The Winners & Losers of The War Within Melee Specs To Avoid, Try & Play!

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Pre-patch is here. Did your spec get saved or shafted? There's only one way to find out.

[@BellularGaming]

Learn Back-end Programming: boot.dev/bellular, and check them out on Boot.dev’s KZbin: @bootdotdev! Use code BELLULAR for 25% off. Sponsored by Boot.dev.

[@TeHzoAr]

no

[@UhlenburgTTC]

Timestamps would be cool

[@michaelwa1548]

I was going to say

[@hum3447]

@@TheDutchmasterjay if you make videos, you want people to give criticisms to make your future content better. imagine testing a game and telling anyone who critiques it to cry less. sub 80 IQ individuals shouldnt be allowed to make comments on youtube.

[@KnightFel]

@@TheDutchmasterjayso would time stamps

[@Vic-qp1gk]

What's the fun in that. He makes a video for you to watch, not skip 90% and move on

[@hum3447]

@@Vic-qp1gk the substance of the video is the information he provides. If someone wants specific info from the video, why would he want to watch the filler info? The info he is looking for are the specs that are good. Maybe some specs he just doesn’t enjoy and is looking for a mix of enjoyable gameplay and competitive potential. You know exactly why he wants time stamps, stop pretending like you don’t lol.

[@matthieucolas7225]

One of the major reason i loved tonplay dh was because it can transform into a big demon, not because it can throw is weapons...

[@RandySnarsh]

Cool

[@kalasmournrex1470]

Well, great that Aldrachi Reaver is literally 30% ahead on dps over Fel Scarred, amirite?

[@blackalphadragon96]

Yeah its a bit weird. Like im a demon hunter not a wepon thrower 😅 Blizz couldnt ya have made a more assassin's like spec?

[@ddenozor]

@@blackalphadragon96 Exactly. You are a demon hunter, not a demon. Whole idea of becoming a demon hunter is to use demons' powers against them but having the will and discipline to not become one of them.

[@donrobbie5528]

I always thought Throw glaive was really a pulling and cope tool (so when you are running away from gimmicks you can be do a little damage). It's a bit strange for it to be the center of the rotation.

[@atrop19]

Rogue and DH share (shared?) a dev, Realz. He is notorious for ignoring feedback throughout all of DF, at least to DH. So it's no surprise both classes feel horrible going into TWW.

[@ericv738]

How do you know who the dev of a class is?

[@JulianTheGR3AT]

@@ericv738 his dad works for nintendo

[@Nicolas-fo8qd]

@@ericv738 He was posting under his dev name in the class forums during DF alpha and beta, and he was talking in the class discords with his dev name too

[@TotalRejection]

Hmm, weren't the rogue reworks mostly well-received, though? I remember rogues praising him for providing regular updates, being semi-available on discord etc.

[@dectocs]

@@Nicolas-fo8qdyes and he sat in the rogue discord and was deligently reading feedback.

[@StrobeFireStudios]

They should have made the Demon Hunter DPS tree about Eye Beam. That's the coolest spell ever. They've neutered it monstrously since it's release in Legion, but that spell needs to be a disgustingly strong spell to avoid at all costs. Throw Glaive...lmao all righty then!

[@kinglfc4life11]

Also if you didn't know Fel Scarred which does buff eye beam is currently about 35% less damage on the top end than the throw glaive spec

[@GylleneGott]

Welcome to the hero class club brother (DK main), lorewise we should be the strongest but Blizzard doesn't love us

[@Setuaro]

@@GylleneGott If you confuse lore power with gameplay power, then you have already lost the game.

[@GylleneGott]

@Setuaro Could always be worse, I could have been you 🤢

[@scanGfu]

Such a missed opportunity that Arms Warriors didn't get Blademaster...

[@joshoxley3869]

Agreed, and the capstone (imo) should have been a passive that had a chance to make your Mortal Strike / Cleave have a chance to do a crit for 3x damage, as a throwback to the WC3 skill

[@Highstar25]

they keep doing that for Arms warriors, huh? Missing out on the Axe of Cenarius as a Legion artefact stung too.

[@user-bc8ui6jv5i]

@@Highstar25 BROX

[@Dangitbobby-KFP_Shaman]

You know what would be great? If havoc didn't have a whole ass hero spec centered around fucking Throw Glaive lmao

[@richiepipes8960]

@@Dangitbobby-KFP_Shaman I hate every class except rogue and dh lol Trying to find a reason not to get a refund

[@IceBlueJoe]

I want a build that allows us to stay in demon form so we can be like Illidan lol

[@kylerBD]

For real its so boring

[@okacz19]

It feels so undemonhuntery. You're either WoW DH and fighting so close the enemies can count your freckles, or Diablo DH so you can't even see what you just shot in the face. Throw Glaive is just an ugly in-between.

[@choomanji]

@@richiepipes8960 you arent getting a refund atp anyway lmao

[@einohrfuermaenner]

Havoc Mains: asking - no, begging, to get rid of this throw glaive shit Blizzard: Fuck you guys stop playing this class

[@michakowalski5405]

@@einohrfuermaenner yeah idk who came up with this shit, i wanna cut, dash and shoot laser when changing into a demon, not throw a little fucking glaive that SOMEHOW apllies a super dot. Dumb af.

[@jesuscollazo4303]

lol only noobs play it

[@naalir6120]

🤡🤡🤡​@@jesuscollazo4303

[@Briansgate]

I felt that

[@sardonicspartan9343]

​@@jesuscollazo4303leave your mom out of this.

[@austincapps4381]

“You know what this melee class needs? A hero spec centered around their ranged ability.” - Blizz designing DH Hero Spec

[@kalasmournrex1470]

It’s actually not though. Most of your damage ends up being Death Sweep and Annihilation.

[@stevox1904]

Down Hill = DH

[@petersimon2619]

That extended melee range made life so much better going from warrior to pally. The extension on the kick alone is life changing in M+.

[@Proverb.]

Ret Paladin is legitimately God Spec. Can execute full rotation from up to 20 yards making it the easiest melee to maintain uptime when needing to dodge mechanics;; Invincible (literally with bubble) and practically, with the amount of defense and self healing, and very good group utility. Easiest CD usage of all specs, insane burst, only 1minute btw. This spec will allow any player to reach the highest levels of content they could hope to achieve easier than any other spec.

[@douglassmith2878]

They’re getting rid of the range

[@KarlMerkli]

@@douglassmith2878 only on AA / kick, the 20y range talent stays.

[@CosmicCleric]

As an lesser but usable alternative to timestamps (web browser client), click the "Show transcript" button in the video's description area, then search for the class/spec you are interested in.

[@Paranitis]

Yay, no more melee range increase. Now my Warriors will be on equal footing with these fuckers that keep outranging me for literally no reason.

[@prochuba]

Exactly. DH and rogue gameplay always felt like they have some 15ish yd range on most of spells and attacks. Wherever you are, somehow they're still hitting you :D And when you do manage to get out of their range, both classes got around 3-4 gap closers to instantly come on top of you again. It's hilarious.

[@mtr7076]

@@prochuba yes makes sense though, random ass poor non magical flesh bones 40yr old warr vs...deon infused wings flying demon blood huntard or lights wing holy armor ignore bubble godloving pally who make ground censecrate fire + get flying heaven asteroid hammer ...

[@mechros4460]

tbh yeah as a rogue main we had acrobatic strikes for example

[@robertviscomi8199]

Collosus could’ve been awesome and made gladiator stance 2.0. Cowards

[@WadeAllen001]

I am actually really worried that the removal of melee range increasing talents will feel really bad. I've been using those on my feral druid for years so I'm so used to being able to melee attack things that are actually pretty far away.

[@nickl514]

I missed this piece of information until now. I'm crushed, that was the best talent (imo) in both the rogue and pally trees

[@yngve9470]

I've played the beta alittle bit and on my holy paladin it feels horrible in dungeons :&

[@vittopav7740]

If i may, it has been put as standard in the cat form, so no worries on that

[@tylersmall634]

​@@vittopav7740 from what I read from the patch notes I dont think thats the case. As its listed twice one for non feral specs have the extra range but feral as a spec does not. I think its exclusive for resto/balance. Might need to be tested

[@Aquwert]

Yeah I’ve got say (as a ranged class player) this is such a silly change, it alienates melee classes even more so

[@Chambers_90]

Hoped to hear feral was good, can't help but think it'll feel like going into BFA and losing all the legendaries etc....the spec is fun at a fairly fast pace, and it fits with the theme. You're a bloody cat for goodness' sake, not an elephant. Slow and deliberate doesn't fit with the spec fantasy.

[@jasonhagar9746]

The telling part was he didn't even talk about the passive hero talents.

[@LawrenceJorgensen]

I honestly dont mind at all, I enjoy not being GCD-capped since otherwise it feels like using utility spells will disrupt my rotation and dps. What is disheartening is feeling like my damage is limited due to balance rather than skill.

[@Marsonis2ya]

You need to be really careful when listening to Bellular with regards to feral and guardian. He has long admitted he has a biased opinion on them because he believes they need a complete overhaul and has to force himself to test them. It's the reason, if you noticed, that was the shortest review of all the classes.

[@brandonc8892]

Slow and steady literally fits feral more than literally any other class. A cat is a fucking ambush predator. Which means high initial outputs but slowly tapering off. Which is exactly how they operate now. Any cat in the wild isn’t a fucking persistence hunter. The high APM never made sense from a lore standpoint.

[@Thrall966]

Agreed

[@jasminpoljak6115]

Playing Feral since Vanilla. Slow down is good at it lets you have more awareness of the group and enviroment and lets you use your utility. If you are GCD locked every utility and healing is a dps loss. Bit worried about the tunning though.

[@LawrenceJorgensen]

Agree completely! Just needs good tuning to actually have competitive dps when u play it right and ill be over the moon!

[@titouan666]

DF Feral spec was really fun to play, I'm soooo ssad they slowed down, this has always been the problem of the spec and we are back on that...

[@mnbaltzer4974]

I sadly retired my 18 year rogue in dragonflight couse of the amount of skills and buttons. Its simply not fun for me anymore.

[@zylle1993]

Yea, i really wanna play rogue, but it feels bad man atm, Sub is pretty cool, outlaw i always hated, and assassin is meh. They need to combine some skills so we dont have 10+ cds to rotate. Major rework needed, lets hope they do it in tww

[@tasteoftacos]

I had the same sentiment as well. I like the utility the class has. But, it can be a bit overwhelming in high pressure scenarios with managing it.

[@alexanderaugunas9795]

Rogue -- IMHO the big problem with Assassination is that the whole rotation is based on a huge, complicated, unfun 12-button priority system. It blows my mind that Arcane Mage got tons of love to make it streamlined and more fun to play, and Assassination just ... sits there. Hoping. Pleading. Outlaw is just a mess. Its button-mashing while hoping for buffs, really not fun. As a warrior main, I've been really disheartened by Blizzard's absolute lack of interest in our class. We got almost no updates or changes, no dev communications talking about design or intent, and the shuffling that was done to our trees did just that--shuffle, but not innovate.

[@vvohvaelez9277]

playing melee the last 2-3 years in pve content has just been dogshit.

[@okacz19]

Outlaw still feels almost unplayable without a Weakaura helping you solve the damn linear regression equation to figure out if you should roll or not. Or is it just me, and are people able to play it okayish on high level without it?

[@baegulimm]

Sin was so boring and simple till recently wym? It's not even that bad. It's just that kingsbane interactions were degen but that has been fixed. Sin is one of the easiest specs in the game to play

[@Candlemancer]

@@okacz19 Yeah, Outlaw is dragged down so much both mechanically and thematically by being forced to LITERALLY ROLL DICE to determine how much damage you're going to do. And then not only is that nonsense not addressed but what do they get for a hero spec? Now you roll dice AND flip coins!

[@blackalphadragon96]

Yeah i dont like that they force us to do 9 diffrent things in a smal stealth window. Make rogue fun again blizz plz 🙏🙏🙏

[@djwooshuu8859]

The cross between class specifications has begun! Next, this could possibly open the door to integrate classes together. For example, Warrior with Monk we could see the Blademaster. Another one is, Death Knight with Warlock as one. This would create a Dreadlord. Death Knight and Mage for Lich. Rogue and Hunter for a Warden. They could call it prestige class or something else. Now you can evolve with your desired class or remain true to it and not evolve. Let your imagination do the rest for interesting combinations.

[@ProxGamer91]

Crys in warrior pain, which can't be ignored!!

[@Fortjul]

That's funny

[@TwoWebersInTheShed]

Warriors are fine.

[@ProxGamer91]

@@TwoWebersInTheShed i know 🤣

[@TwoWebersInTheShed]

@@ProxGamer91 i was dusted last night, didnt even get the obvious joke lmao

[@ProxGamer91]

@@TwoWebersInTheShed 😱

[@Marshal_Dunnik]

Retention stats > Timestamps

[@wrlo4]

Yeah so annoying

[@jaymzOG]

Imagining wanting a video to perform well because it's your job. Weird huh?

[@flyingpiglet]

@@jaymzOG They're already shilling their self-sponsor website in almost every video. Not giving people access to information they want from the start is scummy.

[@jaymzOG]

@@flyingpiglet "scummy" "shilling" What... Why do some people have so much issue with KZbinrs making money?

[@Marshal_Dunnik]

@@jaymzOG Imagine seeing a video succeed on its own merits, not because you're gaming the algorithm. Weird huh?

[@AnubiraiPlus]

Buffed or nerfed, Havoc DH will always be my main. I don’t see them coming out with a better class. Only thing they’re missing is being able to fly with their own wings.

[@astrayamatu]

i have been playing my dwarf palading since vanilla, and i am still playing that hero today even tho i took some long breaks

[@rhylin26]

Draenei Pally since BC. 👍

[@thehatter9400]

I honestly am a bit envious of people that were able to keep their old characters. Had mine deleted by a hack decades ago, had a tarren hunter thst almost was high enough level for unlocking death knights. He's gone though as was my lvl 30 troll shaman. Its mostly about seeing your old character grow and change throughout the game

[@chiefwarcraft1010]

DK since WOTLK 🤙🏼

[@Ricardo89DK]

Human Paladin since Vanilla 💪 (with breaks as well).

[@Captain.AmericaV1]

Feral is supposed to be a faster paced spec, and so many nerfs and slowing it down this much will make it boring

[@xaulted1]

Feral has historically either been incredible chart topping bad assery, or a complete joke. Every single time feral breaks out of mediocracy and actually performs, people go RACING to the forums to QQ QQ QQ about it. I've seen (especially) mages type out walls of text QQ'ing about how they were beaten senseless by a feral druid and how "IT MUST BE STOPPED!". I've played through entire xpacs of people having no interest in inviting a "useless" DPS cat, then suddenly have us be tweeked to a point where we're actually competitive with pure DPS and everyone loses their mind and collectively DEMANDS feral be nerfed to the ground... and so we are. I've given up on feral ever being a real class.

[@yonellearnaudyoanlatouche2104]

You still be a beast in pvp

[@devilsadvocate2643]

​@@xaulted1and then wow gives in and nerfs the shit out of it. Exactly why I stopped playing WoW. I love feral so much, but you're better off playing rogue. It's OP as shit but apparently it's not a problem for anyone.

[@Thrall966]

@@xaulted1yeah agreed

[@technosauruswrex]

After seeing all the changes to Rogue (or more accurately the lack thereof) I've been trying to decide what I want to change my main to for TWW. After looking at all the other amazing changes and addition that classes like Warlock and Paladin have gotten, I've settled on still Rogue.

[@user-nk9ig5wt2c]

As rogue player since vanilla that give up the game in shadow land expansion I was thinking about coming back to the game but this video remembered me why I give up this game and the reason is playing something that isn't mage is like roll a dice if you roll high you get a good dev and your class will be amazing if you roll low you will be the bottom feeder of expansion. Mage obviously have cheat code so they always roll high

[@kryt1cal]

Well, this helped me decide on which melee classes I want to focus on, Surv Hunter and Unholy DK. Thanks!

[@TheOutsider-vc1hy]

Because Outlaw clearly needs more things to manage with Fatebound. What could a class that balances so many plates need from 'Hero Talents'? More plates to spin.

[@babyninjajesus2669]

wat, you dont balance shit as outlaw, you fucking send the whole lot whenever possible and just spam stealth windows for crackshot spam

[@zuralani1]

that's the issue havoc is having with aldrachi right now

[@Petrosmurf9]

Yea and I also can’t stand when people are like “rogue is fine and it’s still early” while they are hard swapping to monk or paladin

[@zuralani1]

same thing with dh. They look at beta damage (as if that matters with more than a month and a half until raid) and go "oh wow must suck to do so much damage" like holy crap what is with people's lack of reading comprehension? We are upset about the fact that it feels like garbage to play and would rather play something that does 30% less damage

[@TheRetartidMunkee]

Undead warrior until undead paladin. FOTM be damned I wanna be a zombie scarlet crusader

[@That_kind_of_orc]

That outlaw part about discord was a bad one lol🤣🤣🤣

[@123FireSnake]

The druid budget seams to have been used up by the emerald dream :D

[@psycodoood]

Ferals getting fked...the best part of feral is the fast paced, feels faster than playing other classes and now we are getting a hand break. damnit

[@sermerlin1]

Yeah well to me in DF feral felt a bit too fast paced. It felt like playing a god damn piano just to be in the operating range of DPS. I was forced to be so focused on what's next to press that I get distracted from what's actually important... Which is what the fuck is enemy doing. I feel like classes overall should be somewhat slower and less twitchy but abilities should deal enough damage overall and be impactful so that people focus more on what's important and that is enemy. I'm not saying "easier" to do proper damage, just less twitchy at trying to stay afloat while enemy is throwing tantrums all over the place.

[@flyingpiglet]

@@sermerlin1 Sounds like a you problem

[@sermerlin1]

@@flyingpiglet aye seems like it

[@sardonicspartan9343]

​@@flyingpigletand yet.. blizzard agreed with him.

[@daviddecker9556]

Fantastic video highlighting real issues people are having with their new spec/talent changes. As a rogue main, I will play my rogue but im looking at DK and Monk and wondering why we cant get the same.

[@arliss35]

I like the dk changes for the most part, though I do wish we could get one more. Dks get these fancy pants class specific enchants and 95% of the classes history it has just been rune of the fallen crusader. I just wish they would slightly retune the class as a whole and make fallen crusader a class passive. Something along the lines of, "as long as you have a runeforge on your weapon, you have a chance to proc fallen crusader." That or remove it entirely. I want to use some of these fancy fun runes.

[@arsalanabbasi9323]

Shaman rework is just orgasmic💦

[@xlightninghawk6360]

which spec?

[@TadSoft]

Rogue here, we are drowning in mediocrity right now.

[@SavageBoricua]

Don't complain... I'm a feral main, we've been bad for years. 😞😞

[@BSD5721]

Been a rogue main since legion... might be looking at making my Ret my main now.

[@ThomasHudek]

so ready for the ranged dps/healer/tank videos!

[@neretilderem7029]

I love how there isn't a single comment about how bad feral driuds will be, because already no one plays feral druid and no one cares.... gg blizzard

[@itachisvk]

Meanwhile me, only person around here, happy about monk changes :D

[@TheByron130]

Feral Druids , for me, have felt like a cheap rogue knock off for a while now. Slowing them down and forcing them to maintain bleed and bite and that's about it, doesn't really help with that very much. Shame, I want to love druids, I just can't get with that god awful space chicken, and feral always feels so dull.

[@mattphoenix4702]

I decided to try out feral at the beginning of Dragonflight and it quickly became my main. Tiger’s Fury and bleed management is actually really fun. Or was fun. It’s just not fun anymore. Feral lost its soul basically. Probably gonna go back to Ret today

[@moonmoon4537]

That’s because the wow community these days is made up of braindead fucks who want to play a meta class, but can’t even do something as basic as interrupting mobs in the dungeon itself. Everyone’s playing DH atm even though they don’t know WHY it’s so good.

[@EleosGames]

Well after listening to the info regarding Rogues, might just skip WW until Rogues are in a great spot :)))

[@Ehh.....]

I stopped playing after BFA im tryna see if its worth getting into again, but a lot of the comments and videos seem conflicting.

[@ChuckS117]

RIP Feral… now I’ll probably need to find another spec

[@PeterKJ15]

Being a long time feral, I think the feral changes are some of the best ever since legion last season or WoD.

[@xBadMarlboro]

I was pretty hyped for tww but seeing those classes really makes me worry, I hope it’s fun

[@SatchaDahmi]

I just resubbed for TWW after not playing since bfa. I previously mained dk for years. I must say unholy feels amazing. It is wonderfully fun and engaging. Very little downtime and cooldowns all line up. My absolute favorite and massive stand out. It is fun while feeling it nails the fantasy better than ever with the constant undead summoning and dying off

[@MrLolguy93]

Been playing my Enh Shammy since I got my own account. Not giving up yet 😁

[@korn7809]

I was the same until DH came out then I switch between them each expansion. I love the mobility as a Vengeance DH.

[@richiepipes8960]

Dude? Enhance is absolutely blasting in beta. Have you watched anything?

[@MrLolguy93]

@@richiepipes8960 I mean, it looks good. I didn't say I'm not giving up

[@bobstoner415]

ENH is so fun. Never give up brother

[@Stonemojo1]

WindFury go BRRRRRR

[@fightcub655]

Do a video over how they screwed over the Mythic + played with the gear changes

[@GiaraTheBear]

I noticed that the Hero talent choices for Windwalker were missed/skipped by Bell What are people leaning towards? Conduit or Shado-pan?

[@megadoomer5309]

I always love these because it changes every single day and it gives me something to watch while I eat lunch

[@MrSimothy]

Is there an import string for Bellular's current UI? I saw his DF UI video but I really like the one in the more recent videos - does anybody know if it's available anywhere?

[@chaseatkinson3842]

Yo Bellular, If you start using Timesstamps on your video's, I'll subscribe. This 23 min video with no book marks is shameful. We cant get one between classes or something. PLEASE

[@Highstar25]

I feel like they should boost melee range across the entire game by a foot or so. It would not only make up somewhat for the loss of range-extending talents but also make melee less crowded in general.

[@ralegar1]

Eviscerate does static, damage!

[@thehnoskos]

I was enjoying my Ret Paladin spec in the beta but in the pre-patch it does feel like there are big gaps without those hero talents and a few times where I'm doing nothing but auto attacks for a handful of GCD's. That being said, I took off of S4 completely in retail and I came back still able to do a ton of damage despite being severely under geared after the raids all went awakened.

[@BroBuildsMtb]

Do not worry. It will be ok in the end.

[@zuralani1]

based on what?

[@mordecaisayag1861]

I think that making Stealth reset the CD of Between the Eyes can make Outlaw much smoother

[@ThibVc]

The whole reason I love Frost DK is swinging a two hander like Arthas. It just feels weird playing with one handers... And screw BoS :(

[@TheGamerGuy1981]

Yeah...never liked one handed Frost. If that's the future may go unholy. Oblit feels like a wet noodle in pvp with 1H

[@jaymzOG]

I dunno why they made Feral druid of all DPS the slow spec. It's a f'ing cat. I guess you could justify it by saying they patiently stalk their prey, but meh. Doesn't quite fit the picture.

[@ericzommer5581]

There are enough of these high APM classes in the game. The game style of banging on your keyboard like a piano just to play a game isn't fun.

[@jaymzOG]

@ericzommer5581 I agree, shouldn't have been Feral to slow down. Why not slow down Arms Warrior so it actually fits the fantasy? Or Frost DK? That's why I said "Feral of all DPS." There are plenty of options it would've made more sense for.

[@xarrison8274]

@@ericzommer5581 yes but changing one spec instead of every to be slow is NOT the way to do that. Why do this to only feral???? Its brainless on their part

[@titouan666]

DF Feral spec was really fun to play, I'm soooo ssad they slowed down, this has always been the problem of the spec and we are back on that...

[@Zalagar619]

Right now the most overpowered Melee DPS is Enhancement Shaman and Frost DK. They are doing ungodly amounts of dmg and will definitely be getting tuned.

[@Xplorewme]

I miss when you found out all this stuff by playing the game, not listening to someone tell you about it

[@ryanmcghee7449]

Unironically technology, the thing that gave us the best memories in life. Also ruined the very thing we loved. You're just on a conveyer belt of min maxing, meta, spreadsheets and words of information to know how to play a game instead of just playing the game. It'll never be the same.

[@truce3038]

give melee +3 or +5 range, and prune some of these damn gap closers

[@malkavianer1337]

a whole 15 seconds of feral. even bellular hates ferals.

[@chopper7891]

They could just add a glyph for shamans, Fiery Stormbringer or something, to make the Stormbringer talents look more fiery instead of lightningy

[@Dajova]

Still waiting to see when we're gonna get a actual weapon imbue spec/subspec for shaman, right now they feel kinda pushed to the side in favour of either going all-out lightning damage or a totem nerd... which is "fine", but it feels lazy when we do have alot of stuff ready to be utilized, but they've been confined to basically active-passives.

[@HomicidalBluePikmin]

Did I just completely miss Windwalker?

[@judgeofdeth7781]

100% agree with this take on melee . great info

[@Kofi2416]

The Rouge and Demon Hunter issues are not the same as the ret Paladin, at DF's launch there was a swell of cautious optimism. The rouge discord especially reads more like we're mid shadowlands.

[@niels453]

Will be playing sub Rogue! Started in DF and will still main it

[@ZAribeniq21]

The next video will be for Range specs :)

[@Getrie1992]

Said nothing about Slayer Fury Warrior. Feels awesome right now.

[@LawrenceJorgensen]

People saying rip feral like it hasnt been dead for over an expansion. Continued sadness as an old feral main.

[@TheWicked003]

Not sure if anyone will see this or care enough to answer if they do but I'm a little confused by the change to mastery for SV hunter. Since it went to a "melee" spec, it's been more like a hit and run playstyle where you're dipping into melee quickly and then spending the rest of the time keeping your distance so you don't get torched. What I don't get is that the mastery change seems really strong but to make the most of it you have to stay in melee as much as possible (to keep proximity with your pet) which looks a little like it conflicts with the way the talents work. I haven't played since January so maybe I'm just out of practice or maybe something's changed that I don't know about? Maybe I just don't fully grasp the way the spec is meant to be played even though I've played it on and off since legion? :P Anyways, I guess I could just go ahead and try it out when the game is reinstalled but I'm impatient lol. Thanks!

[@Linda-yp3zj]

Funny hearing feral and rogue being put down like this because before any of the ‘winners and losers’ videos released, they were the specs I thought were most fun on beta and that’s coming from a DF ret enjoyer. I’ll definitely agree though I think some things like energy starvation on both classes is kinda meh but I personally like the pace of them.

[@markmikolay9019]

Very glad that survival is doing well!

[@depressedonion5610]

The potential warrior could have had with Prot/Arms is Glad stance returning and I still don't forgive them from taking away one of the more fun specs to play.

[@RickheadWashington]

Fury warrior or ret. It's really hard to choose

[@Quetzelkoa]

Its bizzare that the frost death knight is a fast paced, rapid fire spec and a giant feral cat has this slow deliberate playstyle. Fantasies feel backwards there.

[@TheHeadcraB2143]

rogue already had a huge rework in dragonflight

[@ohnoezitsjoez]

Am I cuckoo or was there no comment on WW hero talents? Just the refinement of the class/spec tree? Heard Shado-Pan was dookie/boring.

[@martin9202]

WW is now in such a good state that hero talents don’t matter… celestials have better output now, but shado-pan is more tanky… ✌🏻 If any class need hero talents to being fun, then the class design is wrong… hero talents are just an icing on the top… 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@stedgeHENDERSOn]

the reason I don't have any hope is that DH and Rogue only just got reworked, AFTER Ret Paladin even.

[@heroicxidiot]

Fury being one of the losers is not a surprise. Whoever decided to keep SMF as a talent and then doubling down on it since Dragonflight shows they really don't know what they're doing.

[@Clarketh]

What you mean...? You dont go SMF anyway.. it hasnt been a good thing since vanilla.. its only a own feeling you take it if you think one handers are funnier 😂 one handers will always do less dmg then 2x2 handers.. dosnt matter if they would buff SMF 😅 and Fury is strong even without that spec build

[@Clarketh]

It shouldnt be a talent in the spec.. they should just do some passive in general spellbook that SMF and 2x2 handers are equal strong and remove that extra haste and such 😂

[@Zebediela42]

I feel like Blizz are missing a massive opportunity with Sub Rogue hero talents. They could double down on the shadowy aspect of the class fantasy. Switch out the energy for a mana bar and bring in shadow magic nuances. I wanna be a Malazan claw dammit!!!

[@linaori]

You've only scratched the surface with the issue outlaw has, it's atrocious ranging from bugs introduced in DF S3 with the "rework", literally not being able to play one of the hero specs if you're sensitive to motion sickness or screen flickering because of Killing Spree.

[@xBadMarlboro]

15:50 u got no shadowdance anymore, so it’s even worse than it was

[@keltarking]

Warriors getting the short straw again? Been there, done that, won't stop me from maining it.

[@Kameleeon0728]

We aint getting the short straw this time. Slayer fury is currently strongest spec for m+ Mountain thane is just little weaker in terms of damage but also rocks both hero talents play amazing and fun slayer spins no stop Mountain thane thunder claps your enemies butts to draenor. We be eating good

[@motyovszkimiklos7538]

@@Kameleeon0728 slayer fury is strongest spec in m+ ??? how? dont give me false hope brother...

[@keltarking]

@@Kameleeon0728 Oh good then, mmy main is actually Fury. 😁

[@aaronwylie6928]

gonna play slayer fury

[@keltarking]

@@aaronwylie6928 I haven't looked into the hero talent thing yet, but I'll definitely check that out when it goes live.

[@JC-ok4yx]

Wait, they pulled shadowdance out of the class tree?! Okay. I’ll actually try the new spec then. I didn’t want my outlaw rogue having the entire rotation built around shadowdance.

[@kalasmournrex1470]

I’d put Feral in D or F as a long time feral enjoyer.

[@nobodyneedstoknow128]

Why not timestamp for Sesame Street Craft classes?

[@Slayerdudeto]

I like how frost has been stuck in breath build and unholy has always been the top top class smh

[@Pweips]

Ret, I'll roll ret again. Played it during SL and a lil bit in DF. I'm ready to dive into it

[@chchzuzia]

Wait, where are Arms and Prot Warriors? Did I miss them?

[@Quigglessish]

at the end, it's only dps so no prot

[@Fitz3354]

Definitely a touch sad but I still will be maining my Outlaw Rogue.

[@olubankai7]

Guess I’ll be going back to my Unholy DK for melee 😅

[@Tenezill]

not having shadow dance as an assa is fun, i mean at least i dont have to think about playing it in m+ anymore

[@TheFlyWahine]

I enjoyed the losers, a lot of fun to listen to.

[@MickeyHW9463]

I thought they got rid of those range extending talents because they were increasing the base melee attack range across the board, no?

[@Gunshow0]

4:20 thank god - i legit only play for Solo/Story - idc about raids etc was sick to death of worrying about rotation and getting told my dps sucks

[@aaronmoore7120]

Unholy DK looking really nice

[@Jacob-id7xm]

True, but frost dk pumps even more!

[@gregoryjamaalfulton]

​@@Jacob-id7xm Hmmm meta or having fun...Imma choose fun!

[@Jacob-id7xm]

@@gregoryjamaalfulton frost is fun lol