1978 Les Paul Deluxe Repair - Pancake Glue Fail

[@martinmcgimpsey9750]

You popped that Les Paul apart I about jumped! No joke! Definitely watching this one!

[@macdad159]

I lived in Hawaii for 10 years and I had a 1969 Les Paul pancake body that did the exact same thing. Brought it to a luthier over there and had him re-glue the body back together again. Since living there I have seen plenty of pancake bodies that have spent all their lives in Hawaii split apart.

[@williardbillmore5713]

Is it the heat and/or the humidity...salt air or what? why does this only seem to happen in Hawaii?

[@_-_Michael_-_]

It’s the music that makes them do it 😂😂😂 JK must be humidity and heat combination.

[@williardbillmore5713]

@@_-_Michael_-_ Aren't the necks set with the same glue? Do the necks fall off too? What kind of glue is used when they make their ukuleles?

[@williardbillmore5713]

@@_-_Michael_-_ I have been to Hawaii several times at different times of the year and It never got that hot there compared to states like Arizona, Nevada or even California. I never saw the temperature go much above 85 in Hawaii. California, Arizona and Nevada regularly get highs in the triple digits. I never heard of pancaked Les Pauls falling apart in those places. Hawaii's average humidity is about 73%, not much different from Iowa Illinois or Michigan. It's got to have something to do with the constant trade winds and the salt in the air. Has anyone ever heard of pancaked Les Pauls coming apart anywhere but in Hawaii?

[@modergav]

​@@williardbillmore5713 yes.

[@SteveResor]

Crazy how it just started to come apart like that ! Awesome job getting it back up and playing !!

[@cliffords2315]

70's Gibsons

[@frantisca]

That crack noise at 4:56... frightening ! You showed quite a lot of nerve in this repair job: kudos !!

[@HeadroomPR]

Wow, right now I exactly this same issue in my 1976 Les Paul Custom. I have to find a luthier as talented as you to take care of it. Beautiful work!

[@6v6guy86]

The Brazilian ship had sailed long before a late Norlin era LP like that one, as always- great video on an unusual but equally interesting case.

[@donsaxon1169]

Yep.

[@satinwhip]

Also since it's a pancake body it's not a 1978. They stopped the pancake construction a few years before that.

[@HashiAkitaPuppy]

Sorry, but I wouldn't be happy with the seam the way it looks now.

[@quad1000]

yeah man, no kidding there.

[@GlennWTaylor]

Wrong glue too start with! Hide or fish glue would have been way better…..Is this gentleman a full time luthier and getting paid?? That seem was horrid and would be unacceptable if I were the client paying but at this point how would it be fixable?? Value was sure ruined now 200-250 guitar!

[@JoesephBidon]

@@GlennWTaylor Yeah that was a really poor repair. The seam is awful.

[@Rainyman63]

Damn, that was a good opportunity to add a few weight relief holes....😀

[@flippinheck]

Just a note about scoring using white glued, it actually weakens the bonded area as it's like a sink hole for the glue, aliphatics are really best on consistent smooth surfaces and the thinner the better too much and you will get gapping and distortion due to expansion from overwet wood fibres, keying and scoring works best with resin glues like cascamite which is designed for loose joints, the 70 era Gibsons were junk and trialed split bodies in order to use cheaper selections of woods, there was no effort made to match any pieces either, nice work by the way.

[@greasymonkeyguitars9292]

Wow! That was a first for me seeing that kind of repair. I've always wondered how something like that would go. Great work and take care! 🤘

[@bigdguitars]

Glad you liked it!

[@vinniesworld459]

Love watching your work. Never seen a repair like this before! Also very interesting that the middle section of the pancake was actually two pieces!!! Hope things are well for you and your mother.

[@GC-re3gm]

The irony is that exactly during that year Gibson stopped pancaking bodies. In fact, I have a Deluxe same colour, same year that is not pancake body. As always awesome content!

[@amateurism1]

That sound that’s made when you were scoring the glue joint, adding surface area, is why these old guitars sound so good. Great video!

[@kmichaelp4508]

I had no idea that Gibson made a pancake body. What a screwed up mess. But good on you! Have a cigar.

[@sam_uelson]

Early 70s les paul deluxe modified with dimarzios? Someones an ace frehley fan.

[@markgordon4368]

Great stuff, I have three types of customer, one that doesn't want to know what is happening to their guitar, one who is fascinated by the process of restoration and lastly the one who is initially interested until you present them with a pile of parts and they faint 😱🤣

[@GlenDeanII]

My older brother Steve had one of those back in the late 70's and early 80s.... it is how I decided that the Les Paul is the One Guitar to Rule Them All.....

[@spl311bt]

Super interesting repair, but my ocd self says to clean all the stuff off your bench and use a new blanket/sheet !! Great job

[@guitartec]

Got a 73 LP Custom BB FW with embossed pups (yes, gold finished embossed pups made it into early 73 production). This axe is utterly beat to sht and I love it that way. I think there's even Bondo under the top finish. Old splined headstock repair. The only thing that hasn't separated on this guitar is the pancake. Binding has all been reglued by an obvious vision impaired gorilla. The guitar is magical, and I've played countless LPs in my business, so you can bet it is a very special axe. I loan it out to studio players and performers and everyone's in agreement on this 73. I clearly remember no one wanting Norlin pancakes or 3 bolt Strats back in the day. I'm here to say they were wrong!

[@JonDeth]

That split was almost scary the way it popped. I probably still have some sandwich body guitars in my collection. *I foresaw the solution for the seam and it was exactly the pain in the ass I expected lol.* I'll get into something like this someday.

[@johnhannasmusicaladventure8104]

Excellent work Derek ! You really take on some tough issues, take care brother.

[@bigdguitars]

Thanks, buddy

[@guitfidle]

wow, I've never seen a pancake body fail like that before!! Nice repair 🥰🥰

[@TheQakman]

Chit -chit, chit-chit. Something I didn’t know. Lol. Great job.

[@joebloggs4369]

Outstanding video as usual. Hope your mum is doing ok.

[@scoutrifle6827]

Curious what the thinking was in using the lacquer pens rather than just drop-filling from a can?

[@humbuzztube]

On Pawn Stars there was an episode where a washed up guitarist bought in black Les Paul claiming it was a sixties mode. Brought in a local expert who pegged it as mid seventies , partially due to the pancake body where it was separating. There's lots of history on Norlin era guitars that cheaped out with maple necks and other crap.

[@danandratis]

Thanks for the video Derek - Cheers from Canada

[@TheGuitologist]

This is an unheard of issue. Wow.

[@christianboddum8783]

I didn't see you using indexing pins to line the body parts up, how were you sure they didn't drift?

[@christopherclarke5254]

I've been around Les Pauls since 1970. I've never seen this problem before either!

[@bigdguitars]

yea was so odd

[@mrz80]

Definitely file under "First time for everything"

[@MortandHarley]

No offense, but your work area looks like a storage unit that rolled over twice. Have you considered building or renting a repair shop that is dedicated to repairs, and building your beautiful guitars? Kinda made me nervous seeing all the loose tools and parts laying around while you worked on this guitar.

[@bigdguitars]

Yea that’s an active working shop.

[@chrispile3878]

I've seen these pancake LP's come apart. It's not the salt - more likely humidity and heat.

[@dukenukembubblegum7311]

This guy is super talented, nicely done

[@soapboxearth2]

Norlin pancake LPS had Indian rosewood. Brazilian was only used up until 68 or 69

[@williamdesmarais4931]

What a great time to make some templates.

[@shakarocks]

I had a honeyburst '76 LP that came stock with PAF's. It's still the best LP I've ever owned/played. I regret selling it every day.

[@Relayer6a]

Those guitars weren't $199 in 1978. Working from very old memories they were around $500 on the mainland. Obviously would be more expensive in Hawaii.

[@fredmueller9919]

Exactly, I have a 1976 Les Paul Custom which is a pancake body that I got in 1976 brand new. I have the original receipt and I can assure you it was a lot more than $199.00. More like $750.00 which is about $4000 in today money. And I know the deluxe was a cheaper price Guitar than a custom. I believe gibson made pancake bodies in 1975, 1976, 1977. I’m not sure, but maybe very early 1978. But Gibson has absolutely raise there prices.

[@Relayer6a]

@@fredmueller9919 I had a 75 custom. Cost me about the same as yours. I don't recall exactly because I'm old and forgetful now. 😁

[@Kenba40]

I had a 78 Les Paul Deluxe I bought new in 78. As far as I know all Deluxe models came with mini humbuckers

[@fuzzypoet1018]

I'm in the States and am very impressed by your repair and refinish skills! I was wondering if you are taking on any more repair work? I'm looking to refinish my guitar... the maker messed up the paint job and I'd rather have the re-paint done by someone who puts care and cnsideration into their work. thanks for your time.

[@alexandermclaughlin3978]

The tap? 😂 I've never heard anything sound more Massachusetts and it took me until far too long into the video, before i realised you were talking about the top. Well, until you told about your mam really.

[@haytguugle8656]

amazing job. Though other commenters report that they've seen this kind of failure before, this is a first for me too. and the price...... ????? really? I bought my gold top Standard in '78 (one of the best guitars I've ever owned, regardless of the general crap they were putting out at the time). Mine was NOT $199! I paid (happily) $485 (discounted price) in NYC. or maybe it was $435. It was a long time ago. Either way, a far cry from $199! Maybe Hawaiian dealers knew of the problem already and just wanted to get rid of them quickly? Very interesting repair.

[@markbundy1694]

Great Job Buddy !

[@pedraw]

You must have huge cajones because when I hear that wood crack..................OMG. Stunning work. I dont know if you've ever heard of a guy on youtube called Dr. Nitro. He makes some Les Paul copies under his 8 Bomb Custom brand and his processes and relicing is quite fascinating to me. If you have some time check it out.

[@magnumardent]

awesome...really love those projects of yours, great upload, thanks!

[@Xpyburnt_ndz]

Gr8 repair Derek! I had that same year in a gold top deluxe...I paid $450 for it in 78! That guys got a gr8 deal on this one! LOL

[@dale1956ties]

I have one almost exactly like it. Mine is a little earlier than '78 because I bought mine used in '78 and it cost me $300.00. I was really surprised by that price in Hawaii being under $200.00. I was expecting to hear a much higer number since you always hear about how expensive everything is in Hawaii because of it having to be shipped over. The Original owner put DiMarzios in mine too and I left 'em in there. Nice work! Thanks for sharing.

[@kevinohalloran7164]

Thanks for mentioning a lot I'm thinking about. My Deluxe was $369 new in March 1976. $200 in Hawaii makes me think that it was used when bought (?). I think the metal tuner keys came after '76.

[@dale1956ties]

@@kevinohalloran7164Thanks for the reply! I hope others will chime in on this as well. I really feel that there's something amiss in the $200.00 brand new claim. Although he did say that this repair job came from the "original" owner, I'm finding it hard to believe.

[@dale1956ties]

@@kevinohalloran7164 Another thing I wonder about is what constitutes a "Deluxe"? The only thing different about this one from mine is the truss rod cover. Mine says "Standard" while this one says "Deluxe". I was under the impression that a deluxe had different appointments. This guitar is so close to being a clone of mine it's almost scary. Same headstock overlay, same fingerboard inlays, same binding, same nonfigured multipiece glued up body, same cherry burst, same everything right down to the nonoriginal DiMarzio humbuckers.

[@kevinohalloran7164]

@D.Edward Rice Yes, as far as I know, the only differences between a mid-'70s Deluxe and Standard are the pickups and the title on the truss rod cover. I believe some people ordered full-size humbuckers and the guitar came with "Deluxe" on the truss rod cover anyway. But not sure about that.

[@dale1956ties]

@@kevinohalloran7164 Interesting. I wonder how much more Gibson charged for a truss rod cover engraved "Custom' over one engraved "Standard". By rights the standard should've been more. There were 2 more letters to engrave in "Standard". {8^)

[@piptyson5512]

That's a cool LP that I'm glad to se is back in action 👍

[@ddbrock9675]

I thought they had stopped making pancake bodies by ‘78? Very interesting repair, in any case. Thanks for posting👍

[@scarcam]

Yeah, Maybe '76ish? Gibson serial numbers are a nightmare!

[@IanConnaghan]

The seam looks so prominent now !

[@YooTooobJeff]

Thought you were putting a veneer between the body halves to regain dimension? At 1:05

[@skullheadwater9839]

It turned out really great in the end although I cringed when I heard the CRACK during separating, but it ended up not bad. I get the convenience of rattle can lacquer but with a small compressor and a Harbor Freight spray gun you can get a gallon of lacquer for the price of a can and half. You also do not need to buy the $30 Stew Mac dye to tint it because alcohol-based leather dye from Tandy leather is $6 for 4oz bottles and it works great. This also allows you to mix exact matches for touch ups. Plus, once you get through the first 2/3 of the rattle can it starts sputtering and or if you don't use the whole can the tip clogs. You really get a much better smoother finish with a gun, even the $15 purple Harbor Freight HVLP gun gives a vastly superior finish to a rattle can. Just spray some lacquer thinner through to clean it when you are done. don't get me wrong I used to use rattle can lacquer but it is just so expensive for the tiny amount you get. It used to cost me almost $100 to finish a guitar 3 to 4 rattle cans. I get gallons of Watco Lacquer at Home Depot for $42. Also, a cheap artist paint brush dipped in lacquer work quite well, not sure how much those Stew Mac touch up pens cost but maybe you get a hook up from SM so cost isn't relevant. You may have done better to tint the crack filler lacquer a bit darker so the seam didn't show so much where you didn't use the cherry lacquer, again with the rig I am talking about you could have custom tinted the crack fill. I hope I don't come off as a D-word I am just so much happier with the results and wasn't sure if you had tried somethings besides rattle cans.

[@brettwalmsley3434]

Hi BIG D, I see even Trogly mentioned this video on his show yesterday... Nice job! Greets from Germqny, Brett

[@bigdguitars]

Which video was that?

[@brettwalmsley3434]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/qHiuo6uClLCJn9U - about 04:30+... enjoy! Brett

[@craigusselman546]

What a beautiful well loved Les Paul.

[@TheGorillafoot]

Interesting stuff. Have never seen an Les Paul like that.

[@bigdguitars]

the norlin era les pauls were weird

[@philbrown6787]

Patina, grunge, dna… whatever 😂 Nice work!

[@YooTooobJeff]

Heat the joints slightly with a hairdryer before you score them to minimize the chance of chipping and keeping the score line minimal... Also heat the blue tape slightly with the hairdryer to pull it all off cleanly (or just about any tape) 😉😎

[@bldallas]

When I first saw the cover shot for this video, I though it was going to be about a Les Paul B-Bender! It’s obviously not, but still interesting. I’ve never seen a Les Paul split or like that.

[@ex-subsailor3480]

This one was a first for me. Good job!

[@briandonovan9560]

I had that same guitar w/ mini humbuckers. They weighed a ton.

[@mrz80]

Mind you, it's borderline sacrilege to route out a Deluxe for fullsize humbuckers . Tom Scholz gets a pass 'cause he only did one, and because hey, he's Tom Scholz. :P

[@wombat6]

Hope the mom's fine. Interesting repair for sure. If this was a first for you, I guess it means these pancake bodies are usually solid. Which is good.

[@bigdguitars]

yea I have had a few norlin LPs

[@billsguitargarage]

Amazing work! That would make me so nervous to do that!

[@neilmacmusic]

fantastic work as always! great to watch

[@keithneal4410]

Thanks for posting this video. I live in Las Vegas and I bought a 1975 Gibson Les Paul Deluxe Goldtop from Japan in 2018. In the last year the body has started to separate at the cost and horn. I really enjoy playing the guitar but don't want it to fall apart on a show. I keep it in it's case until I am ready to get it fixed. What should I expect to pay to get this repaired? I would love to know.

[@BlueberryStinkFinger62]

I have a 2021 epiphone custom Koa les Paul that Gibson can't beat it believe that..

[@robertr4193]

It seems like you always get the interesting repair jobs. This one looks like it may turn out to be a doozy. Best of luck sir. Would have been interesting to hear what it sounded like before you did the repair to see if the sound changed and if so how much. It does sound pretty nice after for sure.

[@666gun100]

I've never seen a LP fail like that, I have a '76 one with maple neck like that one.

[@timhallas4275]

You had a chance to hide that glue joint forever and you didn't. I don't get that.

[@cruzedude1]

came out great,hope your mom is doing ok

[@thegeekdude67]

Excellent repair for an odd scenario. Never heard of a body separating like that. Great work! Hoping your mom is doing better. Cheers! 😎👊🎸

[@bigdguitars]

thanks buddy

[@mauionion2]

Have the exact same problem with my 75. My guy here was afraid to touch it.

[@davidcamilli170]

The t- shirt bro, priceess! You make some nice guitars by the way you know

[@Terry3Gs]

Yeah, shame the seam shows so much. BUT awesome job & looks great now !! :)

[@paulneeds]

Love the spray booth! My kinda solution…

[@jjdillon2007]

Derek, where did you get those small pads for the clamps?

[@micmacnz]

have a early 70s LP Custom. Fretless wonder... Took it to Crimson Guitars and had it refretted while I was building my own guitar. Thing is boss, and I dont have to have arm muscles like Arnold to bend strings.

[@D.Guitar]

Oits true. You can never have enough Clamps.... More clamps with moderate pressure. Instead of few clamps with extra extreme pressure....🎉

[@mark-dietz]

Who else jumped at the CRACK as he opened the guitar? Great job though.

[@chrisv1463]

Interesting repair. Guitar top looks like it was 2 pieces top to bottom ( neck to tail)!!Just an illusion?

[@ChrisFranklyn]

I was trying to work that out because it looked like the grain ran from side to side as well there. But I wasn't sure if that might be the veneer between the pancakes.

[@telecasterbear]

That view was the thin third piece between the two mahogany slabs.

[@chrisv1463]

Yeah on second look. Its 2 pieces of veneer (grain running 90 degrees to the outside pieces.)

[@bongnp]

What an opportunity to route some weight relief on the inside

[@ChrisFranklyn]

That's quite the failure! Do you know what sort of glue they were using in the 70s?

[@bigdguitars]

yea it was an industrial glue. not your tightbond etc.

[@HBSuccess]

#1 why didn’t you use Titebond II or III? Or epoxy? Something waterproof? Regular Titebond is going to fail exactly the same way it did from the factory (they used standard PVA glue also) #2 all that “scoring” actually detrimental to a PVA glue joint. It needs complete surface to surface contact. It would have helped an epoxy joint however. Epoxy might have avoided the back swelling issue too.

[@Frankinsteinguitar]

Gibson never ceases to amaze me with their bullshit instrument construction.....and I've been doing tech/luthier for for over 60 years.

[@acidbe]

Great work!

[@blacklion401]

Great video.

[@shtdaprdtr]

Just a correction..the fingerboard is not brazilian...Brazilian rosewood was stopped in mass production on instruments in 1964/65

[@SteveOuimette]

All of that because Gibson probably save a dollar or two by getting thinner pieces of mahogany and marketed the sandwich as an "upgrade". Incredible work fixing the issue, this was a fun watch! BTW, I've had many LP Deluxe's from the 70's and while they can be heavy and less collectible than other eras, I still think they're great rock and roll machines.

[@Relayer6a]

I don't think it was ever claimed to be anything except a cost saving factor. Everyone was using crap wood back then. You used to be told to never buy a painted guitar because they were made from "scrap" pieces that they couldn't use if you could see the guitar through the finish.

[@SteveOuimette]

@@Relayer6a Oh yeah, Gibson marketed it as an upgrade, but we all know that it wasn't. Mineral-laden, heavy wood back then as well as just bad choices. I remember stripping one of my 70's Les Paul copy guitars down to the wood and it was 15 pieces!

[@ericctheartofnoise8613]

Nice repair. It's too bad that you couldn't hide the seam between the two. With lacquer, if it's too thick, it will crack in time. Hopefully, change in temperature and humidity has a very slow effect on the two woods.

[@5barkerstreet]

glue works better on a smooth surface scoring not necessary and can lead to a weaker joint.

[@paul-davidalmond716]

LPD with full sized Hummers?

[@kevinohalloran7164]

Yeah, a lot of people bought Deluxes and then put full-size humbuckers in them. I think you could even order a Les Paul from Gibson with them, but it would still be called a Deluxe. I bought a Deluxe in '76 for $369 plus case. My first Gibson. After liking the cherry SG for 5 years, changed my mind when I saw the cherry burst Deluxe.

[@paul-davidalmond716]

@@kevinohalloran7164 I got a used one in 79, Fell in love with the sound. I still play it, all the time. Nothing beats the detail. You can have the fat hummers, gimme minis, or P-90s...

[@Rotary_Phone]

So "Clown Burst" basically means that there isn't much gradation between the yellow in the middle, and the red on the edges. Is this correct? I've seen some examples of "Clow Burst" online, and one of the examples were really shocking. You really couldn't see the headstock, so it could've been a knockoff Gibson, but if it were a real Gibson I'll never know how they let that thing out of the factory like that, unless they marked the price down.

[@kevinohalloran7164]

Yeah, I thought the color gradation was decent on this one, certainly compared to my '76 Deluxe. Back then I was happy to have a cherry sunburst LP. By today's standards, it's a "red and yellow" guitar. Looks like it was inspired by the colors at McDonald's.

[@ernestschultz5065]

I have never seen this attempt before. Should be interesting.

[@telecasterbear]

Maple neck is always a bonus.

[@bigdguitars]

yes these are solid guitars

[@captainchaos3053]

Two things. Firstly patina is either worn into it and won't clean off or your talking about dirt and secondly that was a lazy and ultimately not well done or nice looking refinish. That does not appeal to me at all.

[@TheBabsPlayGames]

Nicely done.

[@bigdguitars]

Thanks!

[@rakentrail]

You should soak your spray lacquer cans in HOT water! the lacquer will flow out much better!

[@adamkorzon2972]

Looked like the guitar was in traction with all those clamps.

[@kalkidasofficial]

Why don't you use hide glue instead?

[@HawaiiJetboat]

My LP's are in the cases when not in my hands...don't want to see this. Yikes!

[@markdunbar799]

I have almost the exact same guitar except mines a 75 and more beat up looking