The Truth About Keeping Ammunition In Switzerland

[@gorbalsboy]

My goodness,a hypothesis proven by facts,this man is a threat to public order

[@hoilst265]

This is basically 90% of gun debate online: "If it ain't how it is in MURRICA, then it don't exist". That's...that's it. So, because you can't buying 9mm out of the vending machine in the school cafeteria in case that cheerleader who turned you down for prom took more rounds than necessary, it ain't possible to buy ammo at all!

[@CharleyVCU1988]

We mUsT trust tHe SciENCe No not like that!

[@Brazilian.Off.Duty.Cop.]

​@hoilst265 You consider yourself pro gun and say sh1t like this? Thank you for working for the enemy, we don't have enough enemies working to strip us of our freedom worldwide, right? I'm not american, btw.

[@nyet_maker7948]

😂😂😂

[@theeddorian]

@@hoilst265 That is poppycock. Ninety percent of the gun "debate" are ignorati screaming past each other, with their fingers in their ears.

[@TheFlyingPlectrum]

I'm a UK civilian living in Switzerland. The first time I ordered ammo on line I was fretting about not being home when it was delivered but imagine my surprise when I got home from work to find the clearly marked package of 223 sitting on top of my mail box in the entrance to my apartment block. I can't understand how anyone could think you can't buy and keep ammo in Switzerland there are dozens of online shops!

[@SonsOfLorgar]

Roflmao! Are you trying to give Blokes American viewers a double stroke?🤣 1) You ordered ammo for home delivery without issues. 2) It got delivered in a semi-public drop off location where it sat, in the open, in factory labeled packaging with no doubt of contents *for hours!* And it didn't get stolen!

[@TheFlyingPlectrum]

@@SonsOfLorgar Welcome to Switzerland :-)

[@DanMulberry]

@@SonsOfLorgar Uhhhh, you can do that in America too.

[@davedavids57]

@@TheFlyingPlectrum Try moving to Austria, only pistol ammunition needs any form of licence so if you want rifle or shotgun ammo it's sold over the counter with no ID needed whatsoever. Added to that you can buy a Cat C firearm with just an ID if you are an EU or Swiss citizen resident in Austria (there is a three day cooling off period though).

[@Excelnaught-f4b]

@@SonsOfLorgar Where in America can’t you do this? I live in a blue state and get shipments of thousands of rounds every few months

[@jonc4403]

I'm American, and I've known that "Swiss can't have ammo at home" nonsense was false for years. It's the same as the US, taking US military-owned ammo home is a no-no.

[@theeddorian]

It is harder to buy ammunition in parts of the US like California.

[@mikethemaniac1]

@@theeddorian Not really. Just takes a bit longer and you have to sign a paper. Unless you're trying to buy ammo online.

[@theeddorian]

@@mikethemaniac1 I live in California, and while a court decision certainly has _theoretically_ opened things up a bit, the appeals process is not over as far as I know. You cannot, under state law, buy mail - order ammunition. It is still easier in Switzerland.

[@richardprice5978]

i like the seal-can/something-like-it-methodology and illegal-governmental storage+ownership better than currently army that's not supposed to be standing at readiness for tyranny-ect can'd/set-funding-weekly is closer to how founder's will/1790's~ is mentioned

[@omirlino]

@@theeddorianor you could just drive to a neighboring state and by all that you want

[@Irishpewtuber]

What's hard to understand about that? The army's ammo is the army's property. No army in the world would allow service personnel to swan around with pockets full of issue ammunition. When we were issued ammo for the range we had to hand the empty brass back in, that's how the Irish defence forces handled that. Secondly, are you eligible for militia service there as an immigrant to Switzerland if your a naturalised citizen?

[@BlokeontheRange]

If you naturalise young enough, you're obliged to do service.

[@MrThecyrille34]

If you naturalize before the age of 30 you have to go to the military yes.

[@anonym3017]

@@MrThecyrille34 if you are naturalized before 25 you have a service duty like every other swiss guy under 25. If you are naturalized after 25 but before 35 you just get to pay 3% in additional income taxes

[@Andy-Gibb]

In South Africa in the 1980s I completed my national service and after that I was able to go once a year to the local army base and draw and pay for military ammo to use for shooting and target practice. They had 22Lr, 303 British, 223 and 308. I could buy a case of each caliber all I had to have was my military ID no for the paperwork no problem. I used to get my yearly ammo until just before the new government came to power. There was no issues. I don't think it was advertised but it was available if you had a force no. I don't know if it is still like that. All the ammo was Full metal jacket and the 303 were loaded with cordite. I was able to get a crate of 308 FNM sniper ammo one year and used that to hunt and it was the most accurate ammo I ever had. On the back of the shell it said FNM and had a circle with a cross in it. I think a crate of 22LR was 20 rand about 2 dollars US and the wooden crate held 1350 rounds of ammo in boxes of 50 rounds. I wore the barrel out of my 22LR rifle. Those were the days.

[@trioptimum9027]

I think it's just confusing because there are a bunch of articles floating around that were written for a Swiss audience that knew what the deal was with the cans, and so they don't bother to explain that private ammo was always and still is a thing, they just have a headline like "No More Ammo At Home" and then an article that talks about the phasing out of the taschenmunition without ever mentioning private ammo. It's not hard to understand when you have that context, but if you didn't and you just read the article, I could see how people would get confused.

[@maximilianmustermann5763]

I often hear people say that you are only allowed to load two rounds in a gun in Germany. They extrapolate this falsehood from the fact that hunters are only allowed to load 2+1 rounds in their rifles *while hunting*. It's supposed to prevent hunting accidents with auto-loaders I guess. But this doesn't apply to anything else. On the range, it's 20+1 round for pistols and 10+1 (sadly) for rifles. It's also hard to believe for some people that I can actually go to a gun shop in Germany and buy 50K rounds of .223 and 50k rounds of 9mm and the only legal thing I have to think about is not to overload my car (because that would be in violation of road traffic regulations)

[@baneofbanes]

Here in the states you often get people claiming that guns are entirely banned in Europe, and that gets brought up in the gun debate a lot. So for many theirs no middle ground between guns for all and no guns at all, and you get called a liar or they just don’t pay attention to you if you bring up actual European gun laws.

[@sierraecho884]

Germany is retarded. I have never seen such dumb laws, except in Australia and the UK.

[@sierraecho884]

"...the only legal thing I have to think about is.." Because you had to jump through 10 hoops prior with those dumb 1y courses and other stupid bullshit. And the gov. can still take away your ammo and guns because you have no right to own any of it, it´s a privilege in Germany not a right.

[@sierraecho884]

@@baneofbanes Czech republic and Switzerland has one of the most open gun laws. Germany and the UK on the other hand a re huge negative example. In Germany you can´t even carry most pocket knifes for the most dumb reasons imaginable, in the UK you can´t even carry pepper spray. The US laws are also dumb on some other level but at least you guys have a human right to be able to defend yourself with a fireamt which in Germany for instance there is no right for that at all. You are simply at the mercy of the Gov.

[@erik_dk842]

@@baneofbanes It's practically impossible to get a license to carry a pistol for self defense, and you're not allowed to use it for self defense at home.

[@DavidCowie2022]

I am determined to misunderstand the line about "hardcore ammunition."

[@cedhome7945]

It's all about penetration..... Allegedly 😃

[@matteoorlandi856]

It's a type of ammo to be sold only to pro, hardcore shooters. For the weekend shooters like us only casual ammunitions are allowed.

[@colbunkmust]

You need more lube when using hardcore ammo to facilitate deeper penetration...

[@markvondach3617]

😂 You made my Day

[@richardprice5978]

@@PORSCHE_COUNTRY. out-right ban on arms and ammunition-ect is dumb/stupid i can see the local fire marshal's and having parts of the year/unusually-dry that are a no-go as far as home-storage of M16/OG-1600&1780's-models and or taxpayers-rounds that's/1970's~*Swiss-models/historically-usa/+/uk better than the 2024USA's and or USA isn't meant to have a standing-army( coastal-gard/navy and local cop's&election-sharifs getting somewhat of a pass as local-militia-memberships and merchants/privateer's are meant for primary-way's )

[@Gurfi28]

Tiny correction: There are units in the Swiss armed forces that are still issued ammunition that they are allowed to take home. But those are purely professional units such as KSK, MP or KAMIR.

[@tiztiziani434]

You are refering to "Berufsformationen", which do have their own regulations.

[@trashbag5051]

Unfortunately the people that need to see this, never will. But those 300m shooters are quite something. I appreciate them and their dedication to that one very specific skill but damn, many of them are incredibly isolated from the rest of the swiss "gun community" I used to be in a 300m club and to some of those people its like unless it's a stgw90 or 57, you shouldn't be allowed to have it. There are some people there that will genuinely look at you like you're a terrorist because you say you own an AK or a suppressor, asking you "why" because all you really need is a stgw57 (painted red of course with 3000 chf worth of G+E parts) and AR15s are just toys that would never be as accurate of course. Oh and don't forget that scopes will instantly destroy the bullet trap at the 300m range, that's why theyre highly forbidden. Yes I'm a bit frustrated lol

[@DaIssimo]

In the US there are the "M1 Garand" shooters who are like this. 😆

[@thechilledonion9313]

Yeah, I know right. I still hear some people saying that the stg-90 can shoot 5.56mm Nato ammo and the swiss ammo GP90 aka 5.6mm swiss, while a regular nato rifle would explode with 5.6mm swiss. They are unable to understand that GP90 is a nato 5.56 ammo according to STANAG 4172.

[@trioptimum9027]

@@thechilledonion9313 Wasn't that actually a thing with some Spanish ammo? The CETME could handle NATO-standard 7.62, but some of the Spanish ammo was outside spec and would cause problems for your G3/FAL, or something like that? (Don't quote me, this is half-remembered and I might be completely wrong.)

[@thechilledonion9313]

@trioptimum9027 Absolutely no idea. I've never heard of that before. 😕

[@BlokeontheRange]

GP90 doesn't have the NATO SS109 bullet (it's a conventional FMJ with a plated steel jacket rather than a steel-core), but almost certainly fulfils the current requirements in AEP-97, which are in some regards more liberal than they used to be in terms of bullet weights etc.

[@HATECELL]

My favourite Swiss fudd lore is that the GP90 is slightly bigger than regular 5.56mm, so potential enemies can't use it. I'm guessing the GP90 being a slightly different ammo type, the army manuals referring to the Stgw90 as a "5.6mm rifle", and SIG/Swissarms offering a separate barrel for 5.56x45 are helping to keep this alive

[@jasons8757]

very good and informative video 👍🏻 good answers that i had wondered about from time to time as a shooter and USAF Brat here in Texas 🤠

[@neutral_af]

One slight note I'll add but it's more for general info: Outside of carry permits you're also allowed to carry a loaded firearm (rifle or shotgun) if you're a licensed hunter currently hunting. (It still needs to be unloaded if in the car or not actively on the hunt. for example you're chilling in your hunting lodge)

[@brunol-p_g8800]

*if hunting is allowed in your canton, not every canton allows hunting. For example here in Geneva hunting isn’t allowed.

[@neutral_af]

@brunol-p_g8800 Geneva is the *only* Canton that doesn't allow hunting

[@rebralhunter6069]

I've been waiting for the video so long bloke! After seeing you argue with people near daily about this on xitter as well as encountering these people myself its nice there's a concise video to show people on the topic

[@DavidCowie2022]

X is often pronounced like English /sh/ in Portuguese, so xitter would be shitter. Seems appropriate somehow.

[@Braun30]

The only ammo I was forbidden to keep was the little can of ammo for war use when entering service in case of mobilisation.

[@_f355]

Peter Santenello released a video from Switzerland just yesterday, and the Swiss guy who's been showing him around also said something along the lines of "reservists can take their rifle home, but I think they can't have ammo". I immediately thought of you :)

[@maximilianmustermann5763]

I saw that, too. It immediately reminded me of some of the stupid stuff people in Germany say about our gun laws. I talked to a German hunter recently and he was completely perplexed that I had a .357 mag revolver and 9mm guns as a sports shooter. He was under the impression that sport shooters are only allowed .22 lr for olympic shooting. I don't even want to know what other people think, who have no connection to the whole gun scene at all.

[@kleinerprinz99]

Thanks for clarifying something I never heard of. The laws do make sense for law abiding citizen and general firearm safety.

[@dereksollows9783]

Thanks from Canada. The Swiss have been mysterious. You decoded it clearly for me

[@johnberinger1]

Thanks for correcting that often read and heard mistake. I cannot count how many times I have tried to correct people on that topic.

[@Ninja-Alinja]

Thank you for confirming what I understood to be the case. I did not know though that the subsidised army ammo from the FS club is recognisably different from stuff you can legally own, so a big no-no to take unused range ammo home.

[@xboman]

Very good video in California used to be hard to get a carry permit not anymore. It’s just very expensive.

[@The_Casual_Collector]

Thank you for this clear and concise video. I had always wondered what the Swiss laws were regarding ammunition. Two of my favorite firearms I own are my Swiss K31s. Absolutely beautiful weapons. I also have a decent cache of the GP11 ammunition, awesome stuff.

[@seanrenard8171]

Well explained Bloke. I have always been baffled by this myth about not keeping ammo at home here in CH. Every member of my shooting clubs keeps ammo at home. I personally have for example several thousand rounds of 7.62 and 30-06 plus a fair wack of 9mm and 7.65. The only rule is that military subsidised ammo such as GP11 etc, purchased at the club, may only be used at the range, and should not be taken home with you

[@daskrokodil4584]

Living in Switzerland I buy most ammo in web shops and Swiss Post is delivering to my doorstep. Sometimes I buy in stores. While being member of a traditional pistol shooting club I buy 9mm privately, because it is cheaper than the army's ammo we have in the club. No-one buys 7.5mm Swiss privately (with the exception of one single package out of curiosity), because army's GP11 is so good and cheap at the range. But actually, I even buy .223 privately for my SIG 550 (usually GGG), and, of course, .308 for my hunting rifle as well as .44 Mag for revolver and lever action - .44 and .308 aren't army calibres in Switzerland, and while GP90 is quite good I can find the same price or less with comparable private offers in the web.

[@TK-rz6hj]

Love these videos, keep up the great work, bloke!

[@christheswiss390]

Good video and well researched and documented facts. Good job!

[@markvondach3617]

As someone who is in a 300 Meter club but also enjoys shoogting at private ranges and even started to compete in CMA I get shocked over and over again how little the 300 Meter fuds now about other posibiltities to shoot

[@Braun30]

I have a bag of ammo received after a WK in the early 1990s. The source was a ammo return which was too late to be loaded on return train car. Idea was to bring it up the following year and get it shot, problem was that ammo changed from Nikel coated to copper coated. So I went home with the ammo and is still is in my safe since then.

[@DavidNefelimSlayer]

Nickel plated brass. Copper coated appearance is brass. 😉

[@robgrey6183]

I'm sure they'll be by to arrest you shortly.

[@SwissBloke]

Regarding the Munitionsbefehl, it only applies to SAT-related events so your day-to-day ammo purchases are untouched. This was confirmed to us during our annual "rapport d'instruction" meeting with the higher-ups: can't take ammo during OS, FS, JS or competitions, regular practice is fine Worth noting that you can still buy ammunition from the "naughty list", you simply need a specific acquisition permit similar to when you want to buy a select-fire, and some HP are exempted from the list

[@BlokeontheRange]

Huh, that's odd they told you that, cos Munitionsbefehl Art. 1.2 is quite clear that it applies to all ammo involved in the Schiesswesen ausser Dienst... And it's also clear from either the Schiessverordnung or Schiessverordnung VBS too.

[@14goldmedals]

Cheers from 🇨🇦 interesting info. I used to own a Swiss Arms (PE-90) Classic Green (as it was marked). Great rifle and built like a tank. The folding handle makes choosing hard cases easy.

[@worldtraveler930]

I was a collector of Swiss firearms here in Texas I would Really love to get my hands-on some of that GP11 spam cam ammo if for nothing more than the Bragging Rights!!! 🤠👍🇨🇭

[@stackscustominc1]

I only spotted one thing semi wrong, RUAG did produce a batch of authentic cartridge GP90 for Swiss civilian market 2 year ago. It was new ammunition and not surplus, we bought many crates of it

[@DaibhidhBhoAlba]

Ironically, Switzerland has stricter laws on the storage of ammo components than the UK. In the UK, there's no legal obligation to keep ammunition components locked away safely, other than elements subject to an Explosives Certificate (black powder, Pyrodex and 777). In fact, anyone can buy and own most ammunition components without any licence at all, while you need a licence to buy primers and powder, but not to keep them (other than the explosives licence exemption above). And in the UK you can still legally buy S2 shotgun cartridges without a licence at all, albeit most RFDs won't sell them these days unless you present a certificate. But we can't own handguns or semi-auto fullbore, because they're sooooooo dangerous; only criminals are able to own them in most of the UK these days.

[@TheOz91]

Yeah I've seen videos of people reloading centerfire ammunition, in the UK-in their backyard. Yet, the police deemed lever-release rifles to "shoot too quickly" and thus why it is banned in the Offensive Weapons Act of 2019...

[@PaperHunter]

​@@TheOz91Shooting too quickly with the aid of pound coins in the buffer tube or a piece of card in the fire control group, making it easily semi auto.

[@florihae]

Ehm...we do not need a licence in Switzerland, to buy these things, what are you talking about? We only show a proof that we are not criminals, that's it

[@davedavids57]

I don't think ammunition components are controlled after purchase in Switzerland? I live on the Swiss/Austrian border and haven't heard it's any different to here in Austria or in Switzerland when I go shooting there. Here amazingly enough Black Powder is not subject to any controls whatsoever (apart from fire regulations about storing too much in one location). It's only pistol ammo and some jacketed modern military rifle ammo that has any restrictions whatsoever here. If you want to buy say 50,000 308 rounds to build a wall out of you wouldn't even need to show ID if you looked over 18.

[@cedhome7945]

Try explaining this concept to Mr plod when he's searching your house on a flimsy excuse. There are lots of gun grabs going on at the moment around the country.... It's for everyones safety apparently....

[@deputygunner]

very interesting. Thank you for the video

[@jon6815]

Interesting the bit right at the end - when you said that without a permit, for which you really have to provide justification, citizens cannot carry a weapon that is loaded.

[@TheWirksworthGunroom]

Meanwhile, in the UK, apparently nobody has any form of firearm whatever.

[@petergaskin1811]

Says who?

[@contactacb]

@@petergaskin1811 He's satirically repeating the often held misbelief by other countries (& many here in the UK) that no-one other than the Police and Army has a firearm, completely blanking the existence of multiple types of firearms held and used for work (pest control, euthanisation) & leisure (clays, small & large bore target shooting & much more)

[@TheOz91]

@@contactacb This is also why certain people in the UK media needed to do a "hit piece" on legal firearms ownership because the legal process of acquiring and possessing firearms apparently means letting you have them if you pass the requirements and that 10,000 people per year passing the scrutiny of getting a Firearms Certificate is "concerning" somehow. That being said, practical shooting sports are increasingly more popular in the UK, including 2-gun type events (though "two gun" here means rifle and shotgun) and also fast action shooting with .22 AR-15 rifles.

[@maximilianmustermann5763]

oi mate, you got a loicence for that foirearm?

[@fdr3898]

Some people do have guns, it's just the most heavily regulated place in the Western world... :)

[@steveclancy6474]

Yep, live there, buy online, delivered by the nice post, store at home - all legal. Just do it right.

[@recklesssquirel5962]

... does having a bunch of ammo sitting in ammo cans next to the front door count as doing it right?

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

I've never heard anyone claim you can't keep ANY ammunition at home in Switzerland. That's quite the fuddery

[@doejohn8674]

@@chickenfishhybrid44 This comes mostly up on social media discussions when someone says, oh, you know, all Swiss take a full auto machine gun home, and then someone replies, ah but they are not allowed to have ammo for it... I have seen it on twitter, youtube many times...

[@ISAACcookie]

@@chickenfishhybrid44 it's a common responce to people using switzerland as a defence for gun ownership.

[@mrfunswitch]

@@recklesssquirel5962 according to federal law, if you live alone for example, the locked front door is already gtg, because the requirement "no access for unauthorized third parties" is fullfilled. but yeah, I'd still recommend using a safe.

[@milsurpmarine8628]

Hi guys… I just came across a photo of a 24 round GP11 “Pocket Ammuntion” tin from the 1950’s. It has four K-31 clips. I knew Swiss soldiers were issued some emergency ammo but I never saw one of these tins and there is next to no information on the internet. I thought you might be able to provide a little information about them and how they were used. The tin starts out with “Merkblatt für die Taschenmunition” I look forward to your videos… good job.

[@BlokeontheRange]

It's explained in this video.

[@mrfunswitch]

great video! I'm a firearms collector here in switzerland and the article 15 of the swiss federal firearms law seems more interesting to me now. for example, I own a 40mm grenade launcher (perfectly legal) and therefore I'm allowed to own non restricted 40mm less lethal rounds, like the B&T SIR for example. but does that mean, people from a canton, in which they can't get grenade launcher permits, are not allowed to own any 40mm ammo because they can't own the firearm for it? I always thought people are allowed to own any non restricted ammo, as long as they're qualified for owning firearms in general.

[@BlokeontheRange]

No, they only have to fulfil a requirement of Art. 24 WV to be able to buy it. That's the only requirement.

[@mrfunswitch]

@@BlokeontheRange thanks for the quick reply but art. 24 is about importing firearms and ammo. how does this affect Art. 15? 😅

[@BlokeontheRange]

Art. 24 WV is not about importing firearms and ammo. I think you're looking at Art. 24 WG, which is indeed about that. Art. 24 WV contains a specific reference to Art. 15 and 16 WG.

[@mrfunswitch]

@@BlokeontheRange sorry, my bad. here's the text of the art. 24 wv: "Section 3: Acquisition of ammunition and ammunition components (Articles 15 and 16 WG) Art. 24 1 If ammunition or ammunition components for a weapon are transferred, the transferor must ensure that there are no obstacles to the transfer in accordance with Article 8 Paragraph 2 WG. 2 The transferor may assume that there is no obstacle if: a. there is no indication to the contrary; and b. The person purchasing the weapon presents an exceptional permit or a weapons acquisition certificate that was issued to them at least two years before the acquisition, or a valid European firearms passport. 3 If the transferring person doubts, due to the circumstances, that the requirements for the transfer are met, he or she must provide the transferee with a private extract from the criminal record information system VOSTRA, which was issued no more than three months before the transfer, or with the written consent of the person to be acquired requests the necessary information from the relevant authorities or persons." the art. 24a WV is only about magazines. so as I read it, even tho the art. 24 wv is about the art. 15 wg, it doesn't say that you're allowed to own ammo for a firearms you're not allowed to own (at least that's what I understand when reading art. 24 wv). what do you think about that? I mean all the regular ammo like .22lr to 50bmg for example include firearms which every gun owner in switzerland can own but as I already mentioned, some cantons don't issue 40mm grenade launcher permits at all and so according to the art. 15 wg, people who live in cantons, which don't issue grenade launcher permits at all, would be prohibited from owning dedicated 40mm ammo, like the B&T SIR rounds for example (the only exception would be people who already acquired a 40mm grenade launcher while living in a different canton, which granted them a permit for a 40mm launcher). but it would also mean, that hornets nests for .22lr for example, would be legal for them. I guess I'll make a video about this topic in the near future.

[@BlokeontheRange]

I find the edge cases interesting, but I don't think there'd be an issue buying 40mm ammo that's not explosive so isn't prohibited as such.

[@christophers.8553]

Sir, what are the three weapons behind you? I love the "apelflage" sling.

[@krockpotbroccoli65]

I know now why GP11 is so hard to find.

[@Ungood-jl5ep]

Their reimported GP11 must be insanely expensive.

[@gregkollaeg2365]

I just buy from Sellier and Bellot 🤷‍♀️

[@luloadventure]

Thank you so much for sharing this explanation. Danke vielmals. FG

[@JohanLundgren-t6n]

Clear and informative but just a small question why a mem at 2:04 refering to Sweden? 😂 on a side note the rules about ammunition appears similar in both countries.

[@BlokeontheRange]

ThAtS ThE JoKe

[@NeoMarv]

Because in Switzerland there is a joke that americans always think of Sweden while the discussed topic is actually about Switzerland. Mainly because both countries start with "Swi... Or Swe" which sounds similar and both countries are associated with snow and or mountains or both.

[@jet1748]

Thanks for clarifying that you can store loaded gun at home in secure storage. So then additional loaded mags in the same location is fine as well. Even 30+ mag capacity if your permit allowed acquisition of a high capacity mag. gun. 11:46 Do you interpret the lack of detail in the storage law as being able to also have a fully loaded mag + a round in the chamber if the gun is stored safely? Not sure I would want a chambered round but just asking for full clarity.

[@BlokeontheRange]

There's nothing prohibiting it. Also if you live alone, "secure" means "inside your house such that a random visitor couldn't gain access" for most things where there's not a further requirement due to the gat being on an ABK or SON requiring it.

[@PendragonDaGreat]

I went ahead and DL'd this video in case the YT overlords get uppity. This is an excellent resource. I never fully believed that private ammo was verboten in Switzerland, but the lie/half truth is just believable enough that it will definitely persist as long as it's useful to someone.

[@Subgunman]

Never checked your bio, wasn’t aware you were Swiss! That English accent had me fooled ! Bravo! Having lived in the states all of my life until I moved to the Southern EU back in 2006, I was an avid collector of WWII firearms and well as modern firearms which included semi auto rifles and pistols, not to mention hunting shotguns. Now moving to the EU I had to sell off my collection of "toys" since the country I moved to is not a gun friendly place. Trying to get a permit here for even a shotgun for trap, skeet or sporting clays is ridiculous! Must be a member of a club participating in such events. This means traveling to other parts of the country for some of these events. Not an easy task considering one must take a ferry boat to get to the mainland. One must also have a transport permit for said type of firearm. Now there is a catch 22 to this. When you apply to purchase a shotgun many fail to also apply for a transport permit as well. Yeah, nice forget to do that and your butt is in a sling. How did that weapon get to your home? In your car, how else. Where is your transport permit? What permit? No one informed me I needed a transport permit. It’s like the question, "Do you still beat your mother?" Any way you answer it you're in deep sh!t! As for handguns it is more restrictive,you must be in a club for at least a year and have competed in at least six events to qualify for a permit to purchase. Now to purchase any firearm, you need to get a psyche exam at a government subsidized hospital by a government psychiatrist! One must have served in the military as well. Well my service was in the states and the country I currently reside in are NATO members. I am a qualified military rifle and pistol instructor as well as an armorer for a multitude of military and civilian small and medium arms. Well I guess it’s not good enough for them including a military psyche exam from the military in the states. Go figure, as we say in the states "Fear the government that fears your firearms" and "a man with a firearm is a free citizen but those without are subjects of the state ". Thank goodness the Swiss got it right!

[@BlokeontheRange]

I'm not Swiss. Yet.

[@francisdec1615]

@Subgunman And I thought getting a gun the legal way here in Sweden was a humiliating process... The problem is that you are a law-abiding person. If you were a scum doing crimes for a living, it'd be easier to get a gun than getting it the legal way back in the US. What baffles me the most is that people don't revolt against this evil nonsense. Here in Sweden no one has ever really tried to stop "gun control", since gun licenses were introduced in 1934, and it's similar in most of Europe. The Holocaust took place here and most people murdered by Stalin were from the European part of the USSR. Still people can't get it into their heads that they have a right to own the means to protect themselves against the government.

[@Subgunman]

@@francisdec1615 there were thousands deported from Greece during WWII as well, most of the Jewish population was eliminated as well as Roma not to mention many villages were reduced to smoldering rubble and the entire population of said villages were brutally executed whenever it was found that the partisans who fought against the Germans were captured or were ratted upon by the father of the current Priminister of Greece. This is what I was told by many old timers who lived through these times on the western end of Crete. Yet today firearms are heavily regulated because of family vendettas on both the Island of Crete and the region of Mani on the southwestern region of the Peloponnese. The latter region is where the government sent in troops to defuse the vendettas. Today there are new vendettas between the trash of the Roma community that for various reasons they have been fighting but this in turn has angered many of those Roma who wish for a peaceful co existence with the majority of the population. Now these individuals who are causing problems have acquired firearms but it seems that law enforcement has not placed enough emphasis into researching where the firearms come from. It would appear that the government here just uses this as an excuse for maintaining a ban on firearms. What will happen if this spills over into the general population? Those few who have a licensed shotgun for hunting or sport will be able to defend themselves and family if need be but the government will throw the book at them and jail them for no reason than trying to protect their families. Several years ago Italy passed a "Castle Doctrine" that allows owners of legal licensed pistols or hunting guns to protect their homes from intruders without the fear of being prosecuted. A very logical decision by the politicians considering there has been a massive rise in crime with the migrant events that have flooded Italy in the past decade.

[@TheTeeWorldsfreak]

Online ordering guns and ammo is super convenient. Coming from a country not being able to order ammo online...

[@MistyShadows]

Correction on "California Carry". In California, thanks to the Bruen decision, there is no longer a requirement to justify a carry permit. You still need a permit and the process can be expensive and take awhile, but if you have a clear record you should be able to acquire one. This is a pretty recent (last year or two) change though.

[@samuelbean9928]

But we here in Maryland still have to prove our innocence prior to purchase ie. the dreaded HQL. what a f#$king joke. Long guns and shotguns not so much but my state really doesn't want you to have a handgun.

[@francisdec1615]

Why do you need to "justify" anything when the 2nd Amendment clearly says that firearms should be owned and carried without infringement? What a shitty charade! Though here in Sweden you need to "justify" owning any modern gun at all and you can't get a license to carry at all, though you can apply for one (the chance that it will be granted is literally smaller than 1 in 1 million). I would rather get caught with an illegal pistol than going through the humiliation with compulsory shooting club membership and the other nonsense that is needed for the "privilege" to own a pistol here, but unfortunately I don't do crime for a living, so I have yet to find one. The criminal gangs on the other hand have all the guns they want.

[@bower31]

​@@francisdec1615 Several of the US states deeply resent the constitution and do everything in their power to stomp on it, even if it's illegal, because they know the court proceedings can be dragged out for decades

[@francisdec1615]

@@bower31 I know. It's a disgrace, since the US constitution, if followed 100%, would be the greatest on Earth.

[@jameslooker4791]

I remember hearing some version of the army stopped issuing ammunition because rifles and ammo were being stored carelessly and lost ammo became a point of frustration for soldiers and commanders.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Nope, it was cos there were always a few suicides / homicides with the Taschenmunition, which the Feds found embarrassing. Losing your spam can was a chargeable offence.

[@jameslooker4791]

​@@BlokeontheRange I was on tour in Switzerland, and I received a fairly accurate but brief description of how things had changed from a British tour guide. Basically, everyone in militia service used to keep ammo and rifles at home, but that the rules had been "relaxed" to not mandating at home storage and not being issued ammunition. I got the impression it was a compromise meant to make service easier and less intrusive. I never heard the fudd lore about not being allowed to keep ammo at home. "No ammo at home" immediately seems less like gun control or gun safety and more like they just don't want you to have a gun. I mostly have a nose for those things because I live in California. Israel and South Africa have limits on how many rounds you are supposed to store at home, and ammo must be stored in a gun safe. Even there the regulations are genuinely targeted at addressing ammunition theft. I'm more curious what the regulations on firearm components is like in Switzerland. I'm mostly familiar with the US/California and South Africa.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Depends what the component is, it can either be free, or require the same permit as a whole firearm.

[@trioptimum9027]

So, to give a TLDR from a different angle, there is CERTAIN ammunition that you can't take home (because it belongs to the army, or because it is subsidized and sold real cheap at a club for use there and so still kinda partly belongs to the army), and also if you're under 18 you can shoot at a club but you can't take ammo home. But if you're over 18 and your ammo didn't come from the army, you're good.

[@tdevosodense]

Here in Denmark 🇩🇰 we can 6000 rounds of small arms ammo (handguns) and 1000 rounds for riffles ,and it have to in a gunsafe Info - we have around 500.000 firearms registered for hunting and sports shooting 👍🤘

[@dunbar555]

LoL, I keep about 50k ammo at home... and guess what.. only 5k are 22lr

[@wrxs1781]

Nothing the matter with that, you wont run short.

[@armd_n_rdy]

Thanks for straightening that out to all those gullible "googlers". Good job!

[@DagaYute]

This got me remembering - growing up in Hong Kong even though guns were heavily regulated there was actually a Swiss Rifle club which allowed Swiss citizens to shoot their annual rifle qualification on the local (then) British Army ranges. Is this common for the Swiss expat community in other places?

[@BlokeontheRange]

Yes, it's still a thing.

[@johnberinger1]

It even existed in Beijing during the 1990s.

[@DagaYute]

@@johnberinger1 pretty neat!

[@imperialhonorguard1483]

I got a K31 for 485 from royal tiger imports. It's a 1936 production

[@chocol8thunda]

Heard UK accent....stayed for the info. Up here in Canada, I order ammo online all the time. UPS shows up with a 1000 round brick of 9mm. heavy. has no idea...I let em know, some are cool, other are horrified. Ive bought 90% of my firearms online.

[@robgrey6183]

Here in Wyoming I've bought most of my fi*r*armzs face to face, for cash, with no records kept.

[@mooslionheart]

yeah Othias , ‘War Were Declared!’🦊

[@teddyrasputin3850]

There you go again with your facts, details, and proof.

[@togsikmale5625]

I am Swiss and I order large quantities (10,000+) of every caliber due to the lower price. So every now and then a lorry unloads a whole bunch of ammo at my house. Most of my Swiss acquaintances have no idea how that works, believe it’s illegal and are always very surprised to see the palettes in my basement.

[@davedavids57]

Is there a limit to the amount of ammo you can store before you have to tell the local authorities in case of fire? I think in certain Bundeslander here in Austria there are rules to protect the fire service. You can still keep as much as you want technically but the fire service want to have details.

[@SwissBloke]

@@davedavids57 Depends on the canton (state). Zürich, for instance, limits the storage to 300kg of ammunition without permitting from the cantonal fire police (VVB art. F § 17 let. e)

[@trioptimum9027]

To be fair, I would also be surprised if I went in someone's basement and they had palettes of ammo. One palette, okay, you can stack all your ammo on it and it keeps it off the floor, maybe your basement gets damp, makes sense. More than one? That's a double-take-inducing amount of ammo. (Full disclosure: I have a double-take-inducing amount of cheese in my fridge right now, because it was on sale at a good price and I know it'll last. So I'm not judging.)

[@daskrokodil4584]

Looks like you're into IPSC or is there any other reason to buy ammo not in the usual amounts of 1'000 or 2'000 rounds? ;-) I mean I pay between 11.50 and 12.50 for 50 rounds of 9mm, is there still a huge advantage in price to buy 10'000 rounds instead of, say, 2'000? Most people I know would start to reload in this range. The question is serious I am at this point myself.

[@stevin8415]

There is no mention of reloading or restrictions on quantity. Any laws in place for that?

[@lordofabanshee6791]

That sling with the Taz 83 Camouflage...where can i buy it? Greetings from Lozärn ❤

[@BlokeontheRange]

Snacky Progress

[@lordofabanshee6791]

Thanks 🎉

[@alfiocaldelari9930]

At last!!!!!!!!!! So tired of hearing that falsehood. Finally someone made a video about it.

[@kit6580]

Hi, when you say that it is cheap, how does it compare to the exported ammo price? (GP11 and GP90)

[@BlokeontheRange]

Minimum price is .35, max is .50, depends on whether the club puts a margin on it. Re-imported ammo is over 1.00, haven't seen any for ages though so I'm sure it would be more nowadays.

[@Eledore]

Question; Can or is there a clause that allows inspection of gun and/or ammo storage.. As here in Belgium I get a call for a inspection nearly every four years.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Yes. It was always the case for full auto permits, but there's some new caselaw from Solothurn allowing a general control.

[@Foche_T._Schitt]

Oi mate! Ya got a loicense fer dat Gee Pee Elevon?

[@firefox7658]

In the end you said that you don't have to store firearms unloaded. From what I've heard, fully automatic firearms need their bolt removed when in storage. Is it true?

[@doejohn8674]

Full auto weapons: the bolt has to be stored separately and locked up, most cantons impose a few rules on the weight of the safe or that it has to be fixed to the wall for example.

[@firefox7658]

@@doejohn8674 Which cantons in particular?

[@doejohn8674]

@@firefox7658 Vaud imposes a min. weight or fixing the safe to the floor/wall to store bolts of a full auto firearm

[@eichof01]

Yes for full auto you have to store the bolt out of the gun. But Semi you can store loaded.

[@dominichuber4181]

So did i understand it correctly, that you can store your firearms loaded at home? (Min 11:12 ) I was always wondering if i can keep my gun loaded at home or not. Even certain gunshops tell different stories. Regards from Aargau.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Yes you can. Provided no unauthorised person can access it. Anyone who says otherwise should be invited to show in the WG or WV where it says you can't.

[@eichof01]

According to the police in zug, you can store the weapon loaded.

[@dmeinhertzhagen8764]

Is it true that if you are a Swiss citizen and a volunteer in the Swiss military, you can be provided with all the ammo you want for free if you wish to train or target shoot in your own personal time?

[@BlokeontheRange]

No.

[@dmeinhertzhagen8764]

Ok thanks

[@Sman7290]

HOLY SH*T! Was that a box of Chinesium 7.62x39? I vaguely remember that used to be a thing here.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Kyrgyzstani lead core (cos we can't have steel core).

[@mosescelica17]

I once linked a video of yours discussing this topic in the past to someone on reddit, and they still refused to accept that it was the truth...

[@JoelDübendorfer-p8z]

People online: "You can't have ammunitions at homes in Switzerland...." Me: "Wait a sec, the postman arrived whit my 2000 rounds of 7.62x39 at my door you have to excuse me."

[@BlokeontheRange]

Exactly...

[@PurpleFinchFarm]

@ Bloke on the Range Forget guns for a minute. I want your chair. That's super nice. LOL

[@BlokeontheRange]

I have a matched pair of them and I love them :D

[@wacojones8062]

Thanks!

[@peteraugust5295]

Im Sorry, but could you kindly shorten the stock of your CZ Trail by 3 cm? Or buy a shorter silencer?`There was a chance for perfect symetry wasted in this image composition and we cannot have that!

[@cheesebuger13]

Do you guys need to run a background check whenever you buy ammo? I have to every time I do in NY(I know it's the least firearm friendly part of the US).

[@_f355]

I live in Sweden, so can't speak for Switzerland, but here (and in majority of Europe) you need a firearms license to buy ammo, and of course there's a background check in the process of getting one. after that, you can just buy ammo, as much as you want, but if you do ANYTHING nasty - a bar fight, DUI, or simply get too many speeding tickets - the police would come and take your license, your ammo and your guns.

[@BlokeontheRange]

The answer is in the video.

[@chickenfishhybrid44]

And that's a relatively new law in NY?

[@Steven-jz1bl]

@@_f355 En France aussi c'est assez similaire sauf pour quelques calibres militaires ou il y a des quotas...mais sans permis de chasse valide ou licence sportive impossible d'acheter des munitions légalement.

[@DaibhidhBhoAlba]

This is a core difference between the USA and every other weather country. Outwith the USA, we need a background check to get a firearms licence. Once you have the licence, there are no further checks. The licence normally lasts for 5 years, but it can vary between countries. In the USA, because you don't really have any licences for buying or keeping firearms, some states require you to have a background check whenever you buy new guns or ammo. But those checks are nowhere near as thorough as the checks other countries do before issuing firearms licences.

[@EanBezemer]

Bloke.. ever since the Bruen decision, "California Carry" isn't a thing.. may issue isn't allowed anymore, all counties are shall issue, albeit some are easier than others.

[@SamF-vc9gh]

Hey bloke. In south africa we have a s13 and s16 license. There are a couple more categories,but thats the two most use. FA ppl like you and me use s16. S13 for a self defence pistol(5 year license) only allowed 200 rounds on you/ stored at home in a safe. S16 sport shooting license(10 year license) you can license as many as you want ,each gun has its own license and time attached(10years) renew after its 10years,as long as you can motivate why you need it. You can own unlimited ammo with this license,ammo is only allowed what the rifle uses. Cant buy ammo for a FA you dont have a license for. Also you are Only allowed 2.4kg of powder that is safely stored. Everyrhing must be stored in a safe. Our laws are somewhat similar.

[@posttenebraslux200]

"your entire shooting experience is at a 300m rifle club" good god

[@RME1911]

Is handloading/reloading your own ammunition allowed in Switzerland?

[@BlokeontheRange]

Yes. For your own use.

[@dcs6500]

I guess you will have to do a video on the Swiss self defense laws next.

[@daskrokodil4584]

Self defense is not a thing in Switzerland. While in Switzerland no-one wants to tell you what you can or cannot do inside your home it is quite hard to get a carry permit (if not impossible for most people). Good message: when I leave my flat the last thing I ever would need would be a gun - except when I go to the range or hunting.

[@robgrey6183]

@@daskrokodil4584 I guess I could say the same thing about my community here in Wyoming. But I have a natural right to defend myself, so I carry a gun. The State does not interfere with this here.

[@daskrokodil4584]

@@robgrey6183 I'm the last person to deny someone a right. Before the “harmonization” of Swiss gun laws with the surrounding EU carry was not a topic in Switzerland. I tried to figure out why this was changed - and did not find any other reason. The upside is that we “Inländer” (comparable to green card owners without citizenship) can have guns the same way the Swiss can.

[@BlokeontheRange]

It's the usual reasonable force thing. And there's no prohibition on using a gun for self-defence in your domicile / on your property. But it's so safe it's really just a theoretical consideration.

[@matthewtalich9989]

I've always wondered about the handgun ammunition laws in Europe. I've heard hollow points and expanding ammunition is illegal. Is this actually true? Are there exceptions for large game hunting? For instance where I live in the United States if you're hunting large game like deer, elk, bear, or moose a handgun must fire an expanding bullet. Exemptions are made for hard cast lead bullets like Keith type semi-wadcutters since though these bullets don't expand they lack a jacket to stop expansion. Of course laws regarding handguns for hunting vary by state and though handgun hunting in the USA seems to have started in the west with prominent figures like Elmer Keith its more common in the eastern United States were laws Force hunters to use less powerful short range firearms like muzzleloaders, straight wall pistol cartridges, and shotguns loaded with slugs or buckshot and bottleneck rifle cartridges are prohibited from being used for hunting but are legal to own but are only legal to shoot on shooting ranges.

[@BlokeontheRange]

Every European country has its own laws on ammunition.

[@rff999]

Not only are you allowed ammo at home, but there are even laws about how to store LARGE quantities in any one room at home (for fire reasons) based on weight of powder etc... 😊

[@dynamike72]

Lee Enfield carbine , middle gun, Rare

[@JackLucas-jh1eo]

All of this is strange to me. Living in Texas, there are half a dozen places within ten miles of my home where I can buy any type of firearm, excluding fully automatic firearms, or ammunition. In the case of fully automatic firearms, one may acquire them under license. I suspect that the new Administration may promulgate a law that enables "concealed carry" through out the nation.

[@narmiak]

This is more ore less how everything looks in Poland as well. You can only have ammo to guns that you have, some "naughty" types are prohibited, and depending on your permission type you may not be able to buy a gun in certain calibers (like .50 BMG) = you are not allowed to have this ammo. We also have similar storage requirements so if you want to keep guns in your home you need to buy a safe with S1 certification (or better). As for transporting guns and ammo - it depends. In public transport you are advised to keep gun and mag separated if mag is loaded, but if you travel in your own car or even carry a gun on your person (depends on permission type for that specific firearm), you are sometimes allowed to keep loaded mag inside, but in general you are not allowed to have one in the chamber if you are a civilian.

[@scottessery100]

I wonder if this accounts for the 220 broomstick related retirements in 2022 in Switzerland 🇨🇭 compared with 42,200 in the USA 🇺🇸 in the same year 😢

[@benno66691]

Just buy up to 1000 ammo at some weapon store. Only thing needed: ID. Also oline no problem. Sincerelly, a Swiss (multiple) weapon owner

[@BlokeontheRange]

You must be in Valais... The rest of the country observes Art. 24 WV.

[@deadsweetheart1]

I live in the us and never heard this about Switzerland

[@andersalbertsson215]

Is there a limit on privately owned quantities of ammo?

[@davedavids57]

No, although some places limit the amount of ammo being stored in one place due to fire regulations (for example large cities). But that would be 10,000s of rounds and then you would just have to talk to the city about fire safety (they won't want tones of black powder or ammo stored in apartment blocks).

[@eichof01]

No!

[@carlcarlton764]

What? You still get 7,65 Luger from the state? That's a blast from the past.

[@huntersmillie00]

After the U.S. Supreme Court "Bruen" decision, we here in California no longer need "just cause" for applying concealed carry permits. Although the wait times, application fee, psych test, references, etc. are required and takes anywhere from 6 months to a year to get it.

[@muttomaki1]

Bloke, great videos as usual ! What we Yanks need from our dear Cousin Jack is for you to sweet talk the GP11 makers into sending GP11 by the boat load to the U.S. 😀

[@paulscountry456]

Swiss collaborated with Germany and they were not invaded,they needed the rail lines open.

[@BlokeontheRange]

The Germans could have cut off most of Switzerland's food and almost all of its fuel any time they wanted.

[@SafetyProMalta]

Fudds be Fudds...😂

[@pripjatyfighter3786]

How many round was in the taschenmunition can?

[@BlokeontheRange]

As I said in the video, it varied over time. The can in the video contained 24 rounds, as can be seen from the markings.

[@pripjatyfighter3786]

​@@BlokeontheRange Thanks! It was only 1 can that you can have at home?

[@BlokeontheRange]

As stated in the video. They were issued 1 spam can of Taschenmunition. That was the only Army ammunition they could keep at home (and indeed were obliged to keep at home).

[@jameslooker4791]

The fudd lore I grew up with about Switzerland was, "Every Swiss man is required to keep a rifle and ammo in their home by law." Followed by "So obviously gun control is ridiculous." That was then explained to me as "Swiss men under the age of 30 were required to keep a rifle and ammo at home for many decades, but it became an anachronism after the Cold War ended, and now most rifles are kept at local arsenals."

[@BlokeontheRange]

But almost nobody keeps them at local arsenals (which aren't necessarily that local), cos it's a real ballache to have to go to/from to get your rifle for when you need it (repeat course; Feldschiessen; Obligatorisches). Most are kept at home.

[@mikesuch9021]

No Hardcore? Shoot we got Jello that's Hardcore.

[@H.Green83]

Can you have federal hst or gold dot hollow points? Or are they considered too effective?

[@BlokeontheRange]

i am pretty sure they're on the naughty list.

[@davedavids57]

@@BlokeontheRange Does the work around of the The Expansion Mono-Block (EMB) 9mm or Gecco Action Extreme 9mm exist in Switzerland? Fiocchi, Gecco and a few other companies make them and they expand like hollow points but they are copper and machined to expand so they aren't strictly hollow points. They are widely sold here in Austria but we do have a lot loser home defence laws that you guys over the mountain.

[@mrfunswitch]

hollow points are forbidden regarding pistol calibers but black hills honeybadger for example is legal.

[@H.Green83]

@@mrfunswitch crazy I have some of the honey badgers and they’re re nasty little rounds lol have them staggered in my edc with hst’s

[@kingerikthegreatest.ofall.7860]

It grows in the fields.

[@KRN762]

I gotta ask. How did you end up in Switzerland? Was it a gun related decision, or did you just dig the scenery and wristwatches? LOL

[@BlokeontheRange]

yes, and more...

[@juhokuusisto9339]

It was the Toblerone.

[@baneofbanes]

Nah he’s just a very big fan of watches and pocket knives.

[@EarlHildebrandt]

​@@BlokeontheRangeSo the old "business, then pleasure" border crossing joke.

[@radis_noi_r]

I'm living in switzerland for 5 years now and never heard about this fuddlore.

[@doejohn8674]

It's mostly on social media by people who are not living in Switzerland

[@maximilianmustermann5763]

@@doejohn8674 It's Americans who were raised under the impression they were truly special in the world with their 2A, and they can't accept the fact that other people in other countries have guns and ammo, too. 😂

[@raman5329]

@@maximilianmustermann5763 Yep, but they actually can shoot their guns everywhere, not just own them and scare the 300m fudds with the idea of a scope....

[@jon6815]

We who don't live in Switzerland tend to be impressed by the liberality of its gun ownership laws. In Israel where I live, the laws are very strict, you have to fulfil various criteria in order to be eligible for a license, you can only own one pistol and the laws governing its use are very strict - for the purposes of protecting life only. That said, gun owners are expected to carry their weapons loaded (not charged).

[@Nontactical1014]

So basically you can't have the government's ammo in your home understandable.