The Rise of the Meaning Economy - A major paradigm shift is coming, this will reshape life and work!

Patreon (and Discord)
/ daveshap
Substack (Free)
daveshap.substack.com/
GitHub (Open Source)
github.com/daveshap
AI Channel
/ @daveshap
Systems Thinking Channel
/ @systems.thinking
Mythic Archetypes Channel
/ @mythicarchetypes
Pragmatic Progressive Channel
/ @pragmaticprogressive
Sacred Masculinity Channel
/ @sacred.masculinity

[@tylerparker3237]

I used to subscribe to absurdism in that the cosmos has no meaning so shout into the void and create your own meaning but it never addressed that meaning isnt something the universe creates it's something that is created between people. I'm glad metamodernism is taking root through what we are seeing reflected in some media such as Ted Lasso or EEAAO. The meaning emerges from the relationships we build with people (emergence) and the absolutes can still exist in the idea of converging ever closer to a limit of truth(convergence).

[@RadicalAlignment]

Well said

[@jameswilkerson4412]

I NEED to see that movie!

[@ChannelMath]

exactly. It's only relative to people that anything really moves us.

[@shauncy7]

It is ridiculous to separate yourself from the universe and therefore meaning and even human like intelligence as if it was something alien and new to the universe. There is no separation. The universe has literally given birth to you and it is continously doing so. Your meaning, your intelligence, your thoughts they dont belong to your self. They belong to the universe. The idea that you are somehow separate is a delusion.

[@spyspy4236]

creating meaning between people is the same as shouting into the void and creating your own. it's all absurdism no matter what you tell yourself

[@stacyfoote9032]

Being in an asian household , even as a milenial , i still live in a multi generation household , cousins aunts and uncles living but a few minuits away. Grandparents clean the house , working the garden growing extra food for us , taking care of and teaching kids , parents and older kids working together for the household so we dont feel the strain of the economy. We are all able to save money , we pool our money together take family trips , something that is hard for the isolated nuclear family to usually do.

[@aunch3]

That’s part of the American process. Everyone is like that at first. In a generation or two you’ll be like everyone else there’s no escaping it. When you become an American you forego your culture, period. Might not be now, but your kids and grandkids won’t have the privileged you have now. The seeds were sown when your family decided to move here they’re to blame eventually

[@off6848]

That's because the primary nations that made the great leap from feudal agricultural to state of the art nation state basically did a speed run of the whole process that took the West 200 years to achieve. Which means that the genealogies of peoples who immigrated to the west still carry this pragmatic way of living. But if global Neo-liberalism takes over these tendencies will even be bred out of the East Asian diaspora and life every other place everyones life and their government will be only about perpetuating this endless growth of global capital. Hopefully Neo-liberalism dies and America can preserve its spirit and continue its golden legacy of basing the state around the concept of freedom in a new multi polar world.

[@brightharbor_]

@@off6848 It’s not too big in the East Asian *diaspora*. The Asian-Americans I know didn’t live with their parents past college age. It’s big in Asia itself because of cultural and economic factors that are much more prevalent in countries like China, India or Bangladesh. People who leave their home countries tend to be more open-minded and less culturally rigid (this is true of anyone, not just Asian people-I can see this in my own African family). FWIW, I moved out at 18, partially because of being LGBT but also just because I wanted my own life and was willing to work for it. I’d have lost my mind being stuck with my (extremely religious) parents until 30. There are a lot of things wrong with Western culture but the ability for a young (or older) person to strike out on their own isn’t one of them.

[@brightharbor_]

@@off6848 And I’m kind of a fan of neoliberalism? Not because it’s perfect (far from it), but because it’s the one actually existing economic system that brings freedom and empowerment to the world. From experience, I’d much, much rather live in a neoliberal society than one dominated by tradition, religion, etc., where someone like me has no rights, no opportunities and is persecuted. Being an office worker and paying rent is pretty miserable, that’s for sure, but it’s better than being a prisoner or a homeless prostitute (the only “career” options for openly LGBT+ people in my home country, where being gay or trans is still illegal because of religion and tradition). I don’t just want freedom as a quirk of American culture. I want it in my ancestral countries of Liberia and Madagascar, throughout Africa, and across the world. Freedom is worthless unless it’s for all…not just a privileged few in one country.

[@itechnwrite]

@@brightharbor_ - Perhaps what is now more and more obvious is that true freedom does not come at the expense of tearing down all that came before or in denying the unmet needs of individuals seeking to walk untraditional paths, but rather in creating a way forward that allows for greater fluidity supporting both of these constructs. To evolve, we must evolve.

[@CyanCooper]

The problem isn’t that productivity is inherently meaningless, but that the fruits of increased productivity are not finding their way to the majority of workers.

[@housingrevolution2024]

And when those fruits actually do make it to workers, they are immediately siphoned off by the non-productive middlemen such as landlords, insurance companies, and financiers.

[@RCMankiewicz]

That's true. However, the video highlights that the fruits of productivity aren't enough to satisfy. They provide certainty and comfort. Two things that breed an environment that allows people to lead a rich and fulfilling life. BUT wealth and financial security are not the end-goal. Wealth alone does not satisfy on a fundamental level. There needs to be a shift towards accepting something deeper as the most important quality of a human. Economic gain for economic gain's sake is not a fundamental purpose and has led to several negative consequences--climate and a culture devoid of spiritual satisfaction. Classic western philosophy is worth taking a look at in addition to classic/modern eastern philosophy. The 'west' hasn't always been so vain. Monotheism is ultimately what started the decline in classic western philosophy ideals. The Protestant reformation all but totally eradicated it from the culture. Then, as the video describes, the fall of protestantism leaves a void in a fundamental aspect of human nature that was filled with 'financial gain culture.'

[@simonmeszaros2770]

its called equilibrium. man has to take risk to have rewards. instability is troubled waters where man can be free and not opressed as everybody else is fearful to follow you there. loneliness? maybe too but thats a price worth freedom.

[@johnberry2877]

As with increased productivity upon the working class, wage slave comes, increased responsibility and workload. In contrast, the managerial class benefits from increased separation from the working class and an increase in wealth of the productive outcome. Rarely, does the wealth filter to the working class. Moreover, it serves to show a stark difference and separation of wellbeing both mentally and physically. The separation, and the allure of transcending the trenches into the realm of the managerial, overlord class only serves to distract the working class into a trance of transcendent hope. This hope is the carrot that confines, controls and hypnotizes the underclasses into submission. A hope that rarely if ever produces a better life. But keeps the mules turning the millstone of increased production.

[@greenthumb8266]

2:22 I call BS, I’ve heard this talking point repeatedly, it’s a con. There is no health care, infant mortality is up, the people growing the food- can’t put food on their table. Big Pharma (basically runs the medical system, doctors and nurses are no longer taught basic health care, they’re taught what pharmaceuticals to proscribe) Big Ag (toxic chemicals and monoculture practices) Big Oil, Privately owned-for Profit Prisons , sadly you’re either mistaken, or purposely repeating the dogma of the day, people need to wake the hell up , and stop feeding the institutions. Oops meant for this to be on the main video response.

[@loriturner609]

Really enjoyed this! My 15 year old daughter and I have a small baking/crafting business formed entirely out of this thinking. I was raised exactly as you described - and I believe “Childhood Emotional Neglect” is the big psychological buzzword these days. I didn’t want my daughter to feel abandoned. I didn’t want to just labor for money. So I observed her interest in Cottagecore, recognized the path being forged by today’s youth, and responded with an offer of partnership. She is learning many business and art skills, but more importantly, she is learning to work from a place of rest and to create something meaningful with her mom and within her community. I used to feel that I could only access meaning through “changing the world” or having a huge audience. I burned out, failed miserably and had a lot of healing to do. Now, at 46 years old, I am more content and stable as I embrace my own small circle of influence - my family, my neighbors, my community - and focus on the joy of being alive each day, baking bread for my family and friends, and doing my daily work from a place of peace. I so appreciate this video - it frames so much of what we are all experiencing and feeling.

[@citywizardgames]

It sounds like you've got it figured out! Thanks for sharing, I strive to find that level of balance one day with my surroundings.

[@taraalexandria8807]

Oh my gosh, Lori, that is beauti~full. ❤

[@RhoArtMagic]

At 64 I’m doing my part to support this new paradigm. I can feel the hopefulness when I facilitate creativity in older adults who never considered themselves to be creative. When we encourage each other to find value in creativity, compassion, and morality outside of religion, humanity wins.

[@brightharbor_]

I’m not quite 60 but I am getting on in years, and I don’t think these things are mutually exclusive. We can be economically productive and creative, compassionate, and moral (outside of traditional religion).

[@UntangledKnots]

❤❤❤

[@H.Irish616]

@@Pl-ax0I’d imagine it’s because some people won’t give even a chance to listen to any points to be made at the mention of really any religion in general. Especially if they already subscribe to a specific one. Morals is something all people should have regardless of what religion you are or if you’re atheist even so I think that’s why they said outside of religion 😅 in case they don’t come back to this I guess

[@Bleilock1]

Brother, in the eu youd still be part of the work force

[@Bleilock1]

​@@Pl-ax0cause humans arnt drones or born to be cultists

[@1purpleman1]

You may want to look into the “laying flat” movement in China and the high number of over-work related deaths (ctr-alt-delete) in both China and Japan. Many DO a have a lack of meaning but it’s a social taboo to talk about it as it’s seen as disrespectful

[@RadicalAlignment]

Yeah, I'm familiar. Like I said, Eastern cultures have their own problems, but honestly we have the identical problem (see r/antiwork). Even so, I don't see any evidence that Asian cultures are bent out of shape over secularism.

[@matthewwinward]

“Let it rot” in China, Hikikomori in Japan, and the 4B movement in South Korea are also noticeable contributors to the lowest birth rates in the world if anyone decides to look into it.

[@1purpleman1]

@@matthewwinward also very good examples

[@daarom3472]

​@@RadicalAlignmentI do advise you to read more on this topic. Even in ancient China (centuries before Christ) Daoism was already being ridiculed by both confucianists and legalists. The true exponent of Daoism for me isn't even Laozi, it's Zhuangzi. But be aware that their teachings were always fringe / counter culture. I feel Chinese culture has way larger issues than we have, because at the end of the day our original Christian traditions and its offshoots like socialism always have this exhalted end-goal whereas the Chinese are way more pragmatic.

[@kleyyer]

Confucianism plays a much, much bigger role in China than Daoism, and that was before the Mao's culture revolution which pretty much decimated it. The only "chinese" who have preserved it are the Taiwanese. Mainland China all of that is pretty much dead.

[@farinshore8900]

From a Gen Xer, I was aware of these abandonment issues in my youth, but was unable to frame it intellectually. I find your analysis very perceptive. It rings true.

[@trinsit]

This has been my biggest frustration with humans and money. How money has lost meaning because the only point was to make more of it. Which meant take it from others and slavery. Now, grifting has become the new economy

[@RikLeedsMusic.77]

100%

[@off6848]

When Jesus flipped the tables of the money changers he was in what? The temple. What does he repeatedly refer to the temple as? His body. We have to kick mammon (the love of money) out of our temples.

[@irshadazeez4764]

What do you mean when you say grifting is the new economy?

[@trinsit]

@@irshadazeez4764 grifting, scamming, spoofing, basically that the higher end of making money has moved to clickbait type efforts. This effects the entire economy. It's doing activity that does nothing for society nor provides a service. While people shift money around according to what advertisers want, the world is deteriorating. My biggest hope is in those that are getting out of the rat race and getting back to growing our own food. Mega projects to regreen deserts seem very hopeful too.

[@trinsit]

@@off6848 leave your religion at the door. It's not necessary. The point is that we need to start understanding how our lives fit in with this entire ecosystem. Money is only representing resources. It is not a resource itself. We treat it like a resource, which is how it becomes an illusion. None of us, in general, understand how to care for ourselves. We Have to rely on the grocery store, the power company, rules and regulations as to what we're allowed to build. And none of them provide long lasting solutions. Only planned obsolescence in order to make you give more money every month. Learn to grow your own food. Eat what you can , sell what you can, and give excess to others in need before it spoils. The problem isn't that there isn't enough money. It's that we are not willing. If you want to drive your desire to help other because of Jesus, that is perfectly okay. Just don't put that on everyone else, because you stop desiring to help others when their story doesn't line up with your story. The only requirement is to have empathy for the situation of others and see how it benefits you when the society around you is well fed and joyful by their own nature without needing to extract it from others.

[@moclarkmusic]

The spelling ‘Taoism’ is derived from the original Wade-Giles romanization of the Chinese language. It is preferred by Western traditionalists, since most of the early translations of spiritual texts used that system. The spelling ‘Daoism’ is part of the newer Pinyin romanization, which is a bit more consistent with how the language is actually pronounced phonetically. It is preferred by the Chinese government and most modern translators and academics.

[@RadicalAlignment]

Great explanation. I was always confused by that

[@innovationatwork199]

@@RadicalAlignment Your mispronunciation of Toa colors you as very well read but maybe missing personal interaction with the east. I have a lot to learn from you (and just subscribed so I can) but that one point makes me highly skeptical of your takes on the east. To be clear, your discussion of the west (4 phases) seem very helpful. Not just here to criticize, here to learn.

[@Blaccastro]

We definitely need more of this to be spread out into our communities.

[@TheLlidD]

how? can we print news letters?

[@DougBohm]

We are at the beginning of a major transformation whether people choose to be participatory and help shape it or reject the transformation and be unconsciously shaped by it.

[@RadicalAlignment]

I think most people will be passive and unconscious. But as long as like 1% of people are active and conscientious, the message will get out

[@aniksamiurrahman6365]

A little interruption here. Building travel vlogs and writing scripts with AI is a very minor part of participating in AI. Building products and services with AI is a whole different thing, that's basically that same ultra-productivity centric economy, but even more brutal, even more soul sucking, and pays even less for much hectic workplace. Even those minor part - being a social influencer is filled with sleek cheating previously only reserved for people like Pimps. Its almost like the so called "meaning economy" is itself devoid of meaning, is itself a big gaping whole, a blackhole that sucks any actual meaning and only leaves an artificial replica of meaning.

[@fleetinghopes6448]

​@@aniksamiurrahman6365 Yes. Capitalism commodifies/consumes meaning of "meaning workers" just like it commodifies/consumes/proletarianises skills ("worker meaning") of workers (e.g. weavers at the start of the Industrial Revolution). To have a sustainable "meaning economy" we need a "meaning-nurturing/friendly economic system".

[@aniksamiurrahman6365]

@@fleetinghopes6448 Good luck doing that. The reality is - this "meaning economy" or whatever u call it, is a result of capitalism and not much different than Romantic movement of the 19th century. This is just one face of Capitalism, not a way out. The more one consumes these contents, the less they are likely to achieve any of these "meaning" in any true sense of the world.

[@limitisillusion7]

It's the second coming of Christ, but not Christ as in a single Messiah... More like a Christ consciousness that the Bible attempts to symbolically represent (which has likely been misinterpreted in my mind). Christ consciousness could be thought of as an evolutionary wake-up call, where unstable conditions in our environment are forcing us to question the ways we have structured our society and economy. You could go as far to say that Christ consciousness is simply a return to long-term thinking rather than short-term thinking. We see chaos on the horizon due to our short-term, profit-oriented goals, and we are becoming conscious of that looming chaos that comes from the wealth inequality. If you look at the teachings of Jesus in this light, he is nothing more than a philosopher warning about the dangers of excess greed. The solution is quite simple actually... Live communally with every human being. Know that other people will make their problems your problems, so it is therefore only logical to solve their problems if and when you are capable. The second coming of Christ may perhaps just be an instinctual return to collectivistic behaviors and away from rampant individualism. Along with that, a rewrite of history and a new "religion" may be in order. Far as I can tell, this is a pretty exciting time to be alive.

[@psyrochi2342]

As a Gen Z guy watching this video lifted a huge veil in how I grew up and why I feel so empty and hopeless in my life. I pretty much hit all the 4 abandonments and I felt understood for the first time ever probably, id like to know if anyone else from gen z felt the same way watching this video

[@Afkmuds]

welcome

[@RobOhaiyu]

Yep, right in the feels. I need to give my kids a huge hug and do some cool shit. But are Gen Zs even allowed to talk about this?

[@Afkmuds]

@@RobOhaiyu more than

[@LilyGazou]

Older than you. But I feel this.

[@Lastdayone]

I think overcoming the third abandonment by going within yourself and affirming yourself actually helps a lot. Sending love & encouragement to go within so you never go without 💜✨

[@justinmasters220]

This is the only conversation that matters right now.

[@banquetoftheleviathan1404]

Isn't there like a genocide or two going on?

[@keithbell6003]

I think you're right about this. I just came to this conversation in these comments after what I feel like many months of circling around it. This is it. The fundamental problem/opportunity something that has to be sorted out.

[@kabrionervin3702]

This was a good video and explanation. I never fully gravitated to nihilism, but I still understand its value. It has similar qualities to ego death to me. It removes a lot of the meaning and can lead you to feeling insignificant to the point that nothing you do matters, however, I don’t believe that’s the state of mind we’re supposed to be in, and you have to find a way to get to your purpose outside of work. Nihilism is a catalyst for us to take a more zoomed out view of reality, but it’s like once we get there we assume nothing matters, but I feel everything exist for a reason. Finding your reason is the struggle, so people avoid the struggle and fall into the camp that nothing matters, so they can continue with whatever they are currently doing.

[@M00nlord]

Very interesting thoughts. Thanks for sharing. I like what you said about trauma, and I am increasingly coming to the conclusion that the dysfunction and disconnection we se manifest in society grows out of the unhealed traumas in people. I'm a millennial and used to be nihilistic in my teens and early 20s, and today I can clearly see how my destructive nihilism and self hatred grew out of a place of deep inner psychological pain and abandonment trauma. I experienced a paradigm shift when life showed me that it was possible to heal these traumas and I have since grown into a fundamentally hopeful view of life and our collective way forward. Why? because trauma and pain is a universally human experience, and if I have the capacity to heal my traumas then everyone has that capacity. The shared human experience of pain and disconnection also has a shared remedy of love and transformation. And if the dysfunction of the world is manifest through our internalized pains and dysfunctions, then the healing of the world happens through the healing of the self. Sure, there is also a cultural resistance to face our traumas that manifests in the rampant victimhood culture we see today, strongly enabled by identity politics. But deep, true healing is happening. We have access to healing tools and understandings of traumas that didn't exist one generation ago and I have faith the people who need them will find them.

[@FaCiSmFTW]

Can you please point me in the right direction to find trauma healing tools?

[@thelawenforcementproject2705]

​@@FaCiSmFTWone way is through ethnogens, ie, psychedelics. Various mushrooms, cactus, vines, toads etc (plants and animals). And while not directly from ergot fungus, but derived from it; the magic molecule, lsd

[@FaCiSmFTW]

@@thelawenforcementproject2705 Ah ok thanks. I've had bad experiences on psychedelics when I was younger. I know the set and setting were wrong. Still it's lead me to be hesitant of trying them ever since. Maybe I'll reconsider

[@MsKingwa]

I sooooooo resonate with your thoughts on how trauma and attachment wounds shape and drive society and culture. Post-colonial theorist Frantz Fanon wrote extensively on the topic, looking at the psychology of formerly colonised people.

[@dkdoodle]

@@FaCiSmFTW trauma therapy, EMDR, internal family systems therapy, somatic therapy like somatic experiencing. Different things work for different people.

[@thelenbax8497]

As an early gen-z AI enthusiast, I'm grateful you take the time to explain this fog of confusion we live in. It is endearing to know that there are solutions to these existential problems. I especially worry for gen alpha if we don't solve this fast.

[@NOSFERATU_ONE]

Ah, the classic 'As a gen-Z' starter pack. It's almost like every gen has its unique set of challenges. But hey, thanks for being the trailblazers in confusion clarification. Gen Alpha better brace themselves, right? By God..

[@thelenbax8497]

@DOMNU_NOSFERATU dude, what a bummer you are. I never said I was a trailblazer of confusion clarification... and yes, humans are more confused than ever. "We live in a society" amirite?

[@julannelly]

​@@NOSFERATU_ONE "As a Millennial" the tone of your comment is confusing me. What are you getting at? While each generation has had their own struggles, the current situation is something we are ALL struggling with and it's crucial to receive input from many angles to get closer to the solution. Gen Alpha is already screwed (lots of online commentary on that topic).

[@prodyung829]

@@NOSFERATU_ONE Statically speaking we have It harder then any gen before. relax kiddo.

[@urniurl]

David, I appreciate your efforts to navigate humanity through these issues. It's worthwhile not forgetting out pre-socratic lineages.

[@redberries8039]

can you say a little more on this?

[@urniurl]

@@redberries8039 My position is that it's short-sighted to just focus on the nihilistic trends that emerged relatively recently when the history of Philosophy goes back at least a couple of thousand years. In the time of pre-socratic Philosophy the groundwork for metaphysics was laid out and subsequent religions and philosophy expanded on it but never overturned it. Keeping it simple, there's two main positions, at the core reality is an eternal infinite something or it's not (metaphysical nihilism). Parmenides outlined an ontology that had the concept of primal eternal unity at its core. My idea is that we can return to these historical foundations and use them to restructure an optimistic world view. These ideas precede the abrahamic religions of Christianity and Islam and correspond roughly with the time of the Buddha. Modern nihilism in my opinion largely comes from the reasoning that "God" as an interventionist creator being isn't true (which I agree with) but that doesn't mean reality isn't true, that's throwing the baby out with the bath water. There are many examples of philosophy and theology that go much much deeper into the meaningful implications of an eternal true reality - Meister Eckhart is my personal favourite, and I can read him without being a follower of Christianity. Divinity and "religious" experience are part of the potential of human subjectivity, it would be (it is) tragic that poor reasoning removes this possibility from most of us.

[@hoghopper]

I think @urniurl is saying all peoples had some sort of a cultural paradigm (religion, mythology, etc) that worked for that culture before some of them (mainly in the global "west") decided it was primitive, repressive and colloquial and abandoned it because they thought they could find better meaning in rationality and criticism, and then started looking for meaning in the irrationalities of those cultures that have not yet abandoned theirs.

[@redberries8039]

@@hoghopper Thanks for the reply. I was wondering if 'pre-socratic' referred to the Pelasgians or the Greek Primordial Gods, and if so if there was a reason why he considers them important?

[@urniurl]

@@redberries8039 I did post a long reply to your initial question, strangely now I've returned to the thread it's no-longer here unfortunately, I don't know what happened, took a bit of effort to write!

[@trollsmyth]

I know this: if life is illusion, then I am no less an illusion, and being thus, the illusion is real to me. I live, I burn with life, I love, I slay, and am content. - Robert E. Howard

[@urniurl]

"soul" is the most important word in the English language.

[@andreasperjons4707]

Just got this in my feed. Thank you for this, exactly what is needed currently. Looking forward to your future work, all the best to you!

[@solvriksh]

We together shape our collective reality, and the collective reality shapes us.

[@SebRrrr]

So lets shape individualistic a new collective reality and with that will the collective change the world.

[@matmolin]

This is truth. The famous dialectical paradox

[@markkuykendall5475]

The Universe is not cold, uncaring, and meaningless. WE (and all the little gray men, if they exist) are part of the universe. WE are IN the universe the way an organ is IN our bodies and part of our bodies. WE (apparently) are the thought capacity for the universe. We make meaning. We discuss and converse, argue, and fight, and meaning comes from that. We are the universe thinking about itself. People judge themselves apart from the universe. This is a mistake; an egregious and horrible one. If, in the next 20-30 years, we destroy our civilization, it'll be because we're too cowardly to step into our own damn shoes and take responsibility for things. When we try to center value and meaning away from ourselves, what we're really doing is firstly, being afraid, and secondly, looking for easy ways to justify our own lack of compassion for other people we don't like or don't understand. These days, everyone wants to defecate on Post-Modernism for stoutly and adamantly refusing to allow people to appeal to "higher authority," to justify othering, alienating, defaming, oppressing, and just generally being shitty to people we don't like or find frightening or disgusting because they're not like us. We need to grow up. No more tyrannical, jealous, Sky-Daddy bullies and no more loving nurturing Earth-Mommies either.

[@JD_Manufacturing]

Nah. I don't see it that way. I see a Sin Sick World I see a World that strives to remove the God that bled and died for all and calls everyone to righteousness. But no. Most Choose to be apart from God and call him a bully. But he himself was Bullied and put to death for our sake. Time is running short for this World and sides are being chosen.

[@GB-gc6wy]

Dark​@@JD_Manufacturing

[@homerdus9668]

We exist not (ego would say other)

[@insidiousmaximus]

Snowflake

[@0xC47P1C3]

We don’t come into this world. We come out of it.

[@ChristoperGMoore]

I’ve lived, worked and written books in Asia for 35 years. Your presentation contains many valuable insights. In the East rituals, symbols, beliefs and values draw from a different perspective on meaning, life, relationships and obligations. When you learn a language in Asia a whole untranslatable world appears for the first time. Heart Talk was journey down that path.

[@siddheshpatwardhan4920]

Where can I learn more about your work?

[@andrewjameswyng7919]

I bought one of Your books, in Bangkok, in 1993....... I still have it. Chok De.

[@natatattful]

Do you know Michael Morrow?

[@ChristoperGMoore]

Thank you, Andrew. Good to hear it remains in your library.@@andrewjameswyng7919

[@ChristoperGMoore]

I didn't know Michael Morrow. But I share his love of Medieval and early Renaissance music.@@natatattful

[@lukajevich]

I work in branding, and I’ve always been fascinated by brand strategies that involve ’purpose’ as a mindset that one should embody at any given company. These ’purpose statements’ are designed to connect your work to society at large and give a sense of meaning in what you’re doing. Would be super interesting to hear your opinion on these purpose statements, and your thoughts on how they relate to the meaning economy

[@hercolorfulmind]

Thank you so much for this take! 🙌🏽 The age of zombies is not sustainable. People need meaning & connection - some will use technology to find this and others will move away from technology to reconnect with others in their real world - regardless of the path, we will find that which we seek! 🙏🏽❤️

[@chianchen776]

As someone who studies Daoism(I Ching), I feel more empowered now and feel the need to encourage my peers in Taiwan to do so too, thank you!

[@coleadams567]

One of my favorite videos yet. Personally, I made a lot of connections with some new-to-me ideas. You're an incredible resource. Thank you for your time.

[@stevemcalphabet2282]

I love it! Looking forward to what you have to share next.

[@rashisti]

I appreciate that acknowledgement of service and call for much more of it.

[@JBeestonian]

I applaud this effort, it seems to be a direct line between Alan Watts, Ken Wilber, Daniel Schmattenberger that you're drawing here. What I don't see addressed in any of these conversations is how to eradicate the influence of moloch, or the system of incentives that rewards people who seek power. While there might be wisdom in eastern traditions that frame the world as unknowable and that truth can only be hinted at, the fact at the moment is that a cold, mechanistic view of the universe grants wealth, status and influence to those who optimize ruthlessly for power. Even in a post-truth world, that doesn't change anything about the instrumentality of game theory. Truth is not a narrative uttered by those in power, it's a resource that those in power exploit. Until we can break the efficacy of game theory I don't know how we can reach that spiritual wisdom.

[@fleetinghopes6448]

💯 Completely spot on comment! And some of the comments for this video disagree with Dave in regard to China and Japan in modern times with economically-related materialism and worker self-i-cide. I would suggest most of this comes from the modern economic system they adopted from the West, which, as you say, embodies moloch. The problem is the Mechanistic world view and the concentration on individualism. It is time that we transcended these both. A new Enlightenment based on meaning generation and a corresponding new political and economic system are needed to take us into a better future. DS understands the problem very well, but cannot see the solution - thats because he can't accept the immaterial/spiritual aspect of reality. (The Game~B project split down these lines of "woo" and "anti-woo" if you know that history...) He is also stuck in the prison of Game Theory. Seeking domination over the opponent, empires colonising foreign countries, monopolies dominating a market, etc. This is all Mechanistic in nature, all "win-lose". You need to step out of "the game" (remember, games are not the entirety of a person's life (or a society's or nation's life) - they interact with friends, family and at work in a cooperative manner, as well as an altruistic manner at times). You need to step out of "the game" into the world of cooperation, of "win-win", of long-term sustainable relationships, of mutuality. The current economic system of Capitalism and social ideology of Liberalism do not support these values or behaviours. DS has great intellectual horsepower, but he is stuck in his Game Theory. The change we need is to step out of Game Theory to go forward. Have you seen the work of John Vervaeke (Canadian philosopher/cognitive scientist) and his "Meaning Crisis"?? Perhaps not coincidentally, and apropos to Dave's video, he is a Buddhist (i.e. Eastern philosophy).

[@davemontgomery5856]

From a Jungian point of view we will always have to deal with our personal and collective Shadow.

[@jameswilkerson4412]

See: Dune v. Star Trek

[@maax]

As a 23 year old gen z travel and van life / cottage core influencer this one felt very relatable. Love all of your videos across all channels David. Not many people within this niche who I feel understand our generation / my line of work (meaning inspiration). You really hit the nail on the head. I dropped out of university in 2019 to pursue “meaning economics” as I saw a future where any job I trained for / acquired debt for would go out the window. My goal became to search for fulfilment and inspire others to do the same. I know I’m not the only one especially within gen z who feels like there’s more to life so obviously they will come to platforms like KZbin and Instagram to seek out those answers or examples of a life to aspire towards. Thanks for this video!

[@NOSFERATU_ONE]

>As a 23 year old gen z travel and van life / cottage core influencer lol LMAO even this has to be one of the most quintessentially zoomer quotes I have ever read.

[@robertzehm]

People watch you because they are bored while taking a shit at work. It’s not that deep

[@fleetinghopes6448]

Keep at it Maax. The current system and society has created a gaping hole that does need to be fixed. People are seeking meaning because the current system/society is in many ways a "meaning desert" and people are thirsting for meaning in their lives. The younger gens can see this much more clearly than the older gens, who still have the "legacy meaning" from their youth before things got as bad as they are now. It like the "time of false prophets" in the Bible (not all were "false" or disingenuous, many were trying to help the people in existential pain) in that people are searching for explanations of why things are the way they are (people suffering), what the real problems are and what is the way forward. (E.g. everyone here that watched this video. Or people that watch John Vervaeke's "Meaning Crisis", follow Daniel Schmachtenburger, or countless others) Why did all those people follow John the Baptist? Why did all of those people go to Mount to hear a Sermon? It wasn't because they were bored. They were looking for something that was missing in their lives. They were looking for answers when they lived in a system that didn't even know what the problems were. There can be small "prophets"/helpers and big "prophets"/helpers. We can start out small/shallow and grow bigger/deeper as we grow in meaning through our lives, as we understand more deeply and clearly what people are thirsting for. We an all play our part. All the best in your journey.

[@roccj3023]

Thank you for your thoughts and your views they are very refreshing and well thought out continue seeking for what you seek is looking for you. Thank you for helping me expand my thoughts

[@maxb5640]

You have a gift with words. Laying down complex concepts in simple understandable ways , without losing the essence . Very complex topic yet this video gave gave me more understanding in 25 minutes than hundred hours of other material

[@BunnyOfThunder]

For Cosmic Abandonment, learning about science helps. For example, our atoms had to pass through stars to become all the elements needed for life. Being made of the matter of stars is a profound connection that makes me feel a part of the cosmos rather than alone in it.

[@aniksamiurrahman6365]

Yeah! It deeply saddens me that people don't find philosophical meaning and spirituality in all the wonderful facts about the physical universe. I feel like the problem here too is philosophical. In the Big God Religions, the cosmic connection comes from outside of the cosmos, from an entity which is human-like. So, basically for thousands of years, we stayed away from establishing connection with the world around us and find meaning from inside the physical world around us.

[@selfhealingflow]

astrology*

[@91722854]

Carl Sagan is your inspiration, I guess?

[@Nature_Consciousness]

Materialistic philosophical theories are inherently wrong, for many reasons, this opens for idealism, which offer everything that we need.

[@Nature_Consciousness]

​@@aniksamiurrahman6365Materialistic philosophical theories are inherently wrong, for many reasons, this opens for idealism, which offer everything that we need.

[@daretobegreat3124]

30 yesrs ago there were a lot of people calling for more "sharing of work" where some people would work only 20 hours a week for their work years and others would work 40 hours a week but only for 20 something years. It assumes everyone works only for money or the means to pay for what one needs in life. It didn't go anywhere because it didn't recognize that nany people define themeselves through their work or see work as a competitive game as a way to deminstrate competitive superiority. In othervwords it assumed everyone wirks to live and did not realize that many people live to work because they find work as ultimate fulfillment (if given a choice work is what they like to do the most).

[@aniksamiurrahman6365]

This happens already. The rich works much less on average than poor. But its more like the rich work for ~40h while the poor for ~80hr per week.

[@squamish4244]

@@aniksamiurrahman6365 Actually, VPs and CEOs work as many hours as poor people. They choose to pack their lives with work. Those in the top 10% work 4.4 hours a week more than those in the bottom 10%. This isn't a good thing. It's an addiction.

[@SuperIce6374]

Tremendous insight. Thank you for this, I’m glad the algorithm got one right in my feed. This is probably the best take high level take I’ve seen on these topics.

[@chipserkland]

Awesome! This helps. It put into words and ideas my own thoughts I've had for a few years now. Great content and thank you for this piece.

[@CoreyAnton]

For non-postmodern, post-nihilistic horizons of meaning Please see the book: How Non-being Haunts Being: On possibilities, morality and death acceptance.

[@vincentcaudo-engelmann9057]

This is such utterly fantastic and out-of-the-box thinking.

[@Goose-wedding]

wow so glad i found this video. you put into words a lot of what i've been thinking and more. thank you.

[@VersedEight0209]

Great video. Thanks for sharing.

[@petrus4]

You can also use quantum superposition to get past the postmodern assumption that a given premise has to be perpetually true, in order to be true at all. If you read The Lion, The Witch, and The Wardrobe, the wardrobe in that story functioned as an ERP bridge between Earth and Narnia. Yet the bridge was only open some of the time. When it was open, the children could walk through into Narnia. When it was closed, trying to walk to Narnia would result in physical collision with the wardrobe's back wall. ERP bridges/Stargates might be a fictional concept in current terms, but it is mathematically real enough that it can be robustly simulated in computer games such as Minecraft and No Man's Sky. If postmodernism's premises do not take quantum mechanics into account, then it is obsolete by definition.

[@m0ose0909]

I am certainly not worried for myself about finding meaning in retirement lol, bring it on please

[@rickmolchan3421]

You nailed it! Collective wisdom is the way. Keep doing what you are doing. We will get there one day.

[@triciacherise8084]

Wow. I just came across your channel in my suggested videos. I love the way you break it down! I’d say more but humbly I’m new to all this type of discussion. But I’ll be back to get more familiar. Plenty of food for thought. I feel so grateful that I have something significant to ruminate over instead of the superficial soul sucking content that is regularly thrust in my face. Your chapter on emergence made me yell out loud… to myself as I’m the only one home and Big Hell Yeah!! So thank you. I love how you put each chapter in writing so I can pause and read it for myself and then hear you break it down. This is one of the best mornings I’ve had in a while. Thank you for being You. 🙏🏼

[@danherrick5785]

So, your tired of the soul sucking content too. If we can only get rid of the addictive youtube world, we might have a chance to live a real life...

[@electrictao5180]

Amazingly well said. Thanks.

[@stevemartel4729]

There is a fundamental shift happening with the term we call “value“, and as you’ve highlighted in the past with a post-labor world. Great job man. Started following you as I loved your AI content and Research. I love the direction. Thanks for sharing man. This really helps me research and refine a few of my philosophies.

[@davemontgomery5856]

Good overview of our situation...appreciate your efforts to draw a map for us of your theory...im intrigued.

[@ItsRyanStudios]

I'm a software engineer, and I love my work. That being said, I try my best to avoid relying on my JOB as my source of meaning. I always have side projects that are more meaningful to me. And at the pinnacle of meaning sources in my life, are art and leisure with my family.

[@tsuobachi]

Do you make generative art?

[@neurojitsu]

This is a great summary of our current predicament, and I particularly liked the framing of "convergence". I recently read a book by Peter Kingsley - I'm guessing you might know his work, as he's a scholar of ancient Greek philosophy from before Aristotle and Plato, ie the pre-modern mind. His book Catafalque I thought was brilliant in its telling of the story of Jung's experiences writing the Red Book, and in its critique of "rationality" as flawed. There's a lot of "circling" in the style of teaching that Parmenides is famed for. Kingsley writes the book in a way that models these writings of Parmenides, so that we experience his teachings as well as hearing Kingsley talk about them... (another form of circling). Jung as you know was a huge fan of Daoist thought, and wrote the Preface to his friend's translation of the iChing proclaiming it of sound mind. Daoist principles are detectable in much of Jung's work on type theory and archetypes, for example. Look forward to seeing where you take this channel and debate.

[@itsirkeel]

This is pinging me on so many levels! Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts on the complexities and nuance of the profound shift that these 'same planet, different worlds' trajectories are. I've had this real "download" today about fully recognizing that I'm willing myself into a timeline in which we're beyond fiat currency or in a parallel and not equal, but I'm still plugged into the planet, but others are plugged into their VRs and Virtual Planets. Same planet, different worlds. I want to write a spiritually-charged white paper on a new vision for exchanging of both talents and products that is human-focused, not money focused. With our tech, we should be able to do ourselves a favor.

[@CoherantDesign]

All made so much sense to me. Really helpful, thank you.

[@AVADAMS1967]

Abandonment. I saw the 2 people in the workplace starting around 1973, so I think it began with us in Gen X

[@TimiPigeon]

Anyone wanting some further information in this field should check out Canadian Professor John Vervaeke’s series “Awakening From The Meaning Crisis”. There’s a lot of material there and it’s a bit chewy in long form content, but I know that John and a dedicated team are working on condensing and codifying the principles he goes through into a more concise and approachable framework/map.

[@medved0987]

Fantastic video and inspiring to see you tackling challenging topics

[@arieldaemon]

Wow this was SO SO SO good. All my thoughts seemingly put into words. Thanks so much.

[@joshuacrumley2031]

This is outstanding! Most of my background, meaning who I am, and the different philosophies and things I subscribe to, is pretty heavy in both hermeticism and futurism. I've found some ways myself to cope with a lot of the things that have been going on, but it's getting tougher by the day. I envision a world that will eventually end up being something similar to Jacque Fresco's vision, if you're familiar. My biggest struggle in my thought process is how to bridge the gap between where we were, where we are, and where we need to be. I think you described the problem accurately, intelligently, and eloquently. I think you may have just built my bridge for me. Thank you!

[@RyanHeaney42]

I would love to have a recommended reading list from you! Or at least topics I can punch into ChatGPT! Thanks for all you share!

[@cherrlyn381]

All the main topics he mentioned in the video could be a good place to start.

[@u4icdissonance180]

Absolutely fantastic video, thanks for taking the time and effort to put this out there :)

[@Ralic100]

Made a lot of sense! Thanks for helping to get a new sense of direction in this changing world.

[@johncarlson3968]

I don’t recommend following the post-post-post path. Look where it got us. Spirals and corkscrews into nothingness. I would like to see more about Ubuntu philosophy, Proutism, and Apollonean gaskets (federation at all levels).

[@johncarlson3968]

Maybe even interfederation

[@adiq94]

I wonder how to make use of this information, in context that we live in technofeudalism dominated by big cloud companies.

[@MsKingwa]

Yes!!! 😃😃😃 It got me thinking about what Yanis Varoufakis has been saying about the future of the economy too!!!! What all this will look like.

[@intelligize]

dude !! I’ve been talking about this FOREVER! And you nailed it! Not only are lives kinda meaningless due to Materialism but so is everything engineer around us! It’s boring, empty, and soulless.

[@californium2527]

This was so simply brilliant and enlightening. Thank you for your eloquent words and insightful ideas.

[@DilanR596]

Great to hear. Just give me a hut, vegie patch and a Zen Spiritual Group. That pretty much aligns with how we've evolved with Mother Earth.

[@thedarkmoonman]

love conquers all, no doubt

[@fleetinghopes6448]

Love gives continued life to the Universe. (i.e. thwarts entropic Heat Death)

[@markcounseling]

I really appreciated this video and the message you are putting out and the work that you are doing. There was a lot in here for me to reflect upon, and I'm grateful that you have the sort of mind that can pull some of these strands together, synthesize them and present a coherent view for us to consider. Thanks very much for your work!

[@junjunjarjarbinx]

Yes. Important conversation. This is exactly what I've been pondering, and you articulated it well.

[@PaulJohnson-zv3hl]

I agree with the direction of the video with regards to philosophical change. I don’t know if adopting other cultures such as Taoism is the answer (as much as I love the wisdom) I think it might be more of an Immanuel Kant moment where an idea is published and then spreads like wildfire changing our lives and institutions. Who knows maybe that will be from AI also.

[@RadicalAlignment]

I guess I should have clarified - I don't mean wholesale cultural appropriation but rather cultural exchange and synthesis.

[@fleetinghopes6448]

@@RadicalAlignment Exactly! 💯

[@jarijansma2207]

Comment for the algorithm

[@user-rs4cg4ch8d]

Excellent and so many themes that we need to embrace. Here. Thank you. Good simple, understandable approach

[@smario2820]

David you have a beautiful, promising voice. I look forward to exploring more of the channel. Great things come to those who stand up straight and speak the truth.

[@rupert310]

Why are you out of uniform?

[@walkrshaw7244]

Thank you for the perspective

[@taylor-kenny]

Loved this video. I felt like it touched on many thoughts I've been circling around recently. Looking forward to more content like this!

[@christiannitosanchez2872]

very insightful. Thank you for this

[@BillAugersdca]

Grateful for this unexpected, yet meaning(!), philosophical inquiry.

[@marshalmcdonald7476]

Dude, you are on point. Glad to have found you. Good job. New subscriber. I've been a student of Taoism for years. It has made an enormous difference in my life. Recently found a formal teacher. Doin' good.....

[@MrPDTaylor]

Thank you so much for this channel's content. The human race needs it more than they know.

[@lennarthammel3075]

Great video. Continue please!

[@wzsmart2890]

I don’t have as much time to explore these concepts deeply, so your videos are helping me through self abandonment. You are guiding towards meaning that i can intuit deep in my mind, bit couldn’t articulate without the vocabulary. Thank you so much and knowthat you are impacting lives. 🙏

[@aliciaruiz1712]

Thank you. Good stuff.

[@andrewcooke-hedin1903]

Excellent lesson David! I modernism and postmodernism has always been a hole in my education. I didn't take much philosophy in college. You have an incredible vocabulary! its great to watch this while having Chat gpt open to help explain all of the words and concepts you use!

[@Bestbuddy719]

Dayummm g. This vid slapped big time! Thank you!! 👏

[@Dateconomics]

The channel name made me think I was going to hate this but it was really good. Keep up the good work.

[@Matortheeternal]

thanks for the video, i enjoyed it

[@laurentlorenzo4843]

Omg thank youuuuuuuu x 1000

[@the.kleyko]

An awesome summary of what the inspiration and purpose of my youtube channel is. The video that I am currently working on encapsulates a part of this.

[@WanderingSybil186]

Definitely heading in the right direction :)

[@vinanddex]

Profound stuff Dave! I think you are spot on.

[@Bowlyful]

Super interesting, subscribed

[@trshilst]

This was my favorite video of yours. Would love more like it! Excited to hear your thoughts on post nihilism.

[@PensadoresLibrs]

Amazing content, my friend. You have a new sub

[@jarijansma2207]

Really appreciate your videos by the way

[@alexeiw108]

Thank you David, for putting into words what I've felt and intuited for a long time, and for blazing a trail for us all to just ditch nihilism and postmodern foolishness by the roadside, as we move beyond into a more meaningful and authentic conversation 🙏

[@haldanemartin3642]

Thank you for this

[@LBoogie2174]

that was awesome! Keep going! we need you!

[@samalqattan]

I can’t explain how important this video is to me. Giving me some big “aha” moments. Thank you

[@HaroldAnderson-cd7dj]

Very cool perspective and discussion describing humankind's path to find 'I AM'.

[@angelikarossbach7953]

I love all of this, but I love the "I don't care for the holes" part the most, thank you.