The Witchfinders - Take Two Doctor Who Review

The Tardis team find themselves in a village none of them have ever heard of in the middle of a witch hunting hysteria. To complicate matters further, King James (in the form of Alan Cumming) arrives to oversee the witch trials personally.
Original review: • Doctor Who Review: The...
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[@CouncilofGeeks]

My video on the issue of the BBC's support of Transphobia: kzbin.info/www/bejne/l3-XppZmfb-ljac Shaun's 1st video, which includes some additional confirmed information: kzbin.info/www/bejne/mGXFpn2Dgs6qmck Shaun’s 2nd video, which follows how the BBC is trying to dodge accountability for all of this: kzbin.info/www/bejne/p5fNhXpsiLudo7M Shaun’s recent 3rd video: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nIPRYoiQacubmqc Laura Kate Dale's recent protest speech outside the BBC offices: kzbin.info/www/bejne/nnPNeKGNoNx0oKs

[@alexcollier1587]

Ll

[@alexcollier1587]

Lll

[@Rmlohner]

My favorite part of this one is that Graham says the Ezekiel quote from Pulp Fiction, which is famously nothing like the actual Bible quote with that number...and James still recognizes it somehow.

[@edadankmemes]

whoops lmao

[@thegabrielhyde]

Ooff. So: I actually have a pretty big problem with Thirteen's "twist in the sequel" line. The full version of it is Becka quoting "Thou shalt not suffer a witch to live" from King James's Bible, and the Doctor saying "In the *Old* Testament. There's a twist in the sequel. Love thy neighbour." The thing is-"Love thy neighbour (as thyself)" isn't originally from Jesus in the New Testament. It's from Leviticus, in the Hebrew Bible, or the "Old Testament" the Doctor is referring to. It bothers me that the Doctor makes that factual mistake-but it bothers me more because the idea that the "Old Testament" is violent and vengeful, and the New Testament replaced this with Christian love and mercy, is historically antisemitic.

[@CouncilofGeeks]

That's an excellent point. I was taking it just as a snappy comeback to somebody who was taking a twisted view of the book, but you're right it shouldn't have these kinds of errors.

[@kateorgera5907]

To be fair, it is a general rule of thumb for Christians that New Testament takes precedence over Old Testament since those are the words of Jesus and his disciples, and considering this particular group was very invested in its religious identity, I could see why the Doctor chose to point out that it's more "Christian" to show mercy and tolerance than hate and violence (likely a pointed message to modern day conservative Christians who take a similar tact). That said, you're right - that misquote is a surprising oversight on the writers' parts.

[@MichaelJohnson-kq7qg]

This is not a problem. The mention of loving thy neighbor in the Hebrew scripture is part of the Levitical laws (specifically, one of what tends to be referred to as the 'sundry' laws) and is part of a long list of rules of how people of the tribes of Israel are supposed to function. In the Greek scripture, the whole point is that these laundry lists of (often incompatible) rules are specifically replaced by two simple commandments that apply to everyone (not just the tribes of Israel). The Doctor is pointing out that the literalist sort of theology that kills witches is incompatible with the spirit of the law as explained in the New Testament.

[@booradley8895]

People do get bothered by the most stupid of reasons

[@jmurray1110]

You could but there is also a verse in Mathew about not one joit or title of the law may be changed until the end of days

[@DarcyDeee]

I've always wished this episode was 13 on her own dealing with her new body and just fighting the pure historical monsters of puritanical Englishmen. This could have been her midnight

[@CouncilofGeeks]

That would have been interesting.

[@60wattmoon]

I feel like the sonic detecting "no magic" was probably a delivery issue, like it was written as a joke for the Doctor, but delivered earnestly.

[@nellebolton7910]

Usually when the Doctor mentions something like "magic" i just assume they're referring to a specific thing in Gallifreyan that our human brains can't comprehend so match the closest word to it. Kinda like the idea that 10 is actually teaching advanced physics to the kids in the Sarah Jane episode but all they can hear is 'physics' repeated.

[@AlexFyrehartDGAFCave]

I remember my main takeaway when I watched this the first time was that this SHOULD have been a pure historical. I think the same about Demons Of The Punjab as well but not as strongly as this one. We have very real human villains that absolutely work as the *only* villains for the story. There was no need for a "monsters of the week" aspect to this story. And hell, Chibnall works better with less sci-fi goings on usually, so it likely would've been to his benefit to have at least ONE pure historical per series, really.

[@raininscotland]

I always love when the companions get to play dress up for the historic episodes, it's a shame they've barely done it with Jodie's era. I'm usually more picky about historical episodes, but lean towards enjoying them more often than not. I liked this episode, but I admit my bias here. I'll give just about anything a pass when Alan Cumming is there and being his usual amazing self. I was too busy being happy to see him to notice most of the flaws. I'd love to see him get another shot at playing King James in something else, he was perfect for the role. It wasn't anything special and the end monsters were kind of crap, but it was a generally fun episode for me.

[@baaron7]

I love your comment on Alan Cumming and the script, that it didn't fix the poor writing but you were so engaged in his performance that you cared less. That's exactly how I felt about a lot of Capaldi's era, not the best script but he's genuinely the best actor we've ever seen take on the role and that made it so fun to watch!

[@ItsMeHarry]

Definitely do think this is one of those episodes that you forget about but enjoy on a rewatch, and whilst I don't mind a technobabble ending or whatever for the most part I do agree it seems odd to have the Morax be the focus, or at least not making them fit the theming better. Also, as you pointed out Chibnall's tendency to include unnecessary monsters/aliens, it actually reminded me he wrote Countrycide for Torchwood which many consider to be among his best contributions to the world of Who (similarly, Adrift is one often praised and has a similarly monster-less tale). Strange that for his work on Torchwood he seemed so good at developing stories that didn't rely heavily on anything but human drama, yet his work on Doctor Who itself has been much more of a mix of relying on monsters (although I do think he has at least known when to put them on the backburner for the sake of the story being told, which I think is the case in both Eve of the Daleks and Legend of the Sea Devils, although I think the latter was not really well executed nor did it really make tons of sense not to explore them more whilst integrating the romance narrative into it in some way so both stories are well focused on). Given his final episode has what, like 4 returning enemies confirmed minimum, I don't see this necessarily being something we'll see from him again, but I do hope the centenary is at least successful as an emotional farewell, much like how Torchwood series 2 concluded with strong emotional weight

[@arubinojr5670]

"What a nice breezy ep-" *an Anne Boleyn made of mud:* "pyOOny PAthETic pLANet." "Well there goes that."

[@saffroneallen]

I really loved Alan Cumming as King James for so many reasons. The Scot in my loved seeing a Scottish actor in the role, as it should be. I love that they leaned into James' being sooooper flamboyant and sooooper queer (while being played expertly by a gay man). I always saw him as very conflicted in here, Pious and paranoid and broken and hurting and super gay while still obviously conflicted; though that may have been my historical knowledge tinting things. The man who cried over the death of his favourite, closest, very beautiful male servant also being the guy who okay'd the translation of Leviticus 20:13 we know today from the KJV. Because of that he can often be seen as a villain by our community (maybe deservedly), but this portrayal I feel rounded James out and tried to show more than the one facet of him. Fictionally of course. Plus I've loved Alan Cumming since the first Christmas I watched Bernard and the Genie so it was just lovely to see him given the chance to shine in a big hat. And honestly, I entirely forgot about the mud monsters. Entirely. As far as my brain is concerned apparently the episode ends at the end of the second act. Probably best.

[@nekusakura6748]

Minor Correction: Alan Cumming is Bisexual.

[@ColeHrusovsky]

The fact that The Doctor being a woman isn't as entwined as you'd expect might be because the writers didn't know at first The Doctor was going to be a woman. During development it was so secret even they didn't know. According to Chibnall even some of the first draft scripts referred to The Doctor as he. So it's possible much of the backbone of this episode was at least developed under that assumption.

[@c17sam90]

I find this so difficult to believe that they wouldn’t have them given the scripts a complete rewrite or Chibnal would have been so stupid to not tell the writers.

[@euandouglas4674]

Can you please link a text or something that confirms this, if you can find it?

[@c17sam90]

@@euandouglas4674 yeah it sounds really reckless especially if the quotes about Chibnall only wanting Jodie Whitaker are true I can’t see him not telling his writing team and then it’s not like she was cast and then filmed the next day. They would have had time to rewrite etc

[@c17sam90]

@Panic yeah it also brings in to question rewrites and just suppose he had cast an actor in a wheelchair as one of the companions or the doctor wouldn’t that be something the writers would have had to have known?

[@ColeHrusovsky]

@Panic eh, I don't think that's a bad reason. I'm sure it wasn't incredibly late that they knew. Probably just enough that the general story for most of the episodes was hashed out and maybe a couple scripts had been written. Plus, The Doctor being a woman was a HUGE thing that they couldn't afford to leak

[@spencerluther6485]

This is actually my favorite episode of series 11. Why? Throughout the season, I felt starved for a genuinely creepy monster, but the Morax really delivered. I actually think the monster elevates the story - though there are still some issues with the rest of the episode. B+

[@tonyjohansson7567]

I like this episode. Having a very dark episode of humanity combined with a somewhat light hearted and fun Doctor Who story is quite joyful. This is not a great episode, but it's an enjoyable story to watch. A bit like New Earth, Vampires of Venice or Smile.

[@wintergirll]

New earth is cute lol 🐱

[@thegentleartoffisticuffs6983]

I'd compare it to the Power of Three. It has a pretty bad and rushed ending but that doesn't ruin the rest of the episode, which is decent enough.

[@ftumschk]

Good comparison. If anything, The "decent enough" bit of The Witchfinders is a tad more entertaining than the "decent enough" bit of Power of Three, but the latter has the marginally better rushed ending.

[@Scampr_]

The fan sentiment that historicals are one of the best parts of Chibnall's era is something I definitely agree with, and this episode is one of the good examples of that for me - aside from that final 10 minutes or so. When this story first aired, I genuinely thought we were about to get a cliff-hanger and that the story was in fact a two-parter, with the next half shifting focus to the more overt alien threat - and instead we get that underwhelming and rushed climax. But gosh, you are so right in saying that it should've been a pure historical. The more educational vibe and overall style of most 13th Doctor historical stories often draws positive comparisons to the 1st Doctor's era, and this is a story where I could totally picture swapping the Tardis team out for the original Hartnell squad. This makes it all the more disappointing that Chibnall didn't go the extra mile in emulating the 1st Doctor formula by saying "what the hell" and ditch shoehorning a monster/alien into the plot.

[@xpehkto]

The most explicitly magic was addressed in the Seventh Doctor's story "Battlefield" where it's a technology of some specific civilisations from a parallel world. The Doctor did not use sonic screwdriver at the time.

[@melanierhianna]

The Pendle Witches is fairly well known. There's even a line of Ales from Pendle Brewery based around it, like Pendle Brewery Witches Black Cat...

[@thevacuumofcomments2946]

British accent is improving Vera ngl

[@Shaketetess]

Villa dio-DADDY had me on the floor. American accent, I love you.

[@Throkers]

Alan Cummings makes this the best S11 episode, it's not a good one by any means, but he's great which I never found myself saying for any supporting characters in the rest of the season.

[@gozerthegozarian9500]

How can the sonic screwdriver detect magic and not work on wood?!? Make it make sense!🤯

[@emcrolls]

What ? you want Consistency or something 🤦

[@gozerthegozarian9500]

@@emcrolls * sighs deeply * Point made and taken!

[@BlackCover95]

Magic isn’t made from wood.

[@rowanc88]

'What also floats in water?' 'Bread!' 'Apples!' 'Uh....very small rocks.'

[@CouncilofGeeks]

China! Gravy! Churches! Lead!

[@rowanc88]

@@CouncilofGeeks Umm...I think he says cider actually.

[@CouncilofGeeks]

@@rowanc88 well there’s me not parsing the accent.

[@emcrolls]

@@rowanc88 hahaha

[@Fejrus887]

This is a very interesting one for me, because watching it originally I never thought much of it. Then later going back (and also reading the Target novelisation, which gives me a huge bias, knowing some of the new stuff that is in there), I really liked. I agree that it's climax feels a bit too sudden and could have used a better build up and that some Exposition is clunky, but other Than that there is so much to love here. Yaz character Moments, the flat Team structure, King James being hilarious, balancing out the otherwise fairly dark Atmosphere, Ryan and Graham as a duo and them trying to fit in, 13's standing up to King James etc. I don't even mind the historical infodumps, because I feel reminded of the Hartnell era and the dropping of actual real world information, which was a reference point for the current era. That it didn't do the obvious and had the first female doctor having to deal with only sexism, during the Witch trials, because anybody could come up with that. Thematically also quite strong: for me the Morrax are an analogy for the evil in people and how that can embed itself onto people early on and grow stronger with time, making them do horrible things until they get touched by the light meaning either death or the good of other people and then of course Authority and Religion are quite prominent. King James constant juggling all of these things and giving into his worst instincts, until he finally has a change of heart After the talk with the doctor. I'm not 100% sure if the target novel Made those things clearer for me or that I have just interpreted the Story a bit more.

[@TheLastSane1]

I have done that in a high level PF campaign playing the Investigator class had a magical item that had these spells on it that had continuous use or command word and one was detect magic. So they would just break out this item and give the word and scan something. So I love this.

[@ianpark1805]

It’s probably already been mentioned but the basis for this episode is rooted in fact - Pendle Hill and unfortunately, the Pendle Witch Trials are/were a very real thing. As is King James’s authorship of a tome on witchcraft. You are very right, though, the Morax are a messy, rushed and probably rather unnecessary villain, although without them the ‘reanimated dead witch mud zombies’ would have taken a bit of explaining (alien virus disturbed by tree cutting? Willa could have had the solution all along. You’re welcome, Mr Chibnall). I do like the Doctors palpable disappointment when the psychic paper demotes her to Assistant Witchfinder.

[@ianpark1805]

P.S. Your British sloppy pronunciation glottal stopping of the double t in better was excellent!

[@Wurmze]

I remember being very excited when this came out because at the time I was living in view of pendle hill lol

[@ianpark1805]

@@Wurmze to be fair you can see the damn thing for miles from many angles!

[@ianpark1805]

Actually, it occurs to me that my solution to ‘the Morax Problem’ is kind of how they resolved ‘Praxeus’. Who do I sue? 😂😂

[@qqqqqqqqqqqq121212]

I’ve always said this is my favourite episode of series 11, I don’t even mind the Morax too much

[@im903yearsold]

I've always thought that Demons of the Punjab should have been a pure historical too. Have the Doctor think it's aliens but it's just humans - there's already an inconsistency in the version we got where the Doctor asserts the holy man couldn't have been killed by a human, but he was. I think Witchfinders and Rosa still needed some sort of sci-fi gimmick to be the inciting incident, but not necessarily needed a monster.

[@marocat4749]

Ye the monstr werent needed but it doesnt take away from the riot ryan grahan and king james have. And i liked the point the doctor made, even if it not going too dark in the conequences, it does thou , i love the doctors speech how james is just a scared little man and yeah, thats true about that kind of people.That point tht the people starting this are easly scared little ... usually. I like that point. While it doesnt do a lot to the actual accused, that point is good. It probably is even bettr with james shown as funny and threat in the episode. Him being called out on that . ts a good aproach too. And the fear and that.

[@etherealtb6021]

Another great idea, great cast, but couldn't stick the landing!

[@steveopinions9111]

For me ironically this episode ended up as one of the better episodes of series 11 because of the Morax. So many of the episodes in series 11 feature of a twist of the villain isn't the alien/monster/robots and it was just a human or there is no villain and what seemed to be wasn't really bad. At least with the Morax they were clear villains. Could this story have better without them as a pure historical? probably but given series 11's lack of actual villains I was just glad to see actual villains with clear malice which weren't just humans. I think the Morax could have been better tied into the witch theme, or perhaps use the Carrionites which I do think suit the episode better than the Morax but I know Chbinall wanted no returning villains. Also I think they could have made this episode creepier and I think that would have suited the morax vibe a bit better.

[@Polycomical]

LOL definite bonus points for the Holy Grail reference

[@rowanc88]

I didn't mind the more creepy look of the mud-possessed victims (very J-Horror-esque I found), but the lead Morox makeup looked really bad.

[@andurilcuivie]

The reason they almost always have aliens is that their interference is what gives the doctor license to interfere. Remember the Waters of Mars and Fathers Day. So a pure historical would have to have more finesse.

[@CulturePhilter]

Any video that starts with a Monty Python quote is a good video 😄

[@drewlytle2281]

I wish we could have gotten King James meeting Captain Jack.

[@mlp_firewind8129]

Personally I think the idea of a historically set episode with no sci fi elements isn’t a great idea. Not like it hasn’t been done ever, but still. I agree that the Morax are kind of a non sequitur. But it was established that something is up with the mud, and there is a tangible threat here beside the social stigma. I think a story like this with no sci fi elements could have even been worse. It would end up with the doctor showing up and solving this real, complicated, very intricate issue with a wave of her wand and some psychic paper. Or alternatively the doctor leaves without really achieving much of anything. Like, with Rosa. Image if the Doctor was instrumental in Rosa doing what she did. Or alternatively if they had just said hi to her, experiences some racism, and left. Neither if a fun or satisfying story. I think more could have been done to make the last few minutes a bit less jarring. But I liked the episode well enough and I think if there was no aliens the episode could have ended up a lot worse.

[@theshadowdirector]

The portrayal of king James rather sticks out to me compared to other historical figures. We've seen portrayed during the Chibnall era. I know king James was recorded as being a pretty flamboyant kind of person for the time ( it's often speculated. He may have been on the LGBTQ spectrum) but this performance is still rather too OTT for me. Also, king James was Scottish, a fact that he UK made TV show should really get accurate!

[@ftumschk]

Alan Cumming, a Scot himself, does use a Scottish accent, albeit a "posh" one, for King James. I remember reading one review which observed that Cumming seems to have modelled his voice on Sir Malcolm Rifkind, Scottish politician and variously Secretary of State for Scotland, Transport and Defence under the premierships of Margaret Thatcher and John Major.

[@theshadowdirector]

@@ftumschk okay, I'll rettacy that comment, I think I misremembered.

[@ftumschk]

@@theshadowdirector No worries. Alan Cummings' "posh Scottish" accent is so subtle that it's easy to miss.

[@JustinAshbrook]

This supports the theory that in new Who, BBC mandates having a monster every episode and won't allow pure historicals.

[@caiomascarenhas5910]

I can see now how Chibnall is great at creating characters but he is not good at putting context/developing any of them, I wonder sometimes how much of that I liked in the RTD seasons(1-4) where he was still working on DW. Because RTD actually knew how to set and make payoffs so it was always really rounded in a satisfactory way

[@radic888]

You should link to your previous reviews when you do these, please.

[@lucypreece7581]

I agree that this should have been a pure historical. It had the potential to be like the Torchwood episode Countrycide where the true threat is the humans and there is no monster or alien or creature to defeat and you just have to deal with the utter darkness and depravity of humans and how bad and awful and disgusting humans are capable of being. Witch trials and witch hunts were an awful and terrible part of history.

[@Yan_Alkovic]

Frickin' love the Holy Grail cold open! And yeah, I agree that this isn't the worst episode, but it could've been way better had it not gone into the alien crap, that was so unnecessary

[@rat-of-pain]

This one has all the problems of a chibnall era episode. Bad writing, bad characterization, off plot... But I have fun watching it, and the problems aren't as glaring as they are in some other ones, so it ends up being one of my favs of the era, which isn't saying much lol

[@NichtcrawlerX]

11 January is the most "recent"?

[@sbi168]

The ending is waaaay too rushed and again u feel like there is 5 or 10mind in the cutting room floor. Wish there was extended versions on blu ray. I like the episode tho. Good solid fun.

[@iseeundeadpeople9]

This and Demons of the Punjab did not need aliens. At all. It was good without them. And this would have been great without them.

[@tacobowler]

I loved this episode. The only real issue I had with it was that the Doctor didn’t say “I’m the Doctor, and this planet is protected.” It was a missed opportunity to make Jodie feel more like the Doctor in her first season.

[@brucesimmons5517]

For an episode that had the Fairy Godmother in it, I think the Legends of Tomorrow episode "Witch Hunt" explored the witch hunts much better than this one.

[@CapriUni]

I watch KZbin videos with the captions on, and the algorithm is set to automatically censor what it thinks are swear words, So I keep seeing "alan [__]." It's amusing. But it's also really frustrating as heck. If I were fully deaf, and had to rely on the captions, I'd have to guess at the guest star's name. (It would probably be an easy guess, but still).

[@CouncilofGeeks]

I actually had an issue with that on Patreon. It didn't completely block me but when I posted about the review it stopped me and went "are you sure you want to use that word?"

[@tokublwhovian]

My favourite along with Rosa, TWWFTE and Ranskoor Av Kalos

[@jackaylward-williams9064]

If I were to list the 10 episodes of Doctor Who that I disliked the most on first viewing, this episode would come second only to The Return Of Doctor Mysterio, and that is mainly just because of how much of a let down it was to wait an entire year for more Doctor Who and end up with an episode that is little more than a generic superhero movie, a genre that I find rather dull. The worst aspect of this episode is how predictable it is. The Doctor is now a woman and ends up in Lancashire during the witch hunts, I wonder what the climax could possibly be. Said climax also falls into the same trap as that of The Woman Who Fell To Earth, namely that the episode presents it as if The Doctor is in mortal danger despite the fact that we’ve seen her/him get out of much worse. Just as The Doctor falling off the top of a crane is pretty low stakes given that she survived falling from the sky earlier in the same episode, presumably due to the lingering effects of her regeneration, it’s a stretch to expect her to come to any harm being dunked under water given that her previous incarnation survived exposure to the vacuum of space in the previous season. Also, on a relatively minor note, I don’t know why Alan Cummings felt the need to put on an English accent, given that James I was from Scotland.

[@mrdoctorgilmore]

Wasn't a fan on initial viewing, was still annoyed that the pure historical rumour didn't happen. However this is one of episodes that considerably improved on rewatch. The climax is the weakest element and is pretty rushed being slow gothic horror to traditional sci fi in the last few minutes. The novel fixes that issue and makes me hope more Chibnall era stories get adapted eventually.

[@crazypomp927]

The best possible description of this episode is that it's the Mark Gatiss-level episode of the season.

[@doctor1206]

I think now series 11 was the best of the Chibnal Era … It’s not saying much because i still think its a really boring series… Well… its just a thought i did watching this video :p I have a theory, tough… Chibnal cannot make allegories… He puts people directly as monsters and Doctor Who usually speaks about humanity by a monster… it’s why he puts monsters at the end …

[@aarononeil9832]

My memory of this episode is that it was alright, a little mixed with some good stuff and some of Whittaker's best acting by that point but ultimately kinda forgettable

[@michaelmeyerson5051]

I actually enjoyed this episode from start to finish. Sometimes you have to just sit back and enjoy.

[@callisto8413]

The history based stories were all good without the monster or 'bad guy' in them.

[@ftumschk]

I tend to agree. Even the (justifiably) much-praised "Vincent & The Doctor" would have worked better without that giant invisible budgie.

[@ConnorKent428]

The novelisation is the worst thing I've read.

[@CouncilofGeeks]

I completely forgot that they were novelizing these.

[@dogblessamerica]

That's not a bad britbonger accent lol

[@brysimm404]

I didn’t even bother watching this episode because Chibnal had already put me off 🤦🏻‍♂️

[@Adeodatus100]

Boy, did I hate this episode! Given the care that they've taken over other historical episodes, they could not have made a bigger mess of the historical aspects of this one - a mishmash of unresearched, half-remembered pseudohistory with zero awareness of the culture of the time and place. Dreadful.