J.M.W Turner- Understanding Modern Art

[@radioactivedetective6876]

Turner is "the painter of light". And iirc Monet famously said "The real subject of every painting is light." I am so thrilled to know that Monet and Pissaro went to London and were inspired by Turner - had no idea of this detail.

[@no1noseme96]

Not even kidding, I've done three things on this Sunday, eat, use the bathroom and watched your videos.

[@theartshole311]

Sounds like a good way to spend a Sunday to me, glad you enjoy them

[@andrewfrost8866]

Absolutely knocked this out of the park! Excellent stuff.

[@theartshole311]

Cheers!

[@wromanchak]

This is exactly the video I have been looking for to show my art students. Thank you for making this.

[@theartshole311]

Great to hear, hope it helped!

[@JJRiot]

Been watching all the Turner KZbin videos and this is the best yet. Fair play

[@maxy5480]

Amazing review! Thank you so much!!

[@theartshole311]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@radioactivedetective6876]

Fantastic comparison between Napoleon Crossing the Alps and Hannibal Crossing the Alps - just this one comparison and the Neo Classical and Romantic rift becomes clear. David's is all about Napoleon, Turner's is all about the Alps.

[@RD-jd3yh]

Excellent!

[@theartshole311]

Many thanks!

[@rickartdefoix1298]

I absolutely love Turner. I was lucky to be introduced to his sibling or grand grand son, and enjoyed a lot chatting with him about the genius of his ancestor, and other things. He was a kind and cultivated person. We were in an intellectuals kind of party, and enjoyed a lot. I had several of those parties, but this Turner sibling was there only once. Although I knew where else and how I could meet him again. We shared a common friend. As my father and millions with us, am fond of Turner's layers of evanescent colours and his use of light. Think somehow Turner preceded the Impressionists. Anyway, Turner remains a reference when we speak of how to deal with light, in pictures. His delicate and almost sketched pictures make kind of ghostly landscapes. Definetly some of the nicest pictures I've ever seen were Turner ones. Think it's a bit of a topic to speak about this artist, for everyone loves it. But couldn't avoid mentioning him. Don't miss Turner when being in London. A genius, that's out of question. 💎❤️👍🤗

[@jenniferfedorink4130]

a perfect holiday treat. thank you so much and happy holidays!

[@theartshole311]

Thanks, happy holidays to you as well!

[@supremereader7614]

That was a very beautiful video. You're really not afraid to go into fine details such as between Romanticism and Rationalism. Your videos are a kind of art in and of themselves.

[@craigathonian]

LOVE & ENJOYED this beautiful orchestration of Turner's paintings with your direct & quick informative dialogue. One thing i hate is the narrating host spewing mass amounts of words trying to postulate their well educated ego instead of just sharing information or facts. This video has given me a shot in the arm for inspiration, and is a nice reminder of what 2D art has to offer and can achieve. Turner has always "blown me away" with his paintings representing just the tip of the iceberg with what went on in his genius mind. Thank you ❣

[@andrewjack3532]

These lectures are just the best! Explained in a down to earth and amusing way for the non-arty guys like me. Keep them coming.

[@theartshole311]

Will Do, cheers!

[@theartshole311]

We're back with a look at one of my favorite painters, the ever impressive J.M.W. Turner. Wanted to do this one for a long time, Turners a big inspiration for me in general so it's great to share some of the interesting things about his work. Here's the link for the Tom Keating video on Turners techniques, Keating is ,as the saying goes, a bloody legend and I highly recommend checking out his videos, - kzbin.info/www/bejne/g3XQmoKjjtOqgc0 Thanks to everyone whose supporting us on www.buymeacoffee.com/theartshole . Delighted to have the help! Thanks also to everyone for watching, Subscribing and all of that too! I'll see you in the new year with more videos

[@kristasee]

❤Please continue making your instructive videos and offering your interesting perspectives and commentary… just love some of your throw away lines (really appreciate them) I am an aged pensioner in Australia who has to surrender most of my art books and library because I am moving to Aged Care facility… having to downsize drastically to fit into a one room setting…plus bathroom….Discovering your art videos was a wonderful find….I enjoy your lectures / podcasts ….. it gives me heart to follow your uploads I taught art for many years at high schools and engaged in many practical courses in my own time such as Drawing, Painting Ceramics So, thank you, please continue

[@And3aPet]

Thank you! Happy Holidays to you.

[@theartshole311]

Happy holidays to you as well!

[@miladeskandari7]

Thank you for these magnificent videos

[@theartshole311]

Glad you like them!

[@gencofilmco]

Wonderful work.. One of my favorite artists ...

[@theartshole311]

Same, I'm a big fan of his work

[@flintflint7246]

Great video

[@theartshole311]

Thanks!

[@Jowwta]

i love your videos!!! Please keep the great job, i cant never get enough! :)

[@theartshole311]

Thank you! I'll keep them coming so, glad to hear you enjoy them!

[@upinsmokeproductions6471]

The algorithm dropped this on my time line just when I needed it. I'm currently working on a seascape painting and this is too perfect. Killer work as always.

[@theartshole311]

Thanks, love seascapes, hope it helped!

[@upinsmokeproductions6471]

@@theartshole311 I just wrapped it up this week. Please keep these going, they are so helpful. Thank you so my dude.

[@Channel47et48]

Wonderful video! First one I've watched on this channel but certainly not the last, subscribed straight away!

[@theartshole311]

Thanks, glad to hear it!

[@janeking9540]

Gŕeat, like the light hearted moments too.

[@allysonprizeman9317]

Thanks!

[@davesapartment]

Great video as usual, thanks a lot :-)

[@theartshole311]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@ArtReviews]

I think you're right that Turner absolutely belongs in the conversation about modern art given how influential his later works are, though growing up I thought he was all seascapes. Enjoyed the anecdote at the start too, why do so many great artists seem to have such abrasive qualities.

[@theartshole311]

There's a good bit of showmanship in that story, I'd say it was deliberately spun as a bit of performative propaganda on Turners behalf, any publicity is good publicity as they say. As for the abrasiveness who can say, lots of people mention it though so it must have some truth to it.

[@nozecone]

The abrasiveness is, often, inseparable from the single-minded obsessiveness that attends great achievement - if not actual psychological/brain conditions in the line of Asperberger's, then undeveloped social skills from spending so much time in solitude, being spoiled or neglected, etc.

[@graysimpson]

Great stuff as usual 👌🏼

[@theartshole311]

Thanks!

[@radioactivedetective6876]

Loved the video. I had only known of some of the famous Turner paintings. Thanks a ton for showing so many gems unknown to me. Fascinating stuff. Will surely look up more Turner paintings.

[@theartshole311]

Glad you liked it, Turners one of my favorites so great to get a chance to talk about him

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 Friedrich used to be one of my favourites. After watching ur video Turner is becoming one of my favourites too

[@onlibertyjm]

Thanks

[@borderlands6606]

Turner could do it all. Delicate architectural draughtsmanship amid complete abstraction, a mastery of colour, playfulness and ambition, he was competing with himself by the end. Like Cotman had been dropped in post-WW2 New York.

[@ezicarus8216]

Excellent presentation on turner, so many things I did not know..thank you. I'm still not keen on his paintings and I have seen many up close.

[@theartshole311]

Glad to hear there were a few new things in there. His stuff might not be everyone's cup of tea alright but either way its great to see them up close, the quality of the images available online doesn't' do them justice

[@thehistoryofcreativity3030]

Great video. Really informative and concise. Thanks for sharing your excellent work!

[@theartshole311]

Glad you enjoyed it!

[@radioactivedetective6876]

I was trying to look into other Romantic painters, and boat-in-sea paintings, and there's this famous painting that I remembered with a very shiny, unnaturally luminous orange sky and a glowing bile-green sea but couldn't recall the painter. After some google search turned out the painting is The Nineth Wave by a Russian Romantic painter Ivan Aivazovsky. I looked into his other works, and almost all are ship-in-sea landscapes (or rather, seascapes) under varying circumstances, times and weather conditions. What is most striking signature feature is this luminous effect that he creates, as if the water is glowing; and in case of light colours that luminosity produces an added illusion of transluscence, especially noticable in a light aquamarine blue-green that he uses for waves, and in the sky & water surface reflecting light portions of sunset paintings. The names of the psintings are quiet similar - Sunset, Sunset over Ischia, Blue Wave, Black Sea, Black Sea at Night, Stormy Sea at Night. The colours that he achieve are not really realistic in a strict sense, dometimes they are unnaturally rich, the tonal saturation seem pumped up to enhance the dramatic impact, and I don't know how he gets that glowy, luminous effect. It'l be great if u can please enunciate about the colours and effect, when ans if u get time

[@theartshole311]

Its funny, while i'm not overly familiar with Aivazovsky I knew immediately the piece you were describing, its a striking piece of work alright, the colours in particular are unreal(in a good way!). The glowing ephemeral effect is created by a process of layering colours over a tonal under painting, usually in gray or brown which maps out the values of the shadows and lights. The colours are then painted over this and treated tonally. We can see this in the Nineth Wave where the lightest areas are bright yellow/ orange and the darks are comprised of blue/greens. Tonal balance really is everything when it comes to creating glowing effects like this and it goes just the same for Colour as it does for gray scale. At least that's what I think he did to create that effect, I could be wrong. I'm going to do some demo videos demonstrating some of these concepts soon that will hopefully help, bear with me while I get it all together!

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 Please, if possible, do a demo vid. When u get time of course. So, the entire painting is first done in gray scale (or its brown equivalent), and then again re-painted with colour which forms the 2nd layer. And the combined effect of the gray-scale underlayer & the coloured upper layer produces the luminosity?

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 There's this thing I need u to check, please: www.wikiart.org/en/ivan-aivazovsky/the-sunset-1866 www.wikiart.org/en/ivan-aivazovsky/sunset-1866 Are these 2 different paintings? As in did he make 2 with separate colours? Or some person has photoshopped one into a different colour scheme?

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Ivan_Aivazovsky_-_Ship_in_the_Stormy_Sea.jpg The aquamarine blue-green in the foreground is just mindblowingly transluscent-ish! But there is another version I keep coming across, although on slightly less trustable forums (may be) in.pinterest.com/pin/125678645834247576/ I wonder, perhaps he made multiple studies with different colours.

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 Check out 'Storm over the Black Sea' and 'Ship Wreck off the Cliffs' - the purple hills/cliffs in the latter are absolutely unreal, in a good way. And this one is great too: darkbluepaintbrush.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/r185_110.jpg And the effect of sloshing of water in great force that he has produced here is fantastic, u can feel the waves are clashing this way and that, and foam and fume is coming out and everything is hazy: darkbluepaintbrush.files.wordpress.com/2013/11/ivan_constantinovich_aivazovsky_-_ships_in_a_storm.jpg

[@radioactivedetective6876]

Interesting detour from Impressionism and onwards series. End of year special. Hope you are doing well. Thanks for the video.

[@theartshole311]

Slight detour, but an artist that I really wanted to talk about as I'm a big fan of his work. Will be back on track with the 20th century from next month. Hope you're keeping well too, and happy new year!

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 Happy New Year to you too. Although at this point all I am hoping is that 2021 sucks less than 2020 ;-) Please do detours whenever u feel like. We'll get better understanding of amazing works like those of Turner. And better understanding of techniques too. Also, history of art (and every other genre of culture) is a continuous strain, and learning about every individual artist improves one's comprehension of the overall "story". It is all connected.

[@radioactivedetective6876]

6:20 - one can also use the term "subjectivity" in place of "individualism" in relation to Romanticism. Enlightenment ethos and Neo-Classicism in art and culture was centred around objective analysis of external reality and human society, whereas Romanticism focuses on subjective experience and perceptions.

[@theartshole311]

That's a great way of putting it, the tension between Neo classicism and Romanticism is really interesting in general, It might be the best place to pinpoint the emergence of modernism so far as painting is concerned

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 Absolutely. Though in terms of society, philosophy and literature (and even art I think) we often trace the seeds of Modernism in the Victorian era/ Mid to late 19th century, however, the essence of "subjectivity" that Romanticism brought is in many ways the first step in the shift of focus from the community to the individual.

[@nozecone]

I got more out of your timely placement of that Rothko painting than I have from all I've read in trying to understand the popularity of his paintings (in certain circles!).

[@theartshole311]

Delighted to hear that, we will definitely be getting into Rothko and his popularity in certain circles more in the future

[@evanescapades2513]

Wow!!!!!!!!

[@user-et3xn2jm1u]

Wonderful! I watched a video essay on Thomas Kinkade the other day, and given Kinkade's self-title of "The Painter of Light" it's impossible not to compare them. Like Turner, Kinkade was often reluctant to show his methods in action. Unlike Kinkade however, Turner possessed some modicum of genius. Maybe it's a testament to Turner's influence that a lot of his basic work to expand the color and textural sensibility of painting is still completely serviceable today, albeit decidedly cliche. Though, for my money, the best epoch for landscape painting was still the Dutch Golden Age. I love me some van Goyen or van Ruysdael.

[@theartshole311]

Funny you should mention Kinkade, I almost went and made a video on him since it's Christmas and so much of his work is associated with the season. Glad I got to cover Turner though, you really can see his fingerprints on a lot of stuff that follows, even if it is to the point of cliche. I do agree about those Dutch golden age painters too, I was lucky enough to see some a couple of years ago and they really are amazing, we must cover them in the near future

[@radioactivedetective6876]

Woh! This painter went on and gave himself the title "painter of light"??! Humility isn't his strong suit, huh!

[@theartshole311]

Lol, humble he was not, there are accounts from his patrons and peers that paint a similarly self aggrandizing picture of him, but considering how great of a painter he was I'd say he earned it

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 Are u speaking about Turner? Or Kinkade? Coz I know Turner is awesome. Don't know much about Kinkade.

[@user-et3xn2jm1u]

@@radioactivedetective6876 He likely he meant Kinkade, but Turner also had a bit of an ego about him; rightfully so however, considering he was a truly great painter. Also I just realized that my initial comment could come off as though I thought Turner's own work was cliche -- which it isn't, the genuine article is as fresh and beautiful as ever. I only meant that you can take Turner's artistic sensibility and port it directly to the modern day and it still holds up, but copying a 200-year-old style is never going to be that stimulating even if it looks pretty.

[@valmarsiglia]

Great presentation. Have you seen the Mike Leigh film Mr. Turner, and if so, what did you think of it?

[@theartshole311]

Haven't actually seen the film, few people have said it's quite good though, I'll watch it at some point and let you know

[@kevinhastie]

The inferno of Westminster was not the Abbey as stated but the Palace of Westminster (ie Parliament). An event I for one would fervently like to see repeated.......

[@radioactivedetective6876]

Romanticism was a response to Neo Classicism specifically, especially in case of literature and art; however, the genesis of the ethos/philosophy that the Romantics were reacting to can be traced back to Renaissance Humanism and the emergence of Anthropocentric world view (as opposed to the theocentric world view of the middle ages), concepts of free will and man's "will to power". Philosophers like Pico della Mirandola viewed man as placed at the centre of the universe (by god) and endowed with the ability to achieve/accomplish anything he put his mind to (both good and bad). Then the Scientific Revolution brought ideas of mechanical philosophy, inductive reasoning, empericism, culminating in Newton's laws, which sort sealed the deal on the idea that we live in an ordered universe goverened by natural laws that can be deciphered and understood my man through rational inquiry, viz. man has "solved" nature, so to speak. The Enlightenment philosophers, inspired by the Scientific Revolution, its spirit of inquiry and the ideas of reason and natural laws, felt the social order could be reformed and improved, progress (social, political and economic) could be achieved, through rational thinking. Romanticism was a reaction to this entire tradition, starting from Anthropocentric view of Renaissance Humanism and culminating in the Enlightenment with its obsession (for want of a better word) with order and reason. The representations of the sublime that we get in Romantic art and literature questions/subverts the Renaissance-Enlightenment approach to man, the nature of the universe, and man's position in the scheme of things at multiple levels: nature is not perfectly ordered, nor can it be completely deciphered or understood or controlled by man, the idea of the sublime hints at the vastness, the enormity, and ancientness, and the mystery of the universe (or Nature), and that is eerie, and inspires awe, and also fear or terror - awe at the realisation of Nature's immensity and power (and our own tiny-ness), fear because we can not fully comprehend it, nor control it, the unknown is always scary. But the sublime can also inspire serenity (instead of fear) - as in Friedrich's 'Wanderer over the Sea of Fog' and 'Moonrise over the Sea'. And the human figures are present specifically to highlight the enormity of nature, and they also serve as the viewer-surrogate - as if the painter is inviting us to wonder at the beauty of nature, just like the figures in his painting. Turner's paintings like the Slave Ship, Fishermen at Sea (and other "boats in sea" works - which are many) capture the uncontrollable force in Nature and human helplessness; and also the idea of reason and order I think, coz there is no rational explanation why those men in the boat were facing such fury, it is random, it does not follow any moral order or social laws.

[@radioactivedetective6876]

p.s. @ The Arts Hole - took the liberty of jabbering at length, I hope u won't mind. It isn't like I relate to every aspect of Romanticism as a philosophy, but I do love the poetry and paintings (the Sublime and Nature ones, viz Friedrich, Turner; unsure about Delacroix's brand of Romanticism)

[@theartshole311]

Fantastic summary of the forces at play, as you say it goes right back to the Renaissance. I'll hopefully get to fill out those gaps as we cover more artists and periods but I'm particularity fascinated by the concept of the Sublime and Romanticism's opposition to enlightenment rationalism. I intend to take a look at Casper David Fredrich at some stage soon as a companion to this video to explore these ideas a bit more, so thanks for your great summary!

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 Really looking foreward to your Friedrich video. Love so many of his paintings. And I have only looked at them from whatever I know about Romanticism and the Sublime from my study of literature. Very excited about the new insights your video will provide in terms of art history, style and technique, innovation, context and so on

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 Also, may be later sometime you may think about doing a video on this particular strand of Romanticism of Turner, Friedrich with the Romanticism of Delacroix, Gericault. A comparison between The Raft of the Medusa and Turner's ship wreck/ships at sea paintings would be interesting. And I wonder how much being French in revolutionary France has influenced Delacroix and Gericault's subjective individual perspectives (and world view) and shaped their brand of Romanticism.

[@theartshole311]

I've been working on a few scripts in this regard, Romanticism is such a huge area I figure it'd be better to explore it by looking at a few painters in different areas to see the broadness of the response to it. We will definitely take a look a Fredrich, he's a favorite of mine, and funny you sound mention Delacroix, Gericault and the French revolution as I've been brushing up on all of that stuff to cover some of that too. It's a lot to cover so it might be a while, and I want to get back to doing 20th century stuff too, Art Nouveau and Expressionism are next up in that regard. Once I plan it out and get the scripts done I may alternate the schedule between pre modern and modern art topics, we'll see how it goes

[@radioactivedetective6876]

What is the name of the painting at 11:27? Reminds me of Impression Sunrise. And Rain, Speed and Steam reminds me of one of the paintings of the Gere Saint-Lazare series. Both these Turners are way more abstract than the Monets.

[@theartshole311]

As far as I know its called "Sun setting over a lake", it is very reminiscent of Monets work, no doubt a big influence

[@ljimlewis]

How do you become a patron of this arts hole channel?

[@theartshole311]

I'll get around to setting up one of those Patreon yolks one of these days, in the mean time there's a buy me a coffee page at this link if you'd like to help us out www.buymeacoffee.com/theartshole

[@aidanlizotte9124]

Your volume was a bit inconsistent, sometimes louder sometimes softer. Totally not a big deal but if you wanted to even it out a compressor on the audio chain might help.

[@radioactivedetective6876]

5:40 - that is one of the first things I teach my literature students, that Romantic (as related to Romanticism) and romantic (as related to romance/secular love) have very different meanings. None of the major works of the Romantic poets is love poetry.

[@theartshole311]

Yes, very true, I was attempting a bit of wordplay there, hope it doesn't come off as misleading! I really need to cover more of Romanticism in the visual arts, it's going to be coming up again and again so a video specifically on it as a topic might be in order

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 I hope you cover Casper David Friedrich, coz some of his works really encapsulate the idea of the Sublime in Nature.

[@liamkennedy5301]

Do yoi have any plans to do a video on Salvador dali, my friend really likes him and i think he would absolutely love a video about him by you

[@theartshole311]

Yes, I'll be getting to Dali and Surrealism soon, could be a few months but will definitively take a look at him

[@liamkennedy5301]

@@theartshole311 take your time man thanks for responding.

[@radioactivedetective6876]

Hi... I am not being able to post any further comments on your Klimt video. I post them, youtube says "reply added", but then they just vanish.

[@theartshole311]

That's weird, I got notifications for your comments but I can't see them now either, they're not in the held for review section either. Sorry! will look into it and figure out whats going on

[@theartshole311]

I've been looking into why your comments disappeared, sorry but I've no idea! It's not just you though, I've been seeing comments come up and then seemingly vanish minutes later, not sure why but I think I'll have to get on to KZbin about it, apologies!

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 No need to apologise. But if the problem persists then u will have to get in touch with youtube. Seems it is some problem on their side, some glitch or bug or something... Anyway, after the post vanished a couple of times & I had to type it all over again I'd copy+paste-ed & saved my comment, in case the same thing happened. So, I'l just paste-post it here. It's a continuation of the Suprematist composition request: I had just posted an elaboration of the Kandinsky & Malevich stuff, but dunno why, seems not to have gotten actually posted. Anyway, point is: there's Kandinsky's Composition 8 and On White II; and then there's Malevich's Suprematist Composition, Suprematist Composition 2 (www.artnet.com/artists/kazimir-malevich/suprematist-composition-2-RK91GWSu5l6qPiC35KkTBw2), Supremus 56 (pixels.com/featured/suprematist-composition-no-56-kazimir-severinovich-malevich.html) and others like these. Please explain the concepts and philosophies of the two artists behind these works, amd whether, at least in case of some such works, their ideas match or overlap.

[@theartshole311]

Ah I see, both of these artists will be coming up soon, particularity looking forward to Malevich, we haven't touched upon Russian art much yet and this whole period there is fascinating. Kandinsky is great too, I've been looking into his relationship to Theosophy recently, that's a huge influence on a lot of abstract art that deserves a closer look. There is definitely some crossover between their two styles in terms of influences from Cubism and fauvism, but I'll hold off on making any direct connections or contrasts until I've done the research. Will be coming soon though!

[@radioactivedetective6876]

@@theartshole311 No hurry at all. Just wanted to put my request out there.

[@tomfreemanorourke1519]

There is a political conduit that runs throughout all genres of art from the prehistoric to Banksy.... how typical and topical was the subtle art of the artistic licence?

[@siobhanyoung4196]

'the young Mallard took to like a duck to water'

[@rotarystone7085]

Joseph wright of derby is turners father

[@devinmichaelroberts9954]

someones seen the movie "Turner" hahahahaha

[@oldgit4260]

"Arts hole" lol

[@theartshole311]

Perhaps I should have picked a better name but I'm a sucker for a silly pun

[@richardbreyer1486]

Thanks!

[@danielbecker5407]

Thanks!