The Tube Upgrade That Changed EVERYTHING

[@blueriverlore]

I was in the US Air Force from '73 to '78 and was a Weather Equipment Specialist. The equipment I repaired was all tube based with 100s of different types of tubes. One of my duties was testing and burn-in of a new batch of tubes to keep stocked in inventory. We also had a similar tube-tester that you'd find at many TV and radio repair shops back-in-the-day BUT made for military specs. I'm sure they overpaid for the tester. I enjoyed that part of my job and learned a lot about tubes and theory. I think it rather cool that some of the tubes used in weather radar, transmissometers, rotating beam ceilometers and such have found another purpose all these years later. Nice review Rick.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Thank you - and thank you for the comment!

[@jasonsmith9845]

Thanks for this video and for helping me in my process! I have Quicksilver Horn Monoblocks with KT88's. I have had them since late 2020. I haven't had anything else in them as I bought them used on ebay... So I'm at the point now where I wonder if it's time to rotate some other tubes in there. I'm really happy with the Horn Monos (paired with 1981 Klipsch Cornwalls with new Crites drivers). Not sure what brand the tubes are but they're Chinese. I've been looking at options, but this seems like more than I hoped to pay. From reading, I think I'll stick with KT88s as I hear they have the bass and better for Rock which is my main genre. I was hoping to pay less than $300 for a matched quad, but maybe I could put a little more in and get more out with Ray... You've got me thinking so thanks for that.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Hey Jason! Thanks for watching. Let me know what you end up going with. Thise Quicksilver Monoblocks are awesome - a friend of mine has them as well.

[@orangecountycargeek2226]

I love your channel. It's my Sun morning workout 'sound track'. I just can't get over the fact that these are Chinese tubes. There are plenty of reissue tubes from Electro-Harmonix (their own new production E-H, Gold Lion, Mullard, & Tung Sol) that are of the same price and sometimes cheaper if you find them on sale.

[@patbarr1351]

The thing is, there are a lot of small co's in China & Hong Kong that are have "boutique" and medium-size factories producing audio products. I don't see the same thing in Russia. It's a shame that the leaders of both countries are so imperialistic & talented designers happen to live there.

[@szh70]

@@patbarr1351 Ture. But EH is American owned. Profits come back to the USA.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Cheers - and thank you

[@johannkrist]

I had a talk with a Hifi engineer the other day about tubes. He argued that sounding different wasn´t the same as sounding better. As the manufacturer designed the electronics with specific tubes in mind. I just bought a new pre-amp designed around New old stock Telefunken tubes and I swear that it produces pure magic. Only regret is that I didn´t purchase it earlier. The Pre-amp is Vincent SA-T7 Diamond.

[@tothemax324]

Tele smooth plates are in my stash, best sounding preamp tubes I have heard.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

I have NOS Telefunkens in my Galion TS120. I'll never pull those out.

[@dizzle1119]

I installed a Ray's Reserve Series 6SN7 in my Black Ice Audio F360 stereo preamp some months back and I couldn't be happier. If they ever drop Reserve Series 12AX7 tubes, I'll buy a pair of those as well (for my Black Ice Audio Fusion9 MkIII phono pre).

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Good to know! I'm thinking of trying out their Select 12AX7s and 12AU7s. If a Reserve series option comes out that would be even better.

[@VinylRescue]

Oh yeah, Foghat - Fool for The City is my Foghat favorite LP.🎸🎸🎸 Those tubes are a bit pricey for the 12AX7, but maybe someday for my phono preamps.

[@DaSixSixOne]

I have a pair of Ray Tubes KT88 Select to be delivered today. I ordered them as I already have the RT EL34 Reserve and they sound very good. I also ordered RT EL34 Selects but it got delayed as RT said the entire batch they last received did not pass Select standards. Happy to hear they have such high quality control standards.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Let me know what you think of the KT88s when youve had some time with them.

[@LetThereBeSound1]

Both so-called “new production” Gold Lion and Tung-Sol tubes are made by the same company in Russia called New Sensor. They are basically mid-level / average tubes for the most part so I’m not surprised the new tubes outperform them but congrats though! Of the current “new production” tube companies I favor the JJ Electronic from Slovakia. To me these are superior and more reliable than any of Russian tubes coming out of New Sensor in my humble opinion. Your mileage might vary. But in my experience nothing beats hand-picked vintage NOS tubes. Without a doubt.

[@BobCoalWater]

I also settled on JJ's, in my case the E34L's, I even prefer them to my NOS Wing C's from the original manufacture.

[@russbetts1467]

I have just acquired a matched pair of NOS Russian 'Reflektor' 6N23P tubes from Ukraine. These are 6922/ECC88 equivalent tubes, manufactured in 1975. I have been aware of their highly regarded quality for many years. To finally be able to get my hands on a pair for my World Audio Design KLP1 Pre-amp, has made my year. They are currently 'Burning in' and already sound superior to the non-descript 6922's which were in the Pre-amp. I've recently had it re-capped, as it was getting noisy; hence the decision to get the Reflektor tubes. Russ. UK

[@chrislj2890]

EL34 matched quad Select for $310 and Reserve for $860. That's a big noooooo!

[@RobotronR6]

Just get some Mullards at that point.

[@chrislj2890]

@@RobotronR6 Yes I have the Mullard EL34 tubes and I like them a lot. But currently I have the Psvane Horizon tubes installed and they are nice also. To be truthful it's not like I hear a vast difference in tubes anyway, I'm just playing around with them, at least to a certain price point.

[@rofgabor]

when I grew up, we didn't take down the Christmas tree until February, sometimes March. That's the Christmas spirit! (I know I am lame, you probably didn't film this yesterday, but still, could not help it haha)

[@chrislj2890]

At least he turned those annoying flickering lights off, lol.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Took it down last week. We left the window candle lights in - probably until the end of January.

[@rofgabor]

@@TheJoyofVinylRecords I took down the outside christmas lights yesterday, fell off the ladder, messed up pretty badly... but should be OK in a week :)

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

@@rofgabor Yikes! Hope you're ok

[@rofgabor]

@@TheJoyofVinylRecords yes, maybe a broken bone, but nothing that prevents me from playing records :)

[@FrightfulMess]

THE thing I have always wanted from my system (which I honestly don't know if I've ever REALLY achieved) is to hear the artist and/or group sound as though they are performing live like you experience from a KZbin video (which I'm sure KZbin doesn't really present to us with their compression and/or whatever else they are doing to the sound). So, I don't want my speakers to have a "flavor", I want them to send me what the song is supposed to sound like, PERIOD. Same with the amplifier, no matter what "type", and ESPECIALLY., I want a phono cartridge with a stylus that is the IDENTICAL shape of the cutting head that cuts the vinyl, so that it goes down into that groove and digs up everything that cutting head put there, and I DON'T want to have to pay more for it than an Modern SUV. You would think that after 60 years of "research" from audiophile "scientists" they'd have been able to do that by now. So, do you personally think that maybe they always COULD, but won't in order to suck as much cash out of us as possible searching for that "elusive" accuracy?

[@patbarr1351]

I think your quest is in vain. When I was studying multitrack recording, we had JBL speakers in the control room. We knew they had a certain sound (modern JBLs are more neutral than the '80's designs) but it was a brand many home listeners would have had. Engineers are aware that consumers will almost always have something different in their systems, plus the people mixing the songs have their own preferences. Our rooms and even our ears are designed somewhat differently. Plus, cutting a master disc is a different art than playing a record. I suggest seeking a sound that you personally enjoy.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

JR Boisvert at Wally Tools is trying to achieve the same thing with researching and engaging with cutting head manufacturers and engineers.

[@bigdh31]

I have a set of ray select tubes in my kt88 diy amp. I kept the nos 5ar4. Like you said for the first few hours they did not sound that good. After some time probably in the 20 hour range they suddenly changed. I am really enjoying the sound now.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

As a test, I swapped them out and went back to my favorite config that involved Mullard EL34s and went back after 2 days. I can't see taking them out again unless something happens to one of them.

[@Pluralofvinylisvinyls]

You should do a video on your record collection

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

If folks are interested I might.

[@raph28drum]

The best tubes I’ve heard so far in my system (primaluna amp) is NOS telefunken in the pre amp section and TAD el34 red base from tad Germany but made by psvane in china.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Huge fan of the Telefunken NOS 12AT7s in my other amp.

[@a.c.9495]

Thanks for the review! I’ll give a try to a pair of 6SN7 for my Lampizator Horizon and see how they compare to my NOS. I previously tried several Cryotone tubes but they are just mediocre in comparison to my rare NOS. May be better luck this time…..

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Good to know about the Cryotone. I haven't tried them myself and have also heard mixed thoughts about them.

[@neilfisher7999]

I would like to try a set of EL34s in my Black Ice amp to hear the difference between those and my KT88s. Not sure I want to go all in at $850 to try a set. I was thinking of trying the PSVANE Horizon set first to compare.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Can't go wrong with the Horizon Series. They are currently in my phono stage and the Galion upstairs.

[@neilfisher7999]

​​@@TheJoyofVinylRecords I think I can get a matched quad from PSVANE for $178. That sounds fairly reasonable.

[@revelry1969]

Try the psvane kt88 horizon. I have them in my F35. I think I like em better than my KT170s

[@garyglenn3654]

Not sure these tubes would make a noticeable difference in my little Project Tubebox DS with the two each 12AX7 tubes. Probably much more pronounced in a higher end preamp.

[@magnaman94]

They do make a difference. I belive the tubes are not buffering. Supposedly there are no op amps. Using nos right now but golden lions sound really good.

[@raph28drum]

No it’ a a cheap entry level preamp. Save your money

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

I don't think you'd hear a big change. Might be a slight one.

[@revelry1969]

So are these just relabeled PSVANE? There are only like 3 places that make tubes anymore. Everything else is just private labeled. I just buy vintage tubes from a few trusted sellers. The pricing on these reserve tubes is in NOS price range

[@jedi-mic]

I hear where you're coming from but your compensating for the problems in the speaker the tweeters! I'm afraid a lot of manufacturers just don't hit the mark. What speakers have you got? Where do you find it bright? Low down say two three four kHz or the higher frequencies? Also if the tone arm is too light can cause this issue! Running the cartridge a bit heavier can help as well. ideally find a piece of metal about a gram, and place it with a bit of blu tack or double-sided tape on the arm tube next to the headshell, if it's a removable headshell,. but you can slide it further up so it's at the back of the cartridge looking at it, if it's a one piece! but don't do it the other way around. Then set up the arm normally by balancing it over the record by five millimeters and set your counterweight vta accordingly to balance and then set it as normal. You can get those wheels weights at the tyre shop even better.

[@dannyfannyfoodle]

He has the reissue KLH Model 5s.

[@jedi-mic]

@@dannyfannyfoodle right that's a three way in it, not a fan of that type of driver in the mid range, he might be having more lower frequency issue then higher frequencys then. That Speaker is forward sounding I get the impression. you got a pear?

[@jedi-mic]

@@dannyfannyfoodle Yeah I had to look at the specs I'm not happy about it going up to 2800 hertz in the mid range crossover and not particularly cheap! think they're overpriced. the Wharfedale lintons would be a better choice! Also at 32 hertz in room they go down lower at -6db where the klh go to 34hz at -10db

[@sidesup8286]

If you have REAL GOOD signal integrity before the signal gets to your amp, (great source and cables) I am beginning to realize tube equipment isn't necessary. That spacious soundstage and air between instruments is there with really good solid state too. With less microphonics, dark murkiness etc. I have images on my ceiling using all solid state. Tubes do have more warmth, but tone controls can replicate that; if you really need that much warmth. If you can't move your speakers out far enough from the wall behind it (more than 3 feet), you can get depth of soundstage electronically by using tube equipment. If your speakers are 6 feet out from the wall behind them; tubes may make non front row instruments sound too far back. No doubt I will have another fling with tubes though. I just doubt if I'll like the sound as well as my setup now using solid state. There is even certain solid state equipment which place backing instruments too far back in the soundstage, and too far away sounding, where they don't make as much of a statement

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Interesting that you brought up images on your ceiling. For the first time I've started noticing that after a few tweaks in our vinyl room. It's wild when it happens.

[@sidesup8286]

As signal integrity goes up; so does the sound. It starts coming toward you on the ceiling once your sound reaches a certain point. But then, like the Star Of Bethlehem it stops and stays. Limited by the ceiling I guess. It's good that it doesn't continue coming toward you on the ceiling; then the sound would be behind you from above. I wondered about that.

[@ericelliott227]

I wish I could get a tube integrated or something like that, but I can't afford it and I have no place to set it (Well, I suppose I could set it on the bottom shelf of my rack - takeout the current amp there - as there is enough ventilation there I think). Anyway, not going to happen, I do not have the money. If I had a tube amp, I would want to try Russian tubes and the like, just because. (I know nothing about tubes in regards to good and bad).

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Took me years to get a tube amp. My old Denon Solid State got a lot of use

[@ericelliott227]

@@TheJoyofVinylRecords Yeah, I'm not looking to replace mu solid state system. I would rather add to it so I can swap things around from time to time like I do with my vintage receivers. My Sansui 8080db is as close as I get to "tube sound". I'd like to "add to" as I mentioned because every time I heard a Primaluna tube amp at a show, especially when they fed some good rock and roll to it, I just fell in love with it. (The Primaluna/Upscale Audio room is always the first to go against the norm and start pumping Led Zeppelin or something, which resulted in a crowded room too).

[@jakbenardete7707]

Elrog tubes are made in Germany, some of the best tubes in the world.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Good to know. Thank you!

[@danehenas]

$865 for a quad set of EL34s--I would need 2 sets for my two Marantz 8Bs--no thank you... they're probably too wide anyway..

[@Lovelacewatkins139]

A lot of shaking of the valves here

[@tothemax324]

Man youtubers that push octal base tubes in by the glass instead of the base don't know tubes.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

Learn something new every day

[@tothemax324]

@@TheJoyofVinylRecords Its a me problem, if it breaks its your problem 😊

[@carminecupani2315]

Pure marketing hype. I’ve been in the tube audio repair and deign business for over 50 years. There are only 3 places that tubes are made China Russia and Slovakia with the exception of Western Electric which I think are made in the USA but not sure. The Russian tubes are best. Some of the Chinese tubes are good. In any event all of it is amp dependent. VERY amp dependent. Over 400 bucks for a quad of EL34s is ridiculous. Over 800 is insane. Bordering on theft.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

You are correct - Western Electric is the US. There are tubes out of Japan as well.

[@carminecupani2315]

@ very few from Japan available to buy. Luxman used to make their own. Not sure if they still do. In fact many Japanese manufacturers use other tubes. Some house branded. So far the best tubes we have found are from New Sensor out NY. They have 2 factories in Germany. The Gold Lion tubes are very reliable. Again sound varies from amp to amp. Just need to find the ones that are good for your amp. Many high end manufacturers use New Sensor tubes.

[@carminecupani2315]

@ by the way the coating is nothing new. Some NOS 6v6 tubes had it. I believe it was there mainly so the tube filament lights wouldn’t show in the dark. This is back in the 40s. It made no difference in measured performance of the tubes. But just added an additional step in manufacturing. So they stopped doing it.

[@Pluralofvinylisvinyls]

best tubes come from the communists

[@carminecupani2315]

@ from Russia. Not the the democrats.

[@russbetts1467]

Hi Rick. Thanks for this very interesting discourse on Ray Tubes. I have known for many years, that a particular brand of tubes can vary between batches and even tubes within a batch. Some year back, I bought a matched set of Four SOVTEK 12AX7 tubes for my WAD K5881 Power Amp. Three of them were great, but the fourth was very iffy. As it is, I already had a couple of NOS Mullard's, so installed them as the Inputs and that improved things. Just out of curiosity, I swapped them around, putting the Sovtek's as the inputs and preferred it like that. I have just bought a Matched pair of Russian 'Reflektor' 6N23P tubes - 6922/ECC88 equivalents - for my World Audio Design KLP1 Pre-amp. They are currently 'burning in', but already sound better than the non-descript 6922 'Harma' tubes that were in there. As the Ray Tubes EL34 are interchangeable with 6L6/5881 tubes, I might treat myself to a set, later in the year. Cheers, Russ. UK

[@Keith-ux9ku]

No, EL34 and 6L6 do not interchange. Different bias points and different heater draws

[@russbetts1467]

@@Keith-ux9ku Thanks Keith. Don't know how I got that wrong, but thanks for the correction. Cheers, Russ.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

I have some NOS Mullard 12AX7s that I used for years. One started to go bad on me - broke my heart.

[@TheJoyofVinylRecords]

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