The Shocking Cost of Raising a Roman Legion Revealed

[@Gandalf-The-Green]

Great, just when I actually managed to not think about the Roman Empire for a whole day, this video drops.

[@talamioros]

what unnatural heresy is this about not thinking about the Empire

[@ayuwoki453]

Why would you try to NOT think about Rome for a WHOLE DAY?!?! Outrageous!

[@bonsai3547]

i met this guy from finland, he was in america once and told: "the difference between europe and america is, there are all this castles and roman things and old things" (sorry no engl speaker) ... i live "auf dem Römer" too. And i think about romanthings a lot too.

[@mursaldayib6624]

" A man could only consider himself truly rich when his annual income could raise and maintain a Roman legion." Marcus Licinius Crassus

[@bobs_toys]

"Just the one?" - Augustus

[@bobs_toys]

Or is that more an Octavianus thing?

[@giulioluzzardi7632]

....and every dictator since then. BTW ,if you can't afford to keep a private Legion then just borrow the money and then have the loanshark "Topped" for charging excessive interest rates..and to a fellow citizen too.

[@Trump2024asw]

That's the dream or around the sane number of dude's.

[@DanDog91]

@@bobs_toys No, Crassus was the richest aristocrat in the Empire during his time. He paid for his own army to pursue the army of Spartacus - which several previous Roman armies had failed to accomplish.

[@CrimsonGuard1992]

The fact that Crassus was able to pay for raising two additional legions during the Third Servile Revolt out of his own pocket, really says how rich the guy was.

[@proper9095]

Right

[@captainamerica6525]

Never thought of it that way. You can bet he didn't go broke doing it either.

[@mikedangerdoes]

Interestingly Crassus' wealth is a little over-exaggerated. He certainly was wealthy, but don't forget that Pompey was also fielding personal armies at the same time, and in larger numbers. Pompey and Caesar also both ruthlessly extracted wealth during campaigns. Pompey's conquest of the East probably put him on a different level entirely, but Crassus got an unfair reputation for greed because he used money-lending and connections with the publicani (tax-farmers) to apply social pressure to his peers.

[@toniwilson6210]

Rich yes. Great at fielding those legions? No. Not at all.

[@mikedangerdoes]

@@toniwilson6210 That's Caesarian/Augustan slander and I won't stand for it! Crassus was more than capable in the field. Hero of the Colline Gate and smashed Spartacus. He had one really bad day and no one forgot it.

[@Mareczekw30]

Logistic is what makes army truly unbeatable. You are my favorite channel about Romam Empire

[@watarimono17]

This and the Goddess called Disciplina. Oh, and the skill to build advanced stuff as well.

[@micahistory]

logistics truly is rarely discussed in military history because it's not cool and flashy but is what makes armies work or fail

[@jonathanallard2128]

It's boring af. But that doesn't make logistics any less crucial.

[@yoeyyoey8937]

Logistics is what won ww2, and the reason why the Germans were able to fight the whole world to begin with

[@johndoe5432]

Yep, no great general would ever succeed in any sweeping strategy without incredibly intelligent and hardworking logistical administrators.

[@Itsme-ov2ts]

Imagine going through all that effort to have a standing army to protect the empire just for them to all kill each other during a civil war

[@shastasilverchairsg]

What would be the alternative? No army? Rely on mercenaries?

[@MM22966]

It was always a danger. One of the great unsung miracles of America is that its military has been well-out of politics through its whole history.

[@neekogonzalez7096]

😂

[@game_boyd1644]

Really puts into perspective just how disastrous those civil wars were. Lesser empires wouldn't have survived the crisis of the 3rd century.

[@YY-mk4ti]

This is the best channel to imagine the big picture of not just ancient warfare but also their daily lives. No wonder Augustus cried when 3 of his Legion got absolutely decimated in Teutoburg Forest...

[@SirThaHerpderpderp]

Well... not exactly decimated..

[@InfernosReaper]

​@@SirThaHerpderpderp Yeah, it bugs me too how that term gets use so incorrectly that it's basically being used for the opposite of what it means

[@steemlenn8797]

@@InfernosReaper That is just what happens to words over time. Just look at how "epic" is used as "very good" now instead of "really long heroic tale".

[@YY-mk4ti]

@@InfernosReaper What's the meaning of "decimated" in your world?

[@InfernosReaper]

@@YY-mk4ti The original "execution of 10% as punishment" though the "loss of 10%" to make it a more general term is fair Using it for significant losses is a bridge too far

[@legionarybooks13]

"Amateurs talk strategy, professionals talk logistics." - General Omar Bradley Of course, Julius Caesar, Vespasian, Trajan, and every Roman legate with a shred of competence was following this advice 2,000 years before Bradley stated it so well.

[@davidhughes8357]

I know that I have said this many times but after over 50 years of studying Roman military history your channel is unique and unmatched for these levels of detail. Absolutely essential !! THANK YOU . Also looking forward to the final installment of Trajan's Dacian war!!

[@Federalregent]

What sources did you use to study? I'm extremely curious to learn instead of being stuck to KZbin, which is meant to be entertainment rather than pure studying.

[@davidhughes8357]

Hello friend. It started for me in 1956 with a copy of a so called comic book at the time (Anything but). CEASER'S CONQUESTS From Classics Illistrated. From there I searched for anything available on the subject . Still at it every day. Thank you for your interest in a wonderful historical subject.

[@davidhughes8357]

There is alot of information out there. Research research research!!

[@davidhughes8357]

KZbin provides some very good visualizations of historical events!!

[@Nobody77246]

Efficiency is Rome's biggest advantage against their enemies. While an army tens of thousand strong would require years to muster for most, Rome can raise it in half a year, fully kitted and sufficiently trained. That crazy efficiency alone, made them dominated the ancient world.

[@MrBubblecake]

The hard part is feeding your army as it grows bigger, especially if it’s an army on the move Rome won a lot of wars just based on having more grain and legionaries were taught how to cook their own food and make their own bread.

[@The_Oldguy]

Like the Romans, the US Army uses a TO&E (Table of Organization and Equipment) that controlled man power (how many, MOS, Ranks, Rotations), equipment (how many beds, tents, chairs, tables, filing cabinets, computers, trucks. arms, etc), rations (How many calories, food stocks, storage, kitchens, etc.). These TO&E's were set for Company level, BN, Level BGE, Division Level, Army Level. As a C&A (Classification and Assessment Specialist) back in the 60's, I was glad I was only responsible for the Command Personnel and not all that other stuff. A lot of what modern military do now was all based on the Romans. They were impressive!

[@martijnvanderzee5215]

These numbers are absolutely mind boggling, the Roman army really is a wonder of the ages. Of course, other empires/states also needed logistics to field an army, but the romans fine tuned everything. And could the Romans have achieved as much with a levy army? Well I say we need only look at the gradual and sudden changes around the time of Marius when he fought against the Boii et al and before against Numidians. It was getting necessary to professionalize the army. Great video again!

[@Intranetusa]

Republican Rome was able to field huge armies of conscripted milita for a long time. Marius himself only commanded milita armies that disbanded after a few years. Full professionalization with volunteering professionals that we think of didn't really occur until the early imperial era, and even then, conscription and militas were often used. Even during Trajan's Wars, Trajan would write to other Romans talking about how part of his army were composed of conscripts and people who were paid to substitute people's conscription call.

[@huw3945]

“Things you wouldn’t immediately consider….food” Going to be honest guys, that was literally the first thing I would consider, I was expecting soap or something and honestly now I need to go find the stats on soap use rate and work it out for a Roman legion

[@MM22966]

No soap. You get strigil, a sponge, and a jug of 3rd-rate olive oil. Have fun.

[@CptZhu]

Tysm for making these videos They are a blessing to watch while enjoying my food

[@Halfdanr_H]

This is a great video. I wish this kind of information was taught to me as a child.

[@giulioluzzardi7632]

Have you considered that 99% of historical fact has been hidden or edited for public consumption , we may get ideas above our station in life. The license to "re-write" World history has already been granted by the ones who will benefit from it the most.

[@John_Pace]

Roman Legionaries were also paid in other stuff. The classic being SALT from which we get the modern word Salary (as used in this excellent video).

[@fierylightning3422]

this was likely paid earlier on in roman history

[@littlekong7685]

@@fierylightning3422 Yes. I think they could still trade coin salary for goods with the logistics master, so you might get 100 dinarii, or 60 dinarii and 40 value in meat. But most pay was coin (hence the truly massive discoveries of lost Roman salary shipments for mere garrison units), because it made the logistics simpler.

[@aetius7139]

No they did not. Many historian debunked that early roman army was paid in salt. The origin of the word "salary" comes from latin word "salarium". Which either means "an allowance or stipend given to soldiers to buy salt". Or "a meal consisting salt" which means its stipent for buying daily meal. Because roman soldiers had to pay everthing from armour, condiments, wine, clothing, food, and even their own funeral using their own money.

[@InfernosReaper]

@@aetius7139 Yeah, plus salt as a currency is a bit weird because that means that all soldiers have to try to pay for things with that or exchange it for usable currency when the local black smith or whoever has already made more salt than they can use. As much as a lot of people in the modern age hate currency, it's a lot better than having to recreate that Star Trek DS9 episode where that one character had several trade deals going on at once just to get the 1 thing he actually needed

[@TokioExpress]

I did some quick math, when it was stated that the entire Roman Army's annual salary was 290 tons of silver. I put in 295 tons at current spot price per ounce as of 0845am, 8/1/2024 ($29.32) would mean that the entire army costed $305 million USD.

[@SirWolf123]

Is the solution to military overspending reviving the Roman Empire?

[@Jiggleton]

Thats the USMCs artillery budget for a quarter

[@WagesOfDestruction]

If this was half the Roman government revenue, the total Roman government revenue would have been about $600 million USD.

[@MM22966]

Yeah, but that is straight figures, not price point parity/inflation adjustment. The equivalent of less than a dollar back then would feed somebody for a day. I can't do the math, but I suspect 295 tons of silver was about even with a modern superpower's budget. (adjusted)

[@DysfunctionNoMore]

Remember, that's just the salaries. There are many other costs covered in this video

[@geraltgrey-mane695]

This is amazing!❤ love this kind of stuff, so cool to get a small insite into this stuff. Which creates more understanding for other tophics. Such as why medieval armies were so small. Compared with other armies, from the romans or the greeks etc etc

[@Cusifaii]

I would imagine the horses and mules, oxes or w.e they used to move loads didn´t just eat grain, but grazed most (if not all) of their energy consumption. In some situations grain for the animals would be needed, for sure, but grazing (at least in europe) was an available resource. It´s interesting to wonder how availability of grazing grounds affected logistics and legion capabilities. bAlso forraging by the legion needs to be factored into the equation to some degree.

[@VTnewcastle14]

if they were on the march, that may very well be true... but just imagine how much shear acreage thousands of horses/mules/etc could clear in a day. even if sufficient land existed, each day the remaining grazable land gets further and further away..

[@romaliop]

@@VTnewcastle14 A stationary legion does not need the pack animals, though. They just need some to be available if they need to leave camp. I would think that local economy would quite naturally develop around the legions to take advantage of the opportunities.

[@littlekong7685]

@@romaliop Legions stopped frequently during campaigns due to the seasons, one could easily stay for several months in one area before marching on again. During that time the pack animals would need to be kept close so as to avoid enemy sabotage as well as to keep them ready for action if they needed to march sooner than expected. This is probably when the legion would call for feed from the local area.

[@wedgeantilles8575]

@@romaliop Correct, we have several reports how quickly a local economy developed when a more permanant roman base was established. Which isn't surprising of course - because even though a lot of modern people believe our ancestors were stupid, they were not. A few thousand man that were stationed at a location is a nice opportunity to sell them stuff. A few thousand man from the roman army was an amazing opportunity. Because they got paid regularly -> they had money to spend on things. With a premium on wine, more fancy food stuff and whores.

[@PainRack]

For cavalry? No. Horses fed on grass were less effective since less energy gained, more expended foraged. We have Roman records about how much feed was allocated to cavalry. Part of what made Roman armies more effective than the "barbarian" armies of the north was their centralised supply lines, which made the legion more effective on campaign, able to mount year long sieves and reduced need for foraging (no ancient army functioned without foraging). Legions definitely would had grazed their mules and horses if needed, but again, we have the records to say the Romans wanted grain.

[@shortscreator7981]

Again mind blowing video!! Great script and great editing style that explains everything Good job❤❤❤❤

[@HistoriaMilitum]

Thank you so much!

[@beautanner8409]

I love this stuff, you guys really hit the bullseye of awesomeness with this one!

[@jonbaxter2254]

Your Roman logistic videos give me life.

[@Pentagathusosaurus]

On top of the sheer quantity of grain required it's even more incredible when you consider that the grain actually has to get to the legion. Before the invention of railways this was the absolute limiting factor to army size, because everything that could transport grain overland also had to eat grain (pack animals, draught animals or just people) so you couldn't just keep an army fed using wagon trains - iirc something like ten days supply is the maximum an army could expect to march with when not supplied by sea (ships can carry more grain with fewer people to eat it). This is why foraging is so important for pre-modern armies, roman soldiers actually carried sickles and heavy duty tools for threshing and grinding grain when marching. Just marching a legion into enemy territory could absolutely devestate the local population as the army would send out foraging parties who would either harvest the grain in the fields or steal it from local storage supplies. And even an allied territory could be effectively punished by having a "friendly" army camping in their territory due to the difficulty in keeping them fed. Brett Deveraux's blog (a collection of unmitigated pedantry) goes into a ton of detail on these kinds of logistics, and also into the sheer scale of destruction and deveststion pre-modern armies could cause just by existing.

[@steveaustin2686]

13:18 is why I almost always play Rome in Civilization. I regularly have Legions building roads that the tanks and mechanized infantry are using to attack some other civilization. :)

[@xdragonhaterx4579]

I'd love to see a video focused on the different kinds of levy militaries you mentioned at the end of the video, as well as other kinds of militaries around the world, and their comparison.

[@istoppedcaring6209]

any great power in history was so mainly due to an edge in logistics the mongols lived of the land and their horses and famously did not require roads as other armies did for supplies (but this did facilitate their later defeats in europe as they couldn't do that effectively if the lands were stripped bare the moment word of them came and the food was stored in hundreds of castles instead of besieging a huge city whilst holding sway over the surounding farmland the Romans built out insane logistical systems that ensured their militairy remained supplied even in the worst conditions, others who tried to copy their militairy failed to take this aspect into account. (the mediteranean did make logistics much easier than would otherwise have been the case. the Americans today won their wars more trough economic power and most importantly the ability to provide their soldiers with even a thanksgiving roast just on principle. they were fully motorised whilst the Germans were forced to rely on horses at that point. logistics are everything in war, it is why massive cities are possible and also why they may prove disastrous when actually put under siege.

[@iangarrett741]

Apart from recruiting spare agricultural workers the army offered land or pension to long service survivors. You could pick up a trade, get promoted. For officers, if you wanted a political career or notice you had to put in some hard time. Apart from army oriented senators you also got officers with an incentive to be professional.

[@arashp85]

What I find more impressive is not how the standing Roman army of the precipitate supplied all of this to its legions but how the temporary legions of the republic did exactly the same without having a fixed bureaucracy!

[@Comicsluvr]

As a writer, I love channels like this. I can tell when someone writes a story that handwaves the little details like logistics.

[@juicebox7373]

This is great love the detail ! More please

[@Dvadtsat]

The legions would also forage for food while in fort. So it wouldn’t be 100% reliant on their supply from Roman territories.

[@PainRack]

We.... Not sure. Our records from Egypt shows they don't. But Egypt IS the breadbasket and the most luxurious of the Roman legion posting.

[@vaskil99]

Fantastic work as usual, this really helps with the visualization of how large a Roman Legion was.

[@omletdude]

Thank you youtube,for recomending this channel

[@Cecil_Augus]

Such a gem. Subscribed.

[@ClipsOfVTubers]

Your videos are so fascinating. Please never stop dude, you’re my favourite youtuber

[@fakshen1973]

Having a standing army that's conditioned and practiced, puts you leagues ahead of anyone using a militia/draftee style of military. They are capable of covering longer distances, pulling off more complicated maneuvers, and less likely to break if things are tough going over the short or long term.

[@micahistory]

Wow this is super interesting, really makes me respect all the people who worked to make this happen

[@jankramolis8658]

I love videos like this. Incredible job!

[@svon1]

and you still forgot the food for the Mules of each Contubernium and Waste/rot/decay that will destroy a few hides on top :D

[@JB17521or]

Very interesting video! At the end, when you said that we have yet to cover the most important aspect, i thought of men, not armor. I would find it extremely fascinating to have a video or part of one, covering that matter. Keep up the great work! see you in the next one

[@iain-duncan]

This is a great video, though in the monetary sections its worth remembering that soldiers wages were paid AFTER all of their expenses were taken out. Many soldiers spent their money as fast as they made it

[@Timmeh010]

About the metal for the money: most of their salary went to their equipment which was on loan so may be only a tenth had to be paid in actual to the soldiers

[@kurokaiman6198]

i dont know why logistics makes me so happy

[@keerf255]

Since you mentioned the large scale standing armies not appearing after Rome's passing until the 17th century, can you do a video on the first proper successor state to the Roman paid soldier model: the Dutch Republic. Their logistics were absolutely insane aswell. The Dutch's "Staatse Leger" maintained a standing army that equalled in number to the French, and under reforms initiated by William of Orange (commonly attributed only to Maurice of Orange) inspired by works such as Machiavelli's art of war and French mercenary management practices the Dutch republic with a total population of about 2 million managed to keep a massive navy of tens of thousands of armed trade vessels and an army that rose in number to about 100 thousand.

[@robstone9628]

Thank you for what you do, this is very unique Rome content.

[@StrateGems]

Great Video. We will use some of the numbers in our coming video on the complete history of society, geography, economy and logistics. Of course with mention in the description. Have a great weekend.

[@Crimson_Hawk_01]

Great video, thank you!

[@Conclusius68]

The Romans used levy armies for centuries, before the Marian reforms. But when the empire became larger and larger, it became unsustainable to garrison thousands of soldiers (who were farmers) in provinces out of Italy. They were needed at home. The alternative solution could have been to levy local farmers in the provinces, but they could be unreliable. No doubt the Romans tried all kinds of things and found out the hard way that a core of professional legions, augmented by mercenaries and local allies, worked best.

[@linming5610]

No, Augustus favored professionalizing and centralizing the legions to prevent generals from raising their own troops like what happened before the founding of the empire. Oh, also for logistical reasons and retaining combat effectiveness too. Contrary to popular belief, marian reform didn't really happened and Caesar and every roomaan generals of the time were still using levies during the Civil War. But they are now semi professionals because instead of being raised every slack season, they served a period of several years. This is brought by Rome's rapid expansion and lack of personnel during or some time after the 2nd punic war. They need to extend the years of service to help retain soldiers and to act as a garrison to defend their conquest.

[@whitewolfO1]

The logistics of silver pay and the weight of larger brass or bronze coins that may have replaced it could explain the prominence of limes or fouree denarii. These are denarii that are copper or bronze with a silver coating. They're pretty common to this date and most of them don't look like poor counterfeits. A lot of numismatists think they were used to pay soldiers on the frontiers for logistical reasons.

[@ranchopatriot]

I love this stuff.

[@asgardplays7139]

Absolutely great video! Thank you 👍✔👌!!!

[@eliech7112]

Great video thank you

[@dennisjones0081]

Dude - fellow Roman Warriors - I love these man - keep them coming.

[@garydouglas9413]

Make a video about the Roman Army medical system to include its hospitals.

[@suissemhabite.2098]

Now, I want to know about the roman navy logistics...

[@SkyFly19853]

excellent video. truly useful for my video game development.

[@limhan3209]

What game ?

[@cretucristian7935]

The Roman Army never cease to amaze me, so complex, so professional. I don't think there are any equals in history until Napoleon's army (maybe Chinese imperial army in certain periods)

[@WagesOfDestruction]

A comparison between the Chinese and Romans like this would be interesting.

[@desdicadoric]

This is mind boggling considering how long ago all this happened 😮

[@windchange8680]

amazing video

[@rigobertoarredondo254]

Some people may not believe it but in some ways the roman culture still alive in the western countries,greetings

[@darkclownKellen]

Ever heard of Russia?

[@deiongoldsmith515]

"Arrows, pilums, and gladius down fly without supply." - Some Roman POG

[@geolefleur4908]

yup this ones a banger

[@nordicmaelstrom4714]

You should have made note of what period the legions in question are in. The size of the legion was not uniform over the entire history of Rome. For example the legions in the early-mid Republic would have been about 4,200. The legions of that period also had to provide their own kit so the numbers would be vastly different than say the Imperial period. The Marian reformed legions of the late Republic would have had about the same but different troop types/equipment involved as well as the burden of cost placed upon the legion commander and the Senate. Outside of that gripe it was a very nice and informative video.

[@zerosusaku]

It should also be noted and this is a huge thing Rome never realy fielded 28 full strength Legions. Most Legions during the height of this where most of the time at half strenght at best.

[@nordicmaelstrom4714]

@@zerosusaku A very valid point. Especially in provinces like Britain for example the legions stationed there would spread their cohorts throughout the province. So no one particular area would suffer the burden of feeding whole legions.

[@zerosusaku]

@@nordicmaelstrom4714 Thats another thing. Legions where not only spread troughout the Province but overall so there was never realy a huge economic strain. There where just 2 Ocasions in Romes whole History where this many Legions where called together and this was during both Civil Wars with the Battles of Pharsalus and even there many Legions where at half strenght at best and this was during a short period. And again in Greece during the battle between Octavian/Antony and Brutus/Cassius during Philippi. Noteworthy here is that many of the Legions present where Veterans from the last Civil War who had not realy repleneshid their Numbers and where in even worse shape.

[@nordicmaelstrom4714]

@@zerosusaku This is all very true as well. Its an interesting topic but I believe the video was too generalizing and too broad of a stroke when the topic should have been broken down into sub periods.

[@jerryadamek3153]

Fantastic presentation bravo 👏 🏆

[@kellaway-1578]

Avsolutely mind vlowing what the romans were able to achieve

[@micgeinc6694]

Sun Tzu estimated that during campaigns in China the cost of delivery to a bag of grain to a soldier could be 3-5 times the value of the bag of grain itself. His advice was that if you estimate that you can feed 40 thousand men then training in small groups in local cities then you need only 10 thousand men so you will be able to march far away from their lands and not starve. (Of course a soldier would eat more than a farmer for added strength endurance and morale). He also estimated that 100 thousand men laying siege to a city, not moving for years was impossible to feed at any price.

[@Warmaker01]

Large empires could field these large standing armies, i.e. Roman Empire and Imperial China. A strong central government and bureaucracy, efficient tax collection with a generally well off population. The kingdoms of Medieval Europe were small, fractured remnants of what once was the ruins of the Roman Empire, now splintered apart. Even a medieval king's power was not absolute enough, i.e. Feudalism. The idea of a single "Royal Army" didn't exist for most of the the feudal period as the army was composed of the armies lords brought. The army wasn't even the king's. Meanwhile the Roman Senate told some kid named Publius Cornelius Scipio to go play in North Africa, made him Consul, gave him 30,000 men so that he could finally shut up and leave them alone.

[@Mr_Squiggle]

Britannia before the Roman invasion was said to have produced more grain 🌾 etc that modern Britain has only now exceeded with equipment and chemicals. It was severely affected by the invasion, deaths and slavery decimating the quantity of grain produced compared to before the invasion.

[@al_wombat]

This helps understand how the size of armed forces shrunk exponentially after the collapse of the Western Empire from the fifth century AD onwards.

[@seeingimages]

Yes, it was worth it for Rome to maintain a standing army. It is a pity that more of Rome's neighbors could not comprehend the value of living under a government capable of providing the level of peace, prosperity, and security that Rome's standing army offered. On the other hand, it was equally a pity that Roman diplomats were not more effective at persuading their neighbors of the value and advantages of adopting certain Roman cultural practices and institutions. The people of Germania did not begin to reap the benefits of true alphabetic literacy until Christian missionaries brought literacy with them in the Middle Ages. Runes have some limited rudimentary cultural application, but the fully developed writing systems of the medieval period offered greater flexibility and precision. Imagine if large numbers of the people of Germania had become literate in Latin and had begun to read the often careful and insightful descriptions of other cultures that the Romans produced! Imagine a couple dozen residents of Germania producing detailed descriptions of their own cultural, political, and social institutions from their own point of view and informed by their own insights into their own society and its history! So much less waste and destruction through warfare might have occurred. 😢

[@aidanhart9871]

These numbers should be taken with a grain of salt, especially the Roman shoes. Armies are much the same today as they were back then. Look after and repair your own stuff.

[@societyofrobots]

Just because a soldier was paid 200 denarii doesn't mean he was given 200 physical denarii. Romans had a banking system, and his payments were written on a ledger in his account. Many of his expenditures simply subtracted from that amount. No metal needed.

[@shaunkerr8721]

Just imagine how no one man could afford to put forth a modern "legion." 5,000 tropes, 10 tanks, three blackhawks, a medvac helicopter, artillery, medicine, housing, pay, etc. along with transport plane, etc. and probably at least some form of airforce and navy needs. No billionaire could afford to raise and maintain this force comfortably themselves.

[@H3llr4z0r]

Those numbers are boggling, especially for an ancient society

[@theliato3809]

its kinda insane thinking about all the livestock more than the grain needed. Similar to the amount of horses invovled in deployment during the world wars.

[@goobfilmcast4239]

Consider that the Roman Army, in it's various incarnations (and periodic setbacks), was the dominant military force in Europe, North Africa and the Middle East for over 500 years. That is proof of its value.

[@renaudcardinal-lamarche7604]

If you take into consideration corruption, non paid wages, non standard equipment and the recrutment problems, it is a lot harder to have a clear picture of the roman army which is often fantasized about today. But with these facts it is easier to understand why it was sometimes simpler for them to just pay mercenaries whom had training, equipement and sometimes war tactics which the roman legion was not proficient with.

[@Anders_Lund]

This is an insane level of logistics and the Romans managed to do this. And think about how much water they would need, both for the men and animals. I don't think they could have used a levy army due to sudden raids by barbarians, attacks by the Parthians and later Sassanids and the wast empire they controlled

[@Intranetusa]

The Romans actually fought their toughest opponents with a levied/conscripted milita army. The Roman army didn't really become a primarily professional volunteer force until the early empire. The Romans beat Carthage, Seleucids, Macedon, etc. with a milita army. Marius himself only commanded conscripted militas that disbanded after a few years.

[@Conquerthemall]

This was the true strength of the Roman’s Not the big numbers but a great logistical and administrative capabilities

[@anthonyhargis6855]

Alexander Hamilton pointed this out during the American Revolution. Great Britain "ruled the waves/world" because of its East India Company, a.k.a. its economy. Wars cost money. No money, no war: No Army, Navy, bullets, guns, knives, etc. and et al. Money wins wars. (That's not to say that the heroics of troops doesn't count)

[@b1laxson]

Troops need to be heroic only when logistics aren't overwhelming

[@Progamermove_2003]

Someone rightly said, "Amateurs speak tactics, professional speak logistics"

[@shuannlewis2216]

Yes absolutely, one of the biggest factor why Napoleon conquered half of Europe nearly whole

[@Progamermove_2003]

@@shuannlewis2216 And also the reason why Napoleon failed in Russia (more people died in summer than in winter).

[@charlesolinger9735]

Your forgetting one huge the factor. The money paid to soldiers were spent in places and on things owned most likely by the current consol at the time.

[@gustavchambert7072]

I would absolutely not call shield covers a "luxury". Not having them might be feasible for small groups of non-professional soldiers, but when dealing with logistics at the scale of the roman army they become vital. A quality scutum is a complex piece of craftsmanship that takes a lot of labour from skilled craftsmen and they likely require specialized materials. They are also heavy, bulky and a pain to transport. Goat skins also need to be processed, sure, but they are much, much easier to transport, and are also a byproduct of other parts of the supply chain. Using auch covers, which will also last for years if well maintained, is therefore a way of sacrificing a much less logistically complex item to maintain a complex one. Having them then isn't a luxury at all, nor even primarily a question of keeping equipment in ready condition but rather a question of being able to do so cost effectively. And trying to argue that tents aren't necessary because "not all armies used them" is honestly really dumb. Pretty much all even reasonably organised military forces of any significant size have had tents or equivalent mobile shelter, for the incredibly obvious reason that soldiers tend to die from exposure if left in the open, even in relatively clement weather. Sleeping rough is fine for a few nights in summer, but gets really detrimental to fighting ability really quickly beyond that. Only someone who's never really been outdoors would say something like that. It's like calling a supply and logistics system a "non-necessity" because some (usually local levies/militias) forces have done without. In short, I cannot consider a video making claims like this a serious discussion on the topic.

[@robowisanveithasung6022]

Yeah I’m not sure why he said tents were not useful, but don’t let this deter you from his other videos. They’re actually really good!

[@gustavchambert7072]

@@robowisanveithasung6022 I just can't bring myself to listen to a guy who can say things like (I'm paraphrasing because I can't be arsed listening to it again): "you might not have thought food and supplies are important to an army but" and "tents, basic survival gear, are actually luxury items an army doesn't really need". I don't think it's possible for a person with such a shallow understanding of a topic not to be equally catastrophically wrong about other, equally basic things, and I have no time for it. Especially when there ARE loads of serious channels out there doing the exact same thing but better.

[@robowisanveithasung6022]

@@gustavchambert7072 fair enough, but he does delve into some niche topics. I’m usually not too critical of KZbinrs that make grave mistakes like him

[@gustavchambert7072]

@@robowisanveithasung6022 yea, but when he makes mistakes as rudimentary as these, how can you trust anything else he says that you don't already know? I just don't have time for that.

[@robowisanveithasung6022]

@@gustavchambert7072 I totally get you

[@danyalullah5856]

0.8 tons per acre seems very high for ancient yields considering 0.2 tons would have been a good yield in the medieval period.

[@vadanadav]

Thanks

[@funnybaby27]

Misspelt shield covers at 4:10

[@EroticOnion23]

Ancient grains were more calorie/nutrient dense than your modern day frankenstein dwarf wheat, so perhaps the yield differences are offset somewhat 🤔

[@kenkleinsasser8165]

0:34 The cost of the food and precious metals to pay the troops are two things that people wouldn’t immediately consider? Huh?

[@hojoinhisarcher]

Telling how modern yields occur.

[@nicholaswimborne]

A legion would fueled the economy in the local area.

[@ryanaegis3544]

I once heard that the daily ration for a roman soldier was a loaf of bread and a half pound of romano cheese. Can any of you verify if this was ever the case?

[@williammiles5363]

The world needs peace 😢

[@billyteflon1322]

The Footwear is what got me. From a modern perspective. This is correct. Military boots will wear out quick and are expensive in a rocky environment. Tennis shoes will carry you through and a cheaper. The roman footwear was middle ground.

[@seanmarcum9753]

So since pay was deducted, was credit used to further save on shipping coinage to posts?

[@mattpascarelli8766]

I believe in some peace treaties rome demended hindreds of thousands of donkeys. I wonder if they used donkey skin more often than goat skin.

[@gundarvarr1024]

That horse fodder is not that much, horse also eat grass you know. Give them grain fodder only om occasions

[@corey2justified1]

How are you coming up with those numbers? Do you know an approximation of production numbers, or are you just saying one pair of shoes equals on cow hide?

[@russko118]

prato is still used in italian, meaning grass fiel

[@skepticalobserver2135]

Could you please cite your sources and perhaps a bibliography for this subject?

[@Luke-t8z8v]

Not taking into account that these soldiers were professional and thus would probably have their own gear that would be better than what could be provided.

[@robowisanveithasung6022]

Even after the Marian reforms soldiers had to purchase their own stuff