The Trouble With Privatisation | “The Private Sector Gutted Us for £45m when I was Minister”

[@GugiMandini]

I briefly worked for a large multinational with 300K+ employees providing services to the NHS, Prisons and many others. The only interest was reducing standard of service and maximising profit, the sole yearly objective was make 10% against investment. 0 interest in patient well being, when I mentioned the patients my manager got angry. I left within the month.

[@Charles-jf3mx]

Well done. Respect

[@TonyTsobanis]

There are certain services that should never be privatised, the profit motive is diametrically opposed to the needs of many public services. The assumption that a company can do it for less, while still making a profit (meaning service is delivered for even less) is nonsense. Almost always, they plan to improve financials using variations to the original contract

[@greghill7759]

Absolutely correct. It's astonishing that the logic of this argument was heard and rejected during nearly every move for privatisation. And yet here we are, with those services picked clean and failing.

[@RichWoods23]

"The assumption that a company can do it for less, while still making a profit (meaning service is delivered for even less) is nonsense." This is why successive governments used what they called 'public sector comparators' to skew the analysis of whether a particular privatisation would be cost-effective or not. They applied a numeric factor designed to give them the result they desired.

[@oldschool3670]

Profit = decline in service. Even your average voter will understand this if you have the time to explain it

[@jimb9063]

Yes agreed. If nothing else, utilities should be ring fenced IMO. I don't understand how it's a political argument. I don't know why a Nation State would not want full control of it's water and power, let alone any arguments about the 'public good' and profit making from the fundamental needs of everyone.

[@jackdaw1328]

Couldn't put it better.

[@steve6121]

Rory and Alastair - your channel is terrific. But on PFI and on Procurement - hmmm. Fundamentally, if the consumer pays it should be private sector funded, and if the taxpayer pays it should be public sector funded. Trying to mix the two is doomed to fail. PFI is simply public sector borrowing but at a much higher rate than the government can get. The root cause problem here is political - it is a short term fix for votes, that hurls the can down the road, building ever bigger problems as it rolls along. Better to to use cheaper government borrowing and nil profit margin to invest in public services to realise lower future operating costs. PFI uses expensive private sector borrowing and profits, creating higher future operating costs. Forget the nonsensical on/off balance sheet argument, which just heads in the same direction as sub-prime. Anyone who signs a contract for £45m when it currently costs £185m currently is naive at best and more likely just negligent. The prisons contract would have been signed off by a politician, and most likely against the advice of the procurement team. The primary task of procurement is to ensure continuity of supply. Unfortunately, politicians think the first task of procurement is to save money.

[@jimc8609]

My wife’s dad was registered disabled and the management of this was privatized. After a period of time he had to be re-examined to see if he still qualified. I presume they thought his missing leg might have grown back?

[@DBGE001]

What went wrong with the British Sewage system? Answer: it is privatized. What went wrong with the British Railway? Answer: it is privatized. What went wrong with the British Postal Service? Answer: it is privatized. What went wrong with the British Energy providers? Answer: it is privatized. What is going on with the failing NHS? It is being privatized. Were are the profits of the privatized British Oil and Gas? Answer: they are going into the pockets of wealthy businessmen (see how Norway did that). Why are the enormous leaks in the British drink water network not fixed and grew to 1 trillion liters of lost drinking water in England and Wales via leaky pipes? Answer: it is privatized. Someone with half a brain would almost recognize a trend here. How did the average British eligible voter not see that trend?

[@I_Was_Chrispy_Kreme]

Short answer the average British voter believes whatever they are fed by social media and newspapers without questioning it. The solution I think is to add a kind of health warning ‘this is an opinion piece and has no factual basis’

[@niccymak8243]

In the interests of balance please record examples of privatised services which have improved the State of the Nation.

[@ecaeas4439]

It's not that people didn't see it exactly. It's that the vast majority of Westminster politicians have been either supportive of mass privatisation because they have had means to personally benefit from it, or they've been lukewarm to challenging it. Voters are offered voting for parties that either actively privatise or passively resist privatised models but use private providers as a means to plug gaps in service created by those same private providers. There's nobody who you can vote for who is actively committed to reversing all the privatisation of services. That might change if current priorities like economic slump, international crises, soaring poverty are addressed somewhat. Unfortunately though, the fact that privatisation has engineered much of the country's problems doesn't mean politicians are committed to reversing privatisation as a means to solve our issues.

[@gubilasco9022]

Tabloid newspapers are the best selling in the UK, couple that with mainstream TV and there is your answer..

[@jodders619]

@@niccymak8243 Examples of privatisation that have improved the state of the nation: *tumbleweeds*

[@XLseattle]

The privatization of prisons and juvenile detentions in the US has been a horror. All too often private contracts have been impediments to reform and other government work. See ie Waste Management contract with Detroit kept that city from implementing a recycling program for years

[@jimb9063]

Remember a documentary a few years ago about ALEC in the US. It's a broad conservative non profit, but in this instance it was influencing state law to increase the length of sentences, which helped out those running prisons. Longer sentence, more products made by prisoner when in prison, more money made.

[@sararichardson737]

I’m so pleased that TRIP is such a runaway success and that they post on KZbin as well.

[@deemey95]

I am very happy to hear Rory give Project Hail Mary a shoutout at the end of the podcast. The Author Andy Weir is also the author of the well known book turned movie, The Martian. Brilliant novel.

[@bilinguru]

It seems to me that if the government opts to go with PFI, they must invest part of the savings in oversight that ensures performance to clearly defined benchmarks, which if unmet will allow the government to withhold payments until the benchmarks are met. Government can also write in legislation that will prevent these private companies from declaring bankruptcy, or at least hold the key decision makers personally liable for willifully failing to meet the terms of the contracts. The problem as I see it is that governments have simply awarded these contracts and trusted them to provide the services without dilligently and constantly monitoring their performance and insisting that standards are being met. Annual or even quartely reviews are clearly not good enough. Whoever has the portfolio, needs to have a person, if not a team, in place to hold their feet to the fire. One might say, oh well if we have to do that, why go with a PFI at all? The answer is that it is still substantially less costly to do it that way, than to administer the service entirely by the civil service. It's as if governments have gone with PFI to show the public how much money has been saved and to avoid raising taxes, and then deny responsibility when services fall short. Ministers are still the ones who will be, and should be, blamed when things go wrong, either because they didn't vet the bids carefully enough or they did not supervise the execution of the contracts dilligently enough.

[@JohnCl]

Can you give us any examples of when privatisation has actually worked for the vast majority of people, when private companies’ main aim is to maximise profits.

[@tightcamper]

BT

[@AlanKenny-y8e]

High taxes = good public services. Run for the customers, not for greedy shareholders.

[@SplashTasty]

Okay but that's just not true is it

[@phlanjo]

LoL

[@chaipup7045]

not true, we have the highest taxes in generations and the worst public services.

[@maxine2798]

High taxes with a government that doesn’t spunk money = good services. A good economy means more tax paid = good services. Currently we have neither

[@treeaboo]

@@SplashTasty True in countries with competent governments like Norway :)

[@emmarobinson6185]

Another great conversation - thanks fellas. I also love Rory's jumper!

[@tonyaustin4472]

Rory…regarding the Civil Service and politics… there is no bar to civil servants becoming members of the mainstream political parties; Labour, Conservative, Greens etc. There is a bar on becoming a member of the Communist Party. As for active political activity…you can, if you follow the rules; as I remember them, you can become a local Councillor, you can assist in supporting your Party at General Elections and with some restrictions you can stand for election to be an MP. When it comes to General Elections, you have to seek permission from the Department but unless you are in a particularly sensitive role, it’s rarely refused….I was in the Service for nearly 50 years and never heard of anyone being denied permission. Someone who wants to stand for election to being an MP I think I’m right, has to take either unpaid leave or resign and if he/she is unsuccessful is normally taken back. I never heard of anyone ever doing that I might add :-) probably because most Ministers and MP’s are held, quite rightly sadly, in very low esteem in the Service :-) So those are the rules as I experienced them from 1966 to 2007 ish

[@grycripps]

Rather than politicians saying we can't do something with public money, because voters won't vote for it, then using corrupt private companies, which then pull the government's pants down at tremendous cost. They could treat the public like grownups and explain why public ownership is the cheapest and best option in the long run. Oh, they could also start making the super rich pay proper taxes!

[@MrFahrenheit9]

I was so pleased when Rory mentioned Project Hail Mary. One of my favourite recent sci-fis, and not as much for the science aspect of it, but more of a linguistic one. Hence I advise to listen to an audiobook!

[@jamesthomas7928]

I do enjoy these conversations and learn all the time. Thanks guys

[@philipellis7039]

Grayling believed that Probation could be run on a payment by results basis. He set up pilot schemes. The pilot schemes were clearly showing that what Grayling wanted wouldn’t work so he scrapped the pilots and went to full scale implementation. The projections on the private-public split where all wrong so massive adjustments had to be made as they went along and there were thousands of violent offenders managed by private companies that had no background in this kind of work. This kind of thing goes beyond incompetence, there was no justification for it beyond what appeared to be blind faith and the Tory government is culpable in letting it happen (against the evidence base, against the advice of many in the House of Lords and the judiciary,etc). Genuine damage to the probation service (which was generally meeting its targets up to that point and had developed a focus on continual improvement despite problems in it’s past) and it’s supervision of offenders and £millions poured into the coffers of security firms in the USA.

[@playingdominoes]

One wonders whether Grayling or his friends or family have subsequently found themselves in the employment of said security firms in the US

[@heem6619]

@@playingdominoes might have just chucked him a bung, he's too stupid to keep on the payroll

[@simonfrost7094]

"...was generally meeting its targets up to that point" - that's the point though. The Tories see a functioning public service and they think 'that service is ripe for privatisation' rather than 'that service is working well - we should leave it alone and let it do its job'. See also British Rail, which by the end of the 1980s was also working well, had overcome the problems and failures of the modernisation attempts from two decades earlier and were designing and implementing new fleets of locos to run on an upgraded East Coast Main Line. What happened next? It was planned for privatisation (though it was New Labour that finished what John Major's government started).

[@timwilliams19]

I was a public servant and I deliberately didn’t join any political parties, groups or other interest groups even though I may have wanted/liked to.It was very important to me that not only was I as impartial as possible in my work I also appeared to be impartial. I hope that makes sense.

[@MiningForPies]

I’m a civil servant. I’m able to separate my private politics when working. It’s not difficult.

[@paulgibbons2320]

Respectable choice. Majority of them are left wing bordering activists.

[@oldschool3670]

When privatisation goes wrong?? When has it ever gone right?

[@asquithea]

Was probably a good thing BT was privitised - telecoms is one area that did spawn a lot of competition and investment - some of it relatively risky (e.g. cable rollout). But now we're in a place where telecoms have become more of an essential utility rather than a nice-to-have so perhaps it would be better to have a publically-owned utility.

[@oldschool3670]

@@asquithea bull shit

[@jamesbothoms6009]

@@asquitheaand yet our infrastructure is generally behind our European neighbours and light years behind much of Asia. The handling of our Comms infrastructure was considered such a failure that the government had to split BT and Openreach. Basically if it isn’t immediately profitable, you probably don’t have access to full fibre broadband yet, whereas much of even Central Europe has had it for upwards of a decade now

[@PSModelling]

Not sure if Alastair has read Rory's book, Politics on the Edge, as the Brexit prediction he made is covered in there. Anyway it's worth a read for anyone considering reading it, thoughtful reflective insights on British politics.

[@Murray-wk3hz]

The NHS has lots of its services done by private for profit companies, I wonder how things going are with it.

[@lanagibson4334]

I do like these conversations never really thought much of both of them in past but I can see I was wrong

[@peterdollins3610]

PFI was a terrible idea stacking up debts in mountains & giving dismal results. It's OK to make mistakes but then admit & correct them man.

[@PMMagro]

The idea was that Y politican and X coporation decide what happens with the taxpayers money. Works fine for X and Y, not so great for the taxpayer though taking the main risk. IF such a service fails (Thames Water) guess if the taxpayer will have to cough up anyway :) X and Y not so.

[@TheKatLou]

I fear that Starmer will continue letting the private sector continue hollowing out public services for profit...😢

[@31Blaize]

@@TheKatLou Given how much money would be needed to renationalise all those services the Tories have sold off at minimum benefit to taxpayers (and in a lot of cases, tax money is still going to them) and that the economy hasn't grown in 14 years not to mention the anchors that are Brexit and worse borrowing conditions, Starmer has little leeway for changing much in 1 term. I think sadly it's going to take over a decade to recover from Tory mismanagement.

[@DoñaRatona]

May I ask, when has privatisation gone right?

[@stephenlee1756]

Never.

[@katebatt7538]

Spot on AC. This issue is procurement with PFIs. Better, stronger, legal contracts and very clear specs are needed.

[@Tom_murray89]

I love this podcast

[@rhodrijames7962]

All of the things Rory brought up about PFI bidding and contracts apply to private companies hiring consultants too. I work for a small IT contractor, and we regularly find larger companies underbidding us not because they can do the job more cheaply but because they can rely on the client giving in and forking out more money when they inevitably go over budget. Senior civil servants are also far from the only people who change their specs on a weekly basis, or worse issue specs without consulting their own people who will be using the system being developed.

[@Angela-en6oh]

Thank you for another interesting and informative programme, covering a really wide subject range - something for everyone.

[@SandraT1107]

A great topic. A strong independent civil service is vital to the country running well. But so is a strong and independent system for local councils, properly funded. The prison system is an important topic and too often not spoken about. Outsourcing probation services was a huge mistake in my view.

[@sarangistudent8614]

I saw this one video of a Tory minister, Dominic Raab I think it was, stating how he hated human rights… oh that WAS real you say. 🤦🏽

[@clowncarqingdao]

Can you give me some examples of where privatization has been better/measurable improved a public/national service for the public and users/participants of that system. This should, I feel, exceed 50% of the public services that have been privatized. What's the overall picture from your perspective?

[@paulstorm2135]

You two should do a modern take on the Yes Minister series.

[@edwardalexander9486]

This isn't a joke sketch - these two are just making assumptions on the base of; we're re-constituted and cool. No!

[@JelMain]

@@edwardalexander9486 It's been considered and rejected, as nobody's into teaching them how to hurt us more.

[@bearsbreeches]

🐓🐓🐓🐓 these are chickens coming home to roost. We said all this when Margaret Thatcher talked about privatisation being the neoliberal answer to everything

[@scooby1992]

I have just read the Chapter in Rory's book where he talks about the Probation Service when he was a Minister in The Ministry of Justice .

[@SoSo-li6dn]

Hi Guys, many of you dont agree with toryism but you should read Rorys book anyway. Actually, listen to it - one of the best narrators you will ever find.

[@PMMagro]

What is "toryism"? I am not British but the current UK regime seems for us aoutside to be not "New tories" but working to become British National Party allies.

[@jimb9063]

Think I get the gist of your point. Personally have huge respect for Rory, while never having voted for his party. I seem to have shifted a little from 20 odd years ago. Then I might have prioritised peoples political philosophy more when deciding who I 'liked'. Now I find I prioritise a certain standard of conduct that I think people should meet. Part of growing up I guess, and shedding a bit of the goodies and baddies my team their team attitude.

[@trollon1232]

A thing about the German FDP Coalition vote: It wasnt really a "vote". It was a nonbinding membership survey

[@jonsevern]

It's interesting to watch this show and observe your dynamic developing together. You have clearly both softened since being in power, and it's to your credit. It seems to me that you have largely dropped the facade of BS; it's refreshing.

[@kamitsu2352]

will be interesting to tune into next weeks podcast

[@PauldeSwardt]

34:15 Rory's Project Hail Mary is by the same author of The Martian (Andy Weir) but I recommend the audio books of both!

[@michaelmcqueen4514]

This podcast really makes me think that Labour and Conservative have more in common than either party does with the working man.

[@DrVickyHarris]

I was sat next to a couple in Pizza Express West Hampstead when suddenly they were joined by a tall, handsome man in an egregious blue tracksuit. It was Alistair Campbell joining Neil and Glenys Kinnock!! Xx

[@paulmaggs3212]

Yeah, the family Kinnock certainly did well out of socialism.

[@andrewharrison7767]

Were you hoping it was Prince Andrew?

[@robertsmme]

On contracts. in some countries they never accept the cheapest bid and insist on taking the 2nd or 3rd cheapest which means people put in more realistic bids. I once worth for a public utility and we paid consultants to manage the bid and they were able to balance the client and the supplier in a way that the client alone would not have managed.

[@HandmadeDarcy]

What do you mean "when"? Name one time in a Western capitalist society when it hasn't resulted in a service that is both more expensive and lesser quality to the consumers, than when it was a government-run service, properly funded and run in good faith (not running it into the ground to justify privatisation, to the voters). Greed never - ever - results in better quality, let alone less cost, but these neoliberals - of all parties across the anglophone world - since Clinton, Blair et al., with their outsourcing, subsidies and incentives to private industry for every single socially required service, has made greed the sole engine of our economies. It's time for governments to protect the people from the Greedy, not make us all but indentured servants to them.

[@emjackson2289]

"Name one time in a Western capitalist society when it hasn't resulted in a service that is both more expensive and lesser quality to the consumers," BAe/Aerospatiale Concorde vs the Tupolev Tu144 CHARGER The former was not only magnificent but it worked. The latter was a loud and noisy failure that could only fly to Alma-Ata, Almaty now, in Kazakhstan.

[@petersullivan8067]

Very good show BTW!

[@kevoreilly6557]

Any examples of when it has gone right in the UK

[@shellunwin2770]

I got Rorys book for xmas, cant wait to have time to read it 😊

[@mariasmargiassi1983]

Alister, have you commented on T Blair, bringing the Horizon system when he was told it wasn't reliable!!!?

[@fionaspencer857]

2.36 No point the labour party writing to Simon Case as he's on sick leave. The civil service have no Case to answer.

[@dougtsax]

If you turned up your mics a bit then I wouldn't be deafend by the adverts when they barge in.

[@greghill7759]

Privatisation is not the only pointless idea to result in disaster..... I can't remember whether it was the ability to alter and manipulate facial images, or the introduction of the self-driving car that was first announced to an unprepared public, (neither of which were, as far as I know, the result of historical public demand) but my first and only reaction to both of these ill-considered and highly questionable ideas, apart from "What is the point?" was "What could possibly go wrong?" I also think these same sentiments apply to Farage.

[@jimb9063]

The old classic, a solution to a problem which didn't exist.

[@TheGinglymus]

I really don't understand why privatisation and pfi things don't get discussed more. Its so obvious its the root of many of our problems but we speak like there is no choice so we just have to put imup with it. We don't.

[@seanfaherty]

Privatization is paying top dollar for continuously cut services. It always makes us pay more in the end. From prisons to energy to trains we are promised less cost and end up paying more. I do not know of when case where privatization did not lead to higher costs.

[@GrahamRead101]

One of the problems with government contracting work, is that they frequently feel that have to get one of the big consultancies in to help them client side. This inevitably involves (after they get the contract) very bright but young and inexperienced staff who don’t know the subject area, but sound good. This drives the supplier to jump through unnecessary hoops and the actual end users get ignored.

[@MrCalls1]

22:20 can anyone help. What does Alistair mean he says risk here? I understand how in a corporate venture with unknown supply/demand, capital investment presents risk. I don’t understand how the state experiences a meaningful value of risk in capital development on schools or hospitals. Supply and demand is highly predictable and largely a function of state activity. What does risk mean here?

[@dougtsax]

I was thinking of reading Rory's book recommendation but he cut it off at 80, so I'm too old.

[@robinsanders5541]

I rather like the sleeves on Rory’s jumper. It makes him look a bit like a Ring-tailed lemur. In regards to the new French prime minister, as important communication is, there’s a massive difference between communication and governmental competence. I look forward to watching his career.

[@TheKatLou]

😂

[@robinsanders5541]

@@TheKatLou many thanks!

[@koolerking440]

21:28 apart from letting Fujitsu make a whole system built on top of a bad system, the post office still was run like a private company. Had executives, who had bonuses. Which makes it a race to how much they can save/make per year to get bonuses, therefore the same mindset from the top. The issue with PFI, is a private company says “we’ll do this for free”, (nothing decent comes out of it being free, especially if a company sees the payment trickling in over 25 odd years!) but the government just thinks “great, that’s sorted” and they walk away and leave the company to do what it wants. There’s zero accountability, checking it’ll actually work, etc.

[@petersullivan8067]

Are we saying our Civil Service and MPs are not able to manage anything?

[@andrewharrison7767]

they could if we accepted bigger government & were willing to pay taxes for it - Scottish Water is run by an arms length public company, with charges mixed in with council tax

[@jujutrini8412]

If you make the contract state the private sector has to apply/maintain the same standards as for a public sector operation when entering a PFI relationship then it’s ok. When privatisation was first pitched all these ideas were stated from the outset so to pretend that the government had no idea that they would have to use vast amounts of taxpayer money to rectify situations after private sector companies have cocked up whole sectors is just nonsense.

[@davids3526]

What was the Post Office book that Rory is reading?

[@jryn007]

The Great Post Office Scandal by Nick Wallis

[@caspardavidfriedrich7916]

I don't know where you submit questions so I'm just going to put this here: in reference to David Cameron answering questions about potential Israeli war crimes, should a former Prime Minister really be able to use the line 'well, I'm not a lawyer so I would have to defer to the lawyers about that question'? With all due respect to lawyers and in particular human rights lawyers, wouldn't we hope that our Prime Ministers are able to grasp that particular distinction as well as anyone?

[@andrewharrison7767]

that's like asking Alistair / Blair whether the UK killed innocent civilians in Iraq & Afghanistan - the definitions of military targeting means if the forces (IDF in this case) believe there's a genuine threat, their deaths are recorded differently. Genocide implies deliberately targeting non-military combatants, so only the lawyers can list whether any of the 250,000+ Iraqi civilian deaths should be described as unlawful killing.

[@jasalexander-hain2601]

legacy of thatcher and unwillingness to undo by labour, the right to buy introduced by her totally destroyed housing stock

[@Scoobydcs]

28:00 thats classic feature creap, in fairness to manufacturers things like that cause MASSIVE redesigns etc, its not simply a rip off (although sometimes it is)

[@MARKSTRINGFELLOW1]

Same with care homes

[@TheDjfatsostupid]

Rory, your comments seemed to suggest you thought the Barbie movie was flawed, when I think it was more just not your cup of tea. Girls of the 80s and 90s grew up playing with Barbie and being told "you can do anything" and Barbie is the girl who can do anything in their childhood games. But "you can do anything" was an aspirational slogan about a post-sexism society that didn't really exist. I think the movie examines growing up in the tension of the childhood belief that being a girl won't hold you back and the real world fact that at some point in your life being a girl *will* hold you back. When that happens, instead of a childhood story about the triumph of good, you get exhausting battles ending in compromise. I can see how this theme wouldn't connect with you emotionally, but I don't think that's a flaw in the film.

[@TimLangridge]

Project Hail Mary, stony recommend along side the other Andy Weir books. Tim

[@tonyguyot2271]

Gentlemen, I understand why public servants adhere to limits in activity. However... Isn't that an unnecessary and self-inflicted injury? How, on earth, can we truly trust government if all aspects, nooks and crannies are not constantly examined, commented upon and reviewable? Would it not contribute much more to the quality of citizen participation, let alone quality outcomes - if public servants, were expected to present and discuss all available information. Obviously, they would need to be trained, skilled and speak without bias, but on an ongoing basis. Might well prove to be cheaper in the long run...

[@paulinegibson7010]

Failing Grayling. Totally incompetent in every area !

[@victorpedersen585]

00:19:34 Regarding engaging with hard right-wing parties here's my perspective from Sweden: When the Sweden Democrats started to gain momentum during the reign of the Moderate (Major centre-right party) lead Alliance government around 2008ish absolutely no party except the Left Party (Hard leftist, the old communist party) even entered in debates with the Sweden Democrats. The establishment parties tried to totally freeze out them. This did not work: it made the parties look childish and petty and gave the Sweden democrats total freedom in setting the agenda on their favourite question - immigration and culture. Then jump to the present day, the Alliance (the traditional rightwing parties in Sweden The Moderates, The Liberals, The Centre Party and the Christian Democrats) have splintered along conservative/liberal lines depending on their respective view of cooperation with the sweden democrats. Now the situation is that the Moderates is government with support of the Christian Democrats and the Liberals, but the Sweden Democrats have a higher percent of support than the moderates themselves. They both have their cake and can eat it, the government can't out-Sweden Democrat the Sweden Democrats and the Sweden Democrats can claim responsibility for the reforms they like and blame the government for the ones they don't like. I suspect our next government will be Sweden Democrats lead unless something drastic happens. So with all this: ALWAYS DEBATE YOUR POLITICAL OPPONENTS! Otherwise you give ownership of whatever political question to them. Also, trying to pretend that the question doesn't exist and everything is fine and dandy is not only stupid, it's an insult to the citizens who obviously do think the political question is important! Anyways great podcast as always, cheers!

[@fatfreelondon]

Procurement, post office, media abuse via AI. Simple solution, make directors personally liable for contact failures. These failures of prisons, social media, IT procurement, under-bidding happen because heads they win, tails we lose. Not fulfilling your maintenance contract? Off to jail with the board. Believe me, the message will come down from on high that we're not going to take the piss, as usual. This time it's serious

[@matthewpritchard6109]

Fantastic podcast - so refreshing to hear real adults discussing politics, not these weird stunted child-imitations that seem to infest the rotting corpse of our democracy these days. For something a bit less dark, however, have you folks read "Utopia for Realists" by Rutger Bregman, and if so, what do you think of its central ideas? I'm halfway through and really enjoying it. I think some of it is a bit too light-touch, but he makes some really powerful points, to my mind.

[@katebatt7538]

Fantasy books: Anything by Julian May or Raymond E Feist. I'd take a bet that even AC would be charmed by Julian May's Galactic Milieu Series - lots of politics and twists.

[@MiningForPies]

The idea we civil servants cannot be politically active is disgusting.

[@Thomas_basiv]

Not at all, it’s essential for democratic function

[@MiningForPies]

@@Thomas_basiv rubbish. MPs are allowed to vote.

[@Thomas_basiv]

@@MiningForPies Civil service is there to implement, not to politic. Conflating the two would render public services even more vulnerable to political spats and skulduggery

[@MiningForPies]

@@Thomas_basiv I’m able to separate work from private. When MPs are banned from voting and being political, then we can talk about the civil service being totally politically cut off.

[@johnlander1610]

The whole privatisation programme was a failure, and should cease immediately, and regulators should be actively bringing the industries under firm control until, that the whole system is resolved.

[@jezlawrence720]

I assumed brexit was going to happen. I dont understand people who didn't. I still voted against it but like voting green i did it knowing i was going to lose.

[@buzzukfiftythree]

I would argue that privatisation rarely goes well. Shares may begin in the hands of ‘Mr and Mrs Average’, but they almost always end up in the hands of large corporations, venture capitalists and pension funds. When you build in the profit factor, the worship of profit maximisation, high rewards and bonuses to senior managers and shareholder dividends override contractual obligations and public utility. I say this not as a ‘hard leftie’, but one whose political views are marginally left of centre.

[@justlikebuttah]

Does privatisation ever go right?

[@davidrobinson2776]

Can I ask a quite light-hearted question of you both for your next Q&A episode? Do you know any MP's from opposing political parties who, outside of Parliament, are great friends? I always find such friendships quite life affirming in the fact you can disagree intellectually and politically but still enjoy each other's company.

[@darkdestroyer6634]

When has privatisation gone well in the last 5 decades?

[@feekygucker2678]

No mention of Life on Mars?

[@eddiestevenson-kaatsch6306]

What one AI can create as a fake, another AI can say that it is fake. Data transmission, data processing, the stuff we humans take ages to do, can be done in the blink of an eye by AI. AGI, artificial general intelligence, is now learning by itself, just as we do, by reading and absorbing data. Because this is SO fast, it can compare and make intelligent judgements based upon the source and even the raw data itself, as to whether a matter is factual or just a load of nonsense. Plain old AI can be programmed to be biased, whereas AGI can only be shown truths from which to start a thought process. It could dispose of the initial 'truth' if it finds that in reality it is only opinion. From this we can gather that AGI needs to be cognisant of a hominocentric version of morality that places humans first, the planet and nature second, followed by its own welfare third. A bit like a final check list before handing down a mote of wisdom. (Isaac Asimov's three laws of robotics: A robot may not injure a human being or, through inaction, allow a human being to come to harm. A robot must obey orders given it by human beings except where such orders would conflict with the First Law. A robot must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.)

[@andrewelliott1939]

Recent reviews of Joy King Lau have been very poor indeed.

[@paulinegibson7010]

What about the Simpson ?

[@diabolicalartificer]

The simple way to deal with AI is to turn off all the "news" feeds on your device, stop watching political videos, stop buying "news" papers & get on with your life. It's all a load of bollocks. This channel is very good, both of you have integrity, but I'm off to listen to some music.

[@jurassiclark2150]

No danger, if I want I want a way to be more political I'll just leave the job that I rely on to not starve to death and become a SPAD or an MP. Sounds easy enough! I have a sneaking suspicion that while me and Rory have "being civil servants" as a common part of our backgrounds, certain aspects of the rest might be wildly different 🤣

[@mattliamjack3293]

Does a bear reliave itself in forested areas.. thatcher took off the guardrails. Massive wealth tax

[@despicable866]

What! "You didn't like Top Cat!!! Who are you people?

[@ninahathaway]

Re Farage - it depends when our election is. If we have an autumn election he will be in the US where the big bucks are. People are suggesting he has more of a strategy!! He’s just greedy

[@Tom_murray89]

Also civil servants must be non partisan

[@SplashTasty]

Nope

[@tkdbrother1977]

I am a Canadian public servant and I agree with your response to the first question. I stay from any political debates however I do make fun of the political system.

[@justgeneric2876]

Fake news moves 10 to 1 the speed of real news and it takes 100x the effort to clarify. Just not worth the money.

[@_eddcarr_]

Really love the podcast but PFI has really turned out to be a disaster. I understand Alistair's reasoning but look at the state of our privatised services for the real evidence.

[@davesy6969]

I suspect that farage is weighing up his options between taking over the conservative party, joining reform or supporting Trump in the USA (where the big money is). OpenDemocracy has the Rishi Sunak and Boris Johnson memory lapses covid inquiry videos and are also covering the covid inquiry.

[@bp-lx7lf]

Prophetic.

[@philipjones9793]

It won't German coalition is done.

[@tonyblosse3855]

Welcome Germany 🇩🇪 and Netherlands 🇳🇱 Apply pressure Tony William Blosse

[@TheLucanicLord]

B B B b B b but the disaplin of the frie markit leads to the fishensie's!

[@lawrencebishton9071]

birmingham prison ? why birmingham ?

[@tommonk7651]

As an American, I find that "God made Trump" video heinous....

[@salmonfilet1234]

Isnt it funny youve got the guy who spun iraq and the fella who decided he was/is a tory commenting on the ills of nation they made!

[@LesOubliesQuebec]

One book i would advise you to read is the book by Maria Ressa the latest how to stand up to an autocrat. I personally think we need to let the company get sue for using deepfake and my nose tell me the issue would be fixed really quickly. Another issue is the account should be linked to some sort of real ID no more massive amount of bot account. Another issue is how little accountability there is about a politician and lying. It would be a great subject on how to make politicians accountable if they lie both of you probably got more idea and more important feasible one.