The True Cost of Lithium Mining | True Cost | Insider News

With demand for electric batteries sky high, mining companies are making their move on the salt flats of the Andes, where over half of the world's known reserves of lithium are stored. But local people are concerned about damage to their scarce water supplies and that they will not benefit from the white gold rush occurring in their own backyard.
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[@WolfHowl71]

I love how all the 'green' technology is never truly 'green'. Not even close.

[@bryannonya9769]

no emerging technology is perfect, people scoffed at the first cars too, and those people were proven really wrong as you are

[@vikramsrinivasan530]

It’s not green you can argue it’s worse but people don’t see it if it’s further down the chain electric is not a visible as a liquid gas

[@WolfHowl71]

@@bryannonya9769 LOL You really have missed the plot haven't you? Do you see how destructive to these people this kind of mining is? Do you have any idea of how destructive mining cobalt, a component of Lion batteries is? Are you aware of how much coal is burned to power these vehicles? Or are you just obsessed with drinking the kool aid?

[@wieboes]

How can you 'love' that?? Or do you mean that you like the idea that people having misconceptions?

[@heyhihello9677]

Through time electric cars offsets its production. It take about 18 months or even less depending on the electrical grid. No, green technology is not perfect but it’s far less harmful compared to the old fossil fuel technology.

[@BGTech1]

Everyone is focused on electric cars, but what about the lithium batteries in disposable vapes? People throw thousands of them away every day, not to mention all the other electronics with batteries too.

[@juneyshu6197]

Theyre in everything. I have a bag for all used batteries to go to the hazmat place.

[@version1.27]

they use them for vapes helps keep the environment good and removing of excess people

[@jamdoodles]

Kind of a silly comparison by weight alone, but the problem of waste is worth pointing out regardless

[@matthewlawlor4323]

⁠@@version1.27very valid point

[@big0ben209]

How about all the lithium batteries in portable battery banks, electric shavers, computer mice, video game controllers? Everything really, but using lithium is better than one time use batteries in all these small devices, including vapes.

[@rolandbruegger4482]

To use valuable drinking water in such a arid and scarce area for lithium mining is so absurd. Thank you for sharing this info.

[@ScreamingEagle228]

Well you need to show them big bad mining companies! Throw away what ever device you used to make that comment. You know since it’s made from lithium from that mine. Also you need to make sure you throw away any battery powered devices in your home. (Same mine).

[@tinoe.94]

What about water consumption for beef? You need about 4000 gallons of water for one kilo beef, in a tesla is about 30 kilo lithium for 1000 gallons. What about that?

[@rolandbruegger4482]

@@tinoe.94 - thats an interesting comparison. Food vs raw material. I know cattle farming is also done in areas where it causes a lot of adverse and destructive side effects. Tropical rain forest in Brazil for instance. You got a point there.

[@tylerk3616]

Well, also using water for agriculture in a desert is also pretty dumb. At least that lithium can be used for something useful, unlike the few tomatos and quinoa, the mining companies should just hire the locals, so they have good paying jobs, and ensure that they have access to clean drinking water in their homes.

[@tylerk3616]

Well, also using water for agriculture in a desert is also pretty dumb. At least that lithium can be used for something useful, unlike the few tomatos and quinoa, the mining companies should just hire the locals, so they have good paying jobs, and ensure that they have access to clean drinking water in their homes.

[@ecoideazventures6417]

I feel it would be quite easy for these mining companies to ensure water facility for these tiny local communities in the desert!

[@alhypo]

No, it's not possible. If they draw fresh water faster than it replenishes, the water table gradually drops. Then they have to drill deeper wells to reach water. That can't go on forever. The only way to ensure locals have enough water is to not extract it faster than it replenishes. They were already caught extracting more brine than was authorized. You think they won't do the same with fresh water? Never mind. That's a stupid question. Even if they do abide by the established limits, it still won't be sustainable.

[@ericliu5491]

I would be surprised if pro EV people solve the water use problem by paying criminals or terrorists to kill farmers like the one shown in this video.

[@LibLibertyLibertarian]

The process of evaporating the water from the brine likely produces enough fresh drinking water and water for their operation. All that has to be done is to trap it with a clear membrane and channel the condensed liquid down the side. They do this all the time in smaller scales. Perhaps having many smaller brine tanks is the solution.

[@johnb8184]

He's right, it is easy, and definitely possible. Look up "solar desalination" and you will find all sorts of small scale examples. Throw massive green houses over these fields and there will be literal rivers of water as a byproduct. Of course, capitalism doesn't work this way. There's no reason for a CEO to spend money doing the right thing, when he can be exploitive, and make far greater profits. We have allowed 1% of the population to control 99% of the world's wealth; truly think about what that means. Wealth is a closed system, and the only reason so few are so massively rich, is because so many are desperately poor.

[@antr7493]

The chinese and russia don't care about their own people why would they care about bolivians?

[@radow869]

They don't care as long as they have a pocket full of money.

[@Selahaddin33]

And we dont care as long as we can leave comments on our lithium battary powered devices.

[@investingthelike111]

every human reacts to money

[@californigirl]

You can bet that the elite trade in gold standard. Fiat and digital currency is the easiky erased play money for the plebian class.

[@dinmavric5504]

​@@Selahaddin33 sorry lad, my battery does not weigh 2000 pounds

[@marvinmartin4692]

That’s really it! Same for the shareholders!

[@petermaclean9326]

Renewable energy doesnt address the problem of consumerism and western throw away culture...without solving that first, Renewable energy means little...

[@volkhen0]

True, we need to push corporations to support “right to repair”.

[@rkan2]

Endless profit and it's enabler - fractional reserve banking, e.g. debt is the actual problem. New loans or economic growth can never stop: if it does, the whole (pick your word) goes tumbling...

[@pauldeyaeger]

If people werent like that corporations wouldn't make money

[@quitgoogle2534]

The individual is the one that chooses whether to buy or not.

[@miepmaster25]

​@@fishy2939simple: they go back to the stone age

[@purplecouch4767]

*Creates a new problem while trying to solve an old problem*

[@jorgecrawford7419]

Hybrid vehicles are the only answer to saving climate crisis. Just need a mixture of both sides to contribute

[@aleksandarmiljesic68]

@@jorgecrawford7419 they are not the only answer and the process to make an electric car is mega-mining lithium, copper and other metals, not to mention the huge contamination that process leaves behind. Not only that, the demand for silicon, rubber and palstic will skyrocket, along side the deman for petroleum and its derivates. Not to mention the already short tight supply of energy (electricity) and the infrastructure and logistics needed to supply electric cars. This problem will only get worse and worse.

[@jorgecrawford7419]

@@aleksandarmiljesic68 & limited fossil fuels are?? I do agree, the process to manufacture a fully electric automobile isn’t to eco-friendly, but neither is traditional internal-combustion process either. We must meet halfway

[@aleksandarmiljesic68]

@@jorgecrawford7419 first of fossil fuels are not "limited" (yet), every month or so new deposits are discovered to be exploited, specially since petroleum is derived from decomposing organic matter, and today petroleum reserves are estimated to last for another 50 years, thats excluding non discovered deposits. The entire process, infrastructure and logistics for building and mantaining an electric car running is far from "eco-friendly", even further away than todays ICEs. I dont see why we "must" meet halfway, climate has been changing since the earth was formed over 4.4 Billion years ago, nothing we do will stop climate from changing. But, if it gives you some piece of mind, there are car companies out there developing synthetic and alternative fuels that work well with the modern ICEs. Porsche has been testing synthetic fuels and the tests are giving good results, they recently opened a plant in Chile to further develop this fuels. Other companies like Toyota, Hyundai, BMW and General Motors (to name a few) are investing in Hydrogen Fuel Cell technology. Koenigsegg developed an ICE with virtually no carbon emissions, producing super and hyper car performance in a small, compact, low consumption 3-cylinder engine. The technology is being deveolped and the money is moving. But i can assure you, the downsides of the increasing mining activities vastly overcome the benefits of going "eco-friendly" with Lithium batteries.

[@ldmldm3810]

​@@jorgecrawford7419lies produce small, light cars, with small engines, this is a solution. producing 500hp electric cars is not a solution.

[@MrM3-eo4bb]

This is the main problem when you compare "green" tech vs oil/gas etc. You have to include ALL of the production chain, including the mineral chase around the world. Lithium is just one of the minerals requiered. So much for the green revolution.

[@djfurrit4497]

It’s too bad they couldn’t catch the water as it evaporates to store for locals. Water is so precious especially in regions like this

[@drmodestoesq]

Also, a passive solar greenhouse distillation system would greatly increase the amount of evaporation. And it wouldn't have to be a large set of greenhouses. A small operation would produce millions of litres a day.

[@jeffbybee5207]

@@drmodestoesq that's a good idea

[@roxylius7550]

@@jeffbybee5207good but expensive one. Unfortunately, those companies only speak money

[@tylersivia8537]

It's not that they can't, it's that they won't.

[@drmodestoesq]

@@roxylius7550 I'd wouldn't agree with the expensive part. Just a few acres of greenhouses. Or some other passive solar tech. It would be dirt cheap to assemble. But we all know these mining companies. They won't spend a green penny if they can avoid it.

[@laf5537]

The farmers very first words were straight to the point and I applaud it.

[@SaltedBadly]

And then big brother will come out with a story on how they have to “rescue” them in “exchange” of commodities

[@Praisethesunson]

If Chile ever gave the contracts for that mining to Chinese over U.S corporations. Then those mines are going to suddenly need some American democratic intervention.

[@peterthornton2396]

I’m absolutely fine with internal combustion. Very little emissions these days

[@baumaffe7649]

thank you for the input peter

[@benjamincliman2735]

What!?!? Electric vehicles and batteries are made out of limited resources just like gas powered vehicles!?!? No way!!! Thanks for this hugely informative article that definitely told us something we didn't know!

[@nagadsby9413]

Best comment of the day!

[@JamesCouch777]

Nothing in this video is a surprise. There is no free lunch.

[@ThePilotGear]

exactly. As important as it is to get off fossil fuels, buying a 120kWh SUV isn't going to save the planet.

[@astr0nox]

The scenary and landscapes captured in this video are remarkably beautiful. I hope that the mining companies, in addition to making sure the communities are cared for, will not destroy the natural beauty there.

[@doktorhund6926]

pffff i wish i would be half as hopefull as you.

[@GeorgeMonet]

They are guaranteed to destroy the environment. They don't care, they only care about $$$$$.

[@geoms6263]

small price to pay to save the planet

[@MrDmadness]

​@@geoms6263ignorant thing to say.. how exactly does mining lithium "save the planet " ?

[@branchandfoundry560]

If history tells anything, they'll exploit it until the money runs out. Then walk away.

[@chris8456]

Would love to see what’s going on in Africa with Lithium mining…

[@francismarion6400]

Cobalt

[@rogermartinez78]

You idiots are all missing the point, even drilling for oil have been devastating to the environment don't let this propaganda video fool you! In the not too distant future our civilization really needs to get off fossil fuels, whether you guys like it or not!

[@showme360]

@@francismarion6400 Which is used to clean fossil fuels and has been for decades for batteries came along.

[@peterchapman3740]

much the same backhanders for the rich

[@marvinmartin4692]

No doubt just as bad!

[@user-bd1my3jd3z]

that amount of water could have been used for new farms for local people, reforestation projects, reversal of desertification

[@Agustin_R]

No, the water that evaporates comes from the salar, not from rivers. That water can’t be use for human consumption or for any other productive activity

[@bryannonya9769]

and yet it wasnt used for any of those things.

[@michaelsalama6631]

@@Agustin_Rmining operations divert and pollute the rio san pedro and rio loa, the two crucial rivers that allow for these communities to exist. you are incorrect.

[@prophecyrat2965]

@@michaelsalama6631wasted words on fools who worship machines

[@robgriffin4801]

The problem with all of these claims is that this video didn't actually measure any of these benefits or costs (as stated in the title) and so anyone can say anything here. What are the benefits of reforestation? If I had to guess, I'd say from an avoided climate damage perspective (carbon sequestration) they are waaaaay less than the benefits from batteries replacing fossil fuel use. Is reversing desertification important, if even possible considering climate change and how would we get there without the lower fossil fuel consumption that is the whole purpose of these batteries? How many people would that effect and how do those benefits stack up in aggregate? Are new farms even a good idea considering market factors, let alone in such an arid area? The concept of this video was great, the execution - not so much.

[@ReflectedMiles]

Economics can be done well or done badly. This isn't primarily a story about lithium or EV's. It's a story about how foreign players will inevitably act economically compared to locals. Partnerships with foreign companies to help with the technology needed can be just fine. Giving rights to the resource and development to foreign entities or control is an old story with inevitably bad outcomes, and there's no reason for players from Russia or China to care in the least. They don't need any relationship with these countries long-term.

[@OrionTheta1]

Roger that! If it goes bad in China. Ouch! Globally? More Ouch perhaps.

[@GeorgeMonet]

The free market will always destroy due to simple human greed.

[@ReflectedMiles]

@@GeorgeMonet Not necessarily. There are businesses in Europe that have been operating quite freely for many centuries without destroying their resources, customers, or owners. It all depends on the incentives. Greed is often not the only incentive for a local company. The owners / shareholders often have hopes of their children and grandchildren having the same life and earning a living from the same business, and that won’t be possible if it’s just greedily self-destructive. If greed is your only motive in a free market, that reflects on you, not the fact that the market is free. That is also why a truly free market has boundaries (regulation and law), also, to deal with the inevitable bad actors.

[@davidburdick594]

They will use up the resource and leave a huge mess

[@londen3547]

You're right about Russia and China not caring. Partnerships? I would make them invest in millions building infrastructure, roads bridges power plants, before I would let them export one ounce of lithium. Of course they will simply buy off the politicians and take whatever they want. And yes unfortunately there are many in the west that would do the same.

[@kristineulm6503]

Thank you for bringing awareness. Hopefully they consider the situation of the indigenous people.

[@NTh3L3tt3r]

As long as it's not "in my backyard" a blind eye is the only thing to be received from the countries that benefit.

[@ricardo1e93]

Those communities are the reason why I hope we get alternative fuels for cars or equipment that currently work with internal combustion when its expensive or not viable to use batteries.

[@Scyths1]

More than a few brands are working on synthetic carbon-neutral fuel, which works with current engines instead of fossil fuel. A few of them have shown real promise, Porsche's one being the most promising to date.

[@showme360]

It would be need on impossible for any form of piston action engine to match the efficiency of an electric motor than only has one moving part.

[@ecospider5]

You are thinking a fuel produced for ice cars isn’t going to have negative consequences during production for some reason? Why is that?

[@HJK242]

@@showme360 you need a power plant to make that electricity, EV's pollute more when take account how electricity is made

[@zanaduz2018]

This is the wrong mindset to have: rather than argue about which method to use to power cars, we should be focusing on dropping the number of cars needed as a whole. Improve urban planning to encourage walking or mass transit.

[@thehoundGOT]

I think this is a great example of the resource curse.

[@flat-earther]

hi michaelp, have you become a flat earther yet?

[@ThePilotGear]

@@flat-earther man you guys are digging in the wrong hole looking for pancake batter.

[@DemPilafian]

True. It seems poor countries only elect leaders who are either communist or fascist. The communist mismanages the resources, and the fascist loots the resources. Ugh.

[@flat-earther]

@@ThePilotGear why are you generalizing me saying you guys?

[@Ffsdevgj]

I don’t think necessarily to be a resource curse, but rather a human mismanagement problem of these resources not to mention the ferocity of human greediness is ever more present.

[@FlipCouvillion]

Imagine where we will be when table salt is expensive or rare.

[@drmodestoesq]

You mean after we've sold all the trillions of tonnes of salt to the Zagon Galactic Empire? I guess we're gonna be screwed after that happens.

[@elericrivera2010]

This makes you think what we take for granted... Is destroying land and peoples need for water worth all this?

[@R33Z47]

The poor people always suffer when these kinds of things happens 😢, all the big company and government see is the money it’s sad

[@Herrlorddonkoenigczar]

The human rights issues due to cobalt mining in Africa, especially for the Congolese, is atrocious. I wonder if people really knew what it takes to make their electric vehicle…would they still support the industry…probably - and that’s the real sad problem…because people really don’t matter to these big corporations…it’s the “environment” that really matters.

[@girowinters]

I have ab ev. It has zero cobalt. Stop pushing your pro fossil fuel misinformation

[@SardonicDog]

They wouldn’t. But the legacy media makes sure that they don’t run stories about it.

[@cbdp]

'The environment' is just what people have been brainwashed to care about, and they have also been brainwashed about how 'the environment' can be saved. At the end of it, very little of it is not just the way the people who benefit the most from it, are best able to do exactly that. Imagine if more money could be made from manufacturing EVs than vehicles with Internal Combustion enginess, then force the market into EVs by 'banning' IC vehicles...

[@tsunamis82]

I won’t be buying electric, simply can’t afford it. Second hand cars cost $10,000 for a new battery.

[@cbdp]

@@tsunamis82 Without the battery, they are not worth much.

[@zebfischer6088]

This has been known for YEARS.....thanks for finally catching up to everyone...

[@joshuameldru4004]

Very great full that this video is being shown. I feel very strongly against the electric vehicle and the lie being advertised to the ignorant that the electric car is environmentally correct. There is currently no patented method of recycling Lithium batteries, no method commercially practiced. This should be concerning to people with a brain.

[@eilois]

"green energy" destroy nature? oh wow!

[@MakeItWithCalvin]

Nothing is without environmental impact but yes... The children mining cobalt and other rare-earths would like to have a word too!

[@mikeflanary642]

Almost like there is no "free lunch"

[@boblatkey7160]

Meanwhile coal and oil and natural gas is so clean, correct?

[@wavnino1]

@@boblatkey7160 they're both bad. The End.

[@francismarion6400]

​@boblatkey7160 China builds coal plants like we build Starbucks.

[@jimbaranski4687]

The treated sewage likely has chlorine from killing bacteria, and other chemicals that would not be good for irrigation.

[@joshbannink1312]

Yikes that’s a terrible predicament. ‘plugs in rechargeable phone lined with lithium to continue to watch video’

[@syhi7971]

As is industries care about the environment or local people...never happens. They care about profit before everything.

[@Leo-gt1bx]

The new Apple Mother nature advert 😂

[@dfunckt]

The green energy future will leave behind dry desiccated landscapes and the graves of the people who lived there.

[@christopherdesbaux5950]

They are already deserts though. It's a salt flat, what are you going to grow there?

[@Mirakolis]

What do you think made many of these places dry in the first place? It’s climate change induced by fossil fuel usage

[@sethgrissman6833]

​@@Mirakolisclimate change hasn't caused desertification... It's simply that they were already deserts. Climate change has only caused ~1.9F temperature increase. That is not bad, but it isn't bad enough to cause desertification (yet).

[@grass23]

@@sethgrissman6833 all deserts are the result of climate change.

[@dochammer3047]

If people still drove their old gas powered vehicles every day for the rest of their lives, they would put out less pollution than companies that manufacture lithium 🔋

[@LabiaLicker]

Nevermind petrol, go diesel

[@jamaly77]

What an dumb statement, completely missing the context Firstly, lithium isn't only used for car batteries. Secondly, what "people"? Only those who had a car 20 years ago? There will be many more EVs than gas powered vehicles at some point because more and more people can afford a car (on a global scale). Would it be better, if all the people in China who started to be able to afford cars in the last decade would choose a gas powered car? The actual problem is people are fat and lazy, they drive too much for unnecessary things, and many countries have incompetent governments that are lacking decades behind in public transport (USA).

[@christopherdesbaux5950]

Are some salt pools in the middle of the desert really a big deal?

[@tonystochmal2646]

An even bigger deposit has been found in the US. Along the border of Oregon and Nevada!

[@olekatoska1901]

yeah I bet that American Lithium companies do it very differently in Nevada, isn't that right Business Insider/Axel Springer SE? I bet they have much to learn from them, let's see it, I'd love to see a complete report of Lithium extraction, the American way, done by Business Insider and their boss, Axel Springer SE. Wouldn't that be interesting too, Dr. Mathias Döpfner?

[@jimurrata6785]

Lithium mining in Nevada is hard rock mining not brine extraction. There are brines in places like the shrinking Salton Sea.

[@Zarincos]

I'm really curious what the point you're trying to make is. That work standards in wealthier countries are higher? That companies have gotten *really* good at screwing over Central/South American countries?

[@Clintoniumer]

My question...... what happens when these mines start drying up? The cost of batteries worldwide would rocket up as the supply dwindles

[@jmi5969]

Costs will certainly go up much sooner, as the mines are reaching max capacity. No big deal. Sooner or later this EV fad will subside and good old diesel will rise again. The car owner will pay for everything.

[@hav6301]

in fact when supply dwindles the cost will drop because no one would invest on it and move to the next thing

[@hobo1704]

​@@jmi5969exactly. Biggest fad in history

[@Brian-om2hh]

What happens to ICE vehicles once oil begins drying up? At least it is possible to recycled older EV batteries. They can be 95% recycled, with the lithium and cobalt being 90% recovered and reused in new batteries. Is anyone recycling and reusing old burned gas/petrol or diesel?

[@hobo1704]

@@Brian-om2hh drying up 😂 Don't believe the lies sheep. Car oil is recycled... So is car parts. You are obviously uneducated AF like most EV fans, batteries can't be recycled forever, they break down. Your arguments are totally flawed. You do realise electricity to charge EV's is created by burning coal 🙄

[@joshuapatrick682]

The Atacama isn’t one of the driest places on Earth, it is the driest place on Earth. In some parts it has never rained and the only water available is stored in the massive underground ocean underneath…now we’re evaporating that back into the hydrosphere for the first time in decades, and this will have an effect on the climate.

[@utkarshdeepak]

I just wonder why don't they use closed confined shed kind of structure to trap the vapours which then can again be used in the process. Definitely this will add to the cost but would be far most cost effective than desalination.

[@Navaneeth576]

How will the sunlight reach then?

[@utkarshdeepak8824]

@@Navaneeth576 it will work in the same way as green house

[@californigirl]

Amazing that ecologists are fine with this?

[@deborahferguson1163]

Who says they are? They aren’t!

[@ramgabriel5337]

my perception is that the water shortage was already a problem when lithium extraction began, (just maybe) caused by climate change. Big companies should be held accountable and give back to the communities what they need, but that's socialism and no wants that.

[@joefell7845]

​@@deborahferguson1163How about the environmental gestapo ?

[@francismarion6400]

Who cares. Is Greta OK with this? Maybe she needs a bath in that water.

[@semperfi6801]

Most of them are paid by billion-dollar corporations in many ways. They get paid to shut up. They get paid to go along with the company's false research or to come work for the companies selling their own souls to greed.

[@bmanpura]

Anything with "commitment" and "big mining company" summon a feeling of scepticism and comedy nowadays. Sanction works way better.

[@MeetTheSmythes]

Thank you for uploading and sharing this very informative video.

[@guringai]

Half of global lithium comes from Australia where wages are fair & environmental considerations are substantial. Things aren't perfect here but likely a less troubling scenario than Bolivian lithium, or oil drilling for that matter.

[@odorlessflavorless]

😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂

[@alileevil]

Was that why an Indian company was given the rights to mine coal in an Environmentally sensitive region? Australia's largest earner is education after mining. With the lack of any other industry or income, the Govt will not let an opportunity to export minerals slide.

[@MummaBear]

Half don't.

[@markharris6171]

Oil drilling, You're full os sh!t.

[@Mesh17i82]

All Fokus on Lithium. I will juse Oil...its better for the environment 🙃

[@motouno3778]

Unfortunately wherever & whenever USA - China or Russia gets involved in mining the end result is always catastrophic for the local population ! 😢😢

[@semperfi6801]

No one seems to put that together because these countries do an amazing job at distracting its populations, covering up the lie with propaganda, and just the fact that, especially in America, there is a huge concentration of sheeple that will believe anything and everything.

[@cvr527]

That could be said for any country doing mining.

[@trasher84]

Usa does it best, nobody left alive to suffer 😂

[@1jay288]

😂😂😂😂😂 Дак не езди на авто, не летай самолетами, не ешь продкты так как в 99% случаях они перевозятся траками с дизелным двигателем🙄

[@GeorgeMonet]

Any country mining. No reason to pretend that the US, China or Russia are magically worse.

[@Not_Built_For_This_World]

Correction: *_2nd_* "largest deposit". After the recent discovery in the McDermitt caldera on the border of Nevada and Oregon, announced last week.

[@ramheyhey]

I'm so glad this has come out. Fresh water though it's renewable. This amount of freshwater will go into the saltwater portion of the cycle

[@OrionTheta1]

Collect Rain water. Don't worry about the local water rule... it is safe, sorta. ;)

[@GeorgeMonet]

Freshwater isn't that renewable. Especially if they are pumping out groundwater which can take thousands of years to replenish. We are getting less rain and snow every year, snow melt is converting to water vapor directly instead of turning to snow melt that adds to water tables for rivers and lakes,. There is not enough fresh water to go around in many locations on Earth. Look at the news, see all the places experiencing record high temperatures and droughts.

[@EXSKIN]

@@GeorgeMonet Fcuking is in England we've had a whole July of it.

[@aristotlekumpis7095]

This is happening at the Salton Sea here in California. They are building a factory here soon.

[@agh5399]

it’s cool that some awesome mineral specimens are found at least

[@colosousaurs]

How can these lithium companies keep the people WHO LIVE IN THE COUNTRIES in the dark about their processes and agreements and sit by when they are dying of thirst?

[@tdoutdoors4545]

Gotta put human need ahead of innovation

[@fetB]

exactly, so bring these people to somewhere nice. They live in dry and barren land. This is already a pretty poor life they live, so if you actually cared, you'd get them a place somewhere nice. But then again, its not really about the people but the soulless ev's eh?

[@incognitotorpedo42]

You have to put the needs of eight billion humans ahead of Jose Morales. Climate change threatens everyone, including Jose. It also threatens most other species of life on the planet. Sorry about Jose's rough deal, but what happened to all his neighbors? They left to make a life somewhere else because the drought (climate change) made it too hard to live in the desert. Maybe Jose should do the same thing. Some places just aren't good for humans to live in.

[@milancvejic6853]

Looking at how poor in water reserves are these countries and still mining lithium. In Serbia a company was planning to mine lithium but my people protested and it didn't go thru even tho we have lots of water.

[@Gerard-Red]

A few facts to clarify concerns. 1. The salts plates of Northen Chile constains a concentration of lithium 100 times higher than the ones in Bolivia and 6 times higher than the ones in Argentina. That is the main reason why the lithium extraction in Bolivia never took off despite the enormity of the Uyuni Salar. What Bolivia has is other types of salts, much less valuable. 2. The only countries interested in investing in Bolivia are Rusia and China for political and geostrategic reason. The capitalist countries do not want to get into Bolivia because they have a retrograd socialist regime. Even McDonalds do not exist in Bolivia. 3. The North part of Chile always have been a very dry desert with very few small towns close to the Andes mountains where some water comes down from snow melting. On the coast there are quite big cities. They get water mainly from the Pacific Ocean. The many desalination plants in Northern Chile are operated with electricity mainly from solar plants wich are huge and numerous in that part of the world because they get plenty sun all year long. 4. So the water never runs out in North Chile. The more is needed the more is taken from the sea desalinated and used. Many more desalination plants are being buit and more are proyected. 5. Except from hidroponic farms, a few green valleys and small fewer oasis, there is no agriculture in Northen Chile. And the people who work in them are in no risk of not having enough water. Most of the people in Northen Chile works in mines, companies asociated with mines, ports and airports, electricity production, water production, comerce, public service or other services, including turism. 5.The Chilean man and his daugther shown in this video pretending to work in a dry garden are not representative of the people who live there. Because the people who live in northen Chile in the 99% of the cases lives in cities and earn a living from the jobs described above. He was put in the video to portrait a situation that does not even represent the 1%. 6. We live in the 21st century. We have two choices, the first is to use science and inteligence to protect the planet from further contamination and deterioration and still live a better life, or to go back to living conditions similar to three centuries ago, before the steam engines and the internal combustion engines. I think Chile has taken the first choice. Already 60% of the energy suply of Chile comes from clean sources, and every development has to pass stringent environmental impact evaluations to be allowed. 7. The situation in Bolivia is different to the situation in Chile. Because in Bolivia the culture still moves as in 1950s, and the leftist goverments uses ideology to manipulate the minds of people to reject foreign intervention in the shape of investments which is portrayed as abusive devils. To maintain control over the mases the leftist use the maxim "divide to conquer", so they have partitioned Bolivia in diverse indigenous communities and have empowered unions of workers to defend Marxist ideologies. The indigenous communities defend their lands, the unions defend the right to control everything that is done on it and the goverment is interested in heavily taxing any income. Therefore there is no room or utility margin for any company wishing to invest in Bolivia. That stop progress and maintain poverty. What is left is corruption at all levels. And wherever are natural resources and corrupt goverments, then China will have the perfect invitation to get in business.

[@misplaced7858]

If the water is evaporated, can't they condense the vapors and have pure water as a byproduct? It seems really wasteful just having the vapors escape in such a dry area.

[@cmm3338]

The amount of power it would take too run all electric vehicles is mind bending. People are being denied permits all over commercially for power stations as reports show some of these use more power than the whole town…

[@Jhossack]

Cite one actual case. Your deluded or lying. Which is it. It costs 4 dollars to charge a car. Without profit.

[@hobo1704]

​@@Jhossackyou are one inept muppet.. you're the deluded one here champ if you think the current electrical grid can handle everyone owning an EV.. Most hot countries can't even handle a summer providing aircon usage in homes..

[@Brian-om2hh]

The amount of power it takes to run the oil industry is also mind bending. Huge amounts of electricity are required just to pump crude oil out of the ground, before it even reaches a refinery..... and once it does reach a refinery, around 6kw of electricity is used to produce each gallon of gas/petrol or diesel. Then 25% of *all* the diesel produced is used to transport the rest of it to where it is stored or sold. Madness....

[@cmm3338]

@@Brian-om2hh And funny enough, if you switched to electric power right now entirely.. it would be worse for a LONG time, battery charge capacity, and efficiency is not there yet for many applications. We re getting closer though.

[@mojo-zombie]

@@Brian-om2hh Madness indeed... but that applies to both of these options. One has already raped the planet and caused possibly irreversible harm and the other is currently in the process of doing the same, a battery is just an energy storage device and electricity generation is not clean enough yet. EV's will not save the planet and there manufacture is causing considerable harm. I have no preference or answers but would question major government green policies that are pushing this short term stuff due to economics.

[@zackman1156]

I mean it sounds like we just need to pressure them/hold them to switching to sea water. We also need to insure these countries actually benefit to the fullest off these plants.

[@michaelsalama6631]

the desalination plants in chile’s atacama use massive amounts of energy, nearly all of which is fossil fuel generated. also the desalination leeches chemicals into the sea, causing high levels of cancer and other disease and kills the marine ecosystems. every solution has a drawback, but instead of opting for the most sustainable and least destructive, mining companies and government (often one and the same) just choose the most profitable option in the short term.

[@louiejohncastillo9822]

Without the Andes blocking the rain, those lithium deposits might've just washed away into the sea ages ago. Yet, if it only rained there, they wouldn't be facing a fresh water crisis.. but the trade off is there wouldn't be any lithium to mined.

[@anonymous-qm6wq]

Government should stop company using fresh water to industrial purposes

[@gallantsoul8586]

If companies are building plants planning for next 5 or 6 decades, they have already done their homework. What they need to do is build water pipelines to nearby habitable areas and provide that free of charge. In fact that must be in their government contracts.

[@BicycleFunk]

Probably too late, but yes.

[@boblatkey7160]

Well you're just dreaming if you think human beings are going to live that long.

[@gallantsoul8586]

@@boblatkey7160 Dream I must because the alternative is oblivion

[@LDK447]

We’re heading there buddy, and others have already made that decision for us a long time ago

[@louiejohncastillo9822]

it should be a problem if it is a short term (relatively). But, if the mine lasts that long, they could just make solar plants there to desalinate seawater/repurpose used water., they can use the fact that there's virtually no rain clouds all the time. when everything is done, those solar plants can be used by the locals to power their towns.

[@MultiTHEJOKER]

like the US is not doing this 😂😂😂 climate change might be real but its politics to them they dont care

[@spiffinz]

imagine being so brainwashed you believe climate change is driven by human activity

[@jonnyboy8143]

That's crazy, these companies have share some of their profit to local. They I guess someone on top is corrupt for sure.

[@mariahung2946]

water shortage in the country but the government rather let those big company having all those water used for their mining and do nothing about it for their people. should they not restrict the use of fresh water?

[@MrDaiseymay]

The government has just announced their intention to build a massive lithium battery factory, at Bridgewater in Somerset. Meanwhile, all we hear is terrible stories of negativity about EV vehicles, and what a catastrophy awaits us.

[@miepmaster25]

Saves them from building good public transport at least!

[@zweimmk]

Sodium ion batteries are on the horizon and slated to launch late this year. Assuming it does do what it promises to do then the need for Lithium should lower.

[@1jay288]

Jac yttrium 3 с таким аккумулятором🤫

[@MrDmadness]

They are so so far away from being a thing bud.. respectfully intended but I guarantee you that this is not something you will see in the next 10 years

[@dubjubs]

​@MrDmadness If I remember right the Chinese are having a difficult time making there's run at all. Seen several videos of their EVs catching fire more so than people say Teslas do

[@Leo-gt1bx]

Which will require the same mining and create the same pollution

[@JoeSharp1]

@@Leo-gt1bxI’m not sure mining salt needs to create any pollution. We already produce a lot of salt for our food systems. There are many established salt flats, it’s just a case of evaporating sea water

[@danielmoyle5503]

The only way to stop it is to reduce or eliminate the demand for lithium. If the demand is there, its profitable, and it will be done.

[@danielcreatd872]

Yeah, so why don’t you develop an alternative battery with similar energy density? Well, you can’t, because physics. There’s simply no good alternative to this, so just deal with it.

[@mikehouser8308]

The government in US needs to watch this

[@alwaysinmoney3538]

Big Oil has enough money to throw around

[@andrewyu7403]

This is nothing in comparison to the scale of environmental damage from oil and gas extractions. Water can be drawn from desalination plants powered by renewables.

[@francismarion6400]

This is only part. Hunter Briben and the Chinese are in a partnership to use child labor to clear cut and strip mine the Congo for Cobalt. It's a disaster worse than Chernobyl.

[@railroadforest30]

It’s not nothing. For example There are plans in my state to build an open pit lithium mine in Gaston County. This mine would destroy mountain forest and farmland and probably pollute clean creeks

[@MrDmadness]

You have no idea what energy even is is all I'm hearing

[@klousy58]

People screwed over by big companies.

[@JamiroquailX]

What is the cost to the planet in the long term from all of this mining activity

[@DemPilafian]

The _"true cost of oil drilling"_ on local environments is orders of magnitude worse. The whole resource extraction industry has a long history of abusing the environment (and the local people). However, this video felt more like an *oil shill hit piece than news.* The real solution is to push for rules to ensure resource extraction is done responsibly everywhere. All mining companies should have to play by the same rules and invest heavily in technology and techniques to minimize their impact to the environment.

[@m3tricfpsprivat]

Agreed

[@jb5music]

And unlike oil extraction there is a workaround for lithium pollution and resource wasting. It's called sodium-ion batteries. There is no work around for fossil fuel pollution and eco destruction

[@gomezgomezian3236]

Ah yes, the "but this other thing is also bad, maybe even worse, so we can just ignore that we are starting up a new, problematic thing" excuse. Wouldn't it make more sense to solve the problems of the new industry, before it spreads them across the environment? You know, only start a new, clean version of it, that does not, yet again, expect the poor local community to deal with all the problems for little or none of the benefits?

[@DemPilafian]

@@gomezgomezian3236 That's *NOT* what I said. You fossil fuel proponents just can't seem to ever be truthful. You think your little sneaky debate techniques are so clever. Here's your gold star for being such a good debater: ⭐

[@wonniewarrior]

Your whataboutism is glaringly obvious.

[@youxkio]

Well, this report is not bad. Although I would scare the lithium industry a little bit. I would have included the new findings in battery scientific research that proposed alternatives to lithium. Sodium-ion batteries also swerve sharply from lithium-ion chemistries common today. These batteries have a design similar to that of lithium-ion batteries, including a liquid electrolyte, but instead of relying on lithium, they use sodium as the main chemical ingredient. That means all that brine would have to be filtered, or get its water evaporated and still bring a little income to those South American countries. However, much less than lithium. But may not need sweet water in the process.

[@TonyFarley-gi2cv]

Do y'all think it'll be best to pull water out of the atmosphere than to pull it out of the ground cuz some of the water from the ground is in certain structure bases architecture it's got to be there to have certain flows and certain areas or you could take out years of sit development or if you take it in the wrong place certain areas wouldn't get their minerals

[@nancydrew1882]

Ooooh the irony! These tree huggers riding around in their Teslas couldn’t care less.

[@quor2243]

You can make a dramatic story with just about anything farmed at an industry level. Just as there is a massive amount of stories about oil and the harm it has done, of course led to the need for more lithium. There is no getting away from the need for the things that power our world. Could we care more and capitalize less, sure, but good luck making that happen.

[@blerst7066]

Yes, but no. The problem isn't that mining lithium affects the environment, it's that EVs are advertised as "green" when it's actually not. Extracting the resources needed to make EVs is just as harmful to the environment as extracting oil. It's not environmentally friendly, but few people seem to take notice.

[@quor2243]

@@danielcreatd872 Agree, but that don't excuse doing damage because it's less then oil. Or any other industry that's primary purpose is to power our world. To make things worse we still need all those other industries including oil. All EVs have done is add more demand and create a new problem. If we got rid of oil I would be all for it as we chose the lesser of two evils, but that's not the case.

[@danielcreatd872]

@@John-cp6uc Most life cycle analysis show that EVs are more environmentally friendly than internal combustion engines, even accounting for the harm done in manufacturing. The environmental damage done by lithium or cobalt mining is local and won’t affect the rest of the world, while the same cannot be said for carbon dioxide emissions.

[@danielcreatd872]

@@John-cp6uc I never said they were completely harmless. I simply said they result in less carbon emissions overall. A single fossil fuel powered vehicle digging lithium can replace thousands of other fossil fuel vehicles with its output. And as I said before, the damage of mining is mostly local.

[@danielcreatd872]

@@blerst7066 It isn’t completely harmless, but it is much less harmful. The damage done by lithium or cobalt mining is limited to the local area, unlike carbon dioxide emissions.

[@marcromain64]

Lithium does not degrade by being used in batteries, it can literally be recycled forever. But as always, as long as there are cheaper sources of newly mined Lithium, the market doesn't feel the need to do so on a wide scale.

[@Leo-gt1bx]

No it is not

[@marcromain64]

@@Leo-gt1bx Because? What do you think happens to Lithium used in batteries, chemically?

[@houstonbinkley1844]

Yeah ok.... that's why there's millions of EVs just wasting away around the world

[@marcromain64]

@@houstonbinkley1844 So, "millions" it is. Do you have any specific and reliable numbers (preferably per country/region) or are we in the area of perceived facts again?

[@houstonbinkley1844]

@marcromain64 yeah, there's endless fields in Cali, China, UK and France. I'm somewhat of a hybrid/EV tech by trade and love dismantling lithium battery's and watch them spontaneously combust due to oxygen and moisture in the air. You know ScIeNCe.....

[@coleleblanc2722]

hence why i always buy a used phone and run it until it dies. these companies promoting phone upgrades every other year are one of the biggest problems.

[@deemisquadis9437]

The worse thing they can do,, they hurt so much of the environment. Here in Canada too. It kills wildlife and destroys the land. 😢. Oil is not this damaging. 😢

[@tsunamis82]

Fossil fuels have already caused much damage. No rain since 2010 for that little girl and her father. The snow and floods, the heat bubble, the tornadoes and the hurricanes, this year alone in USA and Europe heated summer. All fossil fuels.

[@andreoproprio]

So in Chile we pump underground potable water into these evaporation pools to create brine, while in Saudi Arabia they don't know what to do with too much brine from desalination plants and pump brine back into the ocean?! I also recently learned that where I live, the sewage treatment system treats and purifies a volume that represents about half of what our biggest irrigation dam uses. But all the treated water from the plant is just dumped into the ocean instead of being reused for irrigation. Oh this humanity!!!

[@boblatkey7160]

Well that brine doesn't have any lithium in it! 😂

[@christiannunez6025]

there are reasons for what you mention

[@GeorgeMonet]

Because poisoning the land and people with water containing toxic chemicals is a great idea amiright? Calling something a brine doesn't mean it is all the same. Brine in this instance means it has a mineral salt but that salt isn't necessarily NaCl nor is necessarily a lithium salt. And the brine pumped into the ocean by plants in Saudi Arabia is very highly concentrated saltwater where they have already removed a large volume of fresh water from that brine. Well large as in 10%ish by volume. The remaining brine is a useless poison due to the extremely high concentation of NaCl.

[@pihermoso11]

I don't see Greta or Just Stop Oil protesters rallying against this, how come?

[@1jay288]

Гретта играет свою роль, как актер Зеленский играет роль президента😂😂😂

[@michaeldickins9238]

This was a concern for sometime , also reason to do solar and wind hydrogen and fusion then just battery alone ain’t enough, this reason to figure how to make the atom as alternative to mining anything, even to fix earths natural disasters and swell as much natural disasters in near future

[@user-wi4sd2pd2c]

I just love the way we kid ourselves thinking we are doing the right thing by going green!..What a load of BS, the whole thing is about profits, nothing more.

[@SuperGreatSphinx]

Mammon

[@motionsick]

Getting your cobalt as fast as we can Greta.

[@ThePilotGear]

you're aware our main cobalt needs are in the fossil fuel industry, refining gasoline to reduce sulphur?

[@boblatkey7160]

Meanwhile there are tons of lithium batteries that use no cobalt at all

[@casmatt99]

Can't wait for the breakdown of the true cost of natural gas extraction, coal mining and oil fields

[@1jay288]

300вт ээлектроэнергии тратится, чтоб произвести 1 литр бензина 92 марки, при зжигании 1 литр даст 3квт электроэнерги, чтоб произвести 1 кг литевого аккумулятора тратят примерно 1кВт электроэнергии, чтоб в конечном итого с 1 кг аккумулятора получить 200вт🧐🙄🤯 Про такое вам Гретта ни чего не скажет 😂😂😂😂

[@bizling]

7:35 I can see it's tough but my word isn't it beautiful view. He seems like great father too.

[@ianthehunter3532]

using oil powered machinery to mine material for electric 🤔

[@version1.27]

ironic

[@RutakMcLyde]

Using an established technology to make something new 🤔

[@sgt.briskee9313]

Dumbest thing I’ve read today

[@jimurrata6785]

Seems a prime location for solar, especially at those altitudes that almost never have any cloud cover.

[@drmodestoesq]

And some day they'll use electric power to build the energy systems that draw from the quantum vacuum.

[@smi07067]

The country consumes about 4,900 gallons of potable water per second based on a 2017 water served in Chile. The fresh water consumption for processing accounts for 0.8% of total fresh water usage in the country annually. Compared to the US consumption of 3.8 million gallons per second. It’s easy to make numbers sound scary without context. If the mining industry does consume almost 50% of the country’s water supply, then measures should be investigated there. Not at the 0.8%

[@DavidLucBelanger]

The problem is the amount of water they consume is affecting local communities and nothing is being done to help them.

[@thewaywardgrape3838]

@@DavidLucBelanger Because those communities are profitable to the companies, country and governments. China won't give a hoot if they use all of Bolivia's natural water, as long as it's not there initial problem, they can keep making a profit and the symbiotic nature between Bolivia's government profiting and the backlash from the citizens is heavily skewed towards ignoring the problem for the time being.

[@GeorgeMonet]

It isn't just the amount consumed but what the source of the water they consume is. A lithium mine consuming ground water in the desert is consuming a very scarce nonrenewable resource. The fact that other parts of the country have access to glacial runoff and use more water for agriculture doesn't mean anything.

[@danielmoyle5503]

Its consumption context is local. Not national.

[@thewaywardgrape3838]

@@danielmoyle5503 Since when are finite resources not a global problem? With your logic, air pollution is local too.

[@aaron___6014]

Boycott EV's save these places and these people. These people can't eat or drink lithium. The industry is exploiting people at every level.

[@FT4Freedom]

All the metals are being mined. And very few mines are properly managed.

[@hemifiedsixtyfour2813]

Industry don't care about people, just stock holders.

[@johnfarr5415]

Please do the true cost of oil drilling next. Be sure to include all wars fought over oil. All oil spills. And the impact of oil drilling operations.

[@Igor-uj1sx]

Don’t worry, it is only the beginning of lithium mining. I am sure the industry will surpass all aspects of oil and much more.

[@rcampbell4967]

Wars fought over oil are fueled by artificial factors. The US has enough oil to be self sufficient while exporting oil. IF you believe climate change is caused by human inputs, consider this: currently the life contribution of an electric car is greater than a petroleum fueled car. This will likely change as new methods of recycling lithium from spent batteries is developed, but the carbon contribution of petroleum could instantly decrease with relaxed government restrictions. The US contributes about 15% of the world's carbon emmissions. Cut it in half and statistically it would be negligible. Don't get me wrong, I'm not a scientist and I'd like to point out, neither are you. I'm all for reducing carbon emmissions on the chance that global warming is real and the chance that humans are causing it, but our savior is not electric cars.

[@Igor-uj1sx]

I said nothing about climate change, not sure why you had to write that entire essay. Electric vehicles will be pushed to the masses no matter what. Climate change has nothing to do with it. Other than being a “feel good” emotion.

[@Dethflash]

@@rcampbell4967 I'm less worried about carbon, and more worried about the forever chemicals that corporations dump into our environments that infects our water. In 2023 a study found that about 45% of US households tab water has some level of forever chemicals in it (Forbes wrote an article about it this summer), but I don't see the news talking about this every day like "climate change". Also the phrase "climate change' is kind of meaningless because the Earth's climate has changed before humans existed, and will continue to change if all humans died, remember the ice ages? Thats climate change too. In the 1970s the media thought Earth was going into an ice age, and I think we can all laugh at those predictions now. I agree that the earth warming up a lot could be an big issue, but I think the dumping of harmful toxic chemicals into the environment will poison the earth before the earth becomes too hot due to global warming.

[@rcampbell4967]

@@Igor-uj1sx I was replying to the original poster, not you.

[@yay1023]

The water belongs to the local vegetation, animals, and indigenous people in the mined areas. The governments of these countries authorizing mining licenses to foreign companies is absolutely reprehensible. These farmers and workers there are left with no power or voice when it's their land that is used in an illegal way to hurt their livelihood. Although EV cars are energy efficient ,they are likely to explode anyway due to poor maintenance/ design issues of battery assembly. More electronics, especially batteries, need to be recycled and better resource alternatives for battery manufacturing are necessary.

[@whats_skills]

I'm not an expert on any of this, but why not move soil back onto the land after they are done excavating? And why not build a pipeline to get water from the ocean? It would also provide the country with more irrigation -- which they clearly need. And let the community vote on whether or not they will allow it. But I'm assuming that the locations where they choose to mine are secluded from villages and homes. At least I would hope so.

[@hobbitsodomizer7301]

Hope these Eco friendly groups watch this. And stop forcing electric cars.

[@seanharrison3504]

I recently canceled a new order for an electric car. The batteries, among other reasons, were why I canceled it. I don’t drive that much, so my 10-12 year old car does a decent job on fuel efficiency.

[@BicycleFunk]

It is the better decision since the embodied carbon takes about 17 years to pay off versus a 25mpg gas car driving 2k miles a year.

[@seanharrison3504]

@@BicycleFunk that was my thoughts in a nutshell really 😅

[@BicycleFunk]

@@seanharrison3504 if we were sensible and innovative, we would be electrifying the cars we have now. Well, we would actually stop designing around cars.

[@clack1]

@@BicycleFunk That would be the best all around solution, and would also create a fair amount of jobs. Reusing what we made for the past 40-50 years instead of constantly producing for at least 15-20 years can have it's own impact.

[@BicycleFunk]

@@clack1 makes me think of how the guy that came up with "reduce, reuse, recycle" has so much regret because it is supposed to be in order from the best to worst option. Somehow we are doing worse, which is neither of these but create more. We cannot seem to learn fast enough.

[@kentd4762]

Meanwhile many EV owners smugly think they aren't polluting or damaging the environment...

[@cinilaknedalm]

"So Bolivia will become an energy superpower like Saudi Arabia?" "Err no"

[@jabrique]

As long as we live, we will want more comfort in our life which in turn sacrifice the environment and planet without us realising it.

[@BhavinTolia]

Heartbreaking to see the plight of that little girl... local communities that have been poor since generations could be given Govt jobs elsewhere & assisted out of the poverty that they currently live within...

[@RobAndrews18]

That's a big business they're dealing with. These locals are nothing to the operations of the companies that's why they are not given any value.

[@artmonkey4047]

Compare this to the oil industry. Polluting the entire world.

[@themoviedealers]

They're making sodium ion batteries now. Sodium is found in many places. The batteries are not quite as good as lithium, but these hurdles should be overcome eventually.

[@MrDmadness]

Where can you go buy one? Exactly... its not actually a thing