The Racist Past (And Present!) Of Greek Life | Full Frontal on TBS

Just because there isn’t a Kappa Kappa Kappa chapter, doesn’t mean they didn’t want one! The entire Greek life system was born from white supremacist ideals and it’s about time colleges addressed this.
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[@mysticdueler8979]

I work security in a public University’s library (won’t say which one for safety’s sake), and without hesitation I can say our worst offenders when it comes to wearing masks are the frat boys (or fratholes as I like to call them). Sometimes multiple times an hour. The self-entitlement and privilege is just unbelievable sometimes!

[@MechaJutaro]

Self-entitlement and privilege are one explanation. Also possible..... They're just immature and self-focused young people

[@jelef001]

Thanks for avoiding calling the frats Greek. It’s very offensive to Greek people!

[@MyselftheElf]

Stay safe!

[@VideoHostSite]

Yeah, how horrible that people who are at no risk of Covid want to live lives free of servitude to your hysterical, irrational fears. I mean migod, they might break into your Grandma's house and breath on her, resulting in a 1% chance of her catching a disease with THREE available vaccines and a 99.9% survival rate. People like you disgust me. You do NOT get to let your own irrational cowardice and lack of medical knowledge dictate how other human beings live their lives.

[@mysticdueler8979]

@@VideoHostSite Hah! All my grandparents are already dead! Nice try troll! Go bother somebody else.

[@namic2007]

A college board game club sounds like the greatest thing in the world.

[@TheBasketBaller00]

It is 😁.

[@sandata]

i was part of an unofficial game club in college and as the only woman there i actually had a really great time, we were always playing dnd.. i think the only person that had a hard time ever was the dm 😭

[@darcy487]

Ikr?! I would join.

[@Virjunior01]

For real

[@Virjunior01]

@@sandata jesus. I'd love a DnD group...

[@Em-kg7qn]

Americans please stop calling whatever this is, greek, it's really uncomfortable Sincerely actual Greeks

[@dmitryspivak4586]

Can we still call our homosexual women by the name of one of your islands?

[@carultch]

It's called Greek Life, because they are commonly named with Greek letters that stand for a phrase in the Greek language as their motto, or the Greek words of virtues and traits that the fraternity/sorority values in their members. What the letters stand for, is often a pledged secret for the members to know and never share with the outside world, so it is not easy to find specific examples. One example of a fraternity who made their motto public, is Phi Beta Kappa which stands for the Greek words for "philosophy is the guide to life".

[@Em-kg7qn]

@@dmitryspivak4586 the ancient lesbian islander Sapfo would be proud so yes you have our blessing 😆

[@savannahcarlon7033]

The panhellenic conference has been calling it fraternity and sorority life for awhile, it's just people who have been out of college for awhile who still call it greek life.

[@redcd3743]

@carlhansen it’s still cultural appropriation!!! Or do you think that because it’s the Greeks and not the Latinos it doesn’t matter?? And now it’s getting more and more associated with a racist and segregating system that is purely of American creation!

[@tracymuckle8512]

I'll never understand the American obsession with this stuff

[@sisuguillam5109]

If you would like to have your mind boggled look at the german/austrian Burschenschaften. Don't forgett to keep a bucket handy while you read.

[@heronimousbrapson863]

It was in Canadian universities too, although I'm not sure about the present time.

[@matthewbittenbender9191]

Its tribalism at its finest. Greek fraternities are a way to gain status on campuses and establish an advantage in the workplace beyond college. And with the movie Animal House they became glorified party houses. They can be elitist and supetfo oal, but they were originally supposed to be organizations to build up reaponsibikty and competence among their members through community service.

[@RioMuc]

@@sisuguillam5109 Burschenschaften are not so common and widespread as fraternities in the US. But they do have something in common: they don't have a good reputation and the majority think about them as a bunch of racists in disguise.

[@sisuguillam5109]

@@RioMuc because quite often they are.

[@jordachejordan90]

I love that opening sentence abt Blk history month being a fake pause for racism.

[@CLBarr]

She had William Shatner and Mary J. Bridge on the “William and Mary” meme!!!!!

[@km1dash6]

I think a big problem with sororities and fraternities is that they tend to promote authoritarianism. People are told who they can associate with, what to do, when to do it, and if they fall out of line are shunned by their peer group. Considering that this is a time when people are discovering who they are, it seems like this isn't healthy for our society.

[@melanienolley]

Authoritarianism is a result of their Christian origins.

[@rkms5606]

Black sororities and fraternities do not. Forming in response to white supremacy, most of the experience empowers and creates safe space for leadership and community development

[@km1dash6]

@@rkms5606 I haven't gone into black fraternities or sororities, so I can't talk about the culture there. What I do know is that in general, institutions, even those that serve black people and are run by black people, are not separate from the broader American culture, which does value authoritarianism. Authoritarianism can bleed into these institutions in subtle ways, like discouraging men from expressing emotions, encouraging people to adopt the group's ideology (whether political, religious, or related to an area of study), or creating an exemplar what all members strive toward with deviations being seen as "less than." Don't get me wrong. We need black run spaces. We need places where black men, women, and non-binary people can congregate and be themselves. I just don't think adopting the fraternity/sorority system is the answer. Maybe something more like housing cooperatives would be better? I don't know. I think more research should be done on this topic.

[@mattesparza412]

Not every frat is that way, #hispanicFrat

[@sisuguillam5109]

@Johnny Fash and here goes the block button...

[@mattesparza412]

Shout out to all the nontoxic frats, sororities and multicultural ones. #Odiphi

[@avggamer86]

White culture (not to be confused with European cultures): "what's yours is mine and what's mine is... mine"

[@peacekeeperbabe]

???

[@chasecharland1160]

I think your refering to slavery? I'm guessing you didn't get the memo but it's common knowledge that every race and culture has participated in slavery at one point or another, not just white people. There are more slaves today than all the slaves in history combined, most are in middle east and Africa.

[@jelef001]

@@chasecharland1160 you’re

[@creativedesignation7880]

@@chasecharland1160 I think you might be the only person here talking about slavery. Pretty sure the commentor was talking about the practice of frats to exclude non-white people, while at the same time appropriating those people's culture. You know, the thing the video was about?

[@basma.x.6656]

@@chasecharland1160 Slavery has existed in different cultures and at different times, but america is infamous for the chattel slavery system

[@vernonhampton6973]

...and THIS is why the only 'Greek' I've pledged myself to was the woman I married...

[@philcool1968]

The only Greek i pledged myself to was a salad.

[@vernonhampton6973]

@@philcool1968 Same here, except I can't wrap my head around 'Is my salad Greek because IT'S from Greece, or because my wife is?'

[@Cancun771]

It would be a good start to just simply put the Jim Crow era into the school books. Nationwide mandatorily. Just saying. Imagine the outcry if Germany _didn't_ teach her school children about the Holocaust a half dozen times even just before age fourteen.

[@troyjardine5850]

That would actually require the contents in the textbooks to be factual, and we all know who would prevent "slavery" from being listed as the (only) cause of the US Civil War

[@Cancun771]

@@troyjardine5850 Which reminds me that the Cornerstone speech also needs to become a mandatory part of every American school child's curriculum.

[@charlesstebbins7207]

@@troyjardine5850 According to the people who fought in the civil war, both northerners & southerners, the #1 reason for the Civil War was taxes. The north wanted to raise taxes on agricultural products & the south said f** that. Of course, the south wanted slaves to be labeled as "agricultural equipment" & the north said f** that. So, you know.

[@KingBobXVI]

​@@charlesstebbins7207 - You should maybe actually read some history instead of lost-causer pamphlets and youtube videos. If it was all about taxes, they would have said so, but they didn't. The seceding states themselves said it was to preserve the institution of slavery, the confederate leaders said it was to preserve the institution of slavery, the confederate constitution said it was to preserve the institution of slavery. It was 100% started with the sole and primary purpose being to preserve the institution of slavery. Literally every other dumb excuse lost causers come up with has its roots in slavery as well. For the north, it was less about ending slavery and more about keeping the union together after the south seceded.

[@charlesstebbins7207]

@@KingBobXVI Winners get to define history? That's why I don't trust historians. Way to much bias. Instead, I read the journals, news paper reports, & letters from the era. And all without the "my side's correct because my side won" nonsense.

[@BetterLifeAhead35]

I spent a long time in an eating disorder treatment facility, and let me tell you, the number of college girls who were quite literally trained in the ED behaviors by sororities was disgusting

[@lisab9541]

Those are not sanctioned actions of the organization but individuals or poorly run chapters. Most provide assistance and education. We looked after our members and tried to help anyone who showed evidence of any mental health or other problem.

[@eternalearth88]

This just makes me extra happy and justified I quit greek life. It's a very toxic culture, now this just adds to it and proves it

[@darthknightwingphoenix2081]

I dislike greek life as much as the next guy, but that kinda sounds like confirmation bias.

[@t0n0k0]

I think reform is a better way than abolishing, but again, chances have been given over and over 😏

[@cindys9491]

Are there greek societies where alcohol isn't the major focus? (Excluding business fraternities)

[@redcd3743]

Please don’t call it Greek, it’s cultural appropriation, and highly offensive… And the actual Greek life is quite fun rly (once you disregard the crushing debt 😂)

[@eternalearth88]

@@redcd3743 I am Greek-American, my mom is from Xalkida and my Dad is from Glyfada. I was also in a sorority for a small time in my life. I am aware that there is a difference and often fought to prove a point that what American's call Greek life on College is just plain wrong and that they need to understand the difference.

[@uthmanbaksh3530]

When I was in college, I never pledged a fraternity, as did most students at Brooklyn College. As someone who was bullied as a kid, I didn't have the time or the money to re-traumatize myself as a young adult. We were there to go to class and graduate, occasionally join a few fun student clubs that didn't have alcohol but we still had a good time.

[@beckybertish7841]

Same..🙋‍♀️

[@Newfiecat]

Yup, same here. I just wanted to focus on studying and I hate parties anyway, lol Edit: Come to think of it, fraternities and sororities honestly sound like an intentional extension of all the worst parts of high school life...

[@violetlight1548]

Same here. The Anime club and the Fencing Team were all the socializing I needed :)

[@uthmanbaksh3530]

@@violetlight1548 Ah yes, the anime club. I really should have been more involved with them when I was in college. They even went to Anime conventions and NYCC years beforre I discovered those places on my own.

[@uthmanbaksh3530]

@@Newfiecat Exactly. Why would I spend money to be bullied by the worst people on campus? who were by extension the worst people when they were in high school.

[@shortsatire5669]

Who is surprised by this?

[@MyselftheElf]

Also, also- Don't forget the times that the White students petitioned to be involved in Step shows & dances & safe spaces, while still barring the Black students' entrance in their alumni.

[@MT-od7mc]

At first I thought: What have these ancient Greeks done again?

[@cindys9491]

Bacchus is at it again

[@redcd3743]

Yes, that’s probs due to the inherent cultural appropriation of the term…. It’s quite offensive for a whole culture actually, exquisite 💀

[@velvethunder]

@@redcd3743 as a greek i can confirm

[@TahtahmesDiary]

Keep teaching Sam 🐝!

[@granville7]

joining a club whose members think of themselves as better than others, putting up arbitrary entry barriers, initiation rituals which humiliate the candidates, expecting to obey arcane rules and engage in mindless drinking bouts is all highly unlikely to make anyone involved a better person. if the end result is just personal connections to secure jobs and a network for future opportunities then no support should be given by the university and the practice banned

[@jcgw2]

The problem is that most of the people who care about their college after they graduate is the people who were in a fraternity. And colleges really in those connections and donations made by those members

[@lisab9541]

This is not how most of the organizations and their chapters are these days, especially sororities. That's not to say some are not bad.

[@ashleyokurley2605]

@@jcgw2 How is it that caring about higher education after you've graduated is a "problem"? The caring that you are referring to is emblematic of Greek life -- care about each other, care about your alma mater, care about the wider community, and ultimately, care about the uplift of humanity. If someone really studies the best of these organizations (rather than presume 5-minute comedy bits on youtube provide the best insight), than you might find that the reason they care is because doing so is a key part of the principles and ideals-centered mission for why Fraternities/Sororities were created and why they continue to thrive centuries later.

[@SusiBiker]

Just when I think America is getting its sanity back. 😢 Thanks for highlighting this Sam. xx

[@darthknightwingphoenix2081]

you're presuming that we had it in the first place. We've got PLENTY of underlying and systemic issues that have been pushed aside and onto the backburner for far too long. Mr. Cheeto brought a lot of them to the forefront, but he wasn't the cause of ALL of them.

[@elizabethsullivan7176]

@@darthknightwingphoenix2081 He is the result of it.

[@darthknightwingphoenix2081]

@@elizabethsullivan7176 very true.

[@Mollygan]

I wonder: the overrepresention in positions of power is because they joined a frat and got conections, or is it because most people that come from already wealthy/influential families tend to joing more ?

[@MyselftheElf]

I thought about this a lot, & think it's probably both. Insuring your line stays in public office, donate to the school, open slots to men that don't deserve it, while also hoarding their money

[@danieldougan269]

Yes.

[@jcgw2]

Yes but as a system it makes it easy to make connections. As a system is great for people who take advantage of it.

[@Marshall_Stacks]

Both, especially at a fancy schools.

[@sisuguillam5109]

@@jcgw2 it is great for people who are allowed and therefore able to take advantage of it - that does not make it great.

[@NewMessage]

When you order a Greek Salad, and they refuse to add the black olives.

[@mariag.8242]

Very nice 😂

[@dianeridley9804]

And that feta is sooo salty...

[@sexyfatbastid]

That was funny.

[@carultch]

That's because Greek Salads are made with Kalamata olives.

[@RioMuc]

@@carultch yeah, and they are kind of brownish/black.

[@savannahcarlon7033]

I'm so glad my sorority has been confronting its racist past and present, much to the anger of our oldest members. I love seeing the older members leave in droves.

[@eldiablov2]

I recently resigned from my fraternity entirely and it was a liberating experience. Now to make amends for having ever been a part of such a system. I was in tears reading about Stone Foltz because I saw myself in him, that could have been me, wanting to belong and fit in after a lifetime of never belonging or fitting in.

[@tbayguy9933]

A Rush reference, your Canadian roots are showing

[@francishollingshead2134]

Yeah, Spotify has a "Born in the USA" playlist that includes songs by the Band. Either they don't know the difference or just decided that Levon Helm being born in Arkansas makes them qualify.

[@josephlauriezaepfel7924]

Exactly why I chose a college that had no fraternity/sorority life in the first place.

[@redcd3743]

Yes but please stop calling it Greek, call it sorority fraternity system. It’s 2021, calling it “Greek” is like calling a flight attendant a “stewardess” 💀

[@josephlauriezaepfel7924]

@@redcd3743 You're absolutely right. It's a lazy shortcut that I especially shouldn't use, since I am half (real) Greek myself. Original comment edited.

[@danieldougan269]

Greek life was a big deal at my university. I was not involved in it, but it was ever-present. Instead, I lived in the international dorm wing (despite being only 12 miles from home) with people from all over the world. One of the people in that dorm was actually from Greece. So, when he saw all the Greek letters, he felt right at home. He told a funny story of how he went around to the Greek houses when he first arrived on campus and actually speaking Greek...which led to some very blank stares.

[@lisab9541]

One of my sorority sisters is second generation Greek American.

[@grege5074]

so you're saying the frat Kappa Kappa Kappa isn't too out of place. Edit: Sorry, didn't see this joke in the description. Credit to them for coming up with it first.

[@Perurikun]

that makes me wonder how many times has an application for that name been turned down? 🤣

[@flowbotgirl]

The equivalent is KA in real life (the confederates fraternity)

[@eldiablov2]

@@flowbotgirl I was reading an article the other day about a chapter of KA who disaffiliated from nationals completely over that

[@jessstuart7495]

Members having access to the "fraternity files" (past exams, projects, papers, etc) gives these students an unethical academic advantage.

[@jonathanturner8243]

I was raised to believe that America was about equality and everyone being able to live the life they want to. So, it is very disheartening to know that America was never like that and has been led more by hatred than kindness or compassion.

[@darthknightwingphoenix2081]

we were ALL raised like that, and we were ALL disappointed.

[@jonathanturner8243]

@@darthknightwingphoenix2081 True. It is a matter if people are willing to accept that the lie is a lie and confront it as such.

[@MechaJutaro]

Quote the late, magnificent Stanley Crouch: "Our Constitution has a tragic base. It's not so much based on the idea that human beings are innately good, but that human beings are capable of doing bad things and that they're capable of abusing power, and therefore must be scrutinized closely. But through amendments, you're able to improvise responses to what happens in the society So, if you have policies like slavery being legal and most Americans not being allowed to vote, The Constitution provides us with an instrument to redeem ourselves, and correct decisions which, in hindsight, turn out to be unwise or downright evil, in the same way that a jazz band, the next time it plays a song, can revise a mistake that it made previously, when interpreting a song" The US is made up of human beings, and thus been highly imperfect when it comes to providing equality under the law for all, and equal access to opportunity for everyone. Nonetheless, we keep going, and work towards a land where everyone has a shot at life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness

[@mariahaxton6830]

Anyone who LIVES in United States had to be blind not to see what’s reality is all about!! Good grief people, are you under the rock?!? Have you ever study history?!? Wow..... United States has and still does a very dark side of inequality... open up a book!🤦‍♀️🤣

[@jcgw2]

I was raised to believe that the world is a mean environment where who you know is more important than what you know. And equality and everyone being able to live the life they want to was a dream and not more than a dream. I was never disappointed.

[@marct9942]

Interesting story. The fraternity I joined in school had an original charter that prohibited any discrimination and it was founded in 1895. I guess people join the gang that most reflects their attitude

[@cjwhitmore1881]

Same here. Mine originally prohibited racial and religious discrimination, has opened itself up to transgender members, bans drinking alcohol while wearing your pin or letters, and is about 40% LGBTQ+ according to our last survey. The fraternity system is vast (not to mention the distinctions between social, service, honor, professional, etc.) and has great and bad organizations all over. It's important to know what your frat is about before joining. I'm not going to deny the history of racism or terrible in Greek Life; it's tragic and I've seen deliberate racist acts connected to fraternities. I don't want to scrap the whole system as I also know the great community work that many organizations do; but we definitely need continued reform and for those within the system to stomp out the fires within their own houses before it takes down the entire lot.

[@eldiablov2]

My school was definitely an outlier and not reflective of the institution as a whole, but my personal experience doesn't mean that it shouldn't be abolished entirely

[@davidpumpkinsjr.5108]

Back 70s, my mother went to rush week just to get the free food the sororities were offering, and taking some back to the dorm for her roommate. When asked why she wasn't staying to pledge, she cited the fact that her roommate (who was Jewish) had not been invited. In hindsight, it was a little surprising they were willing to invite my mother (a Catholic girl) to rush a sorority in the deep south.

[@herczeus9341]

I live the “Greek Life” everyday. And I never needed to join a sorority to do so. 😉

[@ReturnofTheBunny]

Animal House, funny movie that it is, should also be called out for creating the image of frat boys as counter-cultural heroes.

[@malcire]

And revitalizing the Greek system.

[@mariag.8242]

As a young woman in university when it came out, I really wasn’t amused

[@AE-ld9ck]

My former BFF ended up joining a sorority with two girls in charge that she described in HS as “the real life Plastics”... She basically dedicated most of her wedding to her sorority sisters and it was a hot mess. They tend to act like they are superior to everyone else that isn’t in their House or in Greek life at all, and behave like mini-Karens or Beckys. It’s great to see ones that take their non profit fundraising and charitable events seriously but it shouldn’t be so exclusive, I mean the amount of money their dues pay to get into the house could’ve been donated if they REALLY cared about being that charitable. There seems to be tokenism with their donations, and used like the phrase “I’m not racist, I have a black friend.”

[@lisab9541]

That is getting better and there are a$$hats in every organization. It is easier to get in than for the group to get rid of them if they slip by and turn out to be horrible.

[@clararomero9206]

You are easily the BRAVEST voice: many THANKS!

[@G0DofRock]

"Scrabble! Scrabble!" Me: "..Scrabble!"

[@BuildingCenter]

Black frats also have christian by-laws, though some keep it (and other requirements) on the down-low. Definitely on the down-low. Representation and inclusivity are important.

[@lesiamahlay]

this segment couldn’t have come at a better time (I’m looking at you, Bachelor Nation...)

[@304Kid]

I say this as someone who started college in their mid-20s and finished at 30. The Greek system really needs to go, it promotes favorites and elitism in every way.

[@304Kid]

@Ohm of Life Well here is how odd it was for me. I'm a native of the same town where my university located, and a good amount of the bars had a "no student" rule because they would cause so many issues, like get into fights, break things, harasses people so they came up with that rule but I could get in no problem because I'm a local, and it was the weirdest thing because you knew which ones were local only, because no else but locals would go to them. Because I from Huntington, WV one of the drug capitals of America.

[@redcd3743]

Ok but please stop calling it Greek, it’s 2021, it’s highly offensive for a whole culture 🙏🏼

[@304Kid]

@@redcd3743 We could call it Greek-letter organizations, would that make you feel better? Look I think we call it the "The Greek system" in the US out of pure tradition at this point. They have been around for over 200 years. Although now that think about it I don't think I ever hear of it be called "greek life" during my time at college. Plus I think you're not seeing the forest for the trees. What we call the system isn't the issue, it's the system itself. that's the issue

[@kidmohair8151]

hmmm.... yet another antedated college hangover that maintains the plutocracy

[@cynthiapena8126]

Well what a shock 😃.... NOT!!

[@flyingcheff]

So unfair to Greek people!

[@rocketreindeer]

It's also dated to name this whole white/classist party world after a nationality it has nothing to do with.

[@cindys9491]

maybe they should call them Greek-letter organizations?

[@troperhghar9898]

5:52 You think thats bad I went to evergreen university in WA we had a tabletop group an organic garden and a "how to be a better socialist" Basically if your racist uncle ever told you collage makes you a liberal he's talking about my collage

[@wiz9496]

Do they teach you how to spell "college" at Evergreen?

[@troperhghar9898]

@@wiz9496 no that just all you can expect from a guy on his phone when he should be working

[@wiz9496]

@@troperhghar9898 Yeah, I always forget how to spell when I'm working, too.

[@troperhghar9898]

@@wiz9496 no stress

[@Newfiecat]

Ooooh sounds like my kind of university!

[@robulaszek4750]

This was an excellent segment that brings to light a disturbing past and some pressing current issues. Those that seek the exclusivity that sanctions racism will find those organizations, and that allows it to continue and fester. But the opposite is also true - if you seek an inclusive, productive association, you can find greek organizations that like the Divine Nine are founded on and driven by ideals. I am proud that my chapter (Wisconsin Gamma at Beloit College) forced and won the integration issue in the late 1960s for the Phi Kappa Psi fraternity. As a result, in the late 80s I was able to join a house that embraced numerous cultures and backgrounds - all of whom contributed to a more valuable experience in college and beyond.

[@justincastillogayray]

I often wonder how my educational path would have been if I attended an upper-class or middle-class college and joined a frathouse.

[@kevinconn]

Shut up Chad!...in this alternate timeline Justin, you changed your name to Chad 😉

[@justincastillogayray]

@@kevinconn Oh no I wouldn't have.

[@pulynanyalikibitz1301]

I think Kevin just outed himself as a Chad.

[@kevinconn]

@@pulynanyalikibitz1301 cha! That’s a lie and you know it! Now excuse me, I have to go on daddy’s taught and have a good time with some “white powder” and some ladies of the night! Some might be black. SEE?? I’m not racist! Some of. Y best friends are black! Cha-I mean Kevin our!

[@mariag.8242]

With Castillo as your family name maybe you’d have trouble joining one

[@JaQuicker]

Devin Nunes...perfect example of abject mediocrity floating to the top. The fact that that guy has access to classified anything shows how broken things are

[@TheBasketBaller00]

This makes me happier/explains why The Evergreen State College has never had Greek life. Instead all those state funds go into programs and Student Activities for fun engaging clubs! Way better than more alcohol poisoning cases. Board game club for life!

[@Newfiecat]

Man, why don't all colleges follow this example??

[@eldiablov2]

Really, if they can address the need to fit in and belong with organisations that don't have all of these same issues, that would go a long way towards abolishing it

[@piscesfish15]

I was in a national fraternity at Carnegie Mellon University and we had a diverse membership and I believe that our Chapter has been recognized for outstanding philanthropy. Yes, there was drinking, partying, and such, but that is not an exclusively fraternity thing! It's college! I still keep in contact with my brothers and little sisters around the world and enjoy the fact that I have a social group to meet when I go back for alumni events. No doubt there are bad actors and bad people in college (and the world) but I don't believe that I can agree with the theme here that fraternities should be abolished. This is an easy target to pick on, but many people benefit from their fraternity experience. I did and others I know did. By all means sanction those that do wrong, but that is true of ANY college or social organization. Rather focus on the true negatives as you (partially) did. White supremacy. Racism. Prejudice. Misogyny. Binge drinking. Those are not exclusively fraternity issues as T***p's time has shown. That being said, love your show overall!

[@eldiablov2]

I was also a member of one and I believe that they should all be abolished.

[@piscesfish15]

@@eldiablov2 Yes, they are not for everyone, and everyone has a different experience. I was stating why I did not agree with this episode. I found it odd that while Sam B was knocking traditional fraternities, she was still supporting traditionally all-black fraternities? (I think all "anything" fraternities are an issue, white, black, christian, etc.) In the episode there was a recognition that there are positive attributes to fraternal life, and I was noting that at least in my undergraduate school the fraternities were largely integrated. I am still out on a limb about what this new "cancel culture" really means, but if there are fraternities, or chapters of fraternities, that are doing well and doing good, what's the issue? If a fraternity or chapter is acting in a way that is discriminating based only on the color of someone's skin, religion, or ethnic background, or endangering the life of its members, then by all means work on those issues, to the extent of closure or legal outcomes. But the reality of life is that people enjoy being in groups, whether fraternities, social clubs, sports clubs, or whatever, and that will not change. Fraternities have been a social and support center and network for college students for a long time, my experience was positive and I support them (or at least mine, because I had a personal experience). If your experience was not positive, then I hope at least you accept that many may have had a positive experience and fraternities be allowed to continue.

[@eldiablov2]

@@piscesfish15 All black and multicultural fraternities are different, because they came to be as a result of discrimination. They also play an important role in those communities. I am not going to say anything about those because that's out of my lane. And really, being integrated isn't a sign of much of anything. Tokenism is very prevalent, and many of those report that they were never really treated as equals and were pretty much there to give the illusion of inclusivity. Anyway, it's only looking back that I see all of the negative things about Greek life and what I experienced. I was very young and naive at the time, and also very desperate to fit in and belong since I had never had that before in my life. Plus, my school wasn't set up like many others in that it wasn't as big, there wasn't a Greek row, and it was a commuter school on the west coast. It looked different than what others describe, but that doesn't change anything. Somebody's personal experience is not representative of anything outside of that person's experience, and doesn't change the structural and historical issues at play, and the fact that these problems are baked into it much like the problems in the country as a whole. It looked different at my school, but when people try to make it more like the traditional fraternities and sororities at other schools, some of these things became more apparent. I will also say that there are people that I liked whom I still talk to. There are others whom the relationship was very shallow and based on being in the same place at the same time, and others whom I find despicable and incompatible with personally and politically. Yeah there are plenty of people, especially at big schools, who joined because they want to recreate and maintained the social order where they are on top. There are others who joined simply because they want to fit in and belong. For those types, it would go a long way to address those things without all of the problems that come with Greek life. And the fact that the calls to abolish it are coming from within is huge. Reform has been tried, and it was met with resistance from the top and ultimately didn't work. I used to think that these stories in the news were just one offs, but I now see that isn't the case. Time to abolish it completely.

[@piscesfish15]

@@eldiablov2 Eliminate the fraternities and something else will just take its place, maybe worse and less visible than before. And what you describe above is the dynamic of any organization with liking some parts and some people and not others. Many exclusive or organized groups have started out as one thing (racist, misogynistic, etc.) then developed into something else. A good example? The Democratic party. It used to be associated with slavery and prejudice, but can hardly be considered that now. That didn't happen overnight. I would argue that there are plenty of chapters of fraternities that are inclusive and doing good things, as well as their social function. All change is a process. If the only answer is to eliminate anything that doesn't pass some impossible purity test then we will have a very boring world indeed. Arbitrarily eliminate fraternities and my guess is that you will only find that other organizations will develop to fill that space. Much better in my view to work to change the mindset and practice of the fraternal system to something that is better than it was before. But again, this is my experience as my chapter was multi-cultural, multi-faith despite being part of a national fraternity. I know that other chapters were not the same, but again, that is the reality of life. As for tokenism, that wasn't the case in my chapter as far as I could tell, it really was a pretty diverse place. As a caution, be careful when stating that "everyone is saying so". Keep perspective, news generally does not report good things, typically it is reporting the worst things. That is what sells. So while it may seem that the system is riddled with negatives it may just be the reporting you are hearing. You have heard the negatives, but are you sure that you really know the positive side of fraternal life and what it can do to help others within the fraternity and to the larger community outside? I feel that I have a realistic view of this and while I support changes overall to the system, I don't feel that wholesale elimination is warranted. Just my $0.02!

[@eldiablov2]

@@piscesfish15 That's why I talked about addressing the structural issues that they are reflective of. It isn't just about them, as they are a symptom. As soon as those issues are addressed, the likelihood of something similar springing up is eliminated. I mean consider the reason for the backlash, those coming out against it are going to take steps to address the systemic issues at hand and make sure that something similar doesn't spring up in its place. Really it's simply part of a much larger cultural and structural change. And again, I was part of it so I saw this stuff up close, I thought that it was selective reporting and a few one off incidents as well, but I see now that is not the the case.

[@shysweet5439]

Wish she had mentioned the history of colorism in black Greek organizations

[@Cerogravity47]

Too much racism for the segment. White Greek Letter groups, hate anyone non white. Black Greek Letter groups, hate certain shades of black people.

[@whitneyoneal2360]

My German Shepherd has a frat boy toy from a Bark Box. It’s the only toy he has that he truly attempts to destroy. Go boy go!

[@VideoHostSite]

What is it about young liberal women that makes them so viciously hateful?

[@kevinbwillson4161]

Yes Samantha hits it out of the park again Thanks

[@37Dionysos]

Poppy & Dubya Bush, Brett Kavanaugh---the distinguished alumnae list goes on. On. And on...

[@mungolikescandy3270]

hi UK here, out of curiosity what are the benefits of joining a frat? we don’t have them

[@zesty9815]

4:36 ... networking and influence?

[@darthknightwingphoenix2081]

connections and parties. It's basically just an old boys club for the old boys network.

[@mungolikescandy3270]

@@darthknightwingphoenix2081 so there’s nothing like cheap/free rent or food or anything involved? I assume if people attend a certain frat they are expected to help out other people who were in the same one or the whole thing collapses (bit like the freemasons etc)

[@darthknightwingphoenix2081]

@@mungolikescandy3270 well, yeah. That's part of the whole "connections" thing. Just a bunch of white dudes helping out other white dudes.

[@lisab9541]

@@darthknightwingphoenix2081 there are all types of fraternities and sororities.

[@deelish22]

I'm shocked and astounded to find out college can be racist...

[@dontspikemydrink9382]

sarcasm

[@kpepperl319]

I can never understand these "clubs".

[@robbingcars9140]

I didn’t technically know this but I’m not the least bit surprised

[@stephenspackman5573]

In most countries, universities are about education, not fraternities and sport. What's up with that, America?

[@Lapusso650]

This makes me feel better about never having gotten a bid

[@michaeljames5936]

Craaazy idea, but how's about your government funds your universities and admission is based on merit, rather than how much your dad paid them. You could also make all organisations associated with these universities open to ALL students, not just rich white, or black elitists.

[@Marshall_Stacks]

Your first sentence makes lots of sense. The 2nd sentence does not. Fraternities and sororities are purely optional.

[@elihan9]

Is it wrong that I don't care about what happens to greek life; regardless of race.

[@redcd3743]

Ok but please don’t call it “Greek”, it has nothing to do with Greece, and it’s extremely offensive 🙏🏼

[@jesyke]

The great irony is that, at least when I was at William and Mary, my sorority had a majority of Jewish sisters and at one point more African American sisters than our AKA chapter...

[@antonispoli]

But I live in Greece, what other life could I be living?

[@BonetheStreetwearCreator]

But there are black fraternities and Sororities. They would let black folk in so we made our own and they’re waaaaay better.

[@Kittymancer78]

THANK YOU MADAME!! I LOVE YOU! THANK YOU Once again you are the light in the dark. The lone voice calling attention to an atrocity, long condoned by sociopaths, and demanding justice. Thank for being that loud firm strong voice for those of use who have no voice Ms. Bee

[@clairekaplan7417]

I loved the movie Animal House growing up. Still undoing the psychic damage. Some good jokes in there, though :/

[@georgegauros199]

I'm Greek and I find it racist that they use the term "Greek Life" just cause they use some letters of the Greek alphabet

[@ashleyokurley2605]

As I'm sure you know, ancient Greece was a pre-racial society. They adopted Greek letters as central to their identities because they were inspired by some of the principles that first took root in ancient Greece, namely democracy and the constant pursuit of wisdom, knowledge and truth (among other principles).

[@TheMfmccarthy]

Gollleeee this woman is attractive

[@nataliestavrum4451]

There are so many things I don't understand about the U.S. but fraternities and sororities are some of the weirdest things they have. Just: why?

[@ashleyokurley2605]

Because there is great value in constantly striving towards principles/ideals. I'm not a US citizen, but joining a Fraternity the month I became an adult is one of the best things I ever did. Being public about striving towards ideals will inevitably lead to criticism because we all fail to live up to our best ideals from time to time. But the effort is worth it -- and that is probably the best answer to your question.......because it's worth it.

[@goodlookingcorpse]

I bet you anything you like that the Bowdoin Board Game Club is quite disdainful of Scrabble, and more than happy to tell you about recent improvements in design in board games.

[@mysticloverfairy1]

Even in fiction fraternities and sororities are hardly ever good.

[@AllDayEDC]

Yeah like them raising hundreds of millions for charity every single year and volunteering requirements for members. How aweful.

[@lRod0j0]

Dragging the Bachelor

[@dreamlife2351]

Excellent information. Love and respect to you Sam and your staff. 🌺 Aloha from Hawai’i

[@praycost2024]

Sam the people from Amherst College just go to UMass ;)

[@smalleyesbigattitude]

Greek life was always banned at my college

[@redcd3743]

Ok, but please don’t call it Greek, it’s extremely offensive! 🙏🏼

[@deltav864]

I always listen to "National Brotherhood Week" by Tom Lehrer at least once in February... and laugh before the feeling sinks in that there's been little progress since that song's inception.

[@nychellebrewer]

"It's only for a week so have no fear / Be grateful that it doesn't last all year!" 😁

[@ralfnator1695]

Fraternity was a major component of the French Revolution. And people have hated on fraternities like Freemasons ever since... I was in a university frat and we didn't segregate. One semester I had a roommate from Bangladesh. We welcomed Blacks and Latinos too. My brothers didn't dictate anything, and it was a great experience. It all depends on the campus and the house. You can take away frats from places like Alabama, and the racism will remain. I promise you that.

[@ashleyokurley2605]

Yes, there's a reason why the words "Fraternity" and "equality" are right next to each other in the French national motto. The birth of Greek life in North America was a direct result of the altruism of the Age of Enlightenment. Of course, the cynicism represented in so many of the comments here fail to see that, but cynics are never very good at supporting organizations based on altruism.

[@ralfnator1695]

@@ashleyokurley2605 Thanks for responding to my post. I was a Sig Ep in the 90s at University of Nebraska at Kearney. I'm from Denver. Kearney was a suitcase college. If you weren't old enough for the bars, the whole greek thing provided activity on the weekend. It turned into a really good support for me when I had a health crisis in my undergrad. It's also where I met my best friend. He's never let me down. I ended up becoming a Freemason. I've received so much. And this last year I gave some back. I dunno. Maybe Boomers were so individualistic that it kind of killed part of our communal culture. I still like Boomers. Thx again.

[@ashleyokurley2605]

@@ralfnator1695 I've heard about a program that Sigma Phi Epsilon has that takes undergrads to Greece during the summer to see where the idea of Fraternity all began. I would like to learn more about it. I can't imagine how awesome it would be to have a formal meeting in the very place where that ancient moral and intellectual legacy began.

[@amitalati5741]

The few weeks America feels bad about being racists. LOL 😂

[@chair547]

Ah yes grssk life.

[@robertdullnig3625]

Board Game Club > Greek life

[@redcd3743]

I’m with you, but please refrain from calling it « Greek » it has nothing to do with Greeks, it’s just cultural appropriation 🙏🏼

[@jeaninelondon1404]

Where are the Brandon streakers? Meet the challenge. SHARE IT!!! GOOD LUCK! MAY THE BEST TEAM WIN!

[@elaineg60]

-reason my best friend & I, in 1978, joined a diverse FRATERNITY of misfits of all ethnicities 😁. We had a BLAST at this house that was more like Animal House than the famous movie..and, lo & behold, we were right next door to the stately, snotty Pike House...who hated us with a passion. Thing is, last I checked, Sigma Nu was still there while the Pikes were shut down & permanently banned many years ago! For those wondering-we were “little sisters” and considering Deb and I were all of 4’11 and about 95lbs at age 18..we were like REAL “little sis’s”. Those guys looked out for us and protected us just like little sisters for over 3 years and we stayed in touch with some of them for MANY years later! I’ll never forget my husbands face when, shortly after our daughter was born, (about 5 years after college); I got a huge bouquet of flowers from the frat. ❤️. We ended up going to a few reunions over the years-before I moved out of state. Back then, I think there was one frat for black men, none for women..at least at our university. Sigma Nu was the only one then that it didn’t matter what race..OR whether you came from a wealthy family.

[@AL-cg4vb]

Lol I’m really glad you included my state Oregon on the front because people here love to forget how disgusting we are

[@ashaneinthewild]

While it is true that many Fraternities and Sororities have an incredibly problematic history they need to address (many of which are actively doing so), it frustrates me that the majority of the discourse is being led by videos like these. The video is well sourced and does have evidence to back up some of the claims about Sorority and Fraternity life, but also presents those alongside unsourced statements that fundamentally don't understand the structure, organization, or even history of Greek Life. Quite a few organizations were founded on explicitly non-discriminatory clauses, there are multiple forms of Fraternity and Sorority ranging from pre-professional, to service, to cultural, to social - with all manners of combinations and variations in between - and it makes factually incorrect statements of chapter operations and organizations. Two specific examples to reinforce this: Phi Beta Kappa is not the first Fraternity, it's the first one with Greek Letters - not all Fraternities have Greek letters and currently 3 national scale social Fraternities don't use them at all (Acacia, Farmhouse, and Triangle). Second example: This video argues that only schools can shut down chapters and disaffiliating chapters cannot shut themselves down; this is patently untrue. Chapters vote to close themselves all the time, it's actually quite common. Whether it's due to financial difficulties (the elephant in the room that these criticisms seem to ignore is that greek life charges dues not to pay for friends, but to pay for insurance and supplies; events cost money, stores and companies don't give you supplies for free), frustrations with greek life at their school, or frustrations with the system as a whole chapter can and do vote to close semi-regularly. Some schools can choose to ban Fraternities and Sororities, but many flat out can't because it's a violation of the first amendment freedom of assembly and those schools have chosen to receive funding from the federal government. Structurally, the schools cannot force an outside group to do anything in many cases - it's a literal violation of the constitution of the United States. To sum this all up: there are very valid criticisms of the behaviour of some Greek Life chapters, and the history of the community. Many chapters, national organizations, and councils are trying to address this. Greek life though isn't a monolith; what happens in one chapter doesn't happen in another. Blaming ALL chapters for then actions of what statistically is the minority of chapters in the modern era, and all forms of greek life for the actions of a few notable instances from one or two types of chapter, is collective punishment for individual action. If you want to know about Fraternity and Sorority life, TALK TO SOMEONE IN A CHAPTER. Don't rely on information like this from individuals with no experience whatsoever in the community who feel they have the knowledge over what the life is like in the community. While that person who isn't from the community may have some valid sources and criticisms they will also likely get a LOT wrong, and no community likes being spoken FOR instead of being spoken TO.

[@antigonemerlin]

Much like how every British Prime Minister goes to Eaton, I'm surprised you didn't address the inherent classism of the good ol' boys network.

[@peglamphier4745]

The Fraternities and Sororities are still segregated, if unofficially. At Cal Poly Pomona there's 'special' Greek organizations for the Asian and Hispanic kids (we have few black students), while the mainstream Greeks are all white. A few years ago some students of mine tried to start a new sorority for promoting Latinas and the gate keepers objected because there was already one Latina sorority. We won, but it was a fight.

[@chukslukesyn5360]

I've always hated fraternities and sororities, imo they are breeding ground for entitlements, racism, bigotry, Brads and Karens

[@georgesais8687]

Greek life? Are you joking? I see Greek letters, life? Universities in Greece were attacked during the U.S. backed military regeme in the late 1960's. Uni. Students in Greece are constantly fighting right-wing interference. There is no reason to associate some romantic attachment beween Greek letters and Greek life!

[@ClareBearBunny]

As a transgender woman, I tried to pledge a sorority. The only ones who didn't get in were me, and the two black women.

[@carultch]

Try pledging Psi Upsilon. That's a coed fraternity that is supportive of transgender members.

[@letsRegulateSociopaths]

I thought they called it greek because it was all older guys and younger boys sleeping in the same house and doing the "elephant walk" to show each other how much they like each other....

[@eldiablov2]

Anyway, as a former member who has resigned completely, I am all in favor of abolishing it, but I also feel that there are some things that need to be considered. We need to stop going after individual people who join, because this is counterproductive, alienates potential allies who may be ready to reconsider things, and also takes away from the fact that this is an institutional issue. People don't suddenly change and become bad and dangerous, there are cultural and structural issues at play that need to be addressed. Making it about individuals takes away from the institutional and structural factors at play. On top of that, not everybody is going to have the same experience. For example, I went to a commuter College on the west coast where Greek life had a very small presence and looked much different than what you would imagine at other schools, so it took me a while to see the problems with it. Plus there's the fact that people join for a myriad of reasons, such as wanting a sense of belonging and a network of people for what is often their first time away from home. It isn't always for a sense of exclusivity and elitism. Understanding these reasons for joining is important when constructing something new to replace fraternities and sororities on campus. When these things are addressed, I would imagine that many would not see a need to join Greek life and with those reactionary types that are relatively small in number, I'm pretty sure that Greek life would eventually wither away. Yes, colleges will absolutely survive without Greek life and it is entirely possible to build a thriving and inclusive social scene without it. Abolishing it is great, but building something new is the direction I think it needs to go

[@fanfictiondreamer7836]

I think it would be more fitting if the r-word was directed towards people like this, not disabled people like myself. At least disabled people are able to understand right from wrong and can live by that without any issues. These people, on the otherhand, couldn't care less about right and wrong and continue to make these vapid decisions, either oblivious to the consequences and the comeupance they receive, are unaware of it or living in the delusion that consequences don't exist. Yeah, community service sounds like the kind of service that they would most likely participate in.

[@andrehavard67]

I never understood why Black College Students would pledged to Greek fraternities and sororities even at HBC? Black citizens are not Greek and there are plenty of historical African Kings and Queens to name our own frats and sororities from but instead continue to join where we are not welcomed.

[@taun96]

Americans every time a bad thing happens: we are not like this and this isn't who we are.

[@fmcevoy1]

My fraternity at Bowdoin was started for the black, Jewish, and Catholic undergraduates, who were barred from the others.

[@DreamcastSwirly]

I gotta be honest when I saw John Hoynes in the Animal House clip I was surprised. Like sir you are the vice president cmon now

[@rwmorey71]

Love random Rush (the band!) references!

[@dianascrimger284]

There is a difference between the wasp and black sororities. They are structured differently and neither groups should haze. Step and lines are not a tradition of the wasp groups. The wasp groups rush differently and has houses on some campuses

[@LucieEleanor]

As a European I don’t understand this at all...we just go to university and live in shared accommodation.

[@TheHistorySoldier]

As someone from Southeast PA, hearing someone pronounce that first R in Swarthmore physically hurts me.