The SR-91 “Aurora”: The Plane that Doesn’t Exist…

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[@megaprojects9649]

Get Holzkern exclusive deals, visit www.holzkern.com/simon, and use the code SIMON for 15% OFF. Thank you Holzkern for sponsoring the video.

[@owenclark7210]

The Canadian company Konifer came out with all-wood watches many years ago. I have one of their pieces made with Zebrawood, and it's fantastic.

[@JakezMad]

I bought a holzkern ring a month ago and they sent the wrong design and size, don't bother with them ppl, go with a small local business

[@markplott4820]

Gibson - was CIA , his job was to MISINFORM . plain & simple.

[@kennethcohagen3539]

Look at how long the F117 was being tested and flown before it was made public. We. Ay not know what’s really going on until something happens that makes telling US about it necessary, or telling US to intimidate our enemies.

[@markplott4820]

@@kennethcohagen3539 - people thought the F117 was a ufo.

[@TheKennyMas]

The fact that the SR-71 flew for years in secret makes me believe this SR-91 exists in some shape or form

[@Britcarjunkie]

That, and the first F-117 flew circa 1977, but we didn't officially know about them until one crashed years later.

[@womble321]

The aviation press think it's the plane in the Tom cruise film. That way they can claim you saw the movie prop! The have done similar things before.

[@beardedxdeath]

​@@womble321china knows something to send a spy satellite 😂

[@joeyhoser]

Also, are we to assume the DoD hasn't even attempted to develop a spy plane since 1966? And they stopped using them entirely in 1998? I guess drones and satellites may make them unnecessary today, but there's a lot of time in between there.

[@dextermorgan1]

No we're not to assume that. Lockheed Martin started work on the sr-72 about 14 years ago. It was public knowledge for quite a while . Then it went dark. I watched a Sandbox news video about the sr-72 a few weeks ago and it is definitely a real thing ​@@joeyhoser

[@25jessieg]

Not sure if it's true or not, but when Kelly Johnson (SR-71 designer) died in 1990, people said he told them we would be blown away by the stuff we were working on, back in 1990.

[@snakezdewiggle6084]

@25jessieg "stuff"......

[@terrafirma5327]

@@snakezdewiggle6084"blown away" ...... Literally, I imagine.

[@Kilo-ct8dh]

KJ HAD to have been an alien.😂

[@snakezdewiggle6084]

@terrafirma5327 "Blown away", is this bombs and weapons, or enlightenment beyond our current imagination "stuff" is an unusual word for that level of professionalism . Its all too convenient.

[@Lebronny_-]

Yea probably I mean they are definitely a lot further ahead then what’s common knowledge or even publicly known otherwise every country would know their capabilities and what to focus their efforts are

[@theorfander]

I’m sure it exists, I grew up near Edward’s Airforce Base and lived in neighborhoods with all kinds of people who worked at Skunkworks and it was kind of an open secret. We would hear the sonic booms all the time and joke “there goes the plane that doesn’t exist. Did you hear anything? I didn’t hear anything.”

[@Er19421]

The fact that Lockheed was so excited about the SR-72 becoming technically feasible in the early 2000’s makes me think the SR-91 was either a technology demonstrator or something similar.

[@randominternetguy]

It was

[@Gunni1972]

@@randominternetguyLockheed Martin can blow through 2.3 billions in a lunch break. Not a chance to BUILD a plane with such requirements on that budget.

[@cjcoleman3893]

​@@Gunni1972 You can't build a fleet on 2.3 billion but sure you can build a technology demonstrator

[@bix20thelabelent94]

Look up T.Townsend

[@nicholasklangos9704]

Of course they can with new hyper fluid dynamic 3D modeling it’s cheaper and faster to develop aircraft now!

[@shubinternet]

So, the one piece of evidence that I consider most telling is the KC-135Q tanker aircraft. They were dedicated to carrying JP-7 fuel for the SR-71. When they retired the SR-71, they did not retire the KC-135Q tankers. So, there was still something flying at that time which used JP-7. We don't know what it was, but that fuel is so hard to ignite and contains so much energy when it does ignite, that there's really only one use for it -- high supersonic or ultrasonic flight by aircraft like the SR-71. That's all I've got.

[@PiDsPagePrototypes]

Q variant only had it's payload tanks seperated from it's own fuel supply, they weren't retired, they were fitted with newer engines as the 135T. Seperate tanks does not mean it was only ever carrying JP-7, just that when it did carry other forms of fuel, it would not be able to share that with it's own engines. The JP-7 was developed for the U-2, so the 135Q could also have been refueling those, which are still in service also.

[@D.Ambrose]

@@PiDsPagePrototypesfair points. I don’t know anything about fuel beyond general knowledge, and definitely don’t know about specialized avionics for fuel delivery and stuff, but I imagine a different fuel requires a different system to safely store. Wouldn’t that mean something “certified” or whatever for JP7 be only able to run JP7 or would that be a sort of “all square are rectangles but not all rectangles are squares” sort of thing?

[@audiguy1978]

​@@PiDsPagePrototypes U-2s don't have aerial refueling capability, and aside from a short test in the early 1960's, they never have had that capability. They simply don't need it. With a full fuel load, the aircraft can fly for 14 hours, which is the max you would ever want an aircrew trying to fly that jet.

[@PiDsPagePrototypes]

@@D.Ambrose The pumping hardware and tanks are all the same, some of the lining materials can be different for different fuels. But in the case of these tankers, it's more a matter of not feeding the wrong fuel in to it's own engines, whereas if the tanker and the jet getting topped up use the same fuel, it can be pumped between tanks, giving the tanker more range, or letting it pass it's own fuel to the refueling system to fill more fighters on shorter tanker flights.

[@stanislavczebinski994]

@@PiDsPagePrototypes Does the U-2 run JP-7? AFAIK (and according to German Wiki) - only the Pratt & Whitney J58 used in SR-71 ran on JP-7. Which makes sense to me as it was famous for leaking fuel like crazy whilst standing on the ground. Therefore, SR-71 wouldn't be possible to built without the invention of JP-7.

[@Late2theShowagain]

I knew a retired SR71 pilot in the 1990's (now deceased) and he would not give up any information about the Blackbird except what was already known. He did mention that the U.S. government was working on a replacement for decades while the Blackbird was still flying and they are always researching the "next aircraft" to replace the newest ones. eg: when the F22 first went into production, they were already drawing up it's replacement. They think of future generations of aircraft while they are still developing current ones. The 1 thing he did tell me was that ramjet and scramjet technologies are no secret and have been in development for a very long time as well as pulse detonation to conserve fuel once you reach the momentum of hypersonic flight at altitude. I assume he probably meant well over 100,000 feet where the atmosphere is much thinner. You are correct that a spy plane will always be in the U.S. inventory because they can be used in a pinch and being at a lower altitude than a satellite, their photos are a much higher resolution.

[@chunkblaster]

F22 replacement will be based on the research from the X36, testing for it was HIGHLY successful and exceeded all expectations and yet no direct production version was ever produced from it (that we know of)

[@BezBog]

For the Aurora to NOT exist, it means that aeronatical engineers must have sat on their hands for the past 50+ years...

[@Gunni1972]

No, they gave us the F-22, and F-35 The latter is still in development,(sorry, meant to say "adding capabilities") technically. And the F-22 will reenter development, To become "MegaRaptor II", with better avionics, radar, stealth, and more room for payload/Drone remote control.

[@imcustomized]

Not really. It just means they've been doing other things.

[@Real28]

​@@Gunni1972 would you intercept me?

[@wa1ufo]

Yes, and we know they didn't do that!

[@MS-ii1sv]

Unless there's some kind of diminishing returns in terms of aircraft performance.

[@gregsnewyt]

I was an en route air traffic controller in the southwestern US from 1980 on. I worked the F-117 aircraft in early testing and later training missions for deployment in the Middle East. I worked SR-71s weekly. U-2 aircraft as well. Our radar equipment and associated automated beacon interpreters were capable of accurately determining the speed of beacon tracked aircraft under positive control. I can say the top speed of of SR-71 aircraft I worked was greater than any published speed today. On one shift I noticed an strange untracked primary radar signal (actual radar skin reflection vs. beacon interrogator system typically used by all aircraft including the military. It caught my eye on the radar scope as it had quickly transited the airspace I was controlling, at roughly 2-4x the speed of the SR-71. I thought it was probably an equipment anomaly but noted the course of the target would place it over northern Arizona just south of the Mojave military aircraft testing area the F-117s operated out of with the track projected to continue east near Albuquerque and on to Amarillo, Texas. On break shortly afterwards I was outside the facility when I noticed a strange west-east contrail that had puffy blobs at regular intervals. This was the expected “soap on a rope” contrail of a scramjet engine. I have no doubt what I saw on radar and later, the associated contrail, was a hypersonic test aircraft using scramjet propulsion. Either the aircraft was only a test bed and never fully developed for deployment, or it has been highly successful and remains classified. Probably the former. So many stories about working he F117 before it was declassified and the problems it created for air traffic control due to very unusually performance characteristics as well. And yes, in the USA, all aircraft operating above 18,000msl are under civilian air traffic control.

[@JTwelks32]

No one carea

[@siroliver5434]

Pulse Detonation Wave Engine?

[@chugs1984]

The research I've read indicates that hypersonic speeds greater the Mach 5 result in a plasma field which is generally really difficult to send or receive RF. Not to mention IRST pods, like AN/AAS-42 IRST would be absolutely useless at those speeds So considering a hypersonic aircraft faster then the SR-71 would be blind, be it in optical l, infrared and Radio frequencies it would seem that it's utility was pretty questionable. Especially when the price of a single aurora (seeing they were $1-2b a piece) would get you a KH-11 with a resolution of less then 20cm. The other problem is if what your saying is true ie a SR-71 was in itself hitting Mach 4 to 5, meaning an Aurora would need to be at least Mach 6-8, that there would be no way for the Russians or Chinese to distinguish an Aurora overflight as either a decapitation strike or reconnaissance flight. Meaning the possibility of nuclear retaliation So with the platform blind, requiring billions to create a way to punch through the plasma (which we still struggle with 30 years later) with there being no weapon that it could possible yield that could give it a benefit that conventional and strategic platforms were already capable of at far lower costs (ie TLAM, Trident, Minutemen III, ATACMs etc it seemed to be a pointless project. The final reason to have a manned hypersonic vehicle evaporated the moment the USSR collapsed negating the need for a SR-71 follow on. Like so many early 90s wonderwaffens, the Comanche, A-12, NASP, the SR-91 was cancelled when it was realised that Russia could barely string a division or two together let alone an entire army group. I mean look at them struggle in a conflict that is comparable to if Canada and Mexico merged and the US lost almost 400,000 men and 3/4 of their entire armed ground forces only to capture less then 10% of the part of Canada you'd want.

[@extraordinarytv5451]

Perhaps an X-15

[@Sdhrjeiwb]

They literally designed it to not be detected if it does exist there is zero chance anything is picking it up

[@Paladin1873]

In the late 1980s I was a USAF officer assisting the Saudi Air Force with the development and fielding of a state-of-the-art air defense system for the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. It was called PEACE SHIELD. The lead contractor was Boeing, and Hughes was a primary subcontractor. The program was so massive and technologically advanced that we had quite a few contractors (beltway bandits) acting as advisors to support us. Most of them were former or retired Air Force radar operators and air combat controllers. As was the custom on our many trips to Seattle to visit the Boeing facility in Kent, I was sitting in a hotel bar one evening with five of these former scope dopes I had gotten to know rather well. As the drinks flowed, each one tried to top the last one's story of Soviet bomber intercepts, remote deployments, and so forth. Eventually the topic of Aurora came up. Each man had his opinion regarding whether or not it was real, but one guy in particular told a strange and convincing story. He was manning his air defense console and tracking the usual air traffic. Each aircraft was represented on his screen as short smear lines. The longer the line, the greater the relative speed of the plane. Suddenly a track appeared out of nowhere and it was far longer than any he had ever seen, including the vaunted SR-71. He immediately reported it and waited for confirmation and further instructions. When the reply came back, it was an order to ignore the track. He was told nothing more and never learned anything beyond what he said to us, but he believed it might have been the mysterious Aurora.

[@DavidEdwards9801]

My father and I were in his backyard some 30+ years ago and we both witnessed a jet with a doughnut shaped exhaust fly horizon to horizon in under 3 minutes.

[@moogle68]

@@DavidEdwards9801 What state were you in?

[@JakeSezz]

As a Navy guy, I can totally believe this story, especially with each person one upping each other 😂 It’s just something all service members do: gotta have them stories told. Plus, I think the point toward the end of the video here helps: sure there probably wasn’t a fleet, but to think there had to be one or two being tested.

[@johncorson6599]

Nothing would surprise me. I was a flight test engineer (turbine engines specialization) for 7 years and spent tons of time in Palmdale and Edwards (some time in Victorville as well) but as a civilian contractor for commercial aircraft (Seattle of course). I saw more specialized aircraft at Edwards in 1 day than most are likely to see over several of trying to see these things. I don’t know these plane types by sight but saw a stealth bomber with 4 engines towed by with 2 servicemen pushing carts to catch dripping fuel under each wing, there were 16 or so F16s parked nearby ready to deploy at any time, 3 F 22 taxied by, a F-35 taxied by and 3 B52s flew over us in a straight line one after another at low altitude (having just took off nearby) . All that in 1 day. Saw stuff at the Palmdale hangars that were bizarre but know nothing of them. Everyone in our flight test crews WANT to take a picture but only the stupid do as you’re finished if you do that .. there were some idiots on the crews like 1 guy was going to go camping on the weekend in the mountains and packed all his camping crap in his vehicle and tried to go to work that day at the Palmdale facility .. well he had a machete in his gear and security caught him .. myself and a coworker were headed in town to get some coffee after our plane had left and this guy was handcuffed sitting on a concrete barrier in the sun .. we came back a few hours later and he was still sitting on the concrete barrier hand cuffed in the sun … do stupid things, get stupid prizes like frying in the hot sun handcuffed and it was hot out there lol

[@Erikr-ex9dj]

Or a uap ?

[@johnlowe37]

I like to think that Aurora really existed (perhaps still exists, hidden away in an underground facility somewhere in the deserts of California or Nevada), and that Clarence "Kelly" Johnson played a part in its early stages of development. If there was anyone who could have made Aurora happen, it was Kelly Johnson, who led the teams that developed the P-80, U-2, F-104, and SR-71. It would have been the perfect final chapter in an illustrious career.

[@Chiller11]

Don’t forget the P38.

[@joshschneider9766]

Johnson was also responsible for mentoring basically every senior engineer who came after him company wide. Skunk works is actually a daughter company of lockheed now because of him

[@zaco-km3su]

They were developing something.

[@davefellhoelter1343]

I grew up and still live in the area of development. In the 70's or 80's? I studied this propulsion as a little kid with Pop science and mechanical engineering. I JUST WATCHED a con trail of perfect smoke rings, or doughnuts as the sun was lighting the upper atmosphere so high no sonic boom. totally different con trails and it goes away sooner.

[@thesenate1844]

Its likely no aliens at all exist in Area 51, but the place is kept under such secrecy because its home to planes like this.

[@P.Galore]

According to a senior Air Force officer, AURORA is not a plane. Aurora is a PROGRAM and a series of craft. In the early 2000's on Sunday mornings I would see contrails looking like a knotted rope, presumably originating from Edwards or Vandenberg AFB

[@Patson20]

That is probably it, we have a series of "technology demonstrator" aircraft that have been declassified lately. Some stealth, some near space, some hypersonic.......now combine all that into one plane and add the laser systems they've been developing. And you've got a near low orbit fighter that can get anywhere in the world fast. Could be useful to take out satellites without making a mess and nuclear weapons. Imagine a plane that could fly almost into space, hit a satellite with a laser so it's useless for its purpose but still controllable, and then come down to do whatever else you needed

[@outerrealm]

Oh, now with the contrails. That's proof positive isn't it?

[@Ryan-323]

You did your homework this was even disclosed on national television by the pilot that invented the program.

[@fishdude666ify]

My theory is that "the Aurora Project" was a program that had several craft come out of it, the TR-3B being the most advanced. Tangentially related: my freshman science teacher ('92) told us to keep our ears out for something called the Aurora Project in about 20 years (from then). That's all he said about it.

[@alternavent]

I absolutely saw the phenomenon one night while taking a walk on a friend’s ranch near Gorman California. The skies there were free from light pollution and we were already at 5k feet elevation. It was common to take nightly walks and this night I was alone. I was walking North and on my left I noticed a quickly growing trail with what looked like puff balls preceded by a flashing pulse of orange-ish light. It was moving from S to N and I reckon it was very high and must have been flying over the Pacific. Directly West of my location was Ventura, and to the East was the Mojave Desert where Edward’s AFB and the Skunkworks facility in Palmdale. I told my friend when I got back to the ranch house but no one believed me and by that time there was no evidence. I was in HS and still fairly young. Was probably 1994/95. I know what I saw and even though to this day no one believes me, I am convinced it was an experimental aircraft and I’ve never seen anything like it since. Honestly, it was pretty freaking awesome.

[@ChatGPT1111]

Probably just a rocket launch from Vandenberg, judging from your location and the time of day. I live near Kennedy in Florida and observe the same thing here.

[@DrewWithington]

Sorry to be mundane and boring but it was probably just a UFO from Area 51.

[@zkal11]

I choose to believe you.

[@user-qq9ir3vx5c]

@@ChatGPT1111 Rockets don't make light pulses. They make a steady light because their rocket is continuously burning. Many believe the mythic test aircraft used an external pulse detonation engine to travel at those speeds, since at the time, Scramjets were not working yet.

[@alanb443]

I was driving from Sacramento to Las Vegas in 2008 around Mina, Nevada on US95 about midday. Looking to the east I saw a plane transitioning from north to south making those donuts on a rope contrails and going faster than anything I've ever witnessed. It appeared and was beyond the horizon before I could even step on the brake and begin to slow down to pull over.

[@deanbauer9579]

If I remember correctly, the USAF retired the SR-71 (rather abruptly) right around the time the Aurora was supposed to have been developed. Then, a few years later, they put it back into service. Connecting those dots suggests that the Aurora was developed and flew but either proved an ultimate design failure or was too expensive, as Simon stated, to build an entire fleet of them.

[@mistermaster38]

if the sonic booms are correct thats most likely why it was canceled

[@bleachorange]

The mid 90s saw a defense spending drawdown in the US. I suspect why no one ever saw or heard of this project since then is it got the budget axe in a time of competing priorities in the Pentagon. They had just won the cold war, and digital satellite reconnaisance was a thing - who was going to fight for Aurora? The Air force had to fight for the F22, and the CIA didnt have enough leverage with the then-friendly relations with Russia. Who needed a spy plane when they were broke, let you into the country, and you had satellites anyways?

[@robinwells8879]

The SR71 was “cancelled” but returned briefly to undertake scheduled SALT style disarmament Treaty confirmation overflights of the USSR. I used to watch it depart, regular as clockwork, from Mildenhall on Thursday afternoons! 😂

[@garydarby2548]

SR 71 haven't flown in years.

[@JoshhGB]

​@@garydarby2548they still maintain a small fleet of them

[@LarryPhischman]

One of my professors in engineering school claimed to have worked on Aurora, and he certainly had the resume complete with an NDA gap. According to him, "Aurora" was a technology demonstrator and testbed for a number of new technologies that were expected to be used in 4th and 5th generation fighters, high altitude hypersonic bombers, and spy planes. And it proved to be a failure. My professor said that they only built and flew 2 Auroras with a partially constructed 3rd prototype sitting in a storage hangar at Wright-Patterson AFB in Ohio last time he checked in the early 90s. The planes were mostly off-the-shelf parts taken from other high speed high altitude aircraft, including the A-12 and SR-71. The only interesting components were a camera designed for hypersonic recon (which ultimately didn't work) and J-58 engines modified with an additional mode after the ram jet. In this third stage the j-58 engines served as the compressor and fuel mixer for an early pulse detonation engine, which produced the iconic contrails. The pulse detonation stage burned a mix of JP-1 and isoborane ("zip fuel") leftover from the "Boron Boom" and B-71 era of the 1950s. The USAF bought a few hundred thousand gallons of several isoboron fuel mixes before it was discovered that stuff can't be used safely in a turbine engine, so the development contract stipulated that Aurora and a few other black projects used it. If it was successful there were plans to restart isoborane fuel programs in the late 80s. According to my professor the Aurora quickly proved to be an impressive disappointment as while the cobbled together aircraft and the exotic new engines performed incredibly well, it proved that both hypersonic reconnaissance and bombing were impractical to impossible. The behavior of atmospheric gases around a hypersonic aircraft proved to be chaotic, and the technology to compensate for it is still decades away. Hypersonic reconnaissance with photos or electronic equipment didn't work because of the ionization of air around the aircraft. Air becomes superheated, glowing first red than blue, which also releases a storm of high energy electrons around the aircraft. The electrons in term release radio waves as they drop down to a ground state around normal atoms. Those radio waves blind electronic surveillance equipment and gave the Aurora a massive radar signature that "a blind operator could see in the dark". Essentially the same thing that happens when spacecraft reenter the atmosphere ("Blackout"). The camera couldn't see through the glowing gases or compensate for the ground speed. Hypersonic bombing proved to be a failure because of the turbulence experienced by a bomb decelerating from hypersonic velocities. A nuke could be dropped hundreds of miles away from the target with all the momentum to hit, but would do so with less accuracy than WW2 era strategic bombing. ICBMs proved more effective. My professor said that the Auroras did achieve the highest velocities of any manned jet plane ever, but they never actually conducted record setting flights. You have to meet certain mission requirements to set an official speed record (closed course, both directions, multiple agencies corrobating the event), and the secrecy of the program required they avoid attracting attention. The fate of the two Auroras was grim, unfortunately. They both exploded due to problems with the isoborane fuel. The first aircraft exploded over the Pacific Ocean somewhere between Hawaii and California during a "high speed research flight" (just flying the expensive things because they had the money and aircraft just sitting there) in 1989. They never found the wreckage. The second prototype exploded just after takeoff due to a likely fuel leak in 1990. The pilot, who was killed in the explosion along with the copilot/flight engineer, was the son of a "wealthy and well connected United State congressman" (my professor didn't actually know who, and regarded the pilot as what we now call a "nepo-baby"). The destruction of the second prototype also happened while a number of ranking military brass were present at the airfield to witness see the Aurora. After the second disaster the program was canceled. Test flights using smaller versions of the engines on unmanned drones were planned to continue in the mid to late 90s, but my professor left "the company" (presumably Lockheed-Martin) in 1992 and lost his security clearance accordingly. My professor regarded the Aurora project as a waste of time and money, and said he would have preferred to have worked on the F-22.

[@RallyRacingVideo]

Indeed interesting post, thanks for sharing! I would left a few questions to it if you don't mind: Were both of the Aurora prototypes the same design or wwre the different in terms of planforms and appearance/design? Were both of them fully manned birds with no autonomous option? I guess so, but it is always better to ask. What was the speed? I consider Mach 5 as a good guess as technology was there to develop it at the time. Were both of them operating out of Groom Lake or some other Nevada fields? Very interesting subject indeed!

[@Pushing_Pixels]

This is the most believable post about the subject. The contrails/exhaust shown are pretty obviously produced by some kind of pulsed engine, not a typical ramjet. The sounds described in the reported sightings confirm this. Everything you said about the difficulties of hypersonic reconnaissance and bombing is true, along with the stealth and communications problems. Whatever it was, it was too ahead of its time to be viable in the 90's.

[@DeepVIDesigns]

Your professor had an awful lot to say about potential super secret Gov’t projects…

[@chiefsilverback]

This sound entirely convincing, but just because your professor no long worked for "the company" and no longer had security clearance wouldn't give him carte blanche to talk openly about such a highly classified project. Also if he shared all of this with you then he presumably shared it with other people but it's never come to light before....

[@brunonikodemski2420]

​This is probably correct. Our company supplied certain types of guidance equipment to a project of this type. We supplied only "handful" of products, so this never went beyond a test platform, but it did go very very high, essentially a vacuum. One rumor was that one of the platforms was "destroyed" due to it having been backed into a power pole, during a night launch, causing major fire damage to parts of the airframe.

[@JamesSullivanCandiEyeStudio]

In the 90s, I was working as a sparky in New Malden for BAE systems. On the 9th floor, it was divided into sections, Project Aurora Flight systems etc etc. Didn't really pay any attention until one day I was sitting in the Tearoom eating a bacon sarnie and reading the paper. When I came across an article saying 'BAE systems deny all knowledge of project Aurora'

[@jonathanperel5332]

In the late 80s/early 90s techno-thriller author Tom Clancy would participate in public roundtable chats on GEnie (an early online service). In one of those chats, a user asked Tom about the cancellation of the SR-71 program. Tom recounted that his sources in the military had told him about “Aurora”, that it operated out of Groom Lake, and that it was Mach 4.5+ capable. Source is me. I asked him the question. Having Tom Clancy answer my question with such a cool answer is of my childhood geek out best memories. I wish there was an archive of the GEnie roundtables.

[@hyau512]

That would be consistent with the video's Ben Rich quote - as "hypersonic" is defined as Mach 5+ :)

[@Gunni1972]

Hanna-Barbera talked about Flying cars in the 60's The Jetsons, I would still want an engineer's expertise on that topic though. Not a novel-writer. I blame your childhood for maintaining that dream. Don't take it too harsh, i fell for many-a statement, in my youth too.

[@RohanAirsoft]

That’s awesome, you’re very fortunate to have talked with Tom. He had an enormous amount of inside information, god knows how he got it or how he was allowed to let it out.

[@Yvaelle]

@@RohanAirsoft Regarding 'letting it out', ideally you want the potential of your capabilities to be known to the enemy, as expressed in Dr. Strangelove, "What's the point of having a Doomsday Device if you didn't tell the world, eh!?". You don't want anyone to know the exact capabilities of your bleeding edge - because then they can potentially counter it - but you Do want their best analysts to be able to speculate that Something must exist in that ballpark: because then the rumour itself is an effective deterrent. For this purpose, I've always believed the Pentagon has relied on pseudo-military sci-fi and hollywood assets like Tom Clancy to imply the bleeding edge of their capabilities. As example, Top Gun 2 (Maverick) was practically an admission that Darkstar is real, especcially accompanied with Lockheed's press conference that refused to deny that it exists, while winking at the camera the whole time. Is it Mach 5, or Mach 10? Who knows. Is it stealth? Air refeulable? Suborbital? A drone shepherd? Nobody knows - but Something exists. And if our enemies are planning to start some shit, the insinuation may be enough to give them pause.

[@getnohappy]

It's basically a techno-cryptid

[@railgun517]

that's a great term

[@grigoryalexandrovitchpecho6934]

SR 91 WEEEEEEEDIGO

[@Gunni1972]

@tahwseodtiYeah, but apart from a little ion-thruster, that is not much more than an orbital glider. Yes it does multiple machs at reentry. But it's main thrust comes from the Launch rocket. It can't take off from a runway.

[@khulgarulfsson8067]

Fantastic term! Love it.

[@recoilrob324]

Back around 1990 there was talk about 'external combustion' aircraft that would use the supersonic shock cone to contain a fuel explosion behind the aircraft for propulsion. At P&W we worked on lots of 'Black' programs out in the General Shop as small bits and pieces normally wouldn't arouse any suspicions as to where they went or what they did....the only clue was that the work order # always began with an 'X'. I had a bank of small rocket nozzle looking things that needed some work and had just heard about the 'external combustion' theory and mentioned this to the engineer overseeing this piece...and me saying those words made the color drain quickly from his face and I ended up needing to go talk to Security about it. Was basically told to shut up, don't think and quit trying to figure out things....or else. OK!!! I'm dense but got the message. The 'external combustion' deal might very well be what caused the 'donuts on a rope' exhaust trail. And this is just the kind of experimental stuff that they do ALL the time...the 'what would happen if' guys that build and test and even when/if it doesn't turn out to be a feasible concept they get lots of data from it that will be useful elsewhere. We were working on SCRAM engines back in the 1990 time frame too among other neat things. Someday we might find out what was going on once the information is no longer relevant to contemporary machines.

[@AreUmygrandson]

My dad was in fuels for the Air Force 1970-1997. He was picked up by the DOD for about another 17 years and became fuels branch manager at NAS Corpus Christi. About 4-5 years ago we were at my parents house for the holidays and I was telling my brother how I saw a contrail that looked like donuts on a rope and my dad pops into the conversation to say “they don’t fly of Texas.” Got an Oh shit look on his face. He legitimately got a job offer for groom lake but choice German instead in the mid 70s.

[@makon2824]

I can say that, if this aircraft ever existed, it was already surpassed by the time news of its existence was leaked decades ago.

[@michaelpettersson4919]

Good optics on satellites for instance.

[@thomasblankinship98]

Wasn't leaked. The name Aurora appeared in a black budget paperwork.

[@Gunni1972]

@@thomasblankinship98 (Of the LA Times)?

[@JGDeRuvo]

The F14 Tomcat was named because Grumman, its creator, had a history of naming its fighters after cats.

[@solicitr666]

Wildcat, Hellcat, Tigercat, Bearcat, Panther, Cougar, Tiger and Tomcat

[@michaeldelaney7271]

And, after Admiral Thomas F. Connolly who fought against the Naval variant of the F-111/TFX.

[@davidelliott5843]

The Tomcat name was to be used on an earlier aircraft but it was considered too risqué

[@michaeldelaney7271]

Imagine a time in our history when something was "too risqué" ... those were the days. @@davidelliott5843

[@tfefire]

Their emergency vehicle side too. Like the Aerialcat fire truck among others.

[@JohDan6969]

I just want to point out, that the US has a helicopter that we only know about, because it crashed in the Bin Laden raid. This was in 2011, and we still don't know how it fully looks. Let that sink in.

[@PDXdjn]

Not shot down. Crash landed. Otherwise, agreed.

[@JohDan6969]

@@PDXdjn Yeah. You are right. My old man brain forgot the detail. I'm going to correct it. Thank you 😉

[@PDXdjn]

@@JohDan6969All good. I completely agree with your statement now.

[@GeeBeeMike]

The Aurora absolutely did exist. As an airborne security surveillance pilot under contract for the USAF many years ago, we eyeballed it one night on the ground from the air whilst on a security detail for the government and watched it briefly after it took-off. The back-seater took screendump photos of it through the FLIR system. There’s more to this story than I will ever publicly write about, but I can assure you, exist it certainly did. I’m just amazed it has never been made public knowledge even now, all these years later.

[@suspiciousstew1169]

That’s how you know this nation is in good hands, this story has made me incredibly patriotic knowing the US always has another trick up her sleeve

[@RallyRacingVideo]

What location you did see it?

[@DonVigaDeFierro]

If it hasn't been made public it's because there's info that may be dangerous if it ever falls on the wrong hands. What info? We may never know. Whose hands? It could be a superpower, or even a small cell of bad actors. There's plenty of information about how to fabricate nukes online, because not everybody has an uranium enrichment facility just lying around, or a rocket testing facility... Also nukes don't work for deterrence if they are kept a secret... But with the Aurora? The information is just too advantageous or too dangerous to even publicly disclose its existence... Or it may not even be real... I mean, anything's possible! It could be a smoke screen just like alien spaceships were back in the day...

[@Bob_Adkins]

Sounds very plausible, but I would have to get verification from Russia and China...

[@cultusdeus]

Good to know that a lot of info is air-tight.

[@dtaylor10chuckufarle]

“I don’t believe anything is true until the government denies it“ ~ Jim Marrs

[@joshwalrath9518]

I remember a story from a cadet from AFA who spent a summer turn at Edwards AFB. He was assisting a pilot in plotting a mission and the instructor seemingly took them through a restricted airspace. The cadet politely reminded that they were going through a restricted test range. The pilot looked at the cadet and said, "that airspace starts at 60,000 feet, and what lives up there goes very fast and very high and makes the SR-71 look like a biplane." This was in the early 90s and was likely a tall tale, but it was a fun story regardless.

[@p.a.reysen3185]

A neighbor, civillian DOD worker on A-51 for many years, over beer on the back porch in Pahrump. stated that if one thought of all the aircraft musuems in the world, would not equal the underground hanger space tunneled within the A-51. He related that every plane ever made around the world had residence within the underground hangar. Much like the F-117, there are planes and other type of craft, air and space capable, that are used to aquaint the engineers from the free world as to what had been created, how it worked, and what was expected in the future.

[@104thDIVTimberwolf]

"Large number of aircraft..." That, i think, is the key phrase. Even the Blackbird never numbered much more than a couple dozen. I remember some of the rumors that were going around when i was in the Air Force and I am reasonably certain that Aurora is very real. Satellites might be more efficient in a lot of ways, but it can take several days to maneuver a Keyhole to look at a given spot. The Blackbirds and Arcangels were the only way to fill in immediate gaps and I can't believe they would put Habu out to pasture without something better to replace it.

[@robertsmith4681]

I remember the article they had in Popular Mechanics about this, for a time I was utterly fascinated by this alleged hypersonic SR-71 replacement and it's distinctive "Donut on a rope" contrails.

[@Revenant-oq9ts]

Given Skunk Works' nature, it's more likely to have existed than not, at least as a prototype. Tech from it was probably adopted into other newer planes, if so.

[@Nefville]

About 10 years ago before I quit smoking I was outside puffing down a cigarette when I saw a passenger plane fly over. It left a normal contrail and in a minute or so the wind blew its contrail into the perfect, prototypical "donuts on a rope" contrail. I wish I had taken a picture of it and far be it for someone to believe a random stranger on the internet but I can 100% promise that those contrails can be made by normal passenger jet aircraft.

[@robertsmith4681]

@@Nefville Indeed they can, usually as the result of an engine malfunction like a compressor stall however, not as part of normal operation.

[@cactuspete1973]

I think I remember that article from Popular Mechanics

[@Cemi_Mhikku]

​@@cactuspete1973 Was way back in the '90s, wanna say 1998 or so. There was one with a whole slew of odd rumored black project aircraft, including a fucking dirigible. Sticks out in my memory 'cos my mother remembers actually seeing it. I was autismally chattering about the article the one day and after she voiced recognition, I of course had to find the issue again to show her.

[@richardcomerford1828]

I'm glad that the metric ton we spend on defense continues to give Simon good material for videos.

[@Justanotherconsumer]

Metric ton? Olympic size swimming pool, perhaps.

[@adriandaw3451]

If it's a metric ton then it's a tonne. And it's only 10% bigger than a ton, so not really a suitable expression of extreme largeness.

[@terrafirma5327]

@@adriandaw3451when its a metric ton of shit, I think then its useful.

[@recoil53]

What are our tax dollar for, if not for KZbin fodder? Don't forget various dams and other large construction projects.

[@Gunni1972]

@@Justanotherconsumer "Rumours-sized". Once you have to build a runway for such a plane, those 2.3 Billions are all but asphalt in the desert.

[@kevinmccarthy8746]

Like every thing the British do, they are real experts at air craft spotting. I absolutely have complete faith in his abilities. Thank you.

[@paulsengupta971]

From the underside, an F-117 looks similar to what was drawn. And it was observed that F-117s operated out of Machrahanish. But that doesn't explain the recordings taken from seismic recorders up the west coast of the UK which tracked a disturbance travelling at around mach 5.

[@littleblackcat2273]

Good thing it was a highly secrect train!

[@paulbarnett227]

Lockheed Martin Skunk Works gave a design to the Top Gun Maverick movie which was called DarkStar in the plot. What if this is the Aurora, and Lockheed Martin are trolling us? That would be funny. I suspect Aurora never got past the prototype stage but did fly a few times.

[@SA12String]

All I know is that we often heard the Aurora's signature pulsing "rumble" in Anaheim, Ca. and multiple sonic booms.

[@suspiciousstew1169]

@tahwseodtichill bro tf he did to you

[@topsecret1837]

@@suspiciousstew1169 It’s not what he’s doing to him; it’s what he’s not telling you and anyone else. That he never actually observed anything whatsoever.

[@Gunni1972]

Two planes going through Mach create 2 sonic booms. 4 planes going through Mach create 4 sonic booms. But a plane going through Mach 2 doesn't create another boom. Go figure.

[@rcisneros8567]

Wow. As someone who has studied everything I could get my hands on about the Aurora project, I'd like to say you nailed it. GREAT JOB! One thing I could add was the reports from LAX of aircraft traveling east at incredible speeds into the desert. The military did not inform or confirm which it routinely does for air safety.

[@billkipper3264]

The F-15 has an advertised ceiling of 65,000 feet. I was in an F-15 squadron based at Nellis AFB back in the early eighties that occasionally tried to do intercepts of SR-71's. "Tried" being the key word here. As the flighline dispatcher for a year or so it was my job to pick pilots up after missions and transport them back to ops. I got to be in on some interesting conversations. Several of these involved SR-71 intercepts. A couple of things that have always stayed with me was that the Blackbird was MUCH faster than advertised and that our aircraft were conducting these missions at 80,000 feet. So, it's untrue to say that only the U2 could fly at those altitudes.

[@suspiciousstew1169]

F-15 my beloved

[@anthonyjackson280]

English Electric (BAE) Lightnings from the 1960's could get to 60,000ft+

[@MrWillNeedham]

The peak altitude a plane can attain in a zoom climb is much higher than the ceiling it can reach in sustained flight.

[@jasonwooden]

I was camping on BLM land at Simpson Springs, UT- directly in-line, above, and about 14 miles from (11,000') runway 12 at Dugway Proving Grounds around 2008. Sitting around the campfire about 2 hours after sunset I heard an aircraft approach from the SE, nearly overhead, making a "waa-waa-waa" sound. The nav lights were turned off. The runway lights came on, and from the sound of the aircraft it landed, likely back-taxied and took off again. As it accelerated down the runway the unique sound of the aircraft grew in pitch and frequency "WAA-WAA-WA-WA-WA..." until it faded over the salt flats to the NE. Unforgettable.

[@sequoyah59]

I think there are more secrets at Dugway than Area 51.

[@joshschneider9766]

also RAF Mildenhall never left UK MOD ownership. we just leased it from you for special recon plane parking purposes. its where we stashed the blackbirds that did USSR overflights.

[@-Jason-L]

It was a tanker base as well. I was stationed there for 4 years. Then combat controllers moved in as well.

[@M3PH11]

mildenhall is currenty the primary US tanker, transport and heavy recon base in the uk. KC-135's come in and out of there all day. RN if you wanna see the super cool stuff hang out at the fence of RAF fairford.

[@joshschneider9766]

@@M3PH11 i will check that out ty sir :)

[@drofwarcnwahs2108]

This issue with relying on satellites alone is that their flight paths are known. You simply cover up whatever you want hidden prior to the overflight by the satellite. You may remember multiple Soviet mistaken civilian airliner overflights of sensitive areas in the US in the 70's-80's and our allies comercial airliner overflights of Soviet bases or sentsitive areas. Memories of the Korean airliner incident in the '80s comes to mind. Airplanes can overfly an area at an unscheduled time catching whatever the target wants to keep hidden.

[@stevefowler2112]

I'm a recently retired A.E./C.E. with a large American defense contractor. I was hired in '83 at a Georgia Tech job fair. I worked on a number of black programs during my time with the company, including at sites like Orlando, Burbank, Groom Lake, Sunnyvale and Ft. Worth. I still remember the day when, I believe it was Revell, came out with the SR-91 Aurora model airplane in the late 80's/early 90's...we were all very impressed with the design...it gave us a good chuckle. That is all.

[@Chilipotamus]

I grew up near Westover AFB and I can recall atleast three occasions that I'd seen those weird contrails in the air, right around the time that we launched the War on Terror. None of my military buddies ever had an answer as to what produced them, but I've since come to learn theyre a product of Scramjet engines like you pointed out, which raises my eyebrows a bit

[@Wiz33]

It probably did not work out after testing until the current mystery of the SR-72. The single engine technical demonstrator was seen near Palmdale around 2017. Then in Jan 2018, Lockheed announced that modern 3D printing technology allow them to build an engine that will allow an aircraft to fly 2-3 times faster than the SR71. Then all reference to the SR72 was removed from Lockheed's official webpage in Mar 2018 which include the phrase "Global Strike" .

[@wildcountry.]

We sailed off UK south coast and would hear Concorde "ba Boom" on a regular basis. Booms continued after Concorde left service - ok March loop - fine, but "Ka Ka Ka Boom Boom" repeating in cycle....always felt that was something very unusual or next gen. Nice presentation.

[@bleachorange]

All mentions of any specifics on anything hypersonic was removed after the media fuss about russian hypersonics initially broke out

[@MrJackal43]

@@wildcountry.that’s the scram jet technology, without question.

[@michaelgideon8944]

DARPA has been bank rolling hypersonic test engines for 15 or 20 years now. I have worked on a few iterations. The additive manufacturing components have become unbelievable in their size, detail, and complexity. The printing technology is the big change that's going to make these engines feasible. The combustion is driven by the old school TEA/TEB injection just like the SR-71. They also use other non-organic compounds to keep the party going.

[@paulsengupta971]

@@wildcountry. Military aircraft still go trans-sonic off the coast. Occasionally over land for an intercept, too.

[@georgefrenz5262]

In 1985 I was working at Lockheed on the D5 SLBM project. We had a monthly corporate magazine. I had also been at Beale AFB one time. One issue of the magazine had a cover depiction of what was called the Aurora. The plane was said to be the successor to the SR-71. It had a stretched triangular shape, although an angular shape, similar to the F117.

[@moogle68]

I highly doubt a classified "black" project plane would literally be on the _cover_ of a company-wide magazine, *and* that it would so plainly and openly link itself to the SR-71like that. Besides, if it was sent to the whole company then there would be hundreds or thousands of copies that I presume employees could have taken home, or even just cut the cover off of, and yet somehow none of those copies (or even photos of them) made it onto the internet, despite the fact that employees would have undoubtedly known how desperate people were for any info verifying the plane's existence and purpose.

[@alexroselle]

My uncle used to work for Lockheed doing graphic design and print layout for that magazine! But he never told me any information about Aurora because he wasn’t privy to anything. It could have been a concept drawing for a cancelled proposal?

[@arlanandrews9822]

In 1992, at a White House briefing by a Lockheed engineer, he referred to “an engine that’s been flight tested in an aircraft that doesn’t exist”. He wouldn’t answer anything I asked about Aurora, though.

[@gregshamieh6339]

My wife and I made a visit to a friend in New Mexico in 1988. Our buddy's place was about 80 miles from White Sands Missile Test Range. It was a beautiful clear night, and we were just hanging out admiring the night sky when something came into view. The 'Something' was at extremely high altitude, so there was no sound. The vehicle was being followed by a green-to-orange glowing plasma tail -- like we just saw in the reentering SpaceX starship test -- consistent with an superheated titanium airframe -- and went horizon to horizon in only a matter of a few seconds. All of us looked at each other in shock and confirmed that we'd all seen the same phenomenon. I was a recently graduated Physics student, so I did the math, and came up with a speed number that made absolutely no sense. I started doing research to find out what the thing could be, and found a Jane's Defense paper on Aurora, whose details lined up perfectly with what we'd seen. So yeah. It may not have made series production, but there was definitely an 'X Plane' that did research into scramjet propulsion.

[@aaronliddell4280]

I live in Northern Utah (about 30 min from Hill AFB) my daughters and I saw two aircraft that fit the Aurora’s description one night 2 years ago. Flying relatively low, completely silent, we only knew they were there by their silhouettes against the stars of the night sky. They said thought they were UFOs, I wasn’t sure for awhile till I started seeing stuff about the Aurora, now I’m pretty sure this is what we experienced.

[@seldonplanB-24]

So I'm not crazy! I JUST posted a similar encounter my father and I had near Livingston, Montana. The fact that it was silent, or nearly silent, is what impressed me most! So it's definitely real. It's definitely stealth, and delta shaped, and it's NOT a B2, and it's not aliens (it had regular aircraft lights if I remember correctly)....what the heck is it?

[@RohanAirsoft]

Hey, if it was silent it was likely the TR3. The aurora was definitely not silent.

[@VoicefulRiver]

I've assumed that this "SR-91" was just early test versions of the SR-72 Darkstar, which Lockheed confirmed the existence of a couple years ago. Such an advanced aircraft could take decades to develop and perfect, it makes sense to me.

[@MarvelousSeven]

Yeah, like it was super bleeding edge tech that cost too much back in the day, but now we are from the future and its become more cost effective to design fly and maintain an airframe with those capabilities.

[@rylian21]

More likely, they were just test beds for the propulsion system used in the 72. DARPA has recently given a peak at some of the newer engine technologies, and 30 years seems to be the timeframe for them to reveal things to the public.

[@ThomasBestonso-zr4ko]

I saw something twin engined that ripped across the skyline recently, looked like Mach 6 at least, somebody's got a hot-rod up there for damn sure...

[@davidelliott5843]

The SR-71 engines were hybrid turbojet/ramjets. The latter don’t really have an upper speed limit.

[@thomasblankinship98]

No. Aurora was built in the mid -late 80's through the early 90's. Dark Star probably wasn't even talked about at that time . Much less being built.

[@DanielPark-sl1wi]

When I was a child in Okinawa in the early 1970's we clung the the chain link fence outside of the Kadena AFB runway and watched SR 71's land. We also watched B52's land with holes as large as cars through their fuselages landing.

[@Leto_II]

I remember when I found out about “Aurora” in the early ‘00s and I’ve always been intrigued by it, and I believe that it’s possible that it was a real aircraft but highly unlikely because we would’ve heard something by now. Or Simon is right and there was only like 3 which make secrecy easier, also it being a test bed for other aircraft would make sense. Real or not the idea is awesome.

[@francisboyle1739]

The US military would have been remiss if it hadn't been working on something like this. The thing is, hypersonic engines are still a work in progress, so I doubt that if a prototype was built (which is likely) it was anything more than test airframe with nothing like the hypersonic capabilities of the intended article.

[@Jayjay-qe6um]

"Travelling at supersonic speeds on its attack runs, the Aurora Bomber is invulnerable to enemy AA fire. After ordnance is released, the jet slows and regresses to base at subsonic speeds. On its return flight or in large groups, the Aurora can be hit by ground fire." -- Command and Conquer Generals manual

[@logic.and.reasoning]

Lol. Games, not facts

[@laurieharper1526]

Why the need for manned ordnance delivery at all? The ability to drop a missile in a bucket on the other side of the world has existed for many years.

[@snakezdewiggle6084]

@Jayjay-qe6um "Supersonic Attack Runs". How fast do you think bullets and Sidewiners go.? Don't answere, I will not be replying. Russians have a plane that can shoot itself down. (*Super sonic attack runs*) You have brightened my day. 👍

[@snakezdewiggle6084]

@laurieharper1526 Because; if a tree falls in the forrest, and nobody was there...

[@willythemailboy2]

@@snakezdewiggle6084 One American F-11 actually did shoot itself down by testing its cannon while in a supersonic dive. The bullets slowed down but the plane didn't, and when the pilot pulled out of the dive the plane took three of its own rounds. The plane crashed but the pilot ejected and survived with severe injuries. That was 1956. An F-14 Tomcat managed to shoot itself down with a Sidewinder missile, and more recently an F-16 was damaged by its own fire but the pilot was able to maintain control enough to land the plane. If the Russians only have "a" plane that can shoot itself down, they're 70 years behind American technology.

[@firestorm755]

Wow glad I found this vid. I've seen this aircraft, sort of. I'll explain. In the early 90s we were in croyd bay in Devon on holiday. We were on the beach taking pics of the sunset when my wife spotted a weird con trail. The con trail was donuts on a rope, it's the only way to describe it. The trail came from the horizon behind us and headed west over the horizon in literally 30 or 40 seconds. What made this stand out more though was that it was really high, so high we couldn't see the aircraft just the trail it left. Donuts on a rope. We both saw it.

[@stealthbomber2127]

When President Reagan did his first press conference as President he spoke of a prototype plane being built he called the Tokyo Express. He said two prototypes are being constructed and would go from Washington, D.C. to Tokyo in 45 minutes. Twenty four years later, I believe that there have been a hypersonic vehicle for years now as mentioned by the California Earthquake Seismic Center. They would get those booms on Thursday mornings with the MACH 4 sonic booms.

[@davidrubinstein9722]

While flying as a Flight Engineer on the C-5, in the mid to late 90’s, I was flying over the Atlantic and heard the following conversation between Gander air traffic control and an unknown aircraft: Aircraft: Gander control, Dark Flight (some number) altitude request Gander: Go ahead Dark Flight Aircraft: Gander, Dark Flight, requesting flight level 60 (60, 000 feet) Gander after a pause: Dark Flight, Gander, repeat request. Aircraft: Gander, Dark Flight, requesting flight level 60. Gander: Dark Flight, if you can get up to flight level 60, it’s all yours Aircraft: Roger Gander, DESCENDING to flight level 600

[@jeanholmgren3127]

Level 60 = 6000 feet, not 60000 feet.

[@davidrubinstein9722]

@@jeanholmgren3127quite right. Missed that last zero

[@RallyRacingVideo]

Hehe, your story looks amazingly similar to account of Brian Schul about LA Speed check with SR71... SR-71 Blackbird pilot Brian Shul reported one exchange. His SR-71 was screaming across Southern California, 13 miles high and its crew were monitoring cockpit chatter as they entered Los Angeles airspace. Though they didn't really control the SR-71, LA monitored its movement across their scope. The SR-71 crew heard a Cessna ask for a readout of groundspeed. "90 knots" Center replied. Moments later, a Twin Beech required the same. "120 knots," Center answered. An F-18 smugly transmitted, "Ah, Center, Dusty 52 requests groundspeed readout." Center (after a slight pause): "525 knots on the ground, Dusty". The SR-71 realised how ripe a situation this was for one-upmanship: "Center, Aspen 20, you got a groundspeed readout for us?" Center (after a longer than normal pause): "Aspen, I show 1,742 knots" No further groundspeed inquiries were heard on that frequency. In similar vein (airport not stated), an SR-71 crew were listening in on a similar "match this" contest. A Cessna asked to clear to 4000 ft, a corporate jet requested clearance to 12,000, an airliner to 18,000, etc. Finally the SR-71 called ATC. SR-71: "Request clearance to 80,000 ft" Tower: "Just how in hell do you plan to get up there?" SR-71: "Uh Tower, I'm descending to 80,000 ...(borrowed from Marc) Is it what made your story or your own separate and different experience and case?

[@mr.coffee6242]

Yeah thats a story from the sr71... Gander, Newfoundland, Canada. Bitch please

[@RallyRacingVideo]

Do you recall the year it happened? Good story

[@Games_and_Music]

Pretty funny, i just finished watching the recent updates of "Iiiiiii'm Alex Hollings, and this is.. Airpower!" Playing some Candy Crush while listening to this video, hearing his name made me look up a bit confused as i had not expected him to be quoted here, unexpected overlap, despite the topic.

[@klonkimo]

Dang it, you stole my comment. Id love to hear "I'm Simon Whistler, and this, is Megaprojects."

[@AlexanderTzalumen]

Ayyyy another Sandboxx News subscriber

[@GuntherRommel]

Came here to say "I know that name.." Sandboxx is awesome.

[@Gunni1972]

@@klonkimoNext channel will be called Manga-projects. LOL

[@SinisterMD]

I remember an Aurora bomber was an option in the PC game Command & Conquer Generals for the Allies. It would fly to the enemy base at hypersonic speed which meant AA couldn't shoot it down but after it delivered its payload it flew back to base at normal speed which made if vulnerable.

[@stanislavczebinski994]

Back then (1991, maybe?!?) there was an article in the German PM Magazine (science for the people - maybe like Popular Mechanics) about it. I really loved to study them. The pulsating propulsion and it's trail was mentioned - and it's hypersonic capability, achieving possibly even Mach 8 or more. The authors (most likely with an academic background) wrote basically what Simon presented us here IIRC. Just 30+ years ago.

[@Fat_Cat_747]

Oh never mind crappy Aurora's. I wish they would go the whole hog and admit to flying saucers. Anti-grav, force fields, insane death rays and flown by cats.

[@suspiciousstew1169]

Reality is often stranger than fiction yk

[@user-hn8lm8th8k]

Thank you for this. There may be 4-6 YT channels I trust to do the work to tell a story properly, accurately, and without clear bias- this one and Alex Hollings' Airpower. I recommend you both frequently. A long time subscriber.

[@urFBIguy]

My uncle died of a stroke in 2014 about 6 years after the following conversation took place, so he couldn’t get in trouble now but he had been in the air force for almost 30 years as both an enlisted man and later as an officer and retired as a colonel. After I had medically retired from the army after getting a second TBI in 2008, I visited him after I came back home and we sat around drinking beer and trading war stories and talking about different military topics….and he insists that the aurora ram jet is real and has existed since the late 80s. He said the pilot has to wear a modified space suit and the seat is filled with gel foam to prevent the pilot being crushed by the G forces. There was only a couple working prototypes with the plan to refine the ram jet further and into a stealth model and put one of the following generations into full production. The other aircraft prototypes he claimed were built and functional was for the next gen versions of a stealth a10 warthog type aircraft, a passenger jet modified that was still being built that was armed with a giant laser tube running through the fuselage to overheat and blind satellites, and a C5 galaxy that was modified to deploy dozens of stealth fighter/bomber drones while its airborne like an airborne aircraft Carrier and a successor to the C130 gunship that instead of guns fired swarms of hundreds of guided rockets.

[@craigsavarese4554]

I live in north central Texas. A state crammed full of huge military bases and contractors. Over the past 2 decades I have often seen ultra high contrails indicative of ram/pulse jet use (long thin lines with hanging “puffs”). I remember one time while floating in my sister’s swimming pool and seeing an extremely high altitude craft traversing the entire sky in a matter of mere seconds. That was almost 20 years ago. You don’t easily forget something moving that fast on a clear summer day.

[@dwaynne_way]

Lockheed make some of the coolest planes on the planet, i still have an airfix model my dad bought me and built with me of the SR-71 Blackbird.

[@justandy333]

😂 it's highly likely I have exactly the same model! Fun times 😊

[@glennllewellyn7369]

Hah! Similar! Australia

[@samuelgarrod8327]

Devices of war are never cool.

[@markwise9868]

​@@samuelgarrod8327you realize the SR-71 was to document and photograph the USSR so we could better negotiate with them during the cold war, right?

[@justandy333]

@@samuelgarrod8327 I disagree. The SR-71 took pictures, no guns were fitted. Even if it did have guns on it or places to hang bombs, it doesn't stop the thing from looking absolutely awe inspiring. Furthermore, we are talking about a model kit of the SR-71.

[@alankeeling2946]

There were ships carrying exotic aviation fuel to the base at RAF Machrihanish and pipelines going from the port there to the airbase at the time you suggest Aurora was flying. The exact type of fuel needed for the types of engines such a high speed aircraft would need.

[@thomasblankinship98]

Aurora was built by Lockheed Skunkworks before Martin merged with them. Built in the mid - late 80's. Hypersonic, mach 7+. Stealthy. Used a hybrid fuel through pulse detonation scram jet engines.

[@rwes61]

Recently I went to the Santa Rosa Air museum (in Northern California)where I saw a Drone that was used on the SR 71 I was shocked because I knew there were only a few of those actually made and it was all in one piece!

[@danielnordeen8410]

Aurora exists I have seen it fly by my property in Aug 1989 in Santa Cruz Mountains flying off the coast tow of them south toward So Cal. Turns out the USAF have a flight zone off the coast N-S. The two aircraft were moving 40 miles in about 10 seconds. I calculated around 5000 mph or so. Mach 8. They looked like a disc shape from the side and had a large contrail and rocket like exhaust. By the way the SR-71 Retired in 1989 coincidence?

[@MastaSquidge]

Well, there's an SR-72 program, so it was very likely to be that.

[@jpx1508]

Living in SoCal in the 1990's and early 2000's there were periodic radar trackings (not so many sightings) and sounds of an aircraft with outrageous speeds which sometimes left funky "doughnut" tracks of a supposed pulse engine. The aircraft appeared to be moving to and from the inland desert and Pacific and often caused USGS seismic recordings. There was, I believe, at least one potentially viable photograph which was unverifiable. The radar and USGS signatures were confirmed and verified many times; however, there were never good explanations... and over time the public was conditioned to ignore the signatures.

[@rcisneros8567]

I don't know about the 2000's, but yes.

[@bleachorange]

the seismic recordings were what sold me on the idea long ago. that there was a collection of them that could be referenced to specific phenomena that something traveling like an aircraft at hypersonic speeds - this is a thing that I dont see a way to fake easily. In conjunction with the contrails, and the sporadic sightings, the evidence was enough to convince me.

[@anaestereo810]

Watching this a day after my Dayton's Air Force Museum visit...

[@johnkidd797]

I bought a Holzkern watch as my wife liked it and i bought it against my better judgement, a wooden thing and a fashion accessory as It didn't work for one full day. As someone who has a collection of nice watches I'd say avoid cheap rubbish and buy quality. 👍🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿

[@brandongaines1731]

All that I have to say is, where there's smoke, there's fire. This goes for jackalopes, chupacabras, dragons, sasquatch - and the SR-91 Aurora

[@blodstainer]

the aurora was the best air superiority fighter in the RTS game "Command & Conquer: Generals" in the US roster. IIRC the name came from basically a NGAD project name long before NGAAD was a thing.

[@H3LLGHA5T]

It wasn't a fighter in the game but a bomber that couldn't be shot down until it delivered its payload.

[@PleegWat]

Satellites may not entirely replace a hypersonic spy plane, but they certainly reduce the need to deploy it, making it easier to keep it secret.

[@templarw20]

I had a math teacher back in high school that was an USAF NCO back in the 1960s. He had some interesting stories...

[@alankeeling2946]

I watched a massive super high flying triangular craft with 3 white lights on each corner, flying higher than any commercial traffic I have ever seen, do a pass over the UK from south to north at about 3am in the morning once. I watched it do a straight line pass, no funny maneuvers etc. It had no hazard lights and I watched it go from horizon to horizon, it took about 15 to 20 minutes.

[@bebo4807]

British cheese manufacturers have convinced the UK population of the significance of the triangle shape. Being seared into the British perception the population of Britain projects this triangle shape through psychological obturation. Thus the mundane viewing of a bird or distant star is transformed into a sinister American spy craft.

[@Dlweta57]

Sounds like you saw the alleged 3rtb

[@montylc2001]

I myself saw the same thing fly over Fort Worth in 1998. Very fast, but it was completely silent. And this was around 2 am.

[@GreatSageSunWukong]

I've seen a black triangle over london twice in the last couple of years, I don't think its aurora, but maybe some successor, it can hover and take off at high speed and it turns in a strange way, its like spin the bottle, it just spins until it locks on and goes in that direction which makes me think its unmanned and trying to lock on to a GPS signal or something spinning to get its berrings.

[@Dlweta57]

@@GreatSageSunWukong waiting till the mercury spins up to speed before it can engage the anti grav drive.. Classic 3 rtb m.o.

[@edwardfletcher7790]

The funny bit is that the people who worked with the "Aurora" will be watching this video, reading these comments and laughing at our mistakes 😁

[@johnnyclark6182]

There is something about the Sideprojects intro theme that is just comfortably nostalgic 😊

[@NobleOmnicide]

I remember back in the early 90's when Revell used to sell a model on what they understood was the prototype of the Aurora plane. So the idea for this plane has been around for at least 30 years. What's crazy is how its existence hasn't been leaked more during that time.

[@frequentlycynical642]

Pretty sure that was the Fp-117. Maybe both? Spies from Mattel, not Russia?

[@NobleOmnicide]

@@frequentlycynical642 No, the F-117 was already known to the public at the time. In addition, the Aurora prototype model was not similar to the 3d models used in this video. Oh well, no biggie :)

[@johnmarkey5470]

And the DoD tried to block Marvel from selling the model. Marvel sued and won by default, as the Pentagon would not put up evidence that the model jeapordized national security. 😅

[@Mmouse_]

This thing, if it exists or not, is old news... What there is now in operation is awe inspiring and I hope that none of it ever needs to be used.

[@AeroLowdown]

That was a fantastic conclusion! Well done to the Megaprojects team

[@johnwhitbread206]

Mildenhall quite often has unusual landings late at night especially after 2001 to 2004, I quite often found myself near there due to my job and aircraft would land late in the evening, 8pm onwards but sometimes it was really late and although I never saw an aurora, seeing some of the stuff the yanks have going in and out of lakenheath and Mildenhall is quite mind boggling,

[@RallyRacingVideo]

Very interesting! Has been looking at those bases for years. Do you recall and are able to tell any details of the aircraft that used to land there between 2001-2004?

[@yabutmaybenot.6433]

Simon always delivers an excellent reading, no matter the topic.

[@stevewhite6861]

A few years ago my sister in law went into their garden doing basic household chores, it was a lovely summers day but while she was out there a large shadow covered the garden so she looked up to see what it was, as it was a cloudless day she was baffled, overhead was a triangular craft and it was utterly silent, this was in North Hull East Yorkshire, she called my kid brother out but he couldn't identify it either, it carried on in the same direction and vanished into the distance very slowly.

[@harryhirsch3637]

If you look at the location of RAF Macrihanish it's ideal for going undetected from civilian radar stations for a very long time/way, no matter starting or landing. Also that AFB got a new runway in the 1990s that was long enough to support whatever exotic plane you can imagine AND it is said to have an elaborate bunker system below ground to hide whatever you wanted including planes or JP-7 tanks to fuel them.

[@millennialtrucker6435]

Personally, I think it’s real. And I’m a firm believer that this plane has advanced technologies. The kind we’ve never seen before. The “aerial phenomenon” that’s been reported on recently I think directly relates to this aircraft. Also, Machrinharish was widely known to house the F117 from time to time. It’s been documented on several occasions. It was a remote air base.

[@dextermorgan1]

Look up the sandbox news video from a couple of weeks ago about the sr-72. It's definitely real

[@nathansheldahl]

I believe that’s more with NGADS then this as the timing of sightings fit better to the timeline.

[@bleachorange]

I believe there to be enough documentation and witnesses of an aircraft that looked and behaved like aurora to call it real. Will we ever hear the full story? Who knows. Many take it at face value that it was just a budget item for the B-2 that accidentally made it in. That may even be true. But that doesnt mean that there was no such aircraft as aurora is purported to be, and its not like the skunkworks is the only secretive aircraft division that exists in the US. Declassified documentation shows many things that were worked on by companies not named lockheed that were kept from public awareness for years or decades. My take? Either it crashed or something else embarrassing and is being covered up, or it hasnt been declassified because the technology of the program is still considered very relevant, likely including its shape. If it was a technological dead end or just a test program for something we think adversaries already have figured out on their own, it likely would have been exposed at some point. Lets not forget the example of the Greenbriar Hotel (and its successor we dont know about) that successfully hid a fortified nuclear bunker for congress for 40 years and no one talked about it until an investigative journalist uncovered the thing.

[@johncrane1420]

The U.S. military is not in the business of losing a capability without already having a superior system ready to take up the task of the retired system.

[@grisall]

The superior SR71 replacement is called a satellite

[@johncrane1420]

You can believe that if you want. @@grisall

[@stephenmartin8376]

​@@grisallmy thoughts exactly!

[@stevenwojtysiak6392]

My guess is Aurora was likely a drone project, if it wasn't a codename for the B-2. It might have even been a codename for the spaceplane that has been launching recently. Aurora as a codename makes sense for an extra atmosphere vehicle, I think.

[@MathewBall]

I remember hearing about The SR-91 “Aurora” project back in senior school around 1998/99.

[@marcoargo]

I was mildly interested in the facts presented until I heard mention of Machrihanish, I used to know an chap who worked as an ATC operator for Machrihanish who claimed of spotting the Aurora during his time there.

[@RallyRacingVideo]

What years that guy saw it there?

[@marcoargo]

Would of been early naughties@@RallyRacingVideo

[@thewb8329]

Most of those observations also fits the description of the SR-71.

[@BensWorldview]

The folder containing all the details on this project is laying under a billiards table in Mar-a-Lago

[@ultralightnative]

I was told it was in a garage next to a corvette

[@DavidEdwards9801]

I'll never forget seeing the doughnut shaped exhaust coming out of the back of a jet that screamed over-head faster than anything I'd ever seen before. It went horizon to horizon in less than 3 minutes. Now I'll watch the video

[@Moodymongul]

imho - 'Aurora' was probably a group of craft. And a place (in the 1980's), they once flew in/out of, was RAF Machrihanish (in the UK). It wasn't really 'RAF' though. In reality, the base was leased to the US back then :) And no, you won't find pictures of it/them online. If you tried to upload one, even now, you'll be blocked and then get a 'knock' on the door ;) The tech may be old, now. But its still not something to be shared with the 'public' (if you get me). On a side note: Don't miss out that the UK had their own versions of these type of project (as did other countries). But they, tended to keep their secrets more than the US (even until today) That too, adds to the confusion. Of who owns what.

[@doom9603]

interestingly, people like me aren't blocked yet 😆 maybe it would be too easy if I upload stuff, and they would confirm it for me that easily.

[@Moodymongul]

@@doom9603 I'm talking closeup shots that show any real detail. No pictures of takeoff or landings. i've yet to see one online :) I've seen videos of other things. But not the real assets.

[@joshschneider9766]

i feel compelled to point out that theres a crapload of conditions that create donut on a rope contrails.

[@davids1inwestholl45]

I don't know if it existed or not, however, I lived down on the beach back then, the Esplanade in Redondo Beach, CA. I had odd work hours: 2pm - 10pm, M - F. That said, I usually spent my mornings down on the beach. There was about 6, maybe 9 months where on the same days of the week, every week, it was either 11am or 12 noon (honestly, I can't recall which hour, but it was always the same). And it was always on time...not 2 minutes deviation every time. At that same time, we all heard the classic, rapid, boom-boom in fast sequence. It never happened before then, and once it stopped, it was never heard from again!

[@revvluvv]

In the mid 90's General Yeager spoke to out AFROTC detachment. during the Q & A one of the cadets asked about the Aurora. Yeager got pissed and responded" Why in the the world would i discuss a classified project with a room full full of cadets!" There was a very awkward silence. He hit a few more questions , signed some autographs and left... Although not a specific confirmation, his statement left most with the thought that it did exist.

[@batboylives]

Though it will be years, Canada ordered 88 F-35 II Lightnings. Best investment I've seen ever, 2nd is JTF2 and training alongside USA, UK, France and Australia.

[@recoil53]

As long as the new stealth drop tanks they are testing on the F-22 part of the package. Anything covering Canada needs the range.

[@bleachorange]

well, the bonus for canada is you will get the good f35 revisions. the downside is a lot of pilot skill loss as your current ones are flying aircraft in such terrible shape pilot retention is a serious issue. Watched several episodes by various youtubers on the topic.

[@batboylives]

@@bleachorange agreed. Which is why 12 are on 'express delivery'. The rest will take years before all are delivered.

[@forzaelite1248]

@@recoil53 The F-35 can do the operationally required distance on internal alone already; the tanks are insurance but more relevant to the F-22

[@recoil53]

@@forzaelite1248 Really? Canada is 4700 miles wide, the F-35 has a range of 1300 miles.

[@dalebelseth3058]

A Spooky guy I know said this of the Aircraft circa 1998, “ The Aurora has never flown an operational mission”

[@jason_m_schmidt622]

Of course

[@sethmangini6671]

I've seen the donuts on a rope contrails numerous times and always wondered about them... I especially remember seeing them when I was in school in Cleveland 2002 - 2006. Sometimes they were just donuts with no rope.

[@stonewolf7850]

I can't help but think about how well the SR-71 program was kept secret for so long, and the timing of the SR-71 being revealed when compared with alleged sightings of the SR-91.

[@jonathantarrant2449]

Aurora was a space based program. Most of the details discussed in this program are the sr72 program along with the tr3a and later tr3b programs

[@tkskagen]

Correction... Originally named the RS-71. Reconnaissance/Surveillance-71 was the original "nameplate" for the Blackbird...

[@robertsmith4681]

Actually it was Reconnaissance/Strike initially as some early variants were supposed to be armed interceptors, that idea was dropped and the SR name was adopted instead

[@o0-0o693]

Not a single reference exists that i could find supporting this. Not a single person besides you claiming it was called rs71. Keep your misinformation to yourself. You cant even get the order of the name right like come on bro. 30 seconds of Googling throughs your credibility in the toilet.

[@thecrapinmytoilet6892]

@@o0-0o693yeah, there’s a tale that president Johnson was to announce it as the RS-71, but instead he switched it up and said SR-71.

[@o0-0o693]

​@@thecrapinmytoilet6892a take with no proof. Nice. Thats really reliable 👏

[@o0-0o693]

​@@thecrapinmytoilet6892i like when people with no proof or credibility. Always seam to talk about how there is something i heard something. Blah blah blah no proof is no proof. A tale seriously? Thats your evidence. Wtf are you Snow White?