The Rise and Fall of the Matchmaking System

[@Cheasle2]

"there's 5 slots for cheaters on the other team and only 4 slots on mine" never thought of it that way...

[@raqyee]

Use that argument (and if needed replace word cheaters with griefers, throwers etc.) about people complaining game forces 50% winrate on them and they just fall apart.

[@realpaiderman]

i'm gonna start using this argument, ty

[@U_Geek]

There are 5 slots for good players in the enemy team but only 4 in mine...oh wait that doesn't really work... or does it?.. Vsauce Michael here...

[@ypsilondaone]

Isnt new

[@csCherry]

And 0 slots if you play with group of friends

[@amyshaw893]

"Some of the younger players haven't even played a singleplayer game" really shook me...

[@benismann]

yeah that's just insane. And I'm not that old myself (2003)

[@sharishth]

Back then internet was expensive, good average hardware wasn't common and not easy to maintain. So lots of us preferred single player more, not to mention the story was so good in those games, those games were not over expensive as now. Also f2p culture (which is good) also plays major roles in it. Even CSGO is free now.

[@Gahanun]

Might be just a sign of games getting more popular. I would imagine the sort of person who plays SP is in it to experience a narrative, play around, etc. The big influx of more casual gamers might be in it for the sport.

[@HeadphoneTarnish]

Well, you have to take into account which type of game makes more money? Multiplayer can be an endless source of $ (a la gtaV fortnight csgo league hearthstone etc etc etc)

[@Sh4d0wzzz]

@@sharishth yes wolfenstein3d. Doom and Duke nukem had the best and most in depth storyline ever in gaming history!

[@Tasoittaja]

The matchmaking is good at finding a well balanced team with equal skills on the enemy team and finding the bad ones on my team

[@aspire8388]

the matchmaking is good at matching me with teammates who are astronomically more dumb than my enemies

[@mannequ1n915]

matchmaking is insane at finding players that don't hear footsteps for my team and finding retards that keep doing a d a d to win aim duels that don't even what crosshair placement is on the other team

[@starplatinumtheworldact4ov699]

I think we all had that one team who forgot to wear their headphones.

[@holorizu7316]

@@starplatinumtheworldact4ov699 *slowly exits the room

[@kamez1049]

True, my teammates either don't have hands or eyes.

[@DeSinc]

single player is going to have a giant resurgence once machine/deep learned AI systems come into play and start to mimic real players so closely someone around today wouldn't even be able to tell. developers will be able to program AI that feels like real players, only they can choose any skill level they want to offer. it'll be like having your own personal slaves to play games with you non stop day in and day out but you can tell them to act exactly as skilled as you want them to be while you mow them down and pretend to be the hero. no more NPCs running into walls, jittering back and forth with a d a d spam, not being able to jump up a box, getting stuck on a poorly crafted NPC pathing node, instead they will seem intelligent.

[@michaelshumshum]

accelerated backhop

[@44r0n-9]

Where the f would be the fun in that? This is absolutely not the future.

[@GrachLP]

you dont want real AI in a Videogame. Its not going to be fun.

[@turmspitzewerk]

what about the games where that's already possible? the things thst you can do in a lot of games, especially strategy games; are simple enough in gameplay that computers can be indistinguishable from real players.

[@Cook1eSP]

When the AI learns when to pick up the better gun, the rounds pretty much over

[@ThaBabris]

5:59 that was a funny experience for my brain, ngl :D

[@jacobmorris8869]

lol

[@lacaulac]

Got me puzzled for a moment yeah

[@jw25546]

It was a glitch in the Matrix

[@ypsilondaone]

I was thinking some kind of horror scene would come xD

[@levoGAMES]

It's absolutely trippy if you're tired. I almost fell asleep and I wasn't sure if he really said it twice....

[@dakotaedey9943]

The fact that 5:50 is the most replayed timestamp, and when there is a random discord notification noise

[@XxToPgamE]

i went back to it to ckeck it is not my discord lol

[@Tweezi]

@@XxToPgamE same lol

[@FlamingSwordful]

5:59 Yes Phillip, can't disagree, but it's important to state another viewpoint, that there's always been cheaters, but when you add value to being the best it makes the problem so much worse!

[@chef6621]

Yeah alternative viewpoints are key with things like this, cause when you add value to being the best it makes the problem so much worse

[@mateuszw.7905]

Yeah. Though i have to add (cause you have forgot about it) that there's always been cheaters, but when you add value to being the best it makes the problem so much worse;

[@TrendyWhistle]

Guys y’all are all missing the point, the cheaters have always been around, but when you add value to being the best it makes the cheating problem so much worse!

[@chuan2164]

A rarer method is to completely nuke the server. This happened to me yesterday because a cheater was spinbotting during warmup , so my teammate just destroy the server.

[@sajtoszsak1928]

@@blower5 The truth is, there have always been cheaters, regardless we should also consider the fact that the perceived value of "being the best" positively correlates with the amount of cheaters

[@Horrorz95]

This is an idea that goes beyond CSGO honestly. The eventual shift to competitive matchmaking has warped a large part of the industry to what it is today. Honestly, I'm just glad CSGO still has some casual servers I can fuck around in and even play fun little game modes people have thought of. Can't say the same for other MP games these days really.

[@HarrowingShadows]

Had the exact same problem with dota 2 a fair few years back

[@HarrowingShadows]

And currently having the same issue with Tekken 7, although it doesn't seem to be to as bad an extent as these other 2 games

[@Nessinby]

Rainbow Six Siege. Used to be a favorite game of mine and friends. But it got to the point where it felt like the game was actively telling us that we can't have fun. We can't relax, and act non-sweaty. If we do, we get stomped 5 seconds into the round. Even the casual mode ended with that, with it gaining a basic MM system and seen by other players as a Competitive Lite. It also doesn't help that I suck, and would constantly feel guilt for dragging my team down. The straw that broke the camel's back, and I will repeat this for years to come, is when I got instant-kicked out of the April Fool's mode by my team. An april fool's mode. The most casual of mode to exist. For having a less than 1 k/d.

[@dariannnnnn]

Casual, Deathmatch, and War Games are the only modes i play. I don't think i will ever play Competitive

[@cheesypoohalo]

God yes, every shooter is so ultra competitive now, and because they're all team based games it feels like you have to perform and sweat your balls off or people will throw a tantrum. The worst example in recent years has to be Overwatch, a game that drew in tons of casuals by its visual and charcter designs, and then slowly tried to push competitiveness in every mode. For example, in the arcade, you need to get 9 wins per week for extra loot boxes. Not 'play 9 games', it has to be wins. Becausse of this, you now often get toxic players in modes like 'Mystery Heroes', where everyone is given a random character, because people are so focused on winning and want to get the loot box garbage. It's such a shame that things have ended up like this. Hopefully there will be a ressurgance in co-operative or PvE games in the future, most games marketed towards older players are eitheer singleplayer games or competitive multiplayer games, and it feels like big companies don't want to develop games that are more casual-focused. Hell, even the new Call of Duty has a ranking system that is applied across all game modes, meaning even casual matches are adjusted by difficulty. Competitiveness is the main focus of online games today.

[@InHooman]

"People who play on different levels depending on their mood that day" Yep, you got me there. Agree with the video, as it explains why I've left CS:GO after 1500 hours - there is no more fun to be had. Last couple hundred hours were played just because it was with friends, but without someone to play with, the game isn't fun anymore. Single player games I've been putting off all these years, here I come

[@scheibenwischer2000]

I feel what you say so much. For me its time to move on. I almost did, but some friends are living far away+corona and its the only way to have fun with them, because they play nothing else I feel like. So even though I reflected that I'm fed up with CS GO matchmaking I'm playing it. It's so stupid.

[@Daniel-jm7ts]

Tbh 1500 h are a lot, most single-layer games have only content for like max 100h, so that a game can entertain you for 1.5k h is quite impressive

[@awesomebrawel4050]

@@Daniel-jm7ts some ppl have 10k hours on cs go

[@bignig123]

just curious what rank you were before quitting?

[@momlookicanfly2685]

Same here. I feel like everyone today tryhard this game so much. There is no casual and fun in it

[@kenobi90000]

I grew up in the transitional era between the singleplayer focused generation and the multiplayer focused generation, and I ended up finding that the singleplayer side is much more enjoyable. I can play DMC3 forever and never get bored of it.

[@fitmotheyap]

Similar I prefer minecraft but i got addicted to uh.. league ;(

[@thecashewtrader3328]

wow cashew index

[@wulfherecyning1282]

For some reason, I have a feeling that when you add value to being the best, it makes the problem so much worse. Even though there have always been cheaters. Oh yes.

[@woestewouter96]

Where have I heard that before? Must be somewhere... I don't know

[@kashu7691]

@@woestewouter96 can you please explain why everyone is repeating that phrase

[@mateuszw.7905]

@@kashu7691 it was a vid glitch.

[@ivanbarrella7352]

This is why i really enjoyed the BF3/BF4 multiplayer. You'd get to play against every skill lvl and gauge your own progress. Plus, there was always a different playstyle to be tried, in case you're not feeling in your A game. I hope BF6 can bring that back

[@Save21]

totally agree

[@baumlutscher8495]

Gotta love starting the matches with a permanent 2v5, that's how the games real fun

[@jacobmorris8869]

frfr

[@karhu07]

And if the enemy team gives you a chance by playing bad guns or only knifing

[@baumlutscher8495]

@@karhu07 nah they usually don't

[@InnocentC0]

If bots were there, I'm gladly to have 4 bots on my side against 5 trashtalk players. It's not like I'm that good or anything. But, I like to have an ability to switch to the bot anytime. When I died, I can switch to a bot to catch the player off guard and beat them off. I know bots are not here anymore. But, I just like to mention adventages to have bots.

[@Ian.Murray]

...and the other team just text-spams in chat and trash talks as though it's a fair match. Humans were a mistake.

[@Ghanemq8]

"oh yes there's always been cheaters, but when you add value to being the best, it makes the problem so much worse" x2 -3kliksphilip 2021

[@washedmaffle11]

Repetition legitimizes.

[@azi6896]

Emphasis!

[@Ghanemq8]

@@washedmaffle11 "Hoes mad" x27

[@vigniringi1033]

Does he imply that there shpuld not be displayable ranks?

[@garfieldh.8820]

@@washedmaffle11 Repetition legitimizes.

[@enrico3769]

the premier matchmaking with the operation pass(when it was limited to pass owners only) was one of the best mm experiences I had in a long time, around 80-90% with friendly teammates who actively used their mic. It turned into normal mm when everyone got access to it tho :(

[@tomhumphries912]

yeah I actively enjoyed that - although the slightly longer typical game time was off putting. I find faceit or community servers are best now, community servers when I can't commit to a full 45mins of csgo

[@kasequark4286]

For me it was just as shit as regular MM.

[@Sieww]

The premier mm has been a complete shitshow at least in Asia region. It completely disregard Trust Factor of hackers with a new steam account that just bought the operation pass. It also disregarded ranks because not many were using it. For instance LE getting queue with silvers and low gn. Why was so many Asia players abandoning premier mm? Because cheaters would just buy the operation pass and mm so that they can circumvent Trust Factor. I had literal clips of me getting obliterated by spin hackers with new steam profiles using premier mm. So many Asia players had moved to Valorant just for that reason alone.

[@AKagNA]

@@tomhumphries912 pub servers are full of cheaters with 2 lvl accounts, even people cheat in FFA DM servers now, genuinely dont know what to say. (not neccessarily spinbots but soft aimlock-wallhacks)

[@goran2734]

With noticeably smaller amount of cheaters !

[@HOUNGOUNGAGNE69]

Talk to me about it...

[@sganicocchi5337]

enjoying road to global?

[@mkgt7axe]

I recently experienced something like your last video with the cheaters on MM. Cheater on the other team had a premade and one of his teammates got banned killing him but we still lost. I had a cheater on my team and i tried blocking shots, i got killed by him once (and once by his premade) but the Bhops let him run away from me. It was funny seeing him rage at why i was not letting him cheat and try to block him/make me shoot me by accident. These games you should try having fun and tilting the cheaters/swear at them/make them feel bad/troll them e.t.c. because if you take them seriously you'll get frustrated and sad. When you cant play the game, invent "THE TROLLING CHEATER GAME!!!!" and play a minigame in cs and have some laughs at least

[@uvuvwevwevweossaswithglasses]

Lmao

[@celebiemre67]

leave mm its dead.

[@annuletout4548]

Road to face it 10 ?

[@CitroenGames]

when i heard the battlefield 1942 music it made me feel old instantly

[@janp6622]

It made me want to search the game up from somewhere and go to nostalgia town.

[@proCaylak]

it is one of those early multiplayer-focused shooters that aren't arena shooters.

[@chiiku4639]

@@janp6622 it's still populated, so come join anytime

[@chiiku4639]

It made me nostalgic, but I can't say I felt old, since I'm only 20 lol

[@SummonerArthur]

I had to watch that part twice cuz my brain went all into the music and forgot that philip was even speaking

[@thefreeman1970]

7:07 New Counter-Strike looks amazing o_O

[@Mysterious_Wizard]

Sounds like battlefield from the music.

[@Prince.Claveria]

It's that the new Counter-Strike Card Game I see? 😳

[@medicfedor]

5:47, love that wall of evenly spaced houses

[@MasterHobbes]

Thank you for this video. You've basically summed up my feelings on competitive matchmaking in most video games today. As someone who grew up in the 90s/ early 2000s in games it was always hard to try and tell people why multiplayer games today felt different than the ones I grew up with.

[@Prince.Claveria]

I really love those days, well it was hard to play online but it's much more fun to play in lan servers with your friends, back when the internet wasn't accessible to everybody yet.

[@OVER9000xDxD]

There is no "fun games" in csgo, the casual 14v14 community servers are basically dead which in my opinion were 10 times more fun then solo queue mm. In older fps like rogue spear, sof2, q3a often times teams were formed to be as balanced as possible, and to some limited extent this existed in csgo community servers before they died out. In modern FPS the idea is to stack a team as much as possible and make the game as one sided as possible in exchange for playing with a squad of friends, which has a detrimental effect on the genre overall. Console match making with premade parties is a thorn in the side of FPS games in terms of balance and fun. I don't personally find 5 man queuing fun, its boring to stomp a team 16-2/3. This also inflates a players "rank" due to the premade party, the moment they are removed from that 5 man you often see a sharp decline in performance almost immediately. That being said, its a "team game" so I get the point of having a 5 man queue, but fps were always "team" games before premade stacking in a console match making style of FPS. In the late 90s, if you wanted a set team, you used a 3rd party ladder to play clans vs clans, and it had rankings based on these clan matches. I think its unfortunate most games have strayed away from fun games and 3rd party ladders in exchange for the current state of FPS. When I say 3rd party ladders I mean ladders anyone and everyone played if they wanted to play competitive matches, CSGO's ladders like esea/faceit are saturated by players who are under the belief of one day being a professional player, which is not even remotely possible for a vast majority, regardless of how well they stack a queue. I really liked the 14v14 community servers csgo had in 2015ish, could play 7-8 hours a day having a blast, nothing like playing dust2 with 7 nades at long door, 4-5 pickers mid and enough smokes to keep everything blocked off the entire round. XD was mayhem, silvers through globals all playing in one server, higher ranked/skilled players less toxic because its a casual match with nothing on the line, and admins watching to keep everyone tame.

[@thecashewtrader3328]

very interesting

[@ok-kp1ot]

intresting how well the bf theme fits csgo gameplay scenes on d2 xD

[@theshortbowwithmasterwork2832]

Here's the link to the rant he mentioned at the end, so you don't have to scroll forever as well. kzbin.info/www/bejne/rpPKdJqGrt13fdk

[@Jackfromshack]

we need a hero to upscale this

[@mabciapayne16]

thanks

[@zoidicabra]

careful he's a hero

[@leandrogoslean889]

Thanks foe the source. Also, had to slow down the speed in that video lmao

[@gplastic]

I have that video downloaded from long ago lol

[@blunderingfool]

I'm, personally, still one for the days when you played on particular servers. Still miss Nachos & Beer to this day. The UT99/2k4 servers running silly maps were always a favourite too.

[@NaSpiorad]

I had a shock when I went looking for old CS servers I played on only to find they stopped running them a few months ago. RIP UKCS. And custom map servers in any game were hilarious. 50% exploring the map and finding things 50% half-heartedly trying to git gud on them.

[@thecashewtrader3328]

wow very interesting... tell me more

[@Xbman98]

My problem with matchmaking is that you don't meet or get to know many new people outside of the friend group you're queueing with. Compared to being a regular on a specific server games feel more impersonal. For most of the people you get put up against, you probably won't meet them again in the next few months.

[@A12C4]

THIS is the reason number one against matchmaking. People jump into a match with random strangers in a few seconds, and if it doesn't go well, they feel free to be as toxic as they want, because soon the match will end and they can do it all over again. Do that on a game without matchmaking like Counter-Strike Source and you will quickly get banned from all the good servers.

[@Top_Weeb]

Halo 3 let you communicate with the other team after the match and party up with them if you wanted. There was also proximity chat during the match.

[@Freakattaker]

Legit. The games are technically more balanced, but we lost a sense of "local community" not unlike a local pub IRL. A place you can go to to chill and hangout and have fun with people you see regularly and eventually build a sense of camaraderie.

[@brysonrichey6707]

I know I’m late to the party here but I recently found out Halo Infinite does NOT EVER let you talk to the other team. Absolutely insane, there is zero sense of community.

[@StephenSweat]

1:31 Wow, this description of old CS was super nostalgic for me. Honestly hadn’t thought about this in a while and I kind of miss it, both as a relative noob and as a skilled player.

[@Kriis_network]

The music at the end brought back some amazing memories from childhood. Battlefield 1942 was a great game where 95% was playing against Bots and 5% multiplayer

[@therealwetwizard]

4:55 This really hit me in a spot for some reason

[@abe9818]

Match making is really toxic lmao, I got queued up with GN’s and a Silver elite being a silver two and the whole time they were complaining about my kills or whatnot

[@_mirru]

yeah its sad. im dmg and when i get queued with le's or globals same thing happen to me. thats why when i get silvers in my team i just try to have fun and not make them feel bad for losing

[@acrain7]

The main issue though is that often times your rank in the game feels like it is based off of factors beyond your control, rather than your actual agility, which makes progressing through the system hard, and enjoying said progress even harder, since you know that your current rank may be lowered at any point, should you loose the next game... even when you won six in a row before that.

[@Invenitive]

This is something I had been saying since 2015 and always getting downvoted to hell on Reddit for. Any sort of indicator as to where your rank is would do a lot to help me feel better about when I rank up or derank. Adding some sort of factor that also takes in how well you're doing instead of winning or losing would also help things balance better. Valorant has the best ranked system of any game I've played in a while, just wish I actually liked the game. CSGO I had a time where I lost a game with 50 kills and deranked. Valorant I lost a game where I had 40 kills, but I still ranked up. Valorant you can lose a game, but still gain MMR or stay around the same area, and they tell you how your rank generally reacts to each game. CSGO you're just stuck fully in the dark.

[@BebxOfficial]

@@Invenitive Rocket leagues ranking system is another example of a great matchmaker. I dunno what it is about it but it just does an excellent job of placing you where you actually belong.

[@Invenitive]

@@BebxOfficial I agree with that decent bit. Rocket League has gone back to being my main game last few months. I appreciate that you can see your exact MMR and know exactly how each game affects your rank. It also does a great job of finding people close to your skill, where most games are pretty close. With smaller teams, it's also easier for player to carry, so you feel like your personal performance contributes much more

[@TriWaZe]

This very thing is talked about in my documentary I made. kzbin.info/www/bejne/b6TQemObotecgdk

[@Invenitive]

@@BebxOfficial kinda expanding on that, Rocket League is the only game where I've ever felt my rank directly reflected my general skill level. The soft reset on rank every few months helps a ton with getting you placed towards a rank more appropriate for your skill. I'm not sure how well a system like that would sit with the CSGO community, though

[@Rogue9]

I’m exactly the same. My YT presence is built on Rainbow Six commentary & analysis but I don’t actively grind the game. I much prefer cooperative or single player gaming experiences. For me, video games are where I go for some fun downtime and not really where I constantly want to compete. Working hard to become really good in a competitive game can be very rewarding... but I just can’t bring myself to “work” at something that is meant to be fun.

[@NovaAge]

How is a comment from a famous KZbinr isn't the most liked *and* doesn't have a single comment?

[@KNDCHV]

5:51 ... OMG Battlefield 1942 theme...goosebumps...

[@hitaishibarai9062]

oh so it was battlefield's theme....I thought it was because I have have been binge watching jackfrags....

[@ghostx80x2]

mm today: lets see how these silvers are gonna play against those Lem and dmg's, its gonna be fun to play for both teams

[@thefirstbushman]

Sounds like the words of someone getting carried in a five stack

[@aceverntoo]

Yeah, True. i have been Constantly getting wallers, and DMGs

[@aeronautisch]

How is matchmaking nowadays. Haven't played seriously in years as a DMG-LE after they removed Cobble, made CSGO F2P and released Scrimmage mode. Have played as a wingman LEM-Supreme, some danger zone and doing 1v1 for fun a year ago for a bit during 3kliks de_fenestration server period, but I stopped after that completely.. Did anything change really since then?

[@lacumbancha6273]

Happened the other day to me, probably those guys who play a single map and grind. Getting prefired through smokes and losing 0-16 was really fun

[@Patrikv303]

its really hard to get out of silver with a full team nowadays tbh, enemies are usually like LEM or DMG in SILVER, and ur teammates are usually trolls or people with 4 hours in the game

[@abhisekbus]

It's mostly because of cheaters and smurfs that I found out how pointless it was trying to rank up. I saw a video interviewing a guy who used paid hacks and it broke my heart on how undetectable it can be. After that, I lost faith in ranked matchmaking.

[@Dazen101]

I love how applicable this is to every competitive PvP game. I think a fix for match making would be just to put it at the back end. Don't show ranks. Just have a competitive mode that players know they'll be challenged on. If you're the best, you'll never know. If you're the worst, you'll never know. The problem I find with most competitive scenes is number chasing. The threat of losing your number makes people so toxic.

[@arnabkar8792]

Yes, like apex, it has a non-competitive mode with hidden ranking, and it always has been fun for me.

[@cubesolver2564]

Having the option to hide your rank (or just ranks in general if it's visible by default) in a game's "competitive" mode would also be nice. Sometimes, people want to play to know how far they can go up the ranks, and that's fine as long as they don't value themselves as a player solely based on that. For me, I just want to have the feeling of a fair match where I won't be steamrolled, or be the steamroller. I don't want my rank to be the one showing me if I'm progressing or not, and instead see that for myself based on the people I'm playing against. If I can't see my rank, but can still play the game normally and enjoy my time, I also won't have to concern myself with that issue related to number chasing, like you mentioned.

[@ATalkingShark]

My experience with matchmaking in *every* shooter tends to be a few good, equal matches at first. Then, quite literally for the next few days, I'll have match after match where the enemy team has to be a coordinated hive mind, yet my teammates are must be playing their first shooter ever. It's always happened and I hate it so much now since I've got less time to play games. The only way around it is to find a dedicated group of people to tag along with.

[@TheSuperappelflap]

thats because after those first few games you are mostly playing against stacks of people who play together a lot so their teamwork is better while youre queueing with randoms.

[@yoke155]

The worst part is when matchmaking fails to do what it sets out to do. I’ve had so many matches where I question the legitimacy of the system. Either because I’m outperforming everyone on my team but nobody on the other team or vise verse.

[@oyshikaadi9631]

I feel like this stems from a very basic, yet unfixable problem of PvP games like CSGO in general. If you are having fun, then by definition, it is physically impossible for everyone else to have fun. Your fun is coming from the price of someone else's, who you are winning against.

[@Dark_Voice]

@@oyshikaadi9631 Not really. If it is you give some and take some everyone has fun but when one player is out there slaughtering OR you have 1 or 2 god level players with rest completely trash and the other team filled with all decent players - then you suffer.

[@SubFiveTheFighterThatCantWin]

@@oyshikaadi9631 it's not zero sum, and fun doesn't always mean stomping the other team. I can accept losing a fair match no problem. What enrages me is matchmaking systems assembling one-sided matches. The games I used to play (paladins, rainbow 6 siege, BF5) offer little to no chance for a good player to carry a match so the options are basically quit or continue to serve as a sparring dummy.

[@capsaicin5332]

I've watched this video so many times and each time I come back to it I identify with it more, thank you

[@AndrosYang]

If you could go into how player retention algorithms are used in matchmaking that'd be epic

[@exitpath2]

VeXXSie’s name on the kill feed reminds me of those videos about her. I hope she’s doing well.

[@zacharyslater7119]

She seems to be fairly active on her reddit so I think she’s ok I noticed the kill feed too lol

[@shrekfanboy2239]

Oh yes, there’s always been cheaters, but when you add value to being the best it makes the problem so much worse.

[@mvsh]

So much worse.

[@kadugbuss]

I used to play a lot of csgo, but the excesive pressure of ranks, wins, losts, having a good team and being good to the team, made me stop enjoying the game as i used to. The more i ranked up, the more i cared about winning to rank up more, and the less i cared about having fun. After that i have stopped with competitive games, and moved more to single player or coop games, and i'm feeling much better now. This video really made me wonder how much i could have enjoyed the older CSs, that i haven't played back in the day because i was too young (actually, not even born at all). But even when not playing csgo, i still love to watch your videos just because of how good they are, keep doing the great work you do, i wish you the best.

[@thexavier666]

I'm more of a 1.6 player. Towards the end of my CS days, i enjoyed surfing and kz maps more. The community is nice, and I can see myself improving. I think valve can push other gamemodes as well.

[@Khrayfish]

Community gamemodes don't make Valve any money though, that's why Dota 2's community maps system is actual garbage.

[@DartzinhoV]

Damn Philip was fast at correcting that repetition, I was extremely confused about half of the comments until I realized there was a cut in the video

[@davidgabay9398]

I feel this video describes perfectly why I stopped playing a lot of CS:GO match-making and started speedrunning games I used to play in the past: it has a set bar of skill that I'm measuring myself with, and it feels more satisfying than playing against a varying skill of players at the moment.

[@n4p0815]

I am 31 yo and you are speaking from the bottom of my heart. I quit csgo 3 months ago and went back to l4d and single player games. To much toxicity and cheaters. Waste of time.

[@Max-gs1lj]

5:59 "I heard that thieves broke into the Arcane University, The Imperial Legion Compound, and the Temple, all on the same night!...wait a minute let me do that one again...I heard that Thieves broke into the Arcane University, The Imperial Legion Compound, and the Temple, all on the same night!"

[@CabbageGod]

Shoutout to my boys who have also played for 5+ years and yet are still silver 1

[@somedude1068]

>join community server >play same server all the time >make connections and friends >people recognize your name >have fun rivalries with decent players on other team >fuck around and make animal noises into microphone >laugh some random squeaker of >jump in or off server when ever you like no attachments Current gaming: >play 8 hrs. per day with random strangers >never feel satisfaction >never make connections because matches too short >feel tense >you an other 9 people hate the game equally >everyone is angry and toxic constantly >don't feel progression and feel even worse Why would you even play?

[@johnes4882]

couldn't have put it in better words myself

[@zzh315]

"alot of playerbase been on MM for only months" well its becasue they get banned and they make new accounts. there are way too many closet cheaters in this game at lease in oce server

[@vladimirgolosin4699]

Ive just recently talked with my brother about how i miss server browsers...

[@deathab0ve]

Not gonna lie I got really into watching that solitary game that I missed a whole minute and just went back for it.

[@markkNL]

I always love the complaints about smurfing in casual. Like, how? You literally cannot do that in casual since there are no ranks.

[@KillukaAnime]

Well, it´s a little bit weird. If you create a new account, then you will found yourself playing with players that are, clearly, starting to play the game. And you will notice it, it´s not like a subtle detail. So i think that, even if you have nothing to lose, there are people smurfing in casual, but idk, maybe it´s just my experience

[@homeyworkey]

there's probably a hidden MMR. rocket league does this, since the mmr is hidden people can take a more casual approach while being against players of their same skill level

[@InnocentC0]

It probably depends on Level and they put the same level players together, If I had to guess.

[@ChernzObyl]

"it's not enough for me to win, you must lose" is something that really applies to the mindset now around multiplayer now

[@L0n3w0lf-YT]

Philip? We gonna talk about 5:59?

[@Robot404_]

WHAT ABOUT IT??

[@D4GUNI4]

That solitaire run gave me a lot of nostalgia damn I had forgotten of how much satisfaction that wining animation used to give me

[@YotaNinja]

I thought this was going to be about the recent heavy influx of cheaters in matchmaking. The last 6 weeks have been absolutely cancer in and out of prime matchmaking. I've been playing cs for over 20 years, and this makes me want to quit completely.

[@YotaNinja]

@Prolific it's even worse for me, and I haven't gotten a single notification from csgo about properly reported cheaters. So I'm anticipating a large vac wave, but not holding my breath.

[@roccatsenseful]

@@YotaNinjaUnfortunately you're hoping for to much im afraid.

[@YotaNinja]

@@roccatsenseful That's why I used the word anticipating, not hoping for or expecting anything. Just simply anticipating it.

[@pauliewalnuts5868]

As someone who still plays Public servers in 1.6,i think i enjoy them farrr more than matchmaking,it just gets boring,half of the time when you are Silver you are with smurfs,hackers or trolls who trap you at spawn and wont let you move,also one of the reasons i saw public servers in 1.6 better than CSGO's matchmaking is that in 1.6 you have a physical admin,so if someone griefs,he gets banned or kicked,and even with Prime in CSGO,it just becomes boring after a while,i grinded for that Prime and its the exact same like the normal game,i sometimes do a quick competitive game and thats basically it for me

[@vilestine]

Battlefield theme? It's everywhere, when is the trailer gonna drop :D

[@SirEdubardo]

june 9 i will sit so hard pressing F5 on dice and EA twitter,that the guy that gets me out of my chair will be the new arthur king

[@thins1378]

I feel like the introduction of seasons like in other games like overwatch would really help the game out. Having it as more of a side thing where you still keep your normal rank. It would be really beneficial to those who feel like they'd been wronged by the ranking system and just generally increase the player numbers during the seasons

[@MrIvory124]

You know you've watched too much KZbin when you see "26 minutes ago"

[@scottrastyles2592]

A big problem I have with matchmaking is reducing the social experience. On severs you could produce a community by just simply choosing to play on a given server and the social aspect grew on its own

[@teamkills]

4:21 Novelty and csgo is such a good topic tbh

[@RassGames]

I love how there is just battlefield music blasting in the background ;D

[@aumuamuanakakara9908]

csgo has been my primary source of social interaction for almost 2 years now. i feel like i don't even care about the gameplay very much anymore, just the little interactions between the players makes the experience for me

[@aumuamuanakakara9908]

@skippy62able v good one

[@maxp9292]

@skippy62able v Being rude to random people online, seems we found the incel who might want to touch some grass.

[@null301_]

@skippy62able v it's always sarcasm when someone gets called out.

[@gregeggheefflar]

Two of my friends, who are both Silver 2 in wingman, played a wingman game against a Master Guardian Elite and a Distinguished Master Guardian.

[@pr1nc026]

2 GN3s, 1 MG, 1 SEM, and a SE somehow equate to 3 MGEs, 1 LE, and 1 S4 smurf.

[@aceverntoo]

Haha so true

[@pr1nc026]

@@aceverntoo ولله ماتشمايكنغ زي الخرى

[@El-Burrito]

In the days of CSS before matchmaking, the only competitive matches I ever had were when I joined a clan and we would do scrums against other clans. That was great fun honestly and I don't really understand the appeal of solo-queue

[@MishMash95]

What i learned from this video is that you can put the revealed cards back in the deck in solitaire 😂

[@SpiffyCS]

That Solitaire video is the pinnacle of frag montages

[@philipstape3431]

Oh yes, there's always been cheaters, but when you add value to being the best it makes the problem so much worst. Oh yes, there's always been cheaters, but when you add value to being the best it makes the problem so much worst.

[@wulfherecyning1282]

Oh yes.

[@Shark-hu8vd]

there's always been cheaters,

[@NukeRadius]

But when you add value to being the best

[@isokrah]

It makes the problem so much worst.

[@froglifes6829]

Oh yes,

[@pritkon8622]

I always come back to CS every year for a few month to get back to Global, then I keep playing for a bit, and leave the game for yet another year. I stopped treating matchmaking as something competetive, yet I didn't stop trying to win. There is just less frustration when losing (thus sadly also less joy when winning) and that makes the experience a whole lot better

[@MrPaul-dk5xk]

6:28 That dab tho

[@mirzis]

Amazing video. I watch you without playing csgo, and the music around 7 minutes is what caught me even more

[@Dje4321]

My biggest complaint about matchmaking is that you never really get a chance to experience and get accustomed to high level play. If the silver 1 enemy team always rushs B, then you never learn to have someone protect A, you just learn how to protect B better.

[@simplysmiley4670]

yeah and eventually when you climb higher it becomes a constant push into "whoever can do the meta better then the other team"

[@TheSkullPanda]

This is great getting to grow with so many other players, ones who shared the single player/genre experiences of the 90s and 00s that I did, and now have some analysis for where we're going today. I kind of hope someone at Valve sees this, if nothing else than to know how longer term players feel about the system and the game. ... watching you play aoe2 also made me kinda nostalgic, though I know if i go back to that there's only so much of it i can take. I feel like our brains, as pc players, are also changing, whether with age or with the changes in the games we play over time.

[@Dammitimmad]

5:59 I think Philip forgot to cut that out

[@ARoyalRuby]

Why do you think that?

[@rihamission487]

love your videos man. Your videos take me back to those days.

[@MMOkillerthefirst]

While I almost never comment on your videos, I'd like to give my opinion from a player who plays rather competitive. For me the game never became boring, because of the core essence of the game. You could always jump into the game, whether is was community servers, mm 5v5 or faceit, and you would get an experience you have never had before. This has always been my motivation to keep playing, that's also something I've never really witnessed in any other game. Whilst most players kept arguing about cheaters in mm, I've never really cared that much, you could either take the challenge against the cheaters or you can just leave. I never understood why people are so frustrated about facing cheater. When playing faceit you either get barely any cheaters or they can't play that obvious, so in the end in doesn't matter if they are just really good or have some programs running. But in the last few months I feel like the amount of cheaters have grown tremendously, which led us to playing mostly faceit. In there you always gotta perform to the fullest which isn't suited for some after-work-games where you just want to chill and play a little bit of cs go. I think faceit is mostly for people who wanna know their limit within the game. If you want to play some chill games of cs go, you just gonna create a smurf account sooner or later, because you can keep your shiny rank at your main account while playing without "pressure" on the smurf account and caring too much abount wins and losses (Also I feel like the cheaters aren't that present at lower ranks).

[@TheSuperappelflap]

its frustrating to play cheaters because theyll always cheat just enough to win 16-14. theres no challenge. its just a wall that gets taller if you try to climb it.

[@SimenRomstad]

Song melody is Battlefield Theme

[@NickBrown33]

I think the major point that has been missed is the community side of the game was what kept people (like me) interested. I have played in and won leagues, but my bread and butter was playing on a community server with a bunch of people that became friends. Moderators dealt with the most obnoxious/toxic people, and what was left was a friendly, fun place to spend time for all skill levels - from very casual players to people that went on to play professionally. Many of the people rarely, if ever, played competitive 5v5 matches, their enjoyment came from playing, laughing and spending time with people they knew and (mostly) liked. That was the point of playing, not a rank. I want to go back to that time where I could happily squeeze a few rounds in a spare 20 minutes, or spend all evening (probably ending on he_glass - if I didn't get talked into playing some pugs). I knew that when I joined the server I would likely get a cheery "hello" from some of the patrons and a "nn" when I left. There was no burnout because the only goal was to have fun, and I could do as much or as little as I wanted. If I wanted to improve, my benchmark was other regulars on the server, or voluntarily limiting my weapon choice or money amount, or by playing in pugs and leagues. I have a wife that goes to bed at a sensible time, so I can't (and don't want to) use my mic so I feel l'm letting my teammates down in matchmaking, as well as not wanting to commit to a solid hour of an often tedious experience. The current casual system has no soul and is a depressing way to spend an evening with randoms, and the way the dedicated servers have been hidden away to wither and die saddens me greatly. It just saddens me that a game I have played for coming on twenty years is so uninviting to me, but perhaps we have just grown apart. You are probably right when you say I should stop trying to wish for the game to be the way I want it, and find the experience I want elsewhere. Any suggestions?

[@lubo1358]

I used to be a community server goblin as well but as a grew up I found myself visiting those servers less and less and the conversation that I would have just continued to feel less meaningful over time til I eventually just stopped going on them altogether. It's probably just a part of getting older though.

[@simplysmiley4670]

to be honest I don't think there are any games really that would fit if what happened to CS:GO doesn't stick with you it's pretty much the trend at this point that doesn't seem to want to die off or slow down I would say TF2 maybe if only it wasn't littered with cheaters and Valve gave a damn anymore but maybe there are some smaller indie titles that could work, but at same time the few I knew of died due to lack of players, no massive marketting budget or already pre-existing massive community kills such games

[@Mothdir]

Did not expect to hear Battlefield theme on a 3kliksphilip video. What a rush of nostalgia along side with the though of not having skill based matchmaking in FPS. Thanks for the video!

[@Mate_Antal_Zoltan]

"there's 5 slots for cheaters on the other team and only 4 slots on mine" even worse when you account for playing with friends, sometimes there's no spots on my team for cheaters, and rarely will there be 2 spots for randoms

[@dm1i]

Battlefield music in the background is so good, that I caught myself listening to it instead of your voice :D

[@Zenith_Nightcore]

I just wish my teammates actually spoke english and didn't tk me for trying to actually play the game seriously.

[@s--b]

Yeah why do I get enemies with 5 ping when my teammates are on a different continent?

[@uniquegod1997]

i feel that so much, i always give 100% until i really see it doesnt make any sense to continue... but usually i do try to tryhard to win the game but you literally cant win 3 games in a row with randoms

[@laika5170]

Really enjoyed this video, it's nice to have what I feel compacted into a short video

[@eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeoeeeeeeeeeee]

4:51 this raises an interesting point about younger gamers, especially as of recently as battle royale games have become some of the most popular. Not only do they not play singleplayer where you always win, but they play game modes where you lose 99% of the time. Such a stark contrast with 10 years ago

[@hersical]

e

[@itsbengreat6989]

the last minute and a half of the video has what sounds like battlefield music. excellent choice

[@PanagiotisPolyzois]

This did not age well.

[@baldman8112]

valve got pissed

[@pippobaudo6554]

The first part of the video is the definition of TF2 casual mode

[@michaelm6867]

VAC and matchmaking both feel very broken at this point as neither work how they should

[@tm03035]

the bf1942 theme in the background awakened something inside me

[@DarkGharren]

I'm gonna say it right now: competitive games don't need matchmaking. It robs you of the sense of progression of getting better at the game and slowly making your way up to the top of the scoreboard. Matching with people of similar skill also prevents you from observing and learning from way better players.

[@dontneedtoknow9629]

If you mean getting better in general, you're gravely mistaken. Competitive modes for all their flaws, have helped so many more people to improve with much faster rate, no contest. That's why some people feel frustrated when they always have to try hard in order to enjoy the game, but you can't deny that in statistically it helps them get better at the game. If the sense of progression is what you're after, then you're correct because the goal post does always move when you get better. I also get your frustration, because of the notion of what a competitive shooter should be played like exists, it has robbed many casual servers with wacky gamemodes newcomers to populate and fall in love with community servers.

[@maxp9292]

Yeah, matchmaking have definately made players better, the pros have gotten better, the average player is better. Because with mm everybody is interested in performing better, for example, there are many YT channels focusing on improving players' ability which just wouldn't be the case if improving wasn't seen as so important.

[@Buglin_Burger7878]

@@dontneedtoknow9629 It doesn't though, statistically if you force EVERYONE get better you just slightly raising the floor and teaching them to seek getting better. Since they are always in the same "equal" match though they never get relatively better. An example, lets say you at at skill level 90/100 when 1 is the goal. The 91-100 rank players are your easy matches. Now when they get to skill level 50 everyone 51-100 is their easy match. They are getting better and having an effect. Now assume it matches you with people in 5 of you.. your experience and growth only shows when you go from 100 to 95 so there is people under you... and from 05 to 01 as there is more people under you. Nothing you do functionally helps you, if anything it restricts you, punishes you, and discourages you for not forming a full team. The SBMM system actively hurts everyone except those at the top. You're not allowed to have fun or you must suffer for trying.

[@Maximum432]

Community-hosted servers + browser will always be the best way to play online.

[@FilipeSilvens]

mm is crash simulator at this point and valve doesn't care about people cheating in prime for the last 6 months

[@DamascoMatheus]

I'm in a group of like 8 friends who have actively played CS:GO from 2014 till late 2020. We all have 2000+ hours but have literally lost hope in this game from the last year or so, so many blatant cheaters every other game and none of them seemed to get banned.

[@sillyultroid]

@@DamascoMatheus ahahaha overwatch just has turned off in the last half year

[@alexalcalaortiz368]

@@DamascoMatheus i also quit in late 2020 due to constant rage cheaters in prime but it seems that was finally fixed a month ago and now you only get suspicious players like before

[@artisticVandal-J]

amazing looking at the gameplay from all those years ago compared to what I play now, COD, Apex Legends etc... Whats even more amazing is that people are STILL playing it and commentate on it...

[@GamingRevenant]

I will be part of the unpopular opinion gang... but I've always considered smurfing *just as much cheating as actual cheaters.* The way I look at it, there's a system in the game that purposefuly pits you against players of similar skill. By smurfing, you are 'cheating' the system and thus knowingly devaluing the gameplay experience for those who are, essentially, queueing for rank and trying to climb and get better. I wish that there was a way to develop deep-learning A.I. that can spot smurfing behaviour (for example a player that has an exponentially higher accuracy and KDR ratio than any of the other members in the game *consistenly* for many games in silver or gold nova), tie this to the computer IP or analyse this by accounts swapping on/off on the same PC (most likely impossible due to VPN, but that's forbidden by the Steam ToS so is also bannable and perhaps less common for those taking their main account seriously). I know matchmaking is supposed to do this by itself, but it is way too slow to properly put smurfs in their respective skill bracket again.

[@vigniringi1033]

I am of the same or similar opinion but it would be interesting not to display the ranks so it would be impossible to know of you were smurfing or not. But the cost would probably be to high because the ranks are something to be proud of or wishing to acheve.

[@Pythonsaresnakes]

I disagree. Currently the game doesnt let you queue with people who have a rank that is 5 higher or 5 lower than yours. In these cases are you just supposed to not play with your friends? This is unreasonable tbh. The solution: unranked matchmaking (scrimmage is good, but needs to exist for maps people actually want to play..)

[@funl]

@@Pythonsaresnakes i think if you want to queue with friends that are way better than you, using a smurf account is fine, if necessary. I still think you're an asshole if you tryhard in a lower rank though. The only reason you would want to play with friends is to have fun anyway. My main is silver one, which is lower than my skill level, because i dont try in the game at all. I guess you could say i purposely deranked in a way. I just mess around with friends and try to hit cool shots and do movement. I don't know if its my trust factor or whatnot though, but 9/10 times the enemy team has at least one high level player in silver one, usually more. sometimes new accounts, sometimes not. And they actually try their asses off against these silver ones. I just think its sad to feel the need to destroy bad players in order to enjoy yourself.

[@GamingRevenant]

@@funl But... if the point is to have fun (which, just to be clear, would need to be the point in ranked OR unranked) with friends that are, as you say, way better than you, then scrimmage would be a solution. This allows you to play with your friends and still experience how they play, without putting a huge risk on the balancing factor FOR ranks. If you want to play ranked, then you just need to play with people of your own rank (and if you want to play with regulars that you get to know and can communicate with, then just assemble them on the forums/discord).

[@funl]

@@GamingRevenant the thing is scrimmage sucks ass for multiple reasons. one being that there are hundreds more cheaters from my experience at least, they decide to include the most awful maps in the pools, there are still going to be tryhards in scrimmage, but now they can be any skill level. If you are going into scrimmage to fuck around, you dont want some global sweating on you guys in an unranked match.

[@Belgarion115]

As always, Philip, thoughtful and insightful commentary. Please, continue.

[@Frosted.7]

I cant play CS:GO Anymore match making killed CS for me. I've been playing CS since I was 9 years old. MM Is filled with cheaters toxicity leavers etc. I had more fun loading up 1.6 and playing a map rotation server last night. There doesn't seem to be a point to play CS off MM or Faceit / ESEA - Honestly multiplayer gaming is kind of dead to me, not because the games more the player bases. I have more fun playing Doom Eternal on Nightmare these days.

[@mohang9969]

I’m 14 and I love single player games. I love half life, most telltale games, portal, etc. But man do I love counterstrike. One of if not my favorite multiplayer games.

[@throwaway5273]

I'd love to see the ranks being hidden completely rather than semi-hidden like now. No more lust to be the best (or more like no way of knowing) while still maintaining balance, but Valve has chosen to be hyper-competitive. Following my suggestion would cause a huge uproar among competitive players.