The Problems With Armchair Bookers

[@tombstonerforever9374]

If arm-chair bookers were real bookers then they’d hate arm-chair bookers.

[@jerelminter]

I agree, if you keep expecting WWE to do what you want and then getting angry at the company, when it doesn't happen. Then that's YOUR FAULT, you gotta remember that this is a scripted show. They're gonna do it their way, and it's your choice to like it or not.

[@judasfire2]

@jerelminter this doesn't make sense. If McDonald's changes the recipe for the Big Mac after decades , hears customers complaints , but still stays on the new recipe , and then starts thinking why the customers are complaining , that's kind of very unthoughtful. The fans is one of the main reasons WWE is so big today , if WWE have low sales , low attendance and low ratings, that's not gonna help them survive even if they are multi billion dollar company. The customer is always right.

[@brudapeace]

​@@judasfire2 I disagree for the simple fact that fans really don't know what they want until they have it, u making an apple to oranges comparison food is meant to bring comfort and satisfy your hunger while wrestling is meant to entertain u and that can come in many forms it can upset you it can make you cry it can make u laugh exc. it is true that the the booker must have a pulse on the fanbase but not in the way ure explaining it wrestling is a sport or at least is mimicking a sport and sports is unpredictable and in sports the fans don't always get what they want but they keep coming back cuz of that exact feeling and that's what wrestling fans are forgetting it's one of the reasons why the attitude era worked so well and one of the reasons why it triumphs any other era

[@JohnKobaRuddy]

Most wrestling fans are narcissistic psychos who think the universe revolves around them

[@lucaslonchampt613]

I am someone that likes to dabble into a bit of fantasy booking. Hell I even tried to redo the year 1995 for the WWF because I thought that was fun. But with that in mind, I do understand that what I'm doing would probably not be feasible in real life, even as I try to be realistic. Because I'm not backstage, I'm not the one having to deal with a plethora of factors and elements I wouldn't know how to handle properly if I was confronted with them. So I do have a lot of respect for the bookers that do try to make shows on a daily basis and make sure the company makes money

[@TheNightTyrant]

Fans needing to decipher every single wyatt six crypitc promo and write an essay to explain their motive goes to show you how much of a geek pro wrestling fans are. This is WWE duty to tell us their storytelling not this to sit and decipher and do their work for them

[@johnnyphesto1247]

I constantly lose money in TEW, just like real wrestling promoters.

[@fillertitle8729]

@@johnnyphesto1247 Idk, TNA in 2010 is pretty profitable

[@johnnyphesto1247]

@ It wasn’t. They’ve had a few shows that were profitable, but year after year, they’d lose money.

[@jackc1186]

I think one of the biggest balancing acts a good booker has to do is giving the fans what they want vs what the story being told is. Sometimes the fans don’t know they want something unless you hint at or even just give them

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

Seriously. I think this happens a lot actually

[@tafua_a]

I read a quote about Triple H that sums up his strength as a booker: during meetings, he always listens to your ideas, and then decides case by case if he likes the idea or not. Sometimes fans have good ideas and you go "why didn't I think about it", while other times you go "this is just stupid" and ignore it.

[@hollywoodtre6098]

“The whole storyline doesn’t suck just because they didn’t do what they thought they should do” THIS IS SO TRUE. We saw busted open suffer from that after survivor series. If wwe didn’t hint at anything why are we putting our expectations so high that we are letting it down. Yes there are sometimes many ways you can take a story, that’s what makes a story great that there are multiple paths u can take and it makes people wonder and want to see what path they take. But if they didn’t hint at anything we’re really letting ourselves down to assume this is the place rock comes back or so and so does this turn or interferes.

[@basquiatofconvos4655]

Don't forget about "Internet Meltzers"

[@tombstonerforever9374]

Even the original Meltzer is bad enough

[@JohnKobaRuddy]

Internet window tonguers

[@AlfredoGomez-kp4cf]

Even as someone who loves playing booking games, im nota fan of armchair bookers who think their ideas are objectively better than what the writers are doing

[@DAHARRISHERE]

GREAT VIDEO DAVE

[@duatchol7710]

I first became an armchair booker when I was like 12 LOL. As you can imagine, I felt especially pompous and confident in my armchair booking because of the trash Vince had put together half the time. As I’ve gotten older, I do feel a lot less entitled about the stuff I want & expect to see happen. But I can’t say I don’t still do this instinctively.

[@andthatswhyidontlike]

Tony khan is exactly what happens when an armchair booker actually owns his own company.

[@NuMetalfan1996]

Well if I was booking my company would look nothing like AEW

[@Abridgimation]

he must be a pretty good armchair booker then, considering AEW keeps getting network deals and guys like Adam Copeland, Bryan Danielson, Claudio Castagnoli, CM Punk and Christian Cage were interested in going over there. Obviously he has some blunders though, I mean shit, he fumbled the bag with CM Punk tremendously and now he's doing awesome in WWE, but he's doing just enough right to keep the company going healthy. People really overdramatize what's going on with AEW for some weird reason, as if they want pro wrestling to return to what it was in the late 2010s, completely ignoring how godawful that era was.

[@andthatswhyidontlike]

@@Abridgimation I’m not saying he’s a bad business man I just find that the majority of his stories and angles are either boring, dumb or completely nonsensical. Sure he puts on the occasional great match but wrestling is much more than that in my eyes, the characters and the stories are just as important as the in ring stuff.

[@david-p8e6o]

@@NuMetalfan1996 nobody would be watching then

[@david-p8e6o]

@@Abridgimation youre funny doing awesome in WWE doing nothing you mean

[@dmac5472]

In the end, many of us don't watch with the mindset of purely being entertained by what is being presented. We often feel like the only way to be entertained is to have the exact resolution we want/expected. Like so many ROH/AEW fans are mad that Starkz didnt beat Athena. I was actually cool w the result

[@johnpittsii7524]

Thanks for the video

[@david-p8e6o]

good video one Dave to another thank you

[@N0strapapas]

What's funny is: I didn't even have John Moxley showing up on my radar... The thought never crossed my mind, UNTIL I heard the Shield music during the main event at Mania, then my mind immediately went to Moxley for some reason. Wasn't disappointed anyway though, that would never happen lol.

[@DirtyDemon917]

“Making sense” usually satisfies most.

[@jerryjanik480]

For me this is men and women they put their bodies all elite wrestling fan I and there's an old school wrestling fan the 90s just enjoy it remember just enjoy it stop the argument and just enjoy pro wrestling please

[@tafua_a]

It's fine to fantasy book as a creative exercise, and I don't share at all the "keep your stories to yourself" mindset. I do agree though that, if you genuinely think that a story sucks because it isn't what you booked, even though you didn't bother to uphold yourself to the standards the companies involved are upheld, then yeah, that opinion shouldn't be shared. Ultimately, like all the discours that arises every time an unattractive female character is introduced in a game, just because you have tastes, it doesn't mean you have good tastes.

[@jesseA6029]

I find it hilarious how armchair booking evolves around actual booking scenarios and can't deviate from that because then it's wrong.

[@StevenWilliams-i1v]

Know I can't book a show

[@NuMetalfan1996]

The thing is, when I was getting into WWE in the mid 00’s, I was very happy with a lot of the booking. Edge from 2005 to 2008 was booked fantastically RVD from January 2006 to July 2006 was booked very well expect everything after July 4th 2006. The Mickie James and Trish story was great The Cena and Edge feud was great The OG 2005 SmackDown vs Raw story was great. The 2005 Orton and Taker feud was great I have a lot of great memories back then The only thing I didn’t like back then was with WWECW I wasn’t happy with the booking of that show. My problem today is almost everything WWE has done since 2010 hasn’t interest me. And almost everything Hunter has been doing since he took over creative hasn’t interested me either. So I just want to watch an entertaining wrestling show like it used to be for me. And at the end of the day I just want to be entertained like I used to be, and feel like a fan again, instead nothing interests me in today’s wrestling.

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

Well that's a you problem. I look back at the exact same time period that you love and I don't like most of it. Everyone is different. And nothing feels the same as childhood. It can't. And no matter how much you want it to, it won't. That's just life.

[@brudapeace]

@@DaveKnowsWrestling I disagree tho there is a subjectivity in storyline quality when u get to a certain range there is an objective basis of what makes wrestling entertaining it's why the attitude era is the general consensus best era of wwe and I personally wasn't there to see it but I watched everything back and I agree with the consensus and while the ruthless aggression era did have it's downers the quality that was there far outweighed the quality in the 2010s era and the current era, now in terms of us the audience thinking we would be able to be able to handle the hot seat is foolish because truth be told despite us knowing so much of the dirt sheets behind the scenes we truly don't know what goes on behind the curtain with that being said u gotta give us the audience some credit of being able to tell what is good and what isn't when we watching it unfold and especially when we look back at the the previous eras in retrospect we fans may be ignorant at times but we're not dumb

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

Well, you are incorrect. By definition, quality is not and can not be objective. Also, your consensus is anecdotal. While I loved the Attitude Era myself, there were many people who didn't, who complained it wasn't wrestling it was just smash TV. So you are incorrect in both assessments

[@NuMetalfan1996]

@@DaveKnowsWrestling I think it’s partly my Autism. I get upset when others don’t show the same amount of passion as i do. It’s a trait of Autism. It’s just when I like something I get extremely passionate about it to the point of obsessing over it. But as I said in my first comment all I want is to enjoy what I like, and I don’t enjoy much about wrestling today.

[@brudapeace]

@DaveKnowsWrestling nah brother that's just not true quality can both be subjective and objective it's actually a very difficult line to draw which is why it's debated on whether something objectively good or not and it's why there's rules to storytelling. Us as humans can tell when something is nonsensical it's just the range of us being able to tell being different hence there being a ceiling before something is subjective in terms of quality. The reason why there is an objective basis is simply put wrestling is a sport or is meant to mimick what a sport should be that is unpredictability, underdogs and dominance in the case of wrestling the less unpredictable it is the more boring it gets the less fans are engaged it's why Cena was so hated in his prime, sports fans hate dominance unless it's their own team added to the fact that fans know it's scripted and its not hard to see why so many fans left after the attitude era tho there were other factors as well. The numbers say attitude era is the most popular so there was an aspect about it that made it objectively much better than other eras and an aspect to it that made people leave after it yeah there are those that say it's smash TV but people also said that Barcelona in 2011 are just passing merchants, it doesn't make it true.

[@DAHARRISHERE]

BTW YESTERDAY I NEVER GOT A ANSWER YESTERDAY WHEN DID TNA ACTUALLY SAID THEY DONT WANT BARON CORBIN

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

I took it as a joke

[@luisrizo8813]

04:23; Living in abundance

[@hiphopdagame]

ah yes, THE IWC...

[@sarmadhabibkhan3036]

3:57 Looking at you WWE, One Piece, Arcane, Attack on Titan, Dan Da Dan and LOTR haters. P.S. Darth Darth Binks was no mistake

[@davidgun07]

book starcade 97 much better

[@NAGAVERSE]

Wrestling fans are so entitled and stew pit. (Even the word stpd is banned so )

[@david-p8e6o]

wrestling fans think they can book better is hilarious

[@markmagician2471]

6:18 yeah Triple H

[@MangyStray]

Your “every member of the creative team started out where you are “comment got me wondering what a young Paul heyman was arm chair booking watching the likes of superstar billy graham and gorilla monsoon

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

Yea, just imagine that. It's crazy to think that we are all on the same step that the greats were once on

[@MultitaskingGuy]

1:07 I love Chelsea green but she has said tons of times she didn’t want a VP title. Michin deserved the us title

[@DAHARRISHERE]

BO CHELESEA EARNED THAT BELT WITH HER CHARACTER WORK AND HER BEING ENTERTAINING SHE DOES ANYTHING CREATIVE TOLD HER TO DO BUT TELL ME WHAT IS MICHIN/MIA YIM'S CHARACTER

[@Solid_Seth]

@@DAHARRISHERE Ok man, you don’t have to say that in all caps. Chill out.

[@DAHARRISHERE]

@@Solid_Seth ITS MY GIMMICK TO SPEAK IN ALL CAPS I'M NOT YELLING I'M A NICE GUY

[@DAHARRISHERE]

@@Solid_Seth AND YOU CHILL OUT LOL

[@BurntRAM]

well the two head bookers from the two big companies are total armchair bookers that managed to worm their way into management or in khans case he was just rich enough to buy his position. modern booking is so bad that im convinced that if you came up with some sort of booker iq test, and tested wrestling audiences you could probably find a handful who could do this better than whats currently being shown.

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

The thing that no one wants to admit is that booking quality is subjective. There is no good or bad. And I said in the video, every booker starts as an armchair booker. Some just take the leap

[@BurntRAM]

@@DaveKnowsWrestling thats true. i dont think modern wrestling fans are all that picky anyway. we saw the leaps wwe took after just a marginal improvement in the booking post vince.

[@BrawlSol1s]

I didn't know that term, but yeah, i feel identified 😂 Idk, I think that after Wrestlemania this year, there has been a lot of storylines that don't make sense, or that have been dragged for far too long (The New Day, Randy turning on Cody just looking at the title without doing anything else, just dragging the situation for a year to the next Wrestlemania) Roman turning babyface without apologizing with anyone, and all the other faces helping him, even though he was like Thanos before leaving on vacation. That's the reason because everybody is critizing and making their own storylines, I think. Actually, I'm doing the same, but with videogames in my channel, if you guys are interested. Booking a show, seeing how hard it is. But yeah, since Wrestlemania, Triple H and his creative team, have been making a lot of bad decisions.

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

Where to begin with this one... first, it's pro wrestling. Trying to have it make sense is a fool's errand to begin with. People don't uncontrollably run back and forth between ropes just because you throw them at it. So save all that. Second, you're doing exactly what I said not to do. Who said anything about Randy turning on Cody. This is you coming up with something you decided is going to happen. And fans have been doing this more than recently, so stop trying to justify it. And NO, your little video game booking is NOT anywhere close to what actual booking is

[@BrawlSol1s]

@DaveKnowsWrestling at the end of the day, it's storytelling. The stories have to make sense. It's like an action movie, avengers, fast and furious, Jackie Chan's movies, there are things that happen, like the thing that you say about the ropes, that aren't going to make sense, but the characters and their motivations have to make sense. Randy has been looking at the title for a long time. It's obvious that they are teasing a future match between the two. Without mentioning the fact, that besides La Knight and Cody, and Aj, Randy is the only other main eventer that SmackDown has. And yes, I know that it's not the same, because booking in a videogame it's a lot more easy that doing it in real life, because you don't have to deal with people's egos and else, but the part of the storytelling it's the same. I have to make good stories as well, if I want people to pay attention and continue to watch the next episodes.

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

My point is that what makes sense to some doesn't make sense to all. And there are loads of movies and booking where the motivation breaks down as soon as you look at it, but they are still successful. And you're really doubling down on my point about entitled fans. Randy is supposed to turn on him, but he's not doing it as soon as you want him to. Therefore this is bad because it isn't doing what you decided it's supposed to. And watch the next episode of what? Who is watching your stuff? What audience do you have for your video game?

[@BrawlSol1s]

@@DaveKnowsWrestling I'm not saying the Randy situation is bad because it hasn't happened, I'm just saying that they are delaying it till Wrestlemania Season. And in the meantime Cody hasn't had any real challenges, and that's one of the reasons why people believe his reign is bad or boring. And about my audience, i only have four people watching on youtube at the moment. I have only been doing this for a month. Everybody, including you, has to start somewhere. You're a small channel as well. I didn't think that you were gonna to belittle someone for having few subscribers, but I guess that's on me. Good luck growing your channel.

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

Exactly, Randy/Cody is bad because it's not happening the way you designated it should, and you've already decided what is definitely happening. And I'm not belittling you for not having a large audience. I trying to signify that thinking that what you do is in anyway remotely connected to actual booking is preposterous.

[@MultitaskingGuy]

2:35 I was confused that the rock didn’t come out at survivor or had a video promo.

[@RextheRebel]

The average fan is absolutely better than the average creative writer. I myself am infinitely more qualified but ive come across thousands of comments and spoken tp dozens of ppl who have much more fantastic booking than WWE or AEW. Did you just admit WWE has a bigger responsibility to its shareholders than it's own fans? The fans which purchase the product in the first place which allows WWE to pay anyone, let alone their shareholders?

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

First, I didn't say they had a bigger responsibility to their shareholders over fans. I just said they had a responsibility. Second, if you think fans bring in more money than the corporate world, then you are horribly mistaken. And third, like I said in the video, if you so good, then do something about it

[@RextheRebel]

@DaveKnowsWrestling without fans, there is nothing for the corporate world to invest in. Without consumers no one would want to invest in anything.

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

So Endeavor didn't give them 9.5B for ownership? NBC didn't give them 1B for the library? And you also overlook that for all the crying on the internet, fans still show up and still watch and still buy merch

[@RextheRebel]

@@DaveKnowsWrestling what is it you're not getting? Without the fans what reason would NBC or Endeavor have of collaborating with WWE and what purpose would they have to invest in a company with no meaningful consumer base?

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

The point is, at no point in time, has WWE ever been in danger of having zero fans or anywhere close. At Raw's lowest, in 2018 is when the Peacock deal was made. Not to mention the SA deal. Fine, if absolutely not one, not one person was watching, then deals would not be happening. But the biggest deals in company history were being struck regardless of internet fan satisfaction and even over hard fan numbers. If you want to play only in absolutes, then fine. But corporate earnings vs fan turnout is wildly disproportionate in favor of business

[@MultitaskingGuy]

3:24 with dom and rhea being married to people in real life I wish that would be cannon in wrestling. It’s weird.

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

So you just completely ignored the point of this video huh

[@MultitaskingGuy]

3:03 the rhea don one would have made a ton of sense. I wish aew and wwe would get along

[@brianallison9437]

So essentially your saying shut up and just like whatever content comes are way. Even if it's trash booking or predictable. Got it

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

No you don't got it. That wasn't even remotely what I was saying at all

[@UbisoftLBGTQ]

@@DaveKnowsWrestling you offended the armchair.

[@UbisoftLBGTQ]

I can't speak for Dave but as a bystander maybe just try it for a year or two shutting up could do you wonders.

[@DaveKnowsWrestling]

I thought I was pretty clear when I said, "Try to see if you can develop armchair booking into a career." And if you are going to do it, then at least do it right. Somehow, that was interpreted as I'm telling people to shut up. Which I'm not. I knew this was going to happen. As there are senstive folks out there who can never accept that, perhaps they might have to alter their behavior in the slightest. And if you look at his original comment, he said "are" when he meant "our." Clearly, he would not be giving up a job at NASA if he were to become a pro booker

[@brianallison9437]

@BigHeelJohnson good attempt at humor. You got me boi. I said what I said and meant it. Crazy how it struck a nerve. Go back to just liking anything. Sheep