The Villainous Crush Trope and Reylo: Why Love Will Redeem Ben Solo

[@proffmsimod3577]

I think the purpose of this trope is primarily to create a scenario where two people should not be together but just can’t. help. themselves. It’s about the forbidden, the temptation and desire that characters just cannot avoid. It’s about creating the kind of romance everyone wants, not a romance with a bad person, but a romance that is all consuming. It’s a story telling device!

[@J_Rossi]

Romantic love needs to win the day this time. Romantic love needs to have it's honor and virtue restored. Since romantic love in effect doomed Anakin, it is only fitting and right that the same kind of love for Rey would inspire and help to save Ben. It perfectly reverses and rights the tragedy of Anakin in the prequels.

[@ladygrae126]

“The only things he’s going to destroy is her....”. OMG! I laughed so hard I nearly fell out of my chair!

[@gretel654]

Ah, I've always wanted to see a Reylo discussion about The Villainous Crush Trope. I think the positive variant of it fits Rey and Kylo's dynamic quite nicely. Rey is Kylo's Morality Pet, and perhaps his Morality Chain? Either way, I hope it'll go with the Love Redeems Trope as well. Reylo is a shipping that's already so spectacular and has so much more beautiful potential.

[@Janette388]

greatt!! you guys give me so much hope!! i'm actually tired of people and actually reylos saying that he will die :(

[@jolinamaitland0356]

I looooove that you talked about Persephone and Hades. I always loved mythology. Rule of 3 follows so many rules. I'm just so scared he'll be a brat and not ask again! He just better not die to be redeemed! My husband thinks I'm crazy for this interest I've taken in Reylo... I love knowing other ppl think about it as much as I. Have you ever thought about Shakespearean ties?

[@pinesdsdsd]

Didn't even realise that Rey started wearing dark clothes after she touched hands with Ben! Really hope they get a happy ending😄

[@amysmith7551]

This was so fascinating. Every time you gals upload a video, your discussion makes it more obvious that they are going in a Ben Solo redemption by love arc. The fans against Reylo are going to be so disappointed when Episode IX gets here. I, on the other hand, will be loving it. It’s such a great direction to take the story. Redemptive love to tie up the Skywalker saga. Thanks for making such great videos! I love them all!

[@carabkb]

I love this podcast so much! I started out a non-Reylo, only believing in Kylo's villainous crush on Rey. It seemed impossible that she could love him back. Your in-depth videos converted me. I can't get enough of this channel!

[@mflo9994]

I love how you're comparing Reylo to Voltron and Batman stuff. Love it all!

[@Wien1938]

I was really intrigued by the idea that they both protect each other, leading to the "us against the galaxy" trope. That could really work as a story!

[@baroqueariadacapo3294]

Well, I'm Greek and I can tell you that the myth of Persephone and Hades (Pluton), besides the changing of the Seasons, also saws that the (greek) mothers-in-law would do anything to interfere to the couple's life, even if the world turns upside-down (literaly!). It also saws Pluton's (Hade's) great political flare, accepting his wife's six-month leave, in order to avoid the worse: that his mother-in-law would come and stay with them the whole year long! Let me also add a little personal note: I once applied the "Persephone method", spending one or two months with the boy, one or two months with mummy and then one or two months with the boy again, on both sides of the Mediterranean Sea. Everybody was happy, the mother, the body and most of all, the airline companies, except for poor Persephone who ended up exhausted, abused, misfit (on both sides of the Mediterranean) and depressed. Still, I believe in the method's advantages (making the other miss you), if used in moderation and with the proper Hades (Pluton). Good luck to Kylo and Rey and greetings from Greece!

[@johanngambolputty4117]

Aw yeeah! New video!

[@anthoneyrago]

When you talked about the reversal stuff between act 1 and act 3 it made me think of a parallel. In the first act of Disney’s Beauty and the Beast the beast is shrouded in darkness and has to step into the light to reveal himself to her, in the final act the beast is bathed in light as he is transformed into a prince. Maybe it’s nothing important but those images popped into my mind when you ladies were discussing the reversal between the two acts.

[@zbh9268]

A couple that I've always been a fan of that fits into this category is the Gwen and Kevin relationship in the Ben 10 franchise. The two meet when they're just kids and Kevin is all kinds of bad news, yet they meet up again 5 years later and things change drastically. Kevin spent most of those years in prison and he lost a father figure that changed his life. The two still have some animosity, but pretty soon it becomes obvious that they start to have feelings for each other. Bringing this into the Reylo context, this pairing has a balance of power. Kevin is street-smart with a powerful mutant ability, and Gwen is book-smart with a powerful magical ability. Even though their abilities are different they balance each other out, like Rey and Ben as well as any other good example of this type of pairing.

[@beckysharp5015]

I thought I was the only loon who has seen parallels between Reylo and Bruce Wayne/Selena Kyle in the Nolan Batman flicks.

[@beckyr1572]

Oh man... it was spuffy that first got me hooked on hero/villain pairings! Memories...

[@Jessmess112]

Chile did she say p***y? 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Hold on, I am going to need more wine.

[@ladygrae126]

Tea with Lee I know! I was listening at work and nearly fell out of my chair. My cubemates thought I’d lost it! 🤣

[@ladygrae126]

I have always loved this type of storyline. The redeemed villain is so much more interesting. (I was so disappointed this didn’t get explored more in Harry Potter with Draco Malfoy.). My hubby picks on me because I analyze the crap out of every little aspect, but I think that’s what makes good literature and movies, all the subtle details and hidden meanings. Thanks again for another great video.

[@mayavp]

Grae Bogle #dramione ;)

[@isobelduncan]

Love the prince Lotor impersonation! It's such a comfort to watch your videos, especially after seeing all my Reylo pins have anti comments on them. On a more positive note, I watched a scene from V:DOTU and noticed one scene with Allura and Lotor was very similar to Rey and Kylo's first meeting on Takodanna. In another episode, Lotor attempt to carry her off, and she's lying in the exact same position as Rey when Kylo carries her off. Coincidence?

[@brittanyd3527]

I love your videos!!! So well thought through, love the back and forth.

[@asiangirlzrokzz]

I knew from the moment I saw the screen cap that this was going to be goooooooood.

[@cristarose503]

This got me thinking. I wonder how a reverse proposal where Ray proposes to Kilo would work?

[@mayavp]

"Do you have a cowl or something?"

[@makethebestoutoflife9948]

How she'd act if she was facing a monster as she said before: (Notices that he's shirtless, couldn't care less) - F*** you, stop avoiding my questions, give me an honest answer about your parents NOW How she actually reacts because she knows that he's a human with emotions and there's more into his story: (Flustered) - Don't you have a cOWl, or SOMEthiNg YOu CouLD put ON ...I lost it when I first saw it, laughe way too much lol

[@bellatheyorkie4377]

Your video's are amazing, I look forward to them every time. They are life and so is Reylo!!!

[@Jessmess112]

This channel is my guilty pleasure. I grew up with 80's Voltron, so this is especially good lol.

[@RaedynRoz]

funny with the Lotor cameo, the recent season of the Voltron Legendary Defenders had Lotor making a similar plea to Allura which came after a canonical KISS which was immediately followed by a switcharoo of moral sides from Lotor just 5 seconds later!!! Lotura and Reylo, my most complex ships D:

[@felixa5749]

Dude. Lotor's season 6 jilted lover meltdown put the Renperor's to shame, and I did not think that was possible. 🤤 Tina and I could not have been more thrilled.

[@jessicadeluna6484]

I love every video you upload!

[@ciara4087]

YEEEESSS another upload!! you guys absolutely kill it every single damn time, you just can't help but fall in love with Reylo

[@theredeft5319]

You know Lotura in the new Voltron actually does remind me of Reylo a bit. However Allura and Lotor while they seem like they are parallels and yin yang at first are not really and definitely not as much as Reylo. Lotor and Allura May have shared history being Altean( or half for Lotor), and Lotor May have grown up abused and manipulated like Ben, but Allura did not have a connection to Lotor like Rey did to Ben. Ben and Rey relate to each other because of their loneliness and Rey is drawn to the dark side and Ben to the light. Allura doesn’t have such a powerful connection, which is why what Lotor did in season 6 (Incoming Spoilers) hiding and draining the Alteans is not forgivable to her. Allura also cannot see into Lotor’s head like Rey has done( literally sensing his hurt and conflict) So while I see Lotura as over Reylo definitely still seems like it will happen. Rey and Kylo are really two sides of the same code. After the last force Skype session I can’t see this ending with either of them killing each other. They may fight, but I absolutely think they will hesitate to kill each other.

[@sybillestahl8646]

I love your videos. I was listening to something else and I saw this, and immediately bailed on the other thing.

[@UnnamedAndUnindicted]

Stupid bell didn't ring but I spotted it anyway

[@liendoesja]

Ladies, I think something similar as the thing between Joker en Batman happens between Sherlock and Moriaty in Sherlock BBC . Sorry if you speak about it later in the video, I just had to write it down now at 11:19 m before I forget it😂

[@thedoctorsboi3453]

GUYS… THIS WAS OFF THE ROOF AWESOME! We are going for option D… nothing but option D is acceptable! Thanks for addressing CLODOOR again and the fact that we may end with a Reylo against the Galaxy Scenario.

[@mariamiles1605]

Amazing video! Can't get enough Reylo.

[@AmidalaEmma]

Nolan's Catwoman/Batman actually reminds me a lot of Han/Qi'ra too

[@felixa5749]

Funny you say this because Han/Qi'Ra reminded us of an inverse, gender inverted Reylo. Tina and I thought there were a lot of parallels between Rey&Han and Qi'Ra&Ben. We'll be talking about that when we do our Solo episode.

[@Simone_Subtle_Salt]

Great analysis! I enjoyed all of it. Thanks for your discussions.

[@jessamydelpapa3986]

That was brilliant. I'm so crook at the moment and you guys just made my week. You completely cheered me up. Only every time I laugh I cough up a lung but I can't stop listening. So great!

[@MissAngie510]

Love this topic!! Thank you for your uploads on Reylo ❤

[@Caroline-qr7zp]

This is a really, really interesting video. And really, really pins a whole new idea to the romance world. Fantastic formulated, good examples and perfection in it are making. Thank you so much for making this, loving that Lotor made an appearance here too! I wonder, have you guys watched the newest season and seen where it develops? What do you guys think one could classify it in terms of A, B, C, D? Wonderful once more. Please continue making well formulated videoes like these!

[@brandedlunacy5891]

I agree with everything and even learned new stuff! Good video, as usual!

[@ravenryuu]

Excellent discussion 😁👍 thank you so much

[@iluvboaz]

Thank you for sharing your knowledge and intelligence with us. I love listening to you all!

[@alexlynn5111]

Shipping gods give me Reylo and Lotura(vld) to make up for Zutara

[@alexlynn5111]

Not sure if youd consider it canon or not since it exists in the comics only but as of season 11 Buffy and Spike are together

[@alexlynn5111]

Oh just fuck me then 😭 I didnt mean canon THAT way guys 😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

[@shan4883]

I'm obsessing now over Ben and Rey and its not healthy!!! 😄❤ lol I love this story of them and the build up of what's to come! I hope we're right that their purpose is to bring balance to the force and end all wars this way! They are destined to be together! Best complicated love story since Han and Leia! Ben is a lot like Anakin struggling with his weaknesses and the good in him is still there. Leia is right and only Rey can save him.

[@tiffanypacleb4348]

Something crazy was when the TLJ came out (pre reylo) we were saying no cliff hanger? After Reylo I saw that as the cliff omg

[@banehog]

This was really interesting! Certainly put some things in a different light.

[@kyloren8564]

#SaveBenSolo JJ,please!!

[@israeldavidramirez8869]

Finaaally a new video...i’ve been waiting 4 dis!

[@SelahViolinist]

Awesome video!

[@fabiolaloja3581]

YAAASSS new video!!

[@nyarlethotep]

Awesome and intelligent video, Ladies! So glad I discovered this channel! Subscribed!

[@heart_nouveau]

This video was so entertaining and insightful! Thank you 😆

[@karafrost3663]

I just wanted to go to bed and you upload an hour long video. How cruel of you.

[@waderace4084]

Awesome new video! Thumbs up!

[@RPGDesignatedPaladin]

This video is fun and smart!

[@MissCatAnne]

Yes! I love your videos! I definitely don't think Ben would be killed off, but I wonder if they would have a situation where Rey dies (or he thinks she does) and that somehow makes him commit to... the light? Not sure how that would play out but, it was a thought.

[@cahs87]

I would have loved to hear some parallels drawn to Crimson Peaks because that was such a haunting dynamic.

[@claudiam764]

i love you guys so much. thank you for the video

[@trickysoda]

Interesting choice of lotor given he is basically in reylo the cartoon this season of voltron lol spoilers: he gets a kiss but it doesn't end so well for them

[@kaitlinpendley3647]

Clicked so fast

[@greenwren5072]

I missed the villainous laugh from the ending otherwise 10/10 would listen again. Hungarian wedding traditions have this thing where late at the wedding party the bride / new wife, who is up to that point in her white or wedding dress, is abducted by male relatives. Then the groom / new husband has to find and rescue the bride, if he can't find her he has to play symbolic ransom. When the bride appears next she's wearing a new dress, usually shorter and traditionally red. Thought I leave this here. It seems to fit some of the things you talked about.

[@AliaaAloha]

Fascinating how we are in the midst of the Villainous Crush Trope, yet after Episode 9 - with hindsight of the ST: Ben will be viewed as the Beast in Beauty and the Beast. His past? Well, with hindsight - Paul the Apostle overcame his past. (Definitely not viewed as a villain. I'm an agnostic, yet for Christians - nope. Yet, as an agnostic, I see that story arch. :)). :D

[@felixa5749]

"Saul to Paul" has definitely been discussed in our religiously/philosophically diverse group. :)

[@janaschafer3384]

Girls! Ladies! Giantesses of symbolism, fandom and industries! I love you guys. Hey from Germany

[@felixa5749]

Much love back to you! I've been to Germany a couple times. You have a beautiful country!

[@TimeandMonotony]

OH MY GOD CLODOR/HODOR MADE ME LOSE MY SHIT! XD

[@superstarem]

YAY love love love

[@Savage_Psykhe]

New podcast! Whoop! :)

[@Wien1938]

I'm really looking forward to the next film... 18 long months! XD

[@TimeandMonotony]

I just have to point out that The Silence of the Lambs is actually the second book in the Lecter series. The first is Red Dragon. (Sorry, I'm a pedant.) Also, I'm commenting as I watch, so that's why I'm leaving a bunch of smaller comments rather than one longer comment with my thoughts on the whole video. Hope that's not annoying!

[@DarthxErik]

I adore everything about this!! Keep up the Lord's work! X'D

[@TimeandMonotony]

Really like your parallels with Rebecca and Brian from Ivanhoe! And you even used pics from my favorite adaptation! That being said, Rebecca/Ivanhoe forever.

[@reyloforever5668]

rowena is not at fault here but it's his wishy-washiness and inability to be turthful to either of the women. he chose rowena, never seriously meant to be with rebecca. his attraction was of rebound natured because rowena/athelstane bethrotal bruised his ego. rebecca's attraction was of hero worship nature cause he saved her father and was the first christian that was nice to them. neither was a true love.

[@freshPrincess626]

FYI, Buffy and Spike actually get back together in the comics.

[@sybillestahl8646]

Did Kylo take Rey to Snoke with the intention of killing Snoke? I thought he was hoping that Snoke would turn Rey to the dark side.

[@theweirdlifeofalex7988]

❤️❤️❤️

[@trinityj1]

Oh man don't make me write another essay about the ending of Hannibal. He doesn't brainwash her!!

[@isrexinsane]

1: good content 2: improve audio quality.

[@darkersandman2328]

From knights of Ren to.. Naughties of Ren, a anime harem-trope star wars spinoff.

[@darkersandman2328]

-?Spike & buffy?- -Why no connection?- never mind.