Destiny Blackpills Train (Hasan, Socialism, Living Your Principles)

[@Sprite_525]

13:15 *Destiny* : “ ‘ _Humans gonna human , Y’know?’_ , as a good old friend used to say 😬” *Train* : “oh Nietzsche ? yeah of course: ‘ _Human , All-Too-Human_ ‘ . That’s Nietzsche right?” *Destiny* : “ 😆 sure …… I was thinking of a KZbin philosopher, but .. close enough 😅”

[@Ass_of_Amalek]

stop saying the n-word, it offends me.

[@leibert6320]

​@@Ass_of_Amalek niggardly

[@DELETETHISPLEASE]

Train is a master of Analytic Philosophy, never forget ☝️🤓

[@TurtleChad1]

A basic necessity budget of buying a multi million dollar mansion and a 200k dollar car

[@jambo5936]

Say the thing

[@Frozander]

you are probably the only person who clicks the bell icon when you sub

[@channel_no_longer_active]

​@@Frozander Cope

[@Baggerz182]

repent to God

[@taylorg8509]

This is the Los Angeles version of basic necessities

[@Fknmeet]

Train came with complain about hasan and leave with existence/social crisis

[@Robinthebank__]

Bro turtle is already here 😭

[@AssailantLF]

This convo feels like Train trying to cope with very basic concepts, like the fact that many people don't care about logical consistency or fact-based reasoning. Most people aren't interested in being 100% honest and aligned with their values, they just want to be liked and successful. Most debates aren't about finding the absolute truth with good faith discussion and valid criticisms, they're about sounding persuasive to a particular audience. If people were actually interested in that shit, then science and moral philosophy would be popular enough that every normie understood them. But clearly most people don't care about science and moral philosophy because it's boring to them (reasonably so, lol). Does this mean the entire world is fucked, we're all doomed, and nothing will ever change? No. It just means that making positive changes in the world involves more than simply spitting hard logic and facts at everyone. You also have to be charismatic and appealing on other levels besides facts/logic.

[@rkdeshdeepak4131]

There is no ethical consumption outside capitalism

[@anubisgod23]

Capitalism isn't ethical consumption tho..

[@anubisgod23]

​@Y Y I doubt destiny gives a single shit ahahaha

[@rkdeshdeepak4131]

@@anubisgod23 it is

[@TheZealo]

By ethical, do you mean freedom to consume what you choose? Or something else?

[@Blueline3691]

@@YY-ln1ol let's say you're right for arguments sake, their criticisms against Hasan and general virtue signalling are still true. He doesn't live his principles and moves the goalpoast of what it means to be a socialist, which is consistent with how he's changed in order to further his career.

[@DreadRobertz]

Absolute power corrupts absolutely

[@nighthowell]

I can’t decide which is more annoying, Train’s rhetorical “do you understand?”s or Destiny’s rhetorical “right?”s to end every other sentence. I’m gonna go with Destiny, because online people using “right?” at the end of their sentences should result in fines or jail time.

[@DudokX]

“Capital has the ability to subsume all critiques into itself, Even those who would critique capital end up reinforcing it instead”.

[@chronographer]

Someone needs to tell destiny to look up the 'sincerity vs authenticity vs profilicity' paradigms of identity. That describes the disconnect train feels. He is in 'sincerity' he builds identity though social roles. Destiny is 'authenticity' you build identity though the persona of the self. But Hasan is using 'profilicity', he builds his identity though how people view him.

[@broorb4104]

« ethical » and « millionaire » are contradictory to Hasan’s ideology though right? I don’t get it.

[@giovalladares1022]

No no, only billionaires are bad! The ones with more than him.

[@Quiestre]

he has never said that ever

[@roadgnome9166]

Jean Paul Sartre's Facticity vs transcendence; being of itself and for itself gives me an existential crisis every time I think too hard about it. If you WERE an alcoholic but have not drank in over 10 years, you are no longer that person... but all it takes is a few bad actions and you are now that person again. I am my past, present and future.

[@Sx-xy2zi]

What's facticity Vs transcendence

[@roadgnome9166]

​@@Sx-xy2zi Facticity is idea that what we are is permanent based on the current state of being. "I am a teacher, a liberal, a republican, an athlete" etc. Which is a bad faith way to look at people because nothing is permanent. Whereas transcendence is the potential of being; what we are not yet or what we can become. Possible outcomes that have not yet been determined. Everyone is a combination of the two: we are what we are now, and we are what we have not yet become. Think of transcendence as a multiverse; all the potential timelines that you could be depending on the choices you make.

[@-Sparagmos-]

We need a train vs Vaush debate.

[@Klom7]

hasan really knows how to make people think he's a socialist

[@callum6224]

Why doesn’t Destiny ever just explain to them what socialism or communism actually is? How do you ‘live as a socialist’ in the US? I think they expect him to literally give away money, which is just stupid

[@Priinsu]

Because socialism/Communism has a hundred different definitions. If you get a bunch of socialists in one room and ask them all "what is Socialism?" You'll get very different answers and they'll tear eachother apart trying to get to a set definition. A Democratic Socialist is gonna disagree with a Marxist-Leninist who is gonna disagree with a Trotskyist who's gonna disagree with a Anarchist who's gonna disagree with Classical Marxist who's gonna disagree with a Libertarian socialist who's gonna disagree with a marxist-leninist-maoist who's gonna disagree with an anarcho-syndicalist and so on and so forth. So for Destiny, who is a capitalist, who has no dog in that fight it would be a huge waste of time and effort trying to debate about what socialism is when socialist can't even agree on what it is.

[@Priinsu]

Hasan could definitely be doing more. Organizing, donating, charity work. Not taking Jeff Bezos money with a twitch partnership while Amazon has been known to mistreat workers. Just for a start. And I highly doubt Hasan or the vast majority of socialist would ever pick up a gun and goto literal war for socialism.😂

[@rhett3185]

@@Priinsu this is true. And even when you pin a socialist down on their specific brand of socialism, they’ll move the goalpost and shift values mid debate if it helps their argumentation.

[@user-pd3el2lo3x]

If youre Hasan and you sit down one day and ask yourself, "how do I best advance my socialist causes given the amount of wealth and influence I have?" I can guarantee the answer is not a multimillion dollar house in one of the most expensive places to live in the world when your job can be done literally anywhere.

[@keithdavid5206]

If you expect them to say that they just want him to give away money then I don’t know if you even watched the video.

[@njdarda]

train is 12 and this is deep

[@dream1430]

Train has a degree in philosophy, and I’m pretty sure he simplifies his speech patterns so his audience can follow along You should look at his older content, he purposefully dumbs down his stuff

[@creepyjesus1471]

Liberals have to come to terms with the fact that being correct is not enough, you also have to look good to the average citizen.

[@DJ-wl5qo]

“He used to do the frat bro stuff.” That’s still all he does.

[@HAHAHAHAHA477]

If people actually intended lived like a socialist, there wouldn't be a socialist movement, the actual socialist lifestyle sucks if taken seriously. Why would we expect people to make themselves worst off?

[@dangolitellyahwat7507]

11:10 ladies and gentlemen... we live in a society

[@dragunov815]

This is depressing.

[@droppedpin1240]

Your trying to argue facts and common sense in a reality of people arguing off emotions.

[@elgeneral5279]

I would say Destiny kicked Hasan's ass, but I don't think he can reach it.

[@actuallyken8874]

No way Destiny used the "war in ukraine=high gas prices here" reference. Fucking CRINGE.

[@jessesammons2508]

Oh young man, welcome to the real

[@Tom-mu2ci]

As a socialist, I think Hasan is aligned with the cause, but is very tip-toey around it. He's very general, and with the amount of splits in the left I don't really blame him. I don't think having an expensive house, or living in an expensive area, or eating out all the time makes him less of a socialist. But claiming you're a fair employer, etc. is all okay... as long as you're not calling that socialism. His contractors/employees/volunteers would cooperatively own whatever enterprise he runs them under, if you were to call him an acting socialist. I think where Hasan kind of loses credence is when he continues to (to be fair, somewhat reluctantly) pump ads, especially at cliff hanger moments [he used to warn people and 'wait' for the ad to be finished]. The other gripe I have is him advocating for content creators and professional athletes and artists to make MORE than they already do. I think people who get income for a crowd service like streaming, acting, or playing professional sports should be progressively taxed. Not necessarily a tax for the government [tax is probably not the right word], but that money could go towards the engineers running the platform that's generating the millions. Hasan's utopia is almost some type of artisan capitalism, cut out middlemen and employers and make your own money, pay what you want [not my fault you're ugly and people don't want to donate to you more than me*]. But if you're selling a service that has virtually zero duplication cost, I don't believe you should take home millions while people donate to you on 40k salaries, while working at twitch. Kinda scatterbrained, but in a nutshell I think Hasan believes in socialist causes, BUT he himself is not an acting socialist. Just like many socialist/communist countries never achieved socialism, but they intended to begin going down that path. Socialism in an enclave is not what most of us want, and neither are charities. We want reorganization of the superstructure, which is hard to do as a twitch streamer, but as a twitch streamer, you have a good platform to make the idea more palatable so maybe a young person watching will go on to start those organizations. That said, in contrast to Destiny's canvassing efforts, Hasan is lacking. *A socialist organization of the economy that focuses on only removing exploitation means only the most capable and good looking people can be successful. Socialism should work for a cohort, not the individual. tl;dr Hasan is a socialist ADVOCATE, not an ACTING socialist. There's a misunderstanding in the debate at hand

[@therantingcat7891]

Yeah, I can see this same logic being used to defend Trump's Christianity. He obviously doesn't live by Christian values but a whole lot of people think he's advocating them by his rhetoric.

[@FN_Kibs]

10:20 "it's fact vs opinion" yeah train, you never heard of trans ppl?

[@Hello-qf3fd]

Is Train Canadian? What's his ethnicity? Is he eastern european?

[@Quiestre]

he is Persian (Irani)

[@Hello-qf3fd]

@@Quiestre Thank you!

[@blakeog2034]

Oh no… they’re dumb 😢

[@bestdjaf7499]

The issue I have with Destiny, he never talks about the tax codes. Destiny knows that the room he uses to stream is tax deductible. Even the t-shirt Destiny wears is tax deductible. When Hasan spends $1000 on t-shirt, he pays less tax. At least one room in his house is tax deductible. His car is partially tax deductible. His travel is tax deductible.....

[@Mrbigdaddymanamale]

Tell me you have no idea how taxes work without telling me.

[@sitonmuhdeckasshole]

@Y Y elaborate?

[@bestdjaf7499]

@@Mrbigdaddymanamale Can you point out the mistakes in my post? Btw, I used to work as a consultant. My car/gas & dinners & travel & work attire ... were tax deductible. The same with Hasan & Destiny. All the stuff you see on the screen are tax deductible - computers & attire & the room they are sitting in. When they travel they deduct all travel expenses.

[@future.endeavors]

Redpill = Muslim?🤣🤣 destiny is dumb asf for that statement. The ones with money are visiting Saudi Arabia to get a new experience in life, it’s not their fault they like it better than here😂 red pill was always Around, it’s literally just a mindset that came from experience from men around the world. Its well know because the guys with the most money and success follow the red pill to avoid losing their money and their time. It was made from men that work and chase money first before anything else. Now it’s exploded because of the new world changes that are incoming. People are starting to realize they need to think for themselves and act instead of waiting and hoping later in life it’ll get better. This is why destiny will always be wrong when it comes to the red pill. They’re not telling men to be creepy or to chase females and make them uncomfortable like the issues we are having now, men are learning to have direct conversations with these woman, they are learning to be honest so they can save their time and money, and the woman also deal less with men that push and then they turn around and complain that men are being taught to push and push which is false as well😂 woman just don’t want to take accountability and they want to have the advantage of turning a man down, which in itself is okay, but to men that are stupid enough not to understand how woman talk and how they convey which is most, they will keep pretending to be nice and innocent till they get some puss.. the red pill is the only real way of taking action for men.

[@JUNO-69]

To be honest I think train is a massive hypocrite so While I agree with this take about Hasan I think he is committing the same double think

[@MysticLGD]

wew

[@arronax3319]

destiny doesnt seem to know what hes talking about. this is pretty much just "im bitter about hasan"

[@chrishernandez8504]

How is he wrong about Hasan being a grifter and not living in any way his believes ?

[@arronax3319]

@@chrishernandez8504 because political ideologies are beliefs about natural rights, its not an aesthetic or a way of life. He is factually incorrect on this and is making an emotional argument guided by his personal grudge with him. His entire argument here is just characterizing Hasan, his fans, and doing a doomer black pill rant that has no instrumental political philosophy. Whats one point he makes thats not just attacking Hasan personally?

[@chrishernandez8504]

@@arronax3319 political ideology ....isn't a way of life or aesthetics and just about natural rights what does that even mean ??😂😂😂😂 .........ok can you please defined the word IDEOLOGY for me . I know you think your really smart buddy but my god the mental gymnastics you have to go threw in order to reach that conclusion are baffling to brain .I literally had to read this ten times to make sure I wasn't reading this incorrectly

[@arronax3319]

@@chrishernandez8504 bro please dont overheat. Most of the principles of the American Liberal democracy comes from Locke's 2nd Treatise of Goverment. In Locke's book he lays out what he believes to be the natural rights every citizen should have in a liberal democracy. The difference between socialism and Locke's liberalism is that Locke claims people have a right to property they have acquiesced by mixing their labor with it. For example if you "claim" unclaimed land and mix "some" amount of labor i.e. till it, you have a right to it and everything it produces or is produced on it. Socialist claim this is not very justifiable, and leads to many problems and that a better, more justifiable natural right is people to the labor that they produce. This is one of the central tenative differences between liberalism and socialism. Its all grounded concretely in political philosophy that Destiny has never read bc hes an internet debator. But this political philospohy has an extremely direct lineage to our Democraric Republic and how it operates

[@arronax3319]

@@chrishernandez8504 a personal philosophy has to do with how you operate. a political philosophy has to do with what you think people are entitled to by the governing authority and how that authority should operate. Hasan would ONLY be a hypocrite (in regards to socialism) if he was hiring swaths of people and exploiting them. Even if he was a hypocrite, Destiny should be talking about the fundamental arguments. People watch all these people for entertainment in news. No one looks up to Hasan or Destiny. Most of these communities cross each other and watch both

[@johnnynewman7514]

Destiny had a discussion with Richard Wolff and still doesn't understand anything about socialism 😂 Have fun trying to solve systemic problems with individualistic solutions

[@nighthawk2548]

Can't you use money and influence to change the system?

[@johnnynewman7514]

@@nighthawk2548 sure, if you have enough of those

[@nathanangulo875]

I will have fun

[@muzzle_4717]

Wolff looked pretty bad in the debate

[@AssailantLF]

you should call in when he's streaming and destroy him by pointing out how flawed his understanding of socialism is

[@WhenItsHalfPastFive]

going to give ya'll a hot take: The whole clowning Hasan for spending money is actually cringe, compared to what he makes, he's kind of dumb and spends very little, I think he even mentioned that he doesn't even have a credit card. He doesn't know anything about finance and doesn't invest in anything. He's very stupid with money, but not in a splurging way. If anything, he's risk averse.

[@broorb4104]

absolutely not cringe. it’s called accountability.

[@deeepdale]

socialism is when you assist people with your money. the less you do that, the less socialist you are. these are the internet rules

[@faikerdogan2802]

So he is a horder? How does this helps the argument ? Also i think he is just lazy. He can buy 2K tishirts after all. So he does waste. He doesn't need to waste everything that would be very stupid

[@drawingpower1]

No offence but if I was that rich, I would invest in money literacy courses, find out how and where to invest my money and make a budget

[@WhenItsHalfPastFive]

@@drawingpower1 exactly, he's stupid with money and needs to learn how to actually use it rather than do nothing with it. But that doesn't mean he's a big spender, like what the meme about him has become. People are running with an incorrect narrative, when really he's spending very little of what he makes.