The WORST thing about disc brakes!

[@paullehrbmx]

as a mechanic, i disagree with all of this being good practice. if your brakes are mushy, you must bleed them, it's an indicator of wear/air/other issues. if your rotor is rubbing, don't push the pad's directly and clean the pistons before pressing them in, this can lead to stuck pistons, or worse, damages piston seal. noise is generally contamination or too much heat. causing pad glazing. i can see how the rotors in this video show signs of overheating, those pad were glazed from contamination as well. rotor truing advice is fine.

[@Skelf71]

Exactly!

[@truthseeker8483]

As an engineer I would say the best solution is rim brakes 😀😀😀😀😀😀😀😀

[@PRH123]

How do you clean the pistons...?

[@kevinnielsen1356]

@@truthseeker8483 rim brakes are a form of disc brakes

[@truthseeker8483]

@@kevinnielsen1356 yes and with a 700mm rotor 😀

[@c3N3q]

Hydraulic brake system is not an open system, unless it is leaking, it relies on the pressure, i.e. you are not getting rid of the air by taping the lever to the bar overnight, you are relocating the bubbles to one spot and temporarily improving performance. 🧐 You would have to open your bleed port on the lever before taking the tape off, suck the air on top out and push in more fluid whilst loosening the lever.

[@davidenglund]

That first hack of wrapping the brake handles in engaged position is something ANY of us can do. Thanks for sharing that! :D

[@myscreen2urs]

0:10 "they require very little maintenance" Me watching this video: "LIES!!!😡"

[@darkplasmo7921]

i have had luck and can't complain, but the noise will 100% not be fixed by rubbing them on sand paper, buy high quality ones not some Shimano crap what is a far bigger problem is the rear shifter on my next bike, I will definitely get a gear box

[@a.campos891]

For my mountain bike I love disc brakes. For my road bike all I need is rim brakes. They are lighter, simpler, easy to service and easier to align than disc brakes.

[@fernandodisola6675]

💯

[@fernandodisola6675]

@Hans i don't ride in the wet...if i do use special brake blocks which desipate the water really well, at least i don't lock up my brakes on 25mm tyres at 100psi now thats dangerous, you'll be riding double sided rotors with abs brakes 😅😅😅🤣🤣 very soon watch this space and race bikes weigh over 11kg🤣🤣🤣 disk brakes are great on MTB gravel bikes and commuting not on performance road bikes absolutely no need

[@goodeggnogg7038]

@Hans my carbon rims have basalt impregnated brake track...extremely hard wearing and much better wet braking than aluminium rims!

[@tomgrant6563]

Unless you do a lot of climbing... And when you descend again the rims wear out too fast, even when dry. In the wet they wear twice as fast again.

[@michaelhaney3388]

Yes, totally agree, mountain disc, road rim.

[@richiejames928]

I love my disc brakes and being a heavier rider they are essential. but boy they are constant work!! Swap wheels,,They rub.. clean your bike,,they rub. bleed your brakes…they rub. Oh and then have to do a lever bleed again a few months later as a massive bubble has mysteriously appeared under the bleed bolt… reset everything. go for one joyous ride. go for a second ride and…they rub lol

[@DaveCM]

You can set your wheels up to swap out. I've done it. It takes some work though. I used shims to get on identical to the other. Unfortunately, when you change rotors on one, you have to do it again but that isn't very often. But, I've since given up swapping wheels though. Not because of rotors but because tubeless. Too much hassle maintaining two two sets of wheels setup tubeless.

[@amuro2000]

Your best video short and right to the point ! Learned a lot , but still love my rim brakes .

[@allrounderbicycle7193]

Great and concise advise. If I could add a tip from my experience as a professional mechanic. When using a rotor truing tool while the bike is on the bike, do your bends on the opposite side of the axle relative to the caliper. For instance the caliper is around 2 o’clock from the axle, rotate the segment of rotor needing bending to 8 o’clock. This prevents the caliper from becoming a bending tool as well.

[@julianmorris9951]

There’s not enough tolerance on road or gravel disc brakes, never had a problem with mountain bikes because the calliper is on a hearty fork leg and not a spindly fork that flexes, I reckon that’s the biggest issue, a fork should be compliant for comfort , as soon as I’m out of the saddle on my gravel bike I got disc rub because the fork is flexing 🙄

[@sepg5084]

Get an alloy fork then. I have a carbon frame but i replaced my fork with an alloy fork. No more fork flex problems. i don't have problems with "compliance" or whatever because tires are the ones that are supposed to soak a bit of that shock anyway.

[@markblanch2905]

@@sepg5084 bizarre that a bike should need to have a reverse build, quality drop to appease a poor design.

"Compliant" = flexible = sucking up your power. A proper road bike should be as stiff as possible. Enduro bikes for weekend warriors are a different breed.

[@DaveCM]

That is a problem with your bike. I've never experienced that on my road or gravel bike and I'm a big and strong guy.

[@julianmorris9951]

@@DaveCM the problem could be it has a quick release and not a through axle, it’s a 2017 bianchi all road, the new gravel bikes all have through axle to stiffen the forks, I’m only 160lb rider so no fatty🤣

[@Mixail747]

Had rim brakes for many years, barely done *any* servicing at all, didn't even change the pads once! Switched to hydro discs and doing at least some maintenance every month or two and buying new pads regualrly all for a smidge of improved performance.

[@steveharrigan7811]

I had a Specialized MTB with Shimano hydraulic discs, had it for 5 years, never had to touch the brakes once. Now I have a Scott MTB, It has the same brakes, 2 yrs in, and I havent had any braking issues..0 maintenance.....I ride on average, about 35 to 40 miles a day.

[@Mixail747]

@@steveharrigan7811 I dunno man, I also have Shimano hydro, and mine are fiddly af.

[@steveharrigan7811]

@@Mixail747 Im on my second bike with hydraulics....Never had to touch them. Both Shimano.

[@DR_1_1]

@@Mixail747 Maybe you need to clean them... What are your brakes brand/model? if you have to replace the pads because of poor performance, you have a main issue, disc brakes should be extremely powerful. Maybe no bed-in? Or poor alignment of the calliper with the rotor? I had to align my rear calliper on my new bike, tolerance is so low and when braking the rotor was bent! I was a bit surprised to see I had to basically loosen the main screws, no setting for that on S 105 (otoh there is a screw especially for alignment on my old Shimano rim brakes, in addition to spacing). Maybe check that alignment, it's less obvious than with rim brakes, you have to look exactly in the plane of the rotor, and maybe a light behind it. Replacing the pads is also a bit more subtle than on rim's, but in both cases, they should last a few thousands kilometers of normal use? Of course riding styles vary a lot, I'm mostly on flat roads, no mountains... I have to replace rim's pads every few years/thousands kilometers, a bit like tyres (those also vary a lot in durability depending on the brand/model and use).

[@rdkuless]

Hello.. i started soaking my new brake pads in filtered water before installing them.. If they are wet they brake in better and now i never get brake squeal.. I still have to go thru the process of completely stopping on a down hill about 10 times to brake them in. I'm not sure exactly what makes them work better, but i no longer hear my brakes at all.. I run Tektro HD Twin E-525's... I also add fluid when they become soft and burp the lines with a vibrating tooth brush (vibrator to shake the bubbles up to the reservoir).. and i doubled the life of my brake pads with this process. I ride in the city with stops at every block.. And i ride between 30-50 miles a day. over 10k miles in the last 4-5 years.

[@rdkuless]

David.. thank you for the refresher.. when disc brakes work they are incredible.. And knowing how to maintenance them is really important to the enjoy-ability of them..

[@Caleketa]

Thanks for sharing. My rear break was spongy and with the tape hack the problem was solved the next day.

[@marzzipanik]

For how long? Honest question.

[@DR_1_1]

@@marzzipanik Same question here, how long do the brakes stay firmer? New brakes here, they were spongy, but get better after some bed-in. I'm asking because I can see no setting for that issue? Also no settings on the calliper, neither for alignment, nor spacing... On my 30 years old rim brakes I can adjust spacing and alignment with a dedicated screw and the ring at the end of the cable (or by adjusting the cable, too)...

[@Kvs-vf9nt]

Also when buying a new bike with hydraulic disc brakes 'm told afther 500 km allready let's do a check up that everything is good and I allways did that with my other bikes too. Offcourse if you have a problem earlier go asap to a mechan. It's a disgrace that on some racebikes it's just not good when they come out off the factory. And if it's a bike from 2000 or 12000 euro ,I don't give a sh*g they have to see that there (hydraulic) disc brakes work! I rode a testlap with the new bike, and breaks are good no squaling at all. It was only 15km but I looked up the most uphill/downhills to test it before I do like 70-100 km rides. Also first a bikefitting 12 August. Like I said I had to buy everything new because my Campagnolo was sold, and before that my Scott catapulted in the air on rim brakes afther malfunction on the descent off the Stockeu and rode against a camionette it was a hard impact, and very weird actually that a bike can fly so "high". If it was against a car, I was through the rear window for sure. So no rimbrakes for me anymore In hot weather they're trash. Since that I'm a bit scared off descends despite it being not my fault, and anyone that knows the full Stockey 2600m at 9,8% knows it's not techninal at all but just very steep when you descend the last km. And the ascend is good but the descent so what they do in LBL was still a horrible road. It's now a long time can anyone tell me that the descent from the (I think it calls rue de Somagne if you ride that side instead off the actual Stockeu where it begins is now also good asphalt?) Like for example Thier de Coo since couple off years now is really good to ride on but before that it was a horrible road . Any Belgian's here or Dutchman? If so you all know what I'm talking about.. I go withing a month- six weeks max for 1 weekend to Stavelot. Not a week, for that my form is not good enough yet. I'm only 8 weeks out off a depression and then started again. I weight myself again only once a week the same day in morning, and evening. I lost 11kg in 7 weeks. Well good news it's now 13kg in 8 weeks allready. Beginning next year I will have a great condition again. Although I won't go lower than between 73kg min-77kg max. I'm 1m89cm so yeah.. in Corona I gained 38kg from Booze Booze and booze and depression and then also corticoids for my disease so yeah now from 113kg to 100kg in 8 weeks without starving myself, just eat healthy and NO alcohol. So when I go in like a month-6 weeks It will be around 85kg - 90kg because I will become slimmer more rapidly because I will do the training then allready on my new Scott roadbike with the 105- R7000 so not bad, not great, but first I have a bikefitting. (Ow yeah this is not the first time that I have had this problem). The first time my weight was 58kg, and went to 97kg and then too I was very fast on a good weight/power again, it was also depression/corticoids and lots off alcohol. But 58kg is to low for me. Around 75kg is perfect then I have the most power. And like I said everywhere, when I was almost 14 until 2years and 6 months later it was all over with the disease Spondylitis Ankylosans. And I was really not bad at cycling. Ok I had not a good sprint but in hilly stages I still have lots off results here on paper, and articles out off the regional paper about me. I rode most important races in Benelux and some races in . And yeah still a top 10 and top 15's so allways with the best off the bunch I'm hilly stages wasn't bad and I had then allready lots off inflammations but the last year it was huge and a blood result showed the factor B27 so yeah I was screwed and heartbroken and still think about it now and again. And if I was a totally crappie rider okay. But I wasn't. But that's all long time ago now. I just want to have fun and hope to find some friends from Benelux to ride with. Especially next year I would like to have a cycling friend alleready that goes with me to the Vosges not to do incredible performances but to enjoy a 1 week bike vacation and do all the most beautifull colls there. And also the hardest like steep planche de belles filles. I have a great Garmin, we can even plan some rides together then. BTW I live 17km from Muur van Geraardsbergen top. Also I become 33year old in december. So if anyone wants to ride with me, please just say the word and we can go on a ride here in the Flemish Ardennes or so together .. And in winter on Zwift will be great too and then in February we can start on the road again. I want to be very descent again, like Ollie from GCN for example that has a lot off fun when he climbs on a very decent pace imo. Considering he's not an ex pro like the rest there. So exactly I hope somebody from Belgium or Netherlands reads this and we can become cycling buddies. Old/young female/male black/white I don't care. I just want a cycling buddy is all! If I have typos sorry but this gsm is annoying asf to type with, it makes up his own words sometimes. I have a new Samsung galaxy fortunately still in the box.

[@ianlloyd1182]

Thanks for the info, very useful. Just a suggestion on using abrasive paper to deglaze the pads. Wash them off with brake cleaner after doing this to get rid of any fine abrasive particles before re assembly.

[@lobuxracer]

Right. And don't use standard abrasives. There's a reason why those of us who work on cars know you should ONLY use garnet on brake systems. Unless you want to pollute your discs with aluminium oxide and ruin your brake pads.

[@magnumllama400]

@@lobuxracer right nobody cares about such details

[@chrisgravel7157]

While often left out of the bike delivery process Disc brakes should come with a pad spacer/block. The Sram Avid one I use has one side for pushing pads apart to get the right spacing and reseting calipers. The other side is to insert while travelling so you dont pinch the pads together. Of course make sure its cleaned with alocohol each time. Shimano has a simular block but it lacks the wider side for reseting pads. Ask your shop for 2 of these if they didn't include them with your bike or at least one for pad/caliper adjustment.

[@firemedic5365]

Superb video. The first hack absolutely blew my mind. Anything that can help one avoid bleeding hydraulic brake lines on a bike is a God-send, as the task is so time-consuming and such a total pain in the ass. Bravo, my friend, for sharing this. I thank you for that.

[@dwayneflannery]

I had terrible front rotor rub on my roadie and it was driving me bats especially when it was raining and my front calibre would lockup and then i had it serviced still kept doing only till i asked them to check the tension in my front wheel spokes well that sorted the issue out the front wheel spokes where terribly loose now i dont have the issue thank goodness

[@Skelf71]

An open brake system does not or should not let air in. If you have a spongy lever it is because it is not bled properly! Open system just means fluid can move from the line into a compensating chamber, or bladder.

[@davidarthur]

You're quite right I probably wasn't super clear, was just meaning that the seals aren’t perfect and the expansion and contraction of the fluid and bladder diaphragm can be more likely to let air enter than a closed system which is why they tend to need more bleeding

[@teok7735]

I think the most overlooked factor is worn out discs, for some reason we think its ok to go for a year or so without replacing them, the pads are not made to travel too far so it rly helps.

[@janeblogs324]

So you bleed and top up the fluid, then you seal it. Then your pads wear, so the pistons move out. Now the internal fluid system is a larger volume but you didn't add more fluid. So what makes up the extra volume? Vacuum. If you put any fluid under vacuum it boils. The oxygen that was bonded to the fluid separates and becomes air bubbles. Almost all fluid contains h2o. There's oxygen in your fluid system to begin with it was just bonded to hydrogen

[@Skelf71]

@@davidarthur Sorry the only reason they need bled other than changing the fluid which should be done regularly is to purge air that was in there already, and not properly removed. At no time does air "get in" unless there is a fault. Check with Shimano, Sram or Hope for a comment. Also a closed system is the same as an open except it does not allow for expansion without user input. (old Hope brakes had an adjuster cap for this as they were "closed") I really like your reviews and videos, refreshing change from the usual BS form CGN etc, please don't go down the "made up mechanics" hole.

[@Skelf71]

@@janeblogs324 Speaking as someone who spends most of their working day working with vacuum machines and hydraulics the "vacuum" effect on a bike brake system is so insignificant its never going to be a concern. Even Water has very little effect below 500mb of vacuum( 10deg approx.) It would be almost impossible for a bike brake system to be even close to a fraction of this level of Vacuum. We are also dealing with oils and fluids, which even at worst case "wet" are still 60%+ higher boiling points than water. Also once the line is closed(when the lever is pulled, it can only be positive pressure in the line. So any small vacuum that exist in the system is now in the reservoir, closed off from the line. In a DOT system, being hydroscopic, continued heat cycles will cause the fluid to degrade, and water to form steam, and give spongy brakes. A different issue to a poorly bled brake, entirely.

[@Rose_Butterfly98]

Some things extra, if you've been using Shimano brakes and go to a bike with SRAM, the brakes may feel spongy, nothing's wrong, that's just how the modulation works. If you are using Shimano rotors, I think it's ice tech or something, they may be extremely thin, do not use a tool, just use some tissues and do it with your fingers or you will definitely bend it off to the other side. I fix squeaking brakes using thunderstorms. If you live in a city, especially with a petrochemical plant somewhere, the air is extremely polluted, here, it essentially turns out rain into some kind of degreaser. I just rode around during a thunderstorm 2 days ago and my brakes stopped squeaking. Also uh, it once degreased my chain for me.

[@botondrostas]

One main reason for loud brakes from my experience is that break mounts on most frames are not faced out of the factory (regardless of the brand / price) and as such the calipers can't be adjusted to sit perfectly. There is no hack around this but to take the frame to a bike shop and pay them to do what the factory should have done.

[@davidarthur]

That's a really good point Botond thanks for sharing

[@Loekie-de-leeuw]

And how would you notice the difference between needing facing, brake misalignement and bend discs?

[@Fixin-To]

@@Loekie-de-leeuw Steel rule.

[@botondrostas]

@@Loekie-de-leeuw From my experience if you spin your wheel while looking down at the rotor, using the brake pads as a reference it's quite easy to see if the rotor is bent. When setting up your brake calipers and no matter how you try to adjust them you can't get them to sit perfectly parallel to the rotor (provided the rotor is straight) it's fair to assume that your frames brake mounts were not faced so that they are in the correct angle to your axles.

[@user-nu5fx6en9h]

My s work frame doing really good

[@stephenpoole6015]

And sometimes disc brakes (Dura-Ace in my case) squeal like stuck pigs every time it rains without there being any detectable problem, but are totally quiet when it's dry. Not my idea of progress given rim brakes are normally quiet, and cheaper, lighter, simpler and allow a comfier fork too...

[@filipwojciechowski3647]

No, this is not "Open system". It is the same as in MTB or Motorcycles and Cars. If your brakes feel "mushy" after some time or hanging on rack, it is indicator that you have not bled them correctly. Idea with tape it just "quick fix", because you will only force air to go into reservoir in lever. It is not proper solution, because source of problem is incorrect bleeding.

[@bitgeist21]

Great video, David. I actually learned something new in this presentation about brake noise and how to address it. (So thank you for that!) I'm currently running the previous generation of Ultegra Di2 with the BR-R8070 disc brakes. I am having an issue with the caliper pistons as they seem to retract very slowly upon a sustained braking event. In other words, I can hear the pads brushing up against the rotors for about 100 meters or so before they retract enough for my brakes to go silent again. I want to try your degreasing recommendation to see if the pistons aren't mucked up internally. One other thing I learned that I would like to share with your community regarding noisy brake pads. When installing new pads, (I use Ice Tech in general); one of the thing I like to do to keep things very quiet is to use a metallic brake pad on the inside surface of the rotor and a resin pad on the outside surface of the rotor for both the front and rear calipers. In my experience, this keeps braking extremely quiet even in wet conditions. When coupled with your recommendations, I think everyone will have a very noise-free braking experience 🙂

[@davidarthur]

I didn't touch on sticky pistons as that's not something I've suffered from at all so maybe I can look at that in another video soon, as it appears it happens to a few people and is causing you some issues. First time I've ever heard about mixing different types of brake pads. Genius. Might have to try that

[@pedalscript]

I had rotors rubbing the pads on a second-hand bike I bought. The bike had the same BR-R8070 brake calipers and mileage around 2000km. The Park Tool video (m.kzbin.info/www/bejne/rIK7d3mdh6eoqtE) about cleaning and lubricating the piston seals was SUPER helpful, I thoroughly recommend watching that. Just make sure you're not pushing the pistons too far out from the caliper. I noticed that the pistons were quite lazy, so they must've been depleted of lubrication, causing them to retract poorly hence rubbing the rotor. After following the procedure on the Park Tool video, the pistons are now super smooth and gosh, what a relief it was on my next ride not hearing a single rubbing noise! Pure bliss! :)

[@halfglassfull]

@@pedalscript I had same problem but cleaning and lubricating did not help. I replaced the caliper. Lazy retraction action still persists.

[@pedalscript]

@@halfglassfull I guess if the piston seals are deformed or damaged enough, then cleaning and lubricating them potentially doesn't help. Did you try "exercising" the pistons? What I forgot to mention on my comment was that I had to pump the pistons in and out quite a few times before the lazy piston started moving more smoothly again. It wasn't enough to actually just clean and lubricate the piston surfaces, but the crucial part was precisely to "exercise" the pistons in order to free them up. This was explained very well on the Park Tool video but I forgot to refer to that part of the procedure. Anyway, I'm sure Shimano acknowledges this issue so it's possible to just get a warranty replacement if it occurs within the first two years (which is the warranty period). I actually had this exact issue on a NEW (!) Shimano GRX RX400 brake caliper, and had to clean, lubricate and exercise them because after bleeding the brakes, the outer piston just wouldn't retract properly and the rotor was rubbing. Doing the piston maintenance solved the issue. I could have just returned the caliper back to the online store for a new one, except that they are as scarce as hen's teeth at the moment, with delivery estimates of 6 months or up to 12 months. I didn't want to wait so long so I decided to try the piston maintenance procedure which did the trick. I've had my share of the Shimano brake caliper issues. Another caliper was micro-leaking mineral fluid through the piston seals (another known problem for their brake calipers), this was also a brand-new caliper (Deore M6000) that was bled properly. It had me spending quite some frustrating moments trying to locate the source of leak as well as having to clean and sand the brake pads due to contamination, all for nothing as the leaking persisted and ended up returning the caliper for a warranty replacement (luckily these calipers were in stock at the time!) 🤷🏼‍♂️ Edit. Oh, and I noticed that you commented having replaced the caliper and the problem still persisted. I don't know if there is a problem with the lever or the caliper, then, but like I said, I had poorly retracting pistons on a NEW Shimano brake caliper, so I wouldn't be surprised if your caliper was also faulty. I should've also mentioned that when I push the pistons back into the caliper with a plastic tire lever, and the system is freshly bled, I tend to first open the bleed port screw on the brake lever before pushing the pistons in, to prevent this action from damaging the seals/bladder inside the lever (because the system might be slightly "overfilled" with fluid after a bleed, so I believe that pushing the pistons back in might increase the pressure in the system, which is why I open the bleed port screw on the lever and usually some drops of brake fluid come out due to the pressure when pushing the pistons back into the caliper). I saw this mentioned on an online discussion forum so take it with a pinch of salt, but I think there's at least some truth to the theory because according to my experience, some fluid does come up the bleed port on the lever when pushing the pistons into the caliper, suggesting that there is a pressure increase in the system when doing this. That said, I would believe that a damaged seal/bladder on the lever would also give other symptoms than just lazily retracting pistons on the calipers, such as leakage of brake fluid through the bracket and/or spongy brake lever.

[@Vinchucca1984]

I have the same brakes and suffer from the same issue on the front brake. Sometimes the pistons just seem too slow and everything rubs like all h*ll for a few hundred meters. Tried fixing it myself by cleanign the pads, the pistons and realigning the caliper but nothing really seemed to help. I eventually turned it in to a bike shop. They bled the brakes and all that but again to little or no avail. Next bike is going to rim brakes again for me. I'll take the poorer braking performace over all the bending, rubbing, bleeding and squeeling any day of the week. Also whatever you do DO NOT attempt to bleed them yourself! The bleedport screw is EXTREMELY easy to round out and strip the threads off, it takes NO force AT ALL and once you've done that you're looking at a replacement brake-lever which is not only crazy expensive but also unavailable at the moment...so just don't.

[@hansschotterradler3772]

My 28" diameter brake rotors work just fine, calipers are eazy to adjust. Never squeaks.

[@medvanporjo]

more than just rotors

[@nizerp]

+1, great video, David! Cleaning your pistons is more of maintenance than hack, but build up of brake dust will gum up the piston seals, reducing how much they will move back. Over time that can exacerbate rubbing from other causes: bent rotors, deformation after hard braking, etc.

[@fotografamos4083]

Centering the brake calliper can be a bit tricky, but I do - and it's worked every time for me - is to loosen the calliper bolts, squeeze que brake lever a bit and tighten the bolts. Works every time.

[@DEAR7340]

@@darinsteele7091 I only have to do this when I swap wheels; the disk is in a slightly different position. Also, in my case, the "loosen-the-bolts-and-squeeze-the-lever" method isn't precise enough for my bike. I have had the most success my inspecting to see which side is actually rubbing, then (carefully/sensitively) moving the brake by hand. It is also important to not fully tighten the bolts; gradually tighten them by alternating between them, while holding the brake in place with your free hand.

[@waynosfotos]

That is what he did on the vid.

[@johndoyle4723]

And keep the the brake lever tight while you tighten.

[@TwinShards]

Most of the tips are good for, obviously, hydraulic/hybrid hydraulic brakes. Would it be possible to give a video how to adjust fully mechanical disc brakes? All hydraulic are 99% 2 pistons. Mechanical brakes are 99% 1 piston & 1 stactic wall with adjustment screw. I ride in the winter salty montreal road and i'm not going back to hydraulic because salts will find it's way between the pistons and jam them. I know how to adjust them but i'm sure many peoples would be interested.

[@johndef5075]

Discs arent necessary on road but for mtbing they are a vast improvement over rim brakes.

[@Mister_Durden]

And needed for an e bike

[@PrzemyslawSliwinski]

1:30 - I do this with my socks (to reset the calipers' positions after pads replacement), but never left them for all night long! It makes sense however - thank you! 4:00 - I use whiteboard marker pens (they are dry and easily removable with the help of pure alcohol) to see where the rotors rub pads.

[@fernandodisola6675]

I love disc brake on MTB, gravel bike & cycle cross but no way on a performance road bike what fuff to maintain.

[@effyleven]

How does the tape squeezing the levers work to firm up the brakes, that is, assuming it does? It happens I keep a stock of velcro-type cable ties... this would be yet another use for them.

[@Smeltz247]

It wouldn't. A mushy feeling break lever means thare is air in the system and they need to be blead.

[@markhebden1052]

The fact that this and many other videos like it exist, tells me I want to stick with rim brakes for as long as I can.

[@waynosfotos]

Half this stuff you never have to do with rim brakes, i hardly or never have to touch mine. Accept for a pad replacement.

[@PRH123]

Agree, the hydraulic discs on my commuter demand constant attention, they really only worked well the first year when they were new. By the way the drum brakes on my bad weather bike have not needed maintenance or adjustment for the last 5 years...!

[@rokker333]

New bikes usually only come with discs brakes :(

[@VeloNippon]

@@waynosfotos Now that you mentioned pads replacement they lasted at least two years. I do a lot hill climbing and with disc brakes have to go through rotor plus brake pads replacement every 6 months. This is more than double running cost that only benefits manufactures not consumers.

[@Kvs-vf9nt]

Just change the disc brakes completely then. If you all have the money for a good bike pay some money for new brakes. It's much safer. Just my humble opinion.

[@petersharkey5510]

Brake and clutch cleaner from a motor factors is far cheaper than Muc Off.

[@Thomas-fy9yc]

I just use 80%alcohol to clean, even cheaper.

[@davapod]

I've been using road disc brakes for a number of years now and have always found them to be disappointing. Admittedly not high end but well reviewed like the TRP Spyre and Avid BB7's on road based bikes, obviously not hydraulic. I have returned to rim brakes recently with a road bike with the 105 5800 rim brake set up and question why ever went down the disc route.😜

[@hawkeyelikesbikes]

TRP is junk. Had them on a bike I acquired second hand. Never again. Not in the same league as SRAM, let alone Shimano hydraulic road disc. I have Shimano 105 on my rain bike, Ultegra on my new road race bike. Infinitely better than the Ultegra rim brakes on my soon-to-be-sold road race bike.

[@davapod]

@@hawkeyelikesbikes I agree, whilst the BB7's weren't too bad, the spyre were awful. I changed rotors, pads, non compression outers etc and they were still awful. I'm sticking with rim brakes for the foreseeable future. Though I wouldn't mind having a go on decent hydraulic road brakes. Then again I'm enthralled with simplicity and excellent performance of my rim brakes.👍

[@chrisschultz3655]

Those are woeful disc brakes. Try some new shimano and you will never go back to rim.

[@jor-el1298]

That's like saying "I ate cement and went back to eating just dirt. I wonder why I ate cement all this time..."

[@NonLegitNation2]

that's because mechanical disc brakes suck compared to hydraulic. I've used both and mechanical were clearly like a half step above stopping flintstone style.

[@marekkozub8957]

Disc brakes require little maintenance? It must be a joke. They are maintenance nightmare. This video proves it.

[@markuskorn4829]

I ride mechanical brakes I do not ride my road bike in rain if I can help it I got a fixed gear for that and with that said I will ride down any hill and trust my campy Daytona to stop me

[@Metalshark100]

i tried doing that loosening the calliper and squeezing brake thing but doesn't always work for me. i find doing it by eye is a more accurate way to centre your disc between the pads. i just used one hand to adjust the calliper whilst i used my other hand to tighten the bolts, and by looking through the gap in the calliper i could see whether the disc was touching any of the pads or not. got it perfectly aligned and only took a couple of extra seconds than the other method but had so many failed attempts of alignment doing it the other way.

[@grahambowes756]

Thanks David the tape trick is new to me and great to know.

[@charlesbrestel8553]

Helpful. Well presented. Thanks!

[@richardmiddleton7770]

Does leaving the levers pulled with tape or a strap mean you never need to bleed them again unless replacing the fluid?

[@johnharris8394]

You talked me out of ever getting disk brakes.

[@thesayn3ver]

To fix disc brakes you throw them away and purchase rim brakes.

[@HarveyLMiller21]

John Harris: There are issues with rim brakes also. Among the many is the fact that, if your wheel isn't true, rim brakes will exhibit uneven braking...or worse like inability to use your bicycle unless you totally open the brakes. If you overheat the rim brake it's possible to have a blow out, very dangerous going downhill at speed. Rim brakes aren't as powerful, in general, as disc brakes and, if you are at load (bike packing, etc.) that can present a stopping power issue. Usually, with rim brakes, one has to open up the brakes to remove the wheel. Problem is that many forget to close them when returning the wheel back onto the bicycle. That's not a big issue but it does occur. The fact is that disk brakes are relatively more effective and safer to operate.

[@jerrykuc149]

Mechanical discs aren’t too bad; but those hydraulic ones suck. Especially the ones that use DOT brake fluid. Nasty stuff.

[@gustavmeyrink_2.0]

@@jerrykuc149 Mechanical disc brakes neatly combine the disadvantages of rim brakes with the disadvantages of disc brakes. I went for a mic of a hydraulic rim brake with a hydraulic disc. Both required zero maintenance in years. Both were vastly superior to wire-pull brakes.

[@andrewroozen9151]

I find that when I put on new pads (Trek Emonda - Shimano) the only way I can get the disc perfectly centred with no rubbing is to 'eyeball' it. Holding the brake on and tighening the bolts doesn't work. I also find that I have to spend time pushing the pistons back fully otherwise I cannot even get the new pads in between. I used to do this using a plastic tire lever and pushing on the pistons directly but now I have a special tool from my bike shop and push the pistons back with the old pads still in place by placing the tool in between them. This avoids damage to the pistons.

[@markbraun1366]

There are situations where disc excel. Rim brakes are much easier to maintain - next bike will be a classic rim bike one.

[@johnnyveganite9141]

On road bikes rim brakes are better because road riding is about speed not stopping unlike gravel and mountain bike. I don't get the road disc gimmick.

[@interceptor7905]

@@johnnyveganite9141 Cycling industry have to keep making zillions,they keep changing stuff like fashion

[@johnnyveganite9141]

@@interceptor7905 👍think you are right, trends to keep the money rolling in...

[@lihtan]

Disk brakes have amazing stopping power in wet conditions. I would see them as being more necessary for mountain and commuter bikes than road bikes.

[@johnnyveganite9141]

@@lihtan for sure

[@Argino1983]

Is the hack with tape useful when bike is hanging on the rack in vertical position? I have found that to long time on race makes disc brakes need of bleeding.

[@byrondixon4648]

This is video is a great argument for rim brakes 😎

[@panzerveps]

Yup. Replace your inner and outer cables once a season and the pads when they are worn out. I was on a cycling holiday a few weeks ago, and I was one of a few with rim brake. None of us rim brake guys had any trouble, while the others had problems with spongy levers, leaks and pads that wore out after a single (but very long) descent. It was quite entertaining to see them trying to find a bikeshop with SRAM brake pads in the Italian countryside.

[@Megahegs]

@@panzerveps if you are wearing out a set of pads on one descent, you are braking too much.😁

[@NonLegitNation2]

sure if you wanna have no stopping power.

[@panzerveps]

@@NonLegitNation2 i wonder how people managed to stop their bikes in the century before discs.... 🤦

[@byrondixon4648]

@@NonLegitNation2 I do have a disc gravel bike. I'll often ride it for a week and then get back on the faster rim brake bike, and think 'be careful brakes won't be as good', but they always feel better than I expect.

[@adamsenik2573]

Firstly, I am wondering how does keeping the brake lever pressed overnight work? What is going on in the system? I think it would be better to bleed the system rather than keep them pressed overnight. It is a straightforward job, takes 10 min. Another common reason for squeaky brakes are worn brake pads. I went for a ride, with a very loud symphony from both brakes. I honestly expected contamination, however the friction material had worn. Problem solved with a set of new pads. I also use adjustable wrench for my rotors:)

[@danbanham728]

I think it forces air bubbles out of the fluid in the pipe or caliper and back up into the reservoir where it rises to the surface out of the fluid.

[@zeemon9623]

As far as I understand it, the sponginess comes from air in the system, which is much more compressible than brake fluid. Through some combination of gravity and pressure, the air will move upwards, out of the actual braking system and into the reservoir. The space previously occupied by air will then be filled by brake fluid from the reservoir. It's basically bleeding, just without adding more brake fluid, which you technically don't even need, as it just sits in the reservoir. Arguably, it's saving weight that way.

[@paullehrbmx]

when under pressure, the air bubble shrink in volume due to the pressure. thi means they have less surface area as well, and allows the bubbles to dislodge to rise to master reservoir. it is not a replacement for bleed procedure.

[@waynosfotos]

Due to it being a open system, it allows the air to flow up to the reservoir and escape from the hydraulic fluid

[@zeemon9623]

@@paullehrbmx Isn't the process of bleeding just getting rid of the air bubbles? So, functionally, as long as you still have enough fluid in the reservoir, it's the same as bleeding. By all means, do correct me if I'm wrong.

[@keith_cottongim]

I have mountain bikes and a gravel bike with disc brakes. I do nothing extra to them. Although I don’t have road disc, I don’t see see why all the grumbling about how their harder to maintain. Let me tell you what is annoying. Hitting a pothole denting your Fulcrum Zero Nite front wheel and now it’s unrideable because the dent totally screws up the front braking! Looking at the wheel it looks fine. If this was disc brake wheel, it would still be rideable

[@miiiikku]

Sometimes brake pad gets stuck on the disk, what causes that? It should be fairly clean. I have mechanical disc brakes.

[@kulasisi08]

The most annoying of them all is the brake rub when out the saddle.

[@AG17_1]

No mention of sticky pistons which i very common in older systems. What about bedding pads into the rotors on brand bikes which is something everyone should do unless the bike shop built the bike and already did it. This has a massive impact on brake squealing. The best sanding paper I find is the Toolstation (if in UK) sanding mesh, as the contaminated dust does not clog the paper - just be careful with cleaning up the dust.

[@MikkoRantalainen]

Another thing worth mentioning is that if you have had oil or grease in the brake pads, you can try adding lots of brake cleaner and trying to suck the oil into clean paper or cloth but in many cases those pads are wasted. (Basically try to solvent the oil into cleaner and then remove it before it dries again.)

[@chrispeters2022]

If you remove the brakes entirely and lower the seat you can use workboots to stop suddenly but it’s a bit tricky downhill

[@billromano5844]

Thanks for these user friendly tips! I am going to try the spongy levers one overnight tonight. Is the “glazed over” disc pads issue the same thing as the dreaded “contaminated” disc brake pads? I’ve always had this idea in my head about contaminated pads being a total wash, just toss them and start over issue. I’ve never had the issue because I’m so scared of it happening that I approach any operation that involves contact with the pads like I’m handling live monkey pox cultures! It would be cool to know what exactly contaminated brake pads are and if there is a fix for them.

[@ItaloPessoa]

Let us know if the levers got any better

[@cavemancodeman9519]

I boiled my oily brake pads in a pan with half a drop of washing up liquid until all the water evaporated and they've stopped squealing and seem to be working well

[@moonraker978]

Yes. Lovely and firm. Top tipp!

[@Mr_Andersound]

I had a soft front brake and the reservoir screw on the lever is rounded, tiny bloody things that they are, so could not remove and bleed. Used the electrical tape holding the lever down overnight and low and behold it worked! Magic! 😂 Thanks David it'll tide me over for now 😎👌

[@kevinnielsen1356]

Taping the lever opens the passage from master cylinder to fluid resevoir, thereby releasing the bubbles via the highest point in the system. If this trick doesn't work try it again with the burp screw on the reservoir loosened, just remember to tighten it before releasing the lever.

[@polarizedpotstone]

It actually closes off the „high pressure part“ of the system from the reservoir, or did I misunderstand you?

[@Smeltz247]

Mushy brakes need to be bleed.

[@jayare8424]

The spongy brakes hack works.. thank you this🙌🙌🙌😁😁😁🚴🚴🚴🚴 now I have working brakes.

[@fontpartners1695]

Is it a good idea to spray the Disc Brake Cleaner directly on the rotor and down into the caliper??

[@josephphillips865]

What about a single piston sticking? I will try and clean and lube but this issue is recurring even on different brands of brake calipers. The list of issues with disc brakes is insane and further development needs to be done to make them better.

[@davidarthur]

Guess I'm lucky but I've not suffered from a sticky piston on countless test bikes or my own personal bikes. And lucky for me I guess but I rarely have to tinker with my disc brakes, they just work fine all the time

[@cavemancodeman9519]

I've got a single sticking piston on the front brake. Well annoying. I've tried washing then oiling the edges of the piston to no avail. I literally can't touch that brake anymore

[@josephphillips865]

@@davidarthur Thanks for replying and hopefully your luck holds. I think in my case my calipers need a full rebuild or replacement. It seems my fancy new bikes need the most attention and cost way more to maintain long term while my old school mech bikes with rim brakes are always ready to go. I do like your list and tips.

[@josephphillips865]

@@cavemancodeman9519 Best I can figure is that something is causing extra friction. Either at the piston/seal interface, contamination accumulation on the piston, or a piston that is out of alignment (which can lead to bore damage). My thoughts are at a minimum the pistons need to be fully removed so that they can be cleaned with Iso alcohol and optionally lubed with a high temp silicon grease. Lubing with DOT or mineral oil depending on the caliper type is more quick fix it seems. Also good luck if you damage a piston when the manufacturer won't sell any replacement parts and are left pursuing aftermarket alternatives on Amazon. No, I'm not salty at the industry at all...

[@cavemancodeman9519]

@@josephphillips865 Thanks for the reply, i'll try that. One thing, It's difficult to get in and remove the pistons when you're working in the gap of the caliper, is it recommended to try take apart the caliper into two halves or is that asking for trouble?

[@Fixin-To]

I have both style brakes. Prefer a rim job.

[@lostboy8814]

Superb hacks....superb video,thanks Dave👍

[@ferarroyo8541]

Great information. Many thanks for this delivery 👍

[@MikkoRantalainen]

6:01 I've had best results with brake cleaner when I first spray the disks wet and swipe it dry with a clean cloth or paper. They you can re-spray the disks and let it dry itself.

[@mason_mac]

this was cool - would love to see the game changes and oddities (purp's bug) first in order

[@markwright8030]

Great video & very informative with easy fixes 👍🚴‍♂️🚴‍♂️

[@johnhollis7290]

My favorite bike consultant !!! Thanks,

[@salvadorelvingonzalez6580]

Great brake hack!!! Thank you !!

[@lihtan]

I've noticed personally that my brakes will be quiet up until I wash the bike. Whatever was on the wheels ends up dripping onto the brake rotors. The last step in cleaning a bike is decontaminating the rotors. I just spray some 100% isopropyl alcohol on a paper towel and give the rotors a quick wipe down. The noise goes away completely when the last of the alcohol fully evaporates.

[@maxlloyd3740]

I probably wouldn't spray a lot of disc cleaners directly on rotors as there is sometimes a oil content in them! Can make noise worse! I just use wet and dry on pads and rotor and that usually does the trick!

[@mistersimple1986]

Just old hydrologic brakes have "open systems" or actually "semi open systems". If you got air in the system you didn't bleed them right! Always fill the complete break including the surge tank till there's no air left...

[@TheBarts27]

Maybe disc calipers are too flimsy and light? Thicker disc calipers will be able withstand the heat better and will not deform as fast (I think). One big disadvantage is the weight.

[@m.cigledy6769]

I know that a lot of people will disagree, but I've always found that good Avid BB7 mechanical brakes are far better than hydraulic. Once you understand how they work, they are easier to set up correctly, and they don't ever need the messy bleeding. The reason why people like hydraulic brakes is the strength and feel, which is FAR better than most cheap mechanical designs. That's why I mentioned the BB7. Every bit as good as hydraulic.

[@madplanet3351]

Centralising the caliper as you say mostly doesn't work. As for forcing the pistons back using your method can be a mistake. A very expensive one. Quite often the diaphragm within Di2 levers can rupture and from what I gather is irreparable. Loosen off the oil/bleed screw first behind the hood and surround lever with cloth to catch any mineral oil. 🤬.

[@LeftLegRightLeg]

Does the pulling the brake levers thing overnight actually work? What’s the reason behind this as it wasn’t touched on in the video

[@WhaJMc]

Only if there is air in your brake lines. Supposedly the air will bubble up into the brake reservoirs.

[@jono_church]

You should be able to hang the bike on a wall without affecting the brakes, if they go spongy they need bleeding. if they continually go spongy there is a fault or they need a different bleeding technique

[@aldepal]

I tried the spongy brake hack and it actually worked! BUT why did it work?? What’s actually happening??? (Edit) Aaah just saw the reply by Kevin in the comments. Brilliant Hack!

[@paveloleynikov4715]

Also, calliper re-centering is often a good way to prevent brake noise

[@h.r.hufnstuf4171]

Just got 2 new discs to chuck on my old bike, I swear both of them have a warp. I didn't bend em, I barely looked at them incase they decided to do it themselves. Hate this system.

[@grahamhaines9931]

Great advice. Tnanks for sharing.

[@MajykOyster666]

I had squeaky disc brakes. I removed the pads, placed 120 grit sandpaper on a flat surface, rubbed carefully the pads in a circle motion. I then cleaned the disks with acetone and let it dry. I then reassembled everything, making sure nothing would contaminate the brakes. I also took the time to burn in the pads for about 10 minutes, braking at about 75% strength, alternating front and back. After all that work, nothing's changed. I'm sad and I'm afraid to annoy the neighbors if I use my brakes.

[@fnorgen]

From my experience some pads are just plain squeakier than others. My current metallic pads produce this extremely high pitched dissonant screech at certain amounts of brake application regardless what I do. Not terribly loud thankfully, but they actually seems to get a little louder immediately after I clean them. In return though they are very heat resistant. I've had other pads that were usually quiet, but would absolutely scream when they got properly toasted on long steep descents. If the noise bothers you too much, consider buying some different pads with a reputation for being quiet.

[@tunatony]

Fantastic quick tips and hacks. You are the master. Thanks 👍

[@QoraxAudio]

1:10 might as well use cable ties. 5:15 especially on the road during freezy winter time... When road salt hasn't had time to get into the tarmac and it has rained or snowed (slushy stuff). That mixture of water and road salt gets splashed up onto the bike. Also very bad for the paint, so you have to rinse it off the same day to prevent corrosion.

[@dougpage2730]

Well done. Thank you David. 👍

[@keanubartolata3465]

The price difference between hydraulic disc brake set on rb vs mtb

[@rah4981]

I just ride, if it is just a little rubbing it will be gone over time anyway when the brake pads gets thinner after using the brake.

[@peterlasky6768]

Thanks mate you did a bloody good job I did the bike rotors it works absolutely bloody good 😊

[@christian_traxler]

Very nice hacks. Thank you!

[@Snicker60515]

Is that disc brake cleaner the same as the kind you can find at your local auto parts shop? Because a can of that is about $3-4 where the stuff from Muc-Off is probably over $10 and almost certainly has the exact same ingredients. Of course I'm probably wrong...

[@ianezzi9212]

I think the true solution to squealing discs on road bikes is really really really bedding them in, like much harder than is usually possible on normal road descents. There's actually a sort of reverse turbo trainer available for shops to bed in customer's disc brakes, every shop should have one!

[@magnumllama400]

Are you out of reality? We don't do that stupid process called bed. Install and go

[@DR_1_1]

You can add water, apparently it makes the bleeding more efficient?

[@danfresca8033]

Has anyone else experienced this? All my qr and disc bikes I’ve had rubbing issues. Non of my thru axle bikes have had this. Granted all my qr bikes were cheaper.

[@JP-om3ou]

0:01 do we love disc brakes?

[@asim9379]

After using hydro and mechanical disc brakes systems, I have far fewer issues with mechanical disc brakes. For the everyday rider mechanical systems are far better and less hassle. Can be upgraded with better cables and decent pads etc to give a close to hydro feel. I've had hydro fluid becoming to hot in warm weather resulting in rubbish braking. Mechanical disc or rim brakes are the way forward in my opinion.

[@adamlynch9153]

Rim brakes are way better

[@johnfaustus1]

Question for the experts: for what riders and under what conditions would rim brakes be preferable to disc (mech or hydraulic). Assume cost is not a valid reason.

[@dudeonbike800]

If you weigh 60 lbs, don't encounter rain, sleet, snow, mud or other inclement weather. And avoid off-road riding. If not, you MUST use disc brakes, otherwise you will certainly die.

[@andrewrobertson4878]

An old toe clip strap works better than electrical tape. Preferably a Mt zefal one 😜. Seriously though if this works the fluid needs at least topped up at the lever end.

[@renatogianmarco]

Well done David, thanks 👍👏👏

[@wellmaywesay]

Thank you for this great video!

[@roccoVAL]

great tips and love the Aussie accent mate!!

[@Patiboke]

I love disc brakes but for a bicycle I prefer cables. The stopping power is ridiculous enough. A while ago I was looking at second hand MTB's. Literally every hydraulic one I looked at had problems. OK for people who buy new material every year, or can afford a mechanic that maintains their bike after every ride.

[@mikewells1070]

A fellow on Strava had really squeaky brakes and used disc brake silencer from Swiss Stop

[@leonschumann2361]

how does the first one work? is the air somehow pushed out due to the higher system pressure than ambient?

[@Smeltz247]

No the system is sealed.

[@litchips]

I'd undo bleed screw on lever before pushing pistons in, to avoid risk of breaking the lever with hydraulic fluid pressure.

[@MADTASS]

Also to Let the Air work its way up and Escape, used to do it on Motorbikes and Leave it Overnight.