 9 year old had a little situation. Climbing, as kids will do, he slipped and hit his stuff 😵. As he was writhing in pain I said "I'm sorry! That's a sensitive area to hit! " He replied, "why did our penises get built outside our body?" Great question kid. Let's talk about the "good enough" (yet sometimes inconvenient) circumstances of evolution. 😁

[@dottedrhino]

Scientists like Dr. Hafer are so delightfully clear in their explanations... :)

[@mulletsandmustaches8656]

Would've loved to have her studies in my highschool science class. I come to see the teeth as a very poor design. There are some animals that get new teeth when one falls out, but us as humans get our permanent teeth at about 5 yrs old, then the last of our lives that's it.

[@adamc1966]

Yes human teeth are the worst.

[@karlrschneider]

When we determine whether theism is the cause...or the result...of insanity, we might have a shot at curing both.

[@jayjonah83]

I'm becoming more convinced that a lot of theism is a combination of ignorance and psychological manipulation

[@jamesthompson2981]

A thought. If religious types are to be belived, we are made in god's image. So, by extension, God did not create us, he merely copy-pasted the design of *HIS* creator.

[@josefinenilsson8059]

But they will say he didn't have a creator - he somehow always existed.

[@jamesthompson2981]

In which case, doesn't that mean his just a shallow being that's patting himself on the back? The universe's most colossal circle-jerk..

[@josefinenilsson8059]

Indeed, but try telling them that.

[@jenniferbrewer5370]

If Adam was made from dust and Eve from his rib, why do they have navels? Even the medieval artists weren't buying this creationist crap, LOL.

[@josefinenilsson8059]

Why indeed? Good point. I wonder how the religious tossers answer that question.

[@sdc2027]

I love this doctor! "God is the world's busiest abortionist" I would love to have her as a professor - Instead, I will get her book ;)

[@sdc2027]

HAha!

[@rubberlegs15]

vachief Nazi? BWHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHA Brainwashed clone. . .

[@dolnick7]

Logic, rational thought, and science are refreshing to the same degree that religion is not.

[@rubberlegs15]

I beg to differ. Having boiled a small pot of water over a flaming bible I brewed myself a refreshing cup of tea!

[@dolnick7]

Your statement is simply absurd. You cherry-pick while failing to demonstrate how a lack of belief in a god hinders scientific work in any way. Whatever the religious beliefs of those you mentioned, they were victims of their age when religious superstitions went largely unchallenged. A quick Wikipedia check brings this quote of Pasteur's, a Catholic: "In each one of us there are two men, the scientist and the man of faith or of doubt. These two spheres are separate, and woe to those who want to make them encroach upon one another in the present state of our knowledge!" The large number of modern scientists who have done ground-breaking work and who identify as atheists also runs counter to your assertion.

[@dolnick7]

You seem to be acting under an agenda-driven premise, which is never a good idea. Retracting scientific papers is a GOOD thing, as this weeds out faulty data; something creationists never have the integrity to worry about. This difference hardly points to the truth of their claims; just the opposite, in fact. And further, how can you claim to be certain of the religious belief or non-belief of each and every scientist who has retracted a paper? Theists lie constantly -- to themselves, mostly -- about the reality of a completely unprovable imaginary force in the universe. Atheists rightly reject these claims due to a lack of evidence, yet to you it is the atheists who are the liars. Your statements are unconvincing on several levels.

[@dolnick7]

The entire idea of peer reviewed science is that scientists are indeed held accountable -- to other scientists and to the public at large, not to some Hebrew war god in the sky. And I'm so glad that this is that case, especially when I cross a bridge, fly in an airplane, drive my car, or surf the Internet. Religion has no place in science, period.

[@dolnick7]

Funny how few other scientists share your low opinions regarding evolutionary science. Anyone who believes in Jesus yet dismisses Darwin as a fable-writer is now in the realm of self-parody and beyond the uses of fruitful discussion. Oh, and I remember the Genesis bit from the moon. Ruining the achievement by repeating the Bronze Age idiocy of the Old Testament merely underscored the need to get these divisive toxic delusions out of the public sphere as soon as possible.

[@erictaylor5462]

56:00 This is 100% caused by our educational system that fails completely to teach *SCIENCE* Instead they teach scientific "facts" that you have to learn to get the correct answer on the test. It teaches "science" as information from authority which is *NOT* at all what science is. It destroys the wonder and joy of discovery that science is, and very few people retain any love of science because they don't have any fun with it. My dad works as a substitute teacher's aid. He had an encounter with the kids at recess. They asked him about the steam coming from the "smoke stacks" for the school's heating system. He explained just enough to them to allow them to discover for themselves that the steam comes from the combustion of natural gas. The hydrogen in the methane combines with oxygen to form H2O, water. He did the same with me when I was a kid, and frankly, it was mind blowing to realize that *WATER* is a by product of fire. Water puts fire out, but at the same time, fire *MAKES* water. We need to teach the kids (from the very start, 1st grade) to think scientifically. To question information from authority,and make "authority" prove what they tell us is true. Of course, having a population who questions information from authority is usually counter to the interests of both government and religion, because it makes it harder to lie to people. Just ask yourself, do you want to make it easier for people to lie to your children? Will they be happier if they believe lies? Would you?

[@hackeritalics]

Seth! I started doing the great courses plus because of this Podcast ! I also started looking at that course on logic that you mentioned. When I 1st saw it with the strange setting and such I wasn't sure how much I would enjoy it. It's an amazing course so far and I'm definitely getting a good amount of use from the ability to slow down the speaker. He is very clear and concise but trying to deeply Consider logical fallacies is much easier at 75% speed for me. Lol either way I am definitely enjoying it! If you guys start to listen to this lecture I highly recommend doing an episode at a time at most and looking up ample examples of each of the fallacies so you really get it.

[@elisenieuwe4649]

Listening to this I got flashbacks to when I was young and getting my drink out of my noose when laughing. Happened me too often xD

[@seanjones2456]

This video series ROCKS! It gives me hope for tomorrow. I am worried because we are at a pinnacle of stupidity with our elected officials right now.

[@1toniah]

and stupidity has no limits

[@ericscaillet2232]

Idiocracy does come to mind.

[@Swidzernaivlaminox]

Too bad we can only put one thumb up ! Loved it 🤗 Tooth are also not very well «design». When one of our teeth fall, as an adult, it is forever. Great white shark is a lot more lucky with its dentition, a new teeth grows every time the past one has fallen.

[@Ploskkky]

Great show. I am going to buy Hafer's book.

[@jenniferbrewer5370]

I can give you a perfect example of why we were NOT "intelligently designed." Look at our nether regions; what idiot puts a waste removal plant next to a recreational area?

[@e.jamesshepard7183]

Because you can also perform recreational activities there as well. Not to far to go to switch it up.😁

[@grogery1570]

That's because getting a baby covered in excrement is a great way to get good bacteria into its digestive tract. Hmm that sounds like even crappier design

[@sicarius2794]

RIP Robin Williams

[@e.jamesshepard7183]

Sicarius. Ok. Dont know what robin williams has to do with that.. But anyways r.i.p.

[@KimFKjr]

Eric Shepard Because Robin Williams said the very same thing in one of his stand up shows.

[@erictaylor5462]

And if you're faithful, you might one day wake up and feel called to bring Jesus to the most hostile uncontacted tribe in the world and get killed in a place your body can never be recovered.

[@DoctorBastard]

Another fine interview.

[@nmikloiche]

I’m so happy that my favorite Cephalopod, the Cuttlefish was mentioned. They are so amazing. If you’ve never seen the PBS Nova special on them you must go now and watch it.

[@rubberlegs15]

The mimic octopus is pretty amazing too

[@rubberlegs15]

Plus your comment made me go and watch a documentary on cuttlefish (again!). Amazing control of colour!

[@midnight8341]

I would call it a cuddlefish, when I was younger...

[@bensteven3091]

they are even more impressive when you see them live in their natural environment

[@ScottM1973]

@30:35 OR maybe squid were created in Cthulhu's image!

[@bazingaburg8264]

Hoping for this comment i scrolled down. Thank you ^^

[@LesActive]

I work with a very proud Christian Chaplain who knows the truth of the Gospel and says Catholics aren't Christian. This show had some great ammo, thanks so much for having her on!

[@dickottel]

World's busiest abortionist! I'm gonna use that one :D

[@keithpopko7068]

That was an enlightening segment.

[@kevinmorgan8782]

You probably have already done so if the chromosomes of either you or your partner were damaged. If you think that's a bad idea, then giving birth to a monstrous living blob might change your mind.

[@kevinmorgan8782]

Yes, the comparison is an apt one--abortionists are busy playing God--and they don't know what He knows.

[@andrewoliver8930]

@@kevinmorgan8782 they're not playing God. They'd disappear if they played God

[@kevinmorgan8782]

@@andrewoliver8930 @Kevin Morgan "Playing God" means deciding who lives and who dies.

[@Nexibis]

So before this video started I got an ad for "intelligent design" and how science just attacks the "theory". I balked.

[@krisbest6405]

Hands up who wants to get remodelled, l want brains and beauty, missed out on both.

[@charlesglidden557]

@@tiffanyfrank3654 sure you just have to be no larger than them . Look up square cube law.

[@charlesglidden557]

@@tiffanyfrank3654 basically your mass is proportional to your volume. Your volume is related to your three dimensions X each other. So if you took a thing doubled each of his Dimensions it would weigh eight times as much. But basically your strength goes as your surface area that goes as the square of your than your dimension. So the square that weight 8 times as much would be four times as strong. If you raise a ant the size of a human it would weigh perhap billions of times and it weighs now but only be of millions times as strong as it is now. So it's strength-to-weight ratio would be a thousand times less.

[@charlesglidden557]

@@tiffanyfrank3654 Well I think the first part is easy. Say you have a cube 1 inch by 1 inch by 1 inch. I would have 1 cubic inch. If you have a cube 2x2x2 you would have 8 cubic inches. so for the same density it would weigh 8 times a much. That is the cube in the square cube law. The square has to do with the strength being proportional to the area not the volume so the area of any cross section has quadrupled. Divide strength by weight and it has gone down by 2. Hope a bit clearer.

[@bengal4047]

I want a smaller chest so I can stop having so many fucking backaches. Can't afford a reduction, have daydreamed about using an axe and cauterizing the wounds way more than once

[@wooddoc5956]

In medical school we learn that unexplained hoarseness can be a sign of a central chest lesion that affects the recurrent laryngeal nerve.

[@abbreviatedalex2418]

"Adequate is the name of the game." Same, my friend, same. I never give 100% if I can squeak by with a 71%.

[@c-3po543]

:-)3 2 :-P Uu Uu

[@c-3po543]

:-iuiii:-)iiii:-P

[@abbreviatedalex2418]

@@c-3po543 are you okay

[@ZealousWins]

@@c-3po543 are you okay

[@mememefinally]

Only in fundamentalist religious countries, basic science is a political issue. This, to me, proves my fear that USA is in most parts, a fundamentalist country. And the fact that it has the most powerful military in the world , gives me chills.

[@fckyouall9895]

We are so poorly "designed" that it's ridiculous. I experience a lot of neck pain and back pain.. plus I suffer from many other health problems that don't make any goddamn sense. I'm fairly young too, 29. I used to have perfect vision till age 25 and now I can't see shit. I get lightheaded way more easily as well... and none of the doctors know why I'm experiencing all these awful symptoms. I used to be able to stay up late but now I'm like some 80y old who needs to go to bed at 10pm or otherwise I can hardly walk. Oh yeah and my hair is turning gray.

[@goremall4330]

fck you all I’m sorry 😪 I deal with these same things too. The only thing that has helped me is potassium and magnesium. My magnesium levels were causing high blood pressure which was making me lightheaded and dizzy, and lack of potassium was making my nerves twitch. I hope you can get better.

[@Berbs73]

Sorry to hear this, man. Hang in there. I have a few things wrong with me that doctors cannot explain either. Life is hard enough even without health issues.

[@Sciguy95]

Zurround100 obviously we did evolve to walk upright otherwise we wouldn't be walking upright. Our skeleton today doesn't allow for us to easily walk on all 4 limbs.

[@ExtantFrodo2]

And other aspects of our physiology preclude our spending most of our time afloat.

[@condorboss3339]

+Vladimir_Bone Spur_tRump I hope you can find a way of saving your sight.

[@mlee2994]

@52:10 is that awe in which we, naturalists, evolutionists, et al, stand in! The last 5 minutes are pure gold!

[@Wistful77]

Our babies are born blind and helpless, what was god planning? I want her book.

[@1toniah]

a very good question. among others.

[@nerychristian]

That's why humans have mothers. To raise them and feed them.

[@msullivan3531]

We’re born early because if we waited any longer our brains would be too big to fit through the birth canal.

[@UniDocs_Mahapushpa_Cyavana]

@@nerychristian Then why have birthing cause depression in mothers. So the baby learns life is a life of suffering?

[@nerychristian]

@@UniDocs_Mahapushpa_Cyavana People who learn to overcome suffering and adversity are stronger and can be self sufficient. And if you are saying people are defective, then you are calling yourself defective too.

[@rickydarcilover5581]

Here we have a prominent biologist. In answers in Genesis, there is a prominent paediatrician woman whose comment about God sending two bears to slaughter 42 children for mocking a man, said, “Well they deserved it.” If I made the rules, she wouldn’t be allowed anywhere near any children.

[@remandstimpy]

If we evolved from single celled organisms with a simple photo-sensitive patch, how come there are still single celled organisms with a simple photo-sensitive patch? (Just joking guys, felt ought to say it before a genuine creationist did)

[@kevinmorgan8782]

Ken, how come there is anything more than a single-celled organism? Don't just tell me, "Evolution did it." That's an appeal to magic for a process that has never been documented as ever taking place. In all the years of watching generation after generation of fruit flies and e. coli, no new coding for new features has ever been documented. Scientists have documented minor promotion of a function that already existed on a duplicated gene, but that is few and far between. The true believer in evolution tells me that sickle cell anemia is an example of evolution. Just goes to show, like Michael Shermer says, intelligent people can believe stupid things.

[@wvayankees]

LOL! Then I'll say the other: if we evolved from chimpanzees, then why are there still chimpanzees? :)

[@judyives1832]

That question comes from a lack of understanding of the process of evolution. Evolution doesn’t destroy the past generation. It is a slow change over a very long period of time. The single celled organisms are ANCESTORS! Species branch off from an ancestor, they don’t descend like a ladder. Chimps, apes, humans, bonobos, Neanderthals, etc branched off from a common ancestor and evolved according to their own habitats and challenges and gene mutations. The existence of humans does not mean that Chimpanzees have to go extinct. Many many species have become extinct over millions of years. Others have not. Shorter tailed frogs evolved from longer tailed but both species are viable and still exist. The common ancestor of all the ape species, has gone extinct. But that wasn’t required for humans to exist. We are not descended from the currant primate species. They are our cousins. Our common ancestor lived millions of years ago.

[@kevinmorgan8782]

@@judyives1832 So the theory goes. However, the DNA evidence gives a different view of the relationship of organisms--a twisted tree with whole modules of genetic information in one supposed branch found in totally "unrelated" species on the other side of the tree. Using lateral gene transfer as an explanation for this is simply spitting in the wind. Furthermore, the idea that random gradual change can produce integrated systems is totally foreign to anything that one can observe. Natural selection has no power to create new integrated code that must go into effect precisely at the right time in embryonic development to produce the different features unique to the "related" species. Orphan genes are ubiquitous throughout the animal kingdom.

[@judyives1832]

Kevin Morgan unfortunately you don’t understand the process of evolution and I’m not going to write a book to refute your misrepresentations.. Go take a course.

[@inertiaforce7846]

Bad breath, tooth decay, and gum disease are clear evidence of intelligent design.

[@1toniah]

little kids have cancer adults have all kind of sickness plenty stupidity, we came and we go in this life wtf?

[@nerychristian]

All those things you mentioned are what happens when there is harm caused to a healthy body, or when you dont take care of your health.

[@SamonMarquis]

Wisdom teef are not an example of Intelligent Design, but rather Malicious Design.

[@inertiaforce7846]

Mark Zink i would say more like careless design. The designer didnt give a fuck.

[@rubberlegs15]

Fangs for the opinion!

[@inertiaforce7846]

Butthole hair is more evidence of wonderful design. Tooth decay. Gum disease.

[@charlesglidden557]

Pretty sure the wisdom teeth design came about before dentistry. An extra tooth could come in handy.

[@lancebybee7962]

Sharks grow new teeth and replace them as they wear out. Humans replace only one set of teeth. So?

[@toddwolford2021]

I am 2 yrs late to the game Seth. But Dr Abby is amazing!!!! Getting the book.

[@SheevPalpatine66420]

'Are squid made in God's image?' Oh my God H.P. Lovecraft was onto something

[@loriw2661]

What a great podcast! Thanks Seth. I am going to see if she has an audio book version and download it immediately. If not, (*sigh*), I’ll read the book. Lol!

[@dancingchocolate66]

Thank you for the great work you do, both Seth and Dr. Abby!

[@jeb6314]

After watching this podcast and hearing what the good doctor has to say, I will definitely be buying her book!

[@embertheasinine2336]

I find the design argument similarly to how I view Pascal's Wager, a thought provoking argument yet still a failure.

[@naughtysims30]

I can't tell you how many times I'll just be sitting down minding my own business, breathing, and suddenly I'm choking on my own saliva. Kind of embarrassing.

[@johnlopperman2161]

Naughty God the failed plumber. I have the very same confused "design" & passed the fuck-up to one of my sons.

[@benbisley]

An excellent and enlightening conversation.

[@dimbulb23]

There is Intelligent Design. Religions are intelligently designed so that no one can ever completely falsify the claims they make.

[@stevenaustin8274]

The chapter on the eye in Richard Dawkins climbing mount improbable is well worth reading

[@kevinmorgan8782]

Be sure to use your transplanted octopus eyes for best viewing.

[@peterlustig502]

Allthough I, as an Atheist apreciate those examples of Not so intelligent Design i think that this strategie wont work with a theist, because they will just say that we can Not apply our understanding of great design on gods creation

[@Dizzinator2114]

Peter Lustig true, but they do that with anything they don't want to accept. For me I personally became an atheist on accident, because I was listening to a book talking about the brain. I didn't expect it break down cognitive biases we have and it led me down a path of researching all that and I had to question my "spiritual experiences"

[@stevenaustin8274]

Some people will refuse to accept whatever strategy you use they don’t want to see and you will never change their minds

[@grejen711]

My response to this is to ask what is the point of a god if you can't really know him or use the relationship to any mutual advantage. Even if you believe in this 'creator who's great design is beyond your understanding' what's the point of revering him? You have just admitted you have no idea what he'll do next or why. I find this "God works in mysterious ways" trope to be absolutely terrifying if true. It means that reality can be broken at a whim. Of course this may already have happened due to a natural process and the end of this reality now rushes towards us at C.

[@influenzaz1012]

Mr. G i was born to shamanism, and didn't know I became an athiest although there shouldn't be that term, when i read the bible at 4th grade if I recall

[@Ugly_German_Truths]

+Peter Lustig "that we can Not apply our understanding of great design on gods creation" Why do THEY do so then? :D They think it IS grea tdesign so it CAN be attributed to god, but a heathen that thinks they found BAD design can't? Can we all say "double standards"? (or more formally: special pleading fallacy)

[@pattersonpi3027]

love you abby, keep on teatching people the greatest obsticale to discovery is not ignorance, but the illusion of knowledge, quote daniel e boorstin

[@JFrazer4303]

30:35 A friend says that anyone who talks about intelligent design must mean the cephalopods; they have only two joints that will ever ache. Only 2 bones, the upper and lower jaw/beak. They can squeeze through any opening they can fit their jaws through. We don't know how long they live if they're not hurt, they don't seem to get sick without major things going on around them. They dream while they sleep and show it on the color-changing ability of their skin, which they can use for communication. IDK if anyone's ever tried to each them language or see what their problem solving skills are (though see the octopus that made a brilliant daring escape form an aquarium) It might to a small degree be because he mentioned the Great Elder god Cthulhu from time to time...

[@brasspick]

What's worse than a Giraffe with a sore throat? Dolly Parton with a chest cold!!!

[@ForsythJC]

OMG! I absolutely LOVED Abby's testicles story! It was the funniest thing I've heard in a long time, and she's soooooo right!

[@rebeljustice9320]

ForsythJC O MY WHO?

[@ForsythJC]

Ryan Booth, hahahaha! Touche! XD

[@a.mckenna1574]

Superman's testicles is outside of his body.😁

[@maddyboombaddybaddy6532]

I'm pretty sick of carrying these dang balls vulnerable as hell to predatory objects and the yoga positions that muck em up ugh...

[@ApatheticEntity]

"Or maybe that squid were made in God's image" Master Cthulhu I always knew you were the true savior. Now I have science backing my God, the one true God's existence.

[@budd2nd]

Just gone and bought her book. Looking forward to reading it when it arrives.👍

[@oxcart4172]

91 creationists (as of 23rd October 2019) can't handle the truth!

[@ziploc2000]

What good is half an eye? Even if we limit ourselves to current living humans, there are plenty of people who have less than 100% perfect vision, but still benefit from whatever level of vision they have, even without corrective lenses. Even if your eyes could only detect light or dark, that would still benefit you.

[@JanetStarChild]

I love that the first argument against "Intelligent Design" is testicles, because it's so true! It's such a stupid design flaw, but the upside is that we get lots of great nutshot video uploads.

[@firefox5926]

1:52 it is kind of amazing to me that basic logic doesn't have its own class in primary school hell in kindergarten by the time a child is 10 they should at least be able to give a good approximation of what the basic logical fallacy's are how to spot them and how to avoid them

[@firefox5926]

5:13 the dude orders the executions of entire villages and generations.... why the fuck would he care if a business stays solvent .. the guys a prick

[@firefox5926]

10:11 well behind the ears obviously duuuh :P

[@firefox5926]

12:50 phrasing :P

[@ion-shivs]

Every Christian should listen to this episode. (I just did for the second time.) So educational and easy to understand.

[@DavidmByrd]

Seth your outstanding with the quality of guests and how you run the radio show.

[@stephaniecuellar3192]

Survival of the adequate... l know a few of those. LOL

[@NoActuallyGo-KCUF-Yourself]

Stephanie Cuellar I think we all know a lot of those!

[@ericssidechick3732]

The smartest among us help the dolts beat natural selection

[@tommyvictorbuch6960]

"Take your God and shove him." - Pat Condell.

[@davidn6811]

Growing up Jehovah Witness, I have a shitload of weird and horrifying stories. I finally got tossed out at 15 for thinking critically and exposing their abuse of us young folk but the elders wanted me out much earlier. This religion is arguably the biggest bullshit story of all time, to borrow from Carlin. Looking back, I was born atheist obviously, then got turned by my parents (who were highly intelligent but for reasons known only to them got brainwashed), then reached an age of reason and became atheist again. Not agnostic, which is a crock of shit, but outright atheist. Peace

[@zarasha8220]

d n agnostic is a perfectly legitimate stance, and is not mutually exclusive with atheist. Agnostic pertains to knowledge, while atheist pertains to belief. From what I've seen, most non believers fall into the 'agnostic atheist' category: they don't *know* for sure about gods existence, and won't *believe* in any unless provided with evidence to warrant belief. There are also a great many agnostic theists, who ALSO don't know for sure about gods existing, but DO believe anyway *despite* the lack of evidence. Simply put, agnosticism and atheism do not occupy the same linear line... They are totally different concepts altogether.

[@inertiaforce7846]

You're not alone I associated with Jehovah's Witnesses at one time also and they are the biggest bullshitters I've ever seen. I've actually started to debate one of them that I knew decades ago. He hasn't said anything new from that time and yet science has shown since thar time that atheism is better than any religion.

[@inertiaforce7846]

NorthernLight I am not confused at all I am an agnostic atheist myself and I'm fully aware of what agnostic atheism is.

[@inertiaforce7846]

NorthernLight so it looks like you were responding to the other guy ignore my response

[@humanbn1057]

"We are not supposed to understand all the ways of Gawd. Gawd made us perfect, even if we don't understand what "perfect" means." Some Christian

[@Fedsmoker666]

I can't believe that my parents believe that there were once biblical giants, but yet there have never been any remains found to prove so. The beliefs go on... I know many others have dealt with people in their life with the same delusional and seemingly unswayable beliefs. Just felt the need to vent this frustration somewhere. :/

[@giancarlosrosales6728]

Idk if she's gonna mention this, because I'm only half way though. Another bad design is the fact we produce scar tissue instead of just the specific tissue needed in that area. Especially in the heart. I was thinking about this in my anatomy and physiology class

[@SMILEY-bu2hj]

Giancarlos -- I recommend you spend your life eating at McDonald's then blame the Designer for not giving you a new heart.

[@giancarlosrosales6728]

@@SMILEY-bu2hj wrong

[@SMILEY-bu2hj]

Giancarlos -- That's ok little gay lord, make believe I'm wrong. Then what?

[@vadinhopsc]

It seems to me that a simple jelly fish got the best "design" ever: immortality (in the practical sense). Check the "turritopsis nutricula", Dr. Abby has already talked about. This jelly fish reaches maturity, reproduces, and goes back to "childhood", beginning all over again. Imagine if we could do the same.....

[@geeesuschrist5285]

Jellyfish have no bones, muscles, or brain. They are basically a ball of floating snot. But if that's how you would prefer to spend eternity, your wish is granted. I'll give you one week to wrap up your personal affairs.

[@vadinhopsc]

HEHE! I do not want to spend any "eternity" whatsoever. It is just a fantasy created by our simple human minds, the same as the so called "intelligent design" (a bag full of garbage). However, we could be a little bit better engineered, for sure. Sigh! We have only what evolution gave us.

[@Hoo88846]

Check out Dr. Tommy Mitchell’s lecture “Evolution-The Eye Does Not Have It”. Also check out Dr. David Menton’s lecture “Evolution - Not a Chance”. Dr. Tommy Mitchell is a medical doctor, while Dr. David Menton is a Ph.D. in biology.

[@davidcollier5821]

what was god thinking when he designed the Platypus?

[@blackice9088]

He was on a bad acid trip

[@iandruckman7779]

My vision sucks...I demand a factory recall!

[@ghostbuddy3106]

Another example of "not-so-intelligent design" is; our dependence on ingesting massive amounts of biomass and poorly processing it resulting in a huge percentage of waste.... POOP! Yea some God made us so perfect as to design perfect poop machines.... LuLz ;o

[@restlessfrager]

God made it so that managing our own refuse would be a hurdle that would make us better once we passed it. Our civilization has been thriving since we learned it during the renaissance. It's all for our own good. (I should probably say I'm being sarcastic)

[@MrBenbaruch]

SCE IF I

[@restlessfrager]

Or did like most animals and left it there.

[@Sciguy95]

restlessfrager its always a good choice to say you're being sarcastic on the internet since we cant hear the voice tones that show sarcasm. Its funny though how what you are making fun of is true. Anytime evidence is shown against our "design" beimg perfect, religious people just say it was intentional as some sort of test or learning mechanism.

[@restlessfrager]

To be honest I was trying to sound genuine, just to prove my point that religious peoples' answers are always the same cookie-cutter unprovable, goal-post moving garbage.

[@aundriamarshall3187]

but you know that no matter how valid and sensical Dr. Hafer's arguments are, a fundie will never hear it. Her brilliant work would always be brushed off with the old "who are we to question gawd's design?"

[@fernandezluis11]

Wow first time hearing her, one of my favorites now

[@drbulbul]

What an interesting interview! Thanks!

[@notaurusexcretus4471]

If the eye is a perfect design why do people wear glasses

[@charlesglidden557]

let me know the next time you make a perfect design

[@spinosaurusstriker]

@@charlesglidden557 i dont think he is a all powerfull god m8.

[@charlesglidden557]

@@spinosaurusstriker completely agree. And the doctor here has atrocious design skills

[@spinosaurusstriker]

@@charlesglidden557 jeah, its funny how you need a doctor to repair mistakes of a all powerfull god.

[@erictaylor5462]

10:00 This is when the Creationist says, "Oh Balls!"

[@dats3]

Man, that was a great show. I just ordered her book.

[@Moriningland]

It’s kind of amazing how god created designed humans and then, after the fall, informed woman “from now on, squeezing an 8 pound baby is going to be very painful”. I mean, wouldn’t that reality exist from the start?