The Roundtable Hold Isn't Real

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#eldenring #eldenringlore #agtjake

[@agtjake]

Use this link to get an XP boost pack and mini pet for your new Guild Wars 2 character! www.inflcr.co/SHDn4

[@darksh1ne1]

Aaah! Grrr! I hate you! You told my theory that I was preparing for end of my series! Although it goes a little further than that but still! Id say, your best video so far. Well done.

[@someyeeterontheblock2421]

We must become Gideon ofnir

[@ravoniesravenshir3926]

Hey have you noticed that the old dragon lord... looks like a Prototype for the 2 Fingers... and as it is missing one head, it could have looked like the 3 fingers if it had that head. Like really, look at that dragon lord in the Crumbling city... it has its heads up like they are 2 fingers. Maybe the 2 fingers are failed clones of this dragon?

[@theforknut2415]

So godskin apostles ost had an lyric updated and it seems that miquella is gloam eyed queen and is leading the godskin rebellion against golden order

[@starflarethewizard1490]

God I really wish they ported the game to consoles… :(

[@ryancox6059]

The 180 of marika actually banishing the first tarnished to protect them from the order and not because they lost their usefulness to her makes so much sense after the explanation.

[@Destroyer120296]

Makes her less of a bitch as well

[@eprimchad2576]

@@abigcupofwater not to mention she sends a human version of herself almost like jesus to bring peace by marrying renalla, and that marika is impaled by a red spear while crucified, this game has alot of christian lore to it.

[@TrueHylianKnight]

Makes sense, the Tarnished all appear to be beings of remarkable power. The player being most obvious, Hoarah Loux, etc. Supporting this is the Giant Crusher, which claims "Man has grown feeble in comparison to his forebears." and who can wield such a weapon? Tarnished warriors. In a way, the Crucible Knights are close cousins of ours, serving the same lord and similarly slandered by history.

[@briankeys5941]

Does anybody think GRR Martins story was so half ass, it was basically tossed and that is why this lore seems very off for a FROM game (think DS2, only the mechanics were very good and FROM released a bunch of patches and DLC to try to fix it) and took so long even with a ton of asset flips and 100 bosses, but really like 10 characters. I think this was going to be a mix of Sekiro also, as in the story is more understandable with more cutscenes. but not as straight forward so there is still some mystery. This is a compliment btw, that if this is close to the mark FROM managed to cobble together an amazing game, that kinda makes since. and gameplay is king, so everybody just said, fkit, there will be YT videos...

[@declicitous1763]

@@briankeys5941 great another clown who doesn’t realise that Elden ring and sekiro were made at the same time so anything sekiro did wouldn’t be in Elden ring

[@lorenzmaut3708]

It's a cool idea that melina is like a manifestation of the fragment of rune of death (and for that it would have aspects of the gloam eye queen) and Marika+Radagon. That would explain why we end up in Farum Azula, really close to the rune of death and malekith.

[@godricktheminecrafted3113]

I personally like the theory that she’s the gloam-eyed queen more

[@steel811]

Something I found interesting is the grace on the table in the round table hold emits the sound of a busy dining hall and I just struggle to visualize a time when the round table hold was happy and peaceful

[@xxcheeriosxx5828]

I noticed that sound too as well

[@plague696]

I always interpreted Gideon fighting us at the end differently. His armor description states he discovered something that should be impossible. What if he didn't discover Marika's will but the Elden Beast's will and therefore the true greater will. He found out that the greater will set us up to fail and thus every foul thing he did in pursuit of an impossible outcome was for nothing. He then decides to stop us because he knows we will attempt to fight this "impossible" fight regardless. He sees him killing us as the only way stop us from suffering at the hands of "Marika"(the Greater Will) and decides that this is the one good thing he can do to atone for what he has done. This being the cruel irony, his knowledge of what he thinks is Marika's will has blinded him to the truth that Marika is the one ensuring that we CAN kill a God. In the end the "All Knowing" knew nothing at all.

[@josephgabel234]

What if he saw other worlds and realized things like fast food exist, but he could never taste it, driving him into madness (fr your argument makes sense tho)

[@plague696]

@@josephgabel234 First, thank you. Second, that would be hilarious if he went insane over McDonald's. 🤣

[@b3at2]

This game was way too abstract, the story telling way too cookie crumb and the world way too expansive that it left me puzzled and lost. I couldn’t get into it.

[@jacobsaunders1092]

Nah I don’t buy that explanation, Gideon is not exactly benevolent in his actions so this attempt at a selfless deed in order to spare us suffering doesn’t fit with his ruthless character, he even talks in a sinister fashion, his dialogue on ranni is a bit off as well, I think marika defeated and bewitched him (somehow)

[@plague696]

@@jacobsaunders1092 I'm not saying he's benevolent. Rather he's so arrogant that when his understanding gets turned upside down his twisted mind thinks this decision might be good but is just as ruthless and foul as every other choice he has made because he is partially responsible for us being there. The point is the man is so arrogant the "All Knowing" actually doesn't know a damn thing.

[@argusbugsby]

the close up on Hoarah at 3:25 is petrifying

[@archayz]

it's kinda funny to me cuz he's devouring his own beard

[@KuraSourTakanHour]

Well in his second phase he does go completely savage

[@_ariosto1519]

I enjoyed the game for the playing experience and then for the great content from creators like you. Thank you for the great video! 🙌🏿

[@spacewalker806]

this is just stupid,we shouldn't have to search the story from youtube or play the GAME with a notebook by ourside.

[@ianperry4974]

As much as I love the sound track from elden ring. Nothing hits quite as hard as the Abyss watchers theme

[@tequilawhiskey]

I realy didnt bond with much of the ost this time. I cant even hum more than the title and sentinal themes in my head. Dunno.

[@RankStankulon]

@@tequilawhiskey agreed, I found the soundtrack to be pretty bland and uninspired compared to previous souls games actually. It has a couple good pieces, some pretty bad ones, and the rest are entirely forgettable for me

[@rmwilliams8193]

Fire link shrine slaps

[@davidson6738]

@@RankStankulon disagree completely. Better ost than a lot of previous souls games, I can hum most Melodie’s in elden ring bosses. Significantly less for every other souls game

[@BadVideoWatcher1]

I liked Godskin Apostles and Mohg Lord of Blood themes, but yeah overall the soundtrack had a huge drop in quality from where it was in Dark Souls 3

[@deepstonecostco]

I'm soooo happy that you interpreted the "make something of yourselves" line from Marika. I've seen lots of takes that it's proof she was evil and hated her kids, but I really came away thinking that by the end she realized she was a pawn and never completely in control.

[@rohanking12able]

Umm morgot......

[@eddyh5]

Yes exactly. Definitely a much needed take on the words.

[@no.9516]

wouldv been better if you open that door in the capital and shockingly find yourself in roundtable hold as you know it. it would have been a nice twist that you have been a pawn sent out from the capital and decieved the entire game.

[@ReaverTheSurvivalist]

I don’t think it’s not real so much as it is just... A pocket dimension in the Erdtree itself.

[@demonintellect9834]

Pretty much this. The Hunters Workshop was a real place but the one we used was a pocket dimension version of that.

[@SevenPr1me]

Yeah it's gotta be in the erdtree because the roundtable doesn't start burning until you set the erdtree ablaze

[@huxleyleigh4856]

when Gideon says Marika wants them to keep struggling he probably didn't understand that Marika = radagon and radagon is very pro golden order. he probably told Gideon to keep struggling and keep fueling the tree

[@getsueinaito]

I think it’s more of a matter of too much knowledge sort of like staring too much into the abyss. Someone mentioned goldmask but think of Corhyn when told of Radagon and Marina being the same. He practically loses his mind and thus either dies in the city of ash or possibly when naked and fled to wander in self exile

[@maxodonnell6092]

@@getsueinaito thats a interesting theory as telling gideon of bosses makes this more clear of going agasint which opens his eyes to what the order hates and so on

[@subtlewill1748]

I think she wants the two fingers to keep struggling, they did this to her and they need to suffer. She can't kill them as ranni did, Gideon found this out via these interactions with Marika's own two fingers in the round table hold. They told him they suffer because of Marika's shattering and revenge.

[@vukkulvar9769]

@@getsueinaito That's because Corhyn is a man of blind faith, when the truth was unveiled, he couldn't accept that what he knew was false or incomplete.

[@matiasluukkanen7718]

Marika is based on Mārīcī (Sanskrit: मारीची, lit. "Ray of Light"; Chinese: 摩利支天; pinyin: Mólìzhītiān; Japanese: Marishiten), Buddhist god (devi) or goddess, as well as a bodhisattva associated with light and the Sun and healing. By most historical accounts, Marici is a goddess -- but in some regions, she is depicted as a male god, revered among the warrior class in East Asia as a war deity. Mārīcī's goal is to lead mankind into salvation through endless battle and suffering that triggers enlightenment; realization that only by annihilation of desire and self you can be released from the cycle of death and rebirth. This obviously has been the inspiration for Marika's own goal as well. It is very Buddhist idea, and very, very scary. No wonder Gideon is struck by fear. Marika wants perpetual Shattering and conflict, so that people will understand the first and most important tenet of Buddhism: "life is suffering." Only then they will abandon the "illusion" of life, and accept non-being. Marika is seeking to usher people into state of non-being, to spite her god(s). Fromsoft have made commentary against Buddhist ideals before, most notably in Sekiro. It would not be out of place for them to make Marika a nihilistic bodhisattva, when she already is based on one, with male persona and all.

[@kyuubimadara]

This is a really solid theory on Marika's goal! I have to ask though, how did Sekiro critique Buddhist ideals? I noticed there were elements of Buddhist teachings and symbols, but I didn't really get the critique you're referring to from playing the game

[@getsueinaito]

Isn’t Buddhism against giving into worldly desires but in Sekiro they are a more darker organization seemingly obsessed with immortality. Have some with the fake immortality by those centipedes and trying to gain similar power as the imperial dragon child made countless horrible experiments to finally create their own incomplete version

[@WanderedIn]

@@getsueinaito Sekiro isn’t anti-Buddhist. The monks in Sekiro have explicitly been lead astray, while the recognition of transience and the necessity of an end is a very Buddhist idea. Remember, the storage you use in Sekiro is explicitly the Buddha’s, given as a favor. Sekiro is a pretty Buddhist game, with some very bad Buddhists as negative examples.

[@Snazzy12341]

You got a source for your description Marici? As far as im concerned with a quick google search, Marici is a goddess/bodhisattva who is associate with light and the sun. She's supposed to protect people from the rage of war, not make them suffer it

[@ChristianUtama]

So much for Buddhism you massacre all beings in lands between, you are gonna be reincarnated in the lowest tier in the samsara wheel. ☸️

[@BIGMandBADAM]

Someone might have said this already, but when you mentioned Melina's eye and the beast eye, I noticed a detail. You suggested that the tattoo on her eye was placed there by Maliketh to seal the Gloam Eyed Queen, and noted Melina's opened eye is the same color as the beast eye. On the item itself, it has a marking on it that almost perfectly matches Melina's tattoo. Idk what it means, but its a cool detail in design that sort of supports this theory

[@victorprati7908]

You just noticed what he literally said it in video -_-

[@garretthuff3073]

Honestly this is one of the most possible theory’s out there right now, love your content man thanks so much !!

[@joseleviste762]

Love this theory . I do wish there was a way to find out exactly what Gideon learned .

[@edwardo19231]

At 9:46, notice that when we finally see Melina again after fully releasing Destined Death and obtain the Flame of Frenzy, it's not just her left eye that become a gloom color. The mark on her left eye also becomes transparent, more like a scar. But previously, the mark is more like a tattoo.

[@PureConsoleGamers]

I believe that the round table hold is proof of time travel in Elden ring, hear me out! It seems fairly obvious to me that the second Round Table Hold that you find in Leyndell is the in the current timeline and the one Melina brings you to is in the past since the one in Leyndell is identical but dilapidated. The biggest clue to this is the description of the Coded Sword that is found upon the throne of the Two Fingers in the Leyndell version of the Round Table Hold: "Hidden sword once granted to the Tarnished of the Roundtable by the Two Fingers. A formless cipher comprises its blade, which deals holy damage no shield can repel. Champions would gather at the Roundtable Hold in days long past, when the Two Fingers were masters of oration, their flesh yet full of vigor." Its not a secret that many believe that Ranni the Witch is Melina, and time travel would highly support this since Ranni’s real body is long dead. So Melina could be the past version of Ranni. In my theory, the event of the shattering actually fragmented reality itself, making different times as well as realities collide. I believe some characters are aware of this phenomenon, and some are not. Possible effected characters: Melina: Melina is Ranni Support for this theory is: 1) Ranni has a ghostly figure next to her that shares an eye with her, the eye is closed and would match Melina’s closed eye, it even has a similar symbol underneath. 2) Both Ranni and Melina fade away in similar fashion. 3) Both Ranni and Melina know Torrent Millicent: I think Millicent is Malenia, either from the past or from an alternate reality. Her ‘sisters’ could be from alternative realities as well (making 6 versions in all, more on that later) support for this theory includes: 1) her missing the same arm 2) her knowing the water foul dance 3) Gowry saying “No, she must embark on her journey, and stare her fate in the eye.” when speaking of her visiting Malenia at the Halig Tree. 4) Millicent believes she is related to Malenia in some way but can’t even ponder it herself, even mentioning she might be an “offshoot” of some kind. 5) Gowry when speaking of her death and personal decision to take out the needle he remarks “Millicent... Malenia... Do you detest us, so utterly?” of course he can be speaking of 2 people, but with everything else in consideration it can certainly be seen both ways. All of this of course would mean that Gowry is aware of the fragmentation of reality. Goldmask: I believe Goldmask is part of a paradox within the fragmented reality. Him wanting to study the Golden Order leads him to actually creating it! His ‘mending rune of perfect order’ would end up becoming the ‘Golden order’ An interesting revelation I had is that Goldmask is very similar to the 2 fingers, as he does not speak and moves his arms (and fingers) in a method of communication. Brother Corhyn even mentions this a few times. Other loose possibilities: Abducted Miquella is from the past alternate reality as he is in his seedling form before he was able to sprout into the Haligtree Jar Barin becomes Alexander when he absorbs his heart. One of the more important parts of my theory is that every alternative reality is governed by each of the six endings or (ages) being the perfect number as I mentioned earlier there are six alternate versions of Malenia/Millicent. Each possible age all ready has influence in the lands between even though they have not happened yet as they are all part of this fragmented timeline and clash of alternate realities. When an NPC invades it does so from another world or ‘reality’ the Urd tree and minor Urd trees act as conduits to the link between these worlds explaining why when you kill Urd Tree Avatars certain NPC invaders can no longer invade. When the Urd tree is set ablaze the the link is weakened causing the fire to seep into the time rift which results in the past version of the round table hold burning down, leading to it’s eventual current state that you find it in Leyndell. Another thought is about Melina's hands: Melina has scar tissue on her hands. This could mean she has been the burning maiden before in previous ages, she keeps trying to fix the broken timeline, in every age (alternate reality).

[@avyayrao2359]

This theory is insanely good!

[@arbxz]

Damn that's good !

[@Akuankka000]

Great theory my guy

[@vib2119]

Good theory, but a few issues: How does Melina being the Gloam Eyed Queen tie into all this? How does Gideon appear in our future, can he time travel too? You mentioned Goldmask creating the Golden Order, but if the Roundtable Hold is in the past, then the Golden Order has already been created because the Two Finger and many others mention it a lot

[@Sitri115]

@@vib2119 Also Melina and Ranni are both spiritual beings, one bound to a doll and the other roaming the land untethered to anything. Of course they share an animation, torrent does too, so do our Spirit Summons. Your points are spot on btw, just thought I'd add on to them. Oh another point is Millicent, how CAN she be Malenia when she has what like 7 sisters or something? Malenia only has Miquella as her sibling not counting their half-siblings of course. If anything Millicent could be a clone or somehow a "daughter" of Malenia to try and get the Goddess of Rot to Bloom since Gowry is obviously connected to the Servants of Rot.

[@KillaCam501]

This is the best Elden Ring lore video I have seen to date. It is so amazing how many different views this one story had

[@littleconan7929]

The two main problem I have are : - what exactly is the Elden Ring ? - what is the use of the elden lord ? For the second question, the elden lord is the consort of an "ascended empyrean". Ok, but except being the sword of its empyrean he seems rather useless. Godfrey has been disposed of after all. yet we have placidusax, first elden lord and apparently, no god/empyrean for him. So the Elden lord would just be the "sacred keeper of the Elden Ring" ? And then the initial question about the elden ring. Apparently, the elden lord cannot use/benefit directly from the elden ring. Only a god can trully harness its power. But we have other gods. It is told that Malenia becoms the godess of scarlett rot. Mohg tries to do something equivalent for its bloody outer god. (Yes god seems to ascended empyrean and vessels for outer gods). So apparently a god does not need the elden ring to be so. At least not for himself, but maybe the existance of the elden ring is required. From what I understand, even though powerfull, a god is limited, the elden ring gives them the ability to shape the world by structuring its principles (runes) and only gods may do so. Marika becomes the godess of the greater will and thus uses the elden ring to shape the world as the greater will want it to be.

[@elipeterman8425]

I really like the way you explained that. Here's some blind speculation that popped into my head while reading that. Perhaps Merika (or any god of the greater will/elden ring) is not supposed to reshape (forge) the runes unless its what the greater will tells them to do. So in the teaser trailer, when Radigon is forging something, he's forging the the plot Merika devised since she herself cant disobey the greater will. Maybe that's why radigon is Merika

[@the1384]

I like that thought, it really looks like there has always to be a Elden Lord and that Rule was truly engraved and implemented into the Elden Ring after what ever happened at Farum Azula. In Reality you get Destined Death, kill the real First known Elden lord Placidusex, then Godfrey and then Radagon and only after that the Spot as Elden Lord will truly be obtainable by a Tarnished

[@36AjT9]

Imagine the same for our world- one who has the divine spark has the ability to gain access to "the elden ring" and shape the world we live in- yet gods and demi gods are all clawing for the same thing- yet they can not unless they have a foothold inside the one with the divine spark- to use the tarnished for their own ends..... exactly the same as our reality.

[@Nezxmi]

@@elipeterman8425 I believe it is opposite. Radagon is the part of Marika that sides with the Greater Will (or at the very least he sides with the Golden Order) and that is why Radagon is attempting to reforge the Elden Ring in that teaser trailer. It is confirmed that the teaser trailer object was the Elden Ring through in-game dialogue and through Marika's Hammer description. Marika calls Radagon the "leal hound of the Golden Order" and says that he is loyal to the Golden Order, not to her, just before she shatters the Elden Ring. She tells Radagon that he does not understand her actions because he is yet to become "Her", implying that Marika herself as ascended in some way that Radagon cannot which may be what allows her to disobey the Greater Will.

[@beansfebreeze]

I thought the Ring itself was just an embodiment of the metaphysical laws of reality and that the holder is the one that dictates how things work. A god is just someone really strong.

[@radagast7200]

We can summon entities from ashes with the bell. The roundtable hold seems to be burning at the end. Perhaps Melina summoned the roundtable hold similarly to how we summon spirits, which is why it burns when she does.

[@ladyfl0wers]

But she does not necessarily burn

[@exxy9931]

Queen Marika is literally serving the Greater Will while trying to outplay it (and then proceeding to get outplayed by the Greater Will AND her other half, literally).

[@eddyh5]

I don't think she was outplayed... in the end she wins. Everything seems to be by design to an extent.

[@mechasmoke]

Elden Ring is my 1st "FromSoftware" experience, and the story is very difficult to piece together for sure. It's been a good experience for me though, I enjoyed Elden Ring a lot. But I love this way of interpreting the story. Especially why Marika would banish Godfrey after taking his grace. This theory is a great way to view The Lands Between in 😁

[@Cman04092]

I love a game that isnt afraid to make me work for the bigger picture. I play the trails game, which has missable items that are newspapers with actual articles, and chapters from novels, which are actual stories about the world. It's my favorite series, and it's also cool because its a continuous story. Arc one takes place in 1 country, arc 2 a second country, and arc 3 a third, and arc 4 a 4th. And the countries from 1 and 3 and 3 and 4 have wars. And the country is 2 becomes occupied by country 3 and 4 at one point. And you see charecters from all the old arcs returning, or meet someone from a later arc just traveling in an earlier arc, and then get their story fleshed out. Its really cool, but really complicated, and you definitely have to put some work in to understand the deep lore behind the scenes, and some people can't handle that kind of story telling. I see elden ring as very similar, you can do just the main story, but there will be a lot you dont understand, and a lot that you dont even know that you dont understand, like the dragons age stuff, and the mogh stuff, and miquella and melania stuff, and radah, rykard, renna as well. And all the underground sections with nox, and albonoric, ect. it's all optional.

[@Wveth]

If you're interested in the even deeper stuff, and you haven't found it yourself in the last seven months, look up Tarnished Archaeologist. It turns out there's a lot to learn from the architecture in this game, it will blow your mind how much of the history you can piece together just from looking at the old buildings REAL carefully.

[@shnorkeythefourth4572]

Melina being a manifestation of the gloam eyed queen would also explain why she looks like Ranni who, is explicitly stated has the doll body resembling her former master. This would imply that the snow witch and the gloam eyed queen may be the same person

[@CuteFriendlyLobster]

This reminds me of the Firelink Shrine in DS3, the one we can only go to through a bonefire is an illusion and the real one is shrudded in darkness, or something like that

[@mattfromtinder9803]

The round table hold exists within Miquellas dream world.

[@Gharya_Prastya.]

This is so far the best theory I've heard on Marika's goals

[@vinceoverheaven]

So happy I subscribed to you, it reignited my love for this game I forgot I had

[@gygaxthecat2448]

ive always likened Merica to Itachi, and us as her sleeper agent. she knew shed be punished but it was worth subverting the lie/flaw/failure of the greater will

[@UnseenHitman-1932]

Who is Itachi

[@gygaxthecat2448]

@@UnseenHitman-1932 Sasuke's older brother

[@UnseenHitman-1932]

@@gygaxthecat2448 What does he have to do with Elden Ring

[@tristanjackson5343]

Yeah getting to the round table hold in the capital made me think of one thing “time is convoluted in souls games” or some other strange thing like the round table hold was another dimension or state of existing or being that serves a greater purpose that being to help the tarnished meditate and grow their strengths and armaments. Further the fact that the round table was burning after the erdtree was set on fire on the mountain top of giants told me they shared a connection some how they were part of the each other.

[@TheMechaNox]

I really like your theories, they make sense to me, you're one of my favourite ER lore theorists. Appreciate how you haven't given up on ER's confusing story like some others. Keep up the good work, but don't bite more than you are comfortable with. Appreciate your work. :) Banishing Godfrey and his men meant they won't be absorbed by the Erdtree upon their death, so they can be left as Queen Marika's personal force unaffiliated with the Greater Will and free from it's brainwashing.

[@danielw88887]

Truly love all your videos. Listening to these make my love for the game grow so much more.

[@subtlewill1748]

Had a thought! Marika's Two Fingers (in lost table) killed godwyn the golden, just as they controlled the black knives to kill iji as ranni killed her own fingers. The two fingers spurned the demigods, that's why they had them killed and Marika lashed out and destroyed the elden ring... Cause unlike ranni she had no control over her fate and this was the only way to get back at them.

[@eldenringpvpenthusiast1710]

I feel like there's a connection with the sun, erdtree and roundtable hold. I cant help but notice at sunset and for some time after theres a path of light leading to the sunset in the direction of roundtable hold on the map

[@mattharris7674]

I never knew Melina's hair was pink. I am colorblind and thought it was like light brown this whole time

[@vanhelsing655-2]

This reminds me so much of bloodborne. How the hub world is just a place that existed in the real world just manifested again by a god

[@plannein]

Melina is clearly Ranni. Or at least, took some form of Ranni's body in some way. Perhaps that is related, because I think there was some item description that said something about the gloam eyed queen having something to do with the moon. But I can't remember specifically.

[@sirgideonofnir6840]

I never once consider Maricka had her own fingers and the possibly being the 3 fingers is a neat idea as well

[@_valfreyja]

This has to be one of the best Elden Ring videos I've watched, great work.

[@phant0mdummy]

In other news, the sky is also blue, and above us.

[@geohernandez4627]

You seem to have hit the nail right on the head my boy. Keep it up. Been enjoying all your videos!

[@blackniol]

Here’s my theory. I don’t know if it makes any sense or if someone thought of it already, but here goes. I think that Marika’s ultimate goal was to free the Lands Between of Greater Will’s influence. I think that the Greater Will influenced or maybe even controlled her thoughts for its benefit, but once she created Radagon, he inherited that control while she was free to think for herself. Under the influence of the Greater Will, she removed the Rune of Death from the Elden Ring, making it so everyone that died joined the Erdtree and possibly feed the Greater Will. The Gloam-eyed Queen probably stole the Rune of Death, created her cult, but after Maliketh killed her, she joined the Erdtree as a spirit like everyone else. Marika, freed from the Greater Will’s influence started concocting a plan to kill the Elden Beast and free the Lands Between. She probably created the Roundtable Hold outside of the Lands Between as a gathering place for tarnished and Hewg’s jail, but connected it with the grace of the Erdtree. She tasked Hewg with crafting a weapon capable of killing a god. She removed the grace from Godfrey and his warriors and banished them to get strong enough to kill a god. She created Melina from the spirit of the Gloam-eyed Queen to help a tarnished capable of killing a god. Probably gave her Torrent as well. And finally, she shattered the Elden Ring, while Radagon who was still controlled by the Greater Will tried and failed to repair it. Melina, as the spirit of the Gloam-eyed Queen could only manifest herself around sites of grace or at the foot of the Erdtree. As a spirit, she is connected to the Erdtree and maybe even Marika herself which is the reason for her ability to hear what Marika spoke in those churches. Unlike Ranni, she doesn’t have a doll to inhabit, so she must follow a tarnished to the foot of the Erdtree in order to open the way and give guidance. She was probably entrusted with the Rold Medallion by Marika as well. It's possible and I think likely that Ranni and Marika worked together to free the Lands Between. Torrent’s former master gave her the Spirit Calling Bell and I think that was Marika. After all, Black Knives were rumored to have close ties with Marika and Ranni used them to free herself of her empyrean body in order to not become the Greater Will’s puppet. Ranni hated the Greater Will probably as much as Marika herself. Sir Gedeon Ofnir probably knew all that, but he believed that no one could kill a god. What he thought was that you would walk in the Erdtree, die, and deliver the Greater Runes in Radagon’s hands. He would repair the Elden Ring and all of Marika’s work would have been for naught. But the final part of Marika’s plan was for the tarnished to kill the Elden Beast. Then you would be able to become the Elden Lord without Greater Will’s control.

[@saintsfearful]

Interesting theory. This is my theory of the Elden Ring timeline which I think you might find enlightening. 1. Previous order of Elden Ring controlled by Dragons and Fire Giants. 2. Numen enter Lands Between and a powerful Numen is chosen to produce demigod children with the current previous order God of the Elden Ring (presumably a Fire Giant/draconian hybrid), likely to gain the Numen long lives to offset the draconian short lives. 3. The empyrean Marika is born with her twin brother Radagon. 4. Marika lives as royalty, getting into mischief around the Great Tree in Leyndell with her shadow Maliketh, while the curious and ambitious young Radagon is sent to become a smith and a knight (probably in the mountains trained by the cruel natured Fire Giants). 5. The Omen begin being born which signifies that it's time for the ceremony to burn the Great Tree which is accompanied by the sacrifice of beast men and slaves to the One Great. The Fire Giants use the flame from the Forge of the Giants to do this. The kind hearted young Marika is horrified by the spectacle. 6. The burning of the Great Tree signifies the end of the Crucible. Marika was chosen to become the next God and she chose her brother Radagon to become her knight. 7. Upon receiving the Elden Ring Marika gazed into the One Great and saw that there was 2 natures to this God: one of light and life and the other of flame and death. Understanding this she, with the help of her brother Radagon, removed the Great Runes associated with flame and death and broke the cycle, rebranding the light and life aspect remaining into the Greater Will. Radagon becomes Marika's secret blacksmith and guard, charging him with disposing of the Great Runes of flame safely and secretly while saving the Rune of Death for power. 3/5 heads of Placidusax lose their flame, signaling trouble to the Elden Lord who believes his god has fled. 8. Marika establishes the Golden Order, promising life everlasting, peace, and prosperity. 9. The Dragons and Fire Giants learn what Marika did to the Elden Ring and Dragon/Fire Giant civil war begins. 10. The Golden Order takes dominance over the Lands Between while continuing the war. Marika begins to suspect something is wrong with the Greater Will. 11. The Nox faction of astrologer's in Raya Lucaria try to summon the stars and the First Carian War begins. 12. First Carian War ends in victory for the Golden Order and the Nox are banished to the Eternal City to make Albinauric slaves for Marikas wars. Carians that weren't aligned with the Nox remained, abandoning astrology in a peace deal with the Golden Order. 13. The young prodigy Renalla appears in Raya Lucaria and through her wisdom and magical prowess unites Liurnia under the banner of the moon and the Carian Royal Family. The Academy and kingdom flourish under her rule. 14. The Golden Order, likely seeing the rising Carian kingdom as a threat, started a conflict with them and the Second Carian War began. 15. Radagon, who has been communing with the Greater Will inside the Erd Tree since the First Carian War bathing in its runes following the completion of his mission, was compelled by the Greater Will to join the war and find Renalla whom was suitable to produce strong offspring. The Greater Will likely sensed Marika's doubts so it sent a rune filled Radagon to sire more empyrean demigods. 16. Radagon fights Renalla and then proposes. She accepts, ending the war. 17. Radagon moves to Caria Manor and Renalla begins to sire him children, first being Radahn, Rykard, and potentially an unnamed sister. Three towers are built for them behind Caria Manor. 18. Years pass and the civil war continues with the entrenched Fire Giants. Rykard and Radahn become a praetor and warrior with Radahn moving to Sellia and Rykard moving to the capital. Something happens to the unnamed sister (I'm guessing she was the youngest and died very young). This is likely why Rennala stopped having children for a while. 19. Rennala gives birth to the twins Ranni and Renna. As Rykard and Radahn no longer live in Caria the twins are given their towers and they are named/renamed the Three Sisters in memoriam to the perished sister. 20. The young twins Renna and Ranni are chosen by the fingers to be empyreans. Renna is physically stronger and more attuned to light, whereas Ranni is more frail and attuned to magic. Ranni, as the magically attuned twin, is then taken by her mother to gaze upon the Full Moon that guided Rennala where she encountered the Dark Moon. 21. The young twins Ranni and Renna get lost in the woods and find/befriend an old ice witch. The witch senses potential in Ranni to learn her witchcraft but none in Renna, so she gifts the young Renna with a spectral steed named Torrent as a consolation prize while she began teaching Ranni of the dark moon and ice magic. Around this time young Blaidd is brought to become Ranni's shadow who is warmly welcomed by Rennala as an adoptive child. 22. The Dragonlord and the Fire Giants were finally defeated and the civil war ends. 23. Marika creates and banishes the tarnished in defiance of the Greater Will. 24. The Greater Will beckons Radagon back to the capital to reign in Marika and orders the young child Renna be brought Leyndell as she is the more compatible empyrean. Radagon knows Rennalla would never allow this so he tricks her into thinking Renna died and in her grief twists her mind with the help of Seluvis, tasking her to rebirth ad infinitum. 25. Radagon moves to the capital and becomes king consort. Marika and/or the Greater Will extends the grace of the Elden Ring to Radagon's children granting them full demigod status. Seluvis is appointed by Radagon to be Ranni's instructor and spy while Rykard returned to the steward the manor and continue his research. Rennala remains in her library rebirthing over and over again like she's in a trance. 26. The Greater Will orders Radagon to impregnate Marika as punishment for her defiance in order to produce more demigods, leading to the birth of the inbred and defective Malenia and Miquella. During this time Renna is renamed Melina to hide her identity and put under the care of Marika who became her mother. Caria falls into disrepair as Rennala fails to lead and Rykard becomes obsessed with power. Radahn continues training in Sellia. 27. After many years Marika appoints Melina to train under Maliketh and assist guarding the Rune of Death. At some point Marika informs Melina about the dark nature of the Greater Will and revealed Radagon's treachery against her birth mother Rennala. She then puts her Numen Black Knives under Melina's command. 28. Melina secretly uses the power of the Rune of Death to become the Gloam Eyed Queen and creates the Godskins to kill the Elden Beast. She enlists Ranni and Rykard to assist her. 29. Maliketh captures Melina and the rebellion ends, but not before Melina showed Ranni how to access shards of the Rune of Death, how to steal and use it's power, and how to create a cursemark to re-bind Destined Death into the Elden Ring. Marika seals the power of the Rune of Death inside Maliketh and the remaining Godskins no longer could use the true Black Flames. Melina has her memories removed by Radagon, but is tasked with becoming the kindling maiden in secret by Marika at the Elden Throne. Demoralized, Rykard and Ranni bide their time. 30. The Greater Will, again seeing through Marika's betrayal, decided to begin fusing Marika and Radagon into a single being to finally force her obedience. Radagon is loyal to the Greater Will above all else. 31. Rykard founds the Volcano Manor and the radical Godskins emerge in the absence of Melina to assist Rykard. Hundreds of years pass. 32. Ranni, likely informed by the moon, learns that the Greater Wills goal is nearly complete and in a desperate attempt to sever herself from the Greater Will designs with the help of Rykard, the Black Knives still loyal to Melina, and the necromancers to plot to steal the shards of the Rune of Death. Ranni secretly plans on using it on herself to deny the Greater Will an empyrean while creating a cursemark that can return death to the land. Rykard learns of Godwyn being chosen by the Greater Will to become it's vessel and instead uses his shards to cut open the cocoon woven into the Erd Tree roots in Deeproot Depths and kill Godwyn. Godwyn's soul dies, but his body doesn't and is instead infected with the Rune of Death that continued the transformation into the Deathroot mass. Ranni, who kills herself at the same instant, has her body die but soul remain tied to the Lands Between and the Greater Will. The cursemark is split between the two. 33. Shock of losing it's vessel caused the Greater Wills control to waver, giving Marika back her body and just enough time to shatter the Elden Ring. She does this in grief and vengeance. 34. Marika quickly distributes the Great Runes amongst her "children" and kicks off the shattering war. 35. Radagon regains control of the body and seals himself in the Erd Tree to attempt repair of the Elden Ring. 36. The shattering war wages for who knows how many years (10's? 100's? It's unclear.). 37. With the war diminishing the land and Radagon failing to repair the Elden Ring, the Greater Will calls back the Tarnished in a desperate attempt to get someone to repair the Elden Ring. 38. Eventually, you the player rises and the game begins.

[@Nezxmi]

I believe you are right about pretty much everything, I think you only missed one part. Gideon truly did not believe we could kill Radagon, more or less the Elden Beast if he knew it existed, simply because he did not know that we had acquired the Rune of Death. Returning from Farum Azula sent us into the Future by an unquantifiable amount, from Gideon's perspective we probably disappeared for a *long* time even though it was an instant for us. Gideon had probably been searching for the Rune of Death the entire time while just watching Tarnished throw themselves at Godfrey, eventually he would come to the conclusion that the Rune of Death was not obtainable for any Tarnished and thus victory was not obtainable, not even for Godfrey. So he would curb Godfrey's growth by standing before him and preventing Godfrey from ever collecting all the Great Runes and then going in just to lose to Radagon, hoping to at least keep things at a stalemate between Marika and Radagon.

[@Nezxmi]

​@@saintsfearful Two issues with your theory, Radagon and Renna. Radagon just cannot be Marika's twin brother based on the lore we currently know. Numen are ONLY female, they are a race of women, Radagon is male. The only sensible explanation I've heard for Radagon and Marika's relation is that Radagon is the physical embodiment of the Great Rune of Order, having been removed from the Elden Ring only after Marika became it's vessel. This would allow Marika freedom from the Greater Will while also explaining Radagon's loyalty to it. Also your timeline is slightly off because the entire reason Radagon returned to Marika and tried to fuse with her was the Night of the Black Knives, that is when Marika realized that the Greater Will was attempting to replace her and when she made the ultimate decision to shatter the Elden Ring. I believe that Ranni and Rykard chose to kill Godwyn simply because they had to split the Cursemark and they already did not like Marika, since they believed Marika was responsible for Radagon leaving their mother Renalla. Godwyn was also very strong so killing him with the assassins left Rykard fresh and ready to fight Maliketh if necessary. Lastly Radagon returning to the Erdtree should leave Marika unable to act directly. We see that upon reaching the Erdtree that she is literally crucified with a shard resembling the Rune of Death stabbed within her body, the defiant half of Marika is practically dead. Everything after the thorns is purely Marika's machinations working as she intended. I do not know where you are getting the idea that Ranni had a twin sister named Renna, Renna is the Ice Witch that Ranni met and I believe that is the only time we hear of a Renna. If you could explain that I'd be interested.

[@saintsfearful]

​@@Nezxmi Bro, you can literally pick Numen as a starting class and be MALE. How did you miss that in your analysis?! Only the Black Knives were all women but having a gendered force is not unusual in high fantasy. Nowhere in game is there a shred of evidence that great runes can become people, yet all these theorists just lean that way for some reason. In fact all the evidence points to the runes requiring other life to utilize them, hence why the Greater Will needs Marika in the first place. You're also wrong about when Radagon returned as Miquella had a relationship with either Godwyn or another demigod and sought to return his soul to his body. Since Godwyn was the first demigod to die and have his soul removed from his body then that means Radagon MUST have returned before the night of the Black Knives. "Lord Miquella, forgive me. The sun has not been swallowed. Our prayers were lacking. Your comrade remains soulless... I will never set my eyes upon it now... Your divine Haligtree..." Nothing in the game suggests that Rykard and Ranni are malicious towards Marika. All of their aggression is directed at the Golden Order and the Greater Will, which considering Marika is clearly fighting against them makes it much more likely Marika HELPED Ranni and Rykard. Why do you think the Black Knives, who are Numen originally loyal to Marika (then the Gloam Eyed Queen at Marika's behest), helped Ranni and Rykard long after the Gloam Eyed Queen had been captured? Next time you fight Morgott and summon Melina to help watch her moveset closely and you'll see it's VERY similar to the beast men and the Black Knives including the weapon she uses. It's literally the holy version of the black knife blade. I'm so sick of people assuming just because you find the Ice Witch set in Renna's Rise and Ranni says "I am the witch Renna" that that automatically means the ice witch is Renna. Don't you find it strange that the towers are called "the Three Sisters" and the Ice Witch set doesn't contain reference to a name? Also, the Ice Witch lived deep in the woods (no woods near the towers). Guess where there is woods though? On the lunar plateau which leads down to the Astel fight. It's much more likely that the Snow Witch was an ancient silver tear that took a form that incorporated aspects of Astel into her humanoid form (silver tears are connected to ice magic). As the silver tears (and their derivatives the Albinaurics) are not a part of the Greater Wills designs it would also explain how the witch learned spirit magic, which is also outside of the Greater Wills designs. I also think this ancient witch assisted the sealing of the Rot God. Snow Witch Robe: "Once worn by the snowy crone who the young Ranni encountered deep in the woods. She was a witch, and well versed in cold sorceries. It is said that the doll that houses Ranni's soul was modeled after her." Blue Dancer Charm: "The dancer in blue represents a fairy, who in legend bestowed a flowing sword upon a blind swordsman. Blade in hand, the swordsman sealed away an ancient god-a god that was Rot itself." This item below is why I think Renna was Ranni's sister. There's only reference to one princess of Caria (Ranni), yet we know that Rennalla was the only queen of Caria so that means any princess is born of her. Also naming convention is extremely important in Souls games, with offspring of important figures having names that are derivatives of the parentage (I've been ingesting lore from these games for like 10 years). It's ridiculous to assume an Ice Witch of a completely different race just happens coincidentally have the name RENNA which is a direct derivative of Rennalla. Ranni's doll form is "modelled after" the Ice Witch, not a direct copy. The Ice Witch is described as a "crone" which is a visually old and decrepit woman, yet Ranni has a youthful face. It's much more likely that the canonically prideful Ranni kept her face but used the body as a way to disguise herself. As far as her saying "I am the witch Renna" I think that was a test to see if you reacted to the name "Renna" as the only people who would know the truth behind the name are Carian royals and agents of Radagon, followed immediately by her asking about Torrent. Twins often impersonate each other as well. Since Torrent originally belonged to Melina (Renna) she wanted to see if you knew of her sister since you had her steed. The Gloam Eyed Queen (Melina) was connected to spirit summoning as the Godskin Swaddling Cloth was in the spirit snail cave protected by spirit summons. Finally Melina is in the exact same state as Ranni, a burned disembodied spirit, and they are the only 2 characters in the game to take this form. Them being twins with a deep connection would explain why when Ranni burned so did Melina and also why their faces are nearly identical including having a scar over the eye. If you look at Melina and Rennalla there's also an uncanny resemblance. I think it's crazy to call all of this a coincidence. Carian Filigreed Crest: "An honor said to have once been awarded to Carian knights who served as direct retainers to the kingdom's princesses. Now there is only one princess: Ranni, daughter of Rennala."

[@filippogrimaldi7228]

@@saintsfearful the One Great is probably a mistranslation as in Japanese it translates to "a great whole" (probably synonym to the Crucible). Similar thing with the Great Tree. Also, in the Japanese version of Hyetta's dialogue it is clearer that the Greater Will made the mistake of creating life&souls,

[@milkinanime7047]

Pffft, the theme is The Flame of Frenzy the only true way to being peace to The Lands Between

[@soulrebelstudios3185]

wow this is one of the deepest lore videos ive seen yet! Blown away tbh.

[@mTealeaf]

I think this is the best theory video I've seen on the true intentions and extent of Marikas power as a god. It's more or less how I've seen things, that it was her influence and grand plan all along and would likely be seen by many (players and characters) as either a pitiable character or would be reviled, but didn't care and still guides the tarnished as a whole in general by creating a sort of time loop or vortex with the Roundtable, so we would have peers as we rise, and directly via her avatar of Melina.. even if Melina didn't understand she was an avatar of Marika until she reaches the foot of the Erdtree. In D&D terms, when they've made stat blocks of gods and their avatars, a common theme is communication via proximity of at minimum 1000ft, and so her amnesiac divine essence was able to commune with her divine body, which still hosted the Elden Ring and is in a constant struggle likely against Radagon (Who, I believe was able to both separate himself at one point before imprisonment, but had been apart of the "whole god" since the time of the Crucible, and who's personality was a driving factor towards Marika's decision to shatter the ring.) Melina is almost a completely different person when she both shows up to help you fight, something she was not able to do before or anywhere else, has that really unique tree healing animation, and we all know the move-set.. and when she talks to you again, almost like she's regained her vast trove of divine knowledge.. but still keeps up the charade of nobody of consequence, a nobody who can remember the exact words Marika once said that spells out her intentions for the tarnished, maybe thousands of years ago in hallow grounds to her, and you talk the same way she did back then. Just like with the Roundtable Hold, which is clearly held together by the giant grace on the table, how the version of that place that is projected is both a tangible physical place but version of it that existed in the past, perhaps the appearance of Melina is a younger version of Marika, as she was when (I give full credit to you for this theory when I recently watched a video of yours suggesting) she was the Gloam Eyed Queen, a Numen woman that embodied Death as the law of nature. If the theories suggesting the Erdtree is actually a fungi do hold merit, which I personally believe they do, then an a budding power force and a god of death probably could see great benefit to a mutual relationship in the times before or at the Crucible. So great, that once established they even cast death out of the world entirely.. at least, put away for safe keeping, until it could be of use such as in the Night of Black Knives (the betrayal spoken of in game) and for her ultimate plan whenever it might have changed to instead end the Golden Order. I think it's important that Ranni is the one narrating the Lore Trailer where the line "Marika was driven to the brink." ~ We learn in game that Ranni has a mysterious cadence about her speech, so to return to that line, it's interesting to think that Ranni knew of Marika's emotional state after the Night of Black Knives. Ranni also isn't above misleading the Tarnished, it's suggested that the death of Godwyn is what drove Marika to the brink, but it could have very well been just been the realization it's time for the Golden Order to be finished. And to finish off this small novel (btw I did join the discord, but I've been pretty quiet on it. I could always talk further there though) Melina being a younger version of, or perhaps just a projection, or avatar, of Marika really just does ultimately make the most sense. It feels like the first thing someone going into the game blind might think, but then with all the twists and turns in the lore you find along the way it becomes "obvious" that because there's so much more to things going on, it of course they aren't the same. Clueless to the fact that they are. It also speaks to why she would have the authority to speak with such certainty during the Frenzied Flame ending, after the Rune of Death had returned to her, and she was still as smart as ever and capable as a god. One extra note, the pink hair does sort of raise questions, but it could either have been her original hair color or even been due to her "birth" she speaks of happening during or at the beginning of the struggle with Radagon in their body directly after the shattering of the Ring, or maybe all this is wrong and she's just some kid or old friend of Marika. ^^; Thanks to anybody who reads

[@eddyh5]

You deserve more recognition for this comment. Thank you for awesome contribution. 🤘

[@PopeDope69-420]

Yes! This was such a mind fuck when I found RTH in Lyndell. Can’t wait to watch this to the end. Thank you! (Liked)

[@artoriapendragonkingofknig2026]

I always love hearing Majula's theme

[@FEARPaintball]

Awesome video as always! I'm glad I'm not the only one that wears the full Tree Sentinel armor B)

[@seanmoore5205]

You’re doing great! I love the content. Keep it up!

[@quincykunz3481]

The elden ring regulates and effects reality itself, right? That is why you can pull a concept like death away from it. I wonder if the ring being shattered is what creates these fragmentary people. Melina, millicent, and possibly gurranq are pieces of shard bearers (Marika, Melania, Maliketh,) Maybe holding fractured reality can fracture yourself? Perhaps shadows like maliketh, blaidd, and serosh are a more intentional version of this? There is also mentions of twins sharing a single soul between two people. Possibly a natural fracture? I wonder how many fractures and offshoots a soul can sustain? The flame of frenzy refers to births as division, not multiplication. All things were once one, and now there are many, and the many cause suffering. Perhaps the life-force of the lands between is finite, which is why dragons and giants have been growing less impressive, and why we seek to absorb strength as runes from all around us. Thoughts?

[@augustuslxiii]

Oh, this is an excellent video! I watch a lot of lore takes, and this is up there.

[@wyattwyattwyatt1833]

My first playthrough, I sacrificed Melina and then did the Frenzied Flame ending and got the cutscene of her as the "Gloam-Eyed Queen". I don't necessarily think she dies if you sacrifice her.

[@mickMahaus32]

her hairs are different in the ending scene, maybe its not even the same character

[@jake_]

The Roundtable Hold may not even be in the Lands Between. When we enter the final arena, instead of the usual " piss curtain" that leads to the boss, we are surrounded by light and teleported somewhere e where we can see other Erdtrees. The inside of the Erdtree may at some level work as part of a cosmic hub that connects all the worlds controlled by the Greater Will. Anyway, even when you finish the game (except for the Age of the Stars and the Frenzied flame endings), you have no idea what you have just accomplished, if anything at all. " Cool, you mended the Elden Ring. Here is a brick".

[@mickMahaus32]

i feel like the 4 vanilla endings are you failing but the frenzied flame and age of the stars are the 2 real endings. one destroying everything of that corrupted world and the other giving people their free will back and trusting that things will get better

[@fidusooel]

the tarnished are gamers and Marika is Miasaki, Gideon are video-essayists, gathering and exchanging knowledge with the players. But no one can truly understand a designer and Gideon is ultimately in the way of the tarnished, who should struggle and make their own path. A fun parallel this video got me thinking about.

[@brandonweed6680]

This is the best comment.

[@VtheBeast_iF]

Miyazaki will personally hunt you down and kill you if you choose flame of frenzy

[@dantecestari9666]

when the majula theme started playing i got the chills..

[@Darien2016]

I freaking love your videos man you give me so much freaking insight. You sir are awesome.

[@dragonlordplacidusax9413]

We atleast know that Godfrey & Marika were allies if we consider the cut content.

[@vulkanlives3821]

Awesome video, and I think you're right. I'm glad I found your channel, your lore videos are very interesting.

[@edeasley144]

The two roundtable holds has had me wondering about what it means to the lore as well. Its so weird. You fight the invaders in the main hall of the ethereal roundtable hold if you jump down there, then you invade others at the actual roundtable hold in Leyndell when you are doing the Volcano Manor Quests. And the other Volcano Manor quests have you fighting the roundtable hold members in the same spot you were ambushed by invaders. And who is the burned body in Leyndell Roundtable Hold where you would find Fia in the ethereal hold?

[@GoulaLegamer]

Even after the video it’s still makes not a lot of sense at all how all the others that are in the round table came here in the first place like rogier ? He says he can’t see the grace anymore so how did he get to the round table ? Does he even have a maiden ? Do u really need a maiden to access the round table hold ? If not how all those people ended up here ?

[@subject8776]

Melina being a fragment of Marika is a very interesting and not so far fetched take. Haven't heard that one before,.

[@sebastianmorin9780]

The eye Melina has sealed shut is also on the same side that Marika/Radagon has missing.

[@angelfire9094]

great observation

[@Michijere77]

Genius! This was a great video!

[@thetsarofall8666]

I figured that the reason the roundtable hold is burning is because, since it draws power from erdtree magic, with the burning of the erdtree its power is burned too

[@SirQwert]

I feel like the round table is a part that was torn away from reality and restored from ruins to greatness

[@Sikraj]

I would love it if you talk about the lore significance as to why all the npc with their first initial M are aspects or at least aligned with Marika and why all the npc with the letter R are aspects or at least aligned with Radagon

[@JackVogel2024]

From all the lore videos out there, this was the most intriguing one I've seen so far. Made the tarnished become less lifeless as heroes in the story, and more enjoyable to picture in the grand scheme of things. A bit more like the ashen ones I guess. Good job 👍

[@MmacentralNl]

I personally thought much the same. my theory is that Marika divested the first tarnished of grace so that the Greater Will couldn't "track" them anymore and thus they could return later to do what Marika wanted. she was betting on multiple things. for the demi-gods to fulfill their destiny (surely one was going to be successful?) and / or the tarnished to affect / alter the governing Order.

[@dirmusloner7963]

The original roundtable hold I think we take a grasp of what it used to be when we go to the Fortified Manor, a secluded area restricted from the rest of the capital. I agree that the roundtable hold that we interact with Gideon and other characters there is a 100% possibility to be an illusion. Also when we first go to the roundtablehold as Melina teleports us, we get invaded as a welcome.

[@khandimahn9687]

Some good theorycrafting there.

[@YodaMan.]

if you discover a secret in your travels -- though not much of one now i suppose but ***spoiler just in case*** youll find merica is radagon.

[@BrassPetals3Voices]

Ofnir’s story sounds like how the original cut content Mimic story went, only the Mimic version seems like a lot more personal of a betrayal. I can’t say Ofnir surprised me, but I imagine being betrayed by a Mimic you hosted and in a sense raised only to use ‘you’ against yourself would be a surprise on top of a betrayal.

[@jessetoews2446]

That character sum up of the npc's was lit

[@TrainingMacro]

7:34 Let me stop you right there, I've never once burned Melina and the roundtable hold still goes ablaze.

[@Jay_daewi]

It’d be really cool if he did a lore video on vyke. He’s by far one of my favorite from soft Characters

[@Dzugashvili]

Vaati talks about his path in his latest video which was pretty amazingly well made

[@Jay_daewi]

@@Dzugashvili I saw that video and I loved it

[@natotornado6104]

Blacksmith in the round table was also made a prisoner until he is able to craft a god killing weapon (for you)

[@Madgunner117]

The part about using her as kindling is the reason the round table hold is burning seems intresting, but what if you use the flames of frenzy to burn down the tree

[@Gunther845]

We must embrace the frenzied flame

[@DannyFiggy501]

Bro you got probably one of the nastiest sponsors! Proud of you and keep that content coming!

[@Mart-E12]

I just realized Gideon has ears on his helmet and armor

[@goldendoaihya6972]

In my head melena one of two parts of the gloam eyed queen, every empyrean have been claimed by an outer god other than the greater will, and they represent these outer gods by their design and inflections, take miquella and melania for example. We know form item description that there is an outer god of death, The Twin birds, one looks like a phoenix and the other like a crow, and that fits the theme of each part of melena, golden eye and pink hair (representing the colors of first part of the sunset) for the phoenix, and her purpose is to get burned, gloam eye with black hair (representing last part of the sunset before night) for the crow.

[@optionalboss3706]

It's difficult because our minds are used to the concept of a story being complete with bits hidden or hard to work out provided we have all the clues etc. but i think the way Miyazaki used to read fantasy novels is extremely telling as it was for Dark souls in that such large gaps are left intentionally for us to create pieces that fill them that will fit with the way we think. Is a big part of what i've enjoyed from all the souls games and honestly it means most theories are correct :)

[@Sleeper_6875]

Good theory especially in regards to Melina, I hope the DLC elaborates ok it

[@jaredfait4280]

Jake, there were some things during your live streams I hard disagreed with you, but after seeing this, I get it. The discourse is necessary to get this level of insight. Much respect to you. Edit: typo correction

[@ulyaoth3579]

I was thinking that the Roundtable hold was a hollow inside the Erdtree.

[@radagast7200]

It's the land between the lands between.

[@lordlossize]

7:30 except it still looks burned after the flame of frenzy burns the erdtree.

[@mickMahaus32]

i didnt watch the thing yet but my guess is that the roundtable, like farum azula, is in another timeline dimension

[@bronsonmcleod1449]

That Dark Souls music always hits

[@muramasa870]

This manifestation type beat of elden ring makes me go goblin mode

[@SevenPr1me]

Idk why I keep forgetting the significance of Horrah Loux being the first tarnished

[@BarynDeSade]

Omg you're sponsored by Guild Wars? My favourite Mmorpg

[@tolkienist7905]

Marika saw her son Godwyn the Golden as the future of the order. Once he was murdered, i think she decided to break the Elden Ring out of despair and anger. Anger at the fingers/greater will being completely unable or unwilling to save him. The greater will then imprisoned her and seems to be syphoning off her very life force to feed the broken ring. She is clearly in a coma or asleep. I dont think she is planning anything. Hence her only ever at most being used as a means to create an ending, rather than being involved in one. I also see both Radigon's attempts to fix the ring and our fight with him as proof that he is now separated from her being and this is part of why they both resemble two parts of a broken whole.

[@NoSuchMachine]

"Young hollow, there are but two paths. Inherit the order of this world, or destroy it. But only a true monarch can make such a choice."

[@TheHateUGive1198]

We see her again in the frenzied flame ending

[@WeyounSix]

Getting Lee Mack to voice gideon was a great move

[@deebo3483]

I just noticed, Master Hewg's Anvil is shaped like Mjolnir, Thor's Hammer.

[@JuniYT]

I wonder if that’s why Gurrag or malikeith isn’t satisfied after you gather “all” the eyes because Melina still has that one

[@adamblue2980]

Also I know this is somewhat tangential but is it pretty agreed upon that the Golden Order is the sun? We have multiple in-game representations of cosmic bodies; multiple moons, the stars, meteorites, so the sun playing a role fits. We know the Elden Beast arrived on a golden star, and thence came the Elden ring, which in its native form is golden glowing circles (runes). And the Erdtree, a seemingly symbiotic golden outer layer on the original Great Tree, the primeval Crucible where all life was fused, likely reminiscent of Miquella's Haligtree. In terms of maintaining immediate (in cosmic scale) influence, it would make sense to establish your network on basically a huge tall antenna with incredible surface area, that could then extend out across a vast network, on a clear high plateau (the root altus meaning high ie altitude). We even see how the fingers operate like antennae. Goldmask's titular mask looks very much like a golden sun, as does his mending rune of perfect order. And with the Elden Ring having been shattered and the Erdtree obviously way past its prime and probably in a slow inevitable decline it explains why the sun is typically so faint and small. The Golden Order may have abandoned the Lands Between, or it may have reached a point where it could simply no longer maintain its connection, especially with the fingers rotting and dying. It would also kind of help explain the eclipse of Castle Sol and the mausoleum knights in that of course they would want to dim the sun as the masters they served were sacrificed by the Golden Order. And perhaps blocking the sun would put a pause on the Order's fucked up hold on death.

[@ViroVV]

Its a cool theory. Personally I am in a holding pattern. Just waiting for the DLC because trying to piece together the puzzle now without the crucial pieces that content will provide is just an exercise in madness.

[@Trakesh]

Sorry, but the theme of every FromSoft Souls game is that "Immortality/stagnation bad. Things need to die so new things can be born"