The Worst Wild Clay Ever (and what to do about it)

[@AncientPottery]

This video is for people who have found wild clay and want to improve it, but if you haven't found any clay yet then you will need to watch this video first, kzbin.info/www/bejne/pKLMe316r7dmrNk then come back here later to learn how to improve it.

[@nated186]

Thanks, I have found clay. I levigated it, and used some DE for temper, it's fairly plastic. I made a pancake and it's been drying for several days. No cracks. It dries to a buff color, we'll see what it fires to. I also dug some muck with raised tire tracks, it's very black with an "organic" smell, not very plastic. I'm enjoying this rabbit hole I fell down. I've been researching the pottery here with some very interesting information. I'm not sure where our red slip came from yet, whether it be local slip or traded from the north. Thanks for all your videos!

[@montyferguson4657]

To increase plasticity of your clay you can boil some rice and use the water to wet your dry clay, or put a teaspoon of flour into the water, boil, then wet your dry clay.

[@bobcostas9716]

If you've got any interest in experimenting with wild marine clay I can post you some. Washed in fresh water, sieved through window screen, then dehydrated in a cotton pillow case over several months. I'm not sufficiently experienced to have an opinion, but it does fire up a nice red color. Might make a nice change from all the desert clay you deal with, and could add another color to your palette anyway. I'd be kind of interested to see what you think of it.

[@AncientPottery]

That's a very nice offer thanks. But you have no idea the amount of clay I am offered on a weekly basis or just how little time I have to test new clays. So I am going to have to decline even though it sounds intriguing. Thanks!

[@airstreamwanderings3683]

You didn't mention that if people sign up for your on-line class there is also access to a clay map for locations in AZ which has been a GREAT help to me. And people during the Wednesday night potters club often share information about clay sources. Primitive potters are a wonderful community. Good job, thanks.

[@AncientPottery]

Thank Wes,

[@camerongaul261]

I'm so glad you posted this! The clay I'm finding is super lean and has poor wet strength. Maybe we should all network to trade out clays that are poor in opposite ways.

[@AncientPottery]

"The Clay Exchange" your trash might be somebody else's treasure.

[@angeladazlich7145]

You've been a great help in my long clay search.

[@AncientPottery]

Thanks, glad to be of help. It can be a looong road.

[@llanitedave]

What a timely video, Andy! For months I've been struggling with my own local clay, in so many ways it's paradoxical. It doesn't shrink much, it's not very plastic, and it sets up quickly -- but it also gets stiff quickly and cracks while drying anyway. Even when I slow the drying to weeks. Not always, but often. I've tried mixing it with smectite, kaolin, and both at once, but the kaolin doesn't do much of anything, and the smectite, while making it more plastic, makes the cracking worse. But when it does survive, it fires well, and I love the color and the texture of the finished product, which seems very strong. I suspect it might work as a stoneware clay. So I haven't been able to convince myself to give up on it yet. Recently I found another wild clay, which is the opposite in many ways. It's extremely plastic, very soft, coils well but resists scraping. I've made one jar out of it so far, and it does have a tendency to sag. But it's leather hard now, seems firm, and shows no signs of cracking yet. I'm thinking that mixing the two clays might preserve the better qualities of each while maybe relieving their worst qualities. But I guess it could do the opposite, so I'll just have to experiment.

[@QuailCanyonAnthropolgy]

Do you let your clay cure before using or do you use it soon after it is mixed?... This makes a difference in my experience. I let my coil pottery clay cure for a week to two weeks, sometimes more. If I'm making anvil pottery where im packing the clay, then I use the clay imediately after mixing.

[@AncientPottery]

Thanks Dave, glad this is helpful to you. Are you coming the Silver City for the kiln conference? If so I could suggest a few places on your way where you could stock up on some good Arizona clay.

[@llanitedave]

@@AncientPottery I've already got the reservations made, Andy. I'll take you up on that offer. Every time I pass a road cut while driving through Arizona I've been looking at the sediment and wondering if it's usable clay.

[@llanitedave]

@@QuailCanyonAnthropolgy Interesting that you have two different approaches depending on your building technique. This last bit of clay I levigated, then tempered while still a bit on the wet side (between 20-25% volcanic ash), and let it set about 24 hours. The clay I've been using prior to this I let set anywhere between overnight to a couple of weeks, and it doesn't seem to make much difference. My cracking issues have definitely decreased with experience, but I still often experience incipient and partial cracking, which is at least usually repairable with slip. As of tonight, with the new clay, still no cracking.

[@QuailCanyonAnthropolgy]

@@llanitedave new clay it is! I had to come to that several times before striking workable clay!

[@jennmorton3155]

I've tried firing tiny wild bentonite pots before. The pots warped in the electric kiln, and several exploded in the fire pit. But I mixed a little bit of it with kaolin a friend found, and it worked really well.

[@AncientPottery]

Bentonite is really hard to work with but if you can make it work, great. There are not hard fast rules. Do what works!

[@coopart1]

Just my two cents … bentonite stores water very well, even if your pot seems dry it takes a long time for the bentonite content to dry.

[@TimmyVision]

I’m so lucky to find really good pure clay in my garden (uk) I could literally dig some up, without even using water, create something and fire it! Without doing anything to it

[@AncientPottery]

That's awesome, you are very fortunate (from a pottery standpoint, not so much as it relates to gardening).

[@QuailCanyonAnthropolgy]

I have tried many clays here in Grants New Mexico, and only one of them have proved worthy, and I have several more claybeds to sample! Love it! The next clay I sample is at a large Indian ruin, that is marked to be old Acoma. Built on top of a steep mesa with a large claybed below... Looks Great! Thanks for another great video, Andy!

[@rustyshackleford3278]

Very insightful thank you Andy! The rivers are very low here so on a whim I got a sample from the banks and riverbed, it was 80% sand. I have much better luck moving along smaller streams and old washes

[@AncientPottery]

Clay is where you find it, sometimes it is nowhere near a river or creek too.

[@TheInfoworks]

Another selection of info to add to the mix, difficult to know why some pots crack and others don't. The important thing is to gain knowledge and experience ,and practice cheers

[@AncientPottery]

Either drying cracks or firing cracks can be mostly eliminated with care. And yes keep experimenting and practicing and you will improve. Thanks!

[@TheInfoworks]

@@AncientPottery , thanks, it's the firing cracks that are the challenge, yellow fires red, you are right, cheers

[@ScottWConvid19]

For real though. This is so educational on multiple levels. Thanks for having a passion for your work and sharing it. Learning about pottery sure does bring a greater understanding to some of the scriptures

[@penguinista]

Most excellent! Wonderful simplification of an immensely complicated subject. Thank you very much!!

[@AncientPottery]

Glad you liked it.

[@lyndafjellman3315]

Some places just don't have lots of good pottery clay. There were brick yards in my area(a hundred years ago), but no historic native pottery(PacificNW) Plenty of clay to play with but it is all very short (so far) and needs other clays added in. I buy ball clay or some other really plastic clay to modify it. It's still fun to be able to say you harvested your own clay even if you have to add store bought to it.

[@AncientPottery]

That is true. Also it is often a lot of work finding a good potters clay. I spent decades using substandard clays before I found the ones I am using now.

[@oldugly9295]

excellent. when a person starts out it is sometimes hard to know why things fail. is it your building skills that are causing issues or is it the clay and temper? when i started i thought i could just dig the clay and make something. but. for me it has been a lot of failed pottery. the length of time that i have been making pottery is very short, only a few years, but in that time i made a couple hundred pots and only a very low percentage actually survived to the final product. 2 or the most important things are patients, and having a good resource to use to learn from. this Ancient Pottery site has so much good information that who ever is interested in wild clay pottery or even pottery in general should watch and use all of Andy's videos, You will always come away with some real important information. great video thank you

[@AncientPottery]

Thanks Tom. It can be frustrating, many of us have been down that path. I used horrible clay for many years myself. The good clay sources I use today are the result of many years of searching and testing. Hopefully I can shorten that struggle a little with my videos.

[@seanfaherty]

I hate to tell you but i watched Andy’s videos and got lucky from what this video says . I put 20% temper and was able to get it to make a bowl. The wet strength seems to get worse the more I work it . I did pre heat it in my oven, bringing the heat up slowly. Then put it in a fire. I made a second pot yesterday , added another bunch of temper, about 35-40%. It’s better. I let it dry a bit before adding another coil. It actually has a shape to it but it doesn’t look like I imagined it. I’m not a very good painter either.

[@seanfaherty]

After leaving that comment I thought I should try to let my clay dry out for a few hours before I worked it. It worked way better, probably did not need the extra temper.

[@GrannyGooseOnYouTube]

I thought I had the worst clay, here in the central valley CA. But managed to work with it, and just had my first truly successful firing. I created a tiny firebrick "kiln" using charcoal (no fallen branches for wood around here!). The pieces aren't beautiful, but they "tink" when you tap them. Yay!

[@AncientPottery]

That's awesome to hear. More success to follow.

[@JimmyCapricorn77]

I love new mexico clay. I go out to the mesas and find clay in the arroyos and it’s just beautiful. I also find a lot of Native American pottery there. No wonder they made their pots out there. The clay is just perfect.

[@AncientPottery]

So true, it is fun to find clay and ancient pottery in the same area, it tells you that you are on the right track.

[@eattheworld4625]

Your videos are very interesting, and your pottery looks beautiful.

[@AncientPottery]

Thank you so much!

[@violetlight8138]

This was a great video. It answered my question. I had to levigate the clay. I had too much temper and silt. Should be good now.

[@AncientPottery]

Awesome, glad it was helpful

[@phong3702]

wow,ur video so ez to understand and give me a lot of information, thank you so much

[@AncientPottery]

You're welcome

[@patrickeakin5319]

Thank you Andy I feel like this is in response to that email that I sent you on the clay that I found that I put the other Hobby center clay to give it the strength that it needed. I always learn something from your KZbin tutorials so thank you very much

[@AncientPottery]

Thank you. I actually get similar questions all the time, hopefully this video will help people to get their clay figured out.

[@NayrbRellimer]

Thanks for the tip on bentonite clay. I am certain that I have accidentally found a deposite of bentonite clay that I collected from a construction site. It behaves exactly like your clay you describe at the end of the video. The shrinkage rate of this clay is way too high for me to use even with 30% temper.

[@AncientPottery]

Yes, that sounds right. I have run across it from time to time myself, it's weird stuff.

[@mojavebohemian814]

Thanks

[@AncientPottery]

Welcome

[@acavoxnegledajtelevizor401]

Hello Andy, i found many types of different clays but one of it is very veird. It have a little green color shade, Ore of it is 99+% pure clay (i not find even tiny particles of sand in it using wet processing). But also its not very sticky and crack easy around finger. I think its maybe formed by stone degratation.

[@AncientPottery]

There are a lot of weird types of clay out there. Sometimes when they are difficult to work with they still make great slips.

[@theindigenouspothead4542]

One good tip for clay that is too plastic and/or sticky, other than adding grog or temper, is to age it for a while after you process it, I have noticed it can help clay get to that "goldie locks" point, it seems to work both ways with clay that isnt plastic enough and for clay that is too soft. However when I say age it, I mean you may have to let it sit for a couple months..up to 6 or more. I found this by accident with some clay I had that was terribly soft, I put it back and forgot I wanted to dispose of it or mix it in with stiffer ckay it for a little over 5 months, when I came across it, I opened it uo and noticed itsm stiffened up quite a bit, it was a little dty, but after adding back in a lottle moisture, it was some of he best wild clay I ever worked with...so I have been aging some of my clay ever since. I will do a video on this soon, I'm still very busy with work and my kids, but this winter Ill be in full swing posting vids and making things... Take care Andy...and everyone here!!

[@AncientPottery]

Good tips, thanks

[@ashleyschroeder3523]

My wild clay is so fragile and breakable after firing, and it never has that nice pottery ring to it....sounds more like a thud. I'm using your "driveway kiln" method 😂 so I feel like it's getting up to temp. It's so weird to find a seemingly perfect solid gray clay and it fires so badly. :/ Arg! Your videos are such a joy! I love this ancient pottery process, one of the best channels out there!

[@AncientPottery]

You must be getting it hot enough would be my guess. Every clay is different and will mature at a different temperature. Are you using lump charcoal or briquettes? I find I can get much hotter with lump charcoal.

[@ashleyschroeder3523]

@@AncientPottery Using lump charcoal, the exact brand in your video. I tried to copy your kiln and process to the T since my 3 previous kiln builds didn't get up to temp. It's personal now! I may try to buy some clay that's a sure bet and test whether it's the clay or the kiln. But it's all part of the fun!

[@AncientPottery]

@@ashleyschroeder3523 sorry it sounds like you are doing everything right so maybe it’s the clay. I hope you get it figured out.

[@ashleyschroeder3523]

Womp womp! Thanks for taking the time to respond. :)

[@coopart1]

I have yet to find a perfect clay , so I usually do what Andy mentioned and mix clays from different digs . ALTHOUGH I did find some great clay In Gallup NM hope to go visit family up there again soon… with alluvial motives 🤔

[@AncientPottery]

The funny thing is that I had another comment here earlier today from a guy who lives in Grants and is having trouble finding good clay. Of course maybe Grants may be geologically different from Gallup but I always think of them as similar Colorado Plateau sandstone stuff.

[@slowwound2656]

Hey Andy thank you for the informative videos over the years. I've been collecting and using clay from around my area for the last 5 years now. And your videos have gotten me to the point I've started teaching my kids and others around me how to collect clay and make pottery with it. I'm hoping to join your online class this year. I just need to come up with the money for it.

[@AncientPottery]

Awesome, glad to help. I hope to see you in our Wednesday night Zoom class soon.

[@Gurren813]

I've been watching your stuff for a little while now, and I've always wanted a Chimea but never really wanted to break off and buy a factory made piece that'd just fall apart in a month. Could you make a video about making one? It seems like a pretty big project and I'd like to have some knowledge on my side before tackling it. Maybe make a mini one first?

[@AncientPottery]

Wow, that would be a super big and challenging project

[@Gurren813]

@@AncientPottery What better lesson than one full of potential failures!

[@petrapetrakoliou8979]

My clay includes some dung in it, probably sheep dung; I wasn't aware of it till I started using it. Do you know if dung may improve clay? This river clay is surely the one they used in the Iron Age hillfort where I found the ceramics I try to replicate, there is hardly any other clay around. At that time they may easily have had animals down at the river just like today, there are not many other water sources - maybe this was even a desirable thing to have in clay, apart from the smell... It does seem to work for the cutaway-neck jug I am finishing now. Balint

[@AncientPottery]

Dung was used traditionally in Arizona as temper , so this clay of yours may need less temper. Also remember that the dung will burn away in the firing leaving more porous pottery. Which could be an advantage if you are making water cooling jars like in my previous video.

[@petrapetrakoliou8979]

It's true there's little or no visible temper in the original pots. I may redo the jug without added temper. The dung didn't go away in the repeated levigation process that I inflicted to the clay to get rid of the enormous amount of vegetal, insect and other junk (even a plastic bag) which were all invisible when I collected the clay. Another type of pottery from the site includes a great amount of vegetal temper, it is of poor quality and seems to have been very large sized containers judging by the sherds. Otherwise one category of ceramics does have a lot of mineral temper which really looks like purposefully added sand, but not the nice jugs I am replicating now. Thicker sherds include even gravel-sized temper in them.

[@TheRojo387]

You know that they say, Andy: "waste not, want not"; so I personally, wouldn't even throw away that "inameliorable" clay just because it couldn't make pottery; I would use such clay in…concrete! Clay is made of alumina and silica, both of which react with calcium hydroxide as it dries out, turning the alumina into aluminate (and silica into silicate). As luck would have it, calcium silicate is a good thermal resistor for building with. So make it into a few cement blocks, what could go wrong!

[@nated186]

Any info on florida clay, that I should be aware of. So I've never worked with clay, I'm from southwest Florida. I went and dug some very hard to dig dirt with red and gray striatons through it. I levigated it, and it's hanging on my fence...we'll see. If it doesn't work, I will buy some clay and start. There is some ancient pottery here, but alot of it is just shards, with alot of incised work. I'd like to re-create something that is close to home. I love these videos and hope I can get a usable mug one day! LoL

[@AncientPottery]

I have a student in Florida who digs and uses local clay but I think he is probably farther north than you are.

[@BubuH-cq6km]

what are your thoughts of river clay or should one avoid if it may have become in contact with industrial contaminates from the past?

[@AncientPottery]

Well I live in an area where industrial contamination is pretty minimal. So it's not something I have had to think about, I would be cautions though.

[@seanfaherty]

Do you think paddle and anvil style pottery is better for stiff clays ?

[@AncientPottery]

I’m no paddle and anvil expert. This question is probably better asked of Tony Soares. But the clay Tony used in the video we made last year was very firm

[@billskinner623]

What if you have a clay with a lot of silt in it? Any way to save it? It's only about 200 yards away from my house and really convenient to dig. I've tried levigating, it really didn't help that much. It can be worked as is but the pots are fragile and break easily.

[@AncientPottery]

You should be able to remove most of the silt by levigating. But if you can't then I think it may be time to move on.

[@QuailCanyonAnthropolgy]

The closest source is rarely the best... I have to hike half way up a mountain to a faultline that emerges the most spectacular grayish white clay ever. Speckled with red Iron oxide! Does your pottery turn out looking like brick stone?

[@billskinner623]

No. This is on the bottom of a slough. Usually, the slough goes dry by this time of year, and I can dig down several feet to the good stuff but the last several have been rather wet, so it's under a couple of feet of water. I tried coming in beside the slough but no luck This is the stuff with lots of fine silt, when you try levigating, the silt mixes with the clay. Best thing i have done is stir it to about milkshake consistency, then let it settle and dry in the bucket. Bottom layer is sand, middle is clay and top is silt. You can scrap the silt off and brush the sand off. That takes several weeks to a couple of months in my Alabama humidity. Tammie Bean loves the clay, so it's good clay. I haven't been able to get to the good stuff for several years. Just a major PITA to actually to get and use. @@QuailCanyonAnthropolgy

[@QuailCanyonAnthropolgy]

@@billskinner623 I would like to see a video of that Bamma clay!

[@billskinner623]

I'll see what I can do, but I'd have to get someone to film it. For some reason, I can't get a lot of volunteers to go into a swamp in Alabama in the middle of August. @@QuailCanyonAnthropolgy

[@BlackPearlZ31]

The soil in my yard turns a lighter brown deeper down (4-5 feet) , maybe even slightly sandy. Is this an indication of anything other than less organic material and more sand?

[@SylviaMallory1]

Can I use any old sand? Could I use beach sand?

[@JH-qj3nu]

Does paleosol (ancient soils) make good pottery clay? And if I have a dark purple paleosol, will it stay purple once fired?

[@AncientPottery]

No idea, I have never heard of paleosol. Clays almost always change color in the firing. In my experience purple clay usually turns brown in the firing.

[@ЕвгенийВилков-о7р]

Друг, усадка это не проблема если предварительно знать её число, можно изготавливать предметы больше на величину этой самой усадки.

[@AncientPottery]

Actually it is. If the clay has extreme shrinkage it will tear itself apart every time. Also who wants to do all the work to make a large pot only to have it shrink into a small pot?

[@sanjibrana8005]

Which percentage of shrinkage rate can be accepteble for pottery.

[@AncientPottery]

It's pretty subjective. I think most potters will accept a clay with a 12% shrinkage rate but as you start approaching 18% - 20% it becomes unusable. But like I said, it is up to the individual potter.

[@sanjibrana8005]

Thank you so much sir

[@ooee8088]

Fermentation also improves plasticity, just saying, I know u know way more than me

[@AncientPottery]

Yes it does. But from my experience it is a marginal improvement.

[@mihailvormittag6211]

👍

[@cjgaming5544]

If we make something out of low plastic clay will it impact the strength of pottery after fireing

[@AncientPottery]

Good question. I think you are probably right that it will, but I can't say that I remember ever reading that anywhere so I can't say for sure. But it certainly seems like a logical conclusion.

[@allwildgardens4936]

Depends on technique used to form the vessel. Pinch pot or straight coil is difficult to keep from cracking. How ever i have found that useing the paddle and anvil method of construction enables use of shorter clays...

[@catblue6393]

👍🏻

[@colleenmcbride3656]

Can you fire this terrible clay and then grind it up and use as grog?

[@AncientPottery]

Sure it could still be used for grog

[@anusophiakarthikeyan2155]

Hello Sir, Is it possible for a 10 year old kid join in your online pottery classes or do you have any age limit?

[@AncientPottery]

No age limits on my classes. Not sure the vocabulary is all understandable to a 10 year old but it is clean and family friendly.

[@anusophiakarthikeyan2155]

@@AncientPottery Thank you soo much sir.

[@nakoawarrior3186]

Is any type of fired clay heavy?

[@AncientPottery]

Not really

[@nakoawarrior3186]

@@AncientPottery Thanks didn't they use to make clay marbles? Are their any tables of specific gravity for clay. I seen you cook bean's in a bowl is it safe dependable cook ware? And is this similar material to moonshine jugs and what material was used to make moonshine jugs.

[@farmlife4533]

My trick is using 50 percent commercial clay 50 percent wild clay and if that doesn’t work I find a new wild clay to try

[@farmlife4533]

I don’t know how to edit a KZbin comment but I don’t actually stop at 50 percent commercial clay I also will try 75% commercial clay as long as the wild clay gives the final piece a interesting and noticeable effect

[@camerongaul261]

Oh also I thought of a dad joke for you. It comes from my experience with hiring a supposed expert in wet processing wild clay for me but after I paid him he gave me the slip!

[@AncientPottery]

Ha ha, I'll have to remember that one! Thanks